On the product page they list > 250k combinations, and since we are talking on/off states that means 2^18 or 262144 real combinations. With 18 bits of state I'd guess it's a 3*6 matrix on that key.
@@plattrap Very cool! So pairs of magnets in each "slot". Each pair can be oriented one of 4 different ways, and each pair can consist of NS, SN, NN, SS polarities. 4 polarity combinations, 4 orientations (though two seem almost identical). That's 16 combinations per slot. And 6 slots. 16^6 combinations? I get over 16 million, not just 250k. But cool that there are apparently only 12 magnets inside. Additionally cool is the fact that each magnet could each push (repel) or pull (attract) something in the lock. If they're smart, there are no magnets in the lock at all, and an additional combination would be to use no magnet in one of the openings. Or maybe a strong versus a weak magnet that would only pull a passive pin either hard (with a stronger spring) or gently (because too hard would pull it too high). No magnets in the lock means it's impossible to snoop the pattern without the key.
@@GeekinTX If you look at the second picture there, it only hast two combinations for the magnets of each slot (they call it red and black), so it seems both magnets always have the same polarity in each slot. With that you reach the 18 bits, so >250k is about right.
@@moe.m It's somewhat confusing. There are four orientations: {J,U,L,Z}, and two orientation subtypes (e.g., J, J0), and two polarities (rouge, noir). That is 16 combinations, but I suspect every other magnet must be a '0' subtype, so that is really only 8, and 8^6 ≈ 262k. I think a way to pick it would be to put some tension on the shackle and then put one of those magnet inserts over one of the 6 "pins" on the padlock and rotate the insert. Keep doing this until you find the binder and click it into place. Do this for all six "pins".
Very cool lock. You could probably use some iron-filings to see the pattern of the magnets inside the key, and possibly the lock as well to see how the fields are interacting.
@@TheTutch , studying the key of a new lock design is often essential, not to cheat with decoding, but to understand how the system works and develop strategies to attack that system and not only that particular lock.
@@danardalin That's the truth. Id be a billionaire if I was given money every time someone wanted something that would help their business and lives until they see the cost, even though the technology pays for itself. The shortsightedness of people is crazy.
@@TheTutch that's kinda my point. Locks only keep honest people honest. The best you can hope for is to provide enough of a hassle that a thief moves on to the next house
Coded magnets are common for magnetic safety interlocks for industrial machine doors and safety gates to keep operators from bypassing them using standard magnets.
My only complaint owning one of these would be that the "key" would stick to my other keys on the keyring and collect iron filings and other magnetic junk. Also probably don't want to put it too close to your phone or credit cards...
It had plastic covering to prevent the key getting dirty. Credit cards for sure, but my phone is held to my car dashboard with a magnet. Modern SSDs aren't magnetic, so phones would be safe.
The only thing in your phone which gets irritated by the magnetic key is the internal compass sensor. Unless you have a cover with room for credit cards and they are in the cover, then they are in danger.
@@exys2086 ATMs without NFC may have a hall sensor to prevent you to stick things without stripe into them. So if the stripe is demagnetized you need a second card to get your card inside (in Europe the visible chip is used to read the card). I demagnetized my card when the chips where introduced and at that time also some readers in shops only would use the chip if they found the use chip trigger on the stripe. Nowadays almost all shops have NFC but the ATMS with NFC are still rare. If you are into retro tech or need cards with stripes for other reasons be careful with tablets! Most have very strong magnets in the back to hold magnetic covers. It may destroy floppy disks also. And I am quite sure I destroyed a portable 512GB hard disk by having it 8 hours in the same bag as a tablet.
Bill, the proper way to use a demagnetizer is to place the object to be demagnetized in close proximity, activate the demagnetizer, move the object around and then slowly withdraw it from the demagnetizer, all the while keeping the demagnetizer on.
That matters if you want to have a fully demagnetised thing. If your goal is only to disturb the magnetisation, it doesn't matter. Because the key worked, it did not demagnetise or wrongly magnetise anything, so diddnt matter.
@@bjm1219 "Permanent magnet" only means that there is residual internal magnetic field left after the external magnet field has been removed. (Check out hysteresis loops, magnetic "hardness" etc)
Thank you for all of your hard work over the years producing lock-picking videos and sharing your knowledge with everyone. Wishing you all the best in retirement.
If you have the key, no need to profile it. If you don't have the key, you have to hope that the magnets in the lock are strong enough, if they're weak af, and rely on a strong key, you aren't going to get any sort of pattern. If they haven't done that with this iteration of the lock, they'd probably do it with the next iteration.
@@RobertSzasz nope, they could be all arranged in the same direction and the opening key will just pull someone and repel other, in similar fashion to a push keypad mechanical lock if you can imagine it
This would be a perfect lock for boats and boat equipment. Brass so it doesn’t rust, no keyway to get rusty or dirty. No worries about the key getting worn down. This thing is perfect!!!!
There's a grid of sliders in the lock and they have 2 different heights. Then a metal sheet that is connected to the ball bearings will slide if all the sliders are in the correct position. When no key is inserted, springs will force sliders into the neutral position, like normal lock. Think of this as a tubular lock but in a grid formation. A hybrid tubular/push button/magnetic lock.
Would it be possible to build a "try-me" key with all one magnetic polarity, apply it to the lock, tension the lock, remove the key, and then use viewing film to see which sliders have bound? Then test for binding with those magnets removed or reversed? I would think decoding that way probably wouldn't be "instant", but could probably be done in well under an hour.
@@dallebull yes the film would show the grid. If you can build a similar grid then adjacent poles are probably alternate orientations so you should be able to test one and get the pattern. Having said that I am not sure that I would want to carry magnet with my keys as I sometimes put my keys in the same pocket as my cards.
Hi Bill. Imho, there need not be magnets in the lock. Only small pivoted pieces of metal (kind of see saw) with a very small spring on both ends to keep it level. If the key has 2 north poles, the metal will not move. If the key has N+S, then the pivot will rotate. If the right ones have rotated, you have an open. (sorry for my bad English).
Bill, I'm going back to grade school with this idea, it won't open the lock but it will allow you to duplicate the key. Just get some paper, iron filings, put the key under the paper and sprinkle some of the filings. That will show you the layout of the magnets but not the orientation (North and South). Once you have the layout it's a matter of reorienting your magnets and then you can make a copy. That being said I doubt that anyone can just pick this lock, they'd have to brute force it. It's nice seeing a company that comes up with a unique idea for a lock, especially if it keeps you scratching your head. Take care and hope all is well!
Fun anecdote for my days at a three letter acronym: They ran into an odd diamond shaped key-way that used magnets inside, and a corresponding magnetized pattern on the key. It turned out that because the internals at the key pattern using only positive magnetic poles that just using a key blank would still attract the correct levers and was a working master key.
Billl, You fooled me when you brought out the Big Gun, Sawsall. I thought you were going to make some iron filings to create a magnetic pattern of the key. Good effort. Since it was key retaining, don't you think that your picking tool would need to stay on the lock to maintain an open state. Keep the videos coming. Thanks.
The speculation in the comments section aside, this is clearly a lock which would defeat conventional attacks, and as such appears to be substantially more secure than most of the locks on the market today.
Only because it's unconventional. If/when these locks become common, you can be pretty sure that people will figure out ways to defeat them quick enough. Maybe I am wrong, and it doesn't change the fact it's a good lock today, but if someone finds out an easy way to defeat them, you might run into issues.
@Bosianbill. Bill. When you took out that recip saw, I had a big smile on my face until you said you weren't sawing it open. Then I was happy to see you come up with that magnetic tip jig. You sure know how to get someone on an emotional joyride. Hope you and your family stay safe and well.
I came up with two ideas First figure out the layout of the internal magnets using magnetic viewing film. Then create a plastic grid (maybe a 3D printer) that can hold rare earth magnets. By listening to the lock you might be able to hear the pins moving. The other idea is to place the lock in a large copper tube and turn the whole thing into an electromagnet. That should destabilize the internal fields in the lock.
Very nice lock. Reminds me of the lock my dad had many years ago. His was a magnetic lock, with a magnetic bar on the side of the lock to open it. But his was made of stainless steel, and yes, it was very heavy.
I know you don't want to destroy such a nice lock, but I would really like to see the insides and how it works. Perhaps you could dissect a cheaper lock of the same type, although there is no guarantee that the cheap lock mechanism is anything like this one.
I've got some sheets allowing me to see magnetic fields. Placing that on there would show you the placement and orientation of magnets. All you'd need to do, is make your own key with neodymium magnets mirroring that (I'd assume). Hoping to win this guy and test it out!
@@TheTutch It looks like you tension it by pulling on the shackle. So I would not be surprised if you can open it but just pulling hard on the shackle and then using a strong magnet in both orientations a couple of times.
@@danieljaworski1294 Amazon. Search for "magnetic field viewing paper" or film or foil. might be different for different languages but something along the lines will get you to them.
There is a screw in both holes for the shackle that allows you to open the lock from the bottom, which allows you to pull the magnetic thing out of it. This is a very secure lock if you do not know the magnetic combination to mimic the key.
They probably thought about the magview and metal filings stuff... Maybe it uses steel pins instead of magnets? I guess it's internals are similar to a dimple lock, but activated by magnets. Would be nice to see this machined open
The most interesting thing about this is that the key can be re-keyed without having to do anything to the lock. It just comes down to moving the 6 plastic disks, that hold 2 magnets each, into different positions within the key...Unless I'm missing something here, I don't see any access to the lock...Great design with 250,000 code possibilities.
That's for making a new key work with a lock, if you know the lock bitting code. The lock itself can't be changed though. It's got 7 million possible combinations (250k "secure"), so changing it isn't as important lol
Ok, I was wondering about that. I was looking at the re-key kit, but it's really not re-keying, it's just a key kit. That's actually a shame that the lock can't be changed. Won't be buying one now.
Use your small magnets in a single stack to scan the lock's key zone, mapping out where attracted, where repelled. Odds are, magnets glued up in an array attracting at every position will work. (The key is attracted, so the bulk of the grid positions are set up for attraction. It's possible they've been sneaky and set a few positions to work in a repelling sense, and trap pins of a sort may be possible.)
Probably attracts and retracts at the same time making the possible combination astronomical making it harder to decode / allowing the company to make more locks with out repeating the same pattern of magnetic keys for a very long time. Very cool lock
magnetic locks have been around for a long time. Old ones i seen used metal pins and a magnetic key they had 10 pins and 10 spots for magnets in the key. This prevented using any old magnet to open it by filling all the pin spots with pins. So if you used the wrong key or a magnet you would pull other pins in place and they would trap the lock so you could not open it even though the 5 proper pins were also moved where they belonged. Pretty damn elegant solution 25 or 30 years ago. But with only 5 pins 5 strong small magnets eg buckyballs or buckycubes it was pretty easy to pick em. This lock uses the same number of magnets inside the lock and in the key each needs to move the proper direction towards the key or away for a unlock. Strait up brilliant .But pickable none the less. Just need a device using multiple small electromagnets in the proper grid spacing. And a way to turn each one on in ither neg or positive polarity starting with all up all down 1 up rest down etc in series through all 250k combinations. With so few combos it shouldn't take more than a few minutes to try them all and some could even be out right skipped top half up bottom down same for right side left side alternating rows all up all down etc. also patterns like -+- +-+ -+- +-+ Etc could also be left out As while they probably exist in the keys your chances of running in to that exact pattern is slim to none
This is fascinating to me. In addition to locks and safes, I'm fascinated by fractal magnetism. This is similar to magnetic fractal antennas used by the Nazis during the 1930s and 1940s. They sunk several uboats filled with nazi plunder from France and Poland, and hid them using passive fractal antennas as a rudimentary GPS. The TV show White Collar tackled the idea to an extent a few years back.
This reminds me when I was a kid and my parents bought a Genii magnetic lock. I was absolutely amazed by it and I knew it had to be operated by magnets. I took it to school and showed my friends, and although none of us knew how to pick locks I passed it around and asked them to pick it. They looked at it and were dumb founded and said "where's the keyhole?" and they tried pulling it open. Then when they were done I told them "you just need super strength!" Then with the key palmed in my hand I grabbed the lock in my two hands and pulled it apart with 'ease', tossed them the open lock and said "try again.".... They never did figure it out. But Alas, the "key" only had the magnets secured by a thick plastic like sticker and curious me pulled it off to figure out how it worked and I spilled the magnets out and lost some on the ground in the process, thus ruining the lock :(
Try heating it up. If there are permanent magnets inside, they will demagnetize at their Curie temperature. I'd also love to see what it looks like with the magnetic viewing film. I wonder if there are any permanent magnetic materials in there at all, or if it's just permeable materials which are free to rotate. If they were placed between a NS pair on the key, they'd align parallel to the face of the lock, but if they were placed between a NN or SS pair on the key, and were asymmetric, they might align perpendicular. Just throwing out a half-baked idea.
I feel like a combination of examining the lock with magnetic film and then building some kind of programmable electromagnetic device would be required. From the way it shines, it looks like there may be 7-8 rows of some kind of variance
Need to get yourself some of this stuff Bill to see the format of the magnetic patterns at play. Magnetic field viewing film is used to show stationary or (less often) slowly changing magnetic fields; it shows their location and direction.
Here's the patent for the same technology, only its shown in a different lock style. It was invented by Hernan Ciecha and it is currently assigned to Capitol Industries patents.google.com/patent/US10125521B2/en?inventor=Hernan+Ciecha
Try putting it in an eyelet, while tugging on the body of the lock, smack the face of the lock with a hard plastic or rawhide mallet to kind of jostle the "pins" like you would bump pins in a normal lock cylinders. Im sure the magnets are on springs and control some sort of pin mechanism in the lock. Just a thought
Create a plastic matrix of holes 4x6 and 3x5. Use it to place magnets against the lock. Your strong small round magnets will either stick or repel from the lock magnets. When they all stick, try to open. If not, reverse the polarity of the magnets and give it a go.
What you do to brute force it, you take small coils with iron cores and connnect to your computer write a small program that will randomly change the magnetic field in the coils to change.
Very impressed. Agree with previous posts that filings may show the magnetic fields; but that is ‘Super Spy’ stuff and might not be practical in the field for a bad person..👍
With a magnetic force viewer you could see the orientation of the magnets in the key. You can get them on Amazon. Green plastic sheet you can partially see through that darken and lighten depending in the field.
To demagnitise the neodymium magnets in that lock, you need a much more powerfull demagnetiser than the one you used. Also heating it up to 150~200°C will demagnetise most magnetic materials.
+1 for blowtorch attack. The trick is knowing how the heat will impact the latching mech and springs when the magnetism is gone. (Just saw there's a followup at ua-cam.com/video/Yqioc6CIqFE/v-deo.html )
It wouldn’t surprise me if Lock Picking Lawyer buys one of these, guts it to figure out how it works, then comes up with some form of bypass that will work in under 2 minutes.
I have this Padlock AND I also have some Pole Sensor Foil. I sent some photos to Bosnian Bill and hope he will upload them to this video. I observed that the magnetic poles of the padlock appeared to be a 3 row by 4 column matrix, with some notable exceptions. The end rows were double wide. Most notable was that the "pins" appeared to be cylinders laying parallel to the flat side of the padlock with the axis running parallel to the legs of the shackle. SO the "pins' were not like a cylindrical magnet on end as you did not see round dots appearing on the sensor foil, but rather as cylinders. If i was to guess how the lock worked I would say the magnetic pins act like "sliders" and are moved longitudinally into an exact position by the corresponding magnets in the key. These magnetic "sliders" would have a "gate" cut in them. SO I think a "plate" on the bottom (if the lock were lying flat on a table), would have "fences" or projections that could be pushed up to the pins by a mechanical transfer action of pulling on the shackle. Perhaps the magnetic "sliders" at each end of a row are larger possibly with "masterkeyed" gates. Anyway that's my guess -- Perhaps I (or someone) can find a patent on this Padlock and let us ll know. Ken
How was this lock put together if there is no way to disassemble it? Molding the internals in metal? I would have at least taken apart the key to see how the magnets are arranged.
A magnetic field visualizer would help, plus a small hall sensor array matching the grid of the elements. This way you first read the position and polarity and you will be able to adjust the relative offset (the lock is not binary)
Can you get an image of the magnetic arrangement by very lightly dusting the lock with very fine iron filings? Also, perhaps a cheap magnetometer (as used in cell phones for a magnetic compass) could be connected to an Arduino or similar microcontroller to determine the arrangement. These magnetometer chips are $1 - $3 on ebay.
Iron filings and other magnetic field viewing tricks will only work if there are indeed different magnet orientations inside. A safer mechanism would be where all magnets are oriented the same, but some have to be attracted and the others repelled. In that case the magnetic field will look the same, and there is no way to figure out whether each magnet needs to be attracted or repelled.
If there are permanent magnets inside the lock, their magnetization can be ruined with hard blows, too. External magnetic fields might not work well in demagnetizing them, because the magnets inside can rotate freely to line themselves up with an external magnetic field. So take the lock, and shoot it to some rock wall at 100mph or something like that. (If you don't believe this, take your magnet, stick to an end of a long stick & whip it hard against something really hard) Also, if the internal magnets rotate freely, you might try rotating magnetic fields. Put a magnet in the end of a drill, and rotate it 2000 rpm above the "key slot". If that doesn't work, make 20 magnets rotate above it.
Hi Bill yeah they do have circular magnets on a pivot and the magnets have "sort of sharp points/pins that align to a plate in a certain directions and amounts, it a pin aligns to a hole in the plate then the plate is allowed to move over the pins then the plate clears the ball bearings and the shackel can be pulled open. There is zero room for error. I would have to draw you a picture to explain. Paul UK
You can get some of those magnetic field indicator mats and see whether you can see the pattern on the lock(and then make a key) Only thing that came to mind.
Hypothesis: The cylinders that house the lightly magnetic lock pins (each of which is perpendicular to the surface) are not bidirectional. Mayhaps some pins' chambers face forwards and others face backwards. This would mean that pulling some pins out of locked position via a large magnetic field would always pull some others into locked position. It would also prevent attempts to demagnetize and then pull all to one side.
If you sprinkled the lock with iron sand you would see the matrix . Possibly harder in new locks but the steel pins would become magnetized easily by rubbing a big magnet over it a few times
Did you try opening the lock while the demagnetizer was running? A demagnetizer rapidly alternates the polarity of the magnetic field it generates. That might have acted like a rake to the sensors inside the lock.
BILL! Because it has 5 rows of magnets and you have 5 rows of magnets instead of going perpendicular to the rows you need to going parallel to the magnets...so the first orientation you tried with the reciprocating saw but going left and right instead of up and down
There's a typo in the description. In the title is says Capitol and description it says Capitor. Depending on the way in which the lock is built it may be possible to open it with that powerful magnet. If the shackle is tensioned and the magnet applied in 1 polarity and then the other it's possible the lock could be opened in a SPP style. My other thought is that if 2 magnets are used with 1 on either side of the lock you may get something happening. Without seeing the innards it's all just guessing though. The lock is meant to have more than 250,000 codes which suggests that it must be something like a 10 by 5 matrix.
One destructive method, without cutting it apart: Heat would demagnetise it, permanently. But doing that might not work, because one of two things can happen. Either the key, or any other magnet of sufficient strength could just pull all of the actuators in one direction, and not allow the lock to open. Or demagnetising it could simply leave the lock incapable of locking again, because no magnets are available for locking the system. For a non-destructive method, how about using the soft hammer on the shackle, or subjecting it to repetitive vibration? Another fairly simple method could be to make your own duplicate key: Purchase enough small magnets to make a full array. Arrange all small magnets so that they are all attracted to each part of the activation area, by using one magnet at a time to decode the matrix, and then attaching them to a support. Now move the array which you constructed to and away from the front of the activation area. If that doesn't work, reverse the polarity of all magnets by flipping the array the other face upwards and then move to and from the activation pad. That latter method would work, unless the manufacturer has constructed the lock so that the key deliberately attracts some areas and repels others. If so, then kudos to them.
Great review Bill, and looking very secure against non-destructive attack. I can wonder if a pattern of small magnets stuck to this lock, so that they are all pulling on the ones in the lock at the same time might work. If not, then all held down in some way and each turned over so all are pushing away in the right pattern? This feels like a way to "Impression' the magnetic lock much like filing a key. There is also plastic sheet you can buy that shows magnetic patterns. and I can't remember who makes it but a small pivoting needle on a stick to show where magnets are and which pole is which.
The little magnets can be used to decode the lock. Get them all on there with the poles in the attractive orientation. If that doesn't do the trick, put a piece of tape on the magnets and flip them over, but likely the attractive side is the key since the real key sticks and doesn't repel. Weaker magnets (or smaller) may be easier. Just my guess... It's possible some magnets may need to repel and some attract.
You could possibly cover the key with tape then sprinkle on iron filings to see where and or how many magnets are present, that should at least give you an idea of how the magnetic "matrix" is arranged.
These are available from officekeys.ca. There is also a lock cylinder protector version that screws over the lock cylinder and has a magnetic lock in a covering slide. They use several sets of magnetically operated binary pins arranged in radial groups of 3. The padlock version has two rows of 3 groups. That gives 2^(3*2*3) combinations (262,144) !
![[1080] Better Than Most: Abus Granit 68 Victory X-Plus Picked](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Csa01fsnCQE/mqdefault.jpg)
Hm... You've probably heard of magnetic viewing film, right? It might be possible to use that to decode the lock, or at least the key.
I was thinking the same thing when I was watching the vid
I wanted to see him pull one of those out the whole time!
Maybe difficult if the magnets are in the key and not the lock
@@SirHackaL0t. some of the little magnets he has are repelled by the lock, so there has to be something in there at least.
Exactly what i was thinking.
On the product page they list > 250k combinations, and since we are talking on/off states that means 2^18 or 262144 real combinations. With 18 bits of state I'd guess it's a 3*6 matrix on that key.
You're probably right. I was thinking the same before reading the comments and seeing that you had already come to the same conclusion.
Have a look at the re-keying kit officekeys.ca/product/capitol-magnetic-padlock-re-keying-kit-kt6w01-10/
@@plattrap Very cool! So pairs of magnets in each "slot". Each pair can be oriented one of 4 different ways, and each pair can consist of NS, SN, NN, SS polarities. 4 polarity combinations, 4 orientations (though two seem almost identical). That's 16 combinations per slot. And 6 slots. 16^6 combinations? I get over 16 million, not just 250k. But cool that there are apparently only 12 magnets inside. Additionally cool is the fact that each magnet could each push (repel) or pull (attract) something in the lock. If they're smart, there are no magnets in the lock at all, and an additional combination would be to use no magnet in one of the openings. Or maybe a strong versus a weak magnet that would only pull a passive pin either hard (with a stronger spring) or gently (because too hard would pull it too high). No magnets in the lock means it's impossible to snoop the pattern without the key.
@@GeekinTX If you look at the second picture there, it only hast two combinations for the magnets of each slot (they call it red and black), so it seems both magnets always have the same polarity in each slot. With that you reach the 18 bits, so >250k is about right.
@@moe.m It's somewhat confusing. There are four orientations: {J,U,L,Z}, and two orientation subtypes (e.g., J, J0), and two polarities (rouge, noir). That is 16 combinations, but I suspect every other magnet must be a '0' subtype, so that is really only 8, and 8^6 ≈ 262k. I think a way to pick it would be to put some tension on the shackle and then put one of those magnet inserts over one of the 6 "pins" on the padlock and rotate the insert. Keep doing this until you find the binder and click it into place. Do this for all six "pins".
Very cool lock. You could probably use some iron-filings to see the pattern of the magnets inside the key, and possibly the lock as well to see how the fields are interacting.
I was thinking the same thing
And now I read someone else had my same idea. Surrounded by geniuses, not a bad place to be...lol.
@@TheTutch IF you can decode/map the key, it would still be a weakness in the design.
@@TheTutch , studying the key of a new lock design is often essential, not to cheat with decoding, but to understand how the system works and develop strategies to attack that system and not only that particular lock.
magnetic viewing film would be better
Imagine that... a lock builder that actually thought about the lock before they built it...
@@TheTutch Happens in the IT world all the time.
@@danardalin That's the truth. Id be a billionaire if I was given money every time someone wanted something that would help their business and lives until they see the cost, even though the technology pays for itself. The shortsightedness of people is crazy.
@@TheTutch according to an old saying I've heard several times, a locked shed only keeps an honest neighbor honest
@@TheTutch that's kinda my point. Locks only keep honest people honest. The best you can hope for is to provide enough of a hassle that a thief moves on to the next house
If I win this lock, I would donate it back to BosnianBill to mill it open for all of us to see!
That would be cool to see. If I win I'll do the same
If I win it, I will sell it to you so that you can give it to BosnianBill, so that he can mill it open. 😁
👍 we really need to see what's inside
The hero we need!
@@my3dviews If I win it, I will sell it to you so you can sell it to him so he can send it to Bosnianbill to mill it open.
This is absolutely one of the coolest locks I've ever seen. So simple and will outlast me, you, the kids, grandkids, etc.
Coded magnets are common for magnetic safety interlocks for industrial machine doors and safety gates to keep operators from bypassing them using standard magnets.
Great to see manufacturers that pay attention to the locksport community. :)
Oh nooooo, we can’t stop here. We must dissect this thing and learn more about it or I will never sleep again.
My only complaint owning one of these would be that the "key" would stick to my other keys on the keyring and collect iron filings and other magnetic junk. Also probably don't want to put it too close to your phone or credit cards...
It had plastic covering to prevent the key getting dirty. Credit cards for sure, but my phone is held to my car dashboard with a magnet. Modern SSDs aren't magnetic, so phones would be safe.
The only thing in your phone which gets irritated by the magnetic key is the internal compass sensor. Unless you have a cover with room for credit cards and they are in the cover, then they are in danger.
@@HSishi, does anyone still use magnetic strip over NFC?.. Never saw anyone do that.
The key comes with a steel shield to prevent that from happening.
@@exys2086 ATMs without NFC may have a hall sensor to prevent you to stick things without stripe into them. So if the stripe is demagnetized you need a second card to get your card inside (in Europe the visible chip is used to read the card). I demagnetized my card when the chips where introduced and at that time also some readers in shops only would use the chip if they found the use chip trigger on the stripe. Nowadays almost all shops have NFC but the ATMS with NFC are still rare.
If you are into retro tech or need cards with stripes for other reasons be careful with tablets! Most have very strong magnets in the back to hold magnetic covers. It may destroy floppy disks also. And I am quite sure I destroyed a portable 512GB hard disk by having it 8 hours in the same bag as a tablet.
Bill, the proper way to use a demagnetizer is to place the object to be demagnetized in close proximity, activate the demagnetizer, move the object around and then slowly withdraw it from the demagnetizer, all the while keeping the demagnetizer on.
That matters if you want to have a fully demagnetised thing. If your goal is only to disturb the magnetisation, it doesn't matter. Because the key worked, it did not demagnetise or wrongly magnetise anything, so diddnt matter.
or heat it til it loses magnetism
Demagnetizers don’t work on permanent magnets either
@@bjm1219 demagnetisers work on any magnet where they can exceed the relevant field strength.
@@bjm1219
"Permanent magnet" only means that there is residual internal magnetic field left after the external magnet field has been removed. (Check out hysteresis loops, magnetic "hardness" etc)
Good luck Bosniabill ! Thank you for this awesome collection of videos that should remain anchored in history ! You will be missed !
This is one of my favourite video. Thanks for sharing. Enjoy your retirement Bill and thanks for your awesome generosity all these years
Thank you for all of your hard work over the years producing lock-picking videos and sharing your knowledge with everyone.
Wishing you all the best in retirement.
Iron filings would show you the pattern on the key.
But then the only way to open the lock would be to get the key, and since you already have the key what's the point 😂
@@_Undeadkenny_ but not so much. If they just have magnets in the body all you need to do is read out the lock body.
If you have the key, no need to profile it. If you don't have the key, you have to hope that the magnets in the lock are strong enough, if they're weak af, and rely on a strong key, you aren't going to get any sort of pattern. If they haven't done that with this iteration of the lock, they'd probably do it with the next iteration.
@@RobertSzasz nope, they could be all arranged in the same direction and the opening key will just pull someone and repel other, in similar fashion to a push keypad mechanical lock if you can imagine it
You can get a special film that is reactive to magnetic fields. By putting it on the lock you might be able to decode it.
This would be a perfect lock for boats and boat equipment. Brass so it doesn’t rust, no keyway to get rusty or dirty. No worries about the key getting worn down. This thing is perfect!!!!
only real issue is the discs inside getting fine dirt trapped in them. theres no way it seems to flush it out once it gets in there.
There's a grid of sliders in the lock and they have 2 different heights. Then a metal sheet that is connected to the ball bearings will slide if all the sliders are in the correct position. When no key is inserted, springs will force sliders into the neutral position, like normal lock.
Think of this as a tubular lock but in a grid formation. A hybrid tubular/push button/magnetic lock.
Would it be possible to build a "try-me" key with all one magnetic polarity, apply it to the lock, tension the lock, remove the key, and then use viewing film to see which sliders have bound? Then test for binding with those magnets removed or reversed? I would think decoding that way probably wouldn't be "instant", but could probably be done in well under an hour.
The manufacturer said in a reply to another comment that the magnets are on rotating discs
They claim it has over 250,000 combinations
Now that's an amazing lock. Gotta love how they give you an assortment of shackles to fit most of your needs.
Not sure they include the shackles. I think that was for marketing. Likely you just pick the right lock when you buy it.
Oh man, I must not have been paying attention too well the first time 😓😅
I would love the see the key and lock with magnetic field viewing films! Also, you know you have to mill it, right?
He should start a 2nd channel _Bosnianmill_
I suspect the fields are too close together for the film to work with any reliable resolution
Björn Dahlberg the film will just show there is magnetic fields. You need to figure out the polarity of them.
@@ruckus724 Yeah, but you should be able to see a grid pattern of the magnets, and at least see if its 3x4, 3x3, 4x5 or something no?
@@dallebull yes the film would show the grid. If you can build a similar grid then adjacent poles are probably alternate orientations so you should be able to test one and get the pattern.
Having said that I am not sure that I would want to carry magnet with my keys as I sometimes put my keys in the same pocket as my cards.
Hi Bill. Imho, there need not be magnets in the lock. Only small pivoted pieces of metal (kind of see saw) with a very small spring on both ends to keep it level.
If the key has 2 north poles, the metal will not move. If the key has N+S, then the pivot will rotate. If the right ones have rotated, you have an open. (sorry for my bad English).
Bill, I'm going back to grade school with this idea, it won't open the lock but it will allow you to duplicate the key. Just get some paper, iron filings, put the key under the paper and sprinkle some of the filings. That will show you the layout of the magnets but not the orientation (North and South). Once you have the layout it's a matter of reorienting your magnets and then you can make a copy. That being said I doubt that anyone can just pick this lock, they'd have to brute force it. It's nice seeing a company that comes up with a unique idea for a lock, especially if it keeps you scratching your head. Take care and hope all is well!
Fun anecdote for my days at a three letter acronym: They ran into an odd diamond shaped key-way that used magnets inside, and a corresponding magnetized pattern on the key. It turned out that because the internals at the key pattern using only positive magnetic poles that just using a key blank would still attract the correct levers and was a working master key.
That may very well be the coolest lock I've seen in a while.
Seems like an excellent lock, Bill, thanks for showing. I know you don't want to mill it open, but I would love to see how it works...
Billl, You fooled me when you brought out the Big Gun, Sawsall. I thought you were going to make some iron filings to create a magnetic pattern of the key. Good effort. Since it was key retaining, don't you think that your picking tool would need to stay on the lock to maintain an open state. Keep the videos coming. Thanks.
tbh the jigsaw setup just looks like a new torture technique but for locks lol.
That is a cool lock design!
The speculation in the comments section aside, this is clearly a lock which would defeat conventional attacks, and as such appears to be substantially more secure than most of the locks on the market today.
Only because it's unconventional. If/when these locks become common, you can be pretty sure that people will figure out ways to defeat them quick enough. Maybe I am wrong, and it doesn't change the fact it's a good lock today, but if someone finds out an easy way to defeat them, you might run into issues.
This is awesome.
@Bosianbill. Bill. When you took out that recip saw, I had a big smile on my face until you said you weren't sawing it open. Then I was happy to see you come up with that magnetic tip jig. You sure know how to get someone on an emotional joyride.
Hope you and your family stay safe and well.
Would be very interesting to view this one through a magnetic paper.
magnetic viewing film or ferror fluid.
Both on the key and on the lock.
Both should give out some information like the magnet grid.
I like that lock. Very cool design.
I came up with two ideas First figure out the layout of the internal magnets using magnetic viewing film. Then create a plastic grid (maybe a 3D printer) that can hold rare earth magnets.
By listening to the lock you might be able to hear the pins moving.
The other idea is to place the lock in a large copper tube and turn the whole thing into an electromagnet. That should destabilize the internal fields in the lock.
Very nice lock. Reminds me of the lock my dad had many years ago. His was a magnetic lock, with a magnetic bar on the side of the lock to open it. But his was made of stainless steel, and yes, it was very heavy.
I know you don't want to destroy such a nice lock, but I would really like to see the insides and how it works. Perhaps you could dissect a cheaper lock of the same type, although there is no guarantee that the cheap lock mechanism is anything like this one.
Maybe there's a way to non-destructively disassemble the lock for rekeying purposes, similar to repinning pin tumbler padlocks. [Edit: Spelling]
Their re-keying video on their web site of a smaller cabinet lock suggests that the magnets are different strengths and polarities.
Kako se zove.....chopstick! lol Thanks you Bill for entertaining us in these hard times.
Sweet lock. I was waiting for the disassembly but was sorely disappointed.
I'm actually glad he didn't. I have a feeling he isn't finished trying with this lock!
@@MrV1NC3N7V3G4 I think you're probably right
I guess you made some Canadian company very happy with this video :-)
I've got some sheets allowing me to see magnetic fields.
Placing that on there would show you the placement and orientation of magnets.
All you'd need to do, is make your own key with neodymium magnets mirroring that (I'd assume).
Hoping to win this guy and test it out!
there is a chance that everything in side is oriented in the same way. so you have to push some and have to pull some.
@@TheTutch It looks like you tension it by pulling on the shackle. So I would not be surprised if you can open it but just pulling hard on the shackle and then using a strong magnet in both orientations a couple of times.
Where did you get the sheets that let you see magnetic fields?
@@danieljaworski1294 Amazon. Search for "magnetic field viewing paper" or film or foil. might be different for different languages but something along the lines will get you to them.
@@danieljaworski1294 Magnetic Field Viewer Film on eBay ;)
I'm interested to see this concept used in other types of locks
Capitol Industries, the next padlock you might consider to make with this tech should probably be a disk padlock.
Wow! Thats a nice look, well played Sir.
There is a screw in both holes for the shackle that allows you to open the lock from the bottom, which allows you to pull the magnetic thing out of it.
This is a very secure lock if you do not know the magnetic combination to mimic the key.
They probably thought about the magview and metal filings stuff... Maybe it uses steel pins instead of magnets?
I guess it's internals are similar to a dimple lock, but activated by magnets. Would be nice to see this machined open
The most interesting thing about this is that the key can be re-keyed without having to do anything to the lock. It just comes down to moving the 6 plastic disks, that hold 2 magnets each, into different positions within the key...Unless I'm missing something here, I don't see any access to the lock...Great design with 250,000 code possibilities.
That's for making a new key work with a lock, if you know the lock bitting code.
The lock itself can't be changed though.
It's got 7 million possible combinations (250k "secure"), so changing it isn't as important lol
Ok, I was wondering about that. I was looking at the re-key kit, but it's really not re-keying, it's just a key kit. That's actually a shame that the lock can't be changed. Won't be buying one now.
Use your small magnets in a single stack to scan the lock's key zone, mapping out where attracted, where repelled. Odds are, magnets glued up in an array attracting at every position will work. (The key is attracted, so the bulk of the grid positions are set up for attraction. It's possible they've been sneaky and set a few positions to work in a repelling sense, and trap pins of a sort may be possible.)
Probably attracts and retracts at the same time making the possible combination astronomical making it harder to decode / allowing the company to make more locks with out repeating the same pattern of magnetic keys for a very long time. Very cool lock
I've been messing with building a lock like this as a challenge lock for nearly 4 months and then this argh... Thought it was a unique idea then bam
magnetic locks have been around for a long time. Old ones i seen used metal pins and a magnetic key they had 10 pins and 10 spots for magnets in the key. This prevented using any old magnet to open it by filling all the pin spots with pins. So if you used the wrong key or a magnet you would pull other pins in place and they would trap the lock so you could not open it even though the 5 proper pins were also moved where they belonged. Pretty damn elegant solution 25 or 30 years ago. But with only 5 pins 5 strong small magnets eg buckyballs or buckycubes it was pretty easy to pick em. This lock uses the same number of magnets inside the lock and in the key each needs to move the proper direction towards the key or away for a unlock. Strait up brilliant .But pickable none the less. Just need a device using multiple small electromagnets in the proper grid spacing. And a way to turn each one on in ither neg or positive polarity starting with all up all down 1 up rest down etc in series through all 250k combinations. With so few combos it shouldn't take more than a few minutes to try them all and some could even be out right skipped top half up bottom down same for right side left side alternating rows all up all down etc. also patterns like
-+-
+-+
-+-
+-+
Etc could also be left out As while they probably exist in the keys your chances of running in to that exact pattern is slim to none
@@nanaki-seto By the time you picked it you would be in handcuffs.
This is fascinating to me. In addition to locks and safes, I'm fascinated by fractal magnetism. This is similar to magnetic fractal antennas used by the Nazis during the 1930s and 1940s. They sunk several uboats filled with nazi plunder from France and Poland, and hid them using passive fractal antennas as a rudimentary GPS. The TV show White Collar tackled the idea to an extent a few years back.
That's one great shed lock. If Bill can't open it after all those hours of work then it's for me! Can you get them in the US?
This reminds me when I was a kid and my parents bought a Genii magnetic lock. I was absolutely amazed by it and I knew it had to be operated by magnets. I took it to school and showed my friends, and although none of us knew how to pick locks I passed it around and asked them to pick it. They looked at it and were dumb founded and said "where's the keyhole?" and they tried pulling it open. Then when they were done I told them "you just need super strength!" Then with the key palmed in my hand I grabbed the lock in my two hands and pulled it apart with 'ease', tossed them the open lock and said "try again.".... They never did figure it out. But Alas, the "key" only had the magnets secured by a thick plastic like sticker and curious me pulled it off to figure out how it worked and I spilled the magnets out and lost some on the ground in the process, thus ruining the lock :(
Try heating it up. If there are permanent magnets inside, they will demagnetize at their Curie temperature. I'd also love to see what it looks like with the magnetic viewing film.
I wonder if there are any permanent magnetic materials in there at all, or if it's just permeable materials which are free to rotate. If they were placed between a NS pair on the key, they'd align parallel to the face of the lock, but if they were placed between a NN or SS pair on the key, and were asymmetric, they might align perpendicular. Just throwing out a half-baked idea.
I feel like a combination of examining the lock with magnetic film and then building some kind of programmable electromagnetic device would be required. From the way it shines, it looks like there may be 7-8 rows of some kind of variance
Wow, I am bamboozled how the hell can you break in without the key? Great Video and attempts on breaking in. Thank you!
C4
Need to get yourself some of this stuff Bill to see the format of the magnetic patterns at play.
Magnetic field viewing film is used to show stationary or (less often) slowly changing magnetic fields; it shows their location and direction.
How about a hammer or 2 to shock the ball bearings to release?
Neat, it's like a magnetic QR code!
Bill, surely they filed a patent and that would be easier to see, than cutting up the lock?
Here's the patent for the same technology, only its shown in a different lock style.
It was invented by Hernan Ciecha and it is currently assigned to Capitol Industries
patents.google.com/patent/US10125521B2/en?inventor=Hernan+Ciecha
Try putting it in an eyelet, while tugging on the body of the lock, smack the face of the lock with a hard plastic or rawhide mallet to kind of jostle the "pins" like you would bump pins in a normal lock cylinders. Im sure the magnets are on springs and control some sort of pin mechanism in the lock. Just a thought
Create a plastic matrix of holes 4x6 and 3x5. Use it to place magnets against the lock. Your strong small round magnets will either stick or repel from the lock magnets. When they all stick, try to open. If not, reverse the polarity of the magnets and give it a go.
What you do to brute force it, you take small coils with iron cores and connnect to your computer
write a small program that will randomly change the magnetic field in the coils to change.
Very impressed. Agree with previous posts that filings may show the magnetic fields; but that is ‘Super Spy’ stuff and might not be practical in the field for a bad person..👍
If I was in the field and needed to get in I'd probably head straight for the C4. Why pussyfoot around?
you can get special film that shows the field, search for "magnetic field viewing film"
Or you could use a little powder from a copy machine. (That black stuff sticks to magnets. Just be careful with it. It's said to be carcinogenic.)
With a magnetic force viewer you could see the orientation of the magnets in the key. You can get them on Amazon. Green plastic sheet you can partially see through that darken and lighten depending in the field.
To demagnitise the neodymium magnets in that lock, you need a much more powerfull demagnetiser than the one you used. Also heating it up to 150~200°C will demagnetise most magnetic materials.
Magnets lose their abilities when they're heated. Maybe attacking this with a blowtorch would , so you can shake them out of the way when cooled of...
Might just brick it.
+1 for blowtorch attack. The trick is knowing how the heat will impact the latching mech and springs when the magnetism is gone. (Just saw there's a followup at ua-cam.com/video/Yqioc6CIqFE/v-deo.html )
It wouldn’t surprise me if Lock Picking Lawyer buys one of these, guts it to figure out how it works, then comes up with some form of bypass that will work in under 2 minutes.
I have this Padlock AND I also have some Pole Sensor Foil. I sent some photos to Bosnian Bill and hope he will upload them to this video. I observed that the magnetic poles of the padlock appeared to be a 3 row by 4 column matrix, with some notable exceptions. The end rows were double wide. Most notable was that the "pins" appeared to be cylinders laying parallel to the flat side of the padlock with the axis running parallel to the legs of the shackle. SO the "pins' were not like a cylindrical magnet on end as you did not see round dots appearing on the sensor foil, but rather as cylinders.
If i was to guess how the lock worked I would say the magnetic pins act like "sliders" and are moved longitudinally into an exact position by the corresponding magnets in the key. These magnetic "sliders" would have a "gate" cut in them. SO I think a "plate" on the bottom (if the lock were lying flat on a table), would have "fences" or projections that could be pushed up to the pins by a mechanical transfer action of pulling on the shackle. Perhaps the magnetic "sliders" at each end of a row are larger possibly with "masterkeyed" gates.
Anyway that's my guess -- Perhaps I (or someone) can find a patent on this Padlock and let us ll know. Ken
Just added to my wishlist.
That is a fantastic lock
How was this lock put together if there is no way to disassemble it? Molding the internals in metal?
I would have at least taken apart the key to see how the magnets are arranged.
A magnetic field visualizer would help, plus a small hall sensor array matching the grid of the elements. This way you first read the position and polarity and you will be able to adjust the relative offset (the lock is not binary)
Can you get an image of the magnetic arrangement by very lightly dusting the lock with very fine iron filings? Also, perhaps a cheap magnetometer (as used in cell phones for a magnetic compass) could be connected to an Arduino or similar microcontroller to determine the arrangement.
These magnetometer chips are $1 - $3 on ebay.
Interesting lock... I was thinking 'Magnetic Viewing Film' also... just to see what's up.
Awesome lock!
Iron filings and other magnetic field viewing tricks will only work if there are indeed different magnet orientations inside.
A safer mechanism would be where all magnets are oriented the same, but some have to be attracted and the others repelled. In that case the magnetic field will look the same, and there is no way to figure out whether each magnet needs to be attracted or repelled.
If there are permanent magnets inside the lock, their magnetization can be ruined with hard blows, too. External magnetic fields might not work well in demagnetizing them, because the magnets inside can rotate freely to line themselves up with an external magnetic field.
So take the lock, and shoot it to some rock wall at 100mph or something like that.
(If you don't believe this, take your magnet, stick to an end of a long stick & whip it hard against something really hard)
Also, if the internal magnets rotate freely, you might try rotating magnetic fields. Put a magnet in the end of a drill, and rotate it 2000 rpm above the "key slot". If that doesn't work, make 20 magnets rotate above it.
Have you tried rapping the side of the lock to align the magnets without the use of any magnets with some tension on the shackle?
Hi Bill yeah they do have circular magnets on a pivot and the magnets have "sort of sharp points/pins that align to a plate in a certain directions and amounts, it a pin aligns to a hole in the plate then the plate is allowed to move over the pins then the plate clears the ball bearings and the shackel can be pulled open. There is zero room for error. I would have to draw you a picture to explain. Paul UK
You can get some of those magnetic field indicator mats and see whether you can see the pattern on the lock(and then make a key)
Only thing that came to mind.
I might get this one pretty cool
Hypothesis: The cylinders that house the lightly magnetic lock pins (each of which is perpendicular to the surface) are not bidirectional. Mayhaps some pins' chambers face forwards and others face backwards. This would mean that pulling some pins out of locked position via a large magnetic field would always pull some others into locked position. It would also prevent attempts to demagnetize and then pull all to one side.
Try to use a magnetic field detection film, it shows the filds so you know what is where.
If you sprinkled the lock with iron sand you would see the matrix . Possibly harder in new locks but the steel pins would become magnetized easily by rubbing a big magnet over it a few times
Maybe try using the small magnets and match the poles to those of the lock 👍good luck👍
Did you try opening the lock while the demagnetizer was running? A demagnetizer rapidly alternates the polarity of the magnetic field it generates. That might have acted like a rake to the sensors inside the lock.
BILL! Because it has 5 rows of magnets and you have 5 rows of magnets instead of going perpendicular to the rows you need to going parallel to the magnets...so the first orientation you tried with the reciprocating saw but going left and right instead of up and down
Nice looking lock.
Could you slim the shackle where the ball bearings are?
Wow. Glad to see a lock that you couldn't brute force (specific to magnets...)
There's a typo in the description. In the title is says Capitol and description it says Capitor.
Depending on the way in which the lock is built it may be possible to open it with that powerful magnet. If the shackle is tensioned and the magnet applied in 1 polarity and then the other it's possible the lock could be opened in a SPP style. My other thought is that if 2 magnets are used with 1 on either side of the lock you may get something happening. Without seeing the innards it's all just guessing though.
The lock is meant to have more than 250,000 codes which suggests that it must be something like a 10 by 5 matrix.
Before you send it. Try some highpower HF inductors at varible frequencys?
Funny, the idea spinning a magnet on a drill came into my mind first as well....
One destructive method, without cutting it apart: Heat would demagnetise it, permanently. But doing that might not work, because one of two things can happen. Either the key, or any other magnet of sufficient strength could just pull all of the actuators in one direction, and not allow the lock to open. Or demagnetising it could simply leave the lock incapable of locking again, because no magnets are available for locking the system.
For a non-destructive method, how about using the soft hammer on the shackle, or subjecting it to repetitive vibration?
Another fairly simple method could be to make your own duplicate key: Purchase enough small magnets to make a full array. Arrange all small magnets so that they are all attracted to each part of the activation area, by using one magnet at a time to decode the matrix, and then attaching them to a support. Now move the array which you constructed to and away from the front of the activation area. If that doesn't work, reverse the polarity of all magnets by flipping the array the other face upwards and then move to and from the activation pad.
That latter method would work, unless the manufacturer has constructed the lock so that the key deliberately attracts some areas and repels others. If so, then kudos to them.
Great review Bill, and looking very secure against non-destructive attack.
I can wonder if a pattern of small magnets stuck to this lock, so that they are all pulling on the ones in the lock at the same time might work. If not, then all held down in some way and each turned over so all are pushing away in the right pattern? This feels like a way to "Impression' the magnetic lock much like filing a key.
There is also plastic sheet you can buy that shows magnetic patterns. and I can't remember who makes it but a small pivoting needle on a stick to show where magnets are and which pole is which.
The little magnets can be used to decode the lock. Get them all on there with the poles in the attractive orientation. If that doesn't do the trick, put a piece of tape on the magnets and flip them over, but likely the attractive side is the key since the real key sticks and doesn't repel. Weaker magnets (or smaller) may be easier. Just my guess... It's possible some magnets may need to repel and some attract.
I’ve found that nothing beats a bolt cutter for bypassing padlocks. 😉
You could possibly cover the key with tape then sprinkle on iron filings to see where and or how many magnets are present, that should at least give you an idea of how the magnetic "matrix" is arranged.
These are available from officekeys.ca. There is also a lock cylinder protector version that screws over the lock cylinder and has a magnetic lock in a covering slide. They use several sets of magnetically operated binary pins arranged in radial groups of 3. The padlock version has two rows of 3 groups. That gives 2^(3*2*3) combinations (262,144) !
Use a stud finder / small compass to map the array of the padlock.
Interesting lock, was a bit surprised to see you get a fail at opening. Very curious at what the mechanism is.