Never Buy A Tamiya For Racing, AGAIN! Pushing A Durga DB-01 To Its Limits vs Modern PRSB401
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- Опубліковано 25 чер 2024
- In this video, I attempt to upgrade the DB-01 4WD Tamiya Durga RC and take it racing again to see if it really can justify its large price tag or is it just a black hole money pit that's best left on the shelf or in the store! I put it head to head with the modern PR Racing SB401 Type R that costs the same amount of money!
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#DB01 #durga #rckicks - Розваги
Tamiya for nostalgia and fun, If you live in Europe you race Schumacher or Xray, if you live in the USA you race Losi or associated, Whatever is supported best where you are.
Well done highlighting the cold hard truth. I’m a Tamiya fan but I understand that most of the time there are better options for racing.
Tamiya is definitely not the sensible option for racing.. but hey.. for most of us racing Tamiya’s it is more of a trip down memory lane.. as for cost.. we spend tons of money on cars that are gonna sit on a shelf.. or worse never come out of the box.. looking forward to seeing how far you can take that 2007 buggy, should do better than expected🖖
But for good cheap road racing the TT01 and TT02 are pretty good....on the cheap
Come on, who in their right mind would buy tamiya to go racing?! You can get the latest and greatest from any of the top manufacturers for £500! And there ready to go without having to spend hundreds on upgrades before you even put it down on a track
Guys like me who aren't top racers and like the brand. If you are a serious racer who needs spares and hop ups for constant racing yeah not the best option unless you are filthy rich
Tamiya fan boy here. I’m sorry. But. As stated already. Tamiyas are for fun and fun racing. Simply the truth. I have PR Racings, Schumachers etc and plenty of Tamiyas. Each have their own purpose and best for. Simple really. 👍🏻. Cool video and good to make it this into a video series.
Very nice video sir. Same here in the Philippines, Tamiya off-road [dirt] are seldom raced here. You might see a few but is heavily modified or sometimes "customized" with DIY parts. On the on-road seen [concrete] you can find a few Tamiya's [TT01/TT02/TAs] but again heavily modified/customized. The TRF line is very expensive here compared to a Mugen Seiki, PR Racing. It is almost comparable to an X-Ray, AE , Losi. One issue though with modifying/upgrading is that a stock rc has an inherent weak-point/s. Modifying it will only transfer this weak-point/s to another area. Then again if you are a "purist", cost does not matter.
Title triggered! Title triggered!!!!!! But yeah, I know. Tamiya for fun , Team Associated to win. Good racing all the same!
17:49 Hurray! There is still hope for the Tamiya!!
I do a bit of racing, too. Currently touring cars. TT01 in stock class. The thing about Tamiya is that you can actually do that and only spend a reasonable low amount of money. Then you can advance to the top stock (TA0x, TT02SRX, TBxx), which still is a reasonable amount of money.
Only in the highest class (which happens to be rather open), you race TRF, XRay and similar where the big money is hidden. That's the thing about Tamiya. You probably don't have high end but there is a full range which hardly any other manufacturer can provide...
And an TRF421 most likely can compete with x-ray and similar
100% Tamiya stock classes are a total blast but the reason is everyone is driving the same kit. It wouldn't be much fun if you dropped an XRAY into that class. If someone want's to go stock Tamiya racing, not easy to say don't get a Tamiya, get something better LOL ;)
Would you say a TRF421 (£845) would be a better way to go vs the XRAY X4’24-GRAPHITE at £449 today NIB?
@@RCKickschannel It's more about "go racing but don't spend crazy amount of money", then there's no way around Tamiya since I would not know any other race league where you can reasonably compete with such cheap cars; Since I am running a brushelss combo I am on a pretty high level pricewise but my TT01R Type E including all electronics and steering is around 500€ (motor combo + steering = 250€), so including servos, battery and hop ups that make sense I have a fully equipped race car for 250€ and this is the total upper price range; maybe go to 300 if you like and spend a bit of bling bling.
Talking about XRAY vs TRF421... I got different prices here: XRAY: between 750 and 800€, TRF421 689€(Tamico). Writing from Austria...
@@RCKickschannel I would tell them to get a TRF421 but purchase it from HK or Germany for around £500 delivered and not pay uk prices for them.
@@joewood306what about xpress they have top of the line range and a budget range which is upgradable. Both are better value than Tamiya.
@@markbruton-young9228 I heard about them. The top cars seem to be pretty competitive. However, they are not yet wide spread enough to create an own racing class...
At least in Austria.
LRP S10 are decent and affordable cars, too. In Germany they had their S10 competition series but as far as I know they no longer but I may be wrong. In Austria definitely no
The Durga looks pretty neutral in everything on that track. This is really interesting. I really think that for Tamiya to be an option in offroad racing, they’d need to bring TRF back and make some new designs, with parts support.
Getting parts is a make or break proposition for any RC racer. I remember back in the day the two Durango 1/10 offroad buddies came out. They were wonderful designs, very well made and people raved about them.
When the parts availability became a problem ( I don’t remember how or why that happened) people offloaded them pretty quickly.
I believe disolving the TRF was the right thing because Tamiya is not getting the returns while having the dream team at the time they lost that last World Championship TRF was in. TRF as we knew it no longer exist but they are still around except there is no signed drivers. TRF nowadays are just the car designers and some Tamiya employees who likes to race.
Great content, happy days !
Great video, cheers Gav
If only the Americans put so much effort, performance, reliability and customer respect into their real cars that they do in their R/C cars! Building a Tamiya to the same competitive level as an Associated or Losi is doable but is only for experts and die-hard brand fans!
When it comes to control variables, it's not necessarily necessary to have the same motor and tires and whatnot between the cars. Like you found out already, the two cars have different needs on race day, so putting matching tires on the tamiya may not be the best option for that specific RC in your hands. It's needs more power, give it more power, but the exact RIGHT amount of power may not be the same for a tamiya as a purpose built racer. Same for grip.... The RIGHT amount of grip is going to be different between the cars.
It's a worthy exercise to bring in part specific control variables, but it's not going to speak toward the FULL ability of the chassis. It'll only be the ability of the chassis under those specific part control conditions.
I think it's enough to meet the standards of a race series, race on the same day, same driver, and maybe same radio too... But matching up servos and power packs and tires is going to limit the options to bring about the best of each chassis for the race series, and that's what I want!! To know the BEST outcome for a racing tamiya, with the parts that make it the best it can be (for the race series conditions)
What cracks me up…: there are plenty more upgrades option too!!!(but not readily available) I deliberately have not tallied up…..
I would like to get the chassis with the motor heat sink built in but zero chance of finding one at a reasonable price.
Ya only need the pin holders and slipper clutch and front universals. And the carbon from Nick Walker. Db01 and 501 share a ton of parts. Not bad for a 18 yo buggy.
Yep, i think it's got more in it.
The Tamiya db01 is a 17 year old car, it was designed for rough dry dusty slippery tracks, going to take a bit of fiddling to make it work well in modern high grip grip tracks.
Yep. It’s funny as I get the feeling it really wants to be a carpet car as it’s way better than expected, even out the box
Durga is understeering, underdamped, you just need to tune that out and give it more power.
I agree put the work n and quit complaining how much parts are im a diehard tamiya collector i own b6,1 team assoc 300 4 kit 150 4 motor\esc 90 4 whls tires and at least 150 4 a good radio i wish i had a chance 2 buy a durga leonis
Let’s get a YZ-870c update next! 😊
Please don’t be put off making a Durga . Most of these parts he mentioned are available now at plaza Japan for around £10 or less each including gear diffs ( £12 ) and alloy suspension blocks . ( £7)
Interesting point about the alloy steering . I have not tried alloy and plastic back to black, the plastic , especially the carbon reinforced ones seem extremely stiff but that has piqued my interest to try it although my 3 racing / gpm set got bent last meeting so maybe the Tamiya parts are the way to go if going With metal .
Lastly .. those PR shocks are gorgeous . They would look great on my db01 RRR . I’m gonna look the up. The whole PR buggy looks amazing to be fair .
Also gav.. if you are not using your reinforced gear covers I have a buyer for you .
So to sum up..
A Durga for £180
£150 at plaza Japan makes a very capable club racer.
Second this - I got all parts from PlazaJapan for a lot lot less than discussed in the video
That’s why we have so many😂
Yup Plaza Japan and RCJaz are great for cheap parts and only take around 5 days for delivery if you choose the slow option.
I use plaza as much as I can because I don’t buy stuff from China.
Hi Gavin, I believe you skip out an important fact for the Durga: HEAVY standard chassis! 😂 I know my car is a porker but the optional lighter carbon reinforced chassis does not come cheap either. Do source the "lightweight" chassis to see if it helps the performance even more. There are three versions available: carbon reinforced with holes for side by side pack, db01R chassis and finally the db01RR/RRR chassis. Good luck finding the last one new 😂
Mine as far as I know came with the modern carbon composite chassis without the motor heat plate and flat battery tray area. 100% I have been looking for the motor heat plate and chassis but like you said, zero around these days
Interesting, lap 22 in the DB01 wasn't clean yet your quickest. At least 1 sec available. How many hours have you driven the PR Racing vs the DB01?
PR Racing is way more dialed in than the Durga currently. The DB-01 needs a load more work over the next few weeks for sure. Anyone got a good small carpet track pro setup sheet for a DB-01?
I just built a TLR 22T for bashing. I'm going the opposite direction. LOL
Slow down the servo in the PR, it will take the twitching away.
To be honest I was so surprised at how well the Durga was running, and it looked like it was handling pretty well too. As you said though, once you take out as many 'variables' as possible you can then do a fair comparison. They are both still quite expensive buggies, but if you have the funds then why not? I'll soon be racing a TC-01 against 'better' 4wd touring cars at my local club, should be interesting.....😜😜
I think the TC-01 will be better than you expect. Good set of Schumacher race tyres on it and stiffen it up, ZooM!
Love all your videos man! That said the comparison really isn't 1:1 if you aren't running the same electrics and tires. Pretty much all your points are spot on but one. The only thing yoyd likely beeak on the TRF5xx cars woild be parts shared with the DBs. They are expensive xor sure, but if you can addord and you are A Tamiya Nerd, nothing else will do
I'm putting all my money into funding the UK Grand Tour project currently, but I would really like to get a 501X and take it racing. That could be a follow up down the road for this series.
Most modern full race buggies are well out of budget for most younger racers. Imagine getting 20 youngsters together running these! Then nibble away at the upgrades as money allows!
The title is way more triggering than the content!
I just bought my first modern racing buggy. A second hand Yokomo SO 1.0. Looking forward to putting it together over the next few months.
£68 for shocks?! If that was for all four please tell me where!😂 Interesting stuff, the approach of testing cars back to back is a sound one and as you say removing as many variables as you can is the best way to go about it. I always wished the rc mags did that back in the day. So from a pure analysis point I'm loving this series. Fanboy hat on, you touched upon the major issue of running most any Tamiya model in the UK; parts supply. The importer doesn't seem to see any value in even attempting to supply anything of the race biased models sadly. Looking forward to the next episode!
I agree - £68 for all for Big Bores and springs? Where were they from??????!!!
Nope, that was a mistake and that was the price of two only. More like £100+ these days if not more with the spring packs.
@@RCKickschannel ah that makes more sense. Yeah they're an insane price. If you have to go Tamiya personally I think the TT02B/DF03 aluminium dampers and springs are a solid choice, half the price but not half as effective. Otherwise Schumacher big bores seem a good choice in the UK.
The next track test, will be more accurate. New tires on both, with the same Motor & ESC 👍🏻
That is the plan.
durga needs alot more initial steering. do tamiya make different castors ? great vid
Don't know if 501X parts will fit
Hi , what's the weight difference between the 2 racing?
Next video we cover this aspect as I try to get the Durga down to the minimum 4WD weight to match the PR Racing.
Was just about ask what the Durga weight was now. I reckon it’s a porker with all the extras
1st rhing I do with both classes of cars is screws and ceramic bearings
The latter is certainly a must for racing imo especially on the drive train in any class. The difference is night and day
I agree. Hellishly expensive at uk prices. Given the car has to come from Japan, the parts may as well come from Japan too. My Tamiya fanboy man-maths puts it at about £500 shipped and taxed. Still obviously doesn't make financial sense. But who needs sense? 😂
Could you drop a link for the supplier of the shock towers?
You can find him on Facebook, Nick Walker facebook.com/nick.walker.9828456
Not video related but wanted to ask the question ti you and anyone other watchers. I already have a TT-02 Type S that i use as a tarmac toy and i race a TT-02 in the Tamiya Tourers at my local club so I know the TT-02 chassis fairly well my question is what 2wd/4wd buggy would you suggest as an off road play thing. Dont really want to spend more than £200 all in as i don't plan on racing with it. Not adverse to a few upgrades over time if stuff breaks. Thanks for your time and apologies if this sort of thing isn't appropriate/acceptable. (Not trying to offend anyone.)
Modern or vintage would be my first question for you? If you just want to have fun with it, well you have a load of great choices. Do you want NIB or a used example is fine?
@@RCKickschannelI'd probably say modern more for ease of spare parts/hop ups. I've been looking at new, cos I like building them. But if it's the right model then I wouldn't be too adverse to buy used. So to actually answer your question properly I'm going to say new. I had a Sand Viper (DT-02) which I really liked that I kinda miss now, sold it to a mate a few years ago who turned it into an Astute, so I had thought about one of those again.
Hi Gav. Where did you get your big bores from mate? Was it £68 for all 4? Thanks
I got that wrong, that was the price for two.
What are the electrics in the durga compared to the PR? different motor winds?
Yep 15.5T brushless HW vs 6.5T brushless in the PR
@@RCKickschannelthat’s a big speed and power difference, i get why as the Tamiya gearbox and belts might not be able to handle a 6.5
I would not totally agree with that statement. Most cars used in rc rally competitions are xv01s and 02s. Only fiew others like lc ptg racing rally platform. It really depends on what u're doing...
It does. The XV 1&2 rally cars are great and at some point I hope to get the new little M chassis rally one. Same with the Tamiya stock classes, these are great fun
I had durga years ago. For my skills it was way too quick. Melted some diffs also. Attended some races to fight for the last spot, or get DNF.
Bought second hand durango 410r about 14 years ago. Never driven it at all. And now it's quite worthless. That's my 1/10 buggy racing in a nutshell
Time to dust it down, chuck some brushless power and a lipo in it and get back out on track :)!
I know you've gone for the click bait title and subject, but why not try it again with Kyoshos equivalent, the DB01s club racer rival the Kyosho ZX5 Ready Set and see how you get on.
Most of the upgrades you've bought certainly aren't needed, the DB01 usually just raced with a slipper and pin mount blocks upgraded. The CVAs need a lot of tuning, but a set of DF03 shocks would do the job without the expense of the big bores.
Mainly as I kept getting emails and messages week in and week out asking what Tamiya should I purchase to go racing. This series is just showing viewers what it takes and costs to take a good Tamiya race buggy racing and why my reply is normally, don't unless you want to run a Tamiy stock class or unless you just want to have fun only. Having fun driving an RC around a track is not the same as going RC racing.
Does Merc pay for this avertising? Time for a RCK hat to match. -U10
Yep, this is true but can't find a cap that is good enough to have made. I need to put more time into it. I would like to make a black cap with RCK on the front in red magneto font and the UJ flag on the underside of the cap like my Benz cap. On the back above the strap the RCKicks full logo.
Excellent comparison. To get a second or so a lap out, for an older buggy isn't, bad truth be told. For a Tamiya it actually does well. Be very interesting that once the electronics and tyres are matched on both cars to see how comparible they are.
Awesome series Gavin. Great fun watching your driving improving by leaps and bounds too.
So much effort for stating the obvious in the end 😂 It is entertaining though 👍🏻
LOL True
To be fair, it did ok. I guess that was a base set up ? If you spent the time im sure you could get some of that time back. P.S stay safe 👍😁
Yep 100% guess starter setup. Shock oil change to a little thicker might help but really I need to see how it handles more punch off the line first. I need to adjust the belts as I think the rear tension is too high. Only now getting started
@@RCKickschannel yeah give it a few months of changing set up and you’ll be winning the A 👍
In 1/10 Touring, Tamiya is a good choice. Lot of spare parts and there is the new trf 421 👍
TRF421 is £850 so it’s right at the tops. One thing that does look to be a factor is resell values of the TRF cars is better than competitors when it’s superseded by the next generation so that can help justify the additional revenue you will be paying for the TRF. I guess this residual value will be set by how good that model actually was on the track so some could be more desirable and thus hold more value. I’m guessing a bit on this one so maybe some TRF owners could comment to this aspect.
@@RCKickschannel normal price in Touring 😅
Good evening am a recent subscriber love you content
I have a TA03F attic find
Runs lovely but want to upgrade motor and shocks ?
Am a complete novice and looking for advice
Much appreciated
Sion
Take a look at Hobby Wing ESC and brushless motor combos. A good balance of quality and cost.
Big bore shocks for £68 ? I take it that is per pair and without springs ?
I noticed the same. Can't even get them from Japan for that price.
£40 a packet at plaza Japan currently but they were on sale last week for £32 a pair.
That could have been the price for two LOL
interesting comparison, but the Durga wins for as its the better looking buggy.....
100% cab forward was never a good look
How dose it comparte to a tt02b?
I personally like the DB-01 over the TT02B for carpet track racing.
I raced for 10 years never had any metal in my car and I did just fine although it was outdoors and Kyosho.
its kyosho though they are much better than tamiya for strength and build
Great video. Super interesting.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Well, one thing is completely different (apart the 15+ years design gap) on both... the drive train. One is shaft, the other is belt 😉 1 sec per lap, not that bad for a belt car designed for dirt 🤔
DB-01 has more in it for sure
Which car was heavier?
I will cover this in the next video as the plan is to get the Durga down to the minimum 4WD allowed like the SB401.
@@RCKickschannel yea, bcoz a true comparison would be equal electronics, tyres, weight, same driver etc. I agree a TRF is the ultimate flexing of the wallet, but see how many will sell their cars for the next season when cash doesnt always equal results. Team Associated and Xray cars for the win. Wish Schumacher had more support at the shops
@@RCKickschannel Are you planning to include your Trickbits on the scales to compare to Durga and SB.
Same gear ratio's?
Not sure yet but if possible
Trf kits tamiya has world championships n on off road competition ask marc rienhard david jun a brit won a euro off road championship with 2wd zahak buggy j martin i think his name was they have you need if you have $ for thier higher level kits
My new TRF421 - Paid just over £500 Delivered from Germany. Spares like the Arms are a third of the price of Schumacher, X-ray, Mugen etc. and are readily available (look at schumacher and mugen availability recently) Tamiya prices are just shocking in the UK because of the markup of the UK distributor. Same goes for the tt-02SRX you love to hate on. buy from Germany and its half the price. parts availability is a non issue if willing to wait a couple of days and buy from Germany or RCJaz etc in HK.
I agree buggies it makes no sense unless you have one already from messing about and you want to dip your toe into racing. Touring cars you logic is extremely flawed.
Sure purchasing from outside the UK can be cheaper but once you add on the expensive shipping cost and the 20% tax for the product and the shipping as well as the courier handling fee, the price racks up fast. I just looked and found one for £552.46 with £7.01 postage. After import and handling the total is £685.764 so better but still. Also this isn’t a great model for our hobby shops now is it? That and you have zero recourse if you ever have an issue with the kit or a part is missing.
Who was hating on the SRX? I said the price is ridicules in the UK, that’a all so I think you are projecting a bit on that one my friend. I also still have it in my collection so 🤷🏼♂️
Touring cars as in Tamiya stock class are great fun but it’s a stock class. As for Touring, do we see many Tamiya cars winning big titles these days at the sharp end of pro driving? So like I said before, pay more, import everything to save money, struggle to find parts and then import them, taking days, and purchase the latest tech that’s two years ago from what others are selling. Don’t get me wrong, some of the TRF stuff looks lovely and I really want to get a 501x but when I look at the facts, this is what I see. Now if Tamiya fan boys are blinkered and can’t have a balanced opinion on it, not my problem as I will go on liking and collecting Tamiya and talking about the good and the bad openly.
@@RCKickschannelA bit defensive there Gav 😂
I have a great relationship with hobby shops in the uk and still buy all my electronics tyres, bodyshells and accessories from them.
I also buy my TRF stuff from a small hobby shop in Germany that I’ve built a good relationship with so I’m still supporting the little guy whilst cutting out the price gouging uk distributor.
Also did you miss the part were I said £500 Delivered I.E including postage, fees etc. and came in 3 days. I’ve had Modelsport take longer to deliver.
The TRF421 came 7th overall on its debut at TITC in a field with the likes of Marc Reinhard, Ronald Volker, Bruno Coehlo & Alex Hadberg. With a driver who hasn’t been around that much so I would say that’s competitive wouldn’t you?
Buggy racing I’d go straight to Schumacher or associated I’ve have a B6.3 and an LD2 as Tamiyas aren’t competitive. But TRF Touring cars are competitive in Blinky and Mod classes and a valid choice that don’t deserve the constant blinkered criticism you show towards them.
Oh and who doesn’t love a bit of colour against the boring blacked out cars of the other manufacturers.
I’m not convinced of the validity comparing an old tamiya to a new team associated for the same money, and while I am a tamiya fan, I get that they are not race bred, but so do tamiya, that isn’t where the market is. Not anymore. I think people buy a tamiya because it looks awesome for the most part. If all you want is to win races, it probably doesn’t matter what brand it is as long as it wins the race? I don’t know as I’m not a racer, and explains why my shelves are full of mostly Tamiya’s lol
It’s a PR Racing modern buggy, not an AE buggy, it’s the PRSB401 Type R 👍🏻
The reason for this series was due to the amount of messages, emails and comments I have gotten asking me what Tamiya should I purchase to go racing. When I looked at it logically, I couldn’t find a current Tamiya I would recommend to actually race. Now obviously if someone wanted to run a tamiya stock class or even rally racing you could but for road and buggy, everything just looked over priced, hard to find and just not as good as other options available for less. I looked around and the best Tamiya that interested me, was available (ish) and I suspected could perform reasonably well but would show the reasons why I recommended other options. Thats why I went with the Durga in the end and I have always wanted to add one to my collection. 100% get a tamiya for collecting be that NIB, shelf queen, garden running or having fun driving around a track or just because you enjoy the build. Tamiya are fantastic for this stuff but if you want to go “racing” to compete, you look elsewhere. If you already own a Tamiya and you want to start racing, nothing wrong with starting off using the Tamiya as you already have it and you will still have fun with it, but if you want to win and go faster, you will always move away to something else in the end, especially buggy racing. Thats why I wouldn’t recommend buying a Tamiya to go racing. 👍🏻
so there was a 15.5T in the DB and 6.5T in the PR - and the PR was faster, wow, that's so amazing!, such a great video gav, trigger those fanboys!
Thanks man, that's most kind of you to say!
@@RCKickschannel no worries gav, the sooner those tamiya blockheads unsub the better this channel will be!
This is an interesting comparison. I am looking for ward to the next installment of the Tamiya soap opera.
Sorry gav but…same bodyshell?
Like myself i can tell your obviously an f1 nut, the only way to compare comparatively is to exactly do what your saying with same electronics, new tyres etc. it is pretty pointless people stating they can beat another car when it is another driver, i mean a prime example in todays modern f1 racing is Max versus perez and we know whos always on top in that scenario!
1000%
68 pounds for a pair of front dampers? Then you also bought a pair for the rears for 68 I guess as well. OMG! At what price does UK charge for customs fees? I don't know what's with Tamiya compared to other brands where all brands have almost the same price whichever country you buy them from but with Tamiya, you can only buy them cheap from Japan and Hong Kong. The rest have these inflated prices.
UK customs is 20% of the product total price, plus 20% of the shipping price. Yes, we pay tax on the shipping as well! Not only that but the courier companies like to get in on that and charge us £12.00 fee to send a letter telling us to pay the tax. All a bit painful when you want to purchase a £30 part and it costs £8.00 to ship it. The total is £57.20!
What is the point ??!!
Why does it need a point? Can it not just be RC entertainment.
I would never buy a Tamiya for racing, there are much better cars on the market imo
Fantastic video Gavin👌👌
You get isehier drivers everywhere
The title is clickbait and the vid incomplete. 1) Why wouldn't you race a Tamiya against other Tamiya's, with a silver can motor ? 2) You admit that getting a Tamiya up to mod-race-spec is more expensive but why does that make it a no-go for racing ? If someone wants to spend more than he has to in order to race, isn't that the same as somebody collecting vintage models to put on a shelf instead of re-re's ? In short, because you can't afford it, nobody should go down that path ?
🤦🏼🤷🏼♂️
Anyone that gets triggered by this is delusional...
I will never buy one for any purpose. They are decades out of date. They are stuck in the 70s-80s.