Diesel fuel contamination in engine oil caused by DPF Regeneration
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- Опубліковано 25 кві 2020
- Diesel fuel contamination in engine oil caused by Diesel particulate filter Regeneration. Does DPF regeneration cause diesel to contamination the engine oil and why does my oil smell like diesel.
After becoming mandatory for turbo diesel and diesel vehicles in 2007 the first generation of Diesel Particulate Filters caused many issues including excessive engine oil contamination due to diesel fuel flooding cylinders and washing past the piston rings into the engine sump. Diesel contamination in the engine oil has been known to reach up to 13% after a regeneration cycle causing premature break down of engine oils. High engine oil temperatures have been used to maintain and control diesel fuel in engine oil.
Low oil temperatures or city driving has seen engine oil contamination levels continue to climb until the service period is reach. Generally these vehicles have a shorter service interval period due to the known contamination issues.
Diesle Particulate Filter regeneration frequency is directly effected by fuel quality as well as Engine oil qulaity and compatibility.
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This is the best explanation i've seen until now and sums up all the problems with that generation of TDIs that had DPF mounted on them after they were engineered without a DPF. I hear everywhere about how bad are those engines and how they start having a lot of issues caused by the DPF clogging. And yes, clogging the exhaust can't be good for any engine. Ofcourse, the problems appear o those cars used in the city on short distances and a lot of DPF regenerations occur because of this. I once saw a TDI engine with DPF (VW 2.0 TDI CR engine from 2010) that had 754000km done in 7 years, but that car went between 2 airports only on highway, ~600km/day on a round trip, so i think that DPF didn't need forced regeneration.
Thank you! Make sure you subscribe and thanks for watching.
@@KCKLubricants I forgot to subscribe, sorry. Subscribed. Thank you for your useful video, i will watch more on your channel :)
finally, a clear, concise explanation- thank you. You've earned a subscription. ;)
Thanks for watching and thanks for the feedback!
Very clear and concise information thank you from Ireland.
Cheers! Thanks for watching
Nicely explained. Appreciate the lesson. Thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Excellent information and knowledge, thank you 👍
Glad it was helpful!
Great video, also worth mentioning when dpf comes towards end-of-life/has an issue that regenerations are happening more frequently and this problem is multiplied
Thanks for watching! yes that is very true
congratulations, I thought desk jockeys couldn't make things any worse, but here we are. Thanks for the info
Thanks for watching! the surprises never end
I watched it thrice to understand the importance of running the engine oil temperature above the flash point of the Diesel(to make sure that the Diesel vaporises instead of contaminating the oil on the engine sump during regeration). Hope i got it right. This is very helpful thanks and respect 🙌🏾
Thanks for watching!
Yes, thought same here - good to check your particular engine oil temperature specs. ! :)
Nice explanation.
My local Toyota dealer tried to claim that 5% fuel dilution of the oil was perfectly normal on our 2015 Yaris 1.3 L... while the oil analysis company is warning that this is dangerous N.B. The oil analysis company is the one to listen to.
The fuel dilution of the oil only started after E10 (10% ethanol) fuel was used for a while:
After stopping the E10 the fuel dilution dropped back into the normal range.
The problem was only picked up because
The E10 causes further problems when it oxidises (and polymerises) and deposits a sticky sludge in the engine:
The sludge gums up the rings... which is what allows the fuel to bypass the rings and causes the fuel dilution.
Gumming up the oil rings can also increase oil usage if it gets bad enough.
In our 2006 Yaris 1.3 L the car suddenly started to use a lot of oil... even though the compression was normal and the mechanic couldn't find anything wrong with it.
It wasn't even obviously smoking... which is mainly what made it hard to diagnose.
The fuel dilution itself causes a breakdown of lubrication and is probably the main reason we now see so many low km (well-maintained) cars with scoring of the bores.
You can avoid this problem by bonding a lubricant to the metal.
The sludge doesn't want to come off without some encouragement... even after multiple oil changes:
To get rid of the sludge do an engine flush (or two).
We used a product called "Ring Free" on my sister's 2006 Yaris and it suddenly stopped using oil.
N.B. Diesel has some lubricating properties (compared to petrol)... so fuel dilution may cause fewer lubrication issues in diesels.
A full synthetic oil seems to help avoid the fuel dilution problem as it offers better protection via better lubrication than semi-synthetic or mineral oils.
🙂
Thanks for watching and thanks for the comment!
TDI EVO engine: is the DPF equipped with a fuel injector right before the filter in order to rise the temperature and clean it? I don't have this info. Thank you for your reply!
VW 504/507 is only available in ACEA C3 SPECS. Will there be a VW 504/507 compatible with ACEA C1 in the future? If the answer is "maybe yes" will there be a significant difference on the number of regen triggered by the ECU in your opinion? Thank you!
Very informative. However, this describes how the system would operate in "ideal" situations. What happens to the oil if the regeneration of the DPF fails or is interrupted? While the complexity of the computers in cars has steadily increased the information shown to the driver has decreased.
Thanks for watching and thanks for the feedback, yes that is correct that this video is discussing a serviceable system that is working as designed by the manufacturer. We will put together a video to discuss the points that you have raised so subscribe and stay tuned!
Does a 2013 2.0 crtdi vw diesel engine use a fifth injector or its using postponed injection to raise the egt during regeneration? I just changed the oil in it, did 500km highway driving, than 10km of city driving, and if I saw it correctly there is more oil already in the engine. This seems to me that the car did one regen, and already fucked my oil up. Im using my car in the city on workdays, and on the highway on weekends. I dont want to buy a gas passat just because of this.
Hi KCK! What a brilliant video. I have just subscribed too! I have a question if you can just confirm my hypothesis to be correct or along the lines if I’m wrong. I have a Ford kuga 2014. It has the vaporiser that sprays the fuel into the DPF. Cut a long story short. My sump was filling up with oil and causing diesel runaway 😮 I changed the vaporiser and it was completely blocked. I then drained oil etc tried again still ran away stalled and then took the DPF off it’s completely blocked. Am I right in thinking that because the DPF is blocked this is causing some sort of pressure in the engine and causing it to somehow backfill with diesel and go down into my sump to then cause the run away. Any advice would be appreciated as in these current times a vehicle is needed for my children. Many Thanks
Thanks for watching! wow, i would hate to guess on that one. We have seen all sorts of weird problems caused by blocked or blocking DPF.
Can I drive and how many miles before I get it into the garage?
Good video. Do you know what is dpf fluid used for on some vehicles? It needs to be filled up every once in a while, but other vehicles don't use it at all
Thanks for watching and great question. I believe it is used in the Peugeot & Citroen diesel, a number of these vehicles are fitted with a DPF dosing system that stores your DPF additive in a tank or bag separate to the fuel tank. Each time the vehicles fuel tank is refilled the engine management system injects a 'dose' of the additive to your diesel tank to aid with efficient regeneration of the particulate filter.
@@KCKLubricants thanks
Interesting vid mate, my 2009 sprinter is suffering oil contamination all because of DPF…. It’s only done 152,000 miles so it’s not what you would say “high miles”…. Dpf egr etc etc is killing a decent turbo Diesel engine, And I am old school
Thanks for watching! everyday we hear the same thing regarding to problems created by pollution management.
I own a 2012 VW TDI i just use Liqui Moly Top teck 507.00 spec oil change it at 6,000 and dont extend oil changes if You do it will add more than necessary crap into the DPF filter that You dont want. and i run it hard on the highway some times to blow the crap out of the DPF one needs to drive these German machines like there back home on the Autobhan some times. that's tthe nature of the beast and secret to keeping that DPF Filter clean.
hold it flat! increasing the engine load/engine speed and therefore the exhaust temperature will help keep the DPF clean
Question- Diesel and Lubricant will form a homogenous mixture. This will lead to lowering of overall evaporation temperature of Oil. If this continue to happen its not only Diesel that will get evaporated. But also oil which will get replaced by diesel after next regen
so the oil concentration will continuously decrease.
Thanks for watching!
Excellent Video, very, very informative ☺️
I have a 2008 VW Golf 1.9 TDi (105hp engine code BLS), do you know if over filling with engine oil could cause intermittent plumes of blurry black smoke? Is this dpf or egr?
Thanks for watching, overfilling the engine oil will definitely cause issues!
Best thing to do is delete that crap.nothing but downtime and lost of money.
Hello! How do you consider ACEA C3-16 vs ACEA C1-16 engine oil effects on the DPF? Is there any significant difference in term of clogging the DPF? How less frequently will the system regenerate with a C1 oil instead of a C3? Thank you very much for your answer!
Great Questions! Stay tuned and we will try to put a video together to answer your questions, make sure you have subscribed!
Great video for oil dilition caused by DPF but how to rise the oil temp. to 268F during the regeneration? shift to 3000 rpm?
If you can maintain some load on the engine it will help
Great video thanks. I have just had a high oil level from my weekly check in my 2009 320d which seems likely is related to diesel getting into it. I think its been about 18 months since last oil service only noticed recently that my service interval distance is not changing from when it was last serviced cause of the age and distance the car has done now (210k miles). I also now do shorter journeys now frequently. Booked an oil change tomorrow and will be keeping a close eye on the level to see if it is creeping up... so you think this sort of issue could be caused by this dpf related oil dilution? The dipstick check shows the level is about a mm or two over the top line now FYI
FYI the level was on the top line for the last 12 months on the computer oil check with no issues retorted.
thanks for watching! sound like diesel contamination which is most likely DPF related. keep an eye on it!
@KCK Lubricants Got a good spot on a tissue and couldn't smell any diesel so if it is I guess it's not up slowly and there's not really much in it yet. Lucky i check it regularly really 👍
@@theoutsider6191 👍
Hi, master ! I have a 2014 ford transit custom 2.2
Also have facing the diesel contamination problem. And the same time the dpf regeneration every 30km.
This situation has continued for more than 80,000 kilometers, without engine failure light.
Hello Andrew, Wow regeneration every 30km sounds very excessive! I would suggest there is something wrong with the DPF? Constant short journeys or incorrect engine oil may cause permanent damage to the DPF and it is unable to be cleaned by a regeneration cycle. I would be interested to hear what you find the problem to be.
This engine actually uses a "5th injector" but also seems to use post-injection alongside.
@@KCKLubricants last month I replace the DPF. Also, clean the 5TH injector, and replace the pipe temp. sensor. The diesel contamination was fixed. But still regeneration every 50KM.
@@a.p.3167 Thanks for watching, there is definitely a problem with the system, it sounds like the ECU thinks the DPF is blocked it. Possibly a sensor fault
@@a.p.3167 hey man, did you fix that?
Good info, but i have mercedes cla 220 cdi 170hp 2013, and i didn't get emergency light for regeneration of dpf, but i did't any way, so now i don't know if i have to change oil or this car have something for anticontamination? Thanks in advance. Grtz
If your in doubt change your oil! if it looks ok maybe consider going on a longish drive to get your oil temperature to full operation temperature to assist in removing any excess fuel. Thanks for watching and make sure you subscribe!
I wish I could install a diverter valve on the exhaust pipe. One that bypasses EGR, DPF and DEF. I would only divert it back while doing emission inspection (once a year). Unfortunately, there are penalties for that.
Thanks for watching! great idea though.....
I have a question recently I took a car also 2.0 125 kw 2011.
the car has a problem with the increase in oil when I took it, there was excess oil after 2500 km, I changed it and again after 5.
I don't know how long the car has been driven, so from the previous owner, it is possible that there was damage to the engine, it runs well, consumes a little around 5.0 and less.
Thank you
@stef5907 thanks for watching! The only way for the oil to increase is from contamination, if you are concerned about damage definitely get it checked out!
Hope you can shed some light 😢
We got a Merc (automatic) e220d w213 a 2017 model and is displaying “Reduced Oil Level” when driving long distance.
When shutdown and restart, the error would disappear. We have replaced, the oil sensor as well as reduced (drained) some oil out but still same issue.
We took it to Mercedes branch to have read for error codes. They were not in position to diagnose or get any readings! They simply said “it could be water or could be diesel but it would be costly to look into it…”
It is concerning because If its diesel mixing then it can damage the engine :(
What to do now? What do I need to change / replace to fix it? Is there an option to reset it or what exactly?
On Motorway highest speed driven is 80 mph. Do we have to drive faster for the DPF to burn properly?
Thanks for watching, sounds like a tricky one and i would hate to guess. Find a good mechanic that is interested in helping you!
I have the same problem in my car can you please help me what have you done with your car to fix that problem please
Question- if diesel in lube evaporates above flash point then where does those fumes go?
Question- if the travel through vent. Modern day vents goes to air inlet won't that cause more white smoke?
Thanks for watching and great questions, yes the engine is designed to contain all emission and will introduce the small amount of vapor back into the intake. Its only a very small amount and will not cause any issues.
Im planning to put external intake manifold catch can to prevent oily crankcase fumes from mixing with EGR gases in intake manifold , forming crusty carbon buildup.
Hello and thanks for the video. Great explanation! However I have one question about one particular oil and a car (VW TDI Passat CRLB 2.0 TDI 110kw). The engine oil in question is Shell Helix Ultra Pro AV-L 0w30 (GTL oil which very stable in terms of temperature). The oil temperature while on highway with the abovementioned car (and oil of course) is ~ 108C. In the video you mentioned that higher the better? Is this a problem? Or the given car has improvements in the DPF regeneration cycle ?
Thanks!
Thanks for watching and make sure you Subscribe! After the initial generation of DPF systems there has been large advances in the efficiency of the DPF systems, another thing to note is even if the sump oil temperature is 108c the oil temperature can far exceed this in situations like oil reaching the back of the pistons or the oil exciting the turbo housing.
Hi, I have problem with pressure motor oil in a CAT 950 H, was going down after dilution with diesel, the mecanics have detecting a problem with de pump but watching a dilution in last three reports make me have some dudes about the if really coold be the pump and it is going to be the rigth solution, could I have some suggestion or recomendations about it?
Thanks for watching, Depending on the engine the pump can leak from the front seal directly into the crankcase, definitely worth a closer look!
Hi, In a deasel engine what are the parameters that I can mnitor to anticipate regen (based on fact that it is not a car that triger regen by fuel consumption or runing hours) meaning monitored and triger by the ECU based on the requiered parameters.
Thanks for watching! Typically the regen cycle is determined by the pressure difference between the inlet and outlet of the DPF, when it begins to clog the pressure difference will be greater and the ECU will trigger a regeneration cycle.
@@KCKLubricants
Thanks
So what if we have 10% fuel in the oil? 2020 6.7 powerstroke. Cleaned dpf, manual regen, p2002 code, oil level rises, all 3 oil test show 10% at end of oil life. Oil is also blowing past the coupler coming off the turbo outlet.
Thanks for watching, There could be a few reasons for this, It could be as simple as worn piston rings or the engine oil doesn't reach operating temperature due to short running times.
question :What can cause over fueling during a burn process in a 2007 craftter
Thanks for watching, there is a few common problems with the Crafter that may cause over fueling, definitely worth getting it checked out.
I've just had my 2010 Audi Q7 4.2 diesel engine fail and most likely seized from poor lubrication. So far 5 litres of oil/diesel removed from the sump and its still overfull. Post mortem is ongoing ....
Thanks for watching and sorry to hear about your failure!
Just imagine the scars it’s leaving in cylinder walls as it passes by the rings it’s basically recycled dirty air going back into your engine without being filtered and what’s worse is carbon is or can be hard like sand.
Thanks for watching! Agreed, fuel washing the lubrication from the bores is becoming a huge problem with this configuration!
After having indestructable older diesels i bought a second hand modern vauxhall with a circle L engine ...dealer had no idea about modern dpfs and i suspect the dpf was already screwed by its previous owners short journies....it was 12 months of motoring hell and then total Dpf failure, car going into limp mode constantly and could never figure out why oil level rose constantly ......if you dont do regular longer journies do not buy a modern diesel no matter how tempting the price ...go for a euro 1.2 puretec or ford 1.0 ecoboost engine if you want good MPG
Thanks for watching, definitely something that has become an issue and a story we hear all the time!
Does the car have to be actually driven for the washed fuel to evaporate after a regen? Will the diesel not flash off even if the car is stuck in traffic? How long after a regen does the car have to be running at the right temperature for all the excess diesel to evaporate?
Thanks for watching, Normally the engine needs to be under load for the oil temperature to get high enough.
Sounds like even on an old-skool (think 1990sMitsubishi Pajero 4m40 Turbo diesel), even running a slightly hotter thermostat might help burning off engine oil contamination?? ;)
Thanks for watching, anything to raise the oil temperature will help!
@@KCKLubricants I hadn't heard of KCK lubricants. re:-critical numbers - 268F to burn off diesel contamination?.
The oils im currently using are Full Zinc either mineral, or semi-synthetic.
I understood that mineral oils are only good to 250F, but synthetic are good to 300F oil temps.
So what oils would KCK recommend for old-skool (think 1990sMitsubishi Pajero 4m40 Turbo diesel), ??
@@androidemulator6952 We have a specific Diesel oil that would be a great fit for the Pajero. Regarding the maximum operating temperature of the engine oil we have a separate video that may explain that a little better. ua-cam.com/video/oeVS8yNLKEA/v-deo.html
check out our website for our full product range and all of the specifications. www.kcklubricants.com/
Hi.
I have a Nissan Navara D40 2.5 DCI 2007 and have some problems diesel goes into the oil and raises the oil level. Do you know anything about this ?
This video should explain everything you need to know!
For two years and this problem occurs to me, and sometimes the code P1405 appears , With a large consumption of diesel, what is the appropriate solution ?
Thanks for watching, You should find a reputable repair shop that car correctly diagnose and repair this problem
Hi,what could cause diesel to enter oil system , is it down to the Dpf? my dpf is brand new and regenerates every 150miles (motorway) ,i notice oil level rising constantly
Thanks for watching, there could be many causes for this including poor injector performance or engine damage.
I have oil contamination with diesel on my mazda cx5. Dpf regeneration was done then 3 weeks later it was back on again. I've left it a few months now the oil is contaminated. If I do an oil change and regeneration will it fix the problem?
Thanks for watching, it sounds like there may be a problem causing the regeneration and therefore the excessive oil contamination.
Did the 2013 VW tdi use portion of the oil to use as fuel for the dpf regeneration?
Hi Dan, To the best of my knowledge in 2013 Volkswagen is using post-injection for regeneration and i haven't heard of them using oil to assist in the regeneration cycle. If anyone has the answer to that i would love to hear it!
@@KCKLubricants I am trying to figure out why the car is consuming 1 quart of oil in 500 miles. New turbo, good compression and drives great. Regeneration happens more often than usual. No leaks outside of the engine. If you have any tips please let me know. The dealer has no clue and they have had it in the shop 7 times.
@@dand7056 WOW!! if the engine is 'consuming' oil it will cause more frequent generation cycles. Sometime switching brand or type of oil will cause a short period of increased oil consumption but this should settle down within 5000 miles or so.
I have 2000 international 4700 the oil is being pulled from the engine into the fuel pump. Have not been able to find the problem any information will helpful thanks
Thanks for watching and make sure you subscribe! I can only guess that the fuel pump outer seal has failed (the seal that separates the engine oil to the fuel pump itself)
Hi thanks for your video. I have a dmax 2013 , I changed oil and filter , and around two weeks later the oil level was already rising! . I have booked a dpf clean, and will change oil and filter after. Do you think that will help or solve my problems please??
wow, I hope so! you will find out pretty quickly after the DPF clean if the problem is still there on not.
Did the DPF cleaning additive work?
@@songoku7915 Thanks for watching, not always
@@songoku7915 DPF cleaning guy plugged into my Dmax with his laptop and said all looks ok! . He did a carbon clean, but regens are still around the 50 mile mark and oil level is still rising!. Have ordered a EGR delete cable from OZ , and am going to give it a try, failing that, it seems like I have got to have new injectors, bloody expensive!!!!. Wish now I had bought a Hilux.
Hi. Did you solve your problem? What did you do?
This hasn’t helped me. Please help me. I have diesel getting into my oil and need a complete oil change every 2 weeks. What can l do to fix this problem please????
Thanks for watching, This video is regarding Diesel fuel contamination caused by the DPF system. Sounds like you have a completely different problem.
Try 20% in mine right now
No extra points for high score! wow, that's not ideal.
So, is there a solution for the DPF without an injector??
Thanks for watching! Regardless of how the manufacture chooses to do the process, the DPF will need to self clean at some point.
on my 2018 T6 CXEB there was so much diesel in the oil so i couldnt read the OiL LEVEL. the oil was liquid and only stuck on the side of the dip stick
WOW!
Fckg diesel… happen now to my L200 Mitsubishi. I’m waiting now if warranty will cover it. Not even 3 years old Vechicle 🥵🤦♂️
Thanks for watching, good luck getting that sorted! Hopefully it all goes smoothly...