Rebellion & Redemption | with Paul VanderKlay, Jonathan Pageau, & Wokal Distance
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- Опубліковано 29 сер 2024
- Wide-ranging discussion with my friends @wokaldistance7000 @JonathanPageau & @PaulVanderKlay about the fall and resurgence of Western civilization.
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You’re not bisexual, you’re 11.
The world needs more of this wisdom.
Wokal is absolutely on fire, and I like how much Paul is enjoying it. Thanks for putting this together Mr. Boyce, you really bring a lot to the table with the shows/interviews you do.
This surprised me as one of my fav convos that includes Paul and Jonathan--so many brilliant nuggets from these two in this convo. A great convo all around.
Lucky looky here..God boiz and Boyce... this is what the Internet was created four... feeding my two week old son at 4am... vibin with these convos
May he be a masculine child!
@@BenjaminABoyce - ❤️
This collab is astounding. Intellectual Greco-Logos lover, Seattle Empath, Orthodox Dad, and Cali Protestant pastor.
“Seattle Empath” is a new one!
@@BenjaminABoyce Love you Benji. You are definitely a unique Seattle Empath bringing a much needed softness to the Western, Godly, hard, masculine, Right-wing-solutions discussion.
You're the oil in the right's moral machine of digging exploration. I keep telling my friend that you're THE one threading the needle right now.
Anyway. Love ya Benji.
*Olympia* empath, no?
I was gonna object to «Seattle Empath» on someone's behalf, but he seems to have handled it gracefully already.
By the by, Drs. Heying and Weinstein aren't from/in Seattle, either. Sadly.
@@Zzyzzyx Somewhere between Portland and Vancouver (the farther Vancouver) - maybe we should just stick with Seattle after all.
Pageau always has the best conversations with the weirdest cats. Stay symbolic, brothas ✊️ !
This was brilliant. Always good to see Paul, John and Ben together. Wokal brought some great youth-vibes 👍
"Whatever action a great man performs, common men follow. And whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts, all the world pursues." Bhagavad Gita 3.21
From purport by A.C. Bhatkivedanta:
"People in general always require a leader who can teach the public by practical behavior. A leader cannot teach the public to stop smoking if he himself smokes."
"The king or the executive head of a state, the father and the schoolteacher are all considered to be natural leaders of the innocent people in general. All such natural leaders have a great responsibility to their dependents; therefore they must be conversant with standard books of moral and spiritual codes."
00:31:50 growing up as a conservative, I definitely would say, no, the conservatives were NOT in charge of the institutions until 2016. We've long heard of young adults from church going to college and being tricked into atheism. Hollywood and the music industry have long been pushers of the Sexual Revolution and opponents of traditional values. The pro-life fight was always an uphill battle until literally last year. I was mostly tracking with Wokal until he said that. It's plain demonstrably wrong. The issue is that liberals hit a plateau in their subversion of conservative values, and it took this new surge of progressivism to get them to their next stage.
32:00 that’s why in the new starwars movies they had to reset “the empire” so that the good guys could be the rebels again.
Wokal didn't seem to be listening
I didn't care much for him the first listen through, but i got a lot more out of it the second time around
Great talk! I wish to see more of Wokal and Lindsay
I really love Wokal and everything he brings, but sometimes he has a way of highjacking a conversation and driving it into the ground.
He has that issue. Sometimes he's ok. Other times he really gets into his shit. But he has said humble things before about his place in life. He just loves these topics
He is who he is. He rewatches our talks and takes critique seriously.
I think its cool to make space for unorthodox artists of ideas. Sure that might lead us astray sometimes, but when it leads to treasure we don't mind!
It was very frustrating
I'm happy to hear Wokal wherever he is.
LOVE this!! Great conversation with some of my favourites. Love how Wokal is thrown into the mix. And Benjamin too.
Still breathing the fumes from Thunder Bay, and glad to know others will experience the magic in Chino.❤
1:23:00 - I have come to terms with the fact that we are not in an age of great Christian glory. People in this little corner are like monks in monasteries during the middle ages. While the Roman empire collapses around us, we need to be austere and accept that things are crumbling and that the best thing we can do is pray and copy down books and know that a new age will come beyond us that we have incubated.
I disagree because I’ve seen so many ppl coming to God. Even the hardcore atheists agree that a Christian moral framework is necessary to conserve our way of life. That’s a big deal. Very quickly the New Atheist movement of the 2000s has died.
I have a friend who was a long time non-believer. Now he wants to go to church and sees the importance of believing in God.
Even I woke up after 20 years of being an atheist after leaving the church as a teen/young adult. JBP’s Genesis lectures did it for me. I didn’t have to literally believe the stories in the Bible. That they were real without being materially real made so much more sense.
I see this as God’s Great Awakening. The blinders that everyone had on bc of the establishment’s grip on controlling information have been removed. We now see those who insist on believing the lies vs those who seek the Truth.
It is an exciting time to be alive. Don’t let your pessimism taint how glorious of an era we are in to witness. The principalities are acting the way they are because they are losing their grip. God is revealing the Truth and ppl are starting to see.
@@umiluv every statistic disagrees with this, though. For every person who comes to God, 5 people stop going to church. I think my view is realistic, not pessimistic.
How about Buddhist tradition holding some answers about non-discursive or beyond discursive meaning finding (as through meditation) while in real life we practice loving kindness … Just a thought, must say I found this conversation fascinating but by far it exceeds my knowledge, thank you
Absolutely. Glad I'm not the only one thinking this. And it can work for those of us with strong anti-authoritarian sensibilities. Buddhist-style meditation is the closest thing to "religion" that I can stomach. It serves every purpose that I need with NO extraneous dogma or other BS garbage that I simply can't do, even if I wanted to.
This is especially true of Zen Buddhism, which I've practiced for 15 years now. The Zen guys are the most pragmatic and bare-bones and emphasize only the importance of the meditative practices at the root of Buddhism. They dont see enlightenment as a state to achieve or a point to arrive at but rather that it is plainly there when we learn to experience mind shorn of the ego/intellect.
They address this in the video. Of course Buddhism holds answers as do multiple other religious practices. Individual meditation and practicing loving kindness is wonderful, but not culture building or binding (the lig in reLIGion is the same lig in the word ligament). In other words what you propose doesn't scale up. The Burger King style "have it your way" spirituality that so many modern westerners prefer, in part because it's obviously easier to stomach, is what they are calling into question. The use of "religion" as a means to my individual chosen ends is just another aspect of our consumerist culture. It is fast food spirituality. Our over-reliance on our own prideful rationality has left us as a people spiritually immature. We're overgrown toddlers who refuse to eat vegetables because we can't first rationally understand why they're good for us.
@@DDeCicco Vipassana is what I'm more familiar with, but same idea--- bare bones and rooted more in practice than belief.
01:14:45 the rebel who finds his mentor or king. I'm surprised we're halfway through and Jonathan hasn't brought up St. Christopher!
Yay, someone pointing out the scope and limits of reason as an instrument and tool. We in the west have very little discussion on the scope and limits of any epistemological system.
As we sidelined rational metaphysics we just keep digging different holes in the same ground trying to find an exit. But as Edward Bernays and advertising in general shows there are so many ways to bypass the reason centers of humans and make humans reason back to an emotional position.
Great conversation all round though.
I wish Pageau had fleshed out his comment. Jesus didn’t rebel against the Pharisees? He certainly opposed them.
They were not the authority. Look how He spoke to the Jewish Synedrion and the Roman representative. No harsh words, no resistance.
When Pageau uses terms like rebel, he means participants in “revolutionary thinking”. And by that he means taking authority from above.
An example Pageau cites is Martin Luther. How Luther was fine in his opposition to Catholic authorities, right up to when Luther started ordaining priests. He was a lay-monk and didn’t have that authority. Hence, he was taking the authority to ordain priests, a role for bishops, to himself.
This is awesome.
Thanks
Hey, Benjamin. I want to complement you on confounding your guests on the question of authority. I think you rightly pressed them on the question. Do you think any of your guests were able to give a sound account of the legitimacy of authority? I think their answers were meandering and vague. Perhaps you have the same insight as I do: this is a function of their ecclesiology. Pageau and Vanderklay are Christians who do not belong to a visibly unified hierarchical authority, so they have tension with giving an account of such an authority in the realm of politics. The Catholics are lurking right around the corner as this question is being raised. Now, I think you are suspicious of such an authority, but I also think that you realize you have a hard time coming up with an alternative. And this is what makes you interesting.
I don’t think he is as suspicious as you think he is, just my own suspicion here. I think this is mostly a display of his interview skills and the advocate for the devil that he tends to play.
How does a visibly unified hierarchical authority solve the problem?
This is my favorite conversation on the internet, even after multiple views and weeks later.
I was thinking I could maybe visit Mount Athos at some point with my wife. I guess that isn't happening lol
Not even if she "transitions," sadly.
heres hoping that rule will go away in the near future..
@@mostlydead3261 ill have to disagree.
If you go with a pilgrimage group, they will typically separate the men and women for the day or two where the men go to Athos, and women go to a women's monastery nearby. But the entire group would be together for visiting other sites like Meteora. Still would be very worthwhile and I hope very much to do it myself someday.
Came over from the podcast to mark it
1:00:45
Wokal speaks to the limits of liberalism and how it is currently being misused. Very well said.
So good
Great conversation. God bless.
A broom is drearily sweeping
Up the broken pieces of yesterday’s life
Somewhere a queen is weeping
Somewhere a king has no wife
And the wind, it cries Mary
I thoroughly enjoy this conversation.
Inversion is an ancient meme. On the New Year the village idiot is crowned, but just for one day. Ever hear of the Crucifixion? So is the ritual sacrifice of the Corn Child.
Gurdjieff visited Mt. Athos apparently.
Didn't help him much, eh?
He played a part in spreading Subud, for which I’m grateful.
@@olgakarpushina492 how so?
@@mostlydead3261 well, he was an occultist and a heretic, so visiting St. Mt. Athos obviously didn't help.
Meaning is destroyed through heresies like nominalism, and heresies are created due to disordered psychological traits that makes us turn our subjectivities into the hermeneutical lenses by which we should interpret reality as a whole and impose that heretical view because is a way to confirm my uncontemplated psychological disorder, and psychological traits are born out of the combination between our nature, our natural environment, relational social environment and spiritual environment, and if we go to the core of the issue we understand that the problem is spiritual first. We need faith, hope and charity, and to get those we ask God for those because we can't create them, those are not human constructs or figments of our subjective imagination, faith (trust, belief) is the light of reason, if you don't trust your own senses you cannot reason at all, natural faith is quite important and more so supernatural faith, and to get that back we need humility, accept that we are dust, and pray to God that he gives us what we need. Because the opposite of humility is pride, and with that you will quickly fall into envy and the process of self destruction will begin again. The solution is to become God loving saints, because in that we will love ourselves as he loves us and we will be able to love our neighbors and creation as ourselves.
What a great one this was!
This was like a balm for me. Thanks gentlemen, thanks chat.
Lip CALM?
Like a balmversation
@@steveb9713 🤣exactly
@@w00tbassman ... +1 purr credit 👍
@@steveb9713 ... + 10 purr credits, but you must split them with WOOT WOOT, due to inspiration 🐈⬛
Really enjoyed this.
Wow Benjamin in Ireland. Hope you have a great time.
Zoom conversations always degrade when someone starts reading from a book.
Wokal nails it on viewers breaking out of nihilism by engaging JBP, Jocko, et al as keys to re-engagement.
The elevation of Liberalism from a system of conflict resolution to a lens which we try to live through the World and create meaning...is the problem. Liberalism was expanded to be a thing it was never meant to do.
-Wokal Distance
That was awesome
Perfect time to switch the glasses ;-)
What book was Wokal reading from? Would love to read it but missed the name
Wokal is a lightweight thinker who doesn’t know it. Needs a lot of attention. And humility most of all.
For the non religious, start with the Beauty in nature. Put your attention there. You will find your way to the Goodness and Truth of Christianity
I think often people struggle however with the apparent ugliness and cruelty, or just plain indifference, they see in nature as well.
We can't and won't all practice the same religion. Yet the wisest people in this world most often ARE linked into some type of spiritual practice. The specific traditions can vary quite a bit while still feeding into a common life-enhancing and community-building result. I think something to consider would be the potential of interfaith community networks, and also what can be learned from the growing population of people identifying as "spiritual but not religious." There's clearly hunger to be part of something bigger. I'm an ex-evangelical, quasi-Buddhist SBNR. Wouldn't have it any other way 😂
I’m honestly beginning to think the “spiritual but not religious” thing is becoming an old hat. Though I would still include myself in that category 🙃. The trouble I perceive with it is the lack of tradition and form, the lack of something to hand down to our children; or even something to hand across to our peers. It’s still a reflection of our individualistic and atomized age. We still see form and structure as being tyrannical or at least something to be skeptical of, and that’s fundamentally a flaw in our thinking that we have to get over at a society wide level.
I still prefer it over atheism and nihilism though.
@@mcshair21 Preferable over atheism and nihilism for sure! Individualism is probably as core to American character as anything. I don't know how we get over that! As for myself, I don't see form and structure as necessarily tyrannical. What I really object to is proselytization based on "our way is the only way" type religion.
Lots there.
Wokal is honestly the best, I could listen to him talk about these and related topics for hours (and have, and will continue to do so)
What an interesting motley crew!
Luther was more suspicious of reason than the catholic scholastics before him. So the characterization is a little unfair. However, the *way* he used reason differed from that of theologians before him.: While the scholastics used reason to reconcile scripture and tradition, Luther used reason to interpret scripture even against tradition
I love how casual these are holy crap like do they know it's recording hahaha
15:34 the critical stinker
35 - a better way to think about this is rebellion against structure itself. This is an inevitable result of post modern style thinking - which is much older than Focoult and Derrida. The core problem, however, is raising up of the lowest while ignoring the middle. It's the loss of hiearachy as such - a flattening, if you will. So people are too enamoured with being at the bottom, because those not at the bottom give them the most attention. This is where victim culture started, way back. Povery as piety. A materialist shortcut to goodness, or at least knowing good from evil.
36 - Jonathan is on to something here, for sure, but his start is a bit, faulty, I think the best way to understand the American story - the Puritans are specifically 'Build the shiny city on the hill' through community control (public Protestantism) which is in contrast to the other protestants who are private protestants (see American Nations by Colin Woodard). The need to then break off from the corporate takeover of government (Behead the King, Parliment is influenced heavily by the East India Company) and inability to appeal to their sovereign leader whose line founded them and gave them authority, forces the Americans to find a new government. This works for a long time, until it doesn't (perhaps, we aren't done with that story)
Searle is wrong, you need the past for rationality itself. Teaching it prevents the outcomes that post moderns (persons attempted to be individuals - which is impossible) wish to happen. So in order to get your logical outcomes, you need to own the past. It needs to conform to what your pre-supposed outcome.
42:50 - The better way to think about all this that Searle is talking about is religion is inevitable, not taking things as 'super natural' is just materialism (material as the primary mover of the world). What Jonathan is trying to do is to re-enchant the world with something higher, non-material, those so called transcendentals.
44:50 - Searle has solved nothing. Demystification of the world is just materialism. It's not a 'different' meaning, it's trying to fit big things into very small frames, material frames. Things like economics, politics, etc. All of which are common recent frames people use that don't work.
Lack of Telos (final Cause) is part of the problem for sure, we've done away with the four causes of Aristotle, compressing the world (flattening it) down to some malformed efficient and formal cause and material cause.
47 - PVK makes a wonderful observation here, if you use rationality and a material book, we can find a way to unify that doesn't require the corrupt church. They will have direct access to truth. It's a very material way of thinking.
48 - the alternative is hierarchy, rather than Luthers flat world, where all you need (Sola Scriptura) is the bible. The idea of communal church is external to your faith, rather than ebedded in it. This is a loss of hierarchy.
53 - so emergence is not only magic, it's nearly always used to explain (scientifically) a quality or what sciency people might call qualia (made up term because everything else is too woo).
There is an inability to even describe, using propositions, emtiontions like anger.
Liberalism isn't a valid way to talk - it's a word that cannot convey a useful concept between people. Classical liberalism can convey something, it says your liberal values are based, grounded, in the concepts of classical thought, the ancient Greeks, western canon, etc.
1:06 - Why do we have to do the opposite? That cannot solve a problem, identifying the opposite of something means you depend upon the thing you are identifying against, which means you can never destroy it and it will come back.
1:07 - A king is not 'hard power' and I bet you cannot come up with a definition of power.
This idea that we didn't have a king during liberalism is false already, we had MANY kinds, we just kept rebelling against all of them. Hierarchy is inevitable, that is what you are missing, if we are not and cannot become equal (evolution is false, in all its aspects if we can become equal) then hierarchy is required, something must be at the top, it doesn't have to stay there, but something must always be there.
Power is not optional. Everyone has it. Otherwise nothing could ever happen. Power it what lets us act and can be the result of action itself.
1:10 - sure, the people who think they are smart want intelligence to mediate power and when that doesn't work, they get upset. This is them secretly wanting to rule, without having to be out front (as a good leader should be). Different problem entirely, I'd say, but the narrative fits even if it is wrong. The idea of reason and logic as the 'thing' is nothing more than 'we rule because we are more reasonable'.
1:11 - there is a legitimate king. We just aren't submitting to him, because we are jockeying for power rather than submitting to power greater than our own. We end up submitting to other, lower people who aren't the true king, so that is Robin Hood, the false King, vs. Return of the King. Same story, different issues and different perspectives.
1:12 - The issue is that Mighty Ducks is another in a long line of 'raise up the lowest' rather than support those in the middle that might rise as proper kings. It's a big problem, using poverty as piety.
1:16 - I'm glad PVK brought up Tyranny here, because Plato talks about this, a good king and a tyrant aren't different forms of government, it's a king that isn't tyrannical. The bottom still gives up power to the top to be directed back downwards appropriately.
1:44 - ya'll are hoping on Objective Material Reality to save you. Not going to happen. Immediate cyncism against Walsh.
1:49 - a redemptive act for the middle class, those who have material but are spiritually bankrupt. Unlike the Protestant ethos, which is ignore anyone who isn't materially poor. So why aren't Christians showing the light to those who have some material? Why aren't they focused on the spiritually bankrupt? Materialism.
1:51 - Practice, or participation, is the key. But it needs to be anchored to a past (historical grounding) and it needs to be navigated through the poetic way of informing the world.
Self reference, like 'good good' is an error. Religion isn't a vessel, it's inevtiable. What you use to gain meaining, claim power, justify action, understand virtues and values - that is your religion. See my video 'what is a church' on Navigating Patterns. Then check out the pattern of religion.
Atheism is rebellion, nothing more. It's an identification against.
Of course the Canadian brings up the Mighty Ducks. My 4th grade teacher's son was an actor in that movie series.
Show and tell me where Matthew 12 gets translated as one greater than the cathedral is here?
I got wokal mixed up with someone else but I can’t remember who
Wokal inspires me to go and wash my socks.
Fantastic discussion!
I loved what Jonathan/hokal had to say about being the revolutionary.
“Being counterculture eventually disintegrates when you regain power.”
I would say the English revolutions Magna Carta / puritans / American Revolution were a bit different though.
Though they did have a strong countercultural element, they always appealed back to a conservative ethos. Or existing agreed-upon Christian pillars.
They always said “ we are rebelling to restore the original agreed-upon Morrow order”
Therefore, when they re-took power, they existed as the “classical moral order new and improved” and not a constant revolution.
Woke ideology does not have this element. Though it easily hijacks the original American ethos.
There justification for rebellion does not have a measurable/grounding principal.
It states the order of society has ALWAYS been broken and unjust, and we must retake it to make things just.
Marxism/ sections of the French revolution/ wokeism
I think this is a very key distinction between the revolutionary ethos with an Anglo revolutionary ethos.
And this explains why the American revolution has lasted for as long as it has.
Along with this, the Anglo revolutions are rebelling against Christian leaders, who your name state they worship God so there is an appeal and rounding principal.
And therefore, it is almost more of a theological revival and not a revolution against Cesar.
Other revolutions do not have an inter-Christian discussion .
This is how I believe Christians can argue for the American revolution and against other revolutions . 27:16
“Beyond a certain point, the inveterate libertine cannot attain orgasm without a sense of transgressing the laws and constraints that he rejects. The door must be both open and closed." ~ Roger Shattuck, Forbidden Knowledge
Benjamin, let’s get coffee sometime.
IMO the point of liberalism is to create a fair playing field for varying viewpoints to engage without devolving into sectarian violence. It was never meant to assign meaning, but rather allow the individual to pursue what seems meaningful to them. Unfortunately, the meaning crisis shows that institutions have abdicated their role in helping to properly form individuals in society.
ETA: the university, the church, the social clubs are shadows of their former selves.
No one talks about the necessary instability of the enlightenment. Its sui generis in the same way God was pre-enlightenment. Reason went the same way truth did in the Garden of Eden, perverted for mans' own glory.
I love this collaboration 😊
Lurking Orthodox priest experienced an emergence when Wokal and his hooka emerged into the rest of the cast, causing a dive into thinking up "walked into a bar" jokes.
Jonathan Pageau’s smiles are contagious. 😊
This may go into my Hall of Fame pod casts.
May I recommend Owen Barfield's
POETIC DICTION and SAVING THE APPEARANCES. Dovetails nice with this calm-versation...
1:31:00 - Paul has talked about ARC on his channel with, I think, some skepticism. I think it would have been inappropriate for him to press Jonathan here about it more, but man I wish he would.
Why does Paul oppose ARC?
@@Joefrenomics I’m not sure if I remember his exact criticism, if he even gave one. Not to put words in his mouth, but if he thought tour-era Jordan Peterson was decadent, I can only imagine what he thinks about an organization whose self-stated goal is to get all the smart people together to fix the world’s problems.
I'm a godless heathen, I still love this conversation
The generally acknowledged 'spirit' within mankind is '_The King_' as defined by the unique human traits of creativity, imagination, inspiration, the emotionally and intellectually mature, culture wide reverence for 'something' outside of the individual, a drive toward refinement and improving as individuals, community and culture...for starters.
As usual, an insightful and informative deep drill down into the meaning of spirit.
Sorry, good political activism died in 1965. Americans have been infantilized since then, nobody grows up anymore. I was a boy back then but wasn't sucked into the "rebel without a cause" meme, I admired my parents and grandparents. I led a charmed life because later I did STEM, not liberal arts.
Ironically, STEM is the area where some of the most infantalized of us exsist in
Someone has to study liberal arts
Looks like a good time for one and all with a star studded line up🥷🐈⬛&🦌alike!
🥷🐈⬛&🦌&🔥🧔♂🧔♂🧔♂🔥amazing
Lol who’s this wokal guy? I see alot of myself in him. Hes funny too
He's basically the only reason I've even remotely considered getting on twitter. Not reason enough though
Nice smoke rings Wokal.
Can’t wait for this one
Grim Griz gettin' those mad shouts out. youtube.com/@GrimGriz
Appreciated your appearance on Sour Patch Lyds this week. She had Auron and Keri Smith on earlier, both who've talked to PVK. I noticed you dropped Vervaeke's name and Pageuaian concepts. Maybe you can let her know about This Little Corner in her quest for a spiritual home :)
This was incredibly frustrating. The Wokal guy really took away from the conversation. 😓
Psychedelics!
1:35
Not showhing your eyes feel soo disrespecting to me.
I understand the need to be a character on youtube but still.
And the guy was great beside this also
I had high hopes for this but Wokal ruins everything. He's not a thinker he's a character and an entertainer and I don't find his schtick amusing.
Different strokes for different folks. Why give one contributor whose style and persona you don't like, have the power to ruin the entire thing for you?
By my estimation Nate, (which I had no thoughts of sharing, until I observed your public memo)
Wokal appears to *me to be a human being with good and useful thoughts. A number of people seem to have enjoyed his presence and company, including myself.
Now, his thoughts and presence may not translate as valuable or palatable to you from your unique personal point and perspective in the cosmos, which is fine and fair.
ps. slandering may not be the look you want to represent, but thats actually not my business. I've said too much already :) Looking forward to your presence in upcoming streams.
Two of the other three do and say particular things in particular ways that really, really grate me. The beauty of this whole boob tube thing is I can simply click away when my ears can no longer take it. Perhaps I’m all the poorer for it, I don’t know. But I do know I don’t have to listen to it…
yeah he's a culture warrior not a thinker..
SAME 😩 He just comes across as immature and he keeps just referencing books he's read and making obvious statements that everybody already knows😑 I don't want to be unkind but it was just so frustrating!
Incredible gaggle of very based guys. Bravo Benny boy
I don't know we if we need another four years with T!!
Wokal looks like he's at the dentist😂
I don't want this to end, Gentlemen! Thank you!
The Four Horsemen anno 2023
Great stuff guys
Planet of the apes still fire though
Great talk man!
A tribe. Oh, how I long for a tribe like this!
Wait a "spirit" is just as vacuous as emergence. At least with emergence we are not saying there is no explanation, we are saying there is an explanation but we might not know what it is. With your "spirit" you are adding an extra entity, you assume your explanation is someone how superior because of your theism. This is not better, it just makes it easier to escape to any epistemological challenge.
I am not at all convinced you have any answer to emergence other than god of the gaps. We all have god of the gaps, this is not unique or at all illuminating.
I think this analysis is ultimately irrelevant as the recognition of the role of power is absent. Yarvin, for example, outlines what is needed for all these potentially forlorn hopes to flourish. It requires a routing of this oligarchy of chaotic, decentralised, atheistic power that is wreaking havoc. Under the regime, both Peterson and Christianity are the enemy and will remain so until the power structure is sorted out.
Pageau admits
At the outset he’s already lost his children. And why are we listening to him exactly??
The guy just vaping is so cringe
Thank you, Sir Benjamin Boyce, for the Calmversation and the... Meme😂!!
Everything but "lattice structure" lol @wokal love you man
Yeah, Paul, "Wow!" Women were not allowed in 1000 years ago. Well, are you still promoting that division? The only woman among men at your meeting a year or so ago and every attempt by me to be included failed. Foolish me to think I had found a place to belong.
Three good Men, Thanks Benjamin
Huh? I counted four! :O
Hahaha WE IDENTIFY AS BEING OUT OF POWER LMAO!!! Thats exactly right. Jesus fn christ. Lol. Epic* moment
Wow. This was great!
Hottest collab of 2023.
Benjamin you lost control to this useless Wokal!
LOL, okaaaayyyyyy... A lot of nonsense occasionally interrupted by a valid point. Worth the time? Not sure...