The real problem is the rough treatment of luggage and how often luggage is lost, it’s unacceptable, airlines need to be seriously held responsible for damaging and/or losing luggage. It’s actually ridiculous how bad it is. Really it should be safe to put it in a fly case and check it.
True.. What the hell even is their job, when they cannot put something, where it belongs. There are some industries, where nobody seems to care about actually doing the work, they are paid for. Imagine, paying like 400 bucks for a Madonna concert and she comes on, sits in a chair, reading todays newspaper and then leaving again. Well, that's how some industries work. Food is another one. But flights are crazy. Especially with luggage handling.
My wife flew Israel -> Boston a couple years back and they straight up didn't even put the luggage on the plane. It took months for it to arrive back at our apartment, and it looked like it was put through some serious beatings. That's the worst I've ever seen, but even just me regularly flying with a single bag they're always trying to get me to stow it under the plane. I will never trust an airline enough to do that unless I don't have another option.
I didn’t expect to relate to this so hard, but this is exactly what it’s like travelling with a wheelchair too! So take your analogy about people being legally empowered to accidentally break your phone to travel, except it’s your legs 😬 BTW great gig in Glasgow 👍
Few months back I toured Japan and I was amazed how courteous their attendants (well in my case was ANA flight crews) in assisting me over my bulky 5 strings Jazz. Even for an economy domestic flight, they provided a "soft box" to put the instrument in to check in, in a way to let the baggage handlers know that it needed to be handled delicately. Best part? They brought my instrument on a trolley and have them parked at the cargo conveyor upon arrival. Made the whole trip to Japan a breeze.
@@fairuzhussaini7301 that, and our director has been doing this every 4 years with the orchestra, so i assume he's got it down to a science at this point
Imagine being Krystian Zimerman, one of the greatest living pianists, who used to fly with his own personal grand piano, before goons at JFK airport confiscated it and destroyed it because “the glue smelled funny.”
My bass teacher recently moved and he and his wife had their cars transported as well. Nothing protects an upright bass (or most any other instrument) like a locked car. Of course it helped that it was spring-like weather on the cooler side.
@@noahmay7708 you can transport pretty much anything on a plane, including other planes. As for the specifics of a grand piano: I imagine a really big wooden box, I'd probably mount it in a frame with some kind of suspension just to take the edge off those hard landings and turbulence.
For travel within Europe, for a number of reasons I would always look for railway options before booking a flight. A. The train staff will almost never hassle you about luggage at all. No airport stress. B. In a lot of European cities, the airport tends to be really far outside while the railway station is dead center. No need to worry about expensive and time consuming airport transfers. C. Trains are often more roomy, comfortable and may (or may not) contain a bistro car, sleeper cabins with showers, etc. Trains being an option of course depends a lot on the touring schedule and locations. If you go Rome - Helsinki - London, by all means, go by flight. There are high speed rail in many European countries, but it's still land travel, so a somewhat neighbouring area is preferable.
Honestly, this is why I don't fly inside of Western/Northern Europe as a wheelchair user. My wheelchair never leaves my presence when I travel by train. I don't have to worry about it being smashed to bits by the time I arrive. There's also no TSA-style security when travelling between countries by train. (It's actually faster to travel between London and Paris via Eurostar than by aircraft, when taking into account security and everything.) Outside of that, I prefer to rent a powered wheelchair at destination rather than take my own, and only take mine to countries where that isn't possible.
I work in a guitar orchestra and we're having our international debut in Germany in about a month. We are about 20 musicians with guitars and all our gear and we'll be going by plane. While it's true that most countries in Europe have a very efficient and reliable train system, they aren't well connected internationally (mostly economic reasons and sometimes infrastructure and technical problems). The only international train from my city is a night train that only goes as far as München and we need to go to Frankfurt, so in a case like this it's better to fly, we can't just take the risk of missing a connection (night trains are notorious for never being on time). We also considered going by bus but it would take 18 hours and it would be extremely tedious and tiring
That same law also has an updated section for wheelchair users (like myself). Airlines have a similar attitude toward medical equipment that they do toward instruments. 'Course, if my wheelchair gets broken, I'd be left bed-bound or floor-bound, and lose my ability to live independently. This is why I do not fly, anymore (even though my dad was a commercial pilot), period. I just can't risk it.
Yeah exactly. Obviously this video is focusing on musician's problems, but it seems like if airline staff just gave a bit more of a shit in general, that would solve a lot of the issues.
I thought they're be more legislation to protect things like wheelchairs and medical equipment, it should be a crime to damage that sort of thing when flying. Could you not sue an airline because it's not just an "inconvience" at that point
When I worked in a deluxe hotel, one musician who was a regular guest had this travel trunk about the size of a small 'fridge. I asked him one day what it was. He opened it and there was a violin. It was on loan to him by a national bank. "What's all this other stuff inside"? Protection, humidifier, heater, cooler, and computerized control. He told me the violin was worth $250,000. It had it's own seat ticket, and never left his sight.
Reminds me of a concert violinist, flying in Australia, who was told they couldn't bring their violin on board because "it might be used as a weapon" She asked the flight attendant how much they thought it was worth. They were off by a factor of 100. She got to bring it onboard.
It was WAY easier in the 80s and 90s by comparison. Never had a bass in a gigbag refused as carry on then, even checked in a road case didn't get upcharged for oversize/overweight baggage (did this many times transcontinental - would cost a ton now). Even transporting double bass was often doable with a decent tip.
@David Price yeah, I was about to say, "shouldn't it have been easier prior to 2001 especially in US flights?" But A) I don't know how European flights compare before and after 2001, and B) I have only flown once on my lifetime, and not with my cello which would have been impossible to be a carry-on and a nightmare without a hard case
@@lycaonking4250 US flights back pre 9/11 were always easy with electric bass in a gig bag. Was never disallowed on domestic (or international) flights. Cello would have probably been tougher but they always seemed willing to help work it out. I know plenty of people who did double basses in hard cases by just tipping the luggage guys at the curb (a thing of the past) $20-$50 and they'd make sure it got on the flight safe. Those would have to be done air freight now for likely over $1K...
When I moved across the country, I just bought a new cello and left my old one with my parents. That way I can gig in both places and not worry about flying with it. Crazy that buying a brand new several-thousand-dollar instrument was best choice
It's a good solution... when the instrument you play is not completely unique and impossible to find. I play the Swedish nyckelharpa, a quite rare 4-rows one with extended keyboard. These cost a kidney and are all unique, basically you can't use the same finger patterns from one instrument to the other (it's like if you would have to play your gig on a 3/4 cello instead of your usual one). Just impossible for musicians in my case =( but I'm glad you found a good solution for yourself =)
I guess one could build an extension that while booking airplane tickets it gives you information about the size of overhead storage of whatever plane you're flying, and tell you what instrument can fit in there, which would also be able to collect and provide data about musicians traveling (at the least ones using the extension). That'd be one step into solving this madness maybe.
I don't know for a fact, but I suspect that part of the problem is that ordering a plane is probably like ordering a car and you can get options. I would not be surprised to find out that overhead bins on various models of planes are not standardized because commercial aircraft never just fly passengers, they also always flight cargo as supplemental income. Moreover, there isn't just a 737. There are four generations of 737 and multiple iterations within each generation. There are currently 10 different models under the main line of the 737 not accounting for the other spin offs. The first 737 flew in 1967 and they are still making 737s today.
Adam said in the video that airlines don't publish the sizes of overhead compartments. If there is anywhere to find this data, I'd like to see it; I think I'd be able to create an extension like you described.
I have obsessed so much about this topic as it’s one of the most stressful parts of my touring life. Feels good to hear the suffering is not just in my imagination.
"it takes a certain kind of bravery to travel with an upright bass" ...aaaand I shall quote you excessively on this 😂 I haven't taken one on a plane as of yet (only electric), but even riding the subway can be scary as hell
This was really eye-opening! I've been working as a ramp agent in the aviation industry for over 6 years (and have been a hack musician for much longer), so I always take extra care when handling musical instruments. One time I unloaded an acoustic guitar with no case and my heart sank. I prayed that it would get to Atlanta intact.
For domestic US flights, I've learned that you get a flare launcher and put it in your luggage. You then let them know that you're flying with a "pew-pew". Your baggage gets special treatment cause if an airline damages or loses a "pew-pew", well that's big trouble.
Deviant Ollam has given a couple of talks on this (including the tidbit about things that count as firearms but aren't Gun Guns) and it's always seemed like a really useful strategy. IIRC it also means you get to (or technically have to) lock your luggage with an actual lock that the airline folks aren't supposed to be able to open. I think "camera gear" or possibly "delicate electronics" were his go to "things to pack alongside your firearm for safety" examples, but instruments definitely seem like a useful application of this trick too.
That’s wild, cos almost everywhere else that means it can’t travel at all! The fact you even get to lock it with TSA proof locks is even wilder. A useful hack to be sure but the fact that it’s both possible and necessary are like… damn
It’s frankly insane how much Airlines are able to get away with that sound SUPER illegal. Imagine pulling up to McDonald’s only for the employee to break your phone, not give you your food that you paid for for hours, and then force you to stay in that McDonald’s for multiple days without compensation because they “don’t have to compensate you if it’s due to weather.” I booked a flight from Bozeman to Las Vegas a few months ago and they cancelled our flight without compensation due to “Unsafe winds in Las Vegas” Checking the wind speed in Vegas at the time, it was 4 miles an hour. The reality was the flight did not have enough crew, but if they admitted that then everyone booked would have been given compensation, which the airline does not want.
I love the way you're referencing other creators alongside news media. Feels a bit like citations, and in a good way where it really adds value and context to this video. Superb job on this.
Adam, Im a crewmember in a large US airline. Heres my advice... Pre-board at the very beginning of boarding for "people who need extra time". That'll give you an empty airplane... More importantly emptyish closets. Kindly ask the flight attendants if you can put it in the closet or if they have a better idea. NEVER CHECK IT! Search UA-cam for "united breaks guitars".
Hey, this might be a long shot but how about reaching out to one of the pilot/air travel UA-camrs to (1) just low-key spread the knowledge of the problem into the industry and hopefully (2) get another set of brains on why this happens and how to maaaybe go about solving it or work around it (more effectively)? Mentour Pilot sometimes does collabs and has a decent-sized audience, for example, and at least judging by his on-screen persona seems like a decent enough bloke.
Hey! Pilot here, great idea. But I will say that us pilots have next to no control over these types of shenanigans as we're often pretty busy doing our own preparations during the boarding process. This is why gate agents and cabin crew exist. We can't really help more than telling off our crew and that requires the issue to actually be brought to our attention. Most pilots won't really care either unfortunately. I wonder if there's any cool cabin crew UA-camrs out there. That being said, I'm sure peter from mentor pilot would be happy to chat about this.
Guitarist in Japan here. I got to tour in Europe for the first time in January. I flew with KLM, used the large size coffin case because I could fit all my gear in there and checked it in as my checked over-size luggage at no extra charge, but was always prepared for it to disappear. So, I put together a tour rig that entirely came out to less than $800 USD. Everyone else in the band used Mono, wrapped in clothes like you recommended. The priority boarding thing is a useful tip.
Surprising that no airline has considered a musician loyalty program that guarantees you a reasonable amount of overhead space for your instrument. Seems like you could turn simply following the law into a marketing opportunity to get more loyalty program members and edge out the competition for traveling musicians lol
Holy crap I would jump on a musician loyalty program so fast! Thankfully never been forced to put my viola in the cargo hold, but the pushback from some airline agents is so distressing
@@noahmay7708 As Adam pointed out in the video, we don't actually have statistics on how many musicians travel via airlines annually. But touring musicians travel as a huge part of their career, so I'd imagine whatever market is there is fairly lucrative with the sheer number of flights annually. Janek Gwizdala has done a podcast about flying as a musician and he's talked about loyalty programs and weighing options of airlines. I guarantee that whatever airline decides to stop treating instruments like trash will probably gain a lot of these pro (and hobbyist) musicians' business bc they do keep up with the perks and programs. It actually wouldn't take much to implement and the infrastructure is already there. Literally could just be an add-on feature to whatever generic loyalty program they have, where perhaps you get priority boarding and a print-out on your ticket that says you're part of the program and get to stow your instrument (under a reasonable size limit ofc) in an overhead compartment or closet. Literally just knowing that the instrument will for sure make it on the plane would be enough for me lol
@@polinanikulina I fail to see how this is a bribe tho. Most airline loyalty programs are free to join and most professional musicians I've heard talk about this issue are actually already enrolled in them. However, promising to give musicians their due overhead space for being members of such a program would be an enticing offer when the alternative is what everyone else does - treat instruments like trash and musicians like jerks for trying to bring them onboard. Getting miles and perks in the process of avoiding the frustration of an unexpected gate check sounds like a good deal to me.
It's part of the never ending stereotype that being a musician is is not viable employment. I committed to checking my bass in a hard case and so far all has been well. I don't travel as much as y'all do though. Thanks for this video.
The part of this that absolutely infuriates me is while there's so much scrutiny and push-back on musicians bringing their instruments on board, golf club bags are regularly either allowed as carry on, or checked into the pilot's chest (closet) without any push-back whatsoever. I'm not a golfer, and I understand that golfers should be able to bring their equipment as well, but especially since a standard golf bag is so similar in size to many instrument bags, it's a double standard that's absolute garbage!!
I hate to give away my travel secrets, but one thing we used to do it shrink-wrap the guitar and bass cases together (In Europe they used to have kiosks where they would do it for a fee). The guitars were already considered oversize, and this would make it cheaper as they would be counted as 1 bag, and the extra mass would mean they wouldn't get thrown around as much be overall sturdier against getting banged around. The other thing we used to do to save on extra fees by the pound was find a spot in the airport and take out our instruments to make the bags lighter. Have one band member wait with all the instruments. Then we'd check the bags, measure the weight, and they'd ask us to drop them in the oversize area. Before dropping them in that oversize area, we'd go and put the instruments back in the bags. Now that I'm explaining it, I can't believe we ever did that! But we did it for almost every European flight! I've had my guitar (a Ric 350) lost once by an airline. They eventually found it and delivered it to my door 2 weeks later. Luckily this was at the end of a tour, so I didn't need it for gigs. There were several times that our instruments were delayed, and we didn't have them to perform. We've had to borrow instruments, or figure out another way to entertain people. Once flying to Rome for the biggest $$ paid gig, British Air didn't get our insts on the flight. Luckily we had a laptop and we were able to throw together an all-electronic karaoke-style set and still play! We just got on stage and were honest with our fans and they were great about it. We even had an "F-British Air" interlude full singalong! I don't tour anymore, last one was Japan in 2016. But honestly I can't believe we put up with that stress almost every day while playing in Europe. I still get anxious thinking about it.
Great stories but lying about weight on a plane can be dangerous and I would heavily advise against it. Fuel is set for the plane for it's checked weight and while normally they will add extra, at times this may not happen
@@chameleonedm I would never do these things today. I meant it more of an example of how absurd it was, and the lengths we went to to be able to afford to tour!
@@erikbrodin2198 Which idea? Our bags weren't always opened, especially for intra-europe flights. The problem with renting is that we'd have to do that every night! We almost always rented backline amps and drums. But even still, they often wouldn't rent out cymbals. Guitars are more problematic, because our instruments were unique and customized.
I would definitely suggest looking at train options when touring. Especially in most of the EU and parts of Asia, trains are great for convenience, cost and, importantly, space for carrying instruments! Obviously, a flight is sometimes the only option, but if for example you're doing Amsterdam -> Antwerp -> Lyon -> Vienna -> Milan -> Rome, trains definitely are an option.
As a bassist currently on my first international tour (just got off the stage in kyoto, japan) this video hit home. I ended up borrowing a bass locally for this tour because I was so worried about flying with my own, but that's not ideal and isnt feasible in many situations. Adam, I enjoy all your videos but especially appreciate when you get political, like here and in your video on copyright. Probably nobody in charge is watching, but if enough people become aware of theses issues, maybe change is possible. Keep fighting the good fight!
Crew here, hiding it in a garments bag is genius lol. Gate agents are the Ops, it would help you sneak it past them if they’re strict. Also if you have to check it in, you can buy ‘I
I was flying few times long haul between Europe and USA. So now we can confirm that delta is great in both cases. Adam, new video please: Horror of moving instruments from one point to another solved - Delta! 😁
I feel like this story is just another piece of a puzzle that I feel shows in general that there's a lot of appreciation for art (or, more accurately, "content") but no appreciation (maybe even contempt) for artists themselves or the work that goes into it.
Still not over the fact that when i travelled with the guitar i built during covid & booked a seat for it, it would NOT let me fly unless I uploaded a covid test *for my guitar*. Like, I could not check in without it. I ended up uploading a pdf with a picture of it and the note "Hello. My guitar is a guitar. She is made from wood and cannot have the coronavirus as it is a people virus and she is wood and metal parts with some plastic. Thank U"
Adam, for some reason I'm finding it difficult to find an article again, but I recently ran across one explaining that some airliners are now stashing guitars, basses, and other similar-sized instruments in the extra space around the landing gear. That means the instruments experience even more extreme conditions than inside the baggage hold.
this seems stupid. logistically, technically and safety-wise it would be a hassle and a half. and for what? space is almost never a defining factor inside a cargo hold, it's the weight that counts.
Thanks for the video. I've been in these situations hundreds of times, as both a performer, and a guitar tech. I once had to do a 2 week Australian festival tour with my backup guitar, as Qantas lost half the band's equipment on the way over. My main guitar finally showed up on the last day, with a broken headstock. One option that wasn't mentioned is working with a logistics company that specializes in music gear, like Global Motion. If you have many pieces to check, and enough lead time, they will make sure the gear arrives safely and on time. I would mostly recommend the custom ATA flight case option, with the downside being there's a chance of lost baggage. But if the alternative is gate checking a gig bag, for me the pros outweigh the cons for overseas and one-off travel. If the group is flying daily with instruments, this can obviously get a bit unreasonable, logistically. For tours with daily flights, I will tend to backline as much as possible. I've even backlined guitars and pedals on radio promo tours. If you are a virtuoso with an intimate connection to your instrument, this will not work for you. I would even go so far as to rejig the schedule to allow for ground travel, if it's at all feasible. It all comes down to how tight your margins are. Ultimately, though, if you need to take a priceless instrument on weeks of daily flights for tour, as in your case, it will always be an uphill battle, until something changes. It is unfair. It is bullshit. And, sometimes, it is beyond our control. Keep going anyway!! Much love
Thanks, Adam! I've been flying with musical instruments since about 1990, and it's an ever-changing challenge. Everything you say here is current, relevant, and a best practice. I've learned to scan the waiting area and tag-team with other musicians - sometimes collaboratively filling an overhead compartment with 3-4 violins & violas. That way, we'te good stewards of the space, and we prevent heavier items from being put on top of our instruments. In recent years, I've had great experiences with Delta- an AFM boycott in the mid 2000's helped to change the way they had been treating musicians. It's a flight by flight journey, though, and these tips, plus courtesy go a long way. Thanks so much.
One of the craziest things I’ve encountered recently is calling the airline helpline only to get conflicting answers… over the same call. And I’ve had crew tell me there was no space only for me to try it and see it actually fits. Traveling with my guitar makes me so anxious because of the unpredictability of the whole situation. Last summer, when I saw the Julian Lage post you mentioned, I followed his tip and put screw inserts into the neck of both my teles. It’s IMO the best method for guitars with bolt on necks, because you only have to replace the strings between each flight and carry a screwdriver. The neck is still longer than the dimensions allowed by some airlines, but it’s way more inconspicuous than trying to hide the guitar at check in 😂
Where did you obtain the screw inserts? Any specific size? This seems like it makes good sense and especially for a tele where you don't need a degree in physics to see how it fits together.
@@aliensporebomb I got 4mm alloys for one tele and 5.5mm steel for another, cause both were with different techs... Just make sure you get a matching set and that it's not bigger than 5.5-6mm because you need wood to still be there at the sides. I'm mentioning the screw sizes btw, the insert sizes should match automatically! I would recommend you get 5mm stainless steel if you can, preferably with an allen wrench head instead of a screwdriver head. That's the perfect size + strength and it's more convenient than even carrying a screedriver! Try to avoid brass and even alloy inserts. One of my alloy inserts broke during installation.
Screw inserts are available at hardware stores. But given the cost of getting it wrong, it seems well worth having a luthier do for you. They work with wood all the time, and can advise on how much wood can be removed and still leave a structurally sound joint. It seems silly that removable necks aren't designed this way to begin with: connections need to be rated for more than a few dozen cycles if they're really "removable!”
I have a lot to say about this, but I'll be brief: 1. I live in Hawaii - so we have to travel by plane - all the time, even to outer islands. 2. For many years, I traveled with a 26-string harp (7lbs), or a handpan (15lbs). Never both at the same time. 3. Always, always, ALWAYS BE NICE to all airline personnel - they are all very stressed. Smile a lot. 4. Don't present them with two problems - your instrument and a a) flapping chicken; b) Aunt Petunia's Angel Food cake in a special box; c) some other obnoxious thing that needs special treatment. 5. For me, since it's a harp, I let the flight crew know what it is, and I offer to play for everyone if there's a delay. Maybe harps are special - flight attendants do not see them every day. Flight attendants are enchanted by the harp. 6. If you score an overhead bin, hopefully you can sit across the aisle and monitor the bin while people are boarding - offer to help people fit their luggage into the bin - be active and courteous, and when the bin is full, close the lid to discourage others from considering the bin. 7. Consider flying First - the cost is not all that much more, and you have more leeway. 8. 90% of the time, I get the green light for the First/Crew Closet - like Adam said, it frees up the overhead. 9. If you had a good experience AND have CDs of your work, give the flight attendants a copy. 10. What do I do now? I have a travelin' cat now, so no more instruments can come with me. Two things - I stash two harps and two handpans on the US Mainland and leave them with friends OR I send them by mail - do NOT buy the USPS insurance - I did not have an incident with an instrument but I insured something else, and it never made it, and six months later I got $40 from the insurance, and the replacement cost would have been $500. Instead, insure them with an insurance company that will cover postal shipments. Very small cost, but they'll replace your instrument if damaged. I could go on, but that's the gist of it.
You think the cost of flying first class is “not that much more”? I’m in California, and it’s literally an order of magnitude more expensive to fly first class to the East Coast.
All valid points, except number 3. I'll be exactly as nice to them as they are to me. Travelling is honestly more stressful for people using the airline than for people working there, personnel just get to make up rules to fuck over travelers just because they THINK their boss might be a little mad. Everyone's job sucks, no need to take that out on travelers.
@@25bever You can have whatever beliefs you want about what their job is like, but do you think that being rude to someone who is being rude to you makes them more or less likely to help you out? De-escalation can work wonders.
@@jasonbonifacio2473 Yes, the airlines change the game all the time. Best to check fares in advance. Coach seats from HNL to San Francisco were 386 One Way - 445 First class with lie flats....but fares come and go.
I've traveled with a Little Martin (about 3/4 size) set up to play lap style. Like the bass or any guitar it takes up more than one space and if someone isn't paying attention they will try to jam their suitcase in right where the neck of the guitar is. So that means (1) I watch the space like a hawk and stop someone who is trying to do that and (2) if I see somebody with a duffel I ask them to put it against the neck of my guitar both to signify that the space is taken and give my guitar some padding. Nonetheless I find it stressful to travel with the guitar. And always assume that one day it's going to be broken. I'm not a touring musician like Adam but I really miss playing if I don't have it with me.
Flying with regular baggage is already torture, I can't even begin to imagine how horrible it is to transport a fragile instrument. Thank you musicians for sacrificing your sanity for the rest of us.
As someone who consistently flies with a 76 key arranger keyboard in a flight case, which is always overweight and never costs me anything less than $150 extra to fly with, I felt this video.. thanks for making a video on a unexplored topic that all of us musicians who travel deal with constantly!
Man I wish this video came out two days ago, I flew southwest from Arizona to New York and both times they forced me and my band mates to check our instruments. And we would just watch out the windows as the baggage crew on the ground would throw our trombones tenors and bari sax ON THE GROUND!!! With no regard to how much these things cost. And they even broke one of our tenors as well 😭
i used to think gate checking was a decently safe option until i remembered when john b. williams gave a talk at my high school. he mentioned that once he was on a domestic flight and had to gate check his double bass and when they tossed it in he could already tell the neck was damaged. when he got it back it was unplayable so he had to borrow a student’s bass from a school nearby the venue. i could also be completely misremembering this anecdote though lol
I've traveled with brass instruments quite a bit and thankfully I've only had one issue where the bell of my bass trombone got bent, but thankfully it was cosmetic. On the other hand just before I joined, a brass band I play with flew to Norway for a week and nearly all of their checked luggage was lost along the way leaving them to have to borrow instruments. For one of the trombone players he flew out of LA, spent that week in Norway and when he returned home he learned that his trombone, which never made it to Norway was in San Francisco.
I know that readers from the States are going to find this perhaps a bit too commy, but the saddest thing for me is that this problem, and a lot of others, all boil down to stressed workers fighting stressed workers while every middle man takes the lion's share home
@@cnking27 capitalism is broken. it's a terrible system that needs to be replaced. but the propaganda is so strong, and the corporate interests so powerful, that we're likely stuck with it until society inevitably collapses in a cpl hundred years
also, the middlemen aren't taking the lion's share, that goes to the people who own the airlines and the executives, investors, banks etc etc. but i suppose u could describe banks as "middlemen"
I was roadie back in the 60's-70's and flew a lot and can't imagine touring today. Back in my day I few gear as baggage all the time and with some small groups not even in flight cases. One band who guitar player is now famous he would take his Fender Deluxe stuff a hotel pillow in the back to protect the speaker and just put a slipcover on and flew it like that in luggage never a problem. Another group the artist was a Hammond B3 player and had a chopped B3 that weight about 200 pounds in it's flight case, with generous tipping of skycaps I flew that thing as luggage. Another band I had a flightcase made that held all the bands guitars and bass. It was made to fit the dimensions of standard baggage chute with wheels and handles all over. I flew it as luggage and it scared a lot tourists seeing that huge case come down the luggage chute onto the baggage carousel. Sometimes with something like Jazz guitar you don't want them in the freezing cargo hold you could request gate check-in and your guitar be hard loaded. What the airline did was hand load the guitar into the cargo area where they put pets and other fragile things. That had air, not a cold, and usually guitar was handled safely. My one suggestion then and now when flying gear is use flight cases is to put lots of handles and wheel on the case. Those baggage handler have terrible job with airline pushing and pushing them to go faster. Well if you gear is easy to handle they will teat it nicer. if it is a pain to lift and move it will be treated like crap. I feel for all you road dogs today touring is a lot of struggle.
This is the US no one takes trains for business travel they aren't even used that much for vacation travel. The US rail system has never been like that in the rest of the world.
@@DojoOfCool No, it has been, it just isn't anymore because the railways were never nationalized. But in the Northeast, Illinois, and California it's decent enough that they absolutely are taken for business travel.
Touring keyboardist here. AA broke my ATA case and keyboard (Nord Stage 3) 3 weeks ago, and according to the Montreal Convention, they cannot pay more than 1731 dollars. They busted the Nord so bad that it will cost 2000 dollars to fix it. As you said.. it’s like a Russian roulette..
I'm only travelling with a fiddle, which is obviously less of a challenge than a guitar. But I always write to the airline customer service team and ask them to confirm in writing that I can carry it in the cabin on that specific flight. I'll quote their policy in my request. I print out a hard copy, arrive early for checking, and arrange early boarding. It's always worked so far.
I go through the same kind of thought processes when I travel with camera gear. I had a rare film camera in a bag that I was forced to gate check, and now it's permanently damaged (though thankfully still usable). I carry that thing in my lap now if I'm going anywhere.
My brother hides all his (very) expensive lenses and the body around a multi-pocketed jacket. Me, I stopped using even compact mirrorless bodies and have taken the drone+RX100+iPhone option for my travel photography. Clothes in the carry-on keep things cosy. Miss a few shots, but I'm not getting paid so I'm chill.
I am one of those guys that detaches my guitar's neck and body and fit everything in my backpack. The few strategies I have learnt throughout my gigging experiences are: 1) Fly ANA, they will literally ask if they could test and see if your guitar fits in the overhead cabin, otherwise, they would offer to put your guitar in the business class garment closet. 2) Get a strandberg, they fit in overhead cabins easily.
ANA offered me preboarding with a softcase acoustic on a trip from Japan. Westjet made me gate check a gibson sg in a mono case on the other hand. Stressful flight.
Great video as always! I can share a bit of insight in the points you mention briefly regarding insurance (I work in insurance as a trainee actuary although I don’t have expertise in anything to do with instrument insurance. Also I fully appreciate that this isn’t the main point of the vid and doesn’t really change anything, this is more for extended reading if anyone is interested!) In order to price an insurance policy you need to know two main things: 1. how much will claims cost? 2. how often will they occur? The first question is easy since it’s the value of the instrument. The second is of course much harder. The obvious approach is to try to work out what causes claims, such as damage/loss in flights, but in reality this as mentioned is extremely hard to get data for and calculate. Instead what I suspect is done is that all the policies are grouped by for example “instruments which stay in one place” / “international cover” / “national cover” / etc. Then the insurer will just look at what frequency policies claim in each group, and voila you’ve got your number! In other words, they will look at past claims frequency and unless there is a notable new risk, assume that future claim rates will be similar so can use this to price the policy. No guessing about how often people fly with instruments or anything like that needed.
Many “airline” staff in airports aren’t employed by the airline. Even though they may wear the airline’s uniform, they are often employed by a specialised airport labour hire company like ‘Swissport’. This is especially true for smaller airlines and for larger ones at smaller airports. I don’t know how this affects things exactly, but it could be that the service agent isn’t overly familiar with the airlines policy.
This stuff would stop me touring. I'd honestly rather rent an instrument where I'm going that have to go through this. Nothing worse than having your pride and joy damaged only to have the airline and insurance company all just shrug their shoulders and blame you.
Yeah, same. Leaving my instrument at home and renting something locally was my first thought after seeing all this madness of taking it around on airplanes.
I was worried about putting my guitar in the cargo hold but everyone I was flying with told me it would be fine. "It's not gonna break" or "They'll be careful with it". Well, we got to our destination and lo and behold my guitar neck snapped. Fuck the airport!
We flew Delta to Ecuador with our instruments. We had no problems with our guitars in the overheads until our last flight from Atlanta to Richmond where the gate agent demanded that we gate check our instruments and placed a special tag on my instrument denoting it was to be gate checked. As I was about to board, a flight attendant saw the tag and warned me that the tag was going to cause my bass in a gig bag to go through the entire baggage system. He said there was no way that he would allow me to risk damage to my very expensive instrument and tore the tag off and waved me onto the plane with my bass. Thanks, dude.
100%. Be as polite as humanly possible for as long as humanly possible, use a bulky soft case with sufficient padding so you can gate check without getting depressed (if you're touring a lot by plane you will have to and you know it), and hope for the best. I'll be over next week for a Greek Pop/folk tour, a few domestic flights involved, will let you know how it went. Struggle is real.
This is one reason that I’m terrified of travelling with an instrument. The idea of my instruments being destroyed during transit and being stuck upon arrival sends shivers down my spine.
Train travel does work better around here than across the pond (a low bar to be fair), but from personal experience trekking back and forth across Europe (without musical instruments) it can very easily mean a long overnight sleeper trip instead of a
From the gig vlogs, they definitely prefer to travel by train. But London to Madrid or Stockholm to Amsterdam will take you the better part of a day which you might not be able to fit into the schedule. And in the summer trains that don't have compulsory seat reservation can get pretty crammed so there can be a bit of a risk of having to travel with the instrument on your lap for hours.
I've done trips around Europe via train - not so much with instruments, but just as a tourist. If I had the choice, I'd take the chance of having my guitar in the back of a plane rather than planning a tour via train. Trains work completely different in each European country. There is a learning curve with this, it's not just like an airport that works the same anywhere on Earth. Especially in the South, you will have trouble finding anyone working at a train station speaking English if there ever is a problem. In countries such as Germany (which maybe has the worst trains in all of "Western" Europe, but it connects so many countries together), you will face insane delays, cancellations, sprints to the next train before it leaves, missing wagons which should've been your seat reservations and overcrowded cabins on which I wouldn't want to transport a drum set, heavy guitar amps and stuff like that. This may be an option for someone who knows Europe very well and has a high tolerance for suffering or only needs to travel the most comfortable, well established lines, but I can't imagine a band from the US on a tight schedule being able to reliably do that. Look at the trips they're taking in the video, that by train just doesn't seem to work
@@narnigrin The price is also high often higher than flying if you have to take multiple trains. It may seem counter intuitive but I have flown from Budapest to London for 18 euros: 9 for me and 9 for my guitar (yes 9 euros a ticket) and that was only a few years ago. Obviously that's ridiculously cheap but companies like Ryanair frequently have flights for under 25 euros a ticket around Europe. Good luck taking a train from one side of France to the other or from London to Edinburgh for that price. That's to say nothing of taking Eurostar.
@@TheKlaun9 I find it interesting that you find German trains the worst, as someone who has travelled in the Netherlands and UK myself but not much in Germany, what makes them worse?
Adam, your advice worked! I went up to the gate waiting to open, and asked to have early boarding and they kindly took my bass and stored it in a closet before anyone boarded! It was a long distance international flight!
Pre-boarding is the key here. Having status can help, but being friendly will go a long way. I've had FAs offer the coat closet before I could even ask
Back in high school, my youth orchestra (from the US) went on tour to France and England. Our strategy was violins, violas, trumpets, French horns, saxophone, and maybe (don’t remember) trombones and bassoons take instruments as their carry on, flute/piccolo, clarinet, and oboe pack them in their checked luggage, and cello/bass brought their bows and instruments were rented for them through the community music school we were exchanging with. It was a whole messy system but it worked, I think mainly because a lot of the carry on instruments don’t necessarily look like instruments on first glance to the untrained eye.
Get yourself a sturdy Peli Case and just check your guitar/bass. I've taken my guitar on tours and flown across the pond so many times and the only time I had an issue was that my baggage got delayed during the crazy summer of 2021 after COVID when every single airport on earth was backed up. Also, make sure you put straps around your case to avoid customs messing with your stuff. I realised that half the time they don't even bother opening the case because they're legally required to put the straps back how they were.
Flew from Sweden to Canada with a marching band in 2009 with all our instruments checked. The ground crew smashed 4 french horns worth $5000 a piece as well as a lyra worth about $2500. Oops...!
@@Hourstone They just don't care. Ground crew's job is just to get things on and off the plane on time. I'd wager they're not even instructed on safe handling for fragile items, let alone watched over to make sure they're following those steps - they're just random employees, so it's basically impossible for any broken item to be traced back to them specifically once it's been down the line. That's how you end up with thousands of dollars worth of damaged instruments - there's no consequences for the people who break them and plenty of reason to not handle them carefully. If the plane can't leave on time because you were being too careful loading in the cargo, that will get someone to come down and fire you, but a broken guitar is customer service's problem somewhere down the line.
Thank you so much for this video, I was truly considering checked my guitar, but by the video, there are no guarantee that my guitar will be safe. So I’ll carry with me and pray to every step of your video works for me as well, thank you so much for clarifying everything 🙏🏻
As a touring and traveling musician-it's wonderfully fantastic to see this extremely important video out there, Adam. Thank you. I recently purchased a new bassoon-partially because it breaks down into a case with smaller dimensions than my previous one. All to avoid detection as a 'musician' traveling with 'musical instruments'. It's so amazing that most travelers put everything on as hand baggage because they don't want to have to wait at baggage-yet us musicians who really need that space aren't allowed to carry on the tools of our trade. The strategies are so important: look into how much time between flights on a multi-flight trip and all the rest you mention about plane overhead space sizes and airline ratings. I often go up to the counter and say "I need a little extra time to get down the runway' and I'm offered that so I can go on near the head of the line. It helps that I'm older and not a young pup who looks perfectly healthy and therefore doesn't 'need extra time'. Traveling as a working musician has gotten tougher and tougher. No romance left to traveling as a musician-the 2 hours on stage ends up as the reward for all of this.
@@zivkovicableit’s an unfortunate reality that strict and unfair working conditions make people horrible at their job when they could very well be better if given the space to be better 🫤
Can confirm that touring with woodwinds is just as much of a problem. Probably like 70% of the time there’s no issue, but the alarmingly common 30% of the time where there is an issue is scary as heck. “We’re going to need you to check one of your bags at the gate.” “Well, you can have my backpack with my electronics, books, and sheet music, then.” “I don’t know, that other bag looks pretty bag. Will it fit under the seat in front of you?” “I’ll make it fit-my $9000 oboe, $7000 backup oboe, and $4000 clarinet [thank god I don’t have to worry about that one cracking in cold theaters] that I need to have functioning the day after I arrive are under NO circumstances leaving my sight.” And don’t even get me started on when there are weight limits to your carry-on baggage…
Under the deception category... 😅 On top of being very avoidant with the gate agent about your instrument, if they tell you you're going to have to gate check it, this often means they give you a gate slip. My advice is to just graciously take it and when you're out of view put it in your pocket, similarly to what Adam says about saying you want to take it to the gate. This will diffuse the situation and put you one step closer to getting your instrument in an overhead. In my experience I've never been stopped after the gate agent with my instrument so long as there's been room. You also essentially get a re-roll on the person keeping you from flying with your instrument safely. 🤣 I've had some gate agents single me out and be pretty mean to me. I'm 3-0 on gate agents telling me my instrument won't fit in an overhead. I've had them suggest "options" for me to fly with my instrument only to tell me it's too late. 😔
Last time i was at LaGuardia I spent like thirty minutes waiting for them to get to my bag at TSA because they couldn’t figure out if a trombone stand was dangerous
Having flown around the globe with a bass, I feel this. Steve Bailey told me a long time ago that you are always within your rights to ask to speak to the captain if it pertains to your overall flight experience. He was right. I got stopped about a gate check, and politely asked if I could speak with the captain about it. The flight attendant quickly changed her tune and said “I think I actually might have some room in our coat closet” (and she did). If I’m flying domestically, in the past, Southwest has been great by offering the Early Bird discount - a small fee (maybe $25 last time I did it) to board the plane early, and since there are no assigned seats, it mitigates the risk of anyone complaining about having my bass in “their” overhead compartment. Keep fighting the good fight, everyone 😅
11:05 pro tip for small instrument owners, even if you have a thin enough bass or guitar case, you can fit it in the first class coat closet. Almost no one actually uses these anymore since no one is wearing an overcoat anymore.
I carry on a backpack, pelican air, and trumpet with the combination strat. You only technically get 2 carry on pieces. I use a carabiner to clip on my gig bag to the backpack side by side and slide by the gate check every time. 100's of flights... Thanks for making this video. This is important info!
Flew with my bass many times for ship gigs. Had a pro bolt-on neck set -up. Took the neck off, packed it in with body in a softshell, folded the softshell case in half with a strap around it. NEVER A PROBLEM!! Used a laptop bag for other stuff. NEVER TAKE A PRIZED GUITAR/BASS WITH YOU!
I have so much to say here... this video is such a good encapsulation of what we go through. Adam, we've never met but you saved my friend Jeremy in India at the Jaipur Jazz Festival when half his band couldn't get into the country. I was there too, with saxophonist Kirk MacDonald, but didn't see you... we were travelling in India, and I was sticking to my main approach which has been set for years... smallest possible cymbal bag-- Jimmy Cobb style 20/18/14, smallest carry-on suitcase... just enough for one suit, pair of shoes, a couple of shirts, and some casual clothes. It's so ridiculously barebones, but I arrive to every gig with every single thing I need. I pack a duffel that folds into itself into my suitcase so I can have a bit more flexibility if there's van travel or whatever between cities. I wear the cymbal bag like a backpack, it's my "personal item". It's way too big to be my personal item, but nobody ever knows its there, because it's on my back like every other backpack in the airport. If there's some kind of announcement like "we will be boarding families with small children, then wheelchair passengers, then anybody who needs a bit more time" I'm all over that... I need a bit more time, can I pre-board, etc? Yes to all of that. On super full flights at the height of summer festival season, I have muscled into first class lines and played dumb when handing over my ticket just to get on the plane first. I put my suitcase up, stack the cymbals on top... takes up no more cubic space than any other personal item, it's just wide and flat. I've had more trouble with security than with airline staff, really. They always want to see the retractable brushes, and I've gotten into some slightly heated situations when they clank my shit around like it's nothing. I usually say "you wouldn't treat a bag of golf clubs like that." I did buy an SKB cymbal safe recently, and used it for the first time and checked my cymbals for a cross-country flight. That was a mixed bag. It made the trip, it was Apple tagged, but it took forever to get on both ends of the flight. Flying back to Toronto on a late flight that arrived at 11:45pm local time... I wasn't home until 2 am and that kind of sucked compared to my usual routine of sailing straight into a cab with my carry-on-only setup. I'm not keen to check my cymbals, generally, I think playing smaller cymbals while on the road and carrying them on is advantageous. I don't travel with 22" cymbals anymore, ever.
Flown with my tuba once. Absolute nightmare having to check it in as "bulky luggage" which costs twice as much as a regular seat, only to still have it get manhandled and violently thrown into the cargo hold. World's foremost tuba soloist, Øystein Baadsvik, went so far as to request a special model from the instrument makers that could detach the bell and fold in the valves to make it fit into a regular suitcase, just to avoid these ridiculous regulations. I'll also mention jazz/funk trombonist Nils Landgren, who always travels with his trombone in a viola case, because for some reason, most airlines have a policy to allow string instruments in the cabin but not brass instruments. Absolutely wild that us musicians have to jump through these ridiculous hoops just to be able to safely travel with one extra bag.
I've flown International (USA to Ireland) a few times carrying a bass in a gig bag, luckily Ive never had any issues. The 1st time after buying a bass in NY I was in JFK going home and the lady at the check in desk looked at the gig bag on my back and "They won't let you carry that on, it's too big!" and I just replied "But I brought it over with me and nobody said anything to me!" and she just replied "Oh that's fine so go ahead!" 😂 Another time when the overhead bins were full the flight attendant offered to put it in their closet for me which was great! The main trick I use (which I saw Victor Wooten say) is to carry the gig bag by my side with the headstock pointing back as it almost looks like a laptop case when viewed from the front then! 👍🏼
I once missed a flight because my bass took too long to show up on the oversized luggage conveyer belt. Senior year of my undergrad, flying into Chicago from Frankfurt after having spent two weeks in the Baltic states. We had less than 90 minutes to get off the plane, go through customs, pickup our luggage, and board the last flight back to our home city -_- I ended up having to stay with one of the professors at a hotel for the night, and fly out the next day.
As a contrabassoonist, I flew once with an extra seat. Even though everything went smoothly, it was stressful enough knowing that I was subject to the whims of the flight crews that I have never repeated the process. Now, I just drive.
My sweetheart and I went to Denmark a few weeks ago, and he brought his guitar. I was advised not to let him, but he had a hard case, so I thought it’d be fine. Delta was thankfully very kind to it, but once we got on a connecting flight to Denmark via KLM, the guitar didn’t arrive with us, but came in the following day, the case having been beat to hell, and seemingly pried open on one side. They couldn’t get it open all the way because the case locked with a key. The guitar, miraculously, survived, even without packing clothes in the case. (Didn’t know about that one beforehand) I’ll see about using these strategies next time. Granted, neither of us are touring musicians, but since my sweetheart is a lefty, and we weren’t going somewhere flush with music stores, that was the only way he was going to get to play anything.
@@LittleDogTobi They told me to contact a completely different company for some reason. I was supposed to contact the airline directly about it, and learned that way too late.
When I was flying a lot I would use my Modulus. Problem solved. You can drive a truck over a Modulus and the neck will never warp.Also the backpack style gig bags look a lot less obvious when you put them on with the neck pointing down.
I recently flew to Florida and my pocket trumpet is considered a carry on for jetblue so I never have a problem! Hopefully your next journey with your bass will go well!
A tip I was given but have yet to have occasion to use is to carry your gig bag on your back upside-down! The logic behind it is since it's not sticking up in the air it's less visible and less prone to bring attention.
Any bass or guitar player who flies a lot should check out Klos instruments. They're designed for air travel with the detachable neck (threaded neck screws and a low profile headstock), and they sound excellent. Definitely worth a look if this is something you deal with often.
I use the SKB bass safe which my kiesel soft case fits perfectly. It has a TSA lock. I've flown 4 times cross country, that's 8 flight changes and my $2700 Kiesel came through perfectly
I’m a flight attendant and this was really interesting to see. Good points about being nice to staff, usually that works best. Hopefully you will continue having positive experiences while travelling with instruments and I wish more airline staff would see this video tbh. Good luck! :)
From the reddit answers you got it sounds a lot like there’s a lot of misunderstanding among flight attendants. “Don’t take your guitar” is a bit shocking. More awareness is needed
I play the Shamisen, it's a japanese string instrument for those who didn't know. Most Shamisen these days have something called "mitsuori", meaning the long neck of the instrument is in three pieces that are really easy to take apart and reconnect, this makes it really easy to travel with. My case wasn't as lucky though, since it was large enough to have to be checked as "bulky luggage", it was probably thrown around a lot since it was really damaged when I got it back. Best of luck to anyone traveling with their instrument!
I used to work with the keyboard tech from a fairly large British band from the 80s (not name-dropping here). He said that (at the time) he had a huge amount of success touring the keybaords in the their original cardboard boxes. A flightcase looks sturdy so gets chucked around (with the results that you showed), but a slightly battered cardboard box, held together with tape and bearing the manufacturer's name and a picture of the contents gets treated a little more gently.
I don't fly but I take a lot of trains with bicycles. Somehow most train companies in Europe are really trying hard to make it difficult to travel by train with a bicycle. Or anything else than a small suitcase really.
Since many of the same kinds of rolling stock are used across the continent, I wonder if that is for the same reason as the UK... Where you have to prebook to carry a non-folding bike as the same space is used for that as one of the train's wheelchair spaces. I recently took a trip as a wheelcahir user and found the space opposite where I was sat was occupied by a bike. Tbh, it's a shame they got rid of the guard carriage on trains, most of which was empty space for carrying things like bikes...
I bought a small classical guitar in Denmark. I brought it on the two flights it took to get back to the US and the thing that saved me was being polite to flight attendants who were already super kind. Guitar made it safely back to the US!
The real problem is the rough treatment of luggage and how often luggage is lost, it’s unacceptable, airlines need to be seriously held responsible for damaging and/or losing luggage. It’s actually ridiculous how bad it is. Really it should be safe to put it in a fly case and check it.
True.. What the hell even is their job, when they cannot put something, where it belongs. There are some industries, where nobody seems to care about actually doing the work, they are paid for. Imagine, paying like 400 bucks for a Madonna concert and she comes on, sits in a chair, reading todays newspaper and then leaving again. Well, that's how some industries work. Food is another one. But flights are crazy. Especially with luggage handling.
My wife flew Israel -> Boston a couple years back and they straight up didn't even put the luggage on the plane. It took months for it to arrive back at our apartment, and it looked like it was put through some serious beatings. That's the worst I've ever seen, but even just me regularly flying with a single bag they're always trying to get me to stow it under the plane. I will never trust an airline enough to do that unless I don't have another option.
The reality is if there was that real kind of liability for airlines, tickets for everyone would go way up.
@@wohfab Yeah, well having someone onstage miming to tracks is that part of the music industry.
Air travel in general is a plague
I didn’t expect to relate to this so hard, but this is exactly what it’s like travelling with a wheelchair too! So take your analogy about people being legally empowered to accidentally break your phone to travel, except it’s your legs 😬
BTW great gig in Glasgow 👍
yyyeeeeeeeeeee!
that's awful. ugh.
never thought about that :o
What kind of dick would intentionally make it hard for people with disability to board a plane
😮
The downside of playing piano/harp: I can't bring my own with me.
The upside of playing piano/harp: I'm not expected to bring my own with me.
lol not on a plane at least. Having to bring my keyboard to the gig is such a drag lol
Only if you are not Krystian Zimerman.
Few months back I toured Japan and I was amazed how courteous their attendants (well in my case was ANA flight crews) in assisting me over my bulky 5 strings Jazz. Even for an economy domestic flight, they provided a "soft box" to put the instrument in to check in, in a way to let the baggage handlers know that it needed to be handled delicately. Best part? They brought my instrument on a trolley and have them parked at the cargo conveyor upon arrival.
Made the whole trip to Japan a breeze.
im going to be touring with a college wind orchestra in japan next year, and this gave me hope that the flying experience will be ok
@@atlassolid5946 Should be. Most of the time they didn't even bother to ask further once you told the attendants it's musical instruments.
@@fairuzhussaini7301 that, and our director has been doing this every 4 years with the orchestra, so i assume he's got it down to a science at this point
You took it on a flight without a case? So they gave you a box?
What the fuck are “touring musicians” spending your money on???!
Imagine being Krystian Zimerman, one of the greatest living pianists, who used to fly with his own personal grand piano, before goons at JFK airport confiscated it and destroyed it because “the glue smelled funny.”
My bass teacher recently moved and he and his wife had their cars transported as well. Nothing protects an upright bass (or most any other instrument) like a locked car. Of course it helped that it was spring-like weather on the cooler side.
That really really sucks, but why would you transport such an instrument on a plane? I would actually really like to know how they did it actually.
@@noahmay7708 you can transport pretty much anything on a plane, including other planes. As for the specifics of a grand piano: I imagine a really big wooden box, I'd probably mount it in a frame with some kind of suspension just to take the edge off those hard landings and turbulence.
@@Milamberinx Every hard hit plays its own cartoonish sound effect, that's actually hilarious.
That's so upsetting. As a musician your instruments grows to be a part of yourself. I would cry if my violin would be destroyed.
For travel within Europe, for a number of reasons I would always look for railway options before booking a flight.
A. The train staff will almost never hassle you about luggage at all. No airport stress.
B. In a lot of European cities, the airport tends to be really far outside while the railway station is dead center. No need to worry about expensive and time consuming airport transfers.
C. Trains are often more roomy, comfortable and may (or may not) contain a bistro car, sleeper cabins with showers, etc.
Trains being an option of course depends a lot on the touring schedule and locations. If you go Rome - Helsinki - London, by all means, go by flight. There are high speed rail in many European countries, but it's still land travel, so a somewhat neighbouring area is preferable.
Honestly, this is why I don't fly inside of Western/Northern Europe as a wheelchair user. My wheelchair never leaves my presence when I travel by train. I don't have to worry about it being smashed to bits by the time I arrive. There's also no TSA-style security when travelling between countries by train. (It's actually faster to travel between London and Paris via Eurostar than by aircraft, when taking into account security and everything.)
Outside of that, I prefer to rent a powered wheelchair at destination rather than take my own, and only take mine to countries where that isn't possible.
I work in a guitar orchestra and we're having our international debut in Germany in about a month. We are about 20 musicians with guitars and all our gear and we'll be going by plane. While it's true that most countries in Europe have a very efficient and reliable train system, they aren't well connected internationally (mostly economic reasons and sometimes infrastructure and technical problems). The only international train from my city is a night train that only goes as far as München and we need to go to Frankfurt, so in a case like this it's better to fly, we can't just take the risk of missing a connection (night trains are notorious for never being on time). We also considered going by bus but it would take 18 hours and it would be extremely tedious and tiring
That same law also has an updated section for wheelchair users (like myself). Airlines have a similar attitude toward medical equipment that they do toward instruments. 'Course, if my wheelchair gets broken, I'd be left bed-bound or floor-bound, and lose my ability to live independently. This is why I do not fly, anymore (even though my dad was a commercial pilot), period. I just can't risk it.
Based
@@wolfetteplays8894 Based?
Yeah exactly. Obviously this video is focusing on musician's problems, but it seems like if airline staff just gave a bit more of a shit in general, that would solve a lot of the issues.
I thought they're be more legislation to protect things like wheelchairs and medical equipment, it should be a crime to damage that sort of thing when flying. Could you not sue an airline because it's not just an "inconvience" at that point
When my mom went to Vegas I tried to convince her to take her old wheelchair instead of her brand new one. She took the new one and it got WRECKED!
When I worked in a deluxe hotel, one musician who was a regular guest had this travel trunk about the size of a small 'fridge. I asked him one day what it was. He opened it and there was a violin. It was on loan to him by a national bank. "What's all this other stuff inside"? Protection, humidifier, heater, cooler, and computerized control. He told me the violin was worth $250,000. It had it's own seat ticket, and never left his sight.
Reminds me of a concert violinist, flying in Australia, who was told they couldn't bring their violin on board because "it might be used as a weapon"
She asked the flight attendant how much they thought it was worth. They were off by a factor of 100. She got to bring it onboard.
I lived this in the 80s and 90s. I can't believe it's still the reality for touring musicians. The struggle is real.
It was WAY easier in the 80s and 90s by comparison. Never had a bass in a gigbag refused as carry on then, even checked in a road case didn't get upcharged for oversize/overweight baggage (did this many times transcontinental - would cost a ton now). Even transporting double bass was often doable with a decent tip.
you have to get a private jet :D
@David Price yeah, I was about to say, "shouldn't it have been easier prior to 2001 especially in US flights?" But A) I don't know how European flights compare before and after 2001, and B) I have only flown once on my lifetime, and not with my cello which would have been impossible to be a carry-on and a nightmare without a hard case
@@lycaonking4250 US flights back pre 9/11 were always easy with electric bass in a gig bag. Was never disallowed on domestic (or international) flights. Cello would have probably been tougher but they always seemed willing to help work it out. I know plenty of people who did double basses in hard cases by just tipping the luggage guys at the curb (a thing of the past) $20-$50 and they'd make sure it got on the flight safe. Those would have to be done air freight now for likely over $1K...
Eh, the pay hasn't changed either!
When I moved across the country, I just bought a new cello and left my old one with my parents. That way I can gig in both places and not worry about flying with it. Crazy that buying a brand new several-thousand-dollar instrument was best choice
It's a good solution... when the instrument you play is not completely unique and impossible to find. I play the Swedish nyckelharpa, a quite rare 4-rows one with extended keyboard. These cost a kidney and are all unique, basically you can't use the same finger patterns from one instrument to the other (it's like if you would have to play your gig on a 3/4 cello instead of your usual one). Just impossible for musicians in my case =( but I'm glad you found a good solution for yourself =)
I guess one could build an extension that while booking airplane tickets it gives you information about the size of overhead storage of whatever plane you're flying, and tell you what instrument can fit in there, which would also be able to collect and provide data about musicians traveling (at the least ones using the extension).
That'd be one step into solving this madness maybe.
Not happening under any circumstances. Uncertainty is a vital component of their warfare.
@@Tascamaniac good point
@@Tascamaniac what do you mean? Whose warfare?
I don't know for a fact, but I suspect that part of the problem is that ordering a plane is probably like ordering a car and you can get options. I would not be surprised to find out that overhead bins on various models of planes are not standardized because commercial aircraft never just fly passengers, they also always flight cargo as supplemental income.
Moreover, there isn't just a 737. There are four generations of 737 and multiple iterations within each generation. There are currently 10 different models under the main line of the 737 not accounting for the other spin offs. The first 737 flew in 1967 and they are still making 737s today.
Adam said in the video that airlines don't publish the sizes of overhead compartments. If there is anywhere to find this data, I'd like to see it; I think I'd be able to create an extension like you described.
I have obsessed so much about this topic as it’s one of the most stressful parts of my touring life. Feels good to hear the suffering is not just in my imagination.
"it takes a certain kind of bravery to travel with an upright bass"
...aaaand I shall quote you excessively on this 😂
I haven't taken one on a plane as of yet (only electric), but even riding the subway can be scary as hell
This was really eye-opening! I've been working as a ramp agent in the aviation industry for over 6 years (and have been a hack musician for much longer), so I always take extra care when handling musical instruments.
One time I unloaded an acoustic guitar with no case and my heart sank. I prayed that it would get to Atlanta intact.
Oh my god. Who wouldn't put a guitar in a case? Crazy.
For domestic US flights, I've learned that you get a flare launcher and put it in your luggage. You then let them know that you're flying with a "pew-pew". Your baggage gets special treatment cause if an airline damages or loses a "pew-pew", well that's big trouble.
Deviant Ollam has given a couple of talks on this (including the tidbit about things that count as firearms but aren't Gun Guns) and it's always seemed like a really useful strategy. IIRC it also means you get to (or technically have to) lock your luggage with an actual lock that the airline folks aren't supposed to be able to open. I think "camera gear" or possibly "delicate electronics" were his go to "things to pack alongside your firearm for safety" examples, but instruments definitely seem like a useful application of this trick too.
I’ve heard that this works internationally (depend on the country) as well.
I heard it was starter pistol but same idea
That’s wild, cos almost everywhere else that means it can’t travel at all! The fact you even get to lock it with TSA proof locks is even wilder. A useful hack to be sure but the fact that it’s both possible and necessary are like… damn
@@kaitlyn__L you can’t carry it in tho u have to check it
It’s frankly insane how much Airlines are able to get away with that sound SUPER illegal. Imagine pulling up to McDonald’s only for the employee to break your phone, not give you your food that you paid for for hours, and then force you to stay in that McDonald’s for multiple days without compensation because they “don’t have to compensate you if it’s due to weather.”
I booked a flight from Bozeman to Las Vegas a few months ago and they cancelled our flight without compensation due to “Unsafe winds in Las Vegas” Checking the wind speed in Vegas at the time, it was 4 miles an hour. The reality was the flight did not have enough crew, but if they admitted that then everyone booked would have been given compensation, which the airline does not want.
I love the way you're referencing other creators alongside news media. Feels a bit like citations, and in a good way where it really adds value and context to this video. Superb job on this.
seconding this
Adam, Im a crewmember in a large US airline. Heres my advice...
Pre-board at the very beginning of boarding for "people who need extra time". That'll give you an empty airplane... More importantly emptyish closets. Kindly ask the flight attendants if you can put it in the closet or if they have a better idea.
NEVER CHECK IT! Search UA-cam for "united breaks guitars".
Hey, this might be a long shot but how about reaching out to one of the pilot/air travel UA-camrs to (1) just low-key spread the knowledge of the problem into the industry and hopefully (2) get another set of brains on why this happens and how to maaaybe go about solving it or work around it (more effectively)? Mentour Pilot sometimes does collabs and has a decent-sized audience, for example, and at least judging by his on-screen persona seems like a decent enough bloke.
Great idea!
Bumping this for traffic.
Bumping this upwards, keep the comments coming people
Let’s push it to the top.
Hey! Pilot here, great idea. But I will say that us pilots have next to no control over these types of shenanigans as we're often pretty busy doing our own preparations during the boarding process. This is why gate agents and cabin crew exist. We can't really help more than telling off our crew and that requires the issue to actually be brought to our attention. Most pilots won't really care either unfortunately. I wonder if there's any cool cabin crew UA-camrs out there. That being said, I'm sure peter from mentor pilot would be happy to chat about this.
Hi Adam! Thanks for shedding light on this struggle, and thanks for including me in your video⚡️
The destruction of Ballake Sissoko's kora 06:01 was just appalling vandalism.
Guitarist in Japan here. I got to tour in Europe for the first time in January. I flew with KLM, used the large size coffin case because I could fit all my gear in there and checked it in as my checked over-size luggage at no extra charge, but was always prepared for it to disappear. So, I put together a tour rig that entirely came out to less than $800 USD. Everyone else in the band used Mono, wrapped in clothes like you recommended. The priority boarding thing is a useful tip.
Did you ever travel with KLM and took your guitare as a carry-on ?
@@CallmeLisa4 I traveled with KLM and my guitar was checked over-sized luggage. :)
Surprising that no airline has considered a musician loyalty program that guarantees you a reasonable amount of overhead space for your instrument.
Seems like you could turn simply following the law into a marketing opportunity to get more loyalty program members and edge out the competition for traveling musicians lol
Not enough of a market for it I'm afraid.
Holy crap I would jump on a musician loyalty program so fast! Thankfully never been forced to put my viola in the cargo hold, but the pushback from some airline agents is so distressing
@@noahmay7708 As Adam pointed out in the video, we don't actually have statistics on how many musicians travel via airlines annually. But touring musicians travel as a huge part of their career, so I'd imagine whatever market is there is fairly lucrative with the sheer number of flights annually.
Janek Gwizdala has done a podcast about flying as a musician and he's talked about loyalty programs and weighing options of airlines. I guarantee that whatever airline decides to stop treating instruments like trash will probably gain a lot of these pro (and hobbyist) musicians' business bc they do keep up with the perks and programs.
It actually wouldn't take much to implement and the infrastructure is already there. Literally could just be an add-on feature to whatever generic loyalty program they have, where perhaps you get priority boarding and a print-out on your ticket that says you're part of the program and get to stow your instrument (under a reasonable size limit ofc) in an overhead compartment or closet. Literally just knowing that the instrument will for sure make it on the plane would be enough for me lol
Great way to legalize bribery lol
@@polinanikulina I fail to see how this is a bribe tho. Most airline loyalty programs are free to join and most professional musicians I've heard talk about this issue are actually already enrolled in them.
However, promising to give musicians their due overhead space for being members of such a program would be an enticing offer when the alternative is what everyone else does - treat instruments like trash and musicians like jerks for trying to bring them onboard. Getting miles and perks in the process of avoiding the frustration of an unexpected gate check sounds like a good deal to me.
It's part of the never ending stereotype that being a musician is is not viable employment. I committed to checking my bass in a hard case and so far all has been well. I don't travel as much as y'all do though. Thanks for this video.
The part of this that absolutely infuriates me is while there's so much scrutiny and push-back on musicians bringing their instruments on board, golf club bags are regularly either allowed as carry on, or checked into the pilot's chest (closet) without any push-back whatsoever. I'm not a golfer, and I understand that golfers should be able to bring their equipment as well, but especially since a standard golf bag is so similar in size to many instrument bags, it's a double standard that's absolute garbage!!
I hate to give away my travel secrets, but one thing we used to do it shrink-wrap the guitar and bass cases together (In Europe they used to have kiosks where they would do it for a fee). The guitars were already considered oversize, and this would make it cheaper as they would be counted as 1 bag, and the extra mass would mean they wouldn't get thrown around as much be overall sturdier against getting banged around.
The other thing we used to do to save on extra fees by the pound was find a spot in the airport and take out our instruments to make the bags lighter. Have one band member wait with all the instruments. Then we'd check the bags, measure the weight, and they'd ask us to drop them in the oversize area. Before dropping them in that oversize area, we'd go and put the instruments back in the bags. Now that I'm explaining it, I can't believe we ever did that! But we did it for almost every European flight!
I've had my guitar (a Ric 350) lost once by an airline. They eventually found it and delivered it to my door 2 weeks later. Luckily this was at the end of a tour, so I didn't need it for gigs.
There were several times that our instruments were delayed, and we didn't have them to perform. We've had to borrow instruments, or figure out another way to entertain people. Once flying to Rome for the biggest $$ paid gig, British Air didn't get our insts on the flight. Luckily we had a laptop and we were able to throw together an all-electronic karaoke-style set and still play! We just got on stage and were honest with our fans and they were great about it. We even had an "F-British Air" interlude full singalong!
I don't tour anymore, last one was Japan in 2016. But honestly I can't believe we put up with that stress almost every day while playing in Europe. I still get anxious thinking about it.
Great stories but lying about weight on a plane can be dangerous and I would heavily advise against it. Fuel is set for the plane for it's checked weight and while normally they will add extra, at times this may not happen
The bags need to be opened so how does your idea actually work? Just rent an axe at your destination tho
@@chameleonedm I would never do these things today. I meant it more of an example of how absurd it was, and the lengths we went to to be able to afford to tour!
@@jeffreyjbyron all good man, more a word of warning for anyone coming across your comment
@@erikbrodin2198 Which idea? Our bags weren't always opened, especially for intra-europe flights.
The problem with renting is that we'd have to do that every night! We almost always rented backline amps and drums. But even still, they often wouldn't rent out cymbals. Guitars are more problematic, because our instruments were unique and customized.
I would definitely suggest looking at train options when touring. Especially in most of the EU and parts of Asia, trains are great for convenience, cost and, importantly, space for carrying instruments! Obviously, a flight is sometimes the only option, but if for example you're doing Amsterdam -> Antwerp -> Lyon -> Vienna -> Milan -> Rome, trains definitely are an option.
It's not always in that order, depending on venue dates.
@@eviloatmeal Right, but if you can make it work... I also just picked EU countries with good enough international train networks in a line
Yes !! I've been touring Europe for several years and do everything by train (I'm European). However, this autumn I'm going to Japan...
As a bassist currently on my first international tour (just got off the stage in kyoto, japan) this video hit home. I ended up borrowing a bass locally for this tour because I was so worried about flying with my own, but that's not ideal and isnt feasible in many situations. Adam, I enjoy all your videos but especially appreciate when you get political, like here and in your video on copyright. Probably nobody in charge is watching, but if enough people become aware of theses issues, maybe change is possible. Keep fighting the good fight!
I appreciate how the thumbnail is also the first frame of the video so the video kinda just started with no jarring transition
Crew here, hiding it in a garments bag is genius lol. Gate agents are the Ops, it would help you sneak it past them if they’re strict.
Also if you have to check it in, you can buy
‘I
I've done the crew closet thing before on Delta flights. They were actually really cool about it.
I just told my wife how Delta was the best when it comes to crew locker. So now I'm sure. 😉
I had the same experience. even when I was traveling with a hard case they were kind enough to put it in the crew closet.
+1 to delta being by far the best experience I've had with an airline regarding domestic US flights with instruments. American was by far the worst.
I was flying few times long haul between Europe and USA. So now we can confirm that delta is great in both cases. Adam, new video please: Horror of moving instruments from one point to another solved - Delta! 😁
I've done it on long haul Lufthansa flights before. They were always very chill about it.
I feel like this story is just another piece of a puzzle that I feel shows in general that there's a lot of appreciation for art (or, more accurately, "content") but no appreciation (maybe even contempt) for artists themselves or the work that goes into it.
Still not over the fact that when i travelled with the guitar i built during covid & booked a seat for it, it would NOT let me fly unless I uploaded a covid test *for my guitar*. Like, I could not check in without it.
I ended up uploading a pdf with a picture of it and the note "Hello. My guitar is a guitar. She is made from wood and cannot have the coronavirus as it is a people virus and she is wood and metal parts with some plastic. Thank U"
Hahahahaha this got me
Someone had to read that. I can imagine several possible reactions.
Adam, for some reason I'm finding it difficult to find an article again, but I recently ran across one explaining that some airliners are now stashing guitars, basses, and other similar-sized instruments in the extra space around the landing gear. That means the instruments experience even more extreme conditions than inside the baggage hold.
this seems stupid. logistically, technically and safety-wise it would be a hassle and a half. and for what? space is almost never a defining factor inside a cargo hold, it's the weight that counts.
Thanks for the video. I've been in these situations hundreds of times, as both a performer, and a guitar tech. I once had to do a 2 week Australian festival tour with my backup guitar, as Qantas lost half the band's equipment on the way over. My main guitar finally showed up on the last day, with a broken headstock.
One option that wasn't mentioned is working with a logistics company that specializes in music gear, like Global Motion. If you have many pieces to check, and enough lead time, they will make sure the gear arrives safely and on time.
I would mostly recommend the custom ATA flight case option, with the downside being there's a chance of lost baggage. But if the alternative is gate checking a gig bag, for me the pros outweigh the cons for overseas and one-off travel. If the group is flying daily with instruments, this can obviously get a bit unreasonable, logistically.
For tours with daily flights, I will tend to backline as much as possible. I've even backlined guitars and pedals on radio promo tours. If you are a virtuoso with an intimate connection to your instrument, this will not work for you.
I would even go so far as to rejig the schedule to allow for ground travel, if it's at all feasible. It all comes down to how tight your margins are.
Ultimately, though, if you need to take a priceless instrument on weeks of daily flights for tour, as in your case, it will always be an uphill battle, until something changes. It is unfair. It is bullshit. And, sometimes, it is beyond our control. Keep going anyway!! Much love
Thanks, Adam! I've been flying with musical instruments since about 1990, and it's an ever-changing challenge. Everything you say here is current, relevant, and a best practice.
I've learned to scan the waiting area and tag-team with other musicians - sometimes collaboratively filling an overhead compartment with 3-4 violins & violas. That way, we'te good stewards of the space, and we prevent heavier items from being put on top of our instruments.
In recent years, I've had great experiences with Delta- an AFM boycott in the mid 2000's helped to change the way they had been treating musicians.
It's a flight by flight journey, though, and these tips, plus courtesy go a long way.
Thanks so much.
One of the craziest things I’ve encountered recently is calling the airline helpline only to get conflicting answers… over the same call. And I’ve had crew tell me there was no space only for me to try it and see it actually fits. Traveling with my guitar makes me so anxious because of the unpredictability of the whole situation. Last summer, when I saw the Julian Lage post you mentioned, I followed his tip and put screw inserts into the neck of both my teles. It’s IMO the best method for guitars with bolt on necks, because you only have to replace the strings between each flight and carry a screwdriver. The neck is still longer than the dimensions allowed by some airlines, but it’s way more inconspicuous than trying to hide the guitar at check in 😂
Where did you obtain the screw inserts? Any specific size? This seems like it makes good sense and especially for a tele where you don't need a degree in physics to see how it fits together.
@@aliensporebomb I got 4mm alloys for one tele and 5.5mm steel for another, cause both were with different techs... Just make sure you get a matching set and that it's not bigger than 5.5-6mm because you need wood to still be there at the sides. I'm mentioning the screw sizes btw, the insert sizes should match automatically!
I would recommend you get 5mm stainless steel if you can, preferably with an allen wrench head instead of a screwdriver head. That's the perfect size + strength and it's more convenient than even carrying a screedriver!
Try to avoid brass and even alloy inserts. One of my alloy inserts broke during installation.
Screw inserts are available at hardware stores. But given the cost of getting it wrong, it seems well worth having a luthier do for you. They work with wood all the time, and can advise on how much wood can be removed and still leave a structurally sound joint. It seems silly that removable necks aren't designed this way to begin with: connections need to be rated for more than a few dozen cycles if they're really "removable!”
@@jorymil I agree completely! Screw inserts should be the default, at least on high end instruments.
I have a lot to say about this, but I'll be brief:
1. I live in Hawaii - so we have to travel by plane - all the time, even to outer islands.
2. For many years, I traveled with a 26-string harp (7lbs), or a handpan (15lbs). Never both at the same time.
3. Always, always, ALWAYS BE NICE to all airline personnel - they are all very stressed. Smile a lot.
4. Don't present them with two problems - your instrument and a a) flapping chicken; b) Aunt Petunia's Angel Food cake in a special box; c) some other obnoxious thing that needs special treatment.
5. For me, since it's a harp, I let the flight crew know what it is, and I offer to play for everyone if there's a delay. Maybe harps are special - flight attendants do not see them every day. Flight attendants are enchanted by the harp.
6. If you score an overhead bin, hopefully you can sit across the aisle and monitor the bin while people are boarding - offer to help people fit their luggage into the bin - be active and courteous, and when the bin is full, close the lid to discourage others from considering the bin.
7. Consider flying First - the cost is not all that much more, and you have more leeway.
8. 90% of the time, I get the green light for the First/Crew Closet - like Adam said, it frees up the overhead.
9. If you had a good experience AND have CDs of your work, give the flight attendants a copy.
10. What do I do now? I have a travelin' cat now, so no more instruments can come with me. Two things - I stash two harps and two handpans on the US Mainland and leave them with friends OR I send them by mail - do NOT buy the USPS insurance - I did not have an incident with an instrument but I insured something else, and it never made it, and six months later I got $40 from the insurance, and the replacement cost would have been $500. Instead, insure them with an insurance company that will cover postal shipments. Very small cost, but they'll replace your instrument if damaged.
I could go on, but that's the gist of it.
You think the cost of flying first class is “not that much more”? I’m in California, and it’s literally an order of magnitude more expensive to fly first class to the East Coast.
All valid points, except number 3. I'll be exactly as nice to them as they are to me. Travelling is honestly more stressful for people using the airline than for people working there, personnel just get to make up rules to fuck over travelers just because they THINK their boss might be a little mad. Everyone's job sucks, no need to take that out on travelers.
@@25bever You can have whatever beliefs you want about what their job is like, but do you think that being rude to someone who is being rude to you makes them more or less likely to help you out? De-escalation can work wonders.
@@jasonbonifacio2473 Yes, the airlines change the game all the time. Best to check fares in advance. Coach seats from HNL to San Francisco were 386 One Way - 445 First class with lie flats....but fares come and go.
I've traveled with a Little Martin (about 3/4 size) set up to play lap style. Like the bass or any guitar it takes up more than one space and if someone isn't paying attention they will try to jam their suitcase in right where the neck of the guitar is. So that means (1) I watch the space like a hawk and stop someone who is trying to do that and (2) if I see somebody with a duffel I ask them to put it against the neck of my guitar both to signify that the space is taken and give my guitar some padding.
Nonetheless I find it stressful to travel with the guitar. And always assume that one day it's going to be broken. I'm not a touring musician like Adam but I really miss playing if I don't have it with me.
Flying with regular baggage is already torture, I can't even begin to imagine how horrible it is to transport a fragile instrument. Thank you musicians for sacrificing your sanity for the rest of us.
As someone who consistently flies with a 76 key arranger keyboard in a flight case, which is always overweight and never costs me anything less than $150 extra to fly with, I felt this video.. thanks for making a video on a unexplored topic that all of us musicians who travel deal with constantly!
Man I wish this video came out two days ago, I flew southwest from Arizona to New York and both times they forced me and my band mates to check our instruments. And we would just watch out the windows as the baggage crew on the ground would throw our trombones tenors and bari sax ON THE GROUND!!! With no regard to how much these things cost. And they even broke one of our tenors as well 😭
Did they comp you for the broken instrument??
i used to think gate checking was a decently safe option until i remembered when john b. williams gave a talk at my high school. he mentioned that once he was on a domestic flight and had to gate check his double bass and when they tossed it in he could already tell the neck was damaged. when he got it back it was unplayable so he had to borrow a student’s bass from a school nearby the venue. i could also be completely misremembering this anecdote though lol
I've traveled with brass instruments quite a bit and thankfully I've only had one issue where the bell of my bass trombone got bent, but thankfully it was cosmetic.
On the other hand just before I joined, a brass band I play with flew to Norway for a week and nearly all of their checked luggage was lost along the way leaving them to have to borrow instruments. For one of the trombone players he flew out of LA, spent that week in Norway and when he returned home he learned that his trombone, which never made it to Norway was in San Francisco.
Adam Neely, you are the absolute GOAT 🐐 of musician youtubers. Every video is fascinating and so well researched
"Can't take the guitar on board"
Ma'am, that's not a guitar, that's a BASS!
This should've been part of their job training.
I know that readers from the States are going to find this perhaps a bit too commy, but the saddest thing for me is that this problem, and a lot of others, all boil down to stressed workers fighting stressed workers while every middle man takes the lion's share home
We badly need socialism here in the US. We're not all brainwashed conservatives
Nearly every problem right now boils down to maximizing profit, in one form or another. Seems bad.
@@cnking27 capitalism is broken. it's a terrible system that needs to be replaced. but the propaganda is so strong, and the corporate interests so powerful, that we're likely stuck with it until society inevitably collapses in a cpl hundred years
also, the middlemen aren't taking the lion's share, that goes to the people who own the airlines and the executives, investors, banks etc etc. but i suppose u could describe banks as "middlemen"
You're right - definitely communist-sounding.
I was roadie back in the 60's-70's and flew a lot and can't imagine touring today. Back in my day I few gear as baggage all the time and with some small groups not even in flight cases. One band who guitar player is now famous he would take his Fender Deluxe stuff a hotel pillow in the back to protect the speaker and just put a slipcover on and flew it like that in luggage never a problem. Another group the artist was a Hammond B3 player and had a chopped B3 that weight about 200 pounds in it's flight case, with generous tipping of skycaps I flew that thing as luggage. Another band I had a flightcase made that held all the bands guitars and bass. It was made to fit the dimensions of standard baggage chute with wheels and handles all over. I flew it as luggage and it scared a lot tourists seeing that huge case come down the luggage chute onto the baggage carousel. Sometimes with something like Jazz guitar you don't want them in the freezing cargo hold you could request gate check-in and your guitar be hard loaded. What the airline did was hand load the guitar into the cargo area where they put pets and other fragile things. That had air, not a cold, and usually guitar was handled safely.
My one suggestion then and now when flying gear is use flight cases is to put lots of handles and wheel on the case. Those baggage handler have terrible job with airline pushing and pushing them to go faster. Well if you gear is easy to handle they will teat it nicer. if it is a pain to lift and move it will be treated like crap. I feel for all you road dogs today touring is a lot of struggle.
Or they could just take a train??? Like.c it’s not that hard
@@wolfetteplays8894 What, a train from New York to Delhi?
This is the US no one takes trains for business travel they aren't even used that much for vacation travel. The US rail system has never been like that in the rest of the world.
@@ameddayr Yes, leaves every day at 27 hours, from the bronx. Didnt you know?
@@DojoOfCool No, it has been, it just isn't anymore because the railways were never nationalized. But in the Northeast, Illinois, and California it's decent enough that they absolutely are taken for business travel.
Touring keyboardist here.
AA broke my ATA case and keyboard (Nord Stage 3) 3 weeks ago, and according to the Montreal Convention, they cannot pay more than 1731 dollars. They busted the Nord so bad that it will cost 2000 dollars to fix it. As you said.. it’s like a Russian roulette..
Gotta love how casually Adam returned to talk about the nightmare of transporting musical instruments
Wultuh
Your everywhere lol
Wdym returned? He usually uploads once every 4 weeks
hey its the guy who doesnt watch videos but just lazily comments for attention
I'm only travelling with a fiddle, which is obviously less of a challenge than a guitar. But I always write to the airline customer service team and ask them to confirm in writing that I can carry it in the cabin on that specific flight. I'll quote their policy in my request. I print out a hard copy, arrive early for checking, and arrange early boarding. It's always worked so far.
I go through the same kind of thought processes when I travel with camera gear. I had a rare film camera in a bag that I was forced to gate check, and now it's permanently damaged (though thankfully still usable). I carry that thing in my lap now if I'm going anywhere.
My brother hides all his (very) expensive lenses and the body around a multi-pocketed jacket. Me, I stopped using even compact mirrorless bodies and have taken the drone+RX100+iPhone option for my travel photography. Clothes in the carry-on keep things cosy. Miss a few shots, but I'm not getting paid so I'm chill.
I am one of those guys that detaches my guitar's neck and body and fit everything in my backpack. The few strategies I have learnt throughout my gigging experiences are: 1) Fly ANA, they will literally ask if they could test and see if your guitar fits in the overhead cabin, otherwise, they would offer to put your guitar in the business class garment closet. 2) Get a strandberg, they fit in overhead cabins easily.
ANA offered me preboarding with a softcase acoustic on a trip from Japan. Westjet made me gate check a gibson sg in a mono case on the other hand. Stressful flight.
Great video as always! I can share a bit of insight in the points you mention briefly regarding insurance (I work in insurance as a trainee actuary although I don’t have expertise in anything to do with instrument insurance. Also I fully appreciate that this isn’t the main point of the vid and doesn’t really change anything, this is more for extended reading if anyone is interested!)
In order to price an insurance policy you need to know two main things: 1. how much will claims cost? 2. how often will they occur? The first question is easy since it’s the value of the instrument. The second is of course much harder. The obvious approach is to try to work out what causes claims, such as damage/loss in flights, but in reality this as mentioned is extremely hard to get data for and calculate. Instead what I suspect is done is that all the policies are grouped by for example “instruments which stay in one place” / “international cover” / “national cover” / etc. Then the insurer will just look at what frequency policies claim in each group, and voila you’ve got your number!
In other words, they will look at past claims frequency and unless there is a notable new risk, assume that future claim rates will be similar so can use this to price the policy. No guessing about how often people fly with instruments or anything like that needed.
Many “airline” staff in airports aren’t employed by the airline. Even though they may wear the airline’s uniform, they are often employed by a specialised airport labour hire company like ‘Swissport’. This is especially true for smaller airlines and for larger ones at smaller airports. I don’t know how this affects things exactly, but it could be that the service agent isn’t overly familiar with the airlines policy.
This stuff would stop me touring. I'd honestly rather rent an instrument where I'm going that have to go through this. Nothing worse than having your pride and joy damaged only to have the airline and insurance company all just shrug their shoulders and blame you.
Yeah, same. Leaving my instrument at home and renting something locally was my first thought after seeing all this madness of taking it around on airplanes.
I was worried about putting my guitar in the cargo hold but everyone I was flying with told me it would be fine. "It's not gonna break" or "They'll be careful with it". Well, we got to our destination and lo and behold my guitar neck snapped. Fuck the airport!
We flew Delta to Ecuador with our instruments. We had no problems with our guitars in the overheads until our last flight from Atlanta to Richmond where the gate agent demanded that we gate check our instruments and placed a special tag on my instrument denoting it was to be gate checked. As I was about to board, a flight attendant saw the tag and warned me that the tag was going to cause my bass in a gig bag to go through the entire baggage system. He said there was no way that he would allow me to risk damage to my very expensive instrument and tore the tag off and waved me onto the plane with my bass. Thanks, dude.
100%. Be as polite as humanly possible for as long as humanly possible, use a bulky soft case with sufficient padding so you can gate check without getting depressed (if you're touring a lot by plane you will have to and you know it), and hope for the best. I'll be over next week for a Greek Pop/folk tour, a few domestic flights involved, will let you know how it went. Struggle is real.
This is one reason that I’m terrified of travelling with an instrument. The idea of my instruments being destroyed during transit and being stuck upon arrival sends shivers down my spine.
How much train travel do you usually do ? In Europe if the tour dates aren't set up completely backwards you could probably make it work.
Train travel does work better around here than across the pond (a low bar to be fair), but from personal experience trekking back and forth across Europe (without musical instruments) it can very easily mean a long overnight sleeper trip instead of a
From the gig vlogs, they definitely prefer to travel by train. But London to Madrid or Stockholm to Amsterdam will take you the better part of a day which you might not be able to fit into the schedule. And in the summer trains that don't have compulsory seat reservation can get pretty crammed so there can be a bit of a risk of having to travel with the instrument on your lap for hours.
I've done trips around Europe via train - not so much with instruments, but just as a tourist. If I had the choice, I'd take the chance of having my guitar in the back of a plane rather than planning a tour via train. Trains work completely different in each European country. There is a learning curve with this, it's not just like an airport that works the same anywhere on Earth. Especially in the South, you will have trouble finding anyone working at a train station speaking English if there ever is a problem. In countries such as Germany (which maybe has the worst trains in all of "Western" Europe, but it connects so many countries together), you will face insane delays, cancellations, sprints to the next train before it leaves, missing wagons which should've been your seat reservations and overcrowded cabins on which I wouldn't want to transport a drum set, heavy guitar amps and stuff like that. This may be an option for someone who knows Europe very well and has a high tolerance for suffering or only needs to travel the most comfortable, well established lines, but I can't imagine a band from the US on a tight schedule being able to reliably do that. Look at the trips they're taking in the video, that by train just doesn't seem to work
@@narnigrin The price is also high often higher than flying if you have to take multiple trains. It may seem counter intuitive but I have flown from Budapest to London for 18 euros: 9 for me and 9 for my guitar (yes 9 euros a ticket) and that was only a few years ago. Obviously that's ridiculously cheap but companies like Ryanair frequently have flights for under 25 euros a ticket around Europe. Good luck taking a train from one side of France to the other or from London to Edinburgh for that price. That's to say nothing of taking Eurostar.
@@TheKlaun9 I find it interesting that you find German trains the worst, as someone who has travelled in the Netherlands and UK myself but not much in Germany, what makes them worse?
Adam, your advice worked! I went up to the gate waiting to open, and asked to have early boarding and they kindly took my bass and stored it in a closet before anyone boarded! It was a long distance international flight!
Pre-boarding is the key here. Having status can help, but being friendly will go a long way. I've had FAs offer the coat closet before I could even ask
Such an important video ! Thanks man
Back in high school, my youth orchestra (from the US) went on tour to France and England. Our strategy was violins, violas, trumpets, French horns, saxophone, and maybe (don’t remember) trombones and bassoons take instruments as their carry on, flute/piccolo, clarinet, and oboe pack them in their checked luggage, and cello/bass brought their bows and instruments were rented for them through the community music school we were exchanging with. It was a whole messy system but it worked, I think mainly because a lot of the carry on instruments don’t necessarily look like instruments on first glance to the untrained eye.
@5:53 You check it in the hold, there is the very real risk your item will be placed on the wrong plane and you will never see it again.
I saw a guitar without hard shell case falling down from the conveyer belt that loads to the belly of the plane. That was like 12 ft. It hurt
Get yourself a sturdy Peli Case and just check your guitar/bass. I've taken my guitar on tours and flown across the pond so many times and the only time I had an issue was that my baggage got delayed during the crazy summer of 2021 after COVID when every single airport on earth was backed up.
Also, make sure you put straps around your case to avoid customs messing with your stuff. I realised that half the time they don't even bother opening the case because they're legally required to put the straps back how they were.
Flew from Sweden to Canada with a marching band in 2009 with all our instruments checked. The ground crew smashed 4 french horns worth $5000 a piece as well as a lyra worth about $2500. Oops...!
wth
@@Hourstone They just don't care. Ground crew's job is just to get things on and off the plane on time. I'd wager they're not even instructed on safe handling for fragile items, let alone watched over to make sure they're following those steps - they're just random employees, so it's basically impossible for any broken item to be traced back to them specifically once it's been down the line. That's how you end up with thousands of dollars worth of damaged instruments - there's no consequences for the people who break them and plenty of reason to not handle them carefully. If the plane can't leave on time because you were being too careful loading in the cargo, that will get someone to come down and fire you, but a broken guitar is customer service's problem somewhere down the line.
- French horns
- Marching band
Something’s not checking out here…
@ Not american marching band obviously
Thank you so much for this video, I was truly considering checked my guitar, but by the video, there are no guarantee that my guitar will be safe. So I’ll carry with me and pray to every step of your video works for me as well, thank you so much for clarifying everything 🙏🏻
As a touring and traveling musician-it's wonderfully fantastic to see this extremely important video out there, Adam. Thank you. I recently purchased a new bassoon-partially because it breaks down into a case with smaller dimensions than my previous one. All to avoid detection as a 'musician' traveling with 'musical instruments'. It's so amazing that most travelers put everything on as hand baggage because they don't want to have to wait at baggage-yet us musicians who really need that space aren't allowed to carry on the tools of our trade. The strategies are so important: look into how much time between flights on a multi-flight trip and all the rest you mention about plane overhead space sizes and airline ratings. I often go up to the counter and say "I need a little extra time to get down the runway' and I'm offered that so I can go on near the head of the line. It helps that I'm older and not a young pup who looks perfectly healthy and therefore doesn't 'need extra time'. Traveling as a working musician has gotten tougher and tougher. No romance left to traveling as a musician-the 2 hours on stage ends up as the reward for all of this.
Finally a UA-cam video talking about this! Thanks a lot!
The biggest problem is how we all just accept that baggage handlers are horrible at they’re job and there’s nothing we can do about it
They're probably better at their job than you are at orthography
Yeah. I think one of the qualifications is, you kind of have to be a tool and enjoy being a tool. LOL
@@PeterCamberwick Or maybe standing on a runway for 8 hours a day hauling suitcases for minimum wage gets the care and attention it deserves.
@@zivkovicableit’s an unfortunate reality that strict and unfair working conditions make people horrible at their job when they could very well be better if given the space to be better 🫤
@@toseltreps1101 who cares
Can confirm that touring with woodwinds is just as much of a problem. Probably like 70% of the time there’s no issue, but the alarmingly common 30% of the time where there is an issue is scary as heck. “We’re going to need you to check one of your bags at the gate.”
“Well, you can have my backpack with my electronics, books, and sheet music, then.”
“I don’t know, that other bag looks pretty bag. Will it fit under the seat in front of you?”
“I’ll make it fit-my $9000 oboe, $7000 backup oboe, and $4000 clarinet [thank god I don’t have to worry about that one cracking in cold theaters] that I need to have functioning the day after I arrive are under NO circumstances leaving my sight.”
And don’t even get me started on when there are weight limits to your carry-on baggage…
Under the deception category... 😅
On top of being very avoidant with the gate agent about your instrument,
if they tell you you're going to have to gate check it, this often means they give you a gate slip.
My advice is to just graciously take it and when you're out of view put it in your pocket,
similarly to what Adam says about saying you want to take it to the gate.
This will diffuse the situation and put you one step closer to getting your instrument in an overhead.
In my experience I've never been stopped after the gate agent with my instrument so long as there's been room.
You also essentially get a re-roll on the person keeping you from flying with your instrument safely. 🤣
I've had some gate agents single me out and be pretty mean to me.
I'm 3-0 on gate agents telling me my instrument won't fit in an overhead.
I've had them suggest "options" for me to fly with my instrument only to tell me it's too late. 😔
Last time i was at LaGuardia I spent like thirty minutes waiting for them to get to my bag at TSA because they couldn’t figure out if a trombone stand was dangerous
Having flown around the globe with a bass, I feel this. Steve Bailey told me a long time ago that you are always within your rights to ask to speak to the captain if it pertains to your overall flight experience. He was right. I got stopped about a gate check, and politely asked if I could speak with the captain about it. The flight attendant quickly changed her tune and said “I think I actually might have some room in our coat closet” (and she did). If I’m flying domestically, in the past, Southwest has been great by offering the Early Bird discount - a small fee (maybe $25 last time I did it) to board the plane early, and since there are no assigned seats, it mitigates the risk of anyone complaining about having my bass in “their” overhead compartment. Keep fighting the good fight, everyone 😅
11:05 pro tip for small instrument owners, even if you have a thin enough bass or guitar case, you can fit it in the first class coat closet. Almost no one actually uses these anymore since no one is wearing an overcoat anymore.
14:02 you covered this too haha. My double mono case absolutely does not fit though 😂
I carry on a backpack, pelican air, and trumpet with the combination strat. You only technically get 2 carry on pieces. I use a carabiner to clip on my gig bag to the backpack side by side and slide by the gate check every time. 100's of flights... Thanks for making this video. This is important info!
Flew with my bass many times for ship gigs. Had a pro bolt-on neck set -up. Took the neck off, packed it in with body in a softshell, folded the softshell case in half with a strap around it. NEVER A PROBLEM!! Used a laptop bag for other stuff. NEVER TAKE A PRIZED GUITAR/BASS WITH YOU!
I have so much to say here... this video is such a good encapsulation of what we go through.
Adam, we've never met but you saved my friend Jeremy in India at the Jaipur Jazz Festival when half his band couldn't get into the country. I was there too, with saxophonist Kirk MacDonald, but didn't see you... we were travelling in India, and I was sticking to my main approach which has been set for years... smallest possible cymbal bag-- Jimmy Cobb style 20/18/14, smallest carry-on suitcase... just enough for one suit, pair of shoes, a couple of shirts, and some casual clothes. It's so ridiculously barebones, but I arrive to every gig with every single thing I need. I pack a duffel that folds into itself into my suitcase so I can have a bit more flexibility if there's van travel or whatever between cities. I wear the cymbal bag like a backpack, it's my "personal item". It's way too big to be my personal item, but nobody ever knows its there, because it's on my back like every other backpack in the airport.
If there's some kind of announcement like "we will be boarding families with small children, then wheelchair passengers, then anybody who needs a bit more time" I'm all over that... I need a bit more time, can I pre-board, etc? Yes to all of that. On super full flights at the height of summer festival season, I have muscled into first class lines and played dumb when handing over my ticket just to get on the plane first. I put my suitcase up, stack the cymbals on top... takes up no more cubic space than any other personal item, it's just wide and flat.
I've had more trouble with security than with airline staff, really. They always want to see the retractable brushes, and I've gotten into some slightly heated situations when they clank my shit around like it's nothing. I usually say "you wouldn't treat a bag of golf clubs like that."
I did buy an SKB cymbal safe recently, and used it for the first time and checked my cymbals for a cross-country flight. That was a mixed bag. It made the trip, it was Apple tagged, but it took forever to get on both ends of the flight. Flying back to Toronto on a late flight that arrived at 11:45pm local time... I wasn't home until 2 am and that kind of sucked compared to my usual routine of sailing straight into a cab with my carry-on-only setup. I'm not keen to check my cymbals, generally, I think playing smaller cymbals while on the road and carrying them on is advantageous. I don't travel with 22" cymbals anymore, ever.
Whoa-good to know on the cymbals.
I used every strategy and managed to travel with my guitar on board as hand luggage. Thank you Adam this was crucial !!
Flown with my tuba once. Absolute nightmare having to check it in as "bulky luggage" which costs twice as much as a regular seat, only to still have it get manhandled and violently thrown into the cargo hold.
World's foremost tuba soloist, Øystein Baadsvik, went so far as to request a special model from the instrument makers that could detach the bell and fold in the valves to make it fit into a regular suitcase, just to avoid these ridiculous regulations.
I'll also mention jazz/funk trombonist Nils Landgren, who always travels with his trombone in a viola case, because for some reason, most airlines have a policy to allow string instruments in the cabin but not brass instruments.
Absolutely wild that us musicians have to jump through these ridiculous hoops just to be able to safely travel with one extra bag.
I've flown International (USA to Ireland) a few times carrying a bass in a gig bag, luckily Ive never had any issues. The 1st time after buying a bass in NY I was in JFK going home and the lady at the check in desk looked at the gig bag on my back and "They won't let you carry that on, it's too big!" and I just replied "But I brought it over with me and nobody said anything to me!" and she just replied "Oh that's fine so go ahead!" 😂
Another time when the overhead bins were full the flight attendant offered to put it in their closet for me which was great!
The main trick I use (which I saw Victor Wooten say) is to carry the gig bag by my side with the headstock pointing back as it almost looks like a laptop case when viewed from the front then! 👍🏼
Thanks for this video, Adam. Even after watching this, most people will have no idea what we‘re really going through. 😊
Especially when you have specialty equipment and gear not easily available!
At 11:30 "Charlotte --> Champagne Urbana" As a graduate of U of Illinois, it is "Champaign". If you want street cred, call it Chambana.
I once missed a flight because my bass took too long to show up on the oversized luggage conveyer belt.
Senior year of my undergrad, flying into Chicago from Frankfurt after having spent two weeks in the Baltic states. We had less than 90 minutes to get off the plane, go through customs, pickup our luggage, and board the last flight back to our home city -_-
I ended up having to stay with one of the professors at a hotel for the night, and fly out the next day.
It’s been a while since I traveled with a guitar a man, this video got me anxious again hahahaha
As a contrabassoonist, I flew once with an extra seat. Even though everything went smoothly, it was stressful enough knowing that I was subject to the whims of the flight crews that I have never repeated the process. Now, I just drive.
I have no practical use for this video but loved every minute of it. Had no idea! I’ll never look at musicians on airplanes the same way again.
My sweetheart and I went to Denmark a few weeks ago, and he brought his guitar. I was advised not to let him, but he had a hard case, so I thought it’d be fine. Delta was thankfully very kind to it, but once we got on a connecting flight to Denmark via KLM, the guitar didn’t arrive with us, but came in the following day, the case having been beat to hell, and seemingly pried open on one side. They couldn’t get it open all the way because the case locked with a key. The guitar, miraculously, survived, even without packing clothes in the case. (Didn’t know about that one beforehand) I’ll see about using these strategies next time. Granted, neither of us are touring musicians, but since my sweetheart is a lefty, and we weren’t going somewhere flush with music stores, that was the only way he was going to get to play anything.
That sounds terrible! Can you get compensation for the delayed arrival or broken case? It's just not right.
Sweetheart twice - cringe. But I'm jaded and jealous.
@@LittleDogTobi They told me to contact a completely different company for some reason. I was supposed to contact the airline directly about it, and learned that way too late.
When I was flying a lot I would use my Modulus. Problem solved. You can drive a truck over a Modulus and the neck will never warp.Also the backpack style gig bags look a lot less obvious when you put them on with the neck pointing down.
I recently flew to Florida and my pocket trumpet is considered a carry on for jetblue so I never have a problem! Hopefully your next journey with your bass will go well!
A tip I was given but have yet to have occasion to use is to carry your gig bag on your back upside-down! The logic behind it is since it's not sticking up in the air it's less visible and less prone to bring attention.
Any bass or guitar player who flies a lot should check out Klos instruments. They're designed for air travel with the detachable neck (threaded neck screws and a low profile headstock), and they sound excellent. Definitely worth a look if this is something you deal with often.
I use the SKB bass safe which my kiesel soft case fits perfectly. It has a TSA lock. I've flown 4 times cross country, that's 8 flight changes and my $2700 Kiesel came through perfectly
I’m a flight attendant and this was really interesting to see. Good points about being nice to staff, usually that works best. Hopefully you will continue having positive experiences while travelling with instruments and I wish more airline staff would see this video tbh. Good luck! :)
From the reddit answers you got it sounds a lot like there’s a lot of misunderstanding among flight attendants. “Don’t take your guitar” is a bit shocking. More awareness is needed
I play the Shamisen, it's a japanese string instrument for those who didn't know. Most Shamisen these days have something called "mitsuori", meaning the long neck of the instrument is in three pieces that are really easy to take apart and reconnect, this makes it really easy to travel with. My case wasn't as lucky though, since it was large enough to have to be checked as "bulky luggage", it was probably thrown around a lot since it was really damaged when I got it back.
Best of luck to anyone traveling with their instrument!
I used to work with the keyboard tech from a fairly large British band from the 80s (not name-dropping here). He said that (at the time) he had a huge amount of success touring the keybaords in the their original cardboard boxes. A flightcase looks sturdy so gets chucked around (with the results that you showed), but a slightly battered cardboard box, held together with tape and bearing the manufacturer's name and a picture of the contents gets treated a little more gently.
I don't fly but I take a lot of trains with bicycles. Somehow most train companies in Europe are really trying hard to make it difficult to travel by train with a bicycle. Or anything else than a small suitcase really.
Since many of the same kinds of rolling stock are used across the continent, I wonder if that is for the same reason as the UK... Where you have to prebook to carry a non-folding bike as the same space is used for that as one of the train's wheelchair spaces. I recently took a trip as a wheelcahir user and found the space opposite where I was sat was occupied by a bike.
Tbh, it's a shame they got rid of the guard carriage on trains, most of which was empty space for carrying things like bikes...
I bought a small classical guitar in Denmark. I brought it on the two flights it took to get back to the US and the thing that saved me was being polite to flight attendants who were already super kind. Guitar made it safely back to the US!