Good review. I've had one for about 6 months and absolutely love it. It's indispensable for me for warbirds and helicopters. It was the realism boost I've waited years for.
I just got the winwing last year...... I love it for the very reasons your showing that this is just like that but the next level up.... Now I gotta find a grand somewhere AGAIN......
Good review! I have one but nice to see any info on it in case I'm using it wrong lol! One thing maybe worth trying is the virpil angled short extension that I found allowed me to get it over my legs much better so it wasn't at arms length when pushing forwwrd in it. Might have a vkb option too.
You had me at 3:50, simulating ETL shuttering. As a real helicopter pilot this has always felt like such an omission and killed the immersiveness. I wanted to build my own cyclic but I think I now have to save a couple hundred Euro more :D
Awesome, do you have like a fish scale or something you can measure the force at the handle of your stick? I know at the base its about 5-6kg but moving up it exponentially gets weaker so I was curious what it would be at the handle
I have a similar aluminium extrusion rig with a shared racing and flight setup. Just received my rhino and am raking my brain thinking of ways to mount it with some sort of "quick release" like mechanism. What did you land on? Did you hard mount yours?
Guys I was reading a blog regarding dcs and in that case Brunner ffb yoke. Sure it was a 3y hold review, but they were saing that no forces were detected apart from trimming. Has the new version of dcs changed the amount of details sent to the joystick????
For the base game no there is only trim force, each module has its own forces added, which only some like the f14 and warbirds have added forces. Vp force then runs an additional program that adds more forces on top.
All vkb grip functions normally, the grip is still hooked to the vkb black box and goes through the vkb software, the vkb stuff doesn't even know its mounted to another base other than it can't see the base axis and blinks the red led on the black box to notify you of such.
In the video, you have your spring strength at 100%, but you seem to have no issue moving the joystick.. Do you have very weak motors or did i miss something?
Do you use VKB's Blackbox or do you have a workaround to use the MCG grip without? I have the adapter but unable to find a blackbox for sale in the UK.
Yes, it's relevant for the effects like stall buffeting, vibrations, and changing your spring force by a click of a button or turn of the knob. an f15 or 18 probably (I don't fly them so I wouldn't know 100%) have feedback motors IRL giving the pilot control feel, and you'd still need to trim the control forces out, but the end result is similar to a spring stick so the difference in a FFB stick is less so than helicopters. If you fly warbirds or helicopters, this stick is a huge leap forward, if modern jets it's a small step forward.
I beg to differ, 800 € is actually cheap. Try making one on your own and you'll see: Walmis sells the motor kits for builders (no waiting) and a lot of people have alread built their own FFB joystick with the motor kits. I don't know why he doesn't raise the price with the demand going through the roof and still no competition in any similar price range. I would pay twice as much.
Most aircraft I know of thats fbw have artificial feel added. Exception would be the f16 since its force sensing and therefore doesn't really move. I fly helicopters in dcs so ffb is really needed to remove the jank gameism trim solutions.
Is there a setting in DCS to enable FF, or is it automatic? Received mine today, and (admittedly in 10 mins fiddling) was unable to feel any in game forces…
In the dcs settings menu, I think under game options, is a checkbox to enable force feedback. Then you should also be running telemffb program from vpforce which adds more effects
@@ryancreed2830 I haven't tried, but the effects like the gun and trim are added via the external program and therefor will be applied to any aircraft. They are always updating and improving it so it would surprise me if it didn't have a lot of added effects.
Brunner doesn't have secondary effects unless the module itself adds them like the f14. Brunner also overheats and shuts off the motors after a couple minutes of full gain. Everyone I know who has both is putting their Brunner up for sale
Helos are very sensitive, all control movements are micro movements, the stick movements look exaggerated due to its axis not being set to the limits of real life for this video. The pedals are vkb which only have less than 3" of total movement.
Its over a year. There's a LOT of people on the waiting list, but a lot also back out. When I got on the list the production capacity was about 20 units a month and there was like 200 people ahead of me, but around 60 people backed out. I have a feeling the list is now 400 people deep since the word has been getting out. But production is up to 25-30 a month.
IL-2 has FFB support of its own for the basics. In addition to that VPForce telemetry sw project is adding more effects for IL-2 every week. And you can tinker these effects yourself - albeit a nice GUI for that is still missing.
How smooth and accurate is it at tiny movements like in very close formation flying and f16 tanking? I’m concerned it’s not exact enough as it’s all 3d printed and stretching rubber belts.
it will be exactly the same as far as accuracy hall sensors are all ready producing far more resolution then the game can use . and any 2 axis cam style gimbal will be as smooth if not more so as the design is for that very purpose. the force feedback gimbal have electric motors to provide the tension an as electric motors use a magnet an stator design you will always get some form of micro bump between the magnets anybody who says otherwise is simply ether over looking due to euphoria or just straight up lying
Hello can I ask you for some general questions regarding flying a plane. My biggest weakness is pulling too much aoa and stalling. I only have a t16000m stick and not sure what to do.
Good review. I've had one for about 6 months and absolutely love it. It's indispensable for me for warbirds and helicopters. It was the realism boost I've waited years for.
I'm in the discord channel but how do I order this and does it come as a whole unite I have VKB stick already
I wouldn't be without mine (My Rhino), previously I have been using a MSFFB2 for the past 20yrs previously !!! brilliant kit.
I just got the winwing last year...... I love it for the very reasons your showing that this is just like that but the next level up.... Now I gotta find a grand somewhere AGAIN......
Mine shipped yesterday after a 7 month wait. Hope nobody expected to see me after new years.
I got on the wait list about the same time yours shipped it seems, time for a long wait 😂
@@terraoftime Just gotten it up and running so naturally a whole lot of tuning to do. But so far WORTH IT.
I now only have 23 Rhino orders before mine! I am so excited
You should, it's worth the wait 😄 also the price is a steal. I was lucky I happened to hear of this project almost a year ago and ordered right away.
@@lelv30superbus64 thanks, now only 18 to go :)
What link did u use to order?
@@gmac2493 via his discord channel. Over 12 months wait for people though
@@gmac2493VPForce discord channel has all the ordering info
Good review! I have one but nice to see any info on it in case I'm using it wrong lol! One thing maybe worth trying is the virpil angled short extension that I found allowed me to get it over my legs much better so it wasn't at arms length when pushing forwwrd in it. Might have a vkb option too.
You had me at 3:50, simulating ETL shuttering. As a real helicopter pilot this has always felt like such an omission and killed the immersiveness. I wanted to build my own cyclic but I think I now have to save a couple hundred Euro more :D
couple of hundreds? MOre like close to 1k
nice review
I my god, I must have it!
Awesome, do you have like a fish scale or something you can measure the force at the handle of your stick? I know at the base its about 5-6kg but moving up it exponentially gets weaker so I was curious what it would be at the handle
Can someone attach a link for the preorders - one above doesn’t seem to work?
I have a similar aluminium extrusion rig with a shared racing and flight setup. Just received my rhino and am raking my brain thinking of ways to mount it with some sort of "quick release" like mechanism. What did you land on? Did you hard mount yours?
Same question
Google QR4rigs does quick release stuff.
That's awesome. Can you attach the Warthog stick to it?
Yes you can
Can force change with airspeed for warbirds?
Guys I was reading a blog regarding dcs and in that case Brunner ffb yoke.
Sure it was a 3y hold review, but they were saing that no forces were detected apart from trimming.
Has the new version of dcs changed the amount of details sent to the joystick????
For the base game no there is only trim force, each module has its own forces added, which only some like the f14 and warbirds have added forces. Vp force then runs an additional program that adds more forces on top.
But you are happy with the VKB grip on it, right? I mean, using this base limits the functionalities of the grip?
All vkb grip functions normally, the grip is still hooked to the vkb black box and goes through the vkb software, the vkb stuff doesn't even know its mounted to another base other than it can't see the base axis and blinks the red led on the black box to notify you of such.
@@suprakillavr4 thanks
Just add a VKB adapter when you order. I'm using an MCGU too with Rhino.
VKB or Virpil grip?
FFB + VR = just no more need of a diy rig with functioning canopy lol. Cheers!!
In the video, you have your spring strength at 100%, but you seem to have no issue moving the joystick.. Do you have very weak motors or did i miss something?
There's a potentiometer on the base and I have that set to adjust spring force on the fly and it's set to about 30%
Wish I could afford one
Can this be used with old games such as IL-2 1946?
Do you use VKB's Blackbox or do you have a workaround to use the MCG grip without? I have the adapter but unable to find a blackbox for sale in the UK.
I use vkb box, I have the full vkb stick before buying this
So when you connect your VKB grip to the base, are you still able to program it with the VKB software? How does that work?
Vkb grip still plugged into vkb black box. It still thinks its on a vkb base.
@@suprakillavr4 thanks for the quick reply. I was just curious. It seems it will take me a while to be able to save up for something like this.
Quick technical question please, is the ffb relevant on modern aircraft, like f15 or 18, how do they trim irl ?
Yes, it's relevant for the effects like stall buffeting, vibrations, and changing your spring force by a click of a button or turn of the knob. an f15 or 18 probably (I don't fly them so I wouldn't know 100%) have feedback motors IRL giving the pilot control feel, and you'd still need to trim the control forces out, but the end result is similar to a spring stick so the difference in a FFB stick is less so than helicopters. If you fly warbirds or helicopters, this stick is a huge leap forward, if modern jets it's a small step forward.
looks good, but also looks expensive.. whats the price to get it to your doorstep?
820ish euros, which I think is right over $1000
I beg to differ, 800 € is actually cheap. Try making one on your own and you'll see: Walmis sells the motor kits for builders (no waiting) and a lot of people have alread built their own FFB joystick with the motor kits. I don't know why he doesn't raise the price with the demand going through the roof and still no competition in any similar price range. I would pay twice as much.
Aren't most real fighter sticks fly by wire with no feedback?
Most aircraft I know of thats fbw have artificial feel added. Exception would be the f16 since its force sensing and therefore doesn't really move. I fly helicopters in dcs so ffb is really needed to remove the jank gameism trim solutions.
where can you buy this, i don't see a store, or is this only available in the usa?
vpforcecontrols.com/
Is there a setting in DCS to enable FF, or is it automatic? Received mine today, and (admittedly in 10 mins fiddling) was unable to feel any in game forces…
In the dcs settings menu, I think under game options, is a checkbox to enable force feedback. Then you should also be running telemffb program from vpforce which adds more effects
@@suprakillavr4 can it add FFB to a f18? I know its FWB but it would be so cool to have it respond like a f-14 or something akin to that. thanks!
@@ryancreed2830 I haven't tried, but the effects like the gun and trim are added via the external program and therefor will be applied to any aircraft. They are always updating and improving it so it would surprise me if it didn't have a lot of added effects.
11:08 - what makes it better than the Brunner?
Brunner doesn't have secondary effects unless the module itself adds them like the f14. Brunner also overheats and shuts off the motors after a couple minutes of full gain. Everyone I know who has both is putting their Brunner up for sale
@@suprakillavr4 Thanks, good to know!
How are you controlling the helo's torque without pedals.. your feet aren't moving...? What is this magic? :)
Helos are very sensitive, all control movements are micro movements, the stick movements look exaggerated due to its axis not being set to the limits of real life for this video. The pedals are vkb which only have less than 3" of total movement.
What makes it better than the brunner?
£650 cheaper plus import tax and duty makes it better for me.
It’s in the post on its way to me.😂
2 year waiting time...did I hear that correctly??
Its over a year. There's a LOT of people on the waiting list, but a lot also back out. When I got on the list the production capacity was about 20 units a month and there was like 200 people ahead of me, but around 60 people backed out. I have a feeling the list is now 400 people deep since the word has been getting out. But production is up to 25-30 a month.
@@suprakillavr4 thanks for the info.
dose it work with il2
Yes
IL-2 has FFB support of its own for the basics. In addition to that VPForce telemetry sw project is adding more effects for IL-2 every week. And you can tinker these effects yourself - albeit a nice GUI for that is still missing.
How smooth and accurate is it at tiny movements like in very close formation flying and f16 tanking? I’m concerned it’s not exact enough as it’s all 3d printed and stretching rubber belts.
I'm never going back to my vkb base.
it will be exactly the same as far as accuracy hall sensors are all ready producing far more resolution then the game can use . and any 2 axis cam style gimbal will be as smooth if not more so as the design is for that very purpose. the force feedback gimbal have electric motors to provide the tension an as electric motors use a magnet an stator design you will always get some form of micro bump between the magnets anybody who says otherwise is simply ether over looking due to euphoria or just straight up lying
Hello can I ask you for some general questions regarding flying a plane.
My biggest weakness is pulling too much aoa and stalling.
I only have a t16000m stick and not sure what to do.
In dcs use saturation or a bit of curve on your axis binds. There are plenty of videos how to set them up.
@@suprakillavr4 thank you, I can’t really control the mig21 in dcs, as it’s too easy to pull too much Aoa.
I’m planing to get the vkb gunfighter with an extension, would you recommend the 100mm or 200mm extension.
200 if you mount in front of you down low
Where to buy?
vpforcecontrols.com/
which headset are you using?
Oculus quest 2
Where the fuck are your rudder pedals, HELLO?
@@theeltea under my feet