Links Mentioned in video: My previous review of Signal ua-cam.com/video/j93B3dcejyE/v-deo.html t.me/durov/142 www.reddit.com/r/signal/comments/kzik0a/a_visual_comparison_of_app_privacy_information_in/
There is a very valid reason why Secret Chats (the end to end encrypted mode) isn't the default. It keeps getting lots of bad rep nowadays but the truth is: After people have used Facebook Messenger, Discord, Steam and whatnot, they are accustomed to cross device cloud sync. They want their messages to instantly appear on all devices without manually backing up stuff. The way the desktop apps are implemented with WhatsApp and Signal are problematic: They are not fully functioning clients, but only "mirrored" apps. What I mean by this is that if your phone runs out of juice, you're in bad luck. And there will be disconnecting from time to time which is really frustrating if you ask me. Since most people really want the cloud syncing and extra bells and whistles, Secret Chats are NOT the default. It's a general assumption people would more likely opt for that instead of E2EE. But for those that really want the less feature packed version with even better (Telegram is secure by default, but E2EE has its own virtues) security, they can choose to do so. They are trying to satisfy all parties here and I think it's a good thing. Btw I've been using Telegram for like 6 years now and I'm extremely happy.
And I'm not trying to say anything negative about Signal but there's another common trait between Signal and WhatsApp that is a real dealbreaker for me. I do not want to share my phone number in any groups. Signal or WhatsApp don't allow this by giving user usernames that give some levels of anonymity. Instead, they force us to reveal a very private thing about ourselves: Our phone number, which is a pain in the ass to change and it is a crucial tool for identification purposes. What's stopping anyone from just signing up to a lot of services with your phone number or spreading it everywhere online? Nothing. And there's very little you could do about it. Or what about prank calls? Sure, you can always block one number at a time, but if they just keep coming, there's only one option left which is to get a new number, go through the hassle of updating it everywhere and next time be more careful as to who you give your number to. And that's exactly the root of the problem. Numbers shouldn't be public!
I forgot to say thanks for the great video and sorry if my feedback sounded negative. Just been an avid user of Telegram and I'm kind of hoping Signal would copy a few handy features (especially usernames) from Telegram and I'd happily use it as a backup service or for private 1v1s. But I have dozens on groups on TG so can't really just switch at this point.
Something worth mentioning about either platform is that your keyboard can undermine the encryption. Many keyboards aggregate words typed and send them to the company operating the keyboard, to make prediction better or to learn new words for instance. Keyboards aren't supposed to do this if asked not to (which Signal does), but if you're talking about something that is prohibited in your location, they may be compelled to ignore this flag by the government. This isn't so much a problem in the US, but in other countries with less free speech, this could result in an encrypted conversation being used to prosecute you based solely on what you typed. If you're in this situation, you should do research and make sure you're not using such a keyboard. Ideally use an open source one which only operates locally. On iOS, this may be less of an issue than Android, but I'm not an iOS user and can't speak to Apple's practices here. You may want to VPN all traffic out as an extra precaution if you're not sure. It would be nice if Signal had a FAQ or something that explained this, as it's not really a fault of Signal but could mean someone who is whistleblowing about human rights violations puts too much trust in Signal and ends up in trouble with their government. Again, not something that would likely affect us in the US, but definitely something I'd be concerned about if I were in a less democratic country with less free speech.
IMO the easiest way to monetize on messaging platforms is Emotes. Create emote skins and give people access to send them for a price per year. Heck, you might even be able to let artists make their own sets, and sell them on a store that they take a cut of.
Great video For these 2 app, things are pretty interesting here in Hong Kong Many people have installed both app I find it interesting that to many people here telegram is telegram and serves more like info channel, but signal replace WhatsApp.
I tried all messaging apps & Signal is the best! Messaging concentrated, means no channels no people nearby no stories. Also no online/writing status bullshit But Signal still needs enhancements like adding Bots for business, broadcast feature & a direct download from their website to avoid censorship, an app built-in updater with notification service
Been on WhatsApp first, added Telegram and now added signal to the arsenal. The main issue I have is, that signal does not natively support a web client. This made me wonder, if there is another alternative. And indeed, I found Matrix with Element/Riot as web interface. And the best about Matrix is, that it is decentealized and offers support for bridges to other networks. So right now, I moved to Matrix and already added a signal bridge. Other bridges going to follow soon.
I'm using Threema instead of Signal. I know that you briefly mentioned it at the beginning, but would like to point out some advantages that Threema has over Signal, as it gets buried under the discussion between Signal and Telegram a lot. - Business Model: Threema has a more sustainable business model in my opinion. Additionally to charging ~$3 for the app, they offer a paid service to businesses called "Threema Work", which is their main source of income AFAIK. I think a stronger business model gives them the advantage to better sustain themselves without selling the company or pushing ads in the future. - Web-Client: I just discovered recently that Signal doesn't have any Web-Client, which is a huge disadvantage for me, as I'm mostly messaging from my computer. Threema does have a very decent Web-Client with all the features you'd expect. - Open-Source and independent audits: They recently made their applications open-source (finally, that one bugged me a lot!) and do independent audits regularly. - Swiss based: Might not be that big of a deal, but they pledge to run all of their infrastructure on their own servers in Switzerland. Which can be an advantage, as the privacy laws are much stricter there and it's harder for authorities to get to. Running their own infrastructure might be an advantage for people distrusting big cloud platforms like Google Cloud, AWS, Azure. But you still need to trust Threema, so that can also be a disadvantage, depending on your standing point. I think apart from that, Signal and Threema do have much in common and both are very solid apps, just wanted to give Threema some love in the discussion. I personally prefer Threema because of the points made above, but I may also not see the whole picture. I'm using both Signal and Threema, because some of my contacts are on Signal but not on Threema and vice versa. Threema is actually the more popular app in my circles, but that differs a lot between countries and regions. Use whatever you prefer, the future probably requires people to have multiple messengers installed, but I'm guessing that Signal will have the biggest user base, at least that's what it looks like now on a global scale. If you want to completely transition from Whatsapp to another Messenger, just delete Whatsapp and inform your contacts with a status update one day before. I've found that people only start installing alternative messengers once their contacts actually leave Whatsapp.
@@amisanthrope247 actually 5 ($/€) one off. Worth it, actually very cheap. I would bet on Threema privacy long before I bet on Telegram. I limit TG use to open groups.
I been using telegram for 3 yrs now and I have WhatsApp also and recently downloaded signal just for curiosity.. But signal doesn't come close to telegram you can customize your own account in telegram, you can make your own channel in telegram, you can read and send email through telegram and more.. Which signal doesn't have ✌️😁
Wow, fantastic way of presenting both options out there and I totally agree that in the end you’ll have to know and agree to the terms these companies impose. Personally I use Telegram since before Signal even existed, I believe Snowden was still working at NSA hahaha when I joined it. I did so mainly due to the many features it already had, particularly their bot API and also the ability to quickly search through million of messages on either my phone or the desktop: something that my phone wouldn’t be able to handle if pure e2e were to be used. Thanks again for your very neutral and objective point of view!
Thank you for the video. It is getting quite hard to find ways to ensure all personal information is enncrypted. My question is what happens to clients' information submitted through google forms, word docs and emails in google, hotmail etc. Ironically I can't manage to restore my hotmail account because the answer to a control question did not work. And someone else might have access to the email (it is not an active one but still...).
I use Telegram to send things between all of my different systems and to communicate with my wife's cell phone, but always separately encrypt anything sensitive in another application before putting those in Telegram. I didn't see any settings under Telegram's "Privacy and Security" options for encrypting any messages better. Could you demonstrate where to find those settings perhaps? Thanks!
Was about to comment this, session is fantastic. But perhaps we shouldn't promote it right now. We don't want it to get banned now they are super sensitive and its not yet fully done. Once they bring out multi device though it will be phenomenal.
Telegram has free infinite cloud service, bots which can literally replace apps from the store, 60fps 1080p stickers and animated stickers too, with groups of more about than 200.000 users and channels with infinite users.. And a big etc, and yes telegram is private too, so that why i prefer telegram honestly
Sadly Threema is not part of that compare. For non-US GDPR is really important and signal is US and thus Patriot Act as well as US Cloud Act. Threema is the goto thing from Switzerland.
@Lawrence Systems "According to documents filed by the Department of Justice, Signal’s encrypted messages can be intercepted from iPhone devices when those Apple devices are in a mode called partial AFU". Any comment on this?
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS In that case, wouldn't Telegram that is able to delete conversations for both parties, by the initiative of the one party alone, be better?
TG is not even close to the best. TG is good for open groups, but terrible for privacy. Better privacy options... Threema uses servers but does not require email or number. Session is decentralized, no phone number or email required.
Telegram is definitely is better than WhatsApp regarding privacy. Do you know who created Telegram? An anti-copyright/pro-freedom of speech guy who is not in Russia. it competes with FB/Meta (like VK, his first creation), not Signal. People concerned with freedom of speech are moving there mostly.
@Loaded Diaper Yeah, so if one thinks Whatsapp is bad behavior, wait till you compare with WeChat which should have many users and some are moving to that to replace
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS thank you for taking the time replying me, much appreciated. although the question is not answered. why ? Mr Musk is a conman who can afford good press due to his fortune....so that people consider him as a brilliant scientists (although he has never proven his scientific skills at anything at all, rather he has scientists and brilliant engineers work for him. standing on a stage showing us animation about rockets reaching Mars is marketing and not a proof of his brilliant skills).....why has he recommended signal?
@@needsomehike I would say look into the details instead of taking Elon for his word. I doubt he understands the details. I did give some weight to Edward Snowden's endorsement.
Great video, thank you 👌🏻 I heard that other apps, like Google Message (in beta), uses Signal's open source encryption library? Does it imply encryption will be properly implemented from end to end on those apps?
Signal makes a bit of money by selling their encryption algorithm and it is used in WhatsApp and Facebook Messenger private chats and some of the things Google does. There are however 2 main questions: firstly is the code running on your device actually what it is supposed to be running and doesn't contain any spyware. Secondly, how do they implement it? For example, WhatsApp defaults to sending unencrypted backups to Apple and Google, delivers messages with new keys without user permission, and a bunch of other stuff that should be changed. (As a side note, this is one of the reasons they went after Wire so hard when they wanted to use Signal's research and license their code more permissively)
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS most probably verry limited people in europe even heard of signal, in Europe it is more about Threema, as it id very secure. Of course Tg gets used aswell, but more for bigger audiences, as you mentionned :) anyways, keep up the good work, next time something like Threema should be included in such a comparison if possible :)
Agree, would have loved to see Threema mentioned a bit more. I actually made a longer comment to elaborate a bit but it doesn't seem to appear, I don't know if it contained any blocked words? I personally really appreciate that they have a web-client and that they run on their own infrastructure in Switzerland :) And I think being a paid app and also providing a commercial product for businesses will allow them to stay independent and ad-free. Oh and being able to write to people without giving out my phone number is also pretty neat!
you forgot Threema with the biggest advantage: Not hosted in the US, where the government has the right to enforce backdoors as was proven by Snowden etc. I like my products as transparent as possible, especially the financing. While donations are good, with threema you pay for the app and that's it. I'm usually quite conscpicuous about any product that's free, then again, so is wikipedia.
privacy. message go thru server,. boom.server has allways admin. yet again another message service that soon someone buy.later ads(privacy/ads) SMS go directly to receiver. no man in middle. other than service provider
Very unpopular opinion: 1. You don't need E2E encryption for everyday conversations. You need the flexibility of accessing your messaging app from anywhere (for example your desktop when you forget your phone at work). And you need your conversations stored with a company you trust, encrypted by several keys that are located on different continents if possible. 2. Even the most basic computer user should understand when to use encryption and when to use E2E encryption. Seriously. Teach this in schools. You don't go driving on a highway till you know how to shift gears. Computers are the same. 3. Remember DES? Well that's the exact reason I use Telegram. Everybody is preaching AES and the 256 bit version is said to be quantum-resistant as well. But it was still made on NSA's order. Who knows, maybe they have a backdoor in the algorithm. Maybe they don't. You could say the same thing about Telegam's encryption but I'd much rather trust literally anyone else than NSA. And if I let my imagination run wild... you do realize that it's illegal to use encryption that the government can't crack in the US, right? Wouldn't that make AES illegal? (Yes, I'm very much familiar with the algorithm, both in software and HDL accelerator forms and no, I did not notice a fault in it myself. As I said, I simply don't trust NSA.)
Threema for security it provides the best in class, and ask for nothing to register, only link by default seems to be device/OS info related 👍( pay to use app ) 👍
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS , that must be an american thing. I often notice that european apps don't get advertised by the Apple App store for instance on devices with US-account but vice versa... I never understood why but I'd really like to know who decides this. I've been using it since 2012 and it took a while to convince people. The IT savvy ones (I know) all use it.
Well no, you use signal just because elon say it, but i use telegram because its a multinational organization with no profit like signal, with more and powerful funtionalities
Links Mentioned in video:
My previous review of Signal
ua-cam.com/video/j93B3dcejyE/v-deo.html
t.me/durov/142
www.reddit.com/r/signal/comments/kzik0a/a_visual_comparison_of_app_privacy_information_in/
its nice to be part of the pre-elon signal users lol
There is a very valid reason why Secret Chats (the end to end encrypted mode) isn't the default. It keeps getting lots of bad rep nowadays but the truth is: After people have used Facebook Messenger, Discord, Steam and whatnot, they are accustomed to cross device cloud sync. They want their messages to instantly appear on all devices without manually backing up stuff.
The way the desktop apps are implemented with WhatsApp and Signal are problematic: They are not fully functioning clients, but only "mirrored" apps. What I mean by this is that if your phone runs out of juice, you're in bad luck. And there will be disconnecting from time to time which is really frustrating if you ask me.
Since most people really want the cloud syncing and extra bells and whistles, Secret Chats are NOT the default. It's a general assumption people would more likely opt for that instead of E2EE.
But for those that really want the less feature packed version with even better (Telegram is secure by default, but E2EE has its own virtues) security, they can choose to do so.
They are trying to satisfy all parties here and I think it's a good thing.
Btw I've been using Telegram for like 6 years now and I'm extremely happy.
And I'm not trying to say anything negative about Signal but there's another common trait between Signal and WhatsApp that is a real dealbreaker for me.
I do not want to share my phone number in any groups. Signal or WhatsApp don't allow this by giving user usernames that give some levels of anonymity. Instead, they force us to reveal a very private thing about ourselves: Our phone number, which is a pain in the ass to change and it is a crucial tool for identification purposes. What's stopping anyone from just signing up to a lot of services with your phone number or spreading it everywhere online? Nothing. And there's very little you could do about it. Or what about prank calls?
Sure, you can always block one number at a time, but if they just keep coming, there's only one option left which is to get a new number, go through the hassle of updating it everywhere and next time be more careful as to who you give your number to. And that's exactly the root of the problem. Numbers shouldn't be public!
I forgot to say thanks for the great video and sorry if my feedback sounded negative. Just been an avid user of Telegram and I'm kind of hoping Signal would copy a few handy features (especially usernames) from Telegram and I'd happily use it as a backup service or for private 1v1s. But I have dozens on groups on TG so can't really just switch at this point.
changed to telegram well happy on there, whatsapp now is history
Does it work communicating internationally? Did you turn on the end to end encryption "private chat"?
Thanks
@@albertthedogeinstein7983 yes to all your questions
Something worth mentioning about either platform is that your keyboard can undermine the encryption. Many keyboards aggregate words typed and send them to the company operating the keyboard, to make prediction better or to learn new words for instance. Keyboards aren't supposed to do this if asked not to (which Signal does), but if you're talking about something that is prohibited in your location, they may be compelled to ignore this flag by the government. This isn't so much a problem in the US, but in other countries with less free speech, this could result in an encrypted conversation being used to prosecute you based solely on what you typed. If you're in this situation, you should do research and make sure you're not using such a keyboard. Ideally use an open source one which only operates locally. On iOS, this may be less of an issue than Android, but I'm not an iOS user and can't speak to Apple's practices here. You may want to VPN all traffic out as an extra precaution if you're not sure.
It would be nice if Signal had a FAQ or something that explained this, as it's not really a fault of Signal but could mean someone who is whistleblowing about human rights violations puts too much trust in Signal and ends up in trouble with their government. Again, not something that would likely affect us in the US, but definitely something I'd be concerned about if I were in a less democratic country with less free speech.
I've never used Signal but I'll never stop using Telegram
IMO the easiest way to monetize on messaging platforms is Emotes. Create emote skins and give people access to send them for a price per year. Heck, you might even be able to let artists make their own sets, and sell them on a store that they take a cut of.
I got signal a week ago, a lot of contacts have joined so hopefully I can move off whatsapp
Wow are you related Harry 's trueman?
Great video
For these 2 app, things are pretty interesting here in Hong Kong
Many people have installed both app
I find it interesting that to many people here telegram is telegram and serves more like info channel, but signal replace WhatsApp.
I tried all messaging apps & Signal is the best! Messaging concentrated, means no channels no people nearby no stories. Also no online/writing status bullshit
But Signal still needs enhancements like adding Bots for business, broadcast feature & a direct download from their website to avoid censorship, an app built-in updater with notification service
Telegram is still number one in several countries, including mine
Been on WhatsApp first, added Telegram and now added signal to the arsenal. The main issue I have is, that signal does not natively support a web client. This made me wonder, if there is another alternative. And indeed, I found Matrix with Element/Riot as web interface. And the best about Matrix is, that it is decentealized and offers support for bridges to other networks. So right now, I moved to Matrix and already added a signal bridge. Other bridges going to follow soon.
I'm using Threema instead of Signal. I know that you briefly mentioned it at the beginning, but would like to point out some advantages that Threema has over Signal, as it gets buried under the discussion between Signal and Telegram a lot.
- Business Model: Threema has a more sustainable business model in my opinion. Additionally to charging ~$3 for the app, they offer a paid service to businesses called "Threema Work", which is their main source of income AFAIK. I think a stronger business model gives them the advantage to better sustain themselves without selling the company or pushing ads in the future.
- Web-Client: I just discovered recently that Signal doesn't have any Web-Client, which is a huge disadvantage for me, as I'm mostly messaging from my computer. Threema does have a very decent Web-Client with all the features you'd expect.
- Open-Source and independent audits: They recently made their applications open-source (finally, that one bugged me a lot!) and do independent audits regularly.
- Swiss based: Might not be that big of a deal, but they pledge to run all of their infrastructure on their own servers in Switzerland. Which can be an advantage, as the privacy laws are much stricter there and it's harder for authorities to get to. Running their own infrastructure might be an advantage for people distrusting big cloud platforms like Google Cloud, AWS, Azure. But you still need to trust Threema, so that can also be a disadvantage, depending on your standing point.
I think apart from that, Signal and Threema do have much in common and both are very solid apps, just wanted to give Threema some love in the discussion. I personally prefer Threema because of the points made above, but I may also not see the whole picture. I'm using both Signal and Threema, because some of my contacts are on Signal but not on Threema and vice versa. Threema is actually the more popular app in my circles, but that differs a lot between countries and regions.
Use whatever you prefer, the future probably requires people to have multiple messengers installed, but I'm guessing that Signal will have the biggest user base, at least that's what it looks like now on a global scale. If you want to completely transition from Whatsapp to another Messenger, just delete Whatsapp and inform your contacts with a status update one day before. I've found that people only start installing alternative messengers once their contacts actually leave Whatsapp.
I stopped reading at $3.
@@amisanthrope247 same lmao
@@amisanthrope247 actually 5 ($/€) one off. Worth it, actually very cheap.
I would bet on Threema privacy long before I bet on Telegram. I limit TG use to open groups.
I been using telegram for 3 yrs now and I have WhatsApp also and recently downloaded signal just for curiosity.. But signal doesn't come close to telegram you can customize your own account in telegram, you can make your own channel in telegram, you can read and send email through telegram and more.. Which signal doesn't have ✌️😁
Wow, fantastic way of presenting both options out there and I totally agree that in the end you’ll have to know and agree to the terms these companies impose.
Personally I use Telegram since before Signal even existed, I believe Snowden was still working at NSA hahaha when I joined it. I did so mainly due to the many features it already had, particularly their bot API and also the ability to quickly search through million of messages on either my phone or the desktop: something that my phone wouldn’t be able to handle if pure e2e were to be used.
Thanks again for your very neutral and objective point of view!
can you please start cross-posting to LBRY or such?
Thank you for the video. It is getting quite hard to find ways to ensure all personal information is enncrypted. My question is what happens to clients' information submitted through google forms, word docs and emails in google, hotmail etc. Ironically I can't manage to restore my hotmail account because the answer to a control question did not work. And someone else might have access to the email (it is not an active one but still...).
Thanks Tom. Very clear information
I've been using "Silence" off fdroid. It is Signal but uses your SMS instead of Google.
I use Telegram to send things between all of my different systems and to communicate with my wife's cell phone, but always separately encrypt anything sensitive in another application before putting those in Telegram. I didn't see any settings under Telegram's "Privacy and Security" options for encrypting any messages better. Could you demonstrate where to find those settings perhaps? Thanks!
You have signal wallpaper behind you. Are you biased towards signal?
I prefer Signal
Signal > Telegram. But long term Session is interesting.
Was about to comment this, session is fantastic. But perhaps we shouldn't promote it right now. We don't want it to get banned now they are super sensitive and its not yet fully done. Once they bring out multi device though it will be phenomenal.
Telegram has free infinite cloud service, bots which can literally replace apps from the store, 60fps 1080p stickers and animated stickers too, with groups of more about than 200.000 users and channels with infinite users.. And a big etc, and yes telegram is private too, so that why i prefer telegram honestly
Sadly Threema is not part of that compare. For non-US GDPR is really important and signal is US and thus Patriot Act as well as US Cloud Act. Threema is the goto thing from Switzerland.
@Lawrence Systems "According to documents filed by the Department of Justice, Signal’s encrypted messages can be intercepted from iPhone devices when those Apple devices are in a mode called partial AFU". Any comment on this?
Yes, it required both the device and the device to be in AFU (After Unlock) so I don't really see that as a concern. Can't be done remotely.
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS In that case, wouldn't Telegram that is able to delete conversations for both parties, by the initiative of the one party alone, be better?
@@puffdragon5403 The term better revolves around in the whole threat model in the first place.
I just don't know what to trust anymore.
You have got to make a decision on who to trust based on knowledge, so start learning my friend :)
As far as I could tell keebase and riot(now element) are very similar.
Telegram is the best.
TG is not even close to the best. TG is good for open groups, but terrible for privacy.
Better privacy options...
Threema uses servers but does not require email or number.
Session is decentralized, no phone number or email required.
Any thoughts on Wire vs Signal?
none, my and my cybersecurity friends all use Signal
Goooood channel محتوى رائع جدا بالتوفيق والنجاح في قناتكم الرائعة ⚘👍✌🌹
Telegram is definitely is better than WhatsApp regarding privacy. Do you know who created Telegram? An anti-copyright/pro-freedom of speech guy who is not in Russia. it competes with FB/Meta (like VK, his first creation), not Signal. People concerned with freedom of speech are moving there mostly.
2 questions here, 1 wasn't telegram founded by a russian? 2 where are you moving to/have moved too if youtube kicks you off?
Yes and don't have any plans on moving from UA-cam.
it doesn't matter if i had any messaging apps because i have no friends
What about Wechat? Would be a great comparison to Whatsapp
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Lol
@Loaded Diaper Yeah, so if one thinks Whatsapp is bad behavior, wait till you compare with WeChat which should have many users and some are moving to that to replace
Wechat is chinese what do you expect ?
why did Elon adverise signal? I am afraid signal is compromised....
Elon said it was a good app on Twitter and Elon has a lot of followers.
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS yeh but why he did that suddenly ... he waked up some morning and decided to advise people to use signal ?
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS thank you for taking the time replying me, much appreciated. although the question is not answered. why ? Mr Musk is a conman who can afford good press due to his fortune....so that people consider him as a brilliant scientists (although he has never proven his scientific skills at anything at all, rather he has scientists and brilliant engineers work for him. standing on a stage showing us animation about rockets reaching Mars is marketing and not a proof of his brilliant skills).....why has he recommended signal?
My assumption is because it's a solid and secure application.
@@needsomehike I would say look into the details instead of taking Elon for his word. I doubt he understands the details. I did give some weight to Edward Snowden's endorsement.
Great video, thank you 👌🏻
I heard that other apps, like Google Message (in beta), uses Signal's open source encryption library? Does it imply encryption will be properly implemented from end to end on those apps?
Signal makes a bit of money by selling their encryption algorithm and it is used in WhatsApp and Facebook Messenger private chats and some of the things Google does. There are however 2 main questions: firstly is the code running on your device actually what it is supposed to be running and doesn't contain any spyware.
Secondly, how do they implement it? For example, WhatsApp defaults to sending unencrypted backups to Apple and Google, delivers messages with new keys without user permission, and a bunch of other stuff that should be changed.
(As a side note, this is one of the reasons they went after Wire so hard when they wanted to use Signal's research and license their code more permissively)
I think it would just be a good idea to steer clear of any big tech company's stuff, no matter how private and safe they claim it is
THank you for your analysis! (Y) what about SESSION ?
dunno, don't use it or plan on using it.
What about Threema?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS most probably verry limited people in europe even heard of signal, in Europe it is more about Threema, as it id very secure. Of course Tg gets used aswell, but more for bigger audiences, as you mentionned :) anyways, keep up the good work, next time something like Threema should be included in such a comparison if possible :)
Agree, would have loved to see Threema mentioned a bit more. I actually made a longer comment to elaborate a bit but it doesn't seem to appear, I don't know if it contained any blocked words? I personally really appreciate that they have a web-client and that they run on their own infrastructure in Switzerland :) And I think being a paid app and also providing a commercial product for businesses will allow them to stay independent and ad-free. Oh and being able to write to people without giving out my phone number is also pretty neat!
It's on this list www.securemessagingapps.com/
For me matrix + element is the way to go, but for me signal > telegram >>>>> whatsapp
Matrix/Element needs to feature match discord before people really move
you forgot Threema with the biggest advantage: Not hosted in the US, where the government has the right to enforce backdoors as was proven by Snowden etc.
I like my products as transparent as possible, especially the financing. While donations are good, with threema you pay for the app and that's it.
I'm usually quite conscpicuous about any product that's free, then again, so is wikipedia.
I have not social media also not planning to do either
Technically UA-cam is a social media app...
Telegram > Signal
Agree
All instant messaging software is rubbish in front of Telegram
Telegram is dangerous for KIDS!!! (and for some adults)
Anyone can contact random people.... and share or communicate inappropriate stuff.
don't talk to strangers.
Do not set a username. Nobody will then be able to contact you unless they are already a contact or you contact them first
compare signal vs wire vs session
www.securemessagingapps.com/
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS I know that ..years ago!
What about keybase, IMO is far superior than signal for security
8:07
Please sync to Odysee.com. UA-cam is not what it used to be.
thanks for the video
You're welcome
Can i get your telegram/signal i need tutorial how can i setup uisp.ui.com cloud didnt found any tutoral for that comunnity group not helping
nice!
Signal is also owned by a guy that worked for facebook and thia guy also owned before some actions from whatsapp and we all know what happened
Another thing of what im on telegram
@@wrenchproductions i have Wickr and is the best ! Better than telegram for me :)
@@s.o3448 you have john wickr?
During the crash, I donated to Signal. The least I could do to help..
How much do they accept?
I think you can donate whatever you want, I donated $3. Check the official site
privacy. message go thru server,. boom.server has allways admin.
yet again another message service that soon someone buy.later ads(privacy/ads)
SMS go directly to receiver. no man in middle. other than service provider
Belarus used Telegram. Жыве Беларусь.
meh, critical of telegram...
As soon you need to type in your phone number and share your contacts... privacy out the window.
I will pay for no adds
then with Signal you get both no adds and do not have to pay - however you can donate if you so wish
@@TheMschipp Yes, I donated!
@@jshrawder49 yep. Me too. We can subsidie people who are unable to pay,
Very unpopular opinion:
1. You don't need E2E encryption for everyday conversations. You need the flexibility of accessing your messaging app from anywhere (for example your desktop when you forget your phone at work). And you need your conversations stored with a company you trust, encrypted by several keys that are located on different continents if possible.
2. Even the most basic computer user should understand when to use encryption and when to use E2E encryption. Seriously. Teach this in schools. You don't go driving on a highway till you know how to shift gears. Computers are the same.
3. Remember DES? Well that's the exact reason I use Telegram. Everybody is preaching AES and the 256 bit version is said to be quantum-resistant as well. But it was still made on NSA's order. Who knows, maybe they have a backdoor in the algorithm. Maybe they don't. You could say the same thing about Telegam's encryption but I'd much rather trust literally anyone else than NSA. And if I let my imagination run wild... you do realize that it's illegal to use encryption that the government can't crack in the US, right? Wouldn't that make AES illegal? (Yes, I'm very much familiar with the algorithm, both in software and HDL accelerator forms and no, I did not notice a fault in it myself. As I said, I simply don't trust NSA.)
Signal is secure and that but telegram is secure too and its more useful
You should check out Joe Rogan's interview with Moxie Marlinspike from Signal it is very interesting. It happened on December 1st 2020.
Is it on youtube or now on Spotify
@@harrytrueman4216 I watched on Spotify but it may be on UA-cam since he didn't officially switch over until the beginning of this year.
I checked UA-cam and couldn't find it so check it out on Spotify
RIP Keybase.
Signal is better
New messenger TELEGUARD (No connection to a telephone number and no collection of user identification data) BY SWISSCOWS
Where Skype?
Here www.securemessagingapps.com/
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS
Please review PALAPA (source code from signal) , messenger apps made in Indonesia.. 🙏🙏🙏🙏
Get Threema
Threema for security it provides the best in class, and ask for nothing to register, only link by default seems to be device/OS info related 👍( pay to use app ) 👍
I really like Threema, it has great security... oh, and btw: swiss made ;)
My big issue with Threema is that no one I know uses it
@@LAWRENCESYSTEMS , that must be an american thing. I often notice that european apps don't get advertised by the Apple App store for instance on devices with US-account but vice versa... I never understood why but I'd really like to know who decides this.
I've been using it since 2012 and it took a while to convince people. The IT savvy ones (I know) all use it.
WIRE!
Keybase
I'm the only one who likes the telegram
According to their page there are a few million other people who like it.
Me too
Kik
Smart people to signal, the others to telegram.
Well no, you use signal just because elon say it, but i use telegram because its a multinational organization with no profit like signal, with more and powerful funtionalities
@@wrenchproductions i had signal before lol, you know nothing
@@j.s9875 oh really? Well then have a good luck with that