Ah you are one of those... thinking the Emperor fucked up lol. Magnus fucked up everything, if the Heresy happened without Magnus, the Emperor would be right on track.
Knowing How similar the emperor and Guilliman are in spirit and mind; I wonder if Guillaman being harshly labeled by the Emperor during their meeting were also reflections of the Emperor's own internal criticisms and internal conflicts.🤔
@@35Subjectas someone else pointed out, bronze age Anatolia, which would have been genetically much different to modern day Turkey. If anything he'd be closer to Greek.
@@35Subject that's because of artists interpretation and inconsistencies. Canonically speaking, Lorgar's face is the closest of the primarchs to the emperor
Pre-daemon angron was the best as he did his job to the fullest extent. He just had a couple software glitches along the way. A few small bugs in his code, if you will.
@@StevDoesBigJumps I think what they're saying is that despite the Emporium of Manx being a general shit hole, Robert Guillemum can still play with a chance at winning despite the hand he's been dealt.
Guilliman wants the same thing for mankind as the Emperor. The Emperor has seen too much both in his past life and future visions. The longer Guilliman leads the Imperium the more he understands why the Emperor is the way he is...
And yet, Big E didn't have to deal with a religion that has dug itself so deeply into the Imperium. That if Big E did wake up. He would have seriously done a lot of killing. All to rip out that blight. All because of...Lorgar.....
How do you know what the Emperor really wants? A colossal psyker soul that has been feeding of thousands of other psyker souls everyday for 10.000 years. What do you think that will come out of that? Nothing good for manking, I can assure you.
Big E: of course shit will hit the fan, that's why we got Girlyman, you'll fix them ... right? Guilliman: ... maybe Big E : and by maybe he means yes Guilliman: ...
When you really think about it genetically speaking the primachs are 90 percent, genetic copy pasted re skinned clones of the Emperor but with removed and re invested stats to fit there specifications. So it does pretty much track that the Emperor would have a back up contingency and what's basically his clone to pick up the slack.
that kinda makes sense though. emps didnt care for the primarchs and marines because they weren't truly human. the same can be said for how guiliman views the emps.
@dancingimmortal448 exactly, humorously Guilliman is one of only two primarchs more loyal to the ideals of the Imperium over the Emperor himself. The other is the Khan. In fact, Guilliman never even considered the Emperor his father trufully. In his eyes, his father was Conner Guilliman, the Emperor was only ever his creator.
If 40k ever ends/transitions, I feel like Big E will formally ascend, and Robot Man Gilbert Godfrey will be officially made Second Emperor of the Imperium
The Emperor rules the Imperium in spirit (including more literally in the Warp, where he is still technically alive) and Guilliman rules it in person, its worldly, flesh and blood supreme Lord. Plus, with the Emperor officially past tense (as painful as that might be for the Imperium) that would mean no more 1000 soul sacrifices a day on Terra and the Imperium stands more of a long term fighting chance with the extra bodies for the front. I like it.
@@thalastianjorus custodes have always been female, terra houses billions of people, i mean trilions of people, i mean milions of people, i mean quadrilions of people, and orks being able to literally believe stuff into existence, i mean not, is just a few that come to mind, and there are many more
@@filipbitala2624 The custodes being female is kind of a weak argument because anyone that's been following 40K for years know that the custodes weren't originally a thing either. Those around for longer know the Horus Heresy wasn't always a thing, either.
@@basteala525 custodes as we know them know were a thing since atleast the 1993, they existed even before but were retconned(ironic) and yes the horus heresy wasnt a thing. But that doesnt mean that it was retconned, retcon is changing something that exists, not necessarily creating something that doesnt
I think in terms of heart and soul the lion is a better reflection of the emperor, but in terms of their image and dream for humanity, guiliman and the emperor were heart and souls together. The sheer fact that when the Big E found guiliman and had no words for him and needed to do nothing in guiliman's empire spoke volumes of what the emperor felt of guliman's empire of humanity.
Agreed, Guilliman fought for ideals, similar to how E is doing even terrible things for what he sees as humanities betterment. The Lion, more similar to his father, had a "yeah that ideal we are striving for is nice an all but lets be real here and just do what needs to be done, and it will be terrible but ends justify the means."
I like the Lion and Leman Russ as two opposit sides of the same coin. The lion being a beast, pretending to be sophisticated and Leman, a smart man pretending to be a savage
The Lion i would argue is the emperor wrath and sense of honor. Just as Logar is the emperors faith something no doubt people will shun me for but the emperor did have a religon he worshipped mankind he treated mankind as some sort of higher being.
@@WaaaghMarine More like worshipped himself, which logar did. the "imperial truth" is basically "his truth",he accepts only his plans, enforces only his laws , shape humanity to his vision, he is the center of everything, while supposedly being just another human.
Guillimen's greatest strength seems to be his general skill at everything related to empire building. He's not the best fighter, but he's damn good. He's not the best orator, but his accomplishments back up his words. He's at least situationally not the best tactician, but he's pretty good in most situations. He is probably the best diplomat, at least when you also consider non-humans.
He literally was the single best thing that could happen to the imperium post golden throne. He’s a near perfect statesman blended with a superb general. If they could only have one primarch return, Guilliman was best case scenario.
Na he is the best tactician, dude almost defated two legions. While his was handie caped. He ability to learn , use and then counter other tactics is whats makes his so dangerous. Like for extanple corvus and him played a war game. Covrus won 3 times but after that he said he could never beat g man. Thier is a reason horus wanted him gone so bad lmao
@davidpower5710 people hate the ultramarines because of one author's terribly fanboy writing about them.. but people forget how and why the ultramarines function.. they are good at everything.. not specializing in just one aspect of war is a good thing, it makes you flexible, fast to adept and leaves very little for the enemy to exploit.. not to mention that ultras regularly interact with normal humans quite often makes them understand the imperial guard more than most legions.. they are a force multiplier legion wherein them lending their strength to any other chapter or imperial force significantly increases the chance of victory for the imperium..
I've heard he can't take his armor off right now as he still requires some life support efforts after his time in stasis. I imagine the smell alone is enough to stop any Rule-34 from happening.
generally will need a wake up call in some way but agreed, he is one of the few that will honestly learn a lesson and change things up. That is why he was willing and able to take his brothers' various ideas and implement them himself.
Yeah, he has untapped potential that comes up when he gets mad. Every time. The fact that despite that Khorn would rather join hands with Slanesh than try to corrupt Guiliman speaks volumes.
It does make some sense now but at the time i also think this still wpuldve made sense at the time. Given the skills of guilliman it wouldve only made sense for him to have taken the spot of next in line despite the narratives written about some the other primarchs. Of course everyone on the traitors, had they succeeded, wouldve made traitorous claims over who should be chaos' best plaything but of the loyalists the only who may have opposed this view of "next in line" at the time wouldve maybe have been the lion given his still prideful view of honor and duty and his "with me or against me" attitudes. None could do it better than guilliman
Yeah, this doesn't really read to me like forshadowing. It just reads like ''yeah, Guilliman could run an Empire' which... he already did with Ultramar.. And later set up as a backup if Terra falls with Imperium Secundus. Guilliman was always setting up Empires, he's really good at it
I know I'm not the only one who expected Guilliman to return. All textual implications pointed to him being the "easiest" and thus most likely primarch to return. The ony ones who can't come back are Ferrus Manus and Sanguinius, because actually saw them die. Dorn was (allegedly) killed but all they found was a fist and primarchs have walked off worse.
Hell, the idea was broached to Ultramarines fans all the way back in Nightbringer by Graham McNiel in a blink and you'll miss it moment. I don't know how much of it was actually planned back then, but they definitely left the door open for such a return.
Technically we can’t even say for certain that Sanguinius can’t come back, as there’s vague mentions of something happening to the vengeful spirit that hints his soul could eventually be able to manifest on the ship. And if he can manifest…there’s a chance he could be reborn.
To be fair, alexis pollux said this: "If it would please you, my lord, it would bring much greater honor to barabas if it were you, the mightiest of the emperor's sons, who would send him on his way." This was during barabas "adamantium balls" dantioch's funeral..
True, but when you look at the state of star wars, world of warcraft, and other western sci-fi/fantasy, having a plan and continuity is sadly a special thing nowadays.
For me it depends on the level of continuity, there's this jrpg series that's been adding and adding to the story with excellent continuity to the point that it actually it's main selling point.
What I like most about gellerman is the fact that hes average. No sad dramatic back story, no wierd warp powers or genetic mutations. Just a dude (obviously a primarch) ironically the most human character in the imperium
As someone who got into 40k in that weird period before 8th edition and the dawn of war memes and the early Horus heresy series so I’ve explored a bit of both old and new 40k so I was practically giddy when I heard a Primarch returned it was like seeing a old friend again or that the main plot of 40k was finally winding up I don’t care what people say about the dark imperium trilogy I was pumped the whole time
I feel that Lion is lesser known by others In-universe, which is why he's not often compared to Big E. That being said, when reading Lion's books, I couldn't help but notice similarities in image, behavior and actions of Big E and El'Johnson. At least in 30k Lion was definitely very similar to Emperor.
In Lord Of the First, it says very similar things about the Lion. I think the principle that the Emperor's sons reflect his attributes is what's referred to here, more than foreshadowing per se.
All of the Primarchs are cast in his image, modified to embody his individual traits, whether they be good or bad. It is why Big E hated Angron so much, Angron is the manifestation of his wrath and malice, things the emperor had no need for.
@@NachtjagerVII Angron was never meant to be his wrath though. There's not a single need for a commander of an entire legion to be perpetually angry and so utterly led by it despite Angron's fighting of it. Angron was man made to be wrath incarnate, but it wasn't by the Emperor's hand.
Well shit. If that happens the Ultramarines are probably gonna going to kill the Emperor, master of mankind or no, you probably shouldn’t kill their dad. To come back from the dead when you are a perpetual anyway.
I mean they could write it like that, but realistically all Big E needs in order to resurrect is to be allowed to die. He is a perpetual, and a god. If the Custodies would have let his physical body die at the end of the heresy then he could have reforged his body at will. They were too scared to let this happen because they didn't know how long it would take or even if it would work.
@@myfaceismyshield5963 i hate to break it to you but thats not why they are the ultramarines. In the og art their armor is ultramarine blue, a shade of blue. Hence the name. Ironically the modern art depicts them as a cobalt blue
I don't think that was a prediction. In you remember, this was in the aftermath of Monarchia and Kor Pharon and Erebus (FU) was trying to turn Lorgar. To do so, they made a direct comparison between the Emperor and the person who Lorgar hated most, Roboute Guilliman. That way, Lorgar would associate the Emperor with Roboute Guilliman.
I doubt it was planned out, more just a throwaway line got latched onto. Like fallout 4 being bult around the institute after a single quest in fallout 3.
I have never thought of games workshop as having good planning skills but this is surely not a coincidence that this one conversation was right on the money
I love that technically Guiliman is a MID primarch by all acaunts at 30K. (Battle Prouece is nowhere near of some of the other ones, and even at imperious secondes he was more of a middleman delegator on purpose) But after the Herecy he stepped up big time, and now he is counted as one of the biggest heroes that have ever lived
They do think years in advance, the latest proce rises are intended to account for inflation for the next 5 years, despite plastics costs being way down
Sometimes I realize that my sense of time is absolutely fucked because I could have sworn that Guilliman’s return wasn’t announced till later. I don’t remember Guilliman coming back while I was in high school.
Here's a video idea. I love "letting the players lead" but i find that players need certain things in order to play off of in order to lead effectively. What are the things that the gm needs to set up for the players to be able to lead effectively? - I have my own thoughts on this, but im always looking to hear other perspectives.
This is one of those ironies i really love from 40k, Guiliaman is the Emperor's "heart and soul", but the difference is that big e mindset is "its my way or the highway, while guiliman was humbled in his fathers death and learned that ultimately he isnt a God.
While Lorgar may actually be....right, here...maybe Guiliman is just a reflection of Horus? Are we sure that the same pride Horus had isn't in Guiliman but just buried deeper? The Lion, who had a natural instinct for sending corruption came to Macragge and said "I feared you had done much worse." If he and even Malcador and Russ suspected Guiliman, that is some strong reason for suspicion of those 3 agree with one another.
Kind of. There will be some pride, but it was always more in “I am proud of the future we have secured” Horus was more “I am proud of what we have done” He always looked to the future, and saw his glory as the success of his worlds. It’s why he’d have sanguinis in charge and Lion in charge of the military, even though he’s the one who created Imperial Secundus. His pride is him giving others success.
I interpreted this as Kor using Lorgars hatred off Guilliman to help poison his love for The Emperor. By casting them as mirror images, Kor Phaeron helps push Lorgar towards to dark side by isolating him from his beloved father.
Guilliman is the Emperors Greatest success as far as primarchs go, only being rivaled by the sheer humanity of Vulkan and in both instances there views are not even crafted by the emperor but rather mortal men and women who cared for them and loved them dearly. Frankly I really love this part of warhammer: At the end of day when all is said in done it is the regular men and women of the imperium who have consistently decided its fate. Whether it be the absolute titan of imperial history Euten is or the simple widow named Ollanius Pius who stood against the full force of chaos personified in Horus which saved the Imperium.
The way GW plans ahead like this, I’ll be on my death bed praying I make it long enough to see what happens next. I’ll probably die before I get all the answers I want out of this setting lol.
Of course theyre planning years in advance if they only worked on what they release that would mean they only work like 20 days a year. Their rollout schedule is meant to keep you engaged
I suppose Perty can relate. Rowboat now carries the Imperium while he had to carry the heresy. I hope they retcon him being a daemon prince, it be pretty neat for them to meet with a brother who isnt a slave to dark gods. fucking evil maybe and definitely full of self hatred, but still sound of mind.
They could've also just written the HH and earmarked it as something which could come up. Then they needed something big in 40k for a new edition and checked what options they had and went for THE WORST DECISION EVER
I feel like the Emperor is Julius Caesar. Conquest after conquest only to be betrayed by within and G man is more like Octavius, the one who brought vengeance and shaped the Roman Empire.
There are other examples of half Astartes too. Luther was Lion's adoptive father and he too became a half Astartes. The full transformation requires the initiate to be a teenager. Otherwise %99 it kills the initiate if they try to go full.
I'm reading the First Heretic novel right now. Incredible book. I want to jettison Cyrene out an airlock cuz she's annoying (should not have looked her up in the wiki cuz she gets even more annoying later. But that conversation in the video was very cool and that was amazing foreshadowing
I have to say guillman is a reflection of the emperor in his view for humanity, is strategic brilliance , and mastery of logic and logistics. . But he represents parts of the emperor that are different from what horse represents. Horace is arrogant, he believes wholeheartedly in his skill to the point of flaw , but so does the emperor , the emperor rally the million worlds to his banner , chorus just as easily took half. Gentleman could not control one of his brothers , Horus at the start of the heresy controlled half of all of. Gilman did not have the respect of all of his brothers yet despite everyone not wanting to accept Horace as warmaster , few of them could deny that he was the best choice. Gillman might be a reflection of the emperor But Horus could be emperor. Guliman is a statesman but lack the hubris and and gusto to be his father.
Having a lack of hubris isn’t a bad thing either admitting that much Guilliman would admit when something was his fault. Horus couldn’t even be arsed to apologize to Corvus for using his gene-sons as cannon fodder. Specifically a frontal assault which the Raven Guard have never specialized in, they aren’t shock troops yes Horus was a great guy before his fall but in the end he screwed up. Royally. Guilliman never hated any of his brothers its only the warped perception of others that clouds others perception of him.
Guilliman: Stop having me manage your biggest fuckups
Emperor: You are my greatest tool
Lion after 1v1 a traitor primarch: Give me a challenge.
Emperor: Wtf?
yeaaa but horus as said here in the video horus is emps brightest star so horus would be like we have emperor at home hahah
Ah you are one of those... thinking the Emperor fucked up lol. Magnus fucked up everything, if the Heresy happened without Magnus, the Emperor would be right on track.
@@bobbobertbobberton1073 not just him but everyone that liked his comment
@@bobbobertbobberton1073 the heresy would have happened with or without magnus
Rowboat "Blueberry" Girlyman is just that good at Stellaris.
You already know he’s the kind of guy to ACTUALLY FINISH STELLARIS GAMES
Until the Lag Heresy electric boogaloo happens and he has to crack some planets to stave off the great enemy.
That is THE MOST perfect description for his abilities.
Bro Rub-me-off Gorrilla-man is my Stellaris Spirit animal.
Now the xenophobia makes sence. All those hybrid pops lag so much lategame...
Knowing How similar the emperor and Guilliman are in spirit and mind; I wonder if Guillaman being harshly labeled by the Emperor during their meeting were also reflections of the Emperor's own internal criticisms and internal conflicts.🤔
Yes ,and he mirrors his hope and regret
When you put it that way I can almost imagine it also being Big E's way of admitting his faults before passing the torch. Interesting....
Ah, he was projecting
@@LordCrate-du8zmbro stealed my joke
@@yopoxikeweapescai9066 stole*
"You bear the Emperor's face Logar"
Conraz and Corvus: right~
no they have his hair
@@zeonthefox yeah, if i remember correctly, the emperor from... middle east ? And he kinda tan too. But still Logar not look like him at all
@@35Subject He was born in anatolia during the bronze age
@@35Subjectas someone else pointed out, bronze age Anatolia, which would have been genetically much different to modern day Turkey. If anything he'd be closer to Greek.
@@35Subject that's because of artists interpretation and inconsistencies. Canonically speaking, Lorgar's face is the closest of the primarchs to the emperor
Robütte göǒlieman is my favorite primearch simply because he’s fully understands the absolute mess his dad created and is playing it to his advantage
Pre-daemon angron was the best as he did his job to the fullest extent. He just had a couple software glitches along the way. A few small bugs in his code, if you will.
What exactly is guilliman's advantage here, the advantage of the emperium as a whole?
@@StevDoesBigJumps
I think what they're saying is that despite the Emporium of Manx being a general shit hole, Robert Guillemum can still play with a chance at winning despite the hand he's been dealt.
@@StevDoesBigJumpsHe has the power of “Common Sense” and “Doing Taxes”. An extremely rare thing in the Imperium ngl.
Guilliman wants the same thing for mankind as the Emperor. The Emperor has seen too much both in his past life and future visions. The longer Guilliman leads the Imperium the more he understands why the Emperor is the way he is...
And yet, Big E didn't have to deal with a religion that has dug itself so deeply into the Imperium. That if Big E did wake up. He would have seriously done a lot of killing. All to rip out that blight. All because of...Lorgar.....
How do you know what the Emperor really wants? A colossal psyker soul that has been feeding of thousands of other psyker souls everyday for 10.000 years. What do you think that will come out of that? Nothing good for manking, I can assure you.
Nuh Uh... Bitch... GullyMax can never see what the emperor saw.
Big E: of course shit will hit the fan, that's why we got Girlyman, you'll fix them ... right?
Guilliman: ... maybe
Big E : and by maybe he means yes
Guilliman: ...
Turns out it wasn't just shit hitting the fan, but the fan got yeeted into a whole ass pit of shit with how fucked the imperium is
If you do, Rob, you’ll get a big tiddy Eldar gf
When you really think about it genetically speaking the primachs are 90 percent, genetic copy pasted re skinned clones of the Emperor but with removed and re invested stats to fit there specifications.
So it does pretty much track that the Emperor would have a back up contingency and what's basically his clone to pick up the slack.
Guilliman, being the Emperor's "Heart and Soul," is ironic as hell, considering Grampa Smurf never really liked the emperor.
Naw he liked his Human mom and dad who ya know for sure loved him
that kinda makes sense though. emps didnt care for the primarchs and marines because they weren't truly human. the same can be said for how guiliman views the emps.
You think the emperor would like himself if he met himself?
@dancingimmortal448 exactly, humorously Guilliman is one of only two primarchs more loyal to the ideals of the Imperium over the Emperor himself. The other is the Khan.
In fact, Guilliman never even considered the Emperor his father trufully. In his eyes, his father was Conner Guilliman, the Emperor was only ever his creator.
@@alecdeter1999and big E liked his parents too, then something traumatic happened
If 40k ever ends/transitions, I feel like Big E will formally ascend, and Robot Man Gilbert Godfrey will be officially made Second Emperor of the Imperium
Age of Guilliman
@@Mognemind Era Indomitus
The Emperor rules the Imperium in spirit (including more literally in the Warp, where he is still technically alive) and Guilliman rules it in person, its worldly, flesh and blood supreme Lord. Plus, with the Emperor officially past tense (as painful as that might be for the Imperium) that would mean no more 1000 soul sacrifices a day on Terra and the Imperium stands more of a long term fighting chance with the extra bodies for the front.
I like it.
“Planning years in advance”
Well if you ignore all the retcons that might be true
There... really haven't been all that many retcons. A lot of added information and details, but very few true retcons.
@@thalastianjorus 🧢
@@thalastianjorus custodes have always been female, terra houses billions of people, i mean trilions of people, i mean milions of people, i mean quadrilions of people, and orks being able to literally believe stuff into existence, i mean not, is just a few that come to mind, and there are many more
@@filipbitala2624 The custodes being female is kind of a weak argument because anyone that's been following 40K for years know that the custodes weren't originally a thing either.
Those around for longer know the Horus Heresy wasn't always a thing, either.
@@basteala525 custodes as we know them know were a thing since atleast the 1993, they existed even before but were retconned(ironic) and yes the horus heresy wasnt a thing. But that doesnt mean that it was retconned, retcon is changing something that exists, not necessarily creating something that doesnt
I think in terms of heart and soul the lion is a better reflection of the emperor, but in terms of their image and dream for humanity, guiliman and the emperor were heart and souls together. The sheer fact that when the Big E found guiliman and had no words for him and needed to do nothing in guiliman's empire spoke volumes of what the emperor felt of guliman's empire of humanity.
He could've said to other Primarchs, those he thought would be loyal and useful, 'This is how you build and rule, you fools.'
Agreed, Guilliman fought for ideals, similar to how E is doing even terrible things for what he sees as humanities betterment. The Lion, more similar to his father, had a "yeah that ideal we are striving for is nice an all but lets be real here and just do what needs to be done, and it will be terrible but ends justify the means."
I like the Lion and Leman Russ as two opposit sides of the same coin. The lion being a beast, pretending to be sophisticated and Leman, a smart man pretending to be a savage
The Lion i would argue is the emperor wrath and sense of honor. Just as Logar is the emperors faith something no doubt people will shun me for but the emperor did have a religon he worshipped mankind he treated mankind as some sort of higher being.
@@WaaaghMarine
More like worshipped himself,
which logar did.
the "imperial truth" is basically "his truth",he accepts only his plans, enforces only his laws , shape humanity to his vision, he is the center of everything, while supposedly being just another human.
Guillimen's greatest strength seems to be his general skill at everything related to empire building. He's not the best fighter, but he's damn good. He's not the best orator, but his accomplishments back up his words. He's at least situationally not the best tactician, but he's pretty good in most situations.
He is probably the best diplomat, at least when you also consider non-humans.
He literally was the single best thing that could happen to the imperium post golden throne. He’s a near perfect statesman blended with a superb general. If they could only have one primarch return, Guilliman was best case scenario.
Na he is the best tactician, dude almost defated two legions. While his was handie caped.
He ability to learn , use and then counter other tactics is whats makes his so dangerous. Like for extanple corvus and him played a war game. Covrus won 3 times but after that he said he could never beat g man.
Thier is a reason horus wanted him gone so bad lmao
@davidpower5710 people hate the ultramarines because of one author's terribly fanboy writing about them.. but people forget how and why the ultramarines function.. they are good at everything.. not specializing in just one aspect of war is a good thing, it makes you flexible, fast to adept and leaves very little for the enemy to exploit.. not to mention that ultras regularly interact with normal humans quite often makes them understand the imperial guard more than most legions.. they are a force multiplier legion wherein them lending their strength to any other chapter or imperial force significantly increases the chance of victory for the imperium..
Roberto Guillermo best Primarch.
Only primarch who is no only a general warrior but also great administrator.
Mas Bueno
😂😂😂😂😂😂 The True father of Crimson Fists
And I'm sure the R34 content between Yvrraine and Guillieman was probably foreshadowed somewhere in between.
I've heard he can't take his armor off right now as he still requires some life support efforts after his time in stasis. I imagine the smell alone is enough to stop any Rule-34 from happening.
@herbderbler1585 idk man. The people who do R34 don't tend to have such limits and/or standards.
Kor Phaeron, in M42 after hearing _the news:_ 😬
Guilliman is predictable in a way, but never underestimate his capacity to switch things up
generally will need a wake up call in some way but agreed, he is one of the few that will honestly learn a lesson and change things up. That is why he was willing and able to take his brothers' various ideas and implement them himself.
Yeah, he has untapped potential that comes up when he gets mad. Every time. The fact that despite that Khorn would rather join hands with Slanesh than try to corrupt Guiliman speaks volumes.
It does make some sense now but at the time i also think this still wpuldve made sense at the time. Given the skills of guilliman it wouldve only made sense for him to have taken the spot of next in line despite the narratives written about some the other primarchs. Of course everyone on the traitors, had they succeeded, wouldve made traitorous claims over who should be chaos' best plaything but of the loyalists the only who may have opposed this view of "next in line" at the time wouldve maybe have been the lion given his still prideful view of honor and duty and his "with me or against me" attitudes. None could do it better than guilliman
Which is ironic since now The Lion would happily let Guilliman run things while he waged war.
hello fellow Signalis enjoyer :D
Yeah, this doesn't really read to me like forshadowing.
It just reads like ''yeah, Guilliman could run an Empire' which... he already did with Ultramar.. And later set up as a backup if Terra falls with Imperium Secundus.
Guilliman was always setting up Empires, he's really good at it
inherited father’s depression mode
I know I'm not the only one who expected Guilliman to return. All textual implications pointed to him being the "easiest" and thus most likely primarch to return. The ony ones who can't come back are Ferrus Manus and Sanguinius, because actually saw them die. Dorn was (allegedly) killed but all they found was a fist and primarchs have walked off worse.
Hell, the idea was broached to Ultramarines fans all the way back in Nightbringer by Graham McNiel in a blink and you'll miss it moment. I don't know how much of it was actually planned back then, but they definitely left the door open for such a return.
Technically we can’t even say for certain that Sanguinius can’t come back, as there’s vague mentions of something happening to the vengeful spirit that hints his soul could eventually be able to manifest on the ship. And if he can manifest…there’s a chance he could be reborn.
@@nikik5567 His body is also mostly intact and its location is known and easily reachable to the Emperor.
Because he is the greataest of them all, an ultramarine
Emperor was Matt Ward all that time. 😂
To be fair, alexis pollux said this:
"If it would please you, my lord, it would bring much greater honor to barabas if it were you, the mightiest of the emperor's sons, who would send him on his way."
This was during barabas "adamantium balls" dantioch's funeral..
Holy Shit! Guilliman is the TRUE SON OF THE STAR CHILD!!!
Wuttt da heeeeelllll!! 🗣️🔥🔥🔥🔥
No.His Father is Konor.
I always hate how people act like a writer being able to look back at what they wrote to continue something they mentioned is something crazy.
Look at the massive multi-billion-dollar fuckup that is Disney Star Wars and lower your expectations accordingly.
True, but when you look at the state of star wars, world of warcraft, and other western sci-fi/fantasy, having a plan and continuity is sadly a special thing nowadays.
For me it depends on the level of continuity, there's this jrpg series that's been adding and adding to the story with excellent continuity to the point that it actually it's main selling point.
@@agentc7020name?
Remember the multi-billion-dollar mistake that is Disney Star Wars and lower your expectations accordingly.
What I like most about gellerman is the fact that hes average. No sad dramatic back story, no wierd warp powers or genetic mutations. Just a dude (obviously a primarch) ironically the most human character in the imperium
His superpower is having adoptive parents that cared for him as a human
he's the superman of 40k
Nah, that's how Guilliman's mortal mom and dad raised him. Sangy got Emperor's soul and he was a ruthless blood thirsty berserker
Sanguinis doesnt get the emperors soul, He gets 2 warp entity, angel of light and angel of dark
As someone who got into 40k in that weird period before 8th edition and the dawn of war memes and the early Horus heresy series so I’ve explored a bit of both old and new 40k so I was practically giddy when I heard a Primarch returned it was like seeing a old friend again or that the main plot of 40k was finally winding up I don’t care what people say about the dark imperium trilogy I was pumped the whole time
The only man who rivals Roboute's resemblance to father, is another brother of mine. And it is the Lion of Caliban
I feel that Lion is lesser known by others In-universe, which is why he's not often compared to Big E. That being said, when reading Lion's books, I couldn't help but notice similarities in image, behavior and actions of Big E and El'Johnson. At least in 30k Lion was definitely very similar to Emperor.
how's running away from The Raven treating yah
In Lord Of the First, it says very similar things about the Lion.
I think the principle that the Emperor's sons reflect his attributes is what's referred to here, more than foreshadowing per se.
All of the Primarchs are cast in his image, modified to embody his individual traits, whether they be good or bad. It is why Big E hated Angron so much, Angron is the manifestation of his wrath and malice, things the emperor had no need for.
@@NachtjagerVII Angron was never meant to be his wrath though. There's not a single need for a commander of an entire legion to be perpetually angry and so utterly led by it despite Angron's fighting of it. Angron was man made to be wrath incarnate, but it wasn't by the Emperor's hand.
That's boss, thanks for that clip✊🏿
That's why he is called the perfect son
"Too damn strong. Too perfect to fall."
Horus Lupercal when asked if he could convince guilliman to join the traitors..
Calling it now. Rowboat Girlyman will be sacrificed to bring about the second coming of the emperor.
Well shit. If that happens the Ultramarines are probably gonna going to kill the Emperor, master of mankind or no, you probably shouldn’t kill their dad. To come back from the dead when you are a perpetual anyway.
I mean they could write it like that, but realistically all Big E needs in order to resurrect is to be allowed to die. He is a perpetual, and a god. If the Custodies would have let his physical body die at the end of the heresy then he could have reforged his body at will. They were too scared to let this happen because they didn't know how long it would take or even if it would work.
There is a reason hes called the "winning son" after all
And his legion are the "over-the-sea-men" which makes sense when all the void is spoken of with naval terms. It's all pretty funny
@@myfaceismyshield5963 i hate to break it to you but thats not why they are the ultramarines. In the og art their armor is ultramarine blue, a shade of blue. Hence the name. Ironically the modern art depicts them as a cobalt blue
I don't think that was a prediction.
In you remember, this was in the aftermath of Monarchia and Kor Pharon and Erebus (FU) was trying to turn Lorgar. To do so, they made a direct comparison between the Emperor and the person who Lorgar hated most, Roboute Guilliman.
That way, Lorgar would associate the Emperor with Roboute Guilliman.
Having it come from *Kor Phaeron* of all people is the cherry on top.
This is probably the biggest compliment the Emperor could ever hope for.
Robert 👍
Calling him the emporers Echo is cool as hell.
I refuse to believe that GW planned anything with that much foresight and actually stuck with it.
Known for planning years in advance? More like known for reconning years in advance
They aren't known for planning much of anything.
I doubt it was planned out, more just a throwaway line got latched onto. Like fallout 4 being bult around the institute after a single quest in fallout 3.
Guilliman be like:
Deamon-Prince 👎
God-Emperor-Prince👍
I have never thought of games workshop as having good planning skills but this is surely not a coincidence that this one conversation was right on the money
Makes sense the emperor hates himself so why wouldn’t his sons.
Guilliman Boy Scout always listen to Daddy lol 😂
His becoming his dad 😢
He does not like his Creator.
It mentions guile man’s healing within the 4th Ed codex space marines
I love that technically Guiliman is a MID primarch by all acaunts at 30K. (Battle Prouece is nowhere near of some of the other ones, and even at imperious secondes he was more of a middleman delegator on purpose)
But after the Herecy he stepped up big time, and now he is counted as one of the biggest heroes that have ever lived
That’s because Guiliman never wanted to be more whereas after the heresy he had no choice but to be more.
@@knightblade0188 how does the saying goes? those don't want power are the ones who should have it?
Lord Guilliman the Imperium would be lost without you
Guilliman is big E in 42M. The star child is always a topic. But big E likes to work through R.G too. Wonder if they could be linked
I never knew this. The Ultramarines are growing on me, at the moment the fists are still my favorite but the boys in blue are gaining ground.
The biggest thing ive learned watching these videos isnt from the videos, but from reading all the comments saying Roe Blu-ray Gill Amen's name wrong
They do think years in advance, the latest proce rises are intended to account for inflation for the next 5 years, despite plastics costs being way down
Time to scour the old books to see who returns next
People were talking about how he was going to come back and take over, well over 20 years ago.
Sometimes I realize that my sense of time is absolutely fucked because I could have sworn that Guilliman’s return wasn’t announced till later. I don’t remember Guilliman coming back while I was in high school.
Big E: you’re the only who can macmicro this whole imperium as decent as me
Here's a video idea. I love "letting the players lead" but i find that players need certain things in order to play off of in order to lead effectively. What are the things that the gm needs to set up for the players to be able to lead effectively?
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I have my own thoughts on this, but im always looking to hear other perspectives.
Looking like a difference between someone trying to take charge and someone who has it bestowed on em
This is one of those ironies i really love from 40k, Guiliaman is the Emperor's "heart and soul", but the difference is that big e mindset is "its my way or the highway, while guiliman was humbled in his fathers death and learned that ultimately he isnt a God.
I love how Guilliman is the emperors equivalent of Jesus Christ
This is foreshadowing the Scouring where Gman dictated the codex to everyone and had the largest legion.
While Lorgar may actually be....right, here...maybe Guiliman is just a reflection of Horus? Are we sure that the same pride Horus had isn't in Guiliman but just buried deeper?
The Lion, who had a natural instinct for sending corruption came to Macragge and said "I feared you had done much worse."
If he and even Malcador and Russ suspected Guiliman, that is some strong reason for suspicion of those 3 agree with one another.
Kind of. There will be some pride, but it was always more in “I am proud of the future we have secured”
Horus was more “I am proud of what we have done”
He always looked to the future, and saw his glory as the success of his worlds.
It’s why he’d have sanguinis in charge and Lion in charge of the military, even though he’s the one who created Imperial Secundus.
His pride is him giving others success.
I interpreted this as Kor using Lorgars hatred off Guilliman to help poison his love for The Emperor. By casting them as mirror images, Kor Phaeron helps push Lorgar towards to dark side by isolating him from his beloved father.
I actually still have that book. A guy was getting rid of his old stuff and he had a box of 40k books so I took them.
Guilliman is the Emperors Greatest success as far as primarchs go, only being rivaled by the sheer humanity of Vulkan and in both instances there views are not even crafted by the emperor but rather mortal men and women who cared for them and loved them dearly.
Frankly I really love this part of warhammer: At the end of day when all is said in done it is the regular men and women of the imperium who have consistently decided its fate. Whether it be the absolute titan of imperial history Euten is or the simple widow named Ollanius Pius who stood against the full force of chaos personified in Horus which saved the Imperium.
The way GW plans ahead like this, I’ll be on my death bed praying I make it long enough to see what happens next. I’ll probably die before I get all the answers I want out of this setting lol.
You say planning I say they tease everything they possibly can.
Guilliman is the Archangel Michael to Horus' Lucifer.
Hardly foreshadowing.
Crazy thing is corfairon prediction came true.
Of course theyre planning years in advance if they only worked on what they release that would mean they only work like 20 days a year. Their rollout schedule is meant to keep you engaged
I suppose Perty can relate.
Rowboat now carries the Imperium while he had to carry the heresy.
I hope they retcon him being a daemon prince, it be pretty neat for them to meet with a brother who isnt a slave to dark gods. fucking evil maybe and definitely full of self hatred, but still sound of mind.
That’s is indeed a cool dialogue they had, but it does not predict his future like you say.
They could've also just written the HH and earmarked it as something which could come up. Then they needed something big in 40k for a new edition and checked what options they had and went for THE WORST DECISION EVER
That's how you do a proper series. Have a plan for the whole thing.
I feel like the Emperor is Julius Caesar. Conquest after conquest only to be betrayed by within and G man is more like Octavius, the one who brought vengeance and shaped the Roman Empire.
Wasn't this back when GW was doing nothing but prop up and glaze the Ultramarines?
Robute ran the imperium after Emprah's internment, he just returned during era indomitus.
Guilliman master on excel's kung fu
Roh Boot Goatedman
I really want to get into the 40k lore but have no idea were to start
I'm not sure the Emperor had much "humility" himself...
You may have your father's face, but unfortunately You and Horus do not have your father's hair pattern bald.....
*Lorgar shoots Kor Phaeron
Is this also the reason why people theorized that Bobby G. would become a leader to humanity if terminus decree end up destroying holy tera?
gw USED to plan in advance
They plan years in advance, unless it is saying there are female custodes.
And yet Guilliman himself made Sanguinius ruler of imperium Secundus
Because he never wanted to be a ruler hell he only became regent due the necessity. Guy just wants a farm.
Wish games workshop would bring back Vulkan. Guilliman could really use a hug
Throat goat sillyman gets all the cool stuff because the blueberry boys are the figureheads of borehammer.
Damn dawg .That was a lot of insults in a row.
The recent changes to custodes dont seem to have been thought out.
If that so then the Imperium has it's hopes once more
Planning ahead my chair. They keeo chsnging and breaking the ruleset every few days like it's random.
GW also as been know to wing it and retcon later.
Wasn't it Malcador the one who said Lorgar reminded him of the Emperor the most?
Uuuh. It was an Imperium Secondus reference.
.... I'm sorry, half astartes?! That guy needs a short next
There are other examples of half Astartes too. Luther was Lion's adoptive father and he too became a half Astartes.
The full transformation requires the initiate to be a teenager. Otherwise %99 it kills the initiate if they try to go full.
I'm reading the First Heretic novel right now. Incredible book. I want to jettison Cyrene out an airlock cuz she's annoying (should not have looked her up in the wiki cuz she gets even more annoying later. But that conversation in the video was very cool and that was amazing foreshadowing
GW and planning? End Times would like a word.
I have to say guillman is a reflection of the emperor in his view for humanity, is strategic brilliance , and mastery of logic and logistics.
. But he represents parts of the emperor that are different from what horse represents.
Horace is arrogant, he believes wholeheartedly in his skill to the point of flaw , but so does the emperor , the emperor rally the million worlds to his banner , chorus just as easily took half. Gentleman could not control one of his brothers , Horus at the start of the heresy controlled half of all of.
Gilman did not have the respect of all of his brothers yet despite everyone not wanting to accept Horace as warmaster , few of them could deny that he was the best choice.
Gillman might be a reflection of the emperor
But Horus could be emperor. Guliman is a statesman but lack the hubris and and gusto to be his father.
Having a lack of hubris isn’t a bad thing either admitting that much Guilliman would admit when something was his fault. Horus couldn’t even be arsed to apologize to Corvus for using his gene-sons as cannon fodder. Specifically a frontal assault which the Raven Guard have never specialized in, they aren’t shock troops yes Horus was a great guy before his fall but in the end he screwed up. Royally. Guilliman never hated any of his brothers its only the warped perception of others that clouds others perception of him.
oh yes, Kor Phaeron, the first heretic.
Yet they kept the female custodes hidden in the palace's kitchens until the awokening happened...
Funk G Wokeshop