Apple’s pricing for upgrades to storage has always been outrageous. But at least back in the day you could buy storage for less elsewhere and do the upgrade yourself. Then they started soldering the parts in place for no better reason than to thwart us, and now with integrated chips we’re completely locked out. It’s one of the worst standards Apple has adopted.
Yeah. Soldered CPU/GPU/SoC? That tracks, the slot takes up real-estate that you just don't have on a laptop and by virtue of being by far the most expensive thing on a board, it's not like replacing just the SoC is a significant saving. Soldered memory? There is a bit of performance you can get from that. It's extremely iffy, has the very serious downside of your RAM dying forcing you to replace your whole board with the SoC, but if you really squint I guess that maybe you can make an argument for this not only being a cash grab. But soldered storage? The gains are nonexistent, the downside of having to replace everything else if the storage dies stays but additionally, if anything at all dies on the board, your data is effectively gone. Obviously there are services that can recover it, but these can be incredibly costly, results aren't guaranteed and if you really need your data now, you're just out of luck. It takes a minor issue of taking out your storage and plugging it into another machine and turns it into a a massive headache for absolutely no benefit to the user. But as long as people keep buying that stuff, they have zero reason to change. This isn't a new issue. Jobs was the guy who put custom screws on the first Macs so that it was really hard to open and work on them, at a time when users would in fact be ready to solder on their own parts
When their products are so shiny, expecting people to vote with their wallet is a stretch. Sometimes when I tell people on here that I upgraded the SSD on my ASUS S13 (from 512 GB to 4 TB) I find some UA-cam commenters dismiss me as poor because it cost me 1/5 the price Apple would charge & refusing on principle to not pay for ludicrously overpriced upgrades is unconscionable in their eyes. Oh well.
@@worldoflonelyfool It's not being thought of as poor (i'm not) that bothers me, it's the mentality of some people to overpay for the sake of overpaying, seemingly just to be able to tell people you overpaid for something & look down on those who didn't/wouldn't. That's the thing I can't get my head around.
I'm glad that more channels--and as a result, consumers--are starting to talk about this pricing problem more and more. With the price of flash storage dropping like a stone, it's becoming harder and harder to justify Apple's price points for storage and RAM, especially when these machines are unmodifiable and can't be user configured out of the box. Hopefully this video will help shine a brighter light on these shady business practices and either force Apple to reconsider, especially with other laptop companies and OSes hopping on the ARM bandwagon. Otherwise, they'll probably get left in the dust once other corporations catch up.
What kinds surprised me (and I know largely it’s that Apple knows people will pay) is that Apple doesn’t simply spec their base models out with (at least) 512GB SSD 16GB RAM, and offer decent prices for higher storage and ram. Their quality/value of their product would blow the competition away so much that they’d probably see a further increase in sales overall.
It’s not just the price, they don’t even stock potential upgrades in store, so if you want something with decent storage and RAM the day you walk into the store, you’re forced up the upgrade ladder.
@@l.g.4425 i can run macos on my pc right now. the only reason people have to pay the apple tax is because of casuals who want to look like they have more than the $30 they have in their bank accounts
@@SweetSweetCandyBoyzSorry for the massive comment I’m just really pissed. So I agree with what you said except they don’t even sell the upgrades in store. Two examples of this: First, I’ve been trying to get a new MacBook Pro locally since launch day. I can’t go to Best Buy and get an M3 Pro in higher than base configuration. And I can’t get an M3 Max in ANY configuration according to the app. In ANY store in the state of NE. A Best Buy rep told me outright that they weren’t allowed to by Apple, who provided the products they wanted to see on the floors. Why?? Secondly, once again Best Buy, but also Target, Walmart, everywhere… won’t let you WALK OUT THE STORE with a new iPhone without connecting it to either AT&T or Verizon, sometimes T-Mobile. Wtf?! I’m trying to throw my money at you! But I’m on Mint and I don’t plan to change so that means you’ve lost my business. However, I think I figured it out. In the first case, Apple doesn’t WANT you to get the best or highest tier devices, as they know you’ll likely keep them for years. They prefer the planned obsolescence forcing you to upgrade. And if you do insist on whatever it takes to get the highest tier? That’ll be $4000 please. Now for the second case, I believe either Apple or the stores themselves are approached by the carriers and offered large incentives to force activation of all devices prior to finalizing purchase. That way you have to go with one of those two (sometimes three) Big Wireless. And even when you have something like Verizon unlocking all phones 60 or 80 days after purchase or whatever it is, are you really going to want to go through the process of switching carriers immediately? Your service is “good enough anyway”… Gotcha. And now Apple and Best Buy take a decent cut.
This issue singlehandedly takes apples products from being an actually good value and turns it into jokes. Not only is the practice extortionate. They don't even use the "best" RAM and storage on the market, far from it - LPDDR5X exists, similarly much faster flash exists especially on Airs. But most importantly, it's the most dissonant and mind numbingly stupid decision you could possibly make from an environmental perspective. Apple saves low single digit % on the MSRPs of these machines by specing them as low as is humanly possible. To make them obsolete as quickly as possible. As long as this remains standard at Apple, all of their gleeful keynotes about how forward thinking and green they are remain hollow and miscreant. It's anti consumer and anti environment.
Their greenwashing is 100% bs. All just an excuse to really just save their bottom line. No charging bricks with iPhones? Even on the new USB-C models? Get real
Despite being an Apple fanboy I agree with everything you said Apple will never win the respect of the hardcore PC buyer market until they couple their revolutionary silicon, and great software, with similarly great RAM and SSD configs and pricing! If you’ve lived your whole life swapping huge drives into your computers on the cheap, why would you “upgrade” to a computer that charges you two or three times as much for half the RAM and a quarter of the storage?! Which is more important, performance per watt, or being able to Have room to actually store all your files on your computer?
@Epicgamer_Mac And with how much of a walled garden Apple insists on, a lot of open source devs just won't bother with directly supporting Apple silicon without the use of pre configured build targets. To my knowledge, Pytorch and Tensorflow are still pretty flaky on Macs.
@@Epicgamer_Mac The real story with upgradeable storage is portability when you upgrade everything else! I've had a 1tb Samsung 950 pro that's lived in 4 different computers over the years and now continues to serve in an external USB enclosure.
I bought a cheap Mac Mini M1 for my macOS work and a windows PC for everything else. Why to spend 2k to 3k to have a very limited Mac, if I can have a good cheap Mac and an excellent PC for everything
@@ricarmigExactly what I’m going to do when i have the money, i’m undeniably an apple fanboy, iphone and macbooks all the way, but I’ll never buy a iMac or Mac pro if i have a choice
It’s even worse for other markets like in the UK where everything is priced the same as in the US but in pounds so it’s actually 30%-50% more expensive!
You're not taking into consideration a few differences. They generally earn more money than we do, and their increased dollar value is across the board. Meaning yes, the exchange rate may raise the cost of a computer from $2,500 to $2,600, but so too is it the same for income. If they're you're taking home $1,000 per week and their income is the same per se', they're taking home $1,200 or so. Exchange rates apply to all money, not just what you buy. Besides, they tend to have larger discretional incomes as well due to many of the things we pay for exuberantly being included for free in their system. Sadly, the U.S., despite it still producing the largest amount of cash per year, we've lost the highest standard of living rating years ago. Our income disparity is grossly out of whack and is now reducing overall income as a result. Which is why, despite our unemployment numbers being as low as they were in the 1950s (we've been fully employed for over year now ranging between 3.4 and 3.9 percent). Yet we're not experiencing the same kind of spending boom. People are not making the kind of money their great grandparents did (considering inflation) back then. Speaking of inflation; Forbes released a study proving that the reason industries across the nation hiked their prices, so high these past two years had nothing to do with the higher cost of labor, supply and distribution issues, etc. They intentionally raised their pricing hiding behind the fact that inflation existed. It is so bad, that Forbes determined that 56% of the inflation rate was due directly to that. All the while, industry after industry companies were reporting record high profits. Greed, and we paid it gleefully without complaint, or action. In my day? There would have been protests blocking the entrances to shopping plaza parking lots and other tactics. Today? I can't figure it out, such lazy complacency. Heck, there would have been screaming for congressional industry wide hearings. Now all we care about are... well really. What do we care about? Anything at all but ourselves? I'm at a loss with that one. So, when comparing economic situations between nations it is rarely apples and oranges. In fact, it is a lot like comparing an Apple to a PC.
You think 50% more is expensive? Try buying a Mac in Brazil. It's literally double the price. Just for comparison, the base model MacBook Air M3 with 8gb of ram and 256gb of storage costs $2508 US Dollars. The RAM upgrade from 8gb to 16Gb costs $399.81, and the same price goes to storage upgrades. The minimum wage in Brazil is R$1412 or $282.26 US dollars. It's insane, and it's no wonder I don't ever see anyone using a Mac
@@euuIgor Yikes! Wouldn’t be surprised if there’s extremely high taxes for those sorts of products that are imported to Brazil while a ton of US and Canadian game developers, film studios and animation studios are extremely dependent on cheap labour from remote workers like digital concept illustrators who are based in Brazil.
As much as I loved my macbook and macos, the lack of upgradability plus the crazy markup on memory and storage led me to pick up a Framework laptop and running Linux as my main machine for the foreseeable future. I'm glad so many creators are calling this out.
Will do the same, I will get a Framework running Linux as my next machine. Either the AMD or even better, a Qualcomm ARM by then. Apple needs to take a lesson for treating it's customers so bad
That's exactly what I did. I still have my M1 base MBA, but I picked up a Framework i7 in '22. It's barely thicker than the MBA. I overkilled it with 64GB RAM and 2TB M.2 storage. I'm running Linux as well. I upgraded the lid to the stiffer CNC lid and I have the 80db speakers waiting to go in when I get home. I wish Framework made smartphones because I would buy one in a second. I escaped Apple's walled garden except for their stock.
Dude, the analysis paralysis I've experienced in preparing myself to upgrade to Apple Silicon (from an Intel Mac Mini) is profound. It's like no matter way you try to just slightly upgrade the different models just makes the cost so ridiculous. But if you don't upgrade storage, you get SLOWER storage! And you can't upgrade RAM later. It's just crazy. Stressing about the upgrade paths has literally probably caused me to postpone my upgrade purchase for almost a year now. I literallly watched the M1 generation go by and now nearly the M2 as well. Simple fact is, the base model specs on Storage and RAM are inexusable. 256gb storage and 8gb or ram is just too low.
Feeling that majorly right now. I recently purchased a fantastic Windows desktop PC for $700, with excellent specs from Micro Center - with all off the shelf parts. Now, I’m considering getting a laptop from Apple (again, after years away)…and wow what a sticker shock it was/is. I just cannot justify it. May actually look second hand
Going through the exact same situation. My 2015 Intel Pro runs great as an every day computer, but for design work (which is what I bought it for) it's struggling to keep up these days. I'm happy to pass it on to a family member or friend as I've been eyeing an upgrade since the M1 release, but I can't justify the price of upgrading to any of the new MBPs with even the bare minimum configurations I need. Considering either the used market or just building a PC for the home office and keeping the 2015 MBP for travel because the sticker shock when ordering directly through Apple is just not it. Love Apple, but have been really tired of seeing the direction they've been going in for a while now.
I was without a computer for a month while visiting family over the holidays. I swapped a new SSD into my mother's 8 year old laptop, and it was more than usable for the video work I was doing. Really annoying that I can't do the same with my MacBook 😢
@@kirkydaturkey depends on what year Macbook. I'm still holding onto my Macbook Pro mid 2012 with upgradable storage and Ram. It's the last generation of easy self upgradable components. I upgraded my hard drive to an SSD. I want a new Macbook but overpaying for upgrade has made me reconsider if I need that upgrade. As for now my Macbook still does what I need it to do but I wouldn't mind the new features. It's Apple lost that I haven't made the jump.
@Trensharo. It's true that the 2012 MacBook wouldn't be ideal for everyone, especially for heavier creative work. But for basic tasks it does a great job. For users like me who don't need a powerhouse, it gets the job done. Luke does a great job outlining that getting older machine can be a great bargain based on the cost and performance.
Of course, if I future-proofed for creative endeavors like VM machines or coding, I'd definitely upgrade to a machine with more muscle. My main gripe is the base configuration's measly 8GB RAM. It feels like Apple kneecaps users with that spec, forcing them to jump to a higher tier for just a bit more wiggle room.
Kudos to Luke for the honesty and decision to make this video. I have been an Apple fanboy for years but I can’t keep singing their praises and defending them when they screw customers over like this. No, Apple’s pricing and tier system designed to fool people is not defensible in any way!
Apple pretends to be all Green and Eco friendly, but who can deny that soldered on SSDs results in very many expensive laptops finding their way to a landfill dump way before their time because of SSD failure?
but you wouldn’t throw electronics away surely it would get recycled which is what apple wants to happen. it shouldn’t be the option tho stuff should be easy to upgrade or be cheaper
Agree 100%. Apple has gone way too far and they're abusing their customers. I bought a M1 Mac Mini for $439 and added an external 2 TB drive for a hundred bucks. It's external, but it works fine. Sadly you can't externally update the RAM. But if people are willing to pay the high prices, Apple has no motivation to change.
I'm sorry but their IOS and OS X platform is lacking. Don't believe me, just look at how many tutorials on how to add music from a Macbook to iPhone there is online.... Now that's telling!
Explain as a stockholder how Apple is going to make more money by making the storage upgrades cheap? Apple's issue is that their SOC's are actually too fast meaning people on M1 don't even feel like their machines are the least bit slow. This was never the case in the Intel days.
The other thing people don't talk about much when discussing price comparisons in storage is we're looking at the retail price of an entire M.2 SSD on Amazon, and not considering the wholesale price of just the actual chip that Apple is soldering onto a board that already exists. It makes the disparity even wider
The thing is; they don’t need to do this. They have enough money. They could make upgrades much more affordable and thus; sell more units. Why they do this is beyond me, it just seems exploitative at this point.
It’s not quite greed. They are playing the long game. If they drop prices then people will shop on price, so they have to emphasize value. There are hundreds of hardware companies who went out of business once because of pricing and not focusing on value. Gateway, compaq, machines, and HP. The real problem is their M1 is too good. Less than 20% actually need an M1 Pro and less than 10% need an M1 Max. Scale to M2 and it’s in the mid single digits. Now scale to M3 and it’s low single digits. How many companies make a v1 product that’s so good very few people can take advantage of v2 or v3?
@@timbukstu9861Did you estimate these numbers or did someone do any math on this? It sounds perfectly right to me but I would be interested to watch/read about this in more detail :)
I miss the Intel based Macs with easily upgradeable storage and RAM. Still rocking my MBP 2010. I bought a 2021 macbook pro and quickly sold it because having only 256gb of space is impossible to work with in my profession.
I still run my 2012 model as my DJ and music production machine. It shows it's age when running a project with a lot of tracks and effects, but the DJ software is relatively light since I mostly spin MP3s and WAVs
I completely agree that something needs to be done so any electronic device lasts longer. But you know what will happen? Apple will put the price up of the MacBook. But yep something needs to happen.
My Dell Latitude D630 from 2006 has more storage than that (yes, it is an SSD.) Quite honestly, the soldered on storage and RAM thing really bothers me. Really, that should be more of a cost cutting measure which should be passed on to the consumer, but this is apple we are talking about.
@@WalterKnox The memory is different issue, as it is die bonded directly to the CPU, but yes, the storage is a big issue to power users - maybe a hint to who they feel their customer base is...
@@yestertechnet It doesn't matter the justifacation, the memory should be user up-gradable as well. I would sort of be okay with it if it were a $200 Wal-Mart Chromebook, but if you are paying apple money, I want something that is going to last for years and be upgradable. Especially pro grade machines. I am still using a mac pro from 2009, which is only possible because it is hugely upgradable. Same thing with my 2011 macbook pro, and 2010 mac mini. I also have a 2011 iMac which had a failed GPU, and if it were a modern machine, it would have gone into the trash, but because it is older, the graphics card could be replaced easily.The move to soldered on and integrated parts is quite honestly disgusting, and people justifying it is as well. I don't care how thin and light it is able to make a machine, it is in reality a cost cutting measurement as well as insuring that the consumer will have no choice but to buy a new computer after a couple of years because they are stuck with the factory configuration. It is not just an Apple issue, however like many other stupid tech trends which make things have less functionality but are "for the greater good" I guess, Apple is the worst and the leader in it.
@@yestertechnet I don't think it suggests their customer base are people who don't need storage... I think it suggests they know that their customers who buy their computers to do heavy workflows, can afford to pay 4x markup for storage and (idk how much)X markup for ram, as they make good money anyway.
@@manoz6194 They've been doing it for ages, but back in the day we at least had ways to upgrade things on our own. Now they literally make it impossible. No they need to get shamed into shape.
Price are outrageous. 2009 I bought the top of the line 3 tera, highest processor 17” MacBook Pro, full memory for around 2500$. Nowadays equivalent model of the line up is over 6000$. That’s just insane.
I've been interested in buying a Mac for a while, either a 15" Macbook Air, or a 16" Macbook Pro and re-visit this every once in a while. Once I add the RAM and storage I'd like it becomes outrageously expensive and I just close the tab again. I'm sure I am not alone with this. They are missing out on some sales from people who are not willing to be extorted for RAM and storage upgrades.
I did the same thing and found a previous year 16 inch model refurbished for 1000$ off on Amazon, from 2800 to 1800. Not sure if the deals are there right now but it's always worth checking for refurbished.
The pricing and the soldered chips are outrageous. The consumer should be able to upgrade the internal storage and the RAM. Honestly, this may need to come about through law like USB-C did…
yep. amazing it took the EU not US consumers or US Congress to force Apple into sanity on the lightening issue. i was bitten by it the other day. was carrying dozens of USB-C cables on me but my car lightning cable was charging slower than the iphone was sucking power and it kept bottoming out at “0%”. had a few usb-c to lightening cables on me but couldn’t find a spare USB-A to lightening to use with my cigarette lighter usb-A socket
@@Milos596 Ah, replaceable processors would have some extra problems. Biggest issue is it would make the machines thicker because a socketed processor takes up more space. Not so much of a problem for myself as I'm not so comfortable with machines that are too thin but the market seems hell bent on paper-thin hardware. Legislation like theEU's mandate for USB-C may not turn out as well as one might think. For one thing, it may prevent the development of even better replacements. And the USB specifications have become such a mess that the USB-C you have for one device may *still* not be quite adequate for another. A great idea done with the best of intentions (and you can see from ua-cam.com/play/PLBuns9Evn1w9XhnH7vVh_7C65wJbaBECK.html how well that often turns out).
Thanks for pointing this out, Luke. Apple's prices made me switch from MacOS to Linux almost 4 years ago and since then I have only experienced freedom and publicly available documentation and I benefit from it professionally.
Yes, it took Luke to point this out. Most of us who follow, or followed, him have grown tired of his BS whining. His business acumen is poor and his message is at best childish. Grow up Luke.
I'm a huge Apple fanatic, but I agree that you really can't beat good old Linux for many applications and basic tasks. You definitely won't get anything super fancy (e.g. UI, features, apps, cross-platform convenience, aesthetics, security/privacy, etc. etc.) but you will get something that works, is silent, and gives you access to countless open-source, by-the-people-for-the-people software. And you also have your choice of which Linux OS you desire based on your specific needs. Oh, and the vast majority of it is 100% free which benefits countless people all over the world. 💯 But there's no need to limit yourself to just Apple or just Linux... I like to have many different technologies and systems to keep me as tech-savvy as possible. 💎 Just no Microsoft. Never Microsoft. I've has absolutely horrendous experiences with Microsoft to the point where I will never support this company ever again. 👎
Finally, someone gets it. All these shitty “tech UA-camrs” can go on here and market apple as selling “Amazing laptops for only X starting price,” but 256GB storage and 8GB memory is a joke even for non-power users. Thats wretchedly horrendous value for a product that has an extremely limited use life due to its specs and the fact that the parts cannot ever be upgraded.
@@danielseddon3177 not even sure if they are loss leaders per se, they probably still make money on those… but maybe harder to determine because depends on if you use costs to develop (and produce) that 1 model as the basis or if you count R&D for future models into it.
@@Ultrajamzyes, I’m sure there isn’t really a loss. The main benefit to them will also likely be greater market reach and therefore a reduction in the costs you mention.
Apple was ahead of the game in 2012, the 1st gen MBP Retina 15” came standard with 256 gbyte SSDs but for whatever reason they’ve stayed at the base 256 gbytes for over a decade now. They’re a bit too greedy with their profit margins.
Fully agree with you Luke! Apple doesn’t seem to realize how much resentment and hatred they cause among their customers! There is a difference between expensive and pure unfettered greed!
What are you on about. They have always been the damn same, its just silly slogans that peabrained normies fall for. They ALWAYS did the same anticonsumer anti-right to repair nonsense.
What are you talking about?? Apple has always been the most expensive in anything, while providing less than anyone else, who've also always done it for far less money?? Total confusion about your comment.
An Apple was always the bohemian computing device for people who can and want to afford it. People always paid extra for the brand, already back in the 80s. The very first Mac had about the same specs as the Amiga and was more than twice as expensive.
"Oh, you want 16gb of ram on your M3 MacBook 'Pro'? Just add $200 (now totaling, $1799) and wait 2-weeks for us to ship you your machine OR spent just $200 more, get the binned M3 Pro AND 16gb of RAM, and what do you know... we just happen have that in stock today...." Apple wants you to spend $2,000, minimum, for a usable machine that takes full advantage of the hardware - it's why the RAM upgrade prices are what they are, and why they don't stock anything but the base models from the Air's to the lesser-Pro's at Apple stores. I had an 8gb RAM model, then returned it for a 16gb model. The performance difference, regardless of the use-case, was noticeably 3-fold (I just happened to get lucky with an "open box" deal at Best Buy). But if you're expecting to walk into an Apple Store and get a machine that takes full advantage of the base M2/M3, you're going to be disappointed with your purchase. Do NOT get the base M2 Macbook Air and absolutely do NOT get the base M2 MacBook Pro.
The M3 Pro has 18 gigabytes of ram, instead of 16, and it's cheaper than a base M3 macbook pro with a ram and storage upgrade. That's the part that makes no sense to me at all. It makes zero sense to buy a base M3 macbook pro with the pricing and the specs.
This is honestly the main reason why I am avoiding to go fully into the Apple Ecosystem. As soon as you go beyond the base configurations, that's when Apple hits your wallet like a MF, and it is necessary to upgrade as the main config are outdated. As long as people keep paying for these upgrades, the prices will not change.
honestly, and this is so funny, I've actually made the correct decision when I bought my 16" M1 Pro MacBook Pro earlier this year. The M2s just came out and I was deciding between the M2 and M1, which would've been a price difference of roughly $300. Only a month or so ago I saw a video comparing M1 Pro, M2 Pro and M3 Pro models for DAWs (digital audio workstations) and guess what? In most professional DAWs (Logic, Pro Tools and some others) the M1 Pro outperforms the other chips due to having more performance cores and those DAWs utilizing those exclusively. What a time to be alive when a 2 year old computer beats the current one.
I'm still fascinated by the fact that the 2012 iMac 21.5" was the first iMac that came with an 8GB RAM base configuration and the upgrade to 16GB was $200. And now it's 2023 and the base iMac still has 8GB and the upgrade costs exactly the same as it did 11 years ago.
It should also be said Apples design of soldered on board is a dangerously stupid - cause if the hard drive gets hit with a power surge then your beautiful $2000 or $3000 machine becomes a glorified paper weight and your data is gone and your machine is DEAD permanently.
@@joelv4495 nah, don't forget that Apple was shipping 8GB as base config in 2012 on their Pro machines, just another 4-5 years and 16 is gonna be standard. Surely...
@@PvtAnonymous Dell, HP, MS and Samsung, et al, shipped 8GB in 2012. Guess what they are still doing it now, as well. Apple gets blasted, but never Windows. Inevitable as Apple is a small player (
@@andyH_England maybe they do, but there's 2 differences: RAM is user upgradable in many of these machines and even if it is soldered, the prices are not as insane as Apple's. This is what Apple really gets blasted for, not the 8GB per se.
@@andyH_EnglandThey do make billions on Macs though, look at their financial statement. They lost market share in 2023 however despite launching 2 generations of silicon.
Any business model has a purpose of making money for the company and NOT what is best for the customers. In this case their business model works perfectly well for Apple.
This was the reason why i left Apple and bought a normal laptop: the freedom to replace memory/disk/wifi/etc. Also better repairability, even at home...
@@SmellsLikeNirvanna No it's not a stupid reason when you consider the fact that when your Apple product develops a fault, Apple will tell you that it's more expensive to have it repaired than to buy a new one. You're either on the Apple payroll or you don't know what you're talking about yourself, so which is it ?
I have always felt this way. Because of that, I just updated my late 2013 MBP with a logic board upgrade from the 2.0 GHz/8MB RAM to 2.6/16GB, the SSD from 256GB to 1TB and a new battery all for a total of $350! I get a "new to me" MacBook Pro and am really happy with the upgrades.
This exact thing is why I have an infrequent upgrade cycle. Their pricing is just insane. I have also recommended friends and family to strongly consider alternative brands where I in the past would most often tell them to buy a Mac…
The sad truth, from a performance standpoint, soldered components Do provide a bit of an upgrade, so I can see why the industry may follow suit, with everybody SO focused on the even MINUTE bumps in performance. Thankfully though, other Manufacturers have apparently been able to keep those costs competitive. But yeah, there is nothing stopping them from price gouging as well.
Apple's benefit is only the operating system. If Mac OS ran on any computer, people would be installing them on better machines. Not everyone needs so much battery life, we have power sockets here and even airplanes have power sockets these days.
My trick was i bought a lenovo laptop , on their website they even have manuals on how to open the laptop so you can change / upgrade memory and storage , install any operating system you want and pay less then half of a standard macbook.
Best way to go. About 10-15 years ago I bought an Alienware M15 laptop. It was insanely priced, kinda like Apple products. But highly customizable, even to do yourself. It literally took unscrewing 4 screws to get it opened up, and everything you could possibly think of to upgrade or repair was easily accessible, as if they ENCOURAGED people to do their own repairs and upgrades. I eventually upgraded my ram, and hard drive in a matter of minutes. I miss that computer. It's outdated now, I gotta see if I can find a motherboard I can put into it compatible with current components.
I have a Windows laptop and I was able to upgrade up to 64 GB RAM and 8TB storage myself (waited for a sale). It feels like a new laptop even though I've been using it for few years already. I was considering an Apple laptop with M3 Max chip, extra RAM and storage (for video editing, animation, coding stuff). But these huge price increases made me consider to keep my Windows laptop longer and upgrade the internal parts, it was more cheaper and I saved a lot of money that way.
Most buyers of expensive Macs will upgrade every cycle as a new chip means faster performance and time is money. It's a tax-deductible investment that pays for itself many times over. I have seen comparisons for developers between the M1 Max and M3 Max, and the M3 can do it significantly faster. At the top end, SSD and RAM are moot compared to CPU/GPU/co-processors.
@@Demopans5990Why are you linux users so cringe and always trying to mention it even tho it is not needed? He is likely to have far more problems on linux than on windows and macos
It was a pleasure helping some family members double the RAM and quadruple the storage on some of their older Mac laptops. Now they all have M-Series and while they've not asked me, when and if they do it's going to be some unfortunate news. While I'm a PC-oriented user, my choice is simple, won't buy Apple since they solder everything together and really offer no post upgradability. Great on you Luke, for calling this out yet again.
The only way Apple will listen is if customers vote with their wallet, which is unlikely to ever happen, so things won't change. Since the M-series chips came out MacBooks have seen their largest ever cut of market share, & zero upgradability has been a core component of their line-up, so there's no incentive for Apple to change anything.
Louis Rossman shows that it burns out the board if the SSD fails, and even if it doesnt you can't even boot from another drive. It seems like its intended to end the whole device. SSDs have limited life anyway so why else solder it in?
That's why I love Thinkpads. You can get them used in perfect condition when companies sell them out after warranty ends. But that's not a problem, as resellers usually give their own warranty for resold TPads (at least in my country). A years extended warranty is the standard, but sometimes or with extra $ you can extend it to 2 years. Sure, these laptops are a few generations behind, but for almost everything I'd need they're more than fine. And if I need to upgrade them - no problem. Buy any NVME you want, pop it in and you can have 2TB for like 120$. My Thinkpad's reseller does the disk swapping for free under their warranty. The same goes for RAM. And battery? No prob, you can just swap the old one with a pristine new one, which you can get for like 70$. Whole operation takes literally 5 seconds. Sure, new Thinkpads are much more expensive, but still nowhere near Apple prices. And most of them still have the same ease of part swapping. I'm never gonna ditch them, unless they go Apple way hard.
Newer Thinkpads after T490 models are shifting to full soldered LPDDR4 RAM which limits the upgradability if you want more RAM in the future. T480 is the sweetest spot, as it has everything: 2 RAM slots, upgradable SSD, swappable battery, very good amount of ports, and still officially supported by Windows 11 (Intel Core 8th gen)
Apple's strategy is to create a pricing ladder that is so closely rung that you are enticed to move up. Every rung is so close to the last that it makes you feel that moving up is a good value proposition, and you'll keep going up til you simply can't afford anymore. Apple gives customers a nice entry point just to get them on that ladder then walk them up it so they spend all that they have.
Everything that depends on me, they won’t get my money. I bought a decent windows laptop for most demanding stuff. It’s cheaper than just having a Mac with upgrades…
The first Mac I had was a 2012 13" Macbook Pro. It came with 4GB of Ram and a rotating hard disk but it you could swap that out for 16GB of Ram and an SSD. So the cost wasn't really all that different to a PC. Now they solder down everything you basically need to buy the machine you'd end up upgrading to and they've massively jacked up the cost of the options you need to include. Looks like I'm going back to Windows, which MS have unfortunately completely ruined in the mean time.
Could you please say what MS ruined about Windows? I saw few comments about that but there is no explanation about it I understand if you don't like it and that is personal preference but there are billions of people who like Windows so saying its ruined by MS is ridiculous
@@user-qf6yt3id3w Bloat this, bloat that... people now complain about Ubuntu being bloated so where is end? At that point everything is bloated for some users A bit modern UI doesn't hurt.. you cant live on Windows XP or Windows 7 UI forever it needs a bit of upgrade Windows always get criticism for bloated but when Google bloat their Android together with a vendor which has their own version of Android, UI and apps so you get double bloated its somehow not an issue? From my point of view im more than happy with Windows and Android i use
Then it won't change; Apple will give up selling unprofitable laptops as it is a tough market where all OEMs are feeling the pain, as consumers demand more and more and are willing to pay less and less.
They already sell basically zero laptops (compared to iPhones). They’re not trying to sell hardware, they’re trying to lock people in to the ecosystem and that’s a whole different playing field.
I was going to replace my iPad this past holiday season. The entry iPads with 64gb are not even close to what I wanted/needed. The price for memory upgrades made me look at android tablets. I bought two android tablets with expandable storage for less than half of a 256gb iPad. This was my first foray out of the Apple ecosystem in years. Truth be told the android tablets work just fine (a lot better than they used to), they took a little getting use to. They work well. They run the same apps (some minor variations). When my iPhone 12 pro dies I'm going to shop Android phones. The cost of living has been going up so I'm not going to blindly shell out for Apple's excessive prices anymore when there are significantly less expensive products that work almost as well.
I have ip12 too and I suppose I will do the same - when it will be very old I will switch to android. With time I will also switch from MacBook M1 Pro to a laptop with windows. I have decided 2 years ago that I will test Apple. After those 2 years I feel that I can safely go back to the better feature with at least not as bad companies as Apple…
This is why I don't buy Apple products. They're too expensive. I can buy a Samsung phone or tablet etc and get more from it than some of these Apple products.
I couldn't agree more! I recently was in the market to buy a new laptop to use for traveling. I needed at least 16GB of RAM and 500GB of SSD space. As a lifetime Windows users but having the rest of my family using only Apple products, I really wanted to buy a Macbook Air. I could not believe the amount of money to upgrade to my minimu requirements!!!! I purchased an ASUS Zenbook S13 OLED that has 32GB or RAM and 1TB of SSD for $1,100!! C'mon, Apple...these prices are ridiculous!
Emphatically agree, Luke. Thanks for articulating what many of us feel. I bought an M1 8 GB/128 GB MacBook Pro for full retail ($1300) but later found a great deal on an M1 8 GB/512 GB 24" iMac for $1250. (I use both, but I bought Logic Pro to use on the iMac.) I decided to get external storage as I could afford it and I really didn't need screaming performance for what I do, so I ended up buying two OWC Envoy Express Thunderbolt 3 enclosures, a 1 TB Samsung 980, and a 2 TB 980 Pro for a total of about $375....so that's 3 TB external storage for less than what Apple wants for 1 TB. I'm pretty happy with my decision. Why couldn't Apple have included some type of expansion method for upgradeable internal RAM and Storage with the Apple Silicon line? (Methinks: greed.) But I really don't see a way for Apple to bring the price of their internal RAM/storage down without all of us buyers who have gone before getting a bit upset. Thanks again, for all you do.
I remember when a family member bought a MBP, and later they complained that it slowed down to a crawl within a few months. Was shocked when I looked at it and it only had a 128GB drive, which naturally filled up quickly. Apple can pound sand, they've been ripping off consumers for ages now with this upgrade BS and borderline crippled base models.
this is one of the things that consumers should have pushed forward to be looked at by legislators. this is unacceptable with today’s demand in terms of longevity of devices especially with how pretty much unrepairable and expensive these devices are.
Hate to tell you that even the most foolish of legislators won’t attempt to tell a company how to price its products and services. The market will decide if Apple’s pricing is out of line not Luke’s infantile videos. If you don’t like, or can’t afford, Apple laptops & desktops, simply buy a PC. There are many great ones out there for far less than Apple products cost. I don’t have a problem with the pricing of Apple products & don’t mind spending more for the specifications I want. I do have a problem with fools like Luke who whine about the pricing but keep buying the products. Move on man, get over it already.
@@hynekd nah, you’re making an excuse for a large tech company to limit their hardware and overprice said hardware for its users. for what? sure, market dictates what the market wants… that’s what this is all there is under the guise of competing with different brands, anyway, right? however, the market didn’t ask for a unified piece of soldered hardware, where you don’t have a safety net when 1 or 2 of those soldered components get broken. this was patented by the tech company with little workaround on options for people to salvage its part for repair. clearly, it’s not an ideal world. those foolish legislators you say have managed to push for apple to switch their cables to a universal standard and look at where we are now, we have an iphone that adheres to a universal standard port for portability, use-case and even impacting a good on the environment a little bit. it’s little but it’s progress. staying mum about these type of issues only lets tech companies get away with these things instead of championing the rights of users with the devices that they own. also, what are you losing if you voice out complaints on the products that you buy, i don’t get it? you’re not losing your dignity by making reasonable arguments as a consumer that ram and storage prices in devices shouldn’t be priced this way, anyway?
If I remember correctly Alex Ziskind had a video where he booted one of the new Macs directly from a $79 external drive (plus price of enclosure) and the read/write performance was just as good as booting from the internal Mac drives.
@@bartvandenpoel8568 Agreed but the point is to show there is nothing special about the SSDs Apple uses. On many Apple forums people will claim that the SSDs that Apple uses are superior to the rest of the market and so the higher price is justified because of superior performance. But if you can boot from an external drive and have speeds on par or better than internal Apple drives, especially after having to go through additional data layers and time delays to connect the drives externally, it shows that Apple internal SSDs aren’t anything special.
As a software developer that need a lot of ram on my machine. Even after using a couple mac book pros for 10+ years,, I'm considering to switch to a PC lab top instead. Apple's price strategy is insane!
I'm always surprised by programmers using macbooks. The macbook keyboard is terrible for programming. It is missing home, end, pgup, pgdown, numpad, no dedicated function keys. The programmers I know homebrew to get the tools they like. Wouldn't a PC be better? Lots of options on keyboards and layouts. Cheaper and can run any Linux distro. Easy to get enough ram to run whatever VMs you need.
@@username7763MacBooks have dedicated function keys. The only key I really miss is the delete key as I never use those home, pgup, pgdown, etc whether I have them on my keyboard or not. The main thing nice with Mac is that it’s Unix. Makes things much nicer than windows to program on. Linux is also great as well, but I like to have good battery life and fast single core speed which Mac hardware happens to have. I do agree Apple’s upgrade model is horrible though. For gaming I build my own windows PC like a sane person. Not even gonna try gaming on a Mac.
I can personally confirm that they are starting to affect their sales with this kind of pricing. I had been holding off replacing my 2014 MBP for this reason. It has 16GB RAM, so it was still just eking by until I could afford the Mac I wanted. But then I had to work remotely for a bit to help my mom after surgery. I needed something better to get me though, so I bought a Lenovo Yoga 6 with 16GB RAM/500 GB SSD on sale for ~$600. And you know, it’s actually pretty nice! It’s light and portable, does what I need, and has an awesome battery life in comparison to what I am used to. And it has a replaceable SSD! So yeah, I switched back to PC and only spent a little more than the RAM and SSD upgrades themselves would have cost on a Mac.
Thank you Luke for voicing this issue on behalf of the community. This is quite LITERALLY the reason I haven’t purchased a Mac since 2015. My Mac Mini 2011 was cheaply boosted to 16/512 in 2012. My MBP Retina 2015 was bought 16/512. Being offered a base model starting at 8/256 in 2024, and seeing the price to upgrade to just 16/512 (a basic configuration I have used for 13 years) is just absolutely unacceptable. I vote with my money and keep my old Mac running. Unfortunately I am aware that not everyone can do this… Good luck.
I'll add an important trick that I learned the hard way. If your external hard drive is over 2TB and you decide to format it in ex-FAT, make sure you make the block size 1024 (you may need a Windows machine to do this). For these drives the default block size is 2048 and newer MacOSXs have problems detecting these drives. The drives are fine and work perfectly in Windows or Linux but will often fail to mount on OSX unless the block size is 1024.
The other thing you have to factor in with these lower storage SSDs, is the total TBW. The lifespan just isn’t there with the smaller amounts and once the chips are done, you’re petty much out of luck.
Have you (somehow) not figured out that all non-enterprise SSDs have their TBW values listed as a WARRANTY amount? There are two standards: TBW and JEDEC endurance. TBW is simple: 1/3/5 year warranty OR a specified TBW value, whichever happens first. JEDEC endurance ratings are when they... you know... actually test the drives to determine the actual endurance. Your SSD should withstand a solid 3x the stated TBW value (in much the same way your engine doesn't blow through the hood of your car at 50,001 miles or 4 years and one day... the warranty just expires.)
It's not only the TBW, some IC'S can fail too the TP62180 for instance and this one shortened your NAND get 12V and is dead, that's why I bought an external drive right away.
You have to imagine it, you buy a house and the house builder gives you the key to the back entrance that lets you into the kitchen and the bedroom and all the furniture is welded to the floor, the windows are just painted on the wall and if you turn on the heating because it's too cold, the house builder tells you have to buy a new one because otherwise you would destroy the house
This is exactly why I (as a developer) haven’t upgraded from Intel yet. Ram pricing is way too expensive. Even 16gb is starting to feel like too little now.
I don’t use a Mac as a dev, but I sure do like my 64 gigs on my pc. The upgrade from 16 to 32 was insane and then when I jumped to 64 it was even better. Think I have only run out ram like 2 times since going 64gb
@@_SP259youre right that 16 to 32gb makes a difference but i really don't see why anyone would need more than 32gb, especially on macos...i have a high end windows gaming pc and i also "only" have 32gb, even though i could upgrade for a really cheap price if i wanted to...i can have a demanding game running while having 100 tabs in multiple browsers running and there is still a lot of ram left and no slowdown...
Agree it’s a crime how little memory the base model has. With not being upgradable they should give us a break on the add ons. More people would decide to bump the specs if they weren’t so ridiculously priced!!
Yeah. At least have your base model be something USABLE. What the hell is the ability to do all these exciting things on a machine that can't store any of it? And don't even get me started with iCloud.
This video is spot on! I'm in the market for a MacBook, but I absolutely refuse to buy a new one from Apple. Their prices are ridiculous and a rip-off. Selling a laptop in 2023/2024 with 8 gigs of RAM and 256 gigs of storage is a joke, especially at Apple's price point. I'd rather buy a used one off Ebay than give Apple my money.
Been using a 13 inch m1 with a 1tb T7 for 2 years now. Absolutely the best decision I made. Unfortunately I had no choice but to upgrade my RAM due to my workflow, but there was absolutely no way I was going to pay extra $200 for 256GB storage, so I went with a weird 16GB 256GB configuration.
So every once in a while, my teacher brings in a few professionals from certain fields (Audio, Video, etc) due to the class being related to media and technology. And one day he brought in a few audio people to present to the class, they of course brought their own computers. But one of them had the most genius setup ever. a 16GB RAM 256GB storage m1 mac mini that had 2 portable SSDs plugged into it. And a portable monitor with a Bluetooth keyboard and magic trackpad. Easily the single most efficient way to sidestep apples storage costs was simply to make himself his own makeshift laptop out of a mac mini and some peripherals, and add his own portable SSD's.
It's indefensible and they only do it because they can. Drawing more attention to it like with this video is about the only thing we can do to address it short of not buying Macs. I do suspect it forces people to buy them less often and that may be another thing we can do, buy as least frequently as possible.
Yes. Bottom line is for those who need semi-reasonable configs (min. 16gb / 1TB), MBPs still remain a more "luxury" product, not a "value" product. Apple always used to be a more "premium" brand, but over the years has come out with base models that work for the "every-day consumer" (Eg. web surfing, e-mail, ppt/spreadsheets, light work use) at a very attractive entry price. But still get any "power" user that needs upgrades to still have to pay that $2k+ "more luxury product" price
Yea, Apple prices that upgrade overlap intentionally. What's interesting is that there's an interview with someone from Apple claiming that 8gb on the M3 14inch pro is better than more ram on windows laptop, or something to that effect. Their unified ram may be faster but when things go to swap on the ssd all the time, it's degrading the ssd more quickly. So apple is KNOWINGLY putting 8gb on their laptops when it may be decreasing the ssd's endurance! Not only that, this shows how profit driven yet shortsighted they are. AI workflows in the future will require more and more RAM , so wouldn't they want more and more people to use their products on the capability of this experience?! Whenever they finally introduce their AI software thing, are they going to be claiming that 8gb is a good enough starting point for that too? All they have to do is bundle some of the benefits together. Upgrading the ram by this much, also includes this much extra storage. Just include it. No sneaky price bumps. Reduce your obscene ram+storage margins just by a little! Your AI team is probably hamstrung by it!
I've been hearing about the "outrageous price" of Apple product since the mid 1980's. It seem that people like to complain a lot, but keep buying their stuff. And, in return this has helped make them the 2.8 trillion dollar company they are today. Whose fault is that?
It's a very different game today than it was in the 80s and 90s. Mac computers used to be a bit more expensive than PC:s but they were of such a high quality that it was worth every penny. For graphics and video PC:s were just not an alternative. Macs were also highly expandable, like the 9600 were you had 6 slots for PCI cards. Adding RAM or larger HD:s wasn't more difficult or expensive than doing the same on a PC. Macs kept on being good value for money well into the 2000's, one example are the 27 inch Imacs that didn't cost much more than the screen only. They also offered LOTS of connections (USB, FireWire, Thunderbolt, DVI etc) and they were always built with backwards compatability in mind. Something happened with Apple around 2005, they stopped being the go to computer for creative professionals and became a luxury brand for the wealthy.
@@wilhelmhagberg8854 nevertheless, the price of Apple products has steadily irritated consumers since the mid 80's, and consumers continue to buy. I don't buy the "luxury brand for the wealthy" argument though. The wealthy may have been a good marketing strategy to promote to the larger masses, but it's the masses themselves who have made Apple trillions, not the rich
@@wilhelmhagberg8854 some people may want to think they became a luxury brand for the wealthy, but the vast majority of their profits have been made by the masses, not the top 1%
It’s super funny because they put an extremely powerful M2 chip inside their MacBook Airs but limit it to 8gb ram 256gb storage, it’s like a Ferrari being tied down to the lot 😂😂
They like to bottleneck their base products because they know most won’t settle for the base storage. Unless someone is willing to spend on the overpriced upgrade Apple is happy to take your money 💰.
I was a long term Apple person (over 25 years) who left Apple and went to PC in 2017 when Apple quit supporting my Apple hardware and required me to buy new hardware. The new Apple hardware had extremely low about of memory like 16 gb and 512GB SSD were my PC has 64 GB with 32 tb of disk space at 1/3 the cost. I am a graphic designer and photographer and need the storage and the ram space. The Apple Mac Books are Ok for doing office work at 2x the cost. I supper glad I switched as my hardware lasts a lot longer with OSs and I can upgrade my current PC hardware with newer stuff.
Thank you for using your voice to more eloquently express our outrage. I’ve started to transaction away from apple because of these kinds of shenanigans.
Years ago, I bought an SD card adapter that you could add a MicroSD memory card to that plugged into the SD slot on my son’s Retina MacBook Pro. It was a great way to add storage for not a lot of money.
I bought an M3 MacBook Pro with 16GB RAM/512GB SSD off of PC Connection for $1,499. Florida currently also has a sales tax holiday so I got a slickdeal. Insane how I paid ~$2500 for the same specs on a 2017 MacBook Pro, deals could be found. Don't pay the Apple Tax!
The main issue with trying to migrate for some people is losing access to Mac-only software. I manage fine now, but not being able to edit in Final Cut Pro was a definite downside to my workflow once upon a time
You bring up a good point, and it's valid. As long as consumers continue to buy, Apple will never bring down the price. And that is just it-consumers have to have it, so they think. Like any company, overcharging they will get away with it because consumers are spoiled and think they need it or have to have it, willing to pay for overpriced products. For those who are not willing to give their money away, they can easily buy a Windows computer and respectfully get the RAM size and SSD space they need for far less than what Apple is charging. It's that simple.
Apple’s pricing for upgrades to storage has always been outrageous. But at least back in the day you could buy storage for less elsewhere and do the upgrade yourself. Then they started soldering the parts in place for no better reason than to thwart us, and now with integrated chips we’re completely locked out. It’s one of the worst standards Apple has adopted.
May I ask how you’re verified with only 5 Subscribers??
Yeah. Soldered CPU/GPU/SoC? That tracks, the slot takes up real-estate that you just don't have on a laptop and by virtue of being by far the most expensive thing on a board, it's not like replacing just the SoC is a significant saving.
Soldered memory? There is a bit of performance you can get from that. It's extremely iffy, has the very serious downside of your RAM dying forcing you to replace your whole board with the SoC, but if you really squint I guess that maybe you can make an argument for this not only being a cash grab.
But soldered storage? The gains are nonexistent, the downside of having to replace everything else if the storage dies stays but additionally, if anything at all dies on the board, your data is effectively gone. Obviously there are services that can recover it, but these can be incredibly costly, results aren't guaranteed and if you really need your data now, you're just out of luck. It takes a minor issue of taking out your storage and plugging it into another machine and turns it into a a massive headache for absolutely no benefit to the user.
But as long as people keep buying that stuff, they have zero reason to change. This isn't a new issue. Jobs was the guy who put custom screws on the first Macs so that it was really hard to open and work on them, at a time when users would in fact be ready to solder on their own parts
read my comment and tell me if i am wrong please
I’m seeing that in the overall laptop market. Dell/HP/Lenovo are all soldering parts onto their motherboard.
@@FastGuy1it’s fake I think, just a symbol
There’s a 3rd option: Vote with your wallet. Don’t buy it. Don’t support a company that does this kind of thing.
When their products are so shiny, expecting people to vote with their wallet is a stretch. Sometimes when I tell people on here that I upgraded the SSD on my ASUS S13 (from 512 GB to 4 TB) I find some UA-cam commenters dismiss me as poor because it cost me 1/5 the price Apple would charge & refusing on principle to not pay for ludicrously overpriced upgrades is unconscionable in their eyes. Oh well.
@@Lee.S321 "dismiss me as poor" i see no problem being seen as poor.
I did. Mac laptop user for 20+ years. Framework 16 arriving in a few weeks.
@@worldoflonelyfool It's not being thought of as poor (i'm not) that bothers me, it's the mentality of some people to overpay for the sake of overpaying, seemingly just to be able to tell people you overpaid for something & look down on those who didn't/wouldn't. That's the thing I can't get my head around.
that's the only thing apple respects.. buy used and fuck this shit!!
I'm glad that more channels--and as a result, consumers--are starting to talk about this pricing problem more and more. With the price of flash storage dropping like a stone, it's becoming harder and harder to justify Apple's price points for storage and RAM, especially when these machines are unmodifiable and can't be user configured out of the box. Hopefully this video will help shine a brighter light on these shady business practices and either force Apple to reconsider, especially with other laptop companies and OSes hopping on the ARM bandwagon. Otherwise, they'll probably get left in the dust once other corporations catch up.
What kinds surprised me (and I know largely it’s that Apple knows people will pay) is that Apple doesn’t simply spec their base models out with (at least) 512GB SSD 16GB RAM, and offer decent prices for higher storage and ram. Their quality/value of their product would blow the competition away so much that they’d probably see a further increase in sales overall.
It’s not just the price, they don’t even stock potential upgrades in store, so if you want something with decent storage and RAM the day you walk into the store, you’re forced up the upgrade ladder.
@@l.g.4425 i can run macos on my pc right now. the only reason people have to pay the apple tax is because of casuals who want to look like they have more than the $30 they have in their bank accounts
Consumers? Lol.
@@SweetSweetCandyBoyzSorry for the massive comment I’m just really pissed. So I agree with what you said except they don’t even sell the upgrades in store. Two examples of this: First, I’ve been trying to get a new MacBook Pro locally since launch day. I can’t go to Best Buy and get an M3 Pro in higher than base configuration. And I can’t get an M3 Max in ANY configuration according to the app. In ANY store in the state of NE. A Best Buy rep told me outright that they weren’t allowed to by Apple, who provided the products they wanted to see on the floors. Why?? Secondly, once again Best Buy, but also Target, Walmart, everywhere… won’t let you WALK OUT THE STORE with a new iPhone without connecting it to either AT&T or Verizon, sometimes T-Mobile. Wtf?! I’m trying to throw my money at you! But I’m on Mint and I don’t plan to change so that means you’ve lost my business.
However, I think I figured it out. In the first case, Apple doesn’t WANT you to get the best or highest tier devices, as they know you’ll likely keep them for years. They prefer the planned obsolescence forcing you to upgrade. And if you do insist on whatever it takes to get the highest tier? That’ll be $4000 please. Now for the second case, I believe either Apple or the stores themselves are approached by the carriers and offered large incentives to force activation of all devices prior to finalizing purchase. That way you have to go with one of those two (sometimes three) Big Wireless. And even when you have something like Verizon unlocking all phones 60 or 80 days after purchase or whatever it is, are you really going to want to go through the process of switching carriers immediately? Your service is “good enough anyway”… Gotcha. And now Apple and Best Buy take a decent cut.
Apple has trained its customers to not just happily accept getting ripped off, but to look forward to it.
this is a highly original opinion that I have never heard before
@@john_mega A hit dog will holler.
they lost me.
@@john_megaso what. Your opinion isn't original either
LMAO good one mate. :D :D
It’s great to finally see that even the biggest fans of the brand like AppleExplained and many others are finally speaking out about this issue.
too little too late......speaking out isnt enough.......stop buying them. If it cant be fixed or upgraded easily then dont buy it.
@@christopher480 Exactly they helped create this by shilling blind tribalism and letting Apple become peak anti consumer.
@@christopher480 Waiting for the EU to begin cracking down on this problem too
This issue singlehandedly takes apples products from being an actually good value and turns it into jokes. Not only is the practice extortionate. They don't even use the "best" RAM and storage on the market, far from it - LPDDR5X exists, similarly much faster flash exists especially on Airs. But most importantly, it's the most dissonant and mind numbingly stupid decision you could possibly make from an environmental perspective. Apple saves low single digit % on the MSRPs of these machines by specing them as low as is humanly possible. To make them obsolete as quickly as possible. As long as this remains standard at Apple, all of their gleeful keynotes about how forward thinking and green they are remain hollow and miscreant. It's anti consumer and anti environment.
Their greenwashing is 100% bs. All just an excuse to really just save their bottom line. No charging bricks with iPhones? Even on the new USB-C models? Get real
the value is only there for the base model or there refurbs. otherwise ya its crazy dumb the prices
Despite being an Apple fanboy I agree with everything you said
Apple will never win the respect of the hardcore PC buyer market until they couple their revolutionary silicon, and great software, with similarly great RAM and SSD configs and pricing! If you’ve lived your whole life swapping huge drives into your computers on the cheap, why would you “upgrade” to a computer that charges you two or three times as much for half the RAM and a quarter of the storage?! Which is more important, performance per watt, or being able to Have room to actually store all your files on your computer?
@Epicgamer_Mac
And with how much of a walled garden Apple insists on, a lot of open source devs just won't bother with directly supporting Apple silicon without the use of pre configured build targets. To my knowledge, Pytorch and Tensorflow are still pretty flaky on Macs.
@@Epicgamer_Mac The real story with upgradeable storage is portability when you upgrade everything else! I've had a 1tb Samsung 950 pro that's lived in 4 different computers over the years and now continues to serve in an external USB enclosure.
As a huge apple fan, their pricing on these upgrades is ridiculous. Cant defend it even if I wanted to.
I bought a cheap Mac Mini M1 for my macOS work and a windows PC for everything else. Why to spend 2k to 3k to have a very limited Mac, if I can have a good cheap Mac and an excellent PC for everything
never defend corporations
@@ricarmigExactly what I’m going to do when i have the money, i’m undeniably an apple fanboy, iphone and macbooks all the way, but I’ll never buy a iMac or Mac pro if i have a choice
@@aintrxidenbe a fan of what works not a logo. I can't with apple fans
@@Kmodoe Amen
It’s even worse for other markets like in the UK where everything is priced the same as in the US but in pounds so it’s actually 30%-50% more expensive!
You're not taking into consideration a few differences. They generally earn more money than we do, and their increased dollar value is across the board. Meaning yes, the exchange rate may raise the cost of a computer from $2,500 to $2,600, but so too is it the same for income. If they're you're taking home $1,000 per week and their income is the same per se', they're taking home $1,200 or so. Exchange rates apply to all money, not just what you buy. Besides, they tend to have larger discretional incomes as well due to many of the things we pay for exuberantly being included for free in their system.
Sadly, the U.S., despite it still producing the largest amount of cash per year, we've lost the highest standard of living rating years ago. Our income disparity is grossly out of whack and is now reducing overall income as a result. Which is why, despite our unemployment numbers being as low as they were in the 1950s (we've been fully employed for over year now ranging between 3.4 and 3.9 percent). Yet we're not experiencing the same kind of spending boom. People are not making the kind of money their great grandparents did (considering inflation) back then.
Speaking of inflation; Forbes released a study proving that the reason industries across the nation hiked their prices, so high these past two years had nothing to do with the higher cost of labor, supply and distribution issues, etc. They intentionally raised their pricing hiding behind the fact that inflation existed. It is so bad, that Forbes determined that 56% of the inflation rate was due directly to that. All the while, industry after industry companies were reporting record high profits.
Greed, and we paid it gleefully without complaint, or action.
In my day? There would have been protests blocking the entrances to shopping plaza parking lots and other tactics. Today? I can't figure it out, such lazy complacency. Heck, there would have been screaming for congressional industry wide hearings. Now all we care about are... well really. What do we care about? Anything at all but ourselves? I'm at a loss with that one.
So, when comparing economic situations between nations it is rarely apples and oranges. In fact, it is a lot like comparing an Apple to a PC.
You think 50% more is expensive? Try buying a Mac in Brazil. It's literally double the price. Just for comparison, the base model MacBook Air M3 with 8gb of ram and 256gb of storage costs $2508 US Dollars. The RAM upgrade from 8gb to 16Gb costs $399.81, and the same price goes to storage upgrades. The minimum wage in Brazil is R$1412 or $282.26 US dollars. It's insane, and it's no wonder I don't ever see anyone using a Mac
@@euuIgor
Yikes! Wouldn’t be surprised if there’s extremely high taxes for those sorts of products that are imported to Brazil while a ton of US and Canadian game developers, film studios and animation studios are extremely dependent on cheap labour from remote workers like digital concept illustrators who are based in Brazil.
As much as I loved my macbook and macos, the lack of upgradability plus the crazy markup on memory and storage led me to pick up a Framework laptop and running Linux as my main machine for the foreseeable future. I'm glad so many creators are calling this out.
Will do the same, I will get a Framework running Linux as my next machine. Either the AMD or even better, a Qualcomm ARM by then. Apple needs to take a lesson for treating it's customers so bad
I am going to do the same as well. Framework will be my next laptop. I love Linux and use it more than Mac OS now anyway.
That's exactly what I did. I still have my M1 base MBA, but I picked up a Framework i7 in '22. It's barely thicker than the MBA. I overkilled it with 64GB RAM and 2TB M.2 storage. I'm running Linux as well. I upgraded the lid to the stiffer CNC lid and I have the 80db speakers waiting to go in when I get home. I wish Framework made smartphones because I would buy one in a second. I escaped Apple's walled garden except for their stock.
Apple sucks.
This. Now all we have to do is get rid of having to use MS Office + Teams and we have an almost perfect world
Dude, the analysis paralysis I've experienced in preparing myself to upgrade to Apple Silicon (from an Intel Mac Mini) is profound. It's like no matter way you try to just slightly upgrade the different models just makes the cost so ridiculous. But if you don't upgrade storage, you get SLOWER storage! And you can't upgrade RAM later. It's just crazy. Stressing about the upgrade paths has literally probably caused me to postpone my upgrade purchase for almost a year now. I literallly watched the M1 generation go by and now nearly the M2 as well.
Simple fact is, the base model specs on Storage and RAM are inexusable. 256gb storage and 8gb or ram is just too low.
Feeling that majorly right now. I recently purchased a fantastic Windows desktop PC for $700, with excellent specs from Micro Center - with all off the shelf parts. Now, I’m considering getting a laptop from Apple (again, after years away)…and wow what a sticker shock it was/is. I just cannot justify it. May actually look second hand
You could buy a refurbished Mac from apple, that would help you save on cost, especially if you have an Apple Card, you can get 3% back
Does the right to repair with apple not bother you? Apple will tell you to pound sand if your device has a failure.
Don't need to buy a Mac
Going through the exact same situation. My 2015 Intel Pro runs great as an every day computer, but for design work (which is what I bought it for) it's struggling to keep up these days. I'm happy to pass it on to a family member or friend as I've been eyeing an upgrade since the M1 release, but I can't justify the price of upgrading to any of the new MBPs with even the bare minimum configurations I need. Considering either the used market or just building a PC for the home office and keeping the 2015 MBP for travel because the sticker shock when ordering directly through Apple is just not it. Love Apple, but have been really tired of seeing the direction they've been going in for a while now.
With a PC I don't have to worry about how much wear and tear the SSD is taking as its so easy to replace and frankly mirror.
I was without a computer for a month while visiting family over the holidays. I swapped a new SSD into my mother's 8 year old laptop, and it was more than usable for the video work I was doing.
Really annoying that I can't do the same with my MacBook 😢
@@kirkydaturkey depends on what year Macbook. I'm still holding onto my Macbook Pro mid 2012 with upgradable storage and Ram. It's the last generation of easy self upgradable components. I upgraded my hard drive to an SSD. I want a new Macbook but overpaying for upgrade has made me reconsider if I need that upgrade. As for now my Macbook still does what I need it to do but I wouldn't mind the new features. It's Apple lost that I haven't made the jump.
ill better pay more than use Windows
@@MESSY-AFI'll pay nothing and use Linux Mint.
@Trensharo. It's true that the 2012 MacBook wouldn't be ideal for everyone, especially for heavier creative work. But for basic tasks it does a great job. For users like me who don't need a powerhouse, it gets the job done. Luke does a great job outlining that getting older machine can be a great bargain based on the cost and performance.
Of course, if I future-proofed for creative endeavors like VM machines or coding, I'd definitely upgrade to a machine with more muscle. My main gripe is the base configuration's measly 8GB RAM. It feels like Apple kneecaps users with that spec, forcing them to jump to a higher tier for just a bit more wiggle room.
Kudos to Luke for the honesty and decision to make this video. I have been an Apple fanboy for years but I can’t keep singing their praises and defending them when they screw customers over like this.
No, Apple’s pricing and tier system designed to fool people is not defensible in any way!
I couldn't agree more.
Apple pretends to be all Green and Eco friendly, but who can deny that soldered on SSDs results in very many expensive laptops finding their way to a landfill dump way before their time because of SSD failure?
Would be nice to see them rerefurbed by some Alibaba seller into a mega-Pi or something. The cpu and ram is still usable after all
@@Demopans5990 All closed sources. Youd see Jesus born again first before Apple releases development tool and blobs/drivers for their hardware
worst part is that m2/m3 storage is serialized.
M1 storage wasn't. Apple literally knows what they're doing.
but you wouldn’t throw electronics away surely it would get recycled which is what apple wants to happen.
it shouldn’t be the option tho stuff should be easy to upgrade or be cheaper
its called greenwashing, and all companies who claim to care about the environment do it
Agree 100%. Apple has gone way too far and they're abusing their customers. I bought a M1 Mac Mini for $439 and added an external 2 TB drive for a hundred bucks. It's external, but it works fine. Sadly you can't externally update the RAM. But if people are willing to pay the high prices, Apple has no motivation to change.
I'm torn by my love for the platform and Apple's super-greedy prices.
Apple is a bully.
I'm sorry but their IOS and OS X platform is lacking. Don't believe me, just look at how many tutorials on how to add music from a Macbook to iPhone there is online.... Now that's telling!
The platform sucks 😂 so closed off to any sort of customisation and because it's so closed you have no idea about telemetrics being taken
@@M.V.P23 every system is lacking in some fields though. Most things are easier on mac comparing to Windows or Linux.
@@rafadydkiemmacha7543definitely agree Apple 🍎 is a bully
As a stockholder, this makes me nervous. They are pushing the edge and abusing their customer base.
This issue has existed for years, I think this issue is already priced into the stock.
I used to have the same dilemma but consumers eat it up
Explain as a stockholder how Apple is going to make more money by making the storage upgrades cheap?
Apple's issue is that their SOC's are actually too fast meaning people on M1 don't even feel like their machines are the least bit slow. This was never the case in the Intel days.
It should make you happy that they have a loyal customer base that will pay the price.
@@vlcheishmaybe they’d n make more
The other thing people don't talk about much when discussing price comparisons in storage is we're looking at the retail price of an entire M.2 SSD on Amazon, and not considering the wholesale price of just the actual chip that Apple is soldering onto a board that already exists. It makes the disparity even wider
very true, the wholesale price for millions of units, will cut the price by at least 30%
@@skeennah1927 and no need to make a whole nvme board, just get two chips. the chips alone are probably $10-20 if you buy them in bulk
read my comment and tell me if i am wrong please
The thing is; they don’t need to do this. They have enough money. They could make upgrades much more affordable and thus; sell more units. Why they do this is beyond me, it just seems exploitative at this point.
Greed is a hell of a drug
you don't become a trillion dollar company by being nice to your customers.
It’s not quite greed. They are playing the long game. If they drop prices then people will shop on price, so they have to emphasize value. There are hundreds of hardware companies who went out of business once because of pricing and not focusing on value. Gateway, compaq, machines, and HP.
The real problem is their M1 is too good. Less than 20% actually need an M1 Pro and less than 10% need an M1 Max. Scale to M2 and it’s in the mid single digits. Now scale to M3 and it’s low single digits.
How many companies make a v1 product that’s so good very few people can take advantage of v2 or v3?
@@timbukstu9861Did you estimate these numbers or did someone do any math on this? It sounds perfectly right to me but I would be interested to watch/read about this in more detail :)
They have more free cash lying around than any company on Earth, don't they?
I miss the Intel based Macs with easily upgradeable storage and RAM. Still rocking my MBP 2010. I bought a 2021 macbook pro and quickly sold it because having only 256gb of space is impossible to work with in my profession.
I still run my 2012 model as my DJ and music production machine. It shows it's age when running a project with a lot of tracks and effects, but the DJ software is relatively light since I mostly spin MP3s and WAVs
Not even mentioning the flexibility of running boot camp and having the best of both worlds on one machine.
that too. Bootcamp helped me run Windows games while overseas. @@ValTek_Armory
I agree, Apple’s greed needs to be stopped! I hope EU will force SSD & Ram upgradability!
+1000000
I completely agree that something needs to be done so any electronic device lasts longer. But you know what will happen? Apple will put the price up of the MacBook. But yep something needs to happen.
Yeh still don’t understand why both are soldered on in the first place.
It hurts performance & efficiency. They just need to make the upgrades cheap.
Damn I literally just commented the same before seeing your comment!
Imagine spending 1200 USD on a laptop and getting a 256GB disk. I had that amount of storage on my 2017 iPhone X. Yes, a phone from now 6+ years ago.
My Dell Latitude D630 from 2006 has more storage than that (yes, it is an SSD.) Quite honestly, the soldered on storage and RAM thing really bothers me. Really, that should be more of a cost cutting measure which should be passed on to the consumer, but this is apple we are talking about.
@@WalterKnox The memory is different issue, as it is die bonded directly to the CPU, but yes, the storage is a big issue to power users - maybe a hint to who they feel their customer base is...
@@yestertechnet It doesn't matter the justifacation, the memory should be user up-gradable as well. I would sort of be okay with it if it were a $200 Wal-Mart Chromebook, but if you are paying apple money, I want something that is going to last for years and be upgradable. Especially pro grade machines. I am still using a mac pro from 2009, which is only possible because it is hugely upgradable. Same thing with my 2011 macbook pro, and 2010 mac mini. I also have a 2011 iMac which had a failed GPU, and if it were a modern machine, it would have gone into the trash, but because it is older, the graphics card could be replaced easily.The move to soldered on and integrated parts is quite honestly disgusting, and people justifying it is as well. I don't care how thin and light it is able to make a machine, it is in reality a cost cutting measurement as well as insuring that the consumer will have no choice but to buy a new computer after a couple of years because they are stuck with the factory configuration. It is not just an Apple issue, however like many other stupid tech trends which make things have less functionality but are "for the greater good" I guess, Apple is the worst and the leader in it.
@@yestertechnet I don't think it suggests their customer base are people who don't need storage... I think it suggests they know that their customers who buy their computers to do heavy workflows, can afford to pay 4x markup for storage and (idk how much)X markup for ram, as they make good money anyway.
Even worse, doing that knowing full well what you're getting into. lol
Apple is crazy with those storage price bumps. Its nuts.
They've been doing it for ages. This is why I love my mid-range Samsung Galaxay phone with microsd card slot
@@manoz6194 They've been doing it for ages, but back in the day we at least had ways to upgrade things on our own. Now they literally make it impossible. No they need to get shamed into shape.
Price are outrageous. 2009 I bought the top of the line 3 tera, highest processor 17” MacBook Pro, full memory for around 2500$. Nowadays equivalent model of the line up is over 6000$. That’s just insane.
well that's called capitalism baby
I've been interested in buying a Mac for a while, either a 15" Macbook Air, or a 16" Macbook Pro and re-visit this every once in a while. Once I add the RAM and storage I'd like it becomes outrageously expensive and I just close the tab again. I'm sure I am not alone with this. They are missing out on some sales from people who are not willing to be extorted for RAM and storage upgrades.
Same here!
A 15inch air with 16gb ram and 1 tb ssd is 2080€ or 2270$ here in Germany!
Yeah it's the old adage do you want 80% of something or 100% of nothing?
I did the same thing and found a previous year 16 inch model refurbished for 1000$ off on Amazon, from 2800 to 1800. Not sure if the deals are there right now but it's always worth checking for refurbished.
Same. I refuse to spend 200 bucks for 8 bloody gigs of ram or laughable 256gb of extra storage
The pricing and the soldered chips are outrageous. The consumer should be able to upgrade the internal storage and the RAM. Honestly, this may need to come about through law like USB-C did…
Well dell is working on a project that should fix it CAM memory. It’s basically m.2 but ram.
And to replace processor!!! Don't forget that as well!
yep. amazing it took the EU not US consumers or US Congress to force Apple into sanity on the lightening issue. i was bitten by it the other day. was carrying dozens of USB-C cables on me but my car lightning cable was charging slower than the iphone was sucking power and it kept bottoming out at “0%”. had a few usb-c to lightening cables on me but couldn’t find a spare USB-A to lightening to use with my cigarette lighter usb-A socket
@@Milos596 Ah, replaceable processors would have some extra problems. Biggest issue is it would make the machines thicker because a socketed processor takes up more space. Not so much of a problem for myself as I'm not so comfortable with machines that are too thin but the market seems hell bent on paper-thin hardware.
Legislation like theEU's mandate for USB-C may not turn out as well as one might think. For one thing, it may prevent the development of even better replacements. And the USB specifications have become such a mess that the USB-C you have for one device may *still* not be quite adequate for another. A great idea done with the best of intentions (and you can see from ua-cam.com/play/PLBuns9Evn1w9XhnH7vVh_7C65wJbaBECK.html how well that often turns out).
@silverjoystix4696USA is corrupt as heck. Err well they call it lobbying
Thanks for pointing this out, Luke. Apple's prices made me switch from MacOS to Linux almost 4 years ago and since then I have only experienced freedom and publicly available documentation and I benefit from it professionally.
Yes, it took Luke to point this out. Most of us who follow, or followed, him have grown tired of his BS whining. His business acumen is poor and his message is at best childish. Grow up Luke.
@@hynekd the more who state that, the better.
I'm a huge Apple fanatic, but I agree that you really can't beat good old Linux for many applications and basic tasks. You definitely won't get anything super fancy (e.g. UI, features, apps, cross-platform convenience, aesthetics, security/privacy, etc. etc.) but you will get something that works, is silent, and gives you access to countless open-source, by-the-people-for-the-people software. And you also have your choice of which Linux OS you desire based on your specific needs. Oh, and the vast majority of it is 100% free which benefits countless people all over the world. 💯
But there's no need to limit yourself to just Apple or just Linux... I like to have many different technologies and systems to keep me as tech-savvy as possible. 💎
Just no Microsoft. Never Microsoft. I've has absolutely horrendous experiences with Microsoft to the point where I will never support this company ever again. 👎
Agree 100%, they are scamming people, with these out of control prices. So sad
As long as sheeple are buying, they are good 👍
Apple does this so they can basically “lie” about their “starting at” price.
absolutely
Correct. The base prices are “loss leaders”.
Finally, someone gets it. All these shitty “tech UA-camrs” can go on here and market apple as selling “Amazing laptops for only X starting price,” but 256GB storage and 8GB memory is a joke even for non-power users. Thats wretchedly horrendous value for a product that has an extremely limited use life due to its specs and the fact that the parts cannot ever be upgraded.
@@danielseddon3177 not even sure if they are loss leaders per se, they probably still make money on those… but maybe harder to determine because depends on if you use costs to develop (and produce) that 1 model as the basis or if you count R&D for future models into it.
@@Ultrajamzyes, I’m sure there isn’t really a loss. The main benefit to them will also likely be greater market reach and therefore a reduction in the costs you mention.
Totally agree about Apple's "RAM scam". It's freakin expensive! For both RAM and SSD!
It's just so sad. So sad!
The worst thing isn't the upselling. It the fact that if you don't upgrade, your laptop becomes obsolete quicker, and apple still wins.
Apple was ahead of the game in 2012, the 1st gen MBP Retina 15” came standard with 256 gbyte SSDs but for whatever reason they’ve stayed at the base 256 gbytes for over a decade now.
They’re a bit too greedy with their profit margins.
That's crazy, because back then 256gb was real big. Most people back then were buying a 64gb SSD.
and those 2012 were still upgradeable. also they came stock with 8gb with ram on those which is still the base configuration even 12 years later...
As a stockholder, you want them to make as much as they can.
@@michvod Yes I still run mine with a 2TB OWC SSD.
@@walkingtheearthin4k Who knows, maybe more people would buy if these machines were upgradable.
I love how you just get straight into the topic at hand without all the intro bait and chatter. Great channel!
The ram part is insane. That impacts the longevity of the device. You can add external storage and cloud no issues. Under 16gm in 2024 will be stupid!
Fully agree with you Luke! Apple doesn’t seem to realize how much resentment and hatred they cause among their customers! There is a difference between expensive and pure unfettered greed!
read my comment and tell me if i am wrong please
They don’t, and they won’t, because people are buying
It's tragic how apple has become the evil they wanted to fight. Apple's slogan once was 'Does more. Costs less' - Now it's the other way around.
What are you on about. They have always been the damn same, its just silly slogans that peabrained normies fall for. They ALWAYS did the same anticonsumer anti-right to repair nonsense.
What are you talking about?? Apple has always been the most expensive in anything, while providing less than anyone else, who've also always done it for far less money?? Total confusion about your comment.
They were never good, remember "you are holding your phone wrong?"
An Apple was always the bohemian computing device for people who can and want to afford it. People always paid extra for the brand, already back in the 80s. The very first Mac had about the same specs as the Amiga and was more than twice as expensive.
Apple, Do Less at a premium price.
I agree. This is holding me back from buying one and I think it is the same with thousands if not millions of people around the world.
LMAO @ the most nonsensical statement of 2024. HILARIOUS!!! 😄😁😆
@@aiconic10 I'm glad I could be of service for your own entertainment! 😉😄
APPLES BECOME A'' RIP OFF COMPANY'' --AND I LOVE AND USE MAC PROS AND ITS DESKTOPS
I SPENT THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS TO APPLE...--- NO MORE ---
"Oh, you want 16gb of ram on your M3 MacBook 'Pro'? Just add $200 (now totaling, $1799) and wait 2-weeks for us to ship you your machine OR spent just $200 more, get the binned M3 Pro AND 16gb of RAM, and what do you know... we just happen have that in stock today...." Apple wants you to spend $2,000, minimum, for a usable machine that takes full advantage of the hardware - it's why the RAM upgrade prices are what they are, and why they don't stock anything but the base models from the Air's to the lesser-Pro's at Apple stores. I had an 8gb RAM model, then returned it for a 16gb model. The performance difference, regardless of the use-case, was noticeably 3-fold (I just happened to get lucky with an "open box" deal at Best Buy). But if you're expecting to walk into an Apple Store and get a machine that takes full advantage of the base M2/M3, you're going to be disappointed with your purchase. Do NOT get the base M2 Macbook Air and absolutely do NOT get the base M2 MacBook Pro.
The M3 Pro has 18 gigabytes of ram, instead of 16, and it's cheaper than a base M3 macbook pro with a ram and storage upgrade.
That's the part that makes no sense to me at all. It makes zero sense to buy a base M3 macbook pro with the pricing and the specs.
This is honestly the main reason why I am avoiding to go fully into the Apple Ecosystem. As soon as you go beyond the base configurations, that's when Apple hits your wallet like a MF, and it is necessary to upgrade as the main config are outdated. As long as people keep paying for these upgrades, the prices will not change.
Exactly. So why would Apple change anything? Would be stupid for them to stop.
I agree. I've been an iPhone/iPad user since the beginning, but I just can't justify Macs in their current state, these prices are just unfair.
honestly, and this is so funny, I've actually made the correct decision when I bought my 16" M1 Pro MacBook Pro earlier this year. The M2s just came out and I was deciding between the M2 and M1, which would've been a price difference of roughly $300. Only a month or so ago I saw a video comparing M1 Pro, M2 Pro and M3 Pro models for DAWs (digital audio workstations) and guess what? In most professional DAWs (Logic, Pro Tools and some others) the M1 Pro outperforms the other chips due to having more performance cores and those DAWs utilizing those exclusively.
What a time to be alive when a 2 year old computer beats the current one.
I'm still fascinated by the fact that the 2012 iMac 21.5" was the first iMac that came with an 8GB RAM base configuration and the upgrade to 16GB was $200. And now it's 2023 and the base iMac still has 8GB and the upgrade costs exactly the same as it did 11 years ago.
indeed
Interesting fact
It should also be said Apples design of soldered on board is a dangerously stupid - cause if the hard drive gets hit with a power surge then your beautiful $2000 or $3000 machine becomes a glorified paper weight and your data is gone and your machine is DEAD permanently.
Now we need to find a way to call Apple out for Ram specifically. The markup is absurd and there is no external option available.
Yup. IMO the pricing wouldn't be so egregious if the baseline models weren't penalty box configs. 8gb memory on a "pro" machine in 2023?? 🖕
@@joelv4495 nah, don't forget that Apple was shipping 8GB as base config in 2012 on their Pro machines, just another 4-5 years and 16 is gonna be standard. Surely...
@@PvtAnonymous Dell, HP, MS and Samsung, et al, shipped 8GB in 2012. Guess what they are still doing it now, as well. Apple gets blasted, but never Windows. Inevitable as Apple is a small player (
@@andyH_England maybe they do, but there's 2 differences: RAM is user upgradable in many of these machines and even if it is soldered, the prices are not as insane as Apple's. This is what Apple really gets blasted for, not the 8GB per se.
@@andyH_EnglandThey do make billions on Macs though, look at their financial statement. They lost market share in 2023 however despite launching 2 generations of silicon.
Apple needs to find out a better business model for its devices. There's just no way 256GB of SSD space should cost $200. It's insane.
No computers base model should START with 256GB period. 10 years ago, sure… 2024? Hell no.
@@bout2cooku425 same with 8GB of RAM. Imagine selling a laptop with "Pro" in its name and offering a base config with 8GB RAM lmao
Right lol. I got my external 1TB SSD for $100
Well, people are buying...
Any business model has a purpose of making money for the company and NOT what is best for the customers. In this case their business model works perfectly well for Apple.
This was the reason why i left Apple and bought a normal laptop: the freedom to replace memory/disk/wifi/etc. Also better repairability, even at home...
this is a stupid reason and shows you dont know what you're doing if you wanted freedom but still bought Apple in the first place.
@@SmellsLikeNirvanna No it's not a stupid reason when you consider the fact that when your Apple product develops a fault, Apple will tell you that it's more expensive to have it repaired than to buy a new one.
You're either on the Apple payroll or you don't know what you're talking about yourself, so which is it ?
@@eastlondonhustler read my comment again. Which part tells you that I am an Apple Fanboy? LOL. Is English your second language?
@@SmellsLikeNirvanna you can't handle the truth
@@aeriskabkr1110 stupid people cannot tell from my comment that Im a PC user
I'm not buying another mac until the base config comes with at least 16GB RAM and 1 TB Storage.
I have always felt this way. Because of that, I just updated my late 2013 MBP with a logic board upgrade from the 2.0 GHz/8MB RAM to 2.6/16GB, the SSD from 256GB to 1TB and a new battery all for a total of $350! I get a "new to me" MacBook Pro and am really happy with the upgrades.
Ah the infamous Apple Tax! Even Apple Explained complained about this of all people. 😂
Where?
This exact thing is why I have an infrequent upgrade cycle. Their pricing is just insane. I have also recommended friends and family to strongly consider alternative brands where I in the past would most often tell them to buy a Mac…
The sad truth, from a performance standpoint, soldered components Do provide a bit of an upgrade, so I can see why the industry may follow suit, with everybody SO focused on the even MINUTE bumps in performance. Thankfully though, other Manufacturers have apparently been able to keep those costs competitive. But yeah, there is nothing stopping them from price gouging as well.
Apple's benefit is only the operating system. If Mac OS ran on any computer, people would be installing them on better machines. Not everyone needs so much battery life, we have power sockets here and even airplanes have power sockets these days.
Well. Replied to the wrong person. Was really talking to @williamCox95
@GotCake2700you're still buying second hand crap all because of them ripping you off stop being a simp
When it comes to tablets it’s seems like Apple have no competition though I am would prefer open os
My trick was i bought a lenovo laptop , on their website they even have manuals on how to open the laptop so you can change / upgrade memory and storage , install any operating system you want and pay less then half of a standard macbook.
Best way to go. About 10-15 years ago I bought an Alienware M15 laptop. It was insanely priced, kinda like Apple products. But highly customizable, even to do yourself. It literally took unscrewing 4 screws to get it opened up, and everything you could possibly think of to upgrade or repair was easily accessible, as if they ENCOURAGED people to do their own repairs and upgrades. I eventually upgraded my ram, and hard drive in a matter of minutes. I miss that computer. It's outdated now, I gotta see if I can find a motherboard I can put into it compatible with current components.
I have a Windows laptop and I was able to upgrade up to 64 GB RAM and 8TB storage myself (waited for a sale). It feels like a new laptop even though I've been using it for few years already. I was considering an Apple laptop with M3 Max chip, extra RAM and storage (for video editing, animation, coding stuff). But these huge price increases made me consider to keep my Windows laptop longer and upgrade the internal parts, it was more cheaper and I saved a lot of money that way.
And even if Windows becomes a problematic os to use, there's always Linux Mint or whatever to make it feel all new and fast again.
read my comment and tell me if i am wrong please
Sadly soldered memory and to a lesser degree storage is more and more of a thing on windows laptops too, especially on lower end ones.
Most buyers of expensive Macs will upgrade every cycle as a new chip means faster performance and time is money. It's a tax-deductible investment that pays for itself many times over. I have seen comparisons for developers between the M1 Max and M3 Max, and the M3 can do it significantly faster. At the top end, SSD and RAM are moot compared to CPU/GPU/co-processors.
@@Demopans5990Why are you linux users so cringe and always trying to mention it even tho it is not needed?
He is likely to have far more problems on linux than on windows and macos
It was a pleasure helping some family members double the RAM and quadruple the storage on some of their older Mac laptops. Now they all have M-Series and while they've not asked me, when and if they do it's going to be some unfortunate news. While I'm a PC-oriented user, my choice is simple, won't buy Apple since they solder everything together and really offer no post upgradability. Great on you Luke, for calling this out yet again.
As a PC guy. People who still defend apple I just can't understand
I'm glad you are talking about this. The more big names we have talking about it, the more pressure it will hopefully put on Apple.
The only way Apple will listen is if customers vote with their wallet, which is unlikely to ever happen, so things won't change. Since the M-series chips came out MacBooks have seen their largest ever cut of market share, & zero upgradability has been a core component of their line-up, so there's no incentive for Apple to change anything.
Real trouble if/when the internal soldered-in storage fails.
Yep thats the reason i will not buy a macbook.
Louis Rossman shows that it burns out the board if the SSD fails, and even if it doesnt you can't even boot from another drive. It seems like its intended to end the whole device. SSDs have limited life anyway so why else solder it in?
@@CampervanCookout Money. Why fixing the issue when customers can just buy a new one?
The more people speak about this issue, the better!
wont make a difference. apple users will continue to buy apple products.
💯
@@hidingmyrealnameWell Macos have much lower market share compared to last couple of months
That's why I love Thinkpads. You can get them used in perfect condition when companies sell them out after warranty ends. But that's not a problem, as resellers usually give their own warranty for resold TPads (at least in my country). A years extended warranty is the standard, but sometimes or with extra $ you can extend it to 2 years.
Sure, these laptops are a few generations behind, but for almost everything I'd need they're more than fine. And if I need to upgrade them - no problem. Buy any NVME you want, pop it in and you can have 2TB for like 120$. My Thinkpad's reseller does the disk swapping for free under their warranty. The same goes for RAM. And battery? No prob, you can just swap the old one with a pristine new one, which you can get for like 70$. Whole operation takes literally 5 seconds.
Sure, new Thinkpads are much more expensive, but still nowhere near Apple prices. And most of them still have the same ease of part swapping. I'm never gonna ditch them, unless they go Apple way hard.
Newer Thinkpads after T490 models are shifting to full soldered LPDDR4 RAM which limits the upgradability if you want more RAM in the future. T480 is the sweetest spot, as it has everything: 2 RAM slots, upgradable SSD, swappable battery, very good amount of ports, and still officially supported by Windows 11 (Intel Core 8th gen)
@@sihamhamda47 that's the exact Thinkpad that I own. It's great :)
Looks like I found a thinkpad comment just as I was thinking about my thinkpad while looking in the comments section!
Apple's strategy is to create a pricing ladder that is so closely rung that you are enticed to move up. Every rung is so close to the last that it makes you feel that moving up is a good value proposition, and you'll keep going up til you simply can't afford anymore. Apple gives customers a nice entry point just to get them on that ladder then walk them up it so they spend all that they have.
Yeah, it works. Instead of the MBA M2 15 M2 with 16GB/512GB, I went with the base MBP M3 Pro.
Truth.
The price of flash storage is so damn cheap. They’re just seeing how far they can go with this garbage pricing
Everything that depends on me, they won’t get my money. I bought a decent windows laptop for most demanding stuff. It’s cheaper than just having a Mac with upgrades…
There’s only one way around it, stop buying Apple.
The first Mac I had was a 2012 13" Macbook Pro. It came with 4GB of Ram and a rotating hard disk but it you could swap that out for 16GB of Ram and an SSD. So the cost wasn't really all that different to a PC. Now they solder down everything you basically need to buy the machine you'd end up upgrading to and they've massively jacked up the cost of the options you need to include. Looks like I'm going back to Windows, which MS have unfortunately completely ruined in the mean time.
I'd never go back to Windows. But Linux exists, is free, and is good enough for what I do.
@@wpj1362 I've tried it and I'm not going back.
Could you please say what MS ruined about Windows?
I saw few comments about that but there is no explanation about it
I understand if you don't like it and that is personal preference but there are billions of people who like Windows so saying its ruined by MS is ridiculous
@@antonioytm Loads of bloat and the touch centric UI they've been pushing since Windows 8.
@@user-qf6yt3id3w Bloat this, bloat that... people now complain about Ubuntu being bloated so where is end?
At that point everything is bloated for some users
A bit modern UI doesn't hurt.. you cant live on Windows XP or Windows 7 UI forever it needs a bit of upgrade
Windows always get criticism for bloated but when Google bloat their Android together with a vendor which has their own version of Android, UI and apps so you get double bloated its somehow not an issue?
From my point of view im more than happy with Windows and Android i use
Unfortunately, the only way it’s gonna change, is when we stop buying them…..😢
Then it won't change; Apple will give up selling unprofitable laptops as it is a tough market where all OEMs are feeling the pain, as consumers demand more and more and are willing to pay less and less.
They already sell basically zero laptops (compared to iPhones). They’re not trying to sell hardware, they’re trying to lock people in to the ecosystem and that’s a whole different playing field.
I was going to replace my iPad this past holiday season. The entry iPads with 64gb are not even close to what I wanted/needed. The price for memory upgrades made me look at android tablets. I bought two android tablets with expandable storage for less than half of a 256gb iPad. This was my first foray out of the Apple ecosystem in years. Truth be told the android tablets work just fine (a lot better than they used to), they took a little getting use to. They work well. They run the same apps (some minor variations). When my iPhone 12 pro dies I'm going to shop Android phones. The cost of living has been going up so I'm not going to blindly shell out for Apple's excessive prices anymore when there are significantly less expensive products that work almost as well.
I have ip12 too and I suppose I will do the same - when it will be very old I will switch to android. With time I will also switch from MacBook M1 Pro to a laptop with windows. I have decided 2 years ago that I will test Apple. After those 2 years I feel that I can safely go back to the better feature with at least not as bad companies as Apple…
i just got the pixel tablet and it works amazing in my home as a google home user
I love a happy ending !
Tip, you can install different launchers to override Android's interface (to some extent). Some even replicate iOS.
This is why I don't buy Apple products. They're too expensive. I can buy a Samsung phone or tablet etc and get more from it than some of these Apple products.
I couldn't agree more! I recently was in the market to buy a new laptop to use for traveling. I needed at least 16GB of RAM and 500GB of SSD space. As a lifetime Windows users but having the rest of my family using only Apple products, I really wanted to buy a Macbook Air. I could not believe the amount of money to upgrade to my minimu requirements!!!!
I purchased an ASUS Zenbook S13 OLED that has 32GB or RAM and 1TB of SSD for $1,100!! C'mon, Apple...these prices are ridiculous!
How are you liking it?
@@_shreyash_anandI love it! I have no regrets.
Emphatically agree, Luke. Thanks for articulating what many of us feel. I bought an M1 8 GB/128 GB MacBook Pro for full retail ($1300) but later found a great deal on an M1 8 GB/512 GB 24" iMac for $1250. (I use both, but I bought Logic Pro to use on the iMac.) I decided to get external storage as I could afford it and I really didn't need screaming performance for what I do, so I ended up buying two OWC Envoy Express Thunderbolt 3 enclosures, a 1 TB Samsung 980, and a 2 TB 980 Pro for a total of about $375....so that's 3 TB external storage for less than what Apple wants for 1 TB. I'm pretty happy with my decision. Why couldn't Apple have included some type of expansion method for upgradeable internal RAM and Storage with the Apple Silicon line? (Methinks: greed.) But I really don't see a way for Apple to bring the price of their internal RAM/storage down without all of us buyers who have gone before getting a bit upset. Thanks again, for all you do.
The scary part is other companies are starting to do this too. I just can’t wait for the gobs to force right to repair to cut down on e-waist.
Not every company, check out framework for example. Totally upgradable
I'm patiently waiting for this
An now Apple is considering taking a page from Adobe's playbook and going with a hardware subscription model where you would be on a rental treadmill.
@@daveindezmenez at that point I am swapping to full Android.
@@daveindezmenez Do you have proof?
I remember when a family member bought a MBP, and later they complained that it slowed down to a crawl within a few months. Was shocked when I looked at it and it only had a 128GB drive, which naturally filled up quickly. Apple can pound sand, they've been ripping off consumers for ages now with this upgrade BS and borderline crippled base models.
That's how they made multi trillion dollar company.
this is one of the things that consumers should have pushed forward to be looked at by legislators. this is unacceptable with today’s demand in terms of longevity of devices especially with how pretty much unrepairable and expensive these devices are.
Hate to tell you that even the most foolish of legislators won’t attempt to tell a company how to price its products and services. The market will decide if Apple’s pricing is out of line not Luke’s infantile videos. If you don’t like, or can’t afford, Apple laptops & desktops, simply buy a PC. There are many great ones out there for far less than Apple products cost. I don’t have a problem with the pricing of Apple products & don’t mind spending more for the specifications I want. I do have a problem with fools like Luke who whine about the pricing but keep buying the products. Move on man, get over it already.
@@hynekd nah, you’re making an excuse for a large tech company to limit their hardware and overprice said hardware for its users. for what? sure, market dictates what the market wants… that’s what this is all there is under the guise of competing with different brands, anyway, right? however, the market didn’t ask for a unified piece of soldered hardware, where you don’t have a safety net when 1 or 2 of those soldered components get broken. this was patented by the tech company with little workaround on options for people to salvage its part for repair. clearly, it’s not an ideal world.
those foolish legislators you say have managed to push for apple to switch their cables to a universal standard and look at where we are now, we have an iphone that adheres to a universal standard port for portability, use-case and even impacting a good on the environment a little bit. it’s little but it’s progress. staying mum about these type of issues only lets tech companies get away with these things instead of championing the rights of users with the devices that they own.
also, what are you losing if you voice out complaints on the products that you buy, i don’t get it? you’re not losing your dignity by making reasonable arguments as a consumer that ram and storage prices in devices shouldn’t be priced this way, anyway?
If I remember correctly Alex Ziskind had a video where he booted one of the new Macs directly from a $79 external drive (plus price of enclosure) and the read/write performance was just as good as booting from the internal Mac drives.
Any chance you'd be able to point me at that video, please?
Not surprisingly. Apple doesn’t seem to be interested in using cutting edge storage for whatever reason.
Sure but dangling around with a drive on a cord makes your laptop a sit on a countertop and make sure no one disonnects the cable computer.
@@bartvandenpoel8568 Agreed but the point is to show there is nothing special about the SSDs Apple uses. On many Apple forums people will claim that the SSDs that Apple uses are superior to the rest of the market and so the higher price is justified because of superior performance. But if you can boot from an external drive and have speeds on par or better than internal Apple drives, especially after having to go through additional data layers and time delays to connect the drives externally, it shows that Apple internal SSDs aren’t anything special.
As a software developer that need a lot of ram on my machine. Even after using a couple mac book pros for 10+ years,, I'm considering to switch to a PC lab top instead. Apple's price strategy is insane!
I'm always surprised by programmers using macbooks. The macbook keyboard is terrible for programming. It is missing home, end, pgup, pgdown, numpad, no dedicated function keys. The programmers I know homebrew to get the tools they like. Wouldn't a PC be better? Lots of options on keyboards and layouts. Cheaper and can run any Linux distro. Easy to get enough ram to run whatever VMs you need.
@@username7763MacBooks have dedicated function keys. The only key I really miss is the delete key as I never use those home, pgup, pgdown, etc whether I have them on my keyboard or not.
The main thing nice with Mac is that it’s Unix. Makes things much nicer than windows to program on. Linux is also great as well, but I like to have good battery life and fast single core speed which Mac hardware happens to have. I do agree Apple’s upgrade model is horrible though.
For gaming I build my own windows PC like a sane person. Not even gonna try gaming on a Mac.
I can personally confirm that they are starting to affect their sales with this kind of pricing.
I had been holding off replacing my 2014 MBP for this reason. It has 16GB RAM, so it was still just eking by until I could afford the Mac I wanted.
But then I had to work remotely for a bit to help my mom after surgery. I needed something better to get me though, so I bought a Lenovo Yoga 6 with 16GB RAM/500 GB SSD on sale for ~$600.
And you know, it’s actually pretty nice! It’s light and portable, does what I need, and has an awesome battery life in comparison to what I am used to. And it has a replaceable SSD!
So yeah, I switched back to PC and only spent a little more than the RAM and SSD upgrades themselves would have cost on a Mac.
People using external storage gangsta till Apple starts making the USB ports proprietary
Thank you Luke for voicing this issue on behalf of the community.
This is quite LITERALLY the reason I haven’t purchased a Mac since 2015.
My Mac Mini 2011 was
cheaply boosted to 16/512 in 2012.
My MBP Retina 2015 was bought 16/512.
Being offered a base model starting at 8/256 in 2024, and seeing the price to upgrade to just 16/512
(a basic configuration I have used for 13 years) is just absolutely unacceptable.
I vote with my money and keep my old Mac running.
Unfortunately I am aware that not everyone can do this… Good luck.
That took you a long time. I haven't bought anything from Apple since 1994.
I'll add an important trick that I learned the hard way. If your external hard drive is over 2TB and you decide to format it in ex-FAT, make sure you make the block size 1024 (you may need a Windows machine to do this). For these drives the default block size is 2048 and newer MacOSXs have problems detecting these drives. The drives are fine and work perfectly in Windows or Linux but will often fail to mount on OSX unless the block size is 1024.
The other thing you have to factor in with these lower storage SSDs, is the total TBW. The lifespan just isn’t there with the smaller amounts and once the chips are done, you’re petty much out of luck.
VERY good point, raised by Louis Rossmann on his channel. The whole Apple thing is wrong, and I'm slowly taking myself away from it.
Have you (somehow) not figured out that all non-enterprise SSDs have their TBW values listed as a WARRANTY amount?
There are two standards: TBW and JEDEC endurance.
TBW is simple: 1/3/5 year warranty OR a specified TBW value, whichever happens first.
JEDEC endurance ratings are when they... you know... actually test the drives to determine the actual endurance.
Your SSD should withstand a solid 3x the stated TBW value (in much the same way your engine doesn't blow through the hood of your car at 50,001 miles or 4 years and one day... the warranty just expires.)
@@tim3172 There's a big difference between "should" and "actually does".
It's not only the TBW, some IC'S can fail too the TP62180 for instance and this one shortened your NAND get 12V and is dead, that's why I bought an external drive right away.
You have to imagine it, you buy a house and the house builder gives you the key to the back entrance that lets you into the kitchen and the bedroom and all the furniture is welded to the floor, the windows are just painted on the wall and if you turn on the heating because it's too cold, the house builder tells you have to buy a new one because otherwise you would destroy the house
This is exactly why I (as a developer) haven’t upgraded from Intel yet. Ram pricing is way too expensive. Even 16gb is starting to feel like too little now.
I don’t use a Mac as a dev, but I sure do like my 64 gigs on my pc. The upgrade from 16 to 32 was insane and then when I jumped to 64 it was even better. Think I have only run out ram like 2 times since going 64gb
@@_SP259youre right that 16 to 32gb makes a difference but i really don't see why anyone would need more than 32gb, especially on macos...i have a high end windows gaming pc and i also "only" have 32gb, even though i could upgrade for a really cheap price if i wanted to...i can have a demanding game running while having 100 tabs in multiple browsers running and there is still a lot of ram left and no slowdown...
Agree it’s a crime how little memory the base model has. With not being upgradable they should give us a break on the add ons. More people would decide to bump the specs if they weren’t so ridiculously priced!!
Yeah. At least have your base model be something USABLE. What the hell is the ability to do all these exciting things on a machine that can't store any of it? And don't even get me started with iCloud.
those 7TB are double the price of my fucking gaming PC + Peripherals 🗿🗿🗿🗣️🗣️🗣️💀💀💀😭😭😭
Yet the Apple consumer still buys it. Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me.
This video is spot on! I'm in the market for a MacBook, but I absolutely refuse to buy a new one from Apple. Their prices are ridiculous and a rip-off. Selling a laptop in 2023/2024 with 8 gigs of RAM and 256 gigs of storage is a joke, especially at Apple's price point. I'd rather buy a used one off Ebay than give Apple my money.
same
I began going back to PC over this issue, after a wholesale shift to Macs 12 yrs ago. 1 down about 5 to go still.
Been using a 13 inch m1 with a 1tb T7 for 2 years now. Absolutely the best decision I made. Unfortunately I had no choice but to upgrade my RAM due to my workflow, but there was absolutely no way I was going to pay extra $200 for 256GB storage, so I went with a weird 16GB 256GB configuration.
My last job issued everyone that config, some M1 and some Intel. Everyone suffers from insufficient storage
Didn’t they double the base storage in early 2020 from 128 to 256?
So every once in a while, my teacher brings in a few professionals from certain fields (Audio, Video, etc) due to the class being related to media and technology.
And one day he brought in a few audio people to present to the class, they of course brought their own computers. But one of them had the most genius setup ever. a 16GB RAM 256GB storage m1 mac mini that had 2 portable SSDs plugged into it. And a portable monitor with a Bluetooth keyboard and magic trackpad.
Easily the single most efficient way to sidestep apples storage costs was simply to make himself his own makeshift laptop out of a mac mini and some peripherals, and add his own portable SSD's.
For Audio, you really don't want the project on your internal drive if you can help it. That's a standard practice in that industry.
It's indefensible and they only do it because they can. Drawing more attention to it like with this video is about the only thing we can do to address it short of not buying Macs. I do suspect it forces people to buy them less often and that may be another thing we can do, buy as least frequently as possible.
Yes. Bottom line is for those who need semi-reasonable configs (min. 16gb / 1TB), MBPs still remain a more "luxury" product, not a "value" product. Apple always used to be a more "premium" brand, but over the years has come out with base models that work for the "every-day consumer" (Eg. web surfing, e-mail, ppt/spreadsheets, light work use) at a very attractive entry price. But still get any "power" user that needs upgrades to still have to pay that $2k+ "more luxury product" price
I am seriously considering buying a PC next time I have to buy a new laptop. It's hard for me to justify the prices.
"There's no reason to change when they know people will pay the price."
Says some marketing guy
Yea, Apple prices that upgrade overlap intentionally. What's interesting is that there's an interview with someone from Apple claiming that 8gb on the M3 14inch pro is better than more ram on windows laptop, or something to that effect. Their unified ram may be faster but when things go to swap on the ssd all the time, it's degrading the ssd more quickly. So apple is KNOWINGLY putting 8gb on their laptops when it may be decreasing the ssd's endurance! Not only that, this shows how profit driven yet shortsighted they are. AI workflows in the future will require more and more RAM , so wouldn't they want more and more people to use their products on the capability of this experience?! Whenever they finally introduce their AI software thing, are they going to be claiming that 8gb is a good enough starting point for that too? All they have to do is bundle some of the benefits together. Upgrading the ram by this much, also includes this much extra storage. Just include it. No sneaky price bumps. Reduce your obscene ram+storage margins just by a little! Your AI team is probably hamstrung by it!
I've been hearing about the "outrageous price" of Apple product since the mid 1980's. It seem that people like to complain a lot, but keep buying their stuff. And, in return this has helped make them the 2.8 trillion dollar company they are today. Whose fault is that?
I've just posted a similar comment, about why this is suddenly a problem(?).
No
It's a very different game today than it was in the 80s and 90s. Mac computers used to be a bit more expensive than PC:s but they were of such a high quality that it was worth every penny. For graphics and video PC:s were just not an alternative. Macs were also highly expandable, like the 9600 were you had 6 slots for PCI cards. Adding RAM or larger HD:s wasn't more difficult or expensive than doing the same on a PC. Macs kept on being good value for money well into the 2000's, one example are the 27 inch Imacs that didn't cost much more than the screen only. They also offered LOTS of connections (USB, FireWire, Thunderbolt, DVI etc) and they were always built with backwards compatability in mind. Something happened with Apple around 2005, they stopped being the go to computer for creative professionals and became a luxury brand for the wealthy.
@@wilhelmhagberg8854 nevertheless, the price of Apple products has steadily irritated consumers since the mid 80's, and consumers continue to buy. I don't buy the "luxury brand for the wealthy" argument though. The wealthy may have been a good marketing strategy to promote to the larger masses, but it's the masses themselves who have made Apple trillions, not the rich
@@wilhelmhagberg8854 some people may want to think they became a luxury brand for the wealthy, but the vast majority of their profits have been made by the masses, not the top 1%
It’s super funny because they put an extremely powerful M2 chip inside their MacBook Airs but limit it to 8gb ram 256gb storage, it’s like a Ferrari being tied down to the lot 😂😂
They like to bottleneck their base products because they know most won’t settle for the base storage. Unless someone is willing to spend on the overpriced upgrade Apple is happy to take your money 💰.
what an analogy! 😂
I was a long term Apple person (over 25 years) who left Apple and went to PC in 2017 when Apple quit supporting my Apple hardware and required me to buy new hardware. The new Apple hardware had extremely low about of memory like 16 gb and 512GB SSD were my PC has 64 GB with 32 tb of disk space at 1/3 the cost. I am a graphic designer and photographer and need the storage and the ram space. The Apple Mac Books are Ok for doing office work at 2x the cost. I supper glad I switched as my hardware lasts a lot longer with OSs and I can upgrade my current PC hardware with newer stuff.
512GB storage and 16GB RAM as base for MacBook Pros are a joke. Their advertised price is nonsense because nobody should be buying them.
Base MacBook Pro comes with even a laughable 8gb of ram.
@@merthacoglu4908 That's a misnomer as far as I'm concerned. That's no pro laptop.
Thank you for using your voice to more eloquently express our outrage. I’ve started to transaction away from apple because of these kinds of shenanigans.
You are SO right Luke! Only option, external storage. I love macOS so there’s no other option for me, cuz you see I’m not a millionaire
Btw Luke that’s a really nice microwave you got there! 8 GB pizza memory? 😂😳🙏
Their rip off ram and storage issue specially ram is the main two reasons I’m buying. Rip off! Not even mentioning the throttling…
Next Apple will require a monthly subscription to access your ram and storage upgrades .
I wouldn’t be surprised if Apple moved to a subscription model.
Years ago, I bought an SD card adapter that you could add a MicroSD memory card to that plugged into the SD slot on my son’s Retina MacBook Pro. It was a great way to add storage for not a lot of money.
That's simply a KEY part of Apple's business plan, since at least 10 years.
I bought an M3 MacBook Pro with 16GB RAM/512GB SSD off of PC Connection for $1,499. Florida currently also has a sales tax holiday so I got a slickdeal.
Insane how I paid ~$2500 for the same specs on a 2017 MacBook Pro, deals could be found. Don't pay the Apple Tax!
Defensible, absolutely not! You are spot on with this take, I couldn't agree more! There is no excuse for this kind of greed! Thanks Luke 👍
Apple's storage and ram price is absolutely crazy. I just don't understand how they can charge like this....
Because people still buy them.
"What the market will bear" and all that.
With the integrated Apple Silicon SOC, the answer is BECUASE THEY CAN. The frakkers.
FOMO marketing and it works
Remember this is the same company that once sold a monitor stand for $999
This is literally the reason i couldn't bring myself to buy a mac when the m2 came out, and I ended up going with a windows machine.
The main issue with trying to migrate for some people is losing access to Mac-only software. I manage fine now, but not being able to edit in Final Cut Pro was a definite downside to my workflow once upon a time
You bring up a good point, and it's valid. As long as consumers continue to buy, Apple will never bring down the price. And that is just it-consumers have to have it, so they think. Like any company, overcharging they will get away with it because consumers are spoiled and think they need it or have to have it, willing to pay for overpriced products. For those who are not willing to give their money away, they can easily buy a Windows computer and respectfully get the RAM size and SSD space they need for far less than what Apple is charging. It's that simple.