Collision of Metrolink Passenger Train and Union Pacific Railroad Freight Train

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  • Опубліковано 22 гру 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 133

  • @Cwilliam1999
    @Cwilliam1999 7 років тому +83

    long story short don't text while driving even on the rails.

  • @geomodelrailroader
    @geomodelrailroader 4 роки тому +15

    because of Chatsworth we now have PTC which is mandatory on all lines. Had PTC been implemented during Chatsworth the Metrolink train would have received a forced emergency application before it SPADed the signal and hit the side of the UP train causing the accident.

  • @heathmondo5224
    @heathmondo5224 8 років тому +60

    It was the Metrolink Enginner's Fault

    • @T128Productions
      @T128Productions 5 місяців тому

      Yes. He should’ve left his phone alone and should stopped at CP Topanga.

  • @GevoGenesis92
    @GevoGenesis92 7 років тому +82

    And ever since this day, train crew's are no longer allowed to have their phone's on while the train is in operation.

    • @louisvilleslugger3979
      @louisvilleslugger3979 7 років тому +17

      I still dont trust that, there needs to be something installed that automatically forces a train to stop at a red signal if the driver does not respond

    • @oxenforde
      @oxenforde 7 років тому +13

      Actually ... there has been such a rule for many years (certainly before 2008). Use of a cell phone was a clear violation.

    • @drh.1142
      @drh.1142 7 років тому +13

      Already done. PTC.

    • @scottbuchanan8300
      @scottbuchanan8300 4 роки тому +4

      @@louisvilleslugger3979 Welcome to the UK, where we have this on our trains!

    • @louisvilleslugger3979
      @louisvilleslugger3979 4 роки тому +2

      @@scottbuchanan8300 Thats great! I would love to come visit there someday!

  • @111jacare
    @111jacare 6 років тому +46

    With this video, though I am not a rail operator, there is one thing that sticks out like a sore thumb to my thinking. Signal post 4451 is on the approach side of the Chatsworth station. Is it possible that it could happen that an Engineer 'forgets' what signal they have passed, stops at the station, then proceeds, forgetting what the signal was that they just went past?
    Would it be prudent to have a 'repeater' or 'slave' signal at the departure end of the platform, reminding the Engineer what the signal is for the section ahead, and that there is a red signal waiting for them? It has been my observation that many railways have the signalling set by distance between signals, and often have a station after a signal head.

    • @amtrak706
      @amtrak706 6 років тому +33

      Yes it would, most lines that host heavy passenger operations have modified their signal spacing so that a signal is visible from every station. For those that have not, there is a rule called Delay In Block specifically created to prevent crashes like this one. The rule states that if a train stops within a signal block before the next signal is visible, then that train must proceed at restricted speed prepared to stop at the next signal, regardless of what the previous signal was displaying.

    • @KutWrite
      @KutWrite 5 років тому +8

      @@amtrak706: Yes, we also had that rule at CSX back in the late 90s.
      Also that all personal electronic devices had to be OFF while on duty.

    • @amtrak706
      @amtrak706 5 років тому +5

      KutWrite Makes sense, I think the delay in block rule was either created or at least greatly expanded after the 1996 Silver Spring, MD wreck which took place on CSX territory.

    • @RaineStudio
      @RaineStudio 4 роки тому +6

      The driver should have seen the Stop signal and points set against him at CP Topanga, even if he had forgotten about the Approach signal.

    • @garingdahl
      @garingdahl 4 роки тому +5

      British trains use a DRA (Driver Reminder Appliance) in this situation. After stopping at the station, driver activates the DRA, the train can't be moved in this state. The driver must deactivate the DRA in order to move the train, thus "reminding" them of the potential for the next signal to be red.

  • @sapper82
    @sapper82 7 років тому +42

    Presumably both drivers were killed.
    A SPAD, Signal Passed At Danger, as we call it over this side of the pond, caused by the METRO Driver being preoccupied with his texting on his phone.
    After more than a few similar tragic events on the railways over this side of the pond, we have a new system, TPWS, (Train Protection and Warning System) that will apply the brakes of any train passing a red signal.
    I hope your railroads have now developed an equivalent and are installing it.

    • @bigdave46148
      @bigdave46148 7 років тому +14

      The railroads are in the process of installing Positive Train Control (PTC) right now. The government wanted it up and running by the end of 2016 but the RR's had to ask for an extension because the cost is being footed by the RR's alone and they are behind in getting it installed.

    • @jaredkelly930
      @jaredkelly930 5 років тому +20

      Nope the crew of the UP train lived. They had to be extricated by LAFD members, but they survived with injuries.

    • @jeffclark5268
      @jeffclark5268 2 роки тому +2

      Nope…cuz FREEDOM!

    • @sapper82
      @sapper82 2 роки тому +3

      @@jaredkelly930 Thank God for that.

  • @jacksalvin364
    @jacksalvin364 5 років тому +9

    On September 12th, 2008 just before sunset, Metrolink Train 111 collided head on with Union Pacific Freight Train at 4:22 p.m. and 23 seconds just outside of Chatsworth, California. 25 were killed in the collision and 135 were injured the crash collision.

  • @SimonTekConley
    @SimonTekConley 6 років тому +21

    I was on that scene.

  • @Nash1a
    @Nash1a 7 років тому +8

    If anyone knows, I'm curious about this: At that last red signal, the Metrolink would have had to cross a switch already set for the on coming Union Pacific train to enter the siding. So how does that not cause a derailleur or at the very least and auto emergency breaking?

    • @MelioraCogito
      @MelioraCogito 7 років тому +10

      The turnouts (switches or "points") are designed to permit trains running in the opposite direction to the turnout to 'run through' a diversion turnout setting without causing a derailment.
      As for an alarm system initiating emergency braking. That's a good point. Unfortunately, unlike European railways where train movements are (for the most part) strictly controlled, were a train to pass a stop signal, an automated emergency braking application (which cannot be over-ridden by the engineer) would be initiated, North American railways are not as automated.
      I suspect ownership of the rail infrastructure has a lot to do with it. In Europe, most railway infrastructure is owned by national governments where road safety takes precedence over cost factors. In North America, most rail infrastructure is owned by the railroad companies themselves, where the bottom line (profit) take precedence over road safety - not that NA RR companies are 'unsafe,' they're as safe as the regulations governing them compel them to be safe.
      They're unlikely to spend money to improve safety (by employing automated train control systems) if the regulations don't require it.

    • @sapper82
      @sapper82 7 років тому +4

      Excellent post!
      Another factor is that in Europe, especially in the UK, the Unions are very quick to take action should a dangerous situation arise.
      Whilst the are times when the UK's transport unions can be a pain in the arse, they have, by and large, contributed greatly to improving safety.

    • @scythelord
      @scythelord 7 років тому +6

      Unions are why US rail doesn't have automated safety systems like that. They fight automation of train systems as ultimately the whole system could be automated and they'd all be out of jobs.

    • @sapper82
      @sapper82 7 років тому +2

      Even without going to full blown automation, there are a lot of systems that can be installed to help the Loco Driver do his/her job safely and over here in the UK the Unions assist that process.

    • @losteroni
      @losteroni 7 років тому +1

      Absolutely like even just an itinerary schedule to already have a plan as to what other trains are using the same track and when to expect to stop and let them pass . I can't believe they're just flying blind and relying ENTIRELY on signals a system developed in the1800's !

  • @pix-point
    @pix-point 7 років тому +3

    Is there no PZB or Indusi System in the USA that automatically forces a train to stop at a red signal if the driver does not respond?

    • @xygomorphic44
      @xygomorphic44 7 років тому +3

      Railroads are in the process of installing this technology (around 30% done by now) but it's been a long drawn out battle. For years there had been talk of requiring the railroads to install it, but they didn't want to spend the money so they lobbied hard against it. But they new the regulations were coming sooner or later. This accident finally gave the railroad administration the ammo they needed to enforce it and the railroads were given until the end of 2015. That deadline came and went and now its been pushed back to the end of 2018.

  • @tom201090
    @tom201090 2 роки тому

    Are these seriously the best graphics the NTSB could find? It looks like something you'd find on a classic vintage video game!

    • @xaero76
      @xaero76 Рік тому +3

      This was 2008 son........ vids were at a lower resolution back then....
      and it never needs to be super high detail.... all you need is basic information, anything else is a waste...

  • @u12bdragon
    @u12bdragon 2 роки тому +1

    Dude, couldn't they retrofit trains with GPS's linked to BIG lights inside the cabin that correspond to the upcoming signal, and say the distance to the upcoming signal below on a screen?

    • @WTC2014
      @WTC2014 11 місяців тому

      It's called cab signals

  • @rickchaidez5711
    @rickchaidez5711 2 роки тому

    What kind of switch machine did the metrolink train trailed?

  • @stumpypetros2685
    @stumpypetros2685 5 років тому +6

    sapper - not new :P Aussie trains have physical signal stops .. little moving bits of metal that flip up on a red STOP and it immediatly physically flips a SPADding trains brake valve with no driver input at all.
    Signals WERE set so that the signals were max speed stopping distance away from a potential crash.
    Sydney almost have had NO accidents.
    Now the 'highly intelligent' railway designers over here are going to shorten the distance between trains without taking speed / weight into consideration, AND puting the reliance on drivers reaction.
    ie the driver who goes "oh er ive got er two seconds to press the stop before um" CRASH!!
    I've been using trains for 40 years. This year I will not be trusting them to carry me and more as soon as the new design goes in.

  • @xonx209
    @xonx209 6 місяців тому +1

    When metrolink ran a red light, why didn't the dispatch say or do something, like "stop!! what are you doing?"

    • @seymoarsalvage
      @seymoarsalvage 5 місяців тому +1

      They didn't have time. It was only 5 sec before the crash.

  • @asura6441
    @asura6441 3 роки тому +1

    Didn’t the metro-link train engineer send the message?

  • @jellofan
    @jellofan 7 років тому +14

    The final report of this incident is a very interesting read: www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/RAR1001.pdf
    Amazing that the engineer was planning on letting a "railfan" run the train later that day, and had already let one do so earlier in the week.

  • @Stefan_Boerjesson
    @Stefan_Boerjesson Рік тому +1

    Incredible that a nation placing men on the moon 40 years earlier have developed and use better safety systems today.

  • @ericwilliams1023
    @ericwilliams1023 2 роки тому +1

    In laymen terms..was he supposed to stop at th at red signal before the curve? Its seems he totally missed it!!

  • @Hellodarknessmyolefriend
    @Hellodarknessmyolefriend 7 років тому +2

    Didn't the metro has cab signals?

    • @mikelowery5741
      @mikelowery5741 5 років тому

      Mad Hatter not sure but if he did he’d probably ignore those too

    • @EMD_F59PHI
      @EMD_F59PHI 3 місяці тому

      *Metro have**

  • @catlover2368
    @catlover2368 3 роки тому +3

    seconds from disaster did a episode on this one! they told a complete version of what happened! it said the driver of the metro link fell asleep! before the collision!

    • @delanorrosey4730
      @delanorrosey4730 Рік тому

      Did they? I don't remember that episode.
      Upon further searching, you've confused the Numb3rs episode "Thirty-Six Hours" with the Chatsworth disaster. Two weeks after the episode was filmed, the Chatsworth crash occurred. The episode was revised to include episodic events that occurred after the end of the story arc.

  • @XSFlanger
    @XSFlanger 6 років тому +1

    What about controllers/dispatchers? Wasn't train positions in general be visible to them back then?

  • @chrispasini5870
    @chrispasini5870 Рік тому

    So first flashing 🟡 that means slow right Next solid 🟡 that would mean next signal 🚦 is the solid Red 🟥 so they should of stopped before the curve union Pacific would of Gone to the siding and Metrolink would of continued if they Saw the signal lights. Is that how the was supposed to work? If I understand the video correctly. This could of been avoided if they watched the signals instead of texting. I remember this it was a terrible crash.

  • @billmorris2613
    @billmorris2613 2 роки тому

    Good morning to all from SE Louisiana 27 Apr 22.

  • @ocsrc
    @ocsrc 10 місяців тому +1

    This is why we MUST have the PTC computer controlled ATCS and no human allowed to override the computer.
    Humans will blow through red signals.
    The computer will not

  • @CallsItLikeISeizeIts
    @CallsItLikeISeizeIts 3 роки тому +1

    At least he can say he died from texting

  • @jaredkelly930
    @jaredkelly930 5 років тому +15

    All this because the Metrolink engineer was texting a foamer.

    • @ironmatic1
      @ironmatic1 3 роки тому +4

      This is why railroads don't hire foamers.

  • @momentumproductions6290
    @momentumproductions6290 3 роки тому +3

    This is why PTC should have been mandated so many years ago. It's sad that people had to die for the railroads to implement it.

  • @j.o.a.t9718
    @j.o.a.t9718 3 роки тому +1

    distracted driving. They were both texting while driving.

  • @MichaelMontgomery-c2u
    @MichaelMontgomery-c2u 9 днів тому

    If you look at the area...clearly Metrolink should have waited at Chatsworth station. Theres no reason for you to continue. It's literally a double track. Why risk it going into a single track regardless of the signal.

  • @iknowyoureright8564
    @iknowyoureright8564 День тому

    why doesn’t the US have TPWS?
    they should definitely have it ok high risk areas…..single like junctions.
    Basically a magnet that is active when the corresponding signal is at danger, if the train SPADS then it will force and emergency brake application, there is also OSS (overspeed sensor) which is an additional set of magnets on approach to the signal. When the signal is at danger these two magnets (which are a set distance apart) start tiling the train when it passes the first one and then stops at the second one….this works out the speed it is travelling, if it is over a pre set speed then the train will not have time to stop and will spad, So the TPWS OSS will apply full emergency brakes to prevent it passing signal at danger. This isn’t new tech either….it works very very well and easily maintained…!

  • @othername1000
    @othername1000 4 роки тому

    Full hearing link?

  • @rustyshackleford9115
    @rustyshackleford9115 7 років тому

    What kind of horn is that?

    • @T128Productions
      @T128Productions 5 місяців тому +1

      There was no train horn sounds used in this particular presentation.

  • @MudderFukker-m6g
    @MudderFukker-m6g 5 років тому +8

    Last Text: "Sorry, can't make it... I'll be dead"

    • @T128Productions
      @T128Productions 5 місяців тому

      Actually it said: “Yea… Usually @ north camarilo.”

  • @stumpypetros2685
    @stumpypetros2685 5 років тому +14

    BTW I just heard the 911 call... UNBELIEVABLE.. "
    "So sir your in a train? yes Where did it crash?"
    I don't know - just near the tunnel umm we just left Chatsworth station.
    "Sir Im gonna need an intersection"
    I'm in a train I just left Chatsworth station
    This happens in Sydney as well.
    "000 what is the nature of the call?"
    "I am at Central station, someones just collapsed and ~"
    "Central station you say Sir? what is the address please."
    "I'm at the S T A T I O N called Central"
    "Sorry but I nees a intersection or crossroad"
    It's a dratted computer they are using. Why cannot the computer allow major landmarks to be entered in.. ?!?!?!
    ie "Sydney Harbout bridge" (Bet you don'/t know what road it is ???)
    or what about ..
    "I'm in the Blue mountains reporting a bush fire."
    "Sir what is your nearest street."
    "Um in the Blue Mountains??"

    • @peterf.229
      @peterf.229 5 років тому

      well, I dont know a whole lot about Australia but the Blue mountains is a rather large area.

    • @DominicciSkycam
      @DominicciSkycam 4 роки тому

      Taking 1-2 mins to determine an exact location is better than giving a broad location and having 1st responders run around like headless chickens for 10-15 mins. In moments of uncertainty it is better to take maybe a few more seconds and create clarity, instead of more chaos. It is deliberate.

    • @stumpypetros2685
      @stumpypetros2685 4 роки тому

      @@peterf.229 yep :) with no cross roads, and mostly, no formal paths.
      The best you can do is give a GPS if you have one.
      Best the Emergency services could have done in BOTH cases is immediately pass the call to a LOCAL emergency station, who would know exactly where the person was describing.

    • @stumpypetros2685
      @stumpypetros2685 4 роки тому

      ​ @Jo Ubi respect your reply, however most people know that the station name and they are in shock, and cannot see any details.
      What I think would be best is Internet Maps can find stations and the emergency service and train companys website should have a lookup.
      BUT I had to report a passenger on a train, I gave the carriage numberplate to Sydney Trains and they asked me so was it an Oscar carriage? what time did the train leave? how would I know what type of carriage it was and it doesn't matter..
      They should have been able to lookup the carriage numberplate, and find what train / destinations it was on, and times.

  • @bouffant-girl
    @bouffant-girl 3 роки тому +1

    Positive train control and fra regulations updates followed this incident this is why you never text and drive

  • @JaimeMendozaEnterprisesInc
    @JaimeMendozaEnterprisesInc 4 роки тому +1

    4:52 Message Received: “I would like that too. We already need to meet 796. That would be best.”

  • @garywatson
    @garywatson 4 роки тому +7

    I was there right after this happened in case my CERT team was called out (it wasn't). About all I could do is let a couple frantic family members use my mobile phone since many people didn't have them in 2008. Don't know how it turned out for them. Another informative video is by a plaintiff's law firm: ua-cam.com/video/Tt0VNqp8EgY/v-deo.html

    • @JawTooth
      @JawTooth 3 роки тому

      Thanks for that other link. That had a lot more interesting information.

  • @mikelowery5741
    @mikelowery5741 5 років тому +4

    The Metrolink train should’ve derailed going against that switch am I right?!? I thought that’s what usually happens when a train goes against the switch

    • @cr10001
      @cr10001 5 років тому +9

      No, not necessarily. The wheel flanges can push the switch points out of the way. I don't know US practice but on some lines this is a design feature at crossing loops.

    • @stumpypetros2685
      @stumpypetros2685 4 роки тому +2

      The problem with loops is the two rails are closing each end so yeah the train can push the points around.
      There is a design called a derailer point - bacically one rail has a point blade that derails the train if it is open, but then the low power electric signal would have to somehow push the derailer closed which is still VERY heavy.
      Australia uses kilometres of pipes of compressed air to move the points along entire parts of the line, and unfortunately, I think America has a lot of very long lines and could not do that.

    • @bhupinderbrar
      @bhupinderbrar 4 роки тому +2

      No, he just split that switch. Something like a "slap and stay" switch.

  • @chrispasini5870
    @chrispasini5870 Рік тому

    Good point rather it's a car, bus, train, or plane don't Text and operate machinery u might miss a 🛑 signal 🚦

  • @danielebrparish4271
    @danielebrparish4271 16 днів тому

    Cell phones should be checked for use after each shift and operators fired if it was used while they were in the cab. There is no safety reason for using a cell phone while driving.

  • @doogiehouser594
    @doogiehouser594 7 років тому +3

    Hey, all you insurance boys! Are you paying attention to this shit? How much do you lose when this happens?

  • @Hokieredneck
    @Hokieredneck 5 років тому +5

    train operators shouldn't be allowed to have phones in the cabs

  • @WarblesOnALot
    @WarblesOnALot 10 років тому +8

    G'day,
    Yay Team..!
    So, the "Miracle of Modern Telecommunications", in the form of Mobile Phone Short Message Servicing, has succeeded in defeating the 1950's Vintage Electro-Mechanically-switched Visual-Signals with Radio-Communications...; because the "Engineer" (Train-Driver) was "too busy" playing around with their Mobile Phone to have been bothered to call out their passage past a Yellow Signal, let alone stop theTrain in observance of the subsequently ignored Red Signal at the Control-Point.
    Change is not always Progress.
    ;-p
    Ciao !

  • @Spontainousteve
    @Spontainousteve 7 років тому +8

    When you're a government agency with millions and millions invested in cutting edge technology and you upload your video in 240p. Really NTSB? Really?

    • @Nash1a
      @Nash1a 7 років тому +15

      Its a 2008 crash. Likely the video was originally in standard def.

    • @Syclone0044
      @Syclone0044 5 років тому +2

      Check out the USCSB UA-cam channel. US Chemical Safety Board. They post the most incredible state of the art 3D animated recreations of postmortem accident investigations you’ve ever seen, and they’re incredibly entertaining too!
      Hundreds of people binge watch and subscribe to notifications and rush to view new CSB videos, I’m dead serious.

    • @fetchstixRHD
      @fetchstixRHD 3 роки тому

      @@Syclone0044: Aye, the USCSB make amazing videos, which appeal to so many people. I was actually binge-watching their investigation videos (so well made, I must repeat!) and was wondering whether the NTSB had a channel.

  • @neorblxeditz
    @neorblxeditz 3 роки тому

    the fact that this happens after 9/11 makes it more scary

    • @NoahDoane
      @NoahDoane 2 роки тому

      This was 7 years later, and not even on 9/11 either.

    • @neorblxeditz
      @neorblxeditz 2 роки тому

      @@NoahDoane I mean the day this happened on 9/12

  • @SOCALRRP
    @SOCALRRP 4 роки тому +2

    This is the chatsworth disaster

  • @MeaHeaR
    @MeaHeaR 3 роки тому

    Dhidd they deids ¿ ¿ ¿

  • @SRTRailfanProduction
    @SRTRailfanProduction 3 роки тому

    All 3 Locomotive and both train Metrolink 855 Union Pacific 8485,8491 damage beyond repair and scrapped

  • @robertgift
    @robertgift 8 років тому +3

    As an Operation Lifesaver presenter, I have ridden in the locomotive through this area several times.
    Sad that the engineers could not see each others trains and stop or sufficiently slow before collision.
    If one were to look, I bet each train could have been seen by the other in the distance.No excuse for the Metrolink engineer gayllowing himself to be distracted by the boys and failing to see the signals.

    • @cple1
      @cple1 8 років тому +5

      Only visible to each other for 5 seconds before impact.

    • @robertgift
      @robertgift 8 років тому +1

      cple1 Incorrect. One can see the train to the west and west train could have seen the east train. But could not discern which track the east train was on. Sad that no one bothered to look. But understandable.
      Inexcuseable thathe Metrolink engineer gayllowed himself to be distracted and failed to obey the signals.

    • @cple1
      @cple1 8 років тому +3

      Robert Gift it's what was said in the video. If I remember right this was on a curve and the UP train was coming out from under an over pass.

    • @robertgift
      @robertgift 8 років тому

      cple1 I know the route. Sad that each engineer did not notice the other's train moving north. Such would indicate thathey would collide. They collided athe northeast curve north of CP Topanga.
      Northwest of Denver, Colorado, freight trains collided under US36. Neither could see the other until they met on a curve under the highway.
      Had either been further ahead, they would have been in an open area where they could have seen one another.

    • @robertgift
      @robertgift 7 років тому +3

      Anthony Smith _"allowing himself...!"_
      My understanding is that the Metrolink engineer was homosexual. He gayllowed himself to be distracted byoung boy train enthusiasts.
      No excuse for failing to read and understand his signals.