The Bible Alone - Sola Scriptura - Dr. Scott Hahn replies
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- Опубліковано 23 бер 2021
- Matt Fradd from Pints With Aquinas interviews Dr. Scott Hahn, and asks him to respond to Sola Scriptura.
For more on Matt Fradd visit:
pintswithaquinas.com/about-ma...
For more on Dr. Scott Hahn visit:
www.scotthahn.com
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It is truly amazing to see, it seems that God reassigned former atheists, protestants, and others, to be as very eloquent and passionate apologists, theologians, and defenders of the Catholic Church and faith at our time.
You're delusional.
all this to contradict what the bible says.
@Eddy Robichaud the Bible that was compiled and canonized infalliably by the Catholic church
@@sengan2475 Sorry, the Bible was in exitance by approximately 100AD
God indded moves in mysterious ways. He uses literally anything to bring us all closer and back to Him. Shalom 🕊️🙏🏼
What a treasure Dr Hahn is for Holy Mother Church! Thank God for him!
Oh he's a treasure for the church all right. Too bad he's not a treasure of truth for JESUS CHRIST!
@@blackhawklue Ok, prot troll….I’ll try to explain it to you. Since Dr Hahn teaches what the Holy Catholic Church does, it’s *all* truth.
Christ established the Catholic Church (not the 47,000 different heretical, man-made prot “churches” like the one you belong to). Since Christ established it, it’s all Truth.
Meanwhile, as a heretical prot, you deny the Eucharist, which Christ Himself told us we need to consume in order to have life. You refuse to even acknowledge that Christ Himself told us that the Eucharist *is* His body. You deny the One True Church that He established in favor of a man-made tradition started by a mentally unstable monk.
Go try your prot garbage with someone else. Your heresy won’t make any inroads here.
@@TheBadTrad 'prot troll'? 'prot garbage'? My my, have i touched a nerve? 'Since dr hahn teaches what the romish church teaches, its all truth'? Sounds kind of dystopian, hmm? Which truth? The truth to flee from idols? Or to venerate mary? That the eucharistic sacrifice is sufficient? Or that u have to simmer in purgatory? That the bishop of rome is the head of the church, or that he's infallible? Im surprised the 'mother' church hasnt declared mussolini a saint yet! Which truth- that the bloodguilty 'mother' is in fact the mother of harlots, mystery babylon, making the nations drunk, in a spiritual stupor, while she gets rich off the political 'merchants' and kings of the earth? I suggest u do some research OUTSIDE of the church narrative. Start w edmond paris' 'the secret jesuits'.
@@digging4pearls961 Yeah…I spent a lot of time responding to your last question only to see you deleted your question. I’m not going to waste anymore time with you.
@@digging4pearls961 Both your questions are not there. Only your second one is (where you also didn’t bother to even acknowledge my answer from your first question). You simply went on to another topic, again invoking Sola Scriptura which has been proven to be unbiblical and man-made.
I can defend the Holy Catholic Church all day long against tired, old disproven talking points, but I refuse to play games.
I used this clip in my discussion with a Protestant. Thanks Dr. Hann
Good to hear! 😃
Thank you if you were the one who added the text at the bottom!
Yes, I added the text showing the scripture verses mentioned, etc. I’m glad you appreciated that! You’re the first person to mention that. I was hoping it would be helpful to someone. God bless you!
@@faithofourfathers It was so very much appreciated! And God bless you!
Well-put ! ✔ Scott is on 🔥🔥
Unless he repents, he will certainly be on fire!
@@blackhawklue Said the stooooooopid WDC (Watered down Christian.
I have learned to hold the Scriptures alone inerrant. -Augustine of Hippo
Augustine is affirming that the Scriptures are inerrant, not that they are the sole authority. Other writings may err but not the Scriptures.
@@johnj9378 But, can other authorities or interpreters err? If so, doesn't that lead back to the Protestant affirmation that the church's interpretations are potentially fallible, but that the Scripture itself remains itself without error, and approachable through the right uses of the normal human means of logical interpretation of language, context, and awareness of genre, and interncanonical contexts? That is the perspicuity isn't located in the interpreter's authoritative norm, but rather in the nature of God and of language to be capable of right interpretation by an interpreter using lawful mechanisms to interpret?
@@georgeluke6382 Which scripture is without error? "Thou shalt commit adultery." Remember that one? We still can't tell for sure if John 6:4 is an insertion or not. We don't know where quotes of Jesus end and commentary of John begins. And how does psychikon translate to "natural"? Seems like that would be physikon. There must be an authority to determine what scripture is canon, what translation is acceptable, what use is to be made of it, and what sense it is to be taken in to avoid error, and it is impossible for that authority to exist within scripture itself. Are your "lawful mechanisms" found in scripture?
Canon Revisted, by Micahel, Kruger,
And Jesus' own limitation of the Canon, to the Law, Prophets, and Writings/Psalms, and his limit on Abel to Zechariah (despite the Macabees existing during his time), indicate the traditional Jewish canon, because Zechariah's only chronologically last via that canon.
Apostolic quotation in the NT of the OT aren't as clean as you're suggesting- that suggests text criticical decisions among a plethora of manuscripts is an early feature, not a bug in the Christian tradition. Centralization happens after the development of the first century canon- which seems to include LXX quotes and other Hebrew traditions. See Timothy Law's work, When God Spoke Greek.
@@georgeluke6382There's a few problems with the theory that Jesus is establishing a canon in Matthew 23. First of all, nothing in the text at all indicates that he is making a statement as to the canon of scripture. The idea that he is is simply being read into the text. Furthermore, it is the writings, not the prophets that are in debate. The context is Jesus talking about innocent people killed, not the canon of scripture.
But that's not the biggest problem. Zechariah the son of Berechiah was not the Zechariah stoned between the sanctuary and the altar. That was Zechariah the son of Jehoida, mentioned in 2 Chronicles 24 and was a completely different Zechariah. While most texts we have of Matthew say the Zechariah Jesus refers to is the son of Berechiah, it is likely an error made by a later scribe as it would simply not be true, unless Zechariah ben Jehoida also had a Berechiah in his lineage. Zechariah ben Jehoida and Zechariah the prophet lived 300 years apart. Jesus simply cannot be referring to Zechariah the prophet, because the Zechariah stoned between the altar and the sanctuary lived 300 years earlier. The only possible other explanation is that a different Zechariah ben Berechiah living around Jesus' time was killed by the people Jesus was speaking to, and that's not a big coincidence and unlikely. Either way, it cannot be a statement as to the canon of scripture, otherwise it would end with Chronicles, and thus leave out several books everyone accepts.
There is also the fact that we have many variants of that verse in Matthew that do not have the "son of Berachiah" line at all, which is evidence for a later scribe making an error, and that error getting perpetuated by accident. Either way, we know it's not Zechariah the prophet Jesus is referring to, thus the idea that He's ending the canon with him is just absurd.
For Sola fide
What the Bible asks is not only to have faith, it is to do what is true with faith. The Bible is a book with verses that are part of a whole, not separate verses to be understood as we want, taken out of context and interpreted. We may have faith, but if we are in the world we are the enemy of God. As James 4:4 said : Adulteresses that you are! Don't you know that love for the world is synonymous with hatred against God? He therefore who wants to be the friend of the world makes himself the enemy of God. If we believe what Christ said but act as the world pleases, then we are acting like the Pharisees, who believed in God, but did not act as they preached. Actions are how we show ourselves to be obedient, consistent, loving, it is through action that we prove that we really agree with what Jesus said and that we are not lying to ourselves. Faith alone is not enough, we needs actions, love, obedience, the grace of God. A servant is not a servant if he believe in what make a servant but do not serve. Actions are complementary to Faith, like women is for men. The Bible is what lead our actions, not only a speech to agree with.
This is very true.
As long as the Old Oral/Verbal Tradition does not contradict God's Written Tradition, God still allowed them to be practiced... However, if it does contradict, then God's Written Tradition which is more AUTHORITATIVE must supersede, overrule, and stop the practice immediately... (ref. 2 Timothy 3:16)...
The Oral and Written Traditions must be UNITED as ONE without confusion and division... One (United) God, One WORD (Scripture/Bible), and One TRUTH...
Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
Take Note #1:... St. Paul said, "STAND FIRMLY and HOLD ON to the TRADITIONS (plural) that you have been taught by us (Apostles) whether by words of mouth/spoke words (Oral Tradition) or by our written Epistles/letters (Written Tradition)." (ref. 2 Thessa. 2:15)... Amen.
Therefore, as long as the Oral Tradition does not contradict the Written Tradition, that is OK/FINE...
However, if there are contradictions, the WRITTEN Tradition must override/overrule/supersede the questionable ORAL/VERBAL Tradition...
In other words, the WRITTEN TRADITION has a Greater Authority over the ORAL/VERBAL TRADITION... (ref. Mark 7:1-13)...
Written Tradition of the Words of God must always PREVAIL no matter the case maybe... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen...
Dr. Scot Hahn mentioned that oral tradition is the prayer of the eucharist and much much more. Is there any source I can look into to learn about this?
At Catholic Answers.. It's very helpful. You can type in oral tradition.
The bulk of Jewish law is ORAL
the talmud is not scriptures but is still binding on jews@@thomascapitalmgt
❤️
Deuteronomy 30:14-16
14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.
15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;
16 In that I command thee this day to love the Lord thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the Lord thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it.
Faith cannot grow without loving your fellow man, even your enemies. Faith is the seed, our love for others and doing unto others as we would have done unto ourselves is the water. Faith without good deeds is dead, true faith bears good deeds. Believe as much as you want, if it's not backed up by good deeds it is of no use. The Lord who is the way, the truth and the life, did not he perform many good deeds, heal the lame, raise the dead and feed the hungry. If it's good enough for Jesus it is good enough for me.
It’s a little bit straw man. Sola Scriptura recognizes Scripture as the highest and solely ultimate authority, recognizing the authority of the church and church leadership. Everything must be tested by Scripture but it does not denounce wisdom where wisdom does not conflict with Scripture.
Exactly. And I would like to know what they say to the Orthodox Jews who teach that there is an oral Thora.
tested by whom?
Shhh, don’t say that to Catholics. It’ll mess up their belief in queen Mary.
This is such a pointless argument because it totally doesn't address the problem. Even if you believe scripture as the highest authority, who will you assign to be the interpreter of it? We all know that different people interprets scripture differently, otherwise there wouldn't be a gazillion of those Protestant denominations popping up.
@@DavidNicholson101better than Queen Luther (and even that guy knew she was the queen of heaven)
Yup
It is clear that the church of the Apostles precedes their writings, but that does not mean that their writings are equal to the indeterminant oral tradition carried on in the church beyond the first generation or two.
The oral tradition gave the early post-Apostolic church (Polycarp, Clement, etc.) the ability to identify authentic Apostolic writings (supposing they met with those not directly given to them). And these men witnessed to the veracity of the Apostolic writings. But once these men passed away the oral tradition was diluted and no longer helpful. The written tradition in the scriptures preserved accurately the oral tradition. It is not that Protestants deny oral tradition, but rather that there is a lack of proof that any oral tradition can be established which is not also found in the written tradition.
That is the burden of proof which the Roman Catholic bears. If the authority of the church dogmatizes teachings that are underdetermined from the standpoint of the Apostolic written tradition, then it is likely setting the bar too high, it is making demands that exceed the Apostolic requirement, especially when it claims to be able to do this not only for administrative matters that change with the times, but for dogma that is required for salvation. When one adds the claim of infallibility, which was only for the Apostles who heard Jesus himself, it becomes extremely problematic.
The Holy Spirit through Paul says, “do not go beyond what is written, then you will not be puffed up in being a follower of of one of us against another” (1 Cor. 4:6). There would be much more unity in the church if we listed to Him.
Analogy... in those days, many were uneducated/unlearned/illiterate people ("no read, no write"), so when they cooked food, they made a SONGS or HYMNS incorporating the ingredients and how they cook a specific food to the Song/Hymn to easily facilitate the memorization (Verbal/Oral Tradition)... and it was passed from generation to generation until finally someone invented the COOKBOOK called Written RECIPES... Now, does it necessarily need to sing a song while cooking?... nope... the same analogy... all of God's WORDS that were necessarily IMPORTANT to our FAITH in Christ so we can have Salvation through HIM were all written down completely... Amen.
All he said is "The apostles had authority to establish the church and we should carry on their traditions". All good Protestants agree with this. There's a major leap from THAT to the idea of an infallible Pope, "doctrinal development", etc. etc. All of which things are presuppositions by Catholics which are not taught in Scripture, but they do provide a convenient framework for claiming to hold the apostolic traditions. Protestants believe in the apostolic traditions too, but we believe they are best found in the Scriptures and God provided no other infallible means of preservation. Considering the emphasis that Scripture, and Christ, place on Scripture, this is really the only path forward.
In a perfect world, would the apostolic traditions be perfectly preserved from generation to generation and we wouldn't need to work at interpreting Scripture to find our answers? Yes! We don't live in that world, and inventing our own supposedly infallible human means of preservation has done harm to this cause, not good. You need not look further than the issues of icons, or the dotrine of the damnation of those outside the church, to see the clear errors of the Church's "authority". They've done complete 180s on these doctrines.
My understanding is this... All written WORD of God (Holy Scriptures) are AUTHORITATIVE and are Breathed out of God, profitable for TEACHING, for REPROOF, for CORRECTION, and for TRAINING in Righteousness, that the man of God may/might be completed, equipt for every Good WORK (Acts/Deeds)"... (Ref. 2 Timothy 3:16-17)
Therefore, any Verbal/Oral Traditions after the Book was completely written, that do not conform, sanction, adhere to, cohere to, and are not allowed by the written Holy Scriptures (the Bible), must and should not be followed, obeyed, or practiced by Christians... Amen.
If R.C.C.'s argument is that the Oral Tradition came first before the Written Tradition... therefore, the Israelite Jews can also argue that the O.T. came first before the N.T., right?... But it does not mean just because the O.T. came first, we (Christians) need to still follow/obey the O.T. more than the N.T. ...
Christ Jesus said, "Do not mix/pour NEW wine on an OLD wineskin." ... and ... "Do not patch/sew a NEW cloth to a hole of an OLD garment." ... (ref. Mark 2:22 / Luke 5:37 / Matt. 9:16-17 )...
Again, when the WRITTEN TRADITION was finally completed from 70 A.D. to 110 A.D. (about 40 years to complete, John's Gospel and Revelation were the last)... all other written books after 110 A.D. were not considered inspired by the Holy Spirit, thus, not included...
God/YHWH was the AUTHOR of the WRITTEN TRADITION, and not man... that was God's own WORD... the Inspired Writers were merely just the SCRIBERS of God guided by the Holy Spirit...
God had summarized all the EVENTS that HIS only begotten Son, Christ Jesus had done for about 33 years of His life on Earth...
God had chosen only those with GREAT IMPORTANCE for Mankind's Salvation to be literally written down, for if all EVENTS that Christ Jesus had done will be written down, the whole world can not hold/contain the books... (ref. John 21:25)...
That was the reason why there were so many missing EVENTS of Christ Jesus' life from 12 years old onward that God did not allow them to be written down... but it does not mean Christ Jesus disappeared in Nazareth and somehow managed to go around the world and only came back during His Ministry.
Take Note #1: ... God is so MERCIFUL to us, HE summarized His WORDS into a Single Compiled Written Scriptures called BOOK to follow/obey so that we may have the Promise of Salvation, and also many could be SAVED...
Christ said, "Come to Me all of you who were Weary and Tired, for My YOKE (Task) is Easy and My BURDEN (Tests/Trials) is Light, come to Me, and I will give you REST."... (Physical/Spiritual Rest = Sabbath of Christ)... (ref. Matt. 11:28-30)...
IMAGINE if all the EVENTS done by Christ Jesus were written down for us to follow/obey, definitely, only a few or maybe no one will be saved.
God made it much SIMPLE (Simplified) for us to follow/Obey HIS WORDS... but here we are debating which is more AUTHORITATIVE either the Oral/Verbal or Written Tradition...
I personally put my TRUST (confidence) with the WRITTEN TRADITION than with the Oral/Verbal Tradition... I truly believe that God does not want those Oral/verbal Traditions that were NOT sanctioned/approved by the Written Tradition whose author is Father God/YHWH (and not Christ Jesus) to be practiced by True Christian Believers/Worshippers starting from approx. 110 A.D. onwards till today...
Take Note #2: ...God/YHWH made the WRITTEN TRADITION so that, the Believers have the MEANS (way) to check and balance the Oral Tradition if they are EXCEEDING beyond what is WRITTEN... (1 Corinthians 4:6)...
Take Note #3: ... It is the "WILL of Father GOD/YHWH" that we need to follow/obey, that is what Christ Jesus truly wants... (ref. Matt. 12:50).
Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
Traditions may not contradict scripture. They are not mutually exclusive.
exactly, the sola scriptura tradition contradicts scripture.
@@bazzy8376 Exactly,. Sola Scripture CONTRADICTS sola fide
Tradition is not outside of Scripture. Scripture is INSIDE of Tradition.
@@bazzy8376 we can asked that where does it said in the bible that believe only in the Bible ?
@thomascapitalmgt It does not we believe Sola Fide which is faith alone but your proof of that faith is your good works .
👍
Very informative response from the Catholic Apologist..... This has been, and continues to be, an ongoing debate throughout the aeons
The Catholics have been right every single time. There is no reason for Protestantism. Why protest the Catholic church that Jesus started,
The confusing element that continues to challenge me,@@johnyang1420, is, how comes, after 500 years of division, the Protestant society continues to build their foundation on concocted lies, as well as their explicit failure in admitting the divisions generated by _Sola Scriptura_ as well as their failure to address this fact and to reconcile this division with sound and historical doctrine?
@@Super-chad i know what you are talking about! The absolute confusing madness call Protestantism is absolutely maddening. 40,000 different Protestant denominations, and they all claim they are right, but all agree Catholic church is wrong. Let's pray that they come home to the Catholic church that Jesus started. God bless you brother!
I lived 26 years of my adult life as a Protestant arguing against the Catholic Church. I began to see more and more how much Protestant denominations or “non-denominations” differed from each other in beliefs. They all have conflicting and contradictory doctrines from one another. Yet, they all claim to go by the bible alone and say they’re lead by the Holy Spirit. But at the end of the day they disagree with other Protestants on doctrine, the teachings of Christ. The Holy Spirit doesn’t lead the Church to contradictory doctrines. It’s a different spirit that does that.
They disagree on what the Bible says...what Jesus says. They disagree in matters regarding salvation itself (how we get it, can we choose it?, can we lose it?, and all kinds of things...endlessly).
Christ did not establish a church with conflicting and contradictory doctrines within itself. Yet that’s what we have in Protestantism. There is no one within Protestantism who can say “thus saith the Lord”. At least not anyone that other Protestants feel obligated to believe.
When one disagrees, they just start a new church, or find one that fits what they want to hear. And on and on it goes. So we’re left with thousands of conflicting and contradictory Protestant churches. Like you wouldn’t say, “the Protestant church”, because it's actually thousands of separate churches, all teaching contradictory things from one another. This is absolutely undeniable. Doctrinal relativism is not an option in Christ's One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. We do not agree to disagree on Doctrine. That would be unbiblical. Truth matters. Peace.
Once more, @@faithofourfathers is another Protestant who actually found his way Home by discovering the truth of the Church of Rome when being led to destroy it. The momentum being generated on Social Media about the truth of Christ's church is constantly expanding. The realm of _Protestantism_ was doctrinally insufficient to convict me towards the undeniable existence and reality of God. The _Church of Rome_ is the only institution that could, and ever will be, the one to elicit such a distinguished revelation.
The Jews would agree.
God allowed only those oral/verbal traditions that have significance, relevance, and importance to the process of SALVATION of Mankind to be written down called the SCROLL/BIBLE... why?... God knew, there will come a day, (our present day, today) that Oral/Verbal Traditions that were not written down but are still practiced will be HARDER to DEFEND by the Written Scriptures (Word of God) against Non-Believers (Atheists/Agnostics) who constantly attack/oppose our Spiritual God in Heaven... Amen.
I think it's a mistake to talk about "oral Tradition" unless we make it clear that such sacred Traditions were written down in the early centuries of the Church by the post-apostolic fathers/leaders of the Church.
Apostle Peter was the 1st BISHOP of the 7 Churches in Asia Minor of the 1st Cent. A.D.... Not the 1ST FATHER/ PATER/POPE/PAPA claimed by the R.C.C.
By proper definition, the word BISHOP does not equate with the word POPE/PAPA/FATHER...
Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
Take Note #2:... God said, "I will WRITE down My Laws/Commandments (God's WILL) to their HEARTS." (ref. Jeremiah 31:33 / Ezekiel 11:19 / 2 Corin. 3:3).
But for that to happen, God must first LITERALLY WRITE it down, which God does by/with His own fingers, God's Ten (10) Commandments written into two ( 2) Pieces of Stone Tablets that were given to Prophet Moses at Mt. Sinai.
Why must be written first?... Basically, because in those days only a few are Educated to know how to READ and WRITE like Moses...
Moses was the 1ST Scriber (inspired writer from the Holy Spirit) of God who wrote some of the MOSAIC LAWS of Israel...
For Example, the Law of Divorce, the Law of Purification, the Law of Sabbath, the Law of Food/Meat, Circumcision, Tithings, etc...
Finally, so that, starting with Prophet Moses, he could Speak out to the crowd of Israelites by READING the written "WORDS of God" that they may KNOW and BELIEVE/OBEY the WILL of God...
According to St. Paul, "FAITH starts/comes from (frequent) HEARING and LISTENING to the Words of God." (ref. Romans 10:17)... that was the ONLY WAY the Words of God be written in the HEARTS of the True BELIEVERS (True Christians who Worship God in SPIRIT and in TRUTH without Idols, Images, Statues, Rosary, Medallion, etc.) ... (ref. John 4:23)...
In conclusion, the WORDS of God must be Literally/Physically WRITTEN down first before the WORDS be written to every man's HEARTS, accordingly...
Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
"All (Written) SCRIPTURE is given by INSPIRATION of God (God-Breathed), and is profitable for DOCTRINAL TEACHINGS, for REPROOF (Rebuke/Reproval), for CORRECTION (Rectify/Repair/Revise), and for INSTRUCTION (Command/Direction/Order) of RIGHTEOUSNESS... (ref. 2 Timothy 3:16)...
Therefore, the WRITTEN TRADITION is more AUTHORiTATIVE (Trustworthy/Reliable/Dependable) than the Oral/Verbal Tradition... Amen.
If sola scriptura is incorrect, then why the Talmud is incorrect as well?
Additionally, St. Paul goes on to demonstrate in II Thessalonians what Tradition he refers to. That Rome drives in whatever Rome believes as Apostolic Tradition through one such verse.
The problem is that tradition is heavily influenced by the tradition of ex-Roman pagans rather than actual Hebrew Semites.
@@user-ls8ks7kv8c Paul wished you would emasculate yourself.
Take Note #2:... The English word BISHOP comes from the Greek word "EPISKOPOS" and in Latin "EPISCOPUS" which means "Head, Team Leader, Overseer, Watcher, Care Taker, Keeper, etc... The Old English of Bishop is "BISCEOP" ... later on became BISHOP...
The HEAD of God's CHURCH is His only begotten Son, Christ Jesus founded upon Himself, "The ROCK."... When Christ Jesus ascended to God's Kingdom, Christ handed over God's Church to Peter as their FIRST CHURCH ELDER (Leader)... or in other words, FIRST BISHOP of God's 7 Churches in Asia Minor (presently Turkey)... Then followed by CHURCH WORKERS (Body of Christ) without HIERARCHY, each one partakes the DUTIES, RESPONSIBILITIES and BURDEN of the CHURCH matters...
Everybody is EQUAL (in Status/Treatment/Respect) among the BODY of Christ in God's Church, including the BISHOP or ELDER LEADER.
There is a SENCE of TRANSPARENCY in God's CHURCH with everything including FINANCES (Collections and Contributions) in the 1st to 3rd Cent. A.D.... The BODY of Christ has the VOICE and VOTE (SAY) to where the FINANCES must priority be spent first... for the sake of the Sick, Poor, Widows, etc... and not on Big Expensive/Luxurius Buildings, or Physical Structures...
Christ said, "God does not dwell on the HOUSE built by the Hands of Men." (ref. Acts 7:47-48 & 17:24-28)...
The English word FATHER in Greek is "PATER"... and in Latin is "PAPA" or "POPE"...
According to the written WORD of God, when it comes to Spiritual/Religious/Church Matters, we must not use or call anyone on Earth the Head/Elder/Leader/Teacher in God's CHURCH, as "FATHER, PATER, PAPA, or POPE, for we have only One Father which God/YHWH... (ref. Matt. 23:9)...
The Greek Orthodox Churches correctly called their Church Elder/Priest/Brethren as BISHOP which means OVERSEER and not FATHER...
Most Protestant Churches called their Overseer/Keeper, as the "Overal Elder Brethren or Head Brethren," and not FATHER or POPE....
Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen...
Sola Scriptura? Where does it say in Scripture what books and how many should be in Scripture?
The matter of "what books and how many should be in Scripture" is a matter of the Canon, which has very little to do with the concept of Sola Scriptura (and is something that none of the Protestant Reformers, all of whom were Catholics, had any problem with).
Fatty Logic . where does it say the Trinity ?
But Paul never gives what these traditions they talk about and where you see them in scripture .
2Thess. 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which “YE HAVE BEEN TAUGHT” whether by word, or our epistles. “ YE HAVE BEEN TAUGHT” its past tense. It does not say to continue onward with more additional teachings.
The apostles were teaching even after this verse was written, where they not? Plus 2 Tim 2:2.
@@faithofourfathers Yes they continue to teach the same teachings given by Jesus Christ until the day they died.
Nothing added nor anything taken away. Galatians 1:8 preach no other gospels or you will be accursed.
@@johnp.6043 What they taught became the liturgy and the dogma that are practiced to the end of time
@@bazzy8376 The apostles never taught Mariology, they never taught Transubstantiation, they never prayed or bow down to no images( Google Photos ,of Popes bowing and kneeling and kissing the feet of statues) the CC removed the second commandment of God , Do not bow to graven images, they never had no vicar of Pope Christ, was with and within them,they never taught or Canaised other saints they had one mediator.
They never preached the mass as being an unbloody sacrifice, they proclaimed “THE SAME GOSPEL” That Jesus, died ,was buried, and rose on the third day, and shed his blood for our sins.
They never sold indulgence for salvation, they never confessed to a priest went directly to God.
@@johnp.6043 You can't say that they weren't taught _Mariology, Transubstantiation or Iconoclasm_ just because it's not written in the New Testament, as the Holy Scriptures being the sole rule of faith and doctrine is strictly and solely practised by Protestant Christians, which merely emerged 500 years ago. Before this Reformation, _all churches_ before practiced all these doctrines and beliefs because they had already known about them. Check all documentation about the Early Church Fathers and you'll see the myriad of frescoes and epistles penned by early Christians and you'll see.... Sola Scriptura could never be approached to these genuine Christians, closest to Christ's era.
Let’s add up that 2 Tim 3:16 refieres to the Old Testament so how can this verse be used to defend Sola Scriptura? That’d equal to remaining Jewish after the coming of the messiah. Not even Jews believe in Sola Scriptura that says enough for me.
All Tradition in Christianity is validated from scripture so if scripture causes it to be valid which is the higher authority?
Tradition came first
The President of any Country has an acclimation title of "The Excellency"... while the Pope is called "MOST HOLY EXCELLENCY" in the SUPERLATIVE DEGREE... Above God/YHWH's Acclimation Title..."Holy, Holy, Holy"... versus... "Most Holy Excellency"...
And what of tradition that violates the word of God? I do not see where tradition is to be valued above the Word. Mark 7 and Matthew 15 suffice here.
The Bible clearly says, that there were lots of things Jesus had done that were not written down (Oral/Verbal Traditions), if they were all written down, the whole world may not be able to hold them down... (Ref. John 21:25).
Therefore, from the CONTEXT of the passage, those that God allowed to be WRITTEN DOWN were the ones IMPORTANT towards our Salvation, and the rest were not needed/required, which is why God never intended that ALL have to be written down... Facts and Truth, Biblically and logically speaking... Amen.
You are connecting two ideas that don't relate at all. The CONTEXT of the passage does not refer to oral traditions or the correct way to follow the teachings of Jesus, but is a closing statement of the book of Saint John about the wonders that Jesus performed and are not included in the text. It is just a statement to emphasize in the divinity of Jesus and how special he is, nowhere in the text it refers to salvation or how to get salvation... you are just adding that up to your interpretation
@@sc4515 Take Note #1:... St. Paul said, "STAND FIRMLY and HOLD ON to the TRADITIONS (plural) that you have been taught by us (Apostles) whether by words of mouth/spoke words (Oral Tradition) or by our written Epistles/letters (Written Tradition)." (ref. 2 Thessa. 2:15)... Amen.
Therefore, as long as the Oral Tradition does not contradict the Written Tradition, that is OK/FINE...
However, if there are contradictions, the WRITTEN Tradition must override/overrule/supersede the questionable ORAL/VERBAL Tradition...
In other words, the WRITTEN TRADITION has a Greater Authority over the ORAL/VERBAL TRADITION... (ref. Mark 7:1-13)...
Written Tradition of the Words of God must always PREVAIL no matter the case maybe... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen...
@@sc4515 Take Note #2:... God said, "I will WRITE down My Laws/Commandments (God's WILL) to their HEARTS."... (ref. Jeremiah 31:33 / Ezekiel 11:19 / 2 Corinthians 3:3)...
But in order for that to happen, God must first LITERALLY WRITE it down, which God does by/with His own fingers, God's Ten (10) Commandments written into two ( 2) Pieces of Stone Tablets that were given to Prophet Moses at Mt. Sinai.
Why must be written first?... Basically, because in those days only a few are Educated to know how to READ and WRITE like Moses...
Moses was the 1ST Scriber (inspired writer guided by the Holy Spirit) of God who wrote some of the MOSAIC LAWS of Israel...
For Example, the Law of Divorce, the Law of Purification, the Law of Sabbath, the Law of Food/Meat, Circumcision, Tithings, etc...
Finally, so that, starting with Prophet Moses, he could Speak out to the crowd of Israelites by READING the written "WORDS of God" that they may KNOW and BELIEVE/OBEY the WILL of God...
According to St. Paul, "FAITH starts/comes from (frequent) HEARING and LISTENING to the Words of God." (ref. Romans 10:17)... that was the ONLY WAY the Words of God be written in the HEARTS of the True BELIEVERS (True Christians who Worship God in SPIRIT and in TRUTH without Idols, Images, Statues, Rosary, Medallion, etc.) ... (ref. John 4:23)...
In conclusion, the WORDS of God must be Literally/Physically WRITTEN down first before the WORDS be written to every man's HEARTS, accordingly... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
@@sc4515 If we carefully read John 21:25, we will find the CORRELATION of the ORAL/VERBAL (Spoken Word) TRADITION with the UNWRITTEN EVENTS that Christ Jesus had done while He was on Earth most especially during His (3 years) Ministry that was perhaps been witnessed by some Early Christians in the 1st Cen. A.D., that they kept on practicing till today...
Again, as long as there are NO CONTRADICTIONS with the WRITTEN Tradition, the ORAL/VERBAL Tradition is OK/Fine to practice till today... However, if contradiction arises, the WRITTEN Tradition must prevail... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
@@jvlp2046 @jvlp2046 various things: 1) The Sacred Tradition of the RCC does not contradict, rather completes and puts to practice the Written Tradition in the Bible. 2) The referenced passage of Saint Mark, yes, it states clearly manmade tradition shall not prevail over the Law of Mosses written by God. There is, however, a little detail: most of the Bible wasn't completed in the first century and there were many more books out there that were not finally included in the Bible proclaimed in the Council of Nicea (325) as divinely inspired. So, for the very first Christians there was no such thing as a unified written source, rather it was the verbal tradition transmitted by the Apostles themselves and their successors the one that came before the Bible to hold sacraments such as the Eucharist. That is just the Tradition that the RCC holds as an fundamental and infallible pilar of truth: the one the Apostles gave us
The Roman and Greek Catholic Church still practiced or copied some Jewish Tradition of Priesthood in their Temple/Synagogue... for example the use of Priesthood colorful Vest/Cloak, the use of Ritual Incense smoke, the use of the ALTAR (sacred table), and all ritual paraphernalia... (may not be exactly the same but were taken from the same tradition)...
In the 1st Century A.D. Christians... Do all the Apostles of Christ "ACT" somewhat like a PRIESTHOOD doing some Spiritual Ritual at any Altar every time Christians gathered around during Sunday (Rest in Christ/Resurrection Day)?... NOPE... Christ Jesus is the Last Priesthood of God... but never acted the same way the Jewish Priesthood did in the Temple/Synagogue...
Does the "Breaking of the Bread" (commemorating the Last Supper of Christ) need/require Ritual INCENSE Smoke and BELLS?...where does this Ritual come from?... I thought Christians were no longer under the Law of Moses and Mosaic Law by practicing Priesthood Rituals every SUNDAY?...
The Oral Tradition that the Apostles had passed down to early Christians during those times without Written Tradition yet does not contradict to their Epistles and the 4 Gospel Writers... Most of the R.C.C. Dogmas especially from Blessed Mary contradicted from their writings...
After the Resurrection and Ascension of Christ Jesus to Heaven, approx. 40 years the Early Christian believers have only ORAL/VERBAL Tradition of the Words of God... That was why God allowed INSPIRED MEN to write down the ORAL/VERBAL TRADITIONS into WRITTEN TRADITION and to leave the EVENTS that Christ Jesus had done not to be written down that have LESS RELEVANT importance to our SALVATION... (ref. John 21:25)...
God had chosen only those EVENTS that have Great Importance to the Salvation of Mankind to be written down through the Inspired Men guided by the Holy Spirit.
After the Words of God were written down, those Old Oral/Tradition that are not written down, which meant, God no longer required them to be practiced by Christian Believers... otherwise, they should have been written down in the first place by the Apostles, logically speaking...
Again, as long as the Old Oral Tradition does not contradict to the writings of the Apostles and their Disciples, that is OK/fine to practice... However, if it does, the Written Tradition must override, supersede, and overrule the Old Oral Tradition...
Logically speaking, St. Paul would not dare to say, "DO NOT GO/EXCEED WHAT IS WRITTEN," if he knew the Written Tradition would not be completed after he died (beheaded)... He was the only ONE that God had shown the 3RD HEAVEN in Vision...
All N.T. Scriptures had been WRITTEN down before the END of the 1st Cent. A.D. (or before 110 A.D.) ... the Book of Revelation was the last written Scripture that God revealed to Apostle John around 92-96 A.D. ... The 4 Gospels and Epistles/Letters were all WRITTEN down before the END of the 1st Cent. A.D. (or before 110 A.D.) ... All the 7 Churches of God in Christ from Asia Minor have all those ORIGINAL copies in Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek, preserved but were not compiled together as one book...
"All (Written) SCRIPTURE is given by INSPIRATION of God (God-Breathed), and is profitable for DOCTRINAL TEACHINGS, for REPROOF (Rebuke/Reproval), for CORRECTION (Rectify/Repair/Revise), and for INSTRUCTION (Command/Direction/Order) of RIGHTEOUSNESS...
(ref. 2 Timothy 3:16)...
Therefore, the WRITTEN TRADITION is more AUTHORiTATIVE (Trustworthy/Reliable/Dependable) than the Oral/Verbal Tradition...
Facts and Truth of the Matters, Biblically and logically speaking... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus...Amen.
Take Note: 1#... The English Word BIBLE comes from the Greek Word "TA BIBLIA" which merely/simply means "THE BOOK."...
The SOURCE of TRUTH is not the BOOK (Bible) itself but what is WRITTEN inside the BOOK which is the "WORD OF GOD." ... (Composed of Narration of History, True Stories of Goodness versus Evilness, betrayal, love, hope, faith, forgiveness, Laws, Commandments, etc.)...
Nobody (mortal man) could memorize all those things by ORAL TRADITION, which was why God/YHWH decided to have His WORD be WRITTEN down by God's chosen Inspired Men (no women) guided by the Holy Spirit to put them into writing... Those Oral Traditions that God did allow to be written down, clearly meant, that God NO LONGER wanted them to be practiced by True Christians after God's WORDS were completed in around 110 A.D. onward up to our time today... (ref. John 21:25)...
Again, as long as the Old Oral/Verbal Tradition does not contradict the WRITTEN TRADITION, that means, God still allows them to be practiced by True Christians... However, if not, the WRITTEN TRADITION must stop/remove those ORAL TRADITIONS, immediately (ASAP)....
In other words, The written "WORD OF GOD" is the Only Source of TRUTH in the SAGA OF MANKIND towards SALVATION...
"Every WORD of God proves TRUE, and God SANCTIFY the People of TRUTH." ... (ref. Proverbs 30:5-6)
"For the WORD of the Lord God is RIGHT and TRUE, He is faithful to all He Does." ... (ref. Psalm 33)
"The sum of your WORD is TRUTH, and every one of your RIGHTEOUS rules endures forever." ... (ref. Psalm 119:160).
"SANCTIFY them in TRUTH, Your (God's) WORD is the TRUTH." ... (ref. John 17:17)
(and many more, just to name a few)...
The Written WORD OF GOD is the Only Source of TRUTH... Facts and Truth of the Matters... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
Word of God>Word of men
Are u muslim or christian ?? I think word of god was a quran , not the bible ....! Am i wrong ?
@@juantulasi1405 I am Christian.
Well that is up to you to do your own research. You have to research your belief and find out if it is credible and something you want to put your faith in.
I put my faith in Jesus Christ because he is sinless and he died for my sins and all of our sins and rose from the dead on the third day. Muhammad did not do that. Jesus is alive Muhammad is not.
Scientists prove Jesus Christ is real and he died on a cross and shed his blood to pay our punishment of sin and rose on the third day, witnessed by 500+ people over 2,000 years ago. Plus Jesus fulfilled 200+ prophesies. Christianity has over 10,000 manuscripts all confirming who Jesus Christ is and what he did for us.
The Quran says Allah made it seem like he put Jesus on the cross but he took him down and put someone else to deceive the Christians. Surah 4:157.
Deception is a form of a lie. And if lying is a sin, and Allah lied, Allah can not be God.
God can not lie.
Allah is the great deceiver. Surah 3:54.
The Bible says Satan is the father of lies. John 8:44.
The Quran came 500+ years after the Scriptures were already complete. Muhammad came 500+ years after Jesus.
Muhammad contradicts Jesus. Are you going to put your trust and faith in someone who never met Jesus and someone who contradict Jesus? That is your choice.
There are 10,000+ manuscripts confirming and all consistency saying that Jesus is God. The Quran insists Jesus is not God. You have to do your own research and look at the teachings of Jesus vs the teachings of Muhammad.
A Muslim is someone who follows the Quran, and the Quran says to “strike your wife” Surah 4:34 And to “kill the polytheists” Surah 9:5.
Jesus says to love your enemies.
Matthew 5:44: “But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,”
“Love your neighbor as yourself.” Mark 12:31
Jesus teaches us to do unto others as you would have them do unto you (Matthew 7:12)
Look at all the amazing teachings on the sermon on the mount.
Big difference between what Jesus teaches and what the Quran teaches.
Plus, Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old and married a 6 year old. Sahih al-Bukhari 5134.
Is that the example we should go by? Striking your wife, killing the polytheists, and having sex with 9 year olds? No wonder the fruit of Islam is so violent.
“By their fruits you shall know them.” Matthew 7:20
The Quran says that in order to go to Heaven you must to good deeds to please God and have your sins taken away. But if God is just then how can a judge let someone go if he committed the crime? You can’t bribe the judge. That won’t work. The judge will say this is the court of law and I do not look at the good things you do but only the crimes you have committed. So you need someone who has not committed the crime to pay the penalty for you, and that is Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ paid our debt and took on the punishment we deserve for our sins so God can let us go free and go to Heaven all because of what Jesus did, not me or you. Jesus then rose from the dead and defeated death itself. No one else has conquered death and came back from the dead other than Jesus. Jesus is God.
The Bible is a previous revelation from Allah. Surah 5:48.
Allah’s words can not change. Surah 18:27
The Quran says Jesus is not God.
The Bible says Jesus is God.
John 1:1: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”
John 1:3: “All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”
John 1:14: “And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”
John 8:58: “Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.”
John 20:28: “Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!”
John 5:18: “This was why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill him, because not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God.”
Titus 1:9: “while we wait for the blessed hope-the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ,”
Colossians 2:9: “For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily,”
Hebrews 1:8: “But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom.”
Matthew 1:23: “Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and they shall call his name Immanuel” (which means, God with us).”
Isaiah 43:11: “I, even I, am the LORD, And besides Me there is no savior.”
2 Timothy 1:10: “but now has been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel,”
Isaiah 44:6: “Thus saith the Lord the King of Israel, and his redeemer the Lord of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.”
Revelation 1:7-8: “Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.”
@@juantulasi1405 Ephesians 2:8-9 says "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith-and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God- 9 not by works, so that no one can boast."
We can not boast because we do not earn nor deserve eternal life.
We can’t do anything to bribe God by our works. God takes no bribes. Deuteronomy 10:17.
Our righteous deeds are like filthy rags. Isaiah 64:6.
Without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins. Hebrews 9:22.
How are your sins forgiven in Islam?
It can’t.
We are all sinners (Romans 3:23) and how can you pay for your own sins?
And go to Heaven?
Try that in the court of law.
Go to the judge and say I commuted the crime but can I just say I’m a good person and did good deeds can I go home.
He will laugh at you.
With Islam, there is no way to have your sins forgiven.
There is no peace and eternal life.
Jesus is the prince of peace. Isaiah 9:6.
Jesus offers you eternal life. John 10:27-28.
Jesus offers you an escape of sin and hell. Romans 6:23: “For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.”
John 3:16: “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”
Here is the Injil, the word Injil is in the Quran but no Muslim can say what Injil is or what it means.
Plus, if the God of the Bible and the God of the Quran are the same, first off why are they spreading a different Gospel?
Paul says if you share a different Gospel that man is to be accursed. Galatians 1:6-9.
As a matter of fact, the word Injil is in the Quran but most Muslims do not even know what that word means.
Which is interesting because it is in their book.
The word means good news. But the reason they do not know the meaning of the word is because there is no good news in Islam. Only bad news.
The good news, the Gospel. That’s what good news means, Gospel, the Gospel (Injil) means the Good news. But before I give the good news I have to tell you the bad news so you appreciate the good news. The bad news is all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. Romans 3:23. We know we all sinned and we know what sin is. And the wages of sin is death. Romans 6:23. It’s like a judge paying a criminal that killed people, death for their crime. God is doing the same thing. We deserve death because of our sins. If you ever lied, stolen, hated, committed blasphemy (used God’s name in vain), killed, lusted, had pride in your heart or any other sin in your life you sinned against God and deserve death. But the good news is you can be forgiven by the grace of God. Most people know Jesus Christ died on the cross for our sins even those the Quran says that Allah made it seem like he put Jesus on the cross but actually put someone else there instead (Surah 4:157), that is a deception, that is a lie, and if lying is a sin, which it is (Exodus 20:16), and Allah sinned, he is not God. But most people they do not know this, and if you can get a grip of this it will change your life forever.
The 10 Commandments are called the moral law, you and I broke the law, but Jesus paid the fine. That is why Jesus said “it is finished” (John 19:30) right before he died, he was saying paid in full. In court, if someone pays your fine you can leave and it is legal. God can legally take the death sentence off of you all because of what Jesus did on the cross. Then he rose on the third day according to the scriptures (1 Corinthians 15:4) and defeated death itself, and if you simply repent and put your trust in Jesus, you have God’s promise and he can not lie, that he will grant you everlasting life. Ask God to change your heart and your desires to love what is right not what is wrong. Psalm 51:10
That’s what it means to be born again. Jesus said unless you are born again you will not see the kingdom of God. John 3:3. When you accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior and pass from death to life all because of God’s mercy, it’s a personal miracle that you can be radically changed from loving sin to loving God. God is gracious and he will provide. 2 Chronicles 30:9. Philippians 4:19. Ask and you shall receive. Seek and you shall find. Matthew 7:7. Jesus is calling all to repent. Acts 17:30. Jesus said repent or likewise perish. But God is not willing that any should perish but all come to repentance. 2 Peter 3:9. Jesus wants to have a relationship with you. It’s not about religion. All these other gods are fake and It’s Satan distracting you from Jesus. Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one comes to the Father but by me.” John 14:6. “God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believes in him, shall not perish but have everlasting life.” John 3:16. God bless. Repent and put your trust and faith in Jesus Christ.
All you have to do to be saved and go to Heaven is put your faith and trust in Jesus not yourself but in God. God Bless
The Bible itself says follow scripture and tradition
Jesus stood for the Bible alone and He never uttered a single word of criticism against what God had revealed in the Old Testament. Even in the Sermon on the Mount Christ said repeatedly, “You have heard it said but I say unto you…” At the beginning of His sermon, He explained: “Think not that I have come to destroy the Law or the prophets; I have not come to destroy, but to fulfil.” Matthew 5:17.
He brought out the deeper truths of the Word, and to fulfill them not to annul them. Jesus was completely submitted to the Word of God and kept the Law of Moses perfectly, and when tempted by the devil in the desert, He quoted the famous expression “It is written” three times to reveal that He was under the authority of His Father’s revelation. Matthew 4:4, 7, 10.
Christ was, first and foremost, a teacher of the Scriptures and Scripture alone, not man’s words.
He went up against the Pharisees repeatedly for adding to God’s word. When He stood up in the synagogue, He read the well-known text of Isaiah 61:1-2 and then proclaimed that, “This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.” Luke 4:21 and from that day forth, the ministry of Jesus was characterized by teaching the Word of God. Matthew 9:35 says, “And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues.”
Christ believed in the great need of sound doctrine and in each moment, His foundation was Scripture. Never “what have the religious leaders said” That is absurd!
Scripture alone was good enough for the LORD, but not you Catholics.
Matthew 9:35 also states that Jesus healed all manner of diseases and sicknesses.
Why was Jesus so concerned about physical healing? The Scripture answers this also: “When the evening came, they brought unto Him many that were possessed with devils: and He cast out the spirits with His word and healed all that were sick: that it might be fulfilled, which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities and bare our sicknesses.” Matthew 8:16-17 FULFILLING SCRIPTURE not man’s word.
Hebrews 4:15 clarifies, “For we have not a high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.” This includes Mary’s sin!!
Even in His darkest hour upon the cross, Jesus continued making known that truth and authority of Scripture. He quoted the messianic Psalm, number twenty-two, thus revealing that He was still meditating upon the blessed written Word of God. So, even His death and resurrection obey Scripture!
Jesus held Scripture in such high esteem that He gave His life and rose again in obedience to it. How many times did Jesus’ prophesy of His death? Do you even care?
Before His passion, He announced, “For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me.” Luke 22:37.
Even after His resurrection, Christ explained that His passion and resurrection occurred so that Scripture would be fulfilled.
“And He said unto them, these are the words which I spoke unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened He their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures. And said unto them, thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day.” Luke 24:44-46.
In life and in death, Jesus obeyed the blessed, infallible, and inerrant written Word of God.
in Matthew 19:5 where Jesus points out that a text from the Old Testament which was penned by a human author, Genesis 2:24, was actually spoken by the living God. Too bad you Catholics reject the teachings and example of Jesus Christ the Lord and God Almighty!
As a protestant we don't believe the bible is the only source of authority - we believe its the only infallible source of authority. That is an important difference.
Amen
Means you departed from the foundational causes of protestantism
You can’t even say as a Protestant, you can’t agree on anything
⚪ 🍷 Who's flesh avails for nothing? 👀 👄 👅 👃 👂 🖐️
Where in the bible did you find that Scripture is not the sole authority? Oral tradition is a false doctrine. Jesus said to the devil, "it is written" (Matt 4:4). The bible tells us that after the apostles, many false teachers would come into the Church. So, we need the bible to guide us, not the Church. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, a light unto my path (Psalm 119:105).
Everyone needs to understand what Paul himself says, who was the LAST to be chosen apostle. and God tells us for what purpose to us, through Luke telling Ananias in Acts 9:15-16 “But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name’s sake.”
Paul’s own word confirms there was no succession of the apostles in 1st Corinthians 15:8 “And LAST OF ALL was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time. For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I labored MOFE ABUNDDANTLY THAN THEY ALL: YET NO I, but the grace of God which was with me.”
Therefore, whether it were I, or they, so we preach, and so ye believed. Paul never said, "or they coming after us or they, referring to more apostles.” He said whether they, meaning the ones he listed, or himself. Paul was the LAST chosen by Christ who say Christ, as it says clearly( AND LAST OF ALL).
1st Corinthians 15:1 says, “Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you THE GOSPLE WHICH I PREACHED UNTO YOU, which also YE HAVE RECEIVED, and wherein YE STAND; By which also YE ARE SAVED, if ye KEEP IN MEMORY WHAT I PREACHED unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. “
The Bible CLEARLY Says the Apostles were used to lay a foundation. When you build a building, EVEN A SPIRITUAL ONE, you only lay a foundation once, you don’t keep laying it. No more apostles were needed, chosen by, or added by Christ. The foundation of the apostles has been laid and Paul’s statement below reiterates that point.
In addition to other passages like Jude 3, “Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was ONCE DELIVERED unto the saints”
We have the sure word of God, as
1st Thessalonians 2:13 CLAIMS IT: “For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God WHICH YE HEARD OF US, ye received it NOT AS THE WORD OF MEN, but as it is in truth, THE WORD OF GOD, which EFFECTUALLY WORKETH also IN YOU THAT BELIEVE.”
I see no way for anyone, including Catholics, to argue against this. This is the WORD OF GOD, and we need no further word from the manmade institution that only represents the Catholic Church, not God, to tell us what to believe to be saved!
AGAIN: 1st Corinthians 15:7-9 says, “then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also.” Paul indicates from his own mouth that the office of apostle is a limited office that is not going to continue and that only those who were eyewitnesses, Peter himself said.
Paul refers to himself as the “Last of all the apostles.”
The Bible shows Paul was preparing Timothy to carry the torch of what all Christ showed him and elect elders. He knew his death was coming, and it was Paul’s his second imprisonment in Rome 2 Timothy 1:2, 8. His final imprisonment was much more severe than his first in prison there as He was in bonds with few visitors, and he felt his death was imminent in verses 4:6-8.
In Titus 1:5 he says, “For this reason I left you in Crete that you would set in order what remains and appoint elders.” The Bible is so clear on this, and the lies of the Catholic Church have no end. Quite sad so many are being led away from Truth, and not to it.
Last of the apostles is just that: last of Apostles; not last of the Church the Apostles built on Christ. Peter’s Chair is alive and well in the Church.
@@harleymann2086 Sorry but your church is not the Church of Christ's. Peter has no chair there or anywhere. You are Peter, son of Barjona. Who is Peter's father? Who was Peter the son of? NOT GOD
Who is Jesus? He is the Christ, the Son of the Living God! BIG DIFFERENCE!
Jesus is The Rock in all of scripture? God and God in CHRIST in flesh is who HIS CHURCH is built on and the fact that Peter claimed it, which was the Truth to the answer of who Christ was, the Rock and he is noted as the Rock throughout all of scripture and Christ never changes who he is!! He never gave his authority to Peter or his name. Christ told them all that all authority was given to HIM in heaven and earth.
You follow false teachers who know nothing about God's word. Christ was the Word who became flesh, he's the Son, he's the Head, he's the Cornerstone, he's the sure and true foundation and Paul said there is no foundation that can be built except on Christ! Christ died and resurrected or there would be no church! Christ even called told Peter "get behind me, Satan" because no sinful mortal cares more for the kingdom of God than the Son of God who came down from heaven to save mankind.
Christ is the Son of God, and Peter was just among the small stones, of which he said we are all living stones in the SPIRITUAL HOUSE of God, not a physical building where a fake priesthood and pompous self-elevating Pope at the Vatican sits pretending to be what he isn't.
Your church uses ONE verse taken out context, misinterpreted and twisted it just to falsely prove a false doctrine at the get go. The keys of heaven is Truth of what Peter said and that is the message of the gospel, and the Bible is clear on that. The gospel is the key and truth that points people to Christ and opens the doors of heaven and salvation for anyone who believes. Ever read ALL THE BIBLE and not just cherry pick verses? That's the revelation.
@@maggiejoban2058 all of Church history proves you wrong, protester!
@@maggiejoban2058 well, that bit of self-righteousness was short lived. Any other private interpretations, or incantations, you wish to cast upon Christ’s One Church? There is to be NO PRIVATE INTERPRETATION of Scripture that *attemps to correct the Church of Christ* . After all, if the Spirit of God moved the writers of Scripture then your private interpretation of texts is equivalent to “rot”.
@@harleymann2086 YOU DON'T HAVE A CLUE. The church is the BODY OF CHRIST and that's all True believers. AND BY THE WAY, PAUL CORRECTED PETER PUBLICLY because HE WAS TO BE BLAMED.
Galatians 2:11 "But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because HE WAS TO BE BLAMED.
Verse 14 "But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?"
Anyone in the BODY OF CHRIST who errors from the way of Christ and teaches others to do so by words or actions are to be REBUKED. THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS A BIG FAT LYING MAN MADE ESTABLISHMENT that blasphemers God and the Blood of Christ! Your Church is NOTHING and Holds no truth.
Scott miss speaks and says 2nd Timothy 316 says "only" scripture Is inspired..... This was like a fruity and slip because as a protestant he was probably hammered with only scripture but in 2nd Timothy 3.16 it says "all" not only... I actually had a debate with a pastor from the church of Christ that would not admit the word "only" was not found in verses 16 and 17. He would say yeah but it says all and I would say but it doesn't say only he would say yeah but it says Perfect and I would say yeah but it doesn't say only. Lol...
A Vatican II respecter critiquing sola scriptura is like a dog's rear looking down on a hunk of crap. Neither comes out smelling like roses.
You Prots are whiny crybabies
The Written Scriptures already EXISTED long before Rome became Catholic in the 4th Cent. A.D. ... Take note, most of the Written Scriptures were written in Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek... and not in Latin... What the Catholics did was to translate them into LATIN with some BIAS Doctrines to FIT their Dogmas...
For example... Prophet Isaiah Prophesied (Isaiah 7:14)... the word "HA ALMAH," which only means, "The Young Woman."... the Roman Catholic Latin Version was translated as "The VIRGIN MAIDEN" ... Isaiah never mentioned "BETHULAH" (Virgin)... he never wrote "HA ALMAH BETULAH."
DINAH the daughter of Jacob was called "ALMAH" (young woman) even after she was RAPED by the pagan prince... R.C.C. twisted the narrative of the Prophecy of Isaiah to FIT their DOGMA narrative of PERPETUAL VIRGINITY... and many more...
The Israelite Jews knew what the R.C.C. had done in the 4th Cent. A.D., which was why the R.C.C. persecuted the WONDERING (Exiled) Jews around the world... They knew what they had done...
Christ Jesus's True CHURCH never commanded His Apostles to harm, persecute, or murder/slaughter those who do not AGREE or CONVERT to CATHOLICISM... "For whatever you do the least of your brothers/neighbors (foes alike), you are doing unto ME (Christ Jesus)" ... (ref. Matt. 25:40)...
Christ only commanded His Apostles a "Symbolic and Spiritual Act" to "SHAKE THE DUST OFF THEIR FEET/SANDALS," for/to those who do not want to accept (rejected) the Gospel"...(ref. Matt. 10:14)... NO Physical VIOLENCE of whatsoever...
Does the R.C.C. obey and follow that?... History attested they have NOT... therefore, that CHURCH was not from GOD from the start... but from SATAN and his FALLEN Angels who always like VIOLENCE, CHAOS, DIVISION, and WAR...
Historians, Theologians, and Archeologists NEVER found the 7 CHURCHES of God built and founded by Christ Jesus in the 1st Century A.D. in Asia Minor mentioned in the Book of Revelation, up to the 3rd Century A.D. ForeFathers of the CHURCH had harmed, persecuted, or murdered Pagans, Gentiles, Agnostics, Heretics, Atheists, and Jews... absolutely, NONE for the sake of FAITH of the CHURCH...
However, perhaps, individual Early Christians had harmed somebody NOT for the SAKE of the CHURCH (FAITH) but for their self/personal reasons caused by their own weaknesses... For example, cheating spouses, jealousy, vendetta, pride, debts, drunkness, etc...
Only in the 4th Century ONWARD when Pagan Rome had accepted CHRISTIANITY through Emperor Constantine... that persecution and slaughtering started for the SAKE of the R.C. CHURCH... Catholicism and Islamism are both KILLING for the sake of their RELIGION/CHURCH.
Facts and Truth, HISTORIANS, THEOLOGIANS, and ARCHEOLOGISTS attested to this matter... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
You go by silence like the gnostics. The demiurge has a silence. The holy Spirit is God with us and God within us by faith. Jeremiah 31: 31-34 and exzekiel 8: 8-12 Galatians 4: 24-26. Hebrews Jermaine 32: 36-41. Many more about the new covenant. Jesus gave them a higher law to observe and teach others. Again the Roman papacy taught for centuries that they superceded Israel. The seat of Rome sits Satan the father of lies.
1. Hahn is asked to not straw-man Sola Scriptura.
2. Within 20 seconds, he straw-mans Sola Scripture.
This is a “giant” of Catholic apologetics, lol.
My Personal Opinion (non-biblical opinion) regarding "Sola Scriptura" (Written Scripture Alone)... during the time when the New Covenant Scriptures of God thru Christ Jesus were not written down yet or have not fully completely written down yet... the early Christians of the 1st Cent. A.D., before the 2nd Temple was destroyed by the Roman Empire, their CHRISTIAN FAITH in Christ Jesus thru God's Grace, practiced their FAITH based on VERBAL/ORAL TRADITIONS alone written from the Hearts of the Apostles and Disciples...
But after the 2nd Temple was destroyed in around 70 A.D., more or less 40 years after Christ Jesus ascended back to Heaven with God the Father... God decided to ALLOW only those VERBAL/ORAL TRADITIONS to be written down by God's People guided by the Holy Spirit that have significance, relevance, and importance to the process of SALVATION of mankind...
Those oral/verbal traditions were practiced by the Early Christians in the 1st Cent. A.D. that was not written down was God's DECISION not to practice no more... most especially after the book of revelation was written down by Apostle John at Patmos in around 92 - 96 A.D.
Apostle John said (Rev. 22:18-19/paraphrase)... "I testified and warned anyone who hears the Prophecy of this SCROLL (singular/Book/Bible): if anyone ADDS any WORDS to them, God will add to that person the PLaGUES (tribulation/troubles) written in this scroll (Book)... And anyone who SUBTRACT (takes away) any WORDS of the Prophecy from this scroll (Book), God will take away to that person any share from the Tree of Life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll (Book)."... Amen
Therefore, in my personal opinion, today, in our time when the WORD of GOD is finally completed without any FAULT of its OWN (not of Human Scribers' errors/mistakes like handwriting, spelling, printing, grammar, language translation, etc.)... we, Christian believers and followers of Christ must RELY Solely upon the written Holy BOOK/BIBLE (no longer Oral/Verbal Traditions).
ive been doing a dive into this trying to help others understand this from a loving standpoint. Too often i feel Catholics get jaded by this conversation and theres always deep resentment and animosity in the conversation. I think if both sides are honest with the conversation that there could be a consensus reached.
Sola Scriptura defended conversation.
God has spoken, scripture is his revealed word of God. Gods word is found no where else. Scripture is the only thing the Church has that is God breathed.
“well who do you think gave you those scriptures?”
Moses gave us the law and formed the levitical priesthood and the profits gave us the rest. The Torah is the backbone of scripture. It predates the church and the church cannot survive without the Torah. Jesus and the 11+Paul quote and echo ONLY the Torah during their ministry. The early church after the Jewish 12 were Hebrew deficient and knew nothing of the Torah in detailed comparison to the Gospel. Given the Gospel is a fulfilled reference point of the Torah, it would be an impossibility for Torah deficient men to manifest the NT scriptures. The NT letters and scriptures were written and circulated by-the 11+ Paul while they were alive and well before 70ad with Jerusalem’s destruction. Peter and Paul both affirm this and Pauls writings echo this reality continually.
“Well, without the Tradition of the early historical church you only have scripture and your own interpretations.”
Scripture interprets its self through and analogy process and always has since Moses. Scripture validates its self. There was never a discouraged interpretive break in scriptural understanding like there is with Rome. Oral tradition over time warped the levitical priesthood to usurp the word of God for Tradition. This is why they missed it with Christ. Tradition expected a conquering King vs a savior of Sin. Christ NEVER condoned tradition and the apostles only likened tradition to the Gospel teachings. Never extra-biblical practices.
“Well how do you know you are correct and history is wrong. By what standard do you measure truth?”
The word of God is only understood by spirit filled believers in Christ. This is a radical difference between the believing and unbelieving. “The message of the cross is foolishness to those perishing, but to those being saved it is the Power of God. “ The power of God is available to those in repentant obedience. Those in dwelt by the spirit of God in Salvation. Those without forgiveness from the Cross cannot understand the mind of God or scripture. Those of only the flesh are blinded by the god or this world from seeing the light of the gospel. Therefore 2 types of people exist.
Unbelieving - unable to understand scripture
Believers - scripture is revealed by God by the spirit placed in you. The Text is clear and EASY to understand. The radically changed do not remain complacent but are transformed by the renewed mind and thrusted into holiness by convicted sanctification through the scriptures.
And such individuals live God, and love their neighbor. When they love this way, argumentation becomes the sin in the way of fellowship. This is why those in-dwelt by the holy spirit are one church. Catholic, Protestant, all who trust in Christ.
“Well, what about the 30,000 denominations. everyone sees things different. None of you are aligned”
This is a classic uniformed perception perpetrated by argumentative politics designed to tear down others, so that they can only see One Direction. This is not an opinion from informed knowledge. Truth is revealed to the the person who’s contrite and broken before God. Truth is not revealed to the ambitious power hungry pastor looking to grow his numbers beyond depth to mega-size standards on the skewed scripture twisting of prosperity or themed churches like rapper churches. The message of Christ is the cross, and it’s one message, not an adaptive allegory meant to fit within the human social constructs.
So, divergent spiritual views are only problematic in radical contrasts. Theres a major difference in the revealed Torah and Gospel message between the Mormon and Reformed Baptist or the Baptist and Red Hill Churches. Only one is Biblically Formed.
ALL faiths must be tested against scripture. All Churches answer to scripture and the evidence of those who are spirit filled revealed will teach a pure rigid Gospel message word for word in holy Scripture WITHOUT personal opinion or side stories or conjecture. The Word of God is sharper than a 2 edge sword and fully sufficient for salvation. ALL must be measured by scripture. Churches who’s sole mission is the Gospel even in the face of congregational, dwindling or collapse are not only biblical but blessed.
The Church is not measures by its numbers but by its message. MOST reformed non catholic denominations are unified in scripture with minor divergences like the rapture, communion or tribulation.
If we all agree salvation is an inner spirit transformation and radical change by God through his son, minor diverging differences are meaningless until they compromise the message of the Cross. This is why 30,000 denominations are still worldly unified yet minorly different.
Those TRULY born from above WITH an obvious radical heart/mind change recognize one another across the spectrum of religion, culture, race, age, gender.
@@HillbillyBlack My understanding is this... All written WORD of God (Holy Scriptures) are AUTHORITATIVE and are Breathed out of God, profitable for TEACHING, for REPROOF, for CORRECTION, and for TRAINING in Righteousness, that the man of God may/might be completed, equipt for every Good WORK (Acts/Deeds)"... (Ref. 2 Timothy 3:16-17)
Therefore, any Verbal/Oral Traditions after the Book was completely written, that do not conform, sanction, adhere to, cohere to, and are not allowed by the written Holy Scriptures (the Bible), must and should not be followed, obeyed, or practiced by Christians... Amen.
@@jvlp2046 as long as tradition is tested by scripture and passes, its fine.
Paul - Galatians 1:8-9
@@HillbillyBlack "TEST every SPIRIT to see whether if they are from God or not." (Ref. 1 John 4)... How can we do that?... through the WRITTEN Scriptures (The Bible)... no longer from Verbal/Oral Traditions... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
@@jvlp2046 do you feel i disagree?
ive been doing a dive into this trying to help others understand this from a loving standpoint. Too often i feel Catholics get jaded by this conversation and theres always deep resentment and animosity in the conversation. I think if both sides are honest with the conversation that there could be a consensus reached.
Sola Scriptura defended conversation.
God has spoken, scripture is his revealed word of God. Gods word is found no where else. Scripture is the only thing the Church has that is God breathed.
“well who do you think gave you those scriptures?”
Moses gave us the law and formed the levitical priesthood and the profits gave us the rest. The Torah is the backbone of scripture. It predates the church and the church cannot survive without the Torah. Jesus and the 11+Paul quote and echo ONLY the Torah during their ministry. The early church after the Jewish 12 were Hebrew deficient and knew nothing of the Torah in detailed comparison to the Gospel. Given the Gospel is a fulfilled reference point of the Torah, it would be an impossibility for Torah deficient men to manifest the NT scriptures. The NT letters and scriptures were written and circulated by-the 11+ Paul while they were alive and well before 70ad with Jerusalem’s destruction. Peter and Paul both affirm this and Pauls writings echo this reality continually.
“Well, without the Tradition of the early historical church you only have scripture and your own interpretations.”
Scripture interprets its self through and analogy process and always has since Moses. Scripture validates its self. There was never a discouraged interpretive break in scriptural understanding like there is with Rome. Oral tradition over time warped the levitical priesthood to usurp the word of God for Tradition. This is why they missed it with Christ. Tradition expected a conquering King vs a savior of Sin. Christ NEVER condoned tradition and the apostles only likened tradition to the Gospel teachings. Never extra-biblical practices.
“Well how do you know you are correct and history is wrong. By what standard do you measure truth?”
The word of God is only understood by spirit filled believers in Christ. This is a radical difference between the believing and unbelieving. “The message of the cross is foolishness to those perishing, but to those being saved it is the Power of God. “ The power of God is available to those in repentant obedience. Those in dwelt by the spirit of God in Salvation. Those without forgiveness from the Cross cannot understand the mind of God or scripture. Those of only the flesh are blinded by the god or this world from seeing the light of the gospel. Therefore 2 types of people exist.
Unbelieving - unable to understand scripture
Believers - scripture is revealed by God by the spirit placed in you. The Text is clear and EASY to understand. The radically changed do not remain complacent but are transformed by the renewed mind and thrusted into holiness by convicted sanctification through the scriptures.
And such individuals live God, and love their neighbor. When they love this way, argumentation becomes the sin in the way of fellowship. This is why those in-dwelt by the holy spirit are one church. Catholic, Protestant, all who trust in Christ.
“Well, what about the 30,000 denominations. everyone sees things different. None of you are aligned”
This is a classic uniformed perception perpetrated by argumentative politics designed to tear down others, so that they can only see One Direction. This is not an opinion from informed knowledge. Truth is revealed to the the person who’s contrite and broken before God. Truth is not revealed to the ambitious power hungry pastor looking to grow his numbers beyond depth to mega-size standards on the skewed scripture twisting of prosperity or themed churches like rapper churches. The message of Christ is the cross, and it’s one message, not an adaptive allegory meant to fit within the human social constructs.
So, divergent spiritual views are only problematic in radical contrasts. Theres a major difference in the revealed Torah and Gospel message between the Mormon and Reformed Baptist or the Baptist and Red Hill Churches. Only one is Biblically Formed.
ALL faiths must be tested against scripture. All Churches answer to scripture and the evidence of those who are spirit filled revealed will teach a pure rigid Gospel message word for word in holy Scripture WITHOUT personal opinion or side stories or conjecture. The Word of God is sharper than a 2 edge sword and fully sufficient for salvation. ALL must be measured by scripture. Churches who’s sole mission is the Gospel even in the face of congregational, dwindling or collapse are not only biblical but blessed.
The Church is not measures by its numbers but by its message. MOST reformed non catholic denominations are unified in scripture with minor divergences like the rapture, communion or tribulation.
If we all agree salvation is an inner spirit transformation and radical change by God through his son, minor diverging differences are meaningless until they compromise the message of the Cross. This is why 30,000 denominations are still worldly unified yet minorly different.
Those TRULY born from above WITH an obvious radical heart/mind change recognize one another across the spectrum of religion, culture, race, age, gender.
Apostle Simon Peter was the 1st BISHOP (Elder Servant) of the 7 Churches in Asia Minor mentioned in Revelation and not the Bishop of Rome... that was the claim of the R.C.C. only... Simor Peter was crucified by the Pagan Rome.
The English word BISHOP (Oversee/Head Elder/Head Servant) does not equate with the Latin word POPE/PAPA (Father in English)...
According to the Bible, we must not call someone in God's CHURCH the title "FATHER" (Pope/Papa) for we have only One Father God/YHWH... (ref. Matt. 23:9)...
At home, we can call our earthly parents Father or Mother... but in the Church of God in Christ Jesus, it is prohibited by the Scripture...
Regarding the English word DEACON... in Greek, "DIAKONOS" which merely meant Church SERVANT... not a STATUS or POSITION... but a DUTY/TASK.
If you read the ACTS of the Apostles... the Early 7 Churches in Asia Minor do not have HIERARCHY... All are treated equally, honored, and respected in the BODY OF CHRIST including the Bishop/Head Servant... No Pope, Cardinals, Archbishop, Magisterium, Councils, etc...
There is TRANSPARENCY among the BODY of Christ inside the CHURCH OF GOD, where their focus is to Spread the Gospel most especially to the Poor, Widows, Sick, Forgotten, Cast out, etc... and focus not on Luxurius Buildings and Structures which the R.C.C. have done...
The Apostles and their Disciples do not want ANYONE including the Body of Christ to bow or kneel down before them or kiss their hands or feet... St. Paul and St. Barnabas had torn their clothes in Public after the People/Crowd had started praising and kneeling down to worship them, saying, "We are only just MEN and not God."... (ref. Acts 14:14)...
In Public, everybody can see that the R.C.C. POPE/PAPA/CARDINALS/BISHOPS/PRIEST allowed their devotees to bow or kneel down/bend knees before them and kiss their hands or Ring of Authority just like the Emperors, Kings and Royalties... Blasphemy in the Sight of God...
We do not need the I.Q. of Einstein or Tesla to understand and comprehend these matters unless we have a CLOSED Heart and Mind or a slow low poor I.Q. or perhaps of a Moron... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
Someone asked me. "What type of Source of Divine Revelation they used before Nicea (325 A.D) and in the 1st Century A.D.?...
Answer... The EXISTING WRITTINGS of the Apostles of Christ Jesus including St. Paul the Apostles to the Gentiles and the 4 Gospel Writers...
R.C.C. never wrote those EXISTING REVELATIONS in the 1st Cent. A.D. .. they just Translated it into the LATIN VULGATE and compiled them, that was all they have done... they never even translated them "AS IS" (Faithfully) but with invested interest to FIT their narrative DOGMAS... that was why they do not want to translate them into other languages other than LATIN...
They persecuted, excommunicated, and murdered in the horrible/terrible way of methods (like burnt alive on stakes, etc.) those who exposed their corruption and abuses of the Papacy and those who translated the Written Scriptures into other Languages...
Come to think of it, the Original Scriptures were primarily written in Hebrew-Aramaic and some in Greek languages, and the R.C.C. translated them into LATIN but does not allow others to translate them into their own TONGUE... This is one PROOF, that R.C.C. was not the CHURCH of God built by Christ Jesus upon Himself (The Rock)...
During Pentecost Day, when the Holy Spirit was poured out to the Apostles and Believers, they all SPEAK in DIFFERENT languages that People at that time could understand but not dead languages... Therefore, God wants the Written Scripture to be translated into all languages so many would understand...not just in LATIN only... Proof that the R.C.C. is not the Church of God in Christ Jesus...
The R.C.C. kept that away from the People... they prohibited the written Scripture to be translated into different languages but copied into LATIN only... That was why God allowed "Men of Faith" (like Jan Hus, John Wycliffe, William Tyndale, Martin Luther, etc.) to have the courage to expose the corruption and abuses of the R.C.Chruch and to translate the Scripture into their own tongue for the sake of the people but the price was too great/high that they lost their lives in the process for doing so, some excommunicated, and some disgrace their graves...
The R.C.C. approved their persecution in the horrible/terrible way of methods (INHUMANE)... just like how Pagan Rome did in Ancient times.
History Attested to this Matters... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen...
===========
The Written Scriptures already EXISTED long before Rome became Catholic in the 4th Cent. A.D. ... Take note, most of the Written Scriptures were written in Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek... and not in Latin... What the Catholics did was to translate them into LATIN with some BIAS Doctrines to FIT their Dogmas...
For example... Prophet Isaiah Prophesied (Isaiah 7:14)... the word "HA ALMAH," which only means, "The Young Woman."... the Roman Catholic Latin Version was translated as "The VIRGIN MAIDEN" ... Isaiah never mentioned "BETHULAH" (Virgin)... he never wrote "HA ALMAH BETULAH."
DINAH the daughter of Jacob was called "ALMAH" (young woman) even after she was RAPED by the pagan prince... R.C.C. twisted the narrative of the Prophecy of Isaiah to FIT their DOGMA narrative of PERPETUAL VIRGINITY... and many more...
The Israelite Jews knew what the R.C.C. had done in the 4th Cent. A.D., which was why the R.C.C. persecuted the WONDERING (Exiled) Jews around the world... They knew what they had done...
Christ Jesus's True CHURCH never commanded His Apostles to harm, persecute, or murder/slaughter those who do not AGREE or CONVERT to CATHOLICISM... "For whatever you do the least of your brothers/neighbors (foes alike), you are doing unto ME (Christ Jesus)" ... (ref. Matt. 25:40)...
Christ only commanded His Apostles a "Symbolic and Spiritual Act" to "SHAKE THE DUST OFF THEIR FEET/SANDALS," for/to those who do not want to accept (rejected) the Gospel"...(ref. Matt. 10:14)... NO Physical VIOLENCE of whatsoever...
Does the R.C.C. obey and follow that?... History attested they have NOT... therefore, that CHURCH was not from GOD from the start... but from SATAN and his FALLEN Angels who always like VIOLENCE, CHAOS, DIVISION, and WAR...
Historians, Theologians, and Archeologists NEVER found the 7 CHURCHES of God built and founded by Christ Jesus in the 1st Century A.D. in Asia Minor mentioned in the Book of Revelation, up to the 3rd Century A.D. ForeFathers of the CHURCH had harmed, persecuted, or murdered Pagans, Gentiles, Agnostics, Heretics, Atheists, and Jews... absolutely, NONE for the sake of FAITH of the CHURCH...
However, perhaps, individual Early Christians had harmed somebody NOT for the SAKE of the CHURCH (FAITH) but for their self/personal reasons caused by their own weaknesses... For example, cheating spouses, jealousy, vendetta, pride, debts, drunkness, etc...
Only in the 4th Century ONWARD when Pagan Rome had accepted CHRISTIANITY through Emperor Constantine... that persecution and slaughtering started for the SAKE of the R.C. CHURCH... Catholicism and Islamism are both KILLING for the sake of their RELIGION/CHURCH.
Facts and Truth, HISTORIANS, THEOLOGIANS, and ARCHEOLOGISTS attested to this matter... Praise be to God in Christ Jesus... Amen.
It just dawned on me that sola scriptura has allowed any individual to create a church out of what the "Holy Spirit" told them, but all these churches have different dogmas. So how could it have been the Holy Spirit? So, I am gravitating towards Catholicism.
So true! Thanks for your comment.
I lived 26 years of my adult life as a Protestant arguing against the Catholic Church. I began to see more and more how much Protestant denominations or “non-denominations” differed from each other in beliefs. They all have conflicting and contradictory doctrines from one another. Yet, they all claim to go by the bible alone and say they’re lead by the Holy Spirit. But at the end of the day they disagree with other Protestants on doctrine, the teachings of Christ. The Holy Spirit doesn’t lead the Church to contradictory doctrines. It’s a different spirit that does that.
They disagree on what the Bible says...what Jesus says. They disagree in matters regarding salvation itself (how we get it, can we choose it?, can we lose it?, and all kinds of things...endlessly).
Christ did not establish a church with conflicting and contradictory doctrines within itself. Yet that’s what we have in Protestantism. There is no one within Protestantism who can say “thus saith the Lord”. At least not anyone that other Protestants feel obligated to believe.
When one disagrees, they just start a new church, or find one that fits what they want to hear. And on and on it goes. So we’re left with thousands of conflicting and contradictory Protestant churches. Like you wouldn’t say, “the Protestant church”, because it's actually thousands of separate churches, all teaching contradictory things from one another. This is absolutely undeniable.
Doctrinal relativism is not an option in Christ's One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. We do not agree to disagree on Doctrine. That would be unbiblical.
Truth matters. Peace.
@@faithofourfathers I was catholic but now protestat. And I see that many protestants are undereducated in their confession and do not understandt what they claim to believe. That is why I cut ties with many of my abusive protestant friends. But that does not mean that Sola Scriptura (which Jesus simply defined as "The Scripture cannot be broken" plus many more etc.) is null and void just because its defenders are inept. And of course one must read the Biblie, which was for almost ten centuries a no-no thing for the flock in the CC.
Yes, hold fast to the traditions *the Apostles* passed on, whether verbal or written. Which the Marian dogmas are not found..
ive been doing a dive into this trying to help others understand this from a loving standpoint. Too often i feel Catholics get jaded by this conversation and theres always deep resentment and animosity in the conversation. I think if both sides are honest with the conversation that there could be a consensus reached.
Sola Scriptura defended conversation.
God has spoken, scripture is his revealed word of God. Gods word is found no where else. Scripture is the only thing the Church has that is God breathed.
“well who do you think gave you those scriptures?”
Moses gave us the law and formed the levitical priesthood and the profits gave us the rest. The Torah is the backbone of scripture. It predates the church and the church cannot survive without the Torah. Jesus and the 11+Paul quote and echo ONLY the Torah during their ministry. The early church after the Jewish 12 were Hebrew deficient and knew nothing of the Torah in detailed comparison to the Gospel. Given the Gospel is a fulfilled reference point of the Torah, it would be an impossibility for Torah deficient men to manifest the NT scriptures. The NT letters and scriptures were written and circulated by-the 11+ Paul while they were alive and well before 70ad with Jerusalem’s destruction. Peter and Paul both affirm this and Pauls writings echo this reality continually.
“Well, without the Tradition of the early historical church you only have scripture and your own interpretations.”
Scripture interprets its self through and analogy process and always has since Moses. Scripture validates its self. There was never a discouraged interpretive break in scriptural understanding like there is with Rome. Oral tradition over time warped the levitical priesthood to usurp the word of God for Tradition. This is why they missed it with Christ. Tradition expected a conquering King vs a savior of Sin. Christ NEVER condoned tradition and the apostles only likened tradition to the Gospel teachings. Never extra-biblical practices.
“Well how do you know you are correct and history is wrong. By what standard do you measure truth?”
The word of God is only understood by spirit filled believers in Christ. This is a radical difference between the believing and unbelieving. “The message of the cross is foolishness to those perishing, but to those being saved it is the Power of God. “ The power of God is available to those in repentant obedience. Those in dwelt by the spirit of God in Salvation. Those without forgiveness from the Cross cannot understand the mind of God or scripture. Those of only the flesh are blinded by the god or this world from seeing the light of the gospel. Therefore 2 types of people exist.
Unbelieving - unable to understand scripture
Believers - scripture is revealed by God by the spirit placed in you. The Text is clear and EASY to understand. The radically changed do not remain complacent but are transformed by the renewed mind and thrusted into holiness by convicted sanctification through the scriptures.
And such individuals live God, and love their neighbor. When they love this way, argumentation becomes the sin in the way of fellowship. This is why those in-dwelt by the holy spirit are one church. Catholic, Protestant, all who trust in Christ.
“Well, what about the 30,000 denominations. everyone sees things different. None of you are aligned”
This is a classic uniformed perception perpetrated by argumentative politics designed to tear down others, so that they can only see One Direction. This is not an opinion from informed knowledge. Truth is revealed to the the person who’s contrite and broken before God. Truth is not revealed to the ambitious power hungry pastor looking to grow his numbers beyond depth to mega-size standards on the skewed scripture twisting of prosperity or themed churches like rapper churches. The message of Christ is the cross, and it’s one message, not an adaptive allegory meant to fit within the human social constructs.
So, divergent spiritual views are only problematic in radical contrasts. Theres a major difference in the revealed Torah and Gospel message between the Mormon and Reformed Baptist or the Baptist and Red Hill Churches. Only one is Biblically Formed.
ALL faiths must be tested against scripture. All Churches answer to scripture and the evidence of those who are spirit filled revealed will teach a pure rigid Gospel message word for word in holy Scripture WITHOUT personal opinion or side stories or conjecture. The Word of God is sharper than a 2 edge sword and fully sufficient for salvation. ALL must be measured by scripture. Churches who’s sole mission is the Gospel even in the face of congregational, dwindling or collapse are not only biblical but blessed.
The Church is not measures by its numbers but by its message. MOST reformed non catholic denominations are unified in scripture with minor divergences like the rapture, communion or tribulation.
If we all agree salvation is an inner spirit transformation and radical change by God through his son, minor diverging differences are meaningless until they compromise the message of the Cross. This is why 30,000 denominations are still worldly unified yet minorly different.
Those TRULY born from above WITH an obvious radical heart/mind change recognize one another across the spectrum of religion, culture, race, age, gender.
The Council of Trent condemned every other translation of the Bible, except for the Latin Vulgate in the Council of Trent, Fourth Session. They had and still have no right to condemn non-Catholic bibles or to declare and arrogantly presume to have the authority over God's word and proper translation. Jerome was commissioned, meaning Hired and Paid to translate another version of the Original Old Latin Vulgate of 150 A.D. and he perverted the gospel and here is another example:
In John Chapter 7, the Messiah told his brothers that he was not YET going up to Jerusalem for the feast of Tabernacles, but would go up later:
"Ye go up to the feast; I am not YET going up to the feast, for my time hath not YET been fulfilled. And having said these things to them he stayed in Galilee. But when his brethren went up, then he also went up to the feast, not openly, but as in secret (John 7:8-10, Greek Orthodox Version).
Here are the same verses from the perverted Latin Vulgate:
"Go ye up to this festival day, but I go not up to this festival day: because my time is not accomplished. When he had said these things, he himself stayed in Galilee. But after his brethren were gone up, then he also went up to the feast, not openly, but, as it were, in secret. (John 7:8-10, Douay-Rheims Version).
By omitting the word YET twice, the whole tenor of the conversation is changed, and Jesus of Nazareth is made a deceitful LIAR. Many of the newer versions follow the example of the Latin Vulgate and omit the all-important word YET. God said not one tittle/jot of his law should be changed and not a word added to or taken from it.
Have you had your WAFER OF SUPERSUBSTANTIAL blasphemous bread today?
The highlight of your blasphemous mass and the supposed "MIRACLE" of transubstantiation where the bread and wine become the literal body and blood of Christ is a LIE. The groundwork for this claimed miracle is found in the corrupt Catholic Version Latin Vulgate Version.
In the Sermon on the Mount Joshua said: Give us this day our daily bread (Matthew 6:11). It was a prayer and had NOTHING to do with the Last Supper of Communion.
On the other hand, the Latin Vulgate tells us to pray for our supersubstantial bread:
Give us this day our supersubstantial (Lat. supersubstantialem) bread. (Douay-Rheims Version).
This false word laid the foundation for the "miracle" of the mass which appeared centuries later.
There are dozens of changes, but not enough room here to list and show them all, but I have them and so do a lot of other True bible believing, bible studying Christians that don't read the corrupted Catholic bible
There are many enemies of Christ, and Your church is one of the biggest enemies. The Jews deny him, but the Catholic Church uses The LORDS'S NAME and BLASPHEMES HIM with every FALSE DOCTRINE
Phew! Have you ever heard of study Catholic bibles? They compare al versions and translations in history. So you cannot say 'we are fooled' by blasphemers. Get a grip and study more. Peace be unto you.
Hold fast to the apostolic tradition not to the post apostolic tradition. The Bible does not speak to that in anyway. He is extrapolating way beyond in actual intent of the texts and reaching centuries on into the future. This is a clear example of isogesis and reading your schematic into the Scriptures.
Keep adding to the Bible 😂 it doesn’t say that
When you trust people in Rome...you make the GOD BREATHED Scriptures irrelevant
Do you celebrate Christmas and Easter?
Sola scriptura need not be based on a presupposition of scripture's infallibility. Rather it's based on the authority of the apostles. Of the writings of the early church, ony scripture is infallible - because it came directly from the apostles. The writings of subsequent generations of church fathers are authoritative, but not infallible in the sense of having no possibility of containing error. The question of who has authority to interpret scripture, and regarding how much authority those later fathers have (short of infallible authority) are other questions.
SIM!! 👍
@@thiagoazevedo9438 I don't know what that means
That's wrong, it based on what the Holy Spirit inspired them to record. Without the Holy Spirit being the author, they could have made errors, but Christ said he'd bring to their remembrance all he taught them, as well as the Holy Spirit to confirm all was True. The Bible is the infallible Qorda of God, ,not the infallible words of the apostles. The Catholic Church hasn't told the truth at all. It's whole claim of Peter i false, as well false Mary doctrines. It doesn't have the gospel of Christ at all.
@@maggiejoban2058 The bible is the infallible word of the apostles. Jesus is the word made flesh. He is fully man fully God. The Bible is written by fully man and fully God. If man has no part in the writing of scriptures then you deny Jesus is the word made flesh fully man fully God.
@@maggiejoban2058 I agree that the Bible is infallible because of the holy spirit's guidance and inspiration of the apostolic writers. Yet there is something unique and authoritative about the apostolic source. I believe that the Holy Spirit still inspires and moves people to speak and write today, and yet I wouldn't credit infallibility to contemporary words or writings of people who claim holy spirit inspiration because as human instruments of the Spirit, they are liable to mix in error with the inspiration.
I am Protestant btw. My original point was to defend sola scriptura against the Catholic argument that sola scriptura is based on circular reasoning that requires a presupposition of scriptural authority (the idea that we believe that scripture is infallible because scripture says that it's infallible). In fact, we believe that scripture is infallible because of the witness of the apostles, who spoke with holy spirit inspiration and Christ given authority.
"Lets not make a straw man", yet that is exactly what you have done!
You quote scripture as if it they have authority, yet, in the same breath the Catholic church de-nigh the inspiration of the New Testament (2 Thessalonians 2:15)? Not well thought out.
Every time the Jesus Chris was tempted by Satan he responded to Satan by quoting scripture (Sola Scriptura); Jesus Christ is our example, and we are to be like him.
Mark 7:13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.
A question for you, Is the New Testament the inspired word of God, preserved by His singular care?
You may also wish to familiarize your self where the Christian church started (was first identified).
Acts 11:26 And when he had found him (the Apostle Paul), he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
2 Timothy 1:13
Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
Romans 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Romans 1:16-18
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. [17] For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. [18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
John 17:17
Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
1 Peter 4:11
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God; if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Proverbs 6:23
For the commandment is a lamp; and the law is light; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:
Isaiah 8:20
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Matthew 6:23
But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!
Mark 7:6-9
He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. [7] Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. [8] For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. [9] And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
1 Timothy 6:3-5
If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; [4] He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, [5] Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.
Tudo que os apóstolos ensinavam oralmente já estavam em suas epístolas. A Tradição apostólica do primeiro século não é a mesma Tradição católica romana. A Tradição católica é um acúmulo de erros teológicos e filosóficos ao longo da história da Igreja cristã. Por isso que o Cânon Bíblico do Novo Testamento foi necessário contra as heresias dentro do cristianismo histórico. SOLA SCRIPTURA!!!
To be clear, sola scriptura actually means that scripture is the only INFALLIBLE source of authority, not “the only authority”.
The meaning of Sola Scriptura depends on which Protestant you ask. If you ask 10 of them you’ll get 17 different answers 😉
@@faithofourfathers Understood, but the definition I provided is the actual one. Scripture being the only authority is now labeled “solo scriptura” and is considered nonsense by most theologians as every church has some sort of authority and Tradition.
@Turtle I was stating what the doctrine actually is, not defending it. I’m an evangelical Christian who became a Catholic Christian.
Yeah..but this is even worst theaching..Luther actualy wanna grab autorithy for self on that way and start "New catolich Church".
@@stephenjohnson9632 i have question for you?how do you feel as evangelical after realaizing what Sola Scriptura realy mean ?
8 Things a Catholic should know
Scripture Endures Forever (1 Peter 1:24-25 KJV); tradition does not.
All scripture will be fulfilled (Mark 14:49 KJV); tradition will not.
Scripture purifies life (Psalm 119:9 KJV) tradition doesn’t.
Scripture is divinely inspired (2 Timothy 3:15-16 KJV); tradition isn’t.
Scripture is absolutely trustworthy (Psalm 119:90, 138 KJV); tradition isn’t.
Scripture Blesses those who keep it (Psalm 119:1-2 KJV); tradition doesn’t.
Scripture gives ASSURANCE OF SALVATION (1 John 5:13 KJV); tradition gives none.
Scripture is PROFITABLE FOR SALVATION (1 Peter 1:23 KJV); Not with tradition.
@Rightly Dividing ... I only checked out one of your quotes, and nowhere in 1 John 5 does he say that Scripture Alone,or even Scripture, assure salvation.. 1 John 5:12-15 (ESV): Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. [no mention of scripture in this truth]
13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. [it is referring to the previous truth that John is saying gives Salvation ... not written words, not a book] 14 And this is the confidence that we have toward him, that if we ask anything according to his will he hears us. 15 And if we know that he hears us in whatever we ask, we know that we have the requests that we have asked of him.
Nowhere does it even suggest that Scripture Alone assures salvation... it is belief and following the Son of Man that is the context of Johns writing. When John wrote this, there was no New Testament. He is writing to those who already believe (vs 13)... so how did they already believe?
They believed through the oral teaching passed on by the Apostles and disciples plus any letter already written up to this point by the apostles ... not by reading a book they couldn't read because it hadn't been written yet!
I'm not even going to spend time on the other quotes you give to give a logical explainstion of why each one does not "teach" Sola Scriptura ... as ᴀʟʙᴇʀᴛᴏ ʙʀᴀɴᴅᴏʟɪɴɪ succinctly puts it "ᴛʜᴇ ᴀᴍᴏᴜɴᴛ ᴏꜰ ᴇɴᴇʀɢʏ ɴᴇᴄᴇꜱꜱᴀʀʏ ᴛᴏ ʀᴇꜰᴜᴛᴇ ʙᴜʟʟꜱʜɪᴛ ɪꜱ ᴀɴ ᴏʀᴅᴇʀ ᴏꜰ ᴍᴀɢɴɪᴛᴜᴅᴇ ʙɪɢɢᴇʀ ᴛʜᴀɴ ᴛᴏ ᴘʀᴏᴅᴜᴄᴇ ɪᴛ.”
@@pboyle3723
Psalm 138:2
King James Version
2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
Since you claim tradition is essential, how come it’s never elevated to the same level as God’s word?
@@rightlydividing7607 thanks for taking the time to respond, and spending time on this Catholic channel to test the truth in what you believe.
I am only pointing out that the Bible does not confirm Sola Scriptura ... the Bible does not confirm the books to be included in the Bible (thay was done nearly 400 years after Jesus was on earth... by a church council), the bible does not say the Bible is the sole authority of Gods Word ... which to me is a huge gap in claiming Sola Scriptura as sole authority of all Gods truth and teaching. However, the Bible does confirm the authority of written AND oral teaching!!
Yes the Scripture is inspired by God (the bible tells us this), but instead of telling us Scripture is the sole authority, the bible actually tells the Word of God is through written Scripure and spoken word which was preached by Jesus and handed on to the church starting with the Apostles. In fact the Bible confirms that Jesus left His authority in the church after His ministry ... not the Bible.
Some quotes from the bible confirming it is not the sole authority of Gods teachings;
1 Corinthians 15:1-2 (ESV): Now I would remind you, brothers, of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, in which you stand, 2 and by which you are being saved, if you hold fast to the word I preached to you-unless you believed in vain.
Ephesians 4:20-21 (ESV): But that is not the way you learned Christ!- 21 assuming that you have heard about him and were taught in him, as the truth is in Jesus,
2 Thessalonians 2:15 (ESV): So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the traditions that you were taught by us, either by our spoken word or by our letter.
Galatians 6:6 (ESV): Let the one who is taught the word share all good things with the one who teaches.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 (ESV): Now we command you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is walking in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us.
Eph. 4:11-15 “And his gifts were that some should be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, some pastors and teachers, to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the cunning of men, by their craftiness in deceitful wiles. Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ”.
2nd Timothy 2:2
And what you heard from me through many witnesses entrust to faithful people who will have the ability to teach others as well.
1st Corinthians 11:2
I praise you because you remember me in everything and hold fast to the traditions, just as I handed them on to you.
1st Timothy 3:15
But if I should be delayed, you should know how to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth.
@@pboyle3723
No problem. I’m surprised you guys go to the Bible to justify traditions, when Rome doesn’t even believe a perfect bible exists today. So half of your authority is non existent. For more on this, look up Dr David Hoffman, Dr David Peacock, Dr Gene Kim, Dr Peter Ruckman. The founder of Catholic answers, Karl Keating, made the mistake of debating Dr Peter Ruckman on topics like this and was embarrassed in front of his fellow Catholics.
@@rightlydividing7607 thanks for the response, although I don't understand the point you are making about surprise that a Catholic would go to the bible for evidence for teaching that is written and supported in the Bible! surely you know that it was the Catholic church that agreed the cannon of the Bible.
I'm totally lost about your point about Rome and the bible. I'm not sure what you think Catholics believe and where you picked it up from.
Hopefully by visiting channels like this you will better understand Catholicism ... the real Catholic church, and not an incorrect perception of what the Catholic church teaches and what Catholics believe.
Hopefully you are open to learn more about the real beliefs of Catholics and why we have those beliefs ... even if you have a different interpretation of the true Gospel of Jesus.
So how do you defend the supposed authority of the Church? Where does that authority supposedly come from? What about when traditions and teachings of the Church don't comport with the teachings of the Bible, are extra-biblical, unbiblical, or heretical? Hahn is making claims he has not argued for and really puts man as the pinnacle, as the final authority. Once you do that, you will buy whatever the Church tells you.
The problem is when Catholic tradition contradicts the scripture they go with tradition over Scripture
You still don’t understand that before the Bible it was an Apostolic Tradition (not the man Traditions the Bible later tells us Jesus denied), the Transmission of the Word of God was By Apostolic Tradition literally, and the Bible is written part of that Holy Tradition. Now the Bible itself tells you it doesn’t contain all the teachings of Jesus; Only 4 Evangelists wrote, the Bible points you forwards the Church as the foundation of Truth…There is not a single doctrine nor dogma of the Church that contradicts the Scriptures, not a single one, in fact they are all substantiated by The Scriptures but you have to humble yourself and ask to be enlightened on what you don’t get yet, in all contexts !
Exemple : read Acts 15: you have a council with a dogmatic decision of the Church!
Read Acts 16 last chapter tells you that After the council of Acts 15 Paul and Timothy went on to preach the “Decisions” of the Church so that churches may grow in number and faith !
We gave you the canon. You Protestants think you are God now And experts on the book we gave you
@@lois2997 God preserved His Word , your comment doesn't make sense. Scripture should still be primary
What terrible eisegesis from someone who is in your position. You rip 'traditions' from the context of 2 thess. and wind it into a purely suppositional argument, as if that were the position of Paul. Are u unfamiliar w the plethora of instances where Paul teaches justification thru faith in Jesus? You know what he taught. This is the tradition he's talking about. What do u think- that there is a whole 'talmud' like new testament that is full of oral law? You are teaching doctrines of men- in whom NO SALVATION BELONGS!
Sola Scriptura is sufficient for salvation. These so-called experts just muddy the water. Here is an example. Mark 16:16 116 The one who has believed and has been baptized will be saved; but the one who has not believed will be condemned.
Only scripture, "TECHNICALLY SPEAKING" is the inspired word of God. I do believe that this heresy. The Bible is the only Book that is inspired by God. The magisterium is writings by man.
ive been doing a dive into this trying to help others understand this from a loving standpoint. Too often i feel Catholics get jaded by this conversation and theres always deep resentment and animosity in the conversation. I think if both sides are honest with the conversation that there could be a consensus reached.
Sola Scriptura defended conversation.
God has spoken, scripture is his revealed word of God. Gods word is found no where else. Scripture is the only thing the Church has that is God breathed.
“well who do you think gave you those scriptures?”
Moses gave us the law and formed the levitical priesthood and the profits gave us the rest. The Torah is the backbone of scripture. It predates the church and the church cannot survive without the Torah. Jesus and the 11+Paul quote and echo ONLY the Torah during their ministry. The early church after the Jewish 12 were Hebrew deficient and knew nothing of the Torah in detailed comparison to the Gospel. Given the Gospel is a fulfilled reference point of the Torah, it would be an impossibility for Torah deficient men to manifest the NT scriptures. The NT letters and scriptures were written and circulated by-the 11+ Paul while they were alive and well before 70ad with Jerusalem’s destruction. Peter and Paul both affirm this and Pauls writings echo this reality continually.
“Well, without the Tradition of the early historical church you only have scripture and your own interpretations.”
Scripture interprets its self through and analogy process and always has since Moses. Scripture validates its self. There was never a discouraged interpretive break in scriptural understanding like there is with Rome. Oral tradition over time warped the levitical priesthood to usurp the word of God for Tradition. This is why they missed it with Christ. Tradition expected a conquering King vs a savior of Sin. Christ NEVER condoned tradition and the apostles only likened tradition to the Gospel teachings. Never extra-biblical practices.
“Well how do you know you are correct and history is wrong. By what standard do you measure truth?”
The word of God is only understood by spirit filled believers in Christ. This is a radical difference between the believing and unbelieving. “The message of the cross is foolishness to those perishing, but to those being saved it is the Power of God. “ The power of God is available to those in repentant obedience. Those in dwelt by the spirit of God in Salvation. Those without forgiveness from the Cross cannot understand the mind of God or scripture. Those of only the flesh are blinded by the god or this world from seeing the light of the gospel. Therefore 2 types of people exist.
Unbelieving - unable to understand scripture
Believers - scripture is revealed by God by the spirit placed in you. The Text is clear and EASY to understand. The radically changed do not remain complacent but are transformed by the renewed mind and thrusted into holiness by convicted sanctification through the scriptures.
And such individuals live God, and love their neighbor. When they love this way, argumentation becomes the sin in the way of fellowship. This is why those in-dwelt by the holy spirit are one church. Catholic, Protestant, all who trust in Christ.
“Well, what about the 30,000 denominations. everyone sees things different. None of you are aligned”
This is a classic uniformed perception perpetrated by argumentative politics designed to tear down others, so that they can only see One Direction. This is not an opinion from informed knowledge. Truth is revealed to the the person who’s contrite and broken before God. Truth is not revealed to the ambitious power hungry pastor looking to grow his numbers beyond depth to mega-size standards on the skewed scripture twisting of prosperity or themed churches like rapper churches. The message of Christ is the cross, and it’s one message, not an adaptive allegory meant to fit within the human social constructs.
So, divergent spiritual views are only problematic in radical contrasts. Theres a major difference in the revealed Torah and Gospel message between the Mormon and Reformed Baptist or the Baptist and Red Hill Churches. Only one is Biblically Formed.
ALL faiths must be tested against scripture. All Churches answer to scripture and the evidence of those who are spirit filled revealed will teach a pure rigid Gospel message word for word in holy Scripture WITHOUT personal opinion or side stories or conjecture. The Word of God is sharper than a 2 edge sword and fully sufficient for salvation. ALL must be measured by scripture. Churches who’s sole mission is the Gospel even in the face of congregational, dwindling or collapse are not only biblical but blessed.
The Church is not measures by its numbers but by its message. MOST reformed non catholic denominations are unified in scripture with minor divergences like the rapture, communion or tribulation.
If we all agree salvation is an inner spirit transformation and radical change by God through his son, minor diverging differences are meaningless until they compromise the message of the Cross. This is why 30,000 denominations are still worldly unified yet minorly different.
Those TRULY born from above WITH an obvious radical heart/mind change recognize one another across the spectrum of religion, culture, race, age, gender.
@@HillbillyBlack While you have provided a lot of information, there is not any other truth then the Bible. When we start adding other books or writings from different people it muddies the message of Christ.
The Bible is sufficient to show one the path to salvation. if followed as Christ commanded then there is not a problem. It is His Church. He has all the authority on Earth and in Heaven.
However, like the Jews, of the Mosaic Law, and the Gentiles that were supposed to follow the Patriarchal Law, man stepped in and added to the Covenant.
When I speak of the Church of Christ being the True Church many believe it is the physical Church. It is not. It is the Spiritual Church. It is the Church that has only one Head, not many heads. There is only one head of the Church on Earth and that is Christ.
8 Things a Catholic should know
Scripture Endures Forever (1 Peter 1:24-25 KJV); tradition does not.
All scripture will be fulfilled (Mark 14:49 KJV); tradition will not.
Scripture purifies life (Psalm 119:9 KJV) tradition doesn’t.
Scripture is divinely inspired (2 Timothy 3:15-16 KJV); tradition isn’t.
Scripture is absolutely trustworthy (Psalm 119:90, 138 KJV); tradition isn’t.
Scripture Blesses those who keep it (Psalm 119:1-2 KJV); tradition doesn’t.
Scripture gives ASSURANCE OF SALVATION (1 John 5:13 KJV); tradition gives none.
Scripture is PROFITABLE FOR SALVATION (1 Peter 1:23 KJV); Not with tradition.
@Rightly Dividing, 1 Pet 1:24-25 never condemns tradition. Where do you see the word “tradition” in this passage. (also, remember 2 Thes 2:15). Verse 25 backfires on you because Peter doesn’t say “which we WROTE to you”. He says “which we PREACHED to you”. That’s Oral Tradition (again 2 Thes 2:15).
And here too, in Mark 14:49, it never condemns tradition. Where do you see the word “tradition” in this passage. (also, remember 2 Thes 2:15).
And the same for the rest of the verses you listed. I should mention, the Catholic Church has been reading and preaching these passages long before there was ever such a thing as a Protestant. In fact, you have exactly 27 books in your New Testament because the Catholic Church canonized them long before there was ever a KJV.
Where is it taught that the traditions mentioned in 2 Thes 2:15 would end?
Finally, do you not realize the New Testament scriptures come from the Traditions of Jesus and the apostles?
@@faithofourfathers
Tradition is not condemned, just not essential for salvation. Tradition is something you do and salvation is a gift.
A child can understand that.
Romans 6:23
King James Version
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Tradition is never elevated to the level of God’s word, any reason why?
Psalm 138:2
King James Version
2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
@Rightly Dividing, I see the shift that you did. First you were talking about ‘Scripture vs Tradition’, now suddenly it’s ‘Salvation vs Tradition’. Where is it taught that Tradition is merely “something you do”? Even the dictionary doesn’t say it’s merely something you do. It’s also things that are believed.
Think about this, before any of the New Testament was written, people were coming to salvation through the the Traditions of Jesus and the apostles...and still are.
Oh, in case I didn’t mention it before… 2 Thes 2:15 😂 😁
Before I’ll respond to any more of you comments, please answer.
Which denomination or “non-denomination" (or whatever) are you with?
(Non-answers: “I’m just a Christian”, I’m just a “bible believing Christian”, I’m just “a follower of Jesus”, I’m just a someone who “rightly divides the word”, etc.)
@@faithofourfathers
I’m a dispensational baptist.
Which dictionary are you using? Is that the dictionary used by Rome or what God told us to use?
The founder of catholic answers, Karl Keating, made the mistake of debating Dr Peter Ruckman on issues like this and was embarrassed in front of his fellow Catholics. Catholic apologists have avoided dispensational Baptists since then.
There was no shift because Jesus is the word, that’s Bible basics 1 0 1. Since Rome doesn’t believe a perfect bible exists today, half of your authority is non existent. I find it mind boggling that you run to a book that you don’t believe is perfect, to justify your beliefs. I’ll go to another catholic and they’ll give me another Bible version, which has different wording. So is your channel concerning tradition right or would I need to go to another catholic with another Bible to convince me that traditions are right and necessary for salvation. Rome doesn’t want their to be a perfect bible because they want the Bible to be in subjection to it, rather than being subjected to the Bible.
Romans 11:6
King James Version
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Deu 4:4
Mat 4:4
Luk 4:4
16:11 King James Bible
Please don’t wrest the scriptures to your own destruction.
@Turtle
Interpretations belong to God, not to a Church.
Genesis 40:8
King James Version
8 And they said unto him, We have dreamed a dream, and there is no interpreter of it. And Joseph said unto them, Do not interpretations belong to God? tell me them, I pray you.
Since Rome doesn’t believe a perfect bible exists today, how do you know the traditions you partake in are right? That being said, when your tradition conflicts with God’s word which is truth (John 17:17
King James Version
17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.) Who’s right God or Man?