I've never worked on a film/show so I don't know the dynamics and decision making involved regarding maintaining some degree of logic regarding military tactics, but I recently learned how Ridley Scott in Gladiator II wanted armored Rhinos and sharks in the water at the Colosseum because he thought it would be cool - despite the fact at how dumb it is. I guess it's as simple as that? Perhaps the director, writer or producers wanted this idiotic battle set up for dramatic effect. I laughed at quite a few moments but one of the dumbest was how Elrond and the elves were hugging themselves along the berm in front of that wall nipple chain siege machine like it was some Saving Private Ryan storming Omaha beach. There's fighting going all around you guys, it's not like you're on the front line before the enemy. Then after the siege machine explodes, he gives the signal to charge? There were already elves fighting in front of you, what the hell were you waiting for? Also comical how Rian (the Asian elf) suddenly gets pelted with six arrows. Were the orcs racist? Why, among all the elves, was she suddenly singled out?
@@jjandorliadul Yeah, definitely they're going for "This is gonna look cool". They wasted the troll, all so that Arondir could do the "Legolas and the mumak" scene from the movies. Catapults (I don't think they're even mangonels/trebuchets) are pounding the walls but can't break through, yet they can hit the mountain from miles away and knock enough rubble down to dam the river. None of the elves on the walls are shooting down at the Orcs with The Ravager or shooting fire arrows at it or just throwing some of the city rubble down on their heads. Thirty Elves stand outside the walls to face the Orc army at the end. Maybe Gil-galad sent the rest home to Lindon to check did he leave the stove on? After all, the Dwarves need their *entire army* to prevent King Durin from single-handedly mining through the mountain to release the Balrog (maybe), so they need four hundred Elves to check are the lights off and the doors locked.
This series is a missed opportunity. Sauron was supposed to be a pseudo Promethean figure generating religious engineering in Harad and Rhûn with the metallurgical revolution he made in the east and south. He could be like Mephistopheles from Goethe's Faust or Azazel from the book of Enoch. Galadriel was supposed to be a sage and a political opponent of Annatar's reformist ideas. She used arguments and debates to fight Sauron in the Unfinished Tales version. She was such a fierce enemy that Annatar instigate Celebrimbor and the Jewelers to stage a coup d'etat on Galadriel and Celeborn. Númenor is a moral and theological story about life vs death vs immortality vs human nature. Not about elven workers taking Númenóreans jobs.
This was the best episode for me because so much of it was unintentionally comedic gold. Something about Mirdania flying off the wall broke me. Celebrimbor getting yeeted TWICE?! Elrond's kung fu horse?
Oh, I think they had at least fifty for this one! 😁 I did wonder why the Orcs were just standing there while the Elves charged them, instead of doing anything to set up a defensive line or get out of the way. Little did I know they had a CUNNING PLAN: Galadriel in a cage, plus Adar knew Elven horses came with brakes so they'd stop short in time.
@@neildaly2635the Hobbit movies followed the Hobbit story. They added a lot of extra stuff that hurt the movie and Peter Jackson indulged is worst traits.
Have you read Appendix III Durin’s Folk? They had the rights to it and totally distorted it, no Dwarf Orc War, no Dain killing Azog, no mention of Durin’s Bane, Thorin not aging at all Thrain hardly there. Agree that they added a bunch of crap.
On FB on the RoP page, I said, "I am praying Adar does not put on Nenya." One responder said, "Adar, puts on the ring and he is healed, and voila' it's Celeborn!" Can you imagine if the show did that? I would not be surprised.
Thinking about it from a D&D perspective. Morgoth could not create life, he could only distort and warp it. Morgoth captures a random elf, this would, of course, have to be say one of the first or second generation elves, and polymorphs him (Celeborn) into Adar, his mind becomes that of a Uruk because that is what he now believes he is. Putting on the Ring dispells the magic or removes the curse. I really hope this is not the case, I'm just having a bit of fun with it.
@@thehobbyguy7089, l said exactly that: Adar is actually Celeborn, who has been captured by Morgoth and Sauron and was tortured until he forgot his own name. As Adar he tried to adopt a bunch of orks in order to make their lives less miserable. But the serene and calming influence of Galadriel will heal him, and the two of them ride into the sunset 😊
@@thehobbyguy7089 Its so stupid, but honestly, this is probably the best way to bring Celeborn back in this show. It could also explain why Adar is still around. Plus, they get to have their stupid "I CAN FIX HIM!" moment, just with the wrong character. Also, Adar is what his daughter, Celebrian, called him when she was a little girl. When he got corrupted, he vaguely remembered wanting to go back to his child, so he "adopted" the orcs as his new "children". Celebrian... is probably in Lorien I guess. (Even if this stupid idea about Adar being Celeborn isn't true, I do think they'll probably just have Celebrian be off in Lorien and she just shows up one day without explaining why nobody mentioned her.)
@@jrconway3 That leaves us with Galadriel and why the f**k hasnt she said anything for 2 seasons, NOT A SINGLE WORD about having a husband. They got into this corner now either Adar shakes hands with Sauron and goes "all according to plan", or even worse he puts the ring and becomes Galadriel's husband who she never ever spoke of EVER. Just dumb all around.
It's the worst episode. Where all the stupidity and contrivance gets to its peak,and also it has that kiss between Galadriel and Elrond. An absolute abomination.
Not only did they create the rings in the wrong order, they forgot that not one ring was created specifically for men or dwarves. Sauron wanted the rings to control elves! Plan B was give them to dwarves and men.
That's what's ironic about it. They could have done the stupid "maybe the rings are evil, maybe they aren't" with the 9 rings first, then go into the 7, then finally, the final 3 are Celebrimbor's last resort. Those are the ones he makes without Sauron's help. He makes them as a counter to the ones Sauron was directly involved in. Well, not in the lore, but it would be the perfect setting here. He finishes the last few rings here after he boots Sauron out of Eregion and while leading the defense of the city.
@@jrconway3 “Sauron himself departed from Eregion about the year 1500, AFTER the Mírdain had BEGUN the making of the Rings of Power. Now Celebrimbor WAS NOT corrupted in heart or faith, but had accepted Sauron as what he posed to be; and when at length he discovered the existence of the One Ring he revolted against Sauron, and went to Lórinand to take council once more with Galadriel.” Unfinished Tales, History of Galadriel and Celeborn.). He could not have made the 3 to “counter” the 16, as he would not have believed/known that the 16 were corrupted by Sauron until after the One was made. But once the One was made, all 19 were suspect, even the 3 unsullied “elven” rings, because even though the 3 were made without Sauron’s direct help, they were made with his knowledge.
"This show is just so..." The word you are looking for is stupid. It might be easier to like this show if the showrunners did not fist kick us in the balls then deny kicking us in the balls while simultaneously claiming that kicks in the balls are what makes Tolkien great. They are hacks, and their show is utter refuse.
Did you just black out the entire "battle" - Trebuchets do not collapse mountains - Rivers don't just "stop" flowing when dammed, they flow around the blockage - River beds take months/years to dry out enough to support men, horses and machines - Wooden siege machines would get burning oil dropped on them pronto. - Wooden siege machines do not explode into a million pieces when hit with one puny flaming arrow - Cavalry do not charge into mud, nor into woods These writers have the critical thinking skills of a slow five year old, with ADHD, locked in a candy factory.
Rivers can be damned by natural causes, but it needs to be a tight seal. Odds are pretty good than knocking a few rocks from a cliffside won't create a tight seal. And even then, its so short of a "dam" that it would quickly overflow.
1. I still don't understand the reason for the existence of this invented Adar character. 2. Where is Celeborn ? I'm curious to see how those simpletons "writters" will deal with him vs his wife who flirted with Sauron and kissed her future son-in-law.
Well, see, Celeborn went off to the wars, but Galadriel laughed at him in his armour before he left, so clearly he decided he's never coming back home to *that* again. He's probably on the other side of the island of Númenor along with Anarion, Cirdan's beard (it escaped after he shaved it off), and my sanity
It's very unfortunate regarding all the widowed Orc wives ... the amount of societal administration/support structure that Sauron will have to set-up in Season 3 is going to be intense.
This is all part of his Great Plan for the Eternal Peace and Paradise post-war. Every widow and orphan and war veteran Orc will have a pension and social housing. Just need to fill out these six hundred forms to get it (he's both creating and expanding the first Orcish civil service to deal with the paperwork).
1) They had the space problems again with expecting the dwarves to show up the following morning. 2) The music for the kiss contributed to the sense that it was meant to be romantic. 3) They hadn't developed Eregion enough for its fall to be gutwrenching. A little more Mirdania might have stressed the nature of the betrayal. 4) They teased the dwarves in battle and then had Durin go nuts off screen. The dwarves collectively giving into greed over time might be better than Durin going nuts and having superpowers. If the dwarves are capable of realizing their leaders are insane, then are they cowered into submission? 5) Sauron misleads Mirdania. There's no indication that she's given him the level of power over her that Celebrimbor or the guards give Sauron. However, it might be more compelling if the guards have been corrupted more conventionally. As is, he owns them despite their intentions to arrest him (that would indicate that they aren't actually evil). The wraiths being slaves might be more of a process. So I can accept the wraiths being slaves. But being able to turn elves seems a problem in terms of 1) theology and 2) why Sauron was able to be taken out. An all powerful sorcerer able to anticipate EVERYTHING and with powers coming out the wazoo seems incongruous with the dude making a pathetic attempt to convince the orcs to stay with him ("yes, you're all going to die, but..."). As is, he can do whatever whenever at will. Seems like that might be a problem. 6) are orcs iffy about sunlight? 7) Do the elves not have defensive measures? The point of a fortification is to make your opponents fight you on your terms. Again, a little more detail would make things seem less artificial. 8) Sauron having a master plan seems incongruous with the battle being unpredictable and outcomes determined by individual bravery or 1 in 1000 pieces of luck or skill. If there are dozens of potential outcomes, he would need dozens of plans. As is, it seems like everything could go to hell if a rock fell on Celebrimbor during the siege and he doesn't seem to know how long the 9 rings will take.
As if we need further evidence, but the unnecessary, incestuous kiss between Elrond and Galadriel shows how spiteful and ignorant these crass show runners and writers truly are. Though they probably see it differently, and are stoked that they now have their “next GoT show”. Ugh, they suck. And that kiss is disgusting, sorry.
Turn your brain back on Erik. As much as it hurts, the fact that you have to turn aside, shows me how stupid this show is......sure it hurts.....but we need a cognitive review. ...thx
If I was told Elrond and Galadriel would make out before the show came out, I wouldn't believe you. Easily the stupidest moment in the entire series. If I had any inclination to give the writers the benefit of the doubt and think they actually believed they were doing justice to the material, then it would be burned in this episode.
I think the label "marginally least worst episode" would be more fitting than "best episode," and even then, it would be over-generous. But you've "shown your quality," (Get it?! That's what Sauron said! Did you catch it?! You know, because that's what Sam told Faramir. Remember?!) so I can forgive you, unlike the writers of this excuse for a show.
I cannot switch my brain off anymore. Everytime I try the seal a scene from Peter Jackson, starwars, the empire fights back. And this time the I suddenly saw a black cat, glitch in the matrix. There is allready enough pitchforks and lynchmob material allready. It is not Tolkien and even trying to see this as fanfiction, the story telling is still Acolyte level. Its switch off your brain, consume and shut up and take your soma. Brave new world..
Erik! You don't mind that Elrond is being a CHEATING CAD? Going around kissing Galadriel after his tender re-union with Durin? Is fidelity a joke to you? 🤣 Gonna be hella awkward when he marries Celebrian and Galadriel is his mother-in-law (never mind that she's technically STILL MARRIED at the time, since she doesn't know for sure Celeborn is dead): "Yeah, I had a massive crush on your mom, but then your dad came back out of the blue, so you're my second-best choice. Wanna get married?"
Even as a ruse, the kiss was just a really bad decision. A hug or a double hand clasp would have worked just as well or better. Under the circumstances and atmosphere, there is no reason for Adar to notice Elrond's pin was missing after a hug, but be so distracted by a kiss that he didn't notice it missing after. Frankly, the only reason for Adar to allow a physical demonstration of affectionate farewell at all, rather than keeping it to verbal only, is if Adar *expects* Elrond to pass Galadriel something, but is certain that it can't stop his plans. There is no reason for Adar to trust anything Elrond says or does. Meaning there is no real reason for Elrond to kiss Galadriel here apart from fan service. Thus the shipping outrage. I would do Payne and McKay the kindness of believing this was just an incredibly poorly thought out production decision (just like Arondir's breastplate), but Payne and McKay were not the major production decision makers for Season 2, as they were busy being on strike. Pretty much ALL the ladies involved in decision making at Amazon Studios...yes, I 100% believe they could have gone with a kiss just for fan service. As far as I'm concerned, whether in context of the show or in lore context of Elrond being Galadriel's future son-in-law, the kiss doesn't get better upon further review. Like Arondir's breastplate, it was a travesty and a (possibly unintended) severe mockery of something that could have been beautiful with just a little more careful thought.
I admit wholeheartedly that I am a Silmarillion thumping Tolkien fanatic. I can endure about 1/2 of the first Hobbit movie and the other two are unbearable. I know it is not a popular opinion but I still have some issues with the Return of the King movie. That said, I could not agree with you more, I was prepared for a lot of plot changes and the diversity angle doesn’t bother me either, if only it was good, but it is an insult to dog poop to compare it to that. I suffered through the first season (happily I have forgotten a lot of it). But when I saw the pixieish looking Sauron get whacked by orcs and turn into some possum eating blob, I passed the point of no return, I tore out my beard, did not speak for 7 days. This cannot be BORNE! Thanks for your insightful reviews I’d much rather listen to them that watch that runbbish.
For sure the Peter Jackson movies arent perfect with the Hobbit being the worst. However I do not think he went in to making them with the BAD intentions that Amazon has . Worst show ever.
Oh man, I complained my little heart out about the Hobbit movies. Then I saw what the first season of this did (Galadriel is going to swim home across the width of the Atlantic, no biggie; Sauron just wants to be good and do some smithing and marry Galadriel and settle down to be emperor of Middle-earth, can't a man - I mean demi-urgic being - have dreams and hopes?) and then we got the opener of season two (third-rate politician Sauron gets Ides of Marched by the Orcs and turns into black ooze floomp-monster) and I'm banging my head against the desk going "And I complained about Kili and Tauriel? stretching the material out into three movies? Radagast as comic relief? What kind of fool was I????"
@@dburgd99to put it into perspective: RoP S1 has a longer runtime than the PJ trilogy and S2 also. So I can forgive the oath breaker short cut in RotK. I can’t forgive rushing through the RoP main plots and giving us boring Adar, Southland, Haarfoots stories.
Just because the episode lacked some of the worst parts of the show doesn't mean it's any more watchable. Those elvish suits of armor were cartoonish and what the hell was gilgadaddy doing there? His killing blow on the troll was one of the worst edited shots of the whole series. I can't even mention the kiss. I laughed out loud multiple times but not in a good way.
Oof yeah I noticed the editing on that scene in particular! At first I thought it was because they were trying to avoid gore and stay PG, but they had the scene with the orc slitting the horse’s throat which was pretty graphic, so I have no idea.
Oh, yeah. THE KISS. Stupidest damn 'distraction' yet, and not even good, because you can *see* in the scene that an Orc is looking *directly* at their hands as Elrond makes the handover 🤣 Annatar does tell the truth: Mirdania got the reward she deserved (poor gullible girl). I did like Elrond's final scenes as he's there in shock/despair, but once again - why is this show making me support the Orcs? As Adar strides through the battlefield kicking Elven ass LIKE A BOSS, I was cheering him on. Even if they CGId his face in the end (why? that was so weird, is it because for some reason Sam Hazeldene was out that day, and instead of doing re-shoots they decided "Nah, we'll CGI his face onto the stunt guy, it'll be great"?) Charlie Hopkinson does deepfake faces better, and that's a bloke working out of his flat helped by his sister and a mate!
They wanted their Game of Thrones. They got it at last but all of that was season 8 of Game of Thrones... Jesus. One would have thought if a creator doesn't feel confident about how to write a battle scene, they'd get consultants on how to do it but no; they're too damn arrogant and proud to ask for professional help on the topic. What amateurish writers...
What's going on with Adar's face makeup? Did they poorly CGI it on his face? It keeps changing and sometimes looks really atrocious (for instance 7:20 in this video)
Yeah, I couldn't believe it either. I thought maybe they wanted to make him look more Orcish? Or something? Then I thought maybe the actor wasn't available to do that shot on the day, or there was some problem with it, but instead of re-shooting they just decided "nah, we'll fix it with CGI later". *Maybe* they're testing out "if we have to recast X or we want to make Y look more like the movie version" - they could be trying something like "yes, the Stranger is Gandalf! and in the last episode of the last season we'll make him look like Ian McKellen as much as we can get away with", though that would be dumb. But this show is dumb, so never say never!
this show sucked so hard that viewers ears popped... total travesty - gross, woke, weak, wrong, and staggeringly dumb!!! Glad to see ratings continuing to plummet insuring that even Joff Bozos will not pay to renew next season.
The fact you had to turn off your brain to plough through this absolute slop… I can’t believe this was written, signed off on, and aired. It felt an like improvisational comedy skit. I feel like I’m going mad that this is happening. Is this really where we’re at with entertainment?
The dialogue you mentioned at the beginning from Celebrimbor is a repurposed dialogue from The Hobbit movie of Gandalf saying the same to Galadriel. The series can't have that sorry. But you really need to downgrade your expectations to far beyond zero to like this episode. It was the worst out of 7 so far . Kinda surprised with you TODAY💀
I think Sam Hazeldine finally got some good opportunities to show his acting chops and has begun to win me over, even though I was initially disappointed that Joseph Mawle left. I'm now rooting for the Balrog to destroy everything and put us out of our misery.
I have to agree this was probably the best episode so far. Mainly because they had only two plotlines going on, which were related: Eregion and Khazad-dum. If they had been doing this kind of thing all along, instead of stuffing each episode full of as much jumping around as possible, it would have been way better. Charles Edwards finally got to do something good at last; good actor but bad characterisation, and it's not his fault. Show decided Celebrimbor would be a doddering old fool, and there's not much you can do with that handed to you. That's the good parts out of the way, now the bad. The big battle wasn't as good as it could have been. The siege tactics didn't make a lick of sense, and the catapults can take down a mountainside miles away to dam the river, but can't knock down the walls they've been battering for days? (or hours, given the way they compress here). The troll, after the big build-up, didn't do anything. And today I learned that Elf horses come with brakes, so that they can all stop at once in a neat line instead of having the ranks behind crashing into the ones in front when they screech to a halt 😁
I ’ve seen people saying "well I know quite well Tolkien’s books and I can say ROP is mostly faithful to the source material" and it seems they weren’t even paid for such a statement. Human brain is an amazing thing.
The Old Man is also good. I got really bored towards the last 20 min or so. The battle was boring to sometimes cringe. I also was only interested in the Annatar/Celebrimbor story. Celebrimbor was the only character I could relate to. And even that story part could have been done better. The dumb elves do not help. The way they build up Sauron did also not help. I agree with you, would have been better if they would have went with Annatar/Saurons scheming than this shite.
Rían in the Silmarillion, was the wife of Huor and mother of Tuor. I can't believe that ROP used her name for a minor elf character. What an insult to Tolkien!
This was the worst episode of a TV show I've ever seen, and I've seen the Bells. Celebrimbor somehow not figuring out he is being tricked when he walks out in the middle of the night and it's broad daylight, but then he DOES figure it out when he sees a mouse repeats an action, is a clear sign of a writer trying to be smart but failing.
I had to turn my brain off so much that I fell asleep mid battle 😂 what an abomination! So cheap, so contrived. Absolute nonsense. Bless you for trying to pull out a few positives.
Now now, a channel that talks about good and bad points, and make some good reason mentally without throwing sh*t around or loving it acritically? Subscribed.
I’m not watching this show but seeing reviews this episode might be the dumbest episode ever. They can knock down a mountain from miles away but cannot knock over some walls. Turning off your brain is the only way to watch this show.
@9:31 There are so many people who have Googled the family tree of Galadriel because of this show who haven’t read the books, and I’ve seen their reactions online. They were all shocked. I still think the kiss was written in for a reason. There are so many problems with second age Galadriel in the text. She’s tempted to marry Celebrimbor in front of her husband, even continuing to hang out with Brimby after refusing him. 🙄 She takes and loses power she craves. Everyone falls in love with her the second they meet her (even in LoTR). This is a trope of Venus. The first person who sees Aphrodite come out of the ocean is the herald of Zeus, Hermes. I think RoP’s kiss is an exploration of a different kind of love, and asking us to question what love means. Is love flirting with a girl and throwing her off a wall? Is love avenging your dead horse? Is it grabbing a chick’s hair when she’s shackled and under your power? The scene was also making us the orcs. We turned away or zoomed in on the kiss. Now, we are asked to question either how the orcs are like us or how we are like orcs. Anyway, RoP’s Elrond is an established lore master/geek, and he knows the detrimental effects Finwe remarrying had on Feanor, and that couples can reunite in Valinor. He has also stated how he met Galadriel when he was but a child, acknowledging that he has respect for Galadriel. I truly find nothing wrong on his part. Though Galadriel has always been suspicious to me, even outside of this show, I am relying on that look of, “You bastard,” afterward. 😅😂
"I still think the kiss was written in for a reason." It certainly was: To trash the lore and bring in some more viewers who like soap opera (they hope).
I think the Annatar-Celebrimbor sequence works well because 1) it is a key part of the actual Tolkien story (even if it isn't done exactly as it is in the text), 2) Charlie Vickers portrays his character quite well, to be honest, and 3) there is a compelling psychological drama between the characters and real consequences of the characters actions. I can't think of any other storylines in the show with those elements... Elrond and Durin probably have the next best chemistry, but there still doesn't seem to be anything of bigger consequence going on between them (maybe this will come after this episode). Why can't this show have more than one intriguing storyline?
Yes - it was the first episode where Sauron actually felt scary/horrifying to me. Taking the creative process - an act of joy, exploration, and creation - and warping it so sadistically was very effective imho. But now that that storyline is wrapping up, I’m not sure where else the show can go to recapture that magic. So far none of the other storylines or performances have been half as good as Sauron/Celebrimbor.
I was forgetting what had to be my most favouritest bit of this episode. Elrond and Vorohil discussing their TOP SECRET HUSH-HUSH NOBODY SAY ANYTHING battle plans out loud, in the middle of the enemy camp, surrounded by Orcs. Good job nobody there speaks Sindarin, even though half the conversation was helpfully in English! Nobody at all! Not even, say, *one* guy we know for *sure* speaks Sindarin! Boy that would have been awkward if the TOP SECRET THIS WILL SAVE OUR ASSES information had leaked out to the enemies! (I was sitting there going 'shut your dumb whore mouth, Peredhil, look around you, you idiot, at all the enemy soldiers listening in' during all of this. He certainly did *not* inherit any of Melian's wisdom for sure!)
Just on the battle... why does Elrond have about a thousand cavalry when he meets Adar, then there's only a couple of dozen elves at the walls of the city running defence? Lost your army, hmm? Full diversity marks for making the Asian elf pay for her outrageous skill and competence by falling under a rain of arrows. Nice. Thanks for the tip about Slow Horses!
I really hated the Darkness/Light speech. Another stolen member berry. This one was from Sam in PJs Fellowship of The Rings. The Rings of Puke writers can't seem to pen their own half decent speeches, so they continually steal someone else's better work and hope we won't notice.
After claiming Episode 7 has few callbacks/"member-berries," which I thoroughly disagree with, the whole ridiculousness with the siege engine - it seems to me - was merely another callback to Jackson's portrayal of Helm's Deep. Instead of destroying the wall with explosives where it was weakest (culvert), they used another piece of engineering (weird reversed ballista type thing) where the wall was weakest (random spot declared by Celebrimbor). Also, that kiss was just pathetic . . . so contrived. Deliberately provocative. If you must show some display of affection, even if as a ruse, he could have easily kissed her forehead or something.
Elrond sharing a romantic kiss with his mother in law. Yay. The Tolkien estate would be happy because this series is probably driving a resurgence in book sales. Does Peter Jackson profit from undoubted new sales of the movie dvds
Grading on a curve is really all we can do-look for the good (the cast, the set design, the score, the practical effects) within the overwhelmingly bad (the writing). At this point I'm watching the series for the heck of it, not because I'm expecting things to get better. A missed opportunity for sure.
I remember commenting on one of your Night Country videos that that show was surprisingly worse than Rings of Power. It seems the folks over at Amazon saw that comment and took it as a slight - and a challenge to outdo themselves and HBO.
Any single action scene of Legolas in lor is much greater than any battle scene in rop How many orcs,elves were there ? Was there no defending army for eregion the second most important province in middle Earth for elves
Re. novelty: they said in interview - want to change things to have surprises; proly meant it more deeply than anyone'd want; maybe thinking they're not pro if sticking to story as is
what really bugs me about the kiss, was the swell of music as if some great revelation just happened. I understood why he kissed her in that moment(still hated it) but the music made me feel rage!!!
That was the least of my objections. The shot showing the gigantic rock *just* held in balance by the small round rock that can be knocked out of the way by the catapult shot with precision aim from miles away, so the big rock falls and starts the avalanche of material to dam the river? I didn't need to turn my brain off for that, it decided it wasn't going to stick around and be insulted for the rest of the episode 😄
@@namenloss730 My brain is not angry with me, it's just disappointed, it expected that I would know better 😁 I admit, I can't wait for the final episode as they shovel in the six different plot lines to tie them up or rather, give us CLIFF HANGERS to make us watch the third season.
I have found a strange feeling of fun watching this show. I just like Adar. Every one else is so dumb compared. They really should not kill him off. I am not alone in this :D You cant stand what the others are doing :) This is such a strange show.
Team "Adar for High King of All Middle-earth" here. Even Ar-Pharazon has to come second to the Lord-Father, he can stay on Númenor and build all the aqueducts he wants 😀
This show is very doodoo. But sometimes you people are looking to criticize. It was quite clear that the kiss was meant as a distraction. Could’ve gone another way but they set this up well.
It is not clear at all that the kiss was meant as a distraction. He passes the pin to her in full view of the watching orc. What is clear is that this was just trashy writing at a soap opera level. Throw in some rage bait in an attempt to get viewers due to the shock value. Hence the camera lingering on them as they kiss, and the romantic music overlay.
Elves can remarry. The Valar allowed Finwe to remarry and his second wife is Indis of the Vanyar, the Fair-Elves of Ingwë. She bears him two sons: Fingolfin and Finarfin, and two daughters: Findis and Írimë. This is part of Tolkien lore, that Finwe remarried. So Elves can remarry and love another Elf in Tolkien's world.
Tolkien's general rule is that Noldor cannot remarry - they are faithful to their partner for eternity, even if the partner dies. There are only two exceptions mentioned (one of them being Finwe), and both ended badly. Not that this should matter - Galadriel in the show says that her husband has disappeared. He is not dead, so even what you have written above is irrelevant to excuse the kiss, which just smashes canon.
@@alexg3434 In ROP Galadriel told Theo that her husband Celeborn went to war in the war against Morgoth and never came back. So Galadriel is saying that Celeborn is presumed dead. Celeborn has been missing for centuries when Galadriel has been hunting Sauron in those centuries. Do you expect Galadriel to be single for thousands and thousands of years? Elves are supposed to be near immortal so will live thousands and thousands of years. Do you truly expect Galadriel to live without affection for the rest of her days? Isn't that a bit unrealistic and downright cruel?
the best answer to "they couldn't do it the right way because they didn't have the rights" is "Why would they try to tell a story they don't have the rights for?"
In Season 1, Galadriel told Theo that her husband Celeborn went to war and never came back. So Celeborn is presumed dead by Galadriel. So Galadriel has no husband and there is no daughter Celebrian. So Galadriel is free to love or express love to whomever she wants especially to a such a beloved friend Elrond who is going to battle Adar and his Orcs, who outnumber the Elven forces 10 to 1. So the kiss is also a deeply felt farewell between 2 friends who love each other lots and know that they are in very real danger of dying. And know that this might be their last embrace.
Noldor marry for eternity, even if she knew her husband was dead, which she doesn't. Just another way this show trashes Tolkien's literature. No, Adar and his orcs don't outnumber the elves "10 to 1": There are about 20 elvish extras in this show and about 30 orcs. God knows what they spent the money on. And no, its not a "farewell kiss": its meant to be romantic, as this show descends into soap-opera level schlock.
@@alexg3434 Elves can remarry. The Valar allowed Finwe to remarry and his second wife is Indis of the Vanyar, the Fair-Elves of Ingwë. She bears him two sons: Fingolfin and Finarfin, and two daughters: Findis and Írimë. This is part of Tolkien lore, that Finwe remarried. So Elves can remarry and love another Elf in Tolkien's world.
@@lydiaparam2566 There are only two exceptions, Finwe and one other, and both end badly. Nevertheless, Tolkien said that the norm for the Noldor is to marry for eternity. Not ignore their husband who is merely missing...
@@alexg3434 Just because the 2 remarriages end badly is due to the individuals in the marriage, not due to the practice of remarrying another Elf itself.
@@lydiaparam2566 Noi, its more than that. Tolkien says that Noldor normally marry for eternity. They stay faithful to their partner even after death. Not that this is even relevant since Galadriel in the show says her husband is not dead. So this attempt to excuse the trash writing in the show also fails.
@@evgeniytsarkov5679 they kiss because this show is made for the fan fiction shippers and because for some reason the showrunners like to antagonize the fans. There are thousands of ways they can resolve the plot and not have them kiss. They just love to ship(and destroy)characters
If they die, their souls will meet again in the Halls of Mandos and recover a physical body some time later. Good elves do not have to worry about their fate after being slayed. Ooh, wait, we are dealing here with a nonsensical show made by Am4zon the Lore-butcher.
They finally reached the level of Game of Thrones
the siege of Winterfell is no longer the dumbest battle put to screen.....
I've never worked on a film/show so I don't know the dynamics and decision making involved regarding maintaining some degree of logic regarding military tactics, but I recently learned how Ridley Scott in Gladiator II wanted armored Rhinos and sharks in the water at the Colosseum because he thought it would be cool - despite the fact at how dumb it is. I guess it's as simple as that?
Perhaps the director, writer or producers wanted this idiotic battle set up for dramatic effect. I laughed at quite a few moments but one of the dumbest was how Elrond and the elves were hugging themselves along the berm in front of that wall nipple chain siege machine like it was some Saving Private Ryan storming Omaha beach. There's fighting going all around you guys, it's not like you're on the front line before the enemy. Then after the siege machine explodes, he gives the signal to charge? There were already elves fighting in front of you, what the hell were you waiting for? Also comical how Rian (the Asian elf) suddenly gets pelted with six arrows. Were the orcs racist? Why, among all the elves, was she suddenly singled out?
@@jjandorliadul Yeah, definitely they're going for "This is gonna look cool". They wasted the troll, all so that Arondir could do the "Legolas and the mumak" scene from the movies. Catapults (I don't think they're even mangonels/trebuchets) are pounding the walls but can't break through, yet they can hit the mountain from miles away and knock enough rubble down to dam the river. None of the elves on the walls are shooting down at the Orcs with The Ravager or shooting fire arrows at it or just throwing some of the city rubble down on their heads. Thirty Elves stand outside the walls to face the Orc army at the end. Maybe Gil-galad sent the rest home to Lindon to check did he leave the stove on? After all, the Dwarves need their *entire army* to prevent King Durin from single-handedly mining through the mountain to release the Balrog (maybe), so they need four hundred Elves to check are the lights off and the doors locked.
This series is a missed opportunity. Sauron was supposed to be a pseudo Promethean figure generating religious engineering in Harad and Rhûn with the metallurgical revolution he made in the east and south. He could be like Mephistopheles from Goethe's Faust or Azazel from the book of Enoch.
Galadriel was supposed to be a sage and a political opponent of Annatar's reformist ideas. She used arguments and debates to fight Sauron in the Unfinished Tales version. She was such a fierce enemy that Annatar instigate Celebrimbor and the Jewelers to stage a coup d'etat on Galadriel and Celeborn.
Númenor is a moral and theological story about life vs death vs immortality vs human nature. Not about elven workers taking Númenóreans jobs.
@@rafaelgustavo7786 so many missed opportunities skilled writers and showrunners would have spun into gold.
This was the best episode for me because so much of it was unintentionally comedic gold. Something about Mirdania flying off the wall broke me. Celebrimbor getting yeeted TWICE?! Elrond's kung fu horse?
Hahahha
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I do find that if you watch the series and think about it as a comedy, it's much better.
I salute you for trying to find joy in this abominable train wreck!
@@3LITA It certainly isn't easy!
The greatest battle of 20 total people ever filmed.
Oh, I think they had at least fifty for this one! 😁 I did wonder why the Orcs were just standing there while the Elves charged them, instead of doing anything to set up a defensive line or get out of the way. Little did I know they had a CUNNING PLAN: Galadriel in a cage, plus Adar knew Elven horses came with brakes so they'd stop short in time.
The question is, WHY are they spending 150 million on the rights if they are barely using them?
Branding.
It worked for the Hobbit movies.
@@neildaly2635the Hobbit movies followed the Hobbit story. They added a lot of extra stuff that hurt the movie and Peter Jackson indulged is worst traits.
Have you read Appendix III Durin’s Folk? They had the rights to it and totally distorted it, no Dwarf Orc War, no Dain killing Azog, no mention of Durin’s Bane, Thorin not aging at all Thrain hardly there. Agree that they added a bunch of crap.
No, no 150 but 250 millions
On FB on the RoP page, I said, "I am praying Adar does not put on Nenya."
One responder said, "Adar, puts on the ring and he is healed, and voila' it's Celeborn!"
Can you imagine if the show did that? I would not be surprised.
@@thehobbyguy7089 oh jfc
Thinking about it from a D&D perspective. Morgoth could not create life, he could only distort and warp it.
Morgoth captures a random elf, this would, of course, have to be say one of the first or second generation elves, and polymorphs him (Celeborn) into Adar, his mind becomes that of a Uruk because that is what he now believes he is. Putting on the Ring dispells the magic or removes the curse.
I really hope this is not the case, I'm just having a bit of fun with it.
@@thehobbyguy7089, l said exactly that: Adar is actually Celeborn, who has been captured by Morgoth and Sauron and was tortured until he forgot his own name. As Adar he tried to adopt a bunch of orks in order to make their lives less miserable. But the serene and calming influence of Galadriel will heal him, and the two of them ride into the sunset 😊
@@thehobbyguy7089 Its so stupid, but honestly, this is probably the best way to bring Celeborn back in this show. It could also explain why Adar is still around. Plus, they get to have their stupid "I CAN FIX HIM!" moment, just with the wrong character.
Also, Adar is what his daughter, Celebrian, called him when she was a little girl. When he got corrupted, he vaguely remembered wanting to go back to his child, so he "adopted" the orcs as his new "children". Celebrian... is probably in Lorien I guess.
(Even if this stupid idea about Adar being Celeborn isn't true, I do think they'll probably just have Celebrian be off in Lorien and she just shows up one day without explaining why nobody mentioned her.)
@@jrconway3 That leaves us with Galadriel and why the f**k hasnt she said anything for 2 seasons, NOT A SINGLE WORD about having a husband. They got into this corner now either Adar shakes hands with Sauron and goes "all according to plan", or even worse he puts the ring and becomes Galadriel's husband who she never ever spoke of EVER. Just dumb all around.
Rings of Prime is pure trash
stop insulting trash people!!! this is much worse, this is mouth to mouth skittles barfing contest
It's the worst episode. Where all the stupidity and contrivance gets to its peak,and also it has that kiss between Galadriel and Elrond. An absolute abomination.
Doesn't Galadriel become Elrond's mother-in-law??
@@dirtyfunkymonkey she should already be
@@dirtyfunkymonkey she does. She should be already, according to the books.
@@dirtyfunkymonkeyyep
@@namenloss730not true. Elrond doesn’t marry celebrian until the third age. He should be in love with her by now though, you may be confusing that.
Not only did they create the rings in the wrong order, they forgot that not one ring was created specifically for men or dwarves. Sauron wanted the rings to control elves! Plan B was give them to dwarves and men.
That's what's ironic about it. They could have done the stupid "maybe the rings are evil, maybe they aren't" with the 9 rings first, then go into the 7, then finally, the final 3 are Celebrimbor's last resort. Those are the ones he makes without Sauron's help. He makes them as a counter to the ones Sauron was directly involved in.
Well, not in the lore, but it would be the perfect setting here. He finishes the last few rings here after he boots Sauron out of Eregion and while leading the defense of the city.
@@jrconway3 “Sauron himself departed from Eregion about the year 1500, AFTER the Mírdain had BEGUN the making of the Rings of Power. Now Celebrimbor WAS NOT corrupted in heart or faith, but had accepted Sauron as what he posed to be; and when at length he discovered the existence of the One Ring he revolted against Sauron, and went to Lórinand to take council once more with Galadriel.” Unfinished Tales, History of Galadriel and Celeborn.). He could not have made the 3 to “counter” the 16, as he would not have believed/known that the 16 were corrupted by Sauron until after the One was made. But once the One was made, all 19 were suspect, even the 3 unsullied “elven” rings, because even though the 3 were made without Sauron’s direct help, they were made with his knowledge.
To me this was the worst episode so far. I couldn’t even finish and don’t know if I will.
Spoiler............
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Annatar reveals there was no extra mythirl, it was his blood , that scene was cool and worthy of the great deceiver
"This show is just so..." The word you are looking for is stupid. It might be easier to like this show if the showrunners did not fist kick us in the balls then deny kicking us in the balls while simultaneously claiming that kicks in the balls are what makes Tolkien great. They are hacks, and their show is utter refuse.
Did you just black out the entire "battle"
- Trebuchets do not collapse mountains
- Rivers don't just "stop" flowing when dammed, they flow around the blockage
- River beds take months/years to dry out enough to support men, horses and machines
- Wooden siege machines would get burning oil dropped on them pronto.
- Wooden siege machines do not explode into a million pieces when hit with one puny flaming arrow
- Cavalry do not charge into mud, nor into woods
These writers have the critical thinking skills of a slow five year old, with ADHD, locked in a candy factory.
@@poneill65 I told you I turned my brain off
Rivers can be damned by natural causes, but it needs to be a tight seal. Odds are pretty good than knocking a few rocks from a cliffside won't create a tight seal. And even then, its so short of a "dam" that it would quickly overflow.
Water doesn't flow uphill either, but somehow that rule didn't apply to Mordor.
@@majkus one does not simply flow down into Mordor
Lol someone watched critical drinker here 😂
1. I still don't understand the reason for the existence of this invented Adar character.
2. Where is Celeborn ? I'm curious to see how those simpletons "writters" will deal with him vs his wife who flirted with Sauron and kissed her future son-in-law.
Well, see, Celeborn went off to the wars, but Galadriel laughed at him in his armour before he left, so clearly he decided he's never coming back home to *that* again. He's probably on the other side of the island of Númenor along with Anarion, Cirdan's beard (it escaped after he shaved it off), and my sanity
@@valentinafaina4032 how about Adar is missing Celeborn? Can you cope with it? 😂😂😂
It's very unfortunate regarding all the widowed Orc wives ... the amount of societal administration/support structure that Sauron will have to set-up in Season 3 is going to be intense.
We have this office in Australia called centrelink, I imagine it would be a lot like that
This is all part of his Great Plan for the Eternal Peace and Paradise post-war. Every widow and orphan and war veteran Orc will have a pension and social housing. Just need to fill out these six hundred forms to get it (he's both creating and expanding the first Orcish civil service to deal with the paperwork).
Season 3 will focus on the orc bureaucracy
1) They had the space problems again with expecting the dwarves to show up the following morning.
2) The music for the kiss contributed to the sense that it was meant to be romantic.
3) They hadn't developed Eregion enough for its fall to be gutwrenching. A little more Mirdania might have stressed the nature of the betrayal.
4) They teased the dwarves in battle and then had Durin go nuts off screen. The dwarves collectively giving into greed over time might be better than Durin going nuts and having superpowers. If the dwarves are capable of realizing their leaders are insane, then are they cowered into submission?
5) Sauron misleads Mirdania. There's no indication that she's given him the level of power over her that Celebrimbor or the guards give Sauron. However, it might be more compelling if the guards have been corrupted more conventionally. As is, he owns them despite their intentions to arrest him (that would indicate that they aren't actually evil). The wraiths being slaves might be more of a process. So I can accept the wraiths being slaves. But being able to turn elves seems a problem in terms of 1) theology and 2) why Sauron was able to be taken out. An all powerful sorcerer able to anticipate EVERYTHING and with powers coming out the wazoo seems incongruous with the dude making a pathetic attempt to convince the orcs to stay with him ("yes, you're all going to die, but..."). As is, he can do whatever whenever at will. Seems like that might be a problem.
6) are orcs iffy about sunlight?
7) Do the elves not have defensive measures? The point of a fortification is to make your opponents fight you on your terms. Again, a little more detail would make things seem less artificial.
8) Sauron having a master plan seems incongruous with the battle being unpredictable and outcomes determined by individual bravery or 1 in 1000 pieces of luck or skill. If there are dozens of potential outcomes, he would need dozens of plans. As is, it seems like everything could go to hell if a rock fell on Celebrimbor during the siege and he doesn't seem to know how long the 9 rings will take.
9) they had a geography problem, none of the establishing shots of eregion prior to this episode had that cliff next to the river
As if we need further evidence, but the unnecessary, incestuous kiss between Elrond and Galadriel shows how spiteful and ignorant these crass show runners and writers truly are. Though they probably see it differently, and are stoked that they now have their “next GoT show”. Ugh, they suck. And that kiss is disgusting, sorry.
Turn your brain back on Erik. As much as it hurts, the fact that you have to turn aside, shows me how stupid this show is......sure it hurts.....but we need a cognitive review. ...thx
If I was told Elrond and Galadriel would make out before the show came out, I wouldn't believe you. Easily the stupidest moment in the entire series. If I had any inclination to give the writers the benefit of the doubt and think they actually believed they were doing justice to the material, then it would be burned in this episode.
I've never read these other LOTR books but it makes me so mad we aren't getting a good adaptation of what could be such an amazing prequel...
I think the label "marginally least worst episode" would be more fitting than "best episode," and even then, it would be over-generous. But you've "shown your quality," (Get it?! That's what Sauron said! Did you catch it?! You know, because that's what Sam told Faramir. Remember?!) so I can forgive you, unlike the writers of this excuse for a show.
Hey now I'm in a callback!? SWEET
I can't tell any of the characters apart... Translation: I just don't give a flip.
Cringe of Powerrrrrr🎉❤
all the little extra spins and stuff the elves do before their stabs make me laugh so hard. it’s so goofy
The battle scenes reminded me of Game of Thrones season 8.
And not in a good way.
@@DarthDevorin is there a good way??
@@ErikKain no.
I cannot switch my brain off anymore. Everytime I try the seal a scene from Peter Jackson, starwars, the empire fights back. And this time the I suddenly saw a black cat, glitch in the matrix. There is allready enough pitchforks and lynchmob material allready. It is not Tolkien and even trying to see this as fanfiction, the story telling is still Acolyte level. Its switch off your brain, consume and shut up and take your soma. Brave new world..
It’s annoying because there are moments in the Annatar Celebrimbor scenes where you think .. “ oh this could have been good”
But alas no ..
I am convinced CW could have done a lot better on a fraction of the budget . I did enjoy the first episode of Penguin though.
Erik! You don't mind that Elrond is being a CHEATING CAD? Going around kissing Galadriel after his tender re-union with Durin? Is fidelity a joke to you? 🤣 Gonna be hella awkward when he marries Celebrian and Galadriel is his mother-in-law (never mind that she's technically STILL MARRIED at the time, since she doesn't know for sure Celeborn is dead): "Yeah, I had a massive crush on your mom, but then your dad came back out of the blue, so you're my second-best choice. Wanna get married?"
Even as a ruse, the kiss was just a really bad decision. A hug or a double hand clasp would have worked just as well or better. Under the circumstances and atmosphere, there is no reason for Adar to notice Elrond's pin was missing after a hug, but be so distracted by a kiss that he didn't notice it missing after. Frankly, the only reason for Adar to allow a physical demonstration of affectionate farewell at all, rather than keeping it to verbal only, is if Adar *expects* Elrond to pass Galadriel something, but is certain that it can't stop his plans. There is no reason for Adar to trust anything Elrond says or does. Meaning there is no real reason for Elrond to kiss Galadriel here apart from fan service. Thus the shipping outrage.
I would do Payne and McKay the kindness of believing this was just an incredibly poorly thought out production decision (just like Arondir's breastplate), but Payne and McKay were not the major production decision makers for Season 2, as they were busy being on strike. Pretty much ALL the ladies involved in decision making at Amazon Studios...yes, I 100% believe they could have gone with a kiss just for fan service. As far as I'm concerned, whether in context of the show or in lore context of Elrond being Galadriel's future son-in-law, the kiss doesn't get better upon further review. Like Arondir's breastplate, it was a travesty and a (possibly unintended) severe mockery of something that could have been beautiful with just a little more careful thought.
I admit wholeheartedly that I am a Silmarillion thumping Tolkien fanatic. I can endure about 1/2 of the first Hobbit movie and the other two are unbearable. I know it is not a popular opinion but I still have some issues with the Return of the King movie. That said, I could not agree with you more, I was prepared for a lot of plot changes and the diversity angle doesn’t bother me either, if only it was good, but it is an insult to dog poop to compare it to that. I suffered through the first season (happily I have forgotten a lot of it). But when I saw the pixieish looking Sauron get whacked by orcs and turn into some possum eating blob, I passed the point of no return, I tore out my beard, did not speak for 7 days. This cannot be BORNE! Thanks for your insightful reviews I’d much rather listen to them that watch that runbbish.
@@neildaly2635 appreciate that!
For sure the Peter Jackson movies arent perfect with the Hobbit being the worst. However I do not think he went in to making them with the BAD intentions that Amazon has . Worst show ever.
Oh man, I complained my little heart out about the Hobbit movies. Then I saw what the first season of this did (Galadriel is going to swim home across the width of the Atlantic, no biggie; Sauron just wants to be good and do some smithing and marry Galadriel and settle down to be emperor of Middle-earth, can't a man - I mean demi-urgic being - have dreams and hopes?) and then we got the opener of season two (third-rate politician Sauron gets Ides of Marched by the Orcs and turns into black ooze floomp-monster) and I'm banging my head against the desk going "And I complained about Kili and Tauriel? stretching the material out into three movies? Radagast as comic relief? What kind of fool was I????"
I feel you!
@@dburgd99to put it into perspective: RoP S1 has a longer runtime than the PJ trilogy and S2 also. So I can forgive the oath breaker short cut in RotK. I can’t forgive rushing through the RoP main plots and giving us boring Adar, Southland, Haarfoots stories.
"This show can't help but ruin even its best moments." -- Simple: Incompetent writers & producers.
Just because the episode lacked some of the worst parts of the show doesn't mean it's any more watchable. Those elvish suits of armor were cartoonish and what the hell was gilgadaddy doing there? His killing blow on the troll was one of the worst edited shots of the whole series. I can't even mention the kiss. I laughed out loud multiple times but not in a good way.
Oof yeah I noticed the editing on that scene in particular! At first I thought it was because they were trying to avoid gore and stay PG, but they had the scene with the orc slitting the horse’s throat which was pretty graphic, so I have no idea.
This show has gotta be painful to review.
Great song!!! These seem obviously AI. What are you using, Mr. Kain?
@@gregorycollins6561 thanks! I use Udio
Oh, yeah. THE KISS. Stupidest damn 'distraction' yet, and not even good, because you can *see* in the scene that an Orc is looking *directly* at their hands as Elrond makes the handover 🤣 Annatar does tell the truth: Mirdania got the reward she deserved (poor gullible girl). I did like Elrond's final scenes as he's there in shock/despair, but once again - why is this show making me support the Orcs? As Adar strides through the battlefield kicking Elven ass LIKE A BOSS, I was cheering him on. Even if they CGId his face in the end (why? that was so weird, is it because for some reason Sam Hazeldene was out that day, and instead of doing re-shoots they decided "Nah, we'll CGI his face onto the stunt guy, it'll be great"?) Charlie Hopkinson does deepfake faces better, and that's a bloke working out of his flat helped by his sister and a mate!
They wanted their Game of Thrones. They got it at last but all of that was season 8 of Game of Thrones...
Jesus. One would have thought if a creator doesn't feel confident about how to write a battle scene, they'd get consultants on how to do it but no; they're too damn arrogant and proud to ask for professional help on the topic.
What amateurish writers...
OK, I'll buy your ruse explanation. Just to be positive. But I am rereading the Unfinished Tales, to refreshen myself.
Fair!
What's going on with Adar's face makeup?
Did they poorly CGI it on his face? It keeps changing and sometimes looks really atrocious (for instance 7:20 in this video)
Yeah, I couldn't believe it either. I thought maybe they wanted to make him look more Orcish? Or something? Then I thought maybe the actor wasn't available to do that shot on the day, or there was some problem with it, but instead of re-shooting they just decided "nah, we'll fix it with CGI later". *Maybe* they're testing out "if we have to recast X or we want to make Y look more like the movie version" - they could be trying something like "yes, the Stranger is Gandalf! and in the last episode of the last season we'll make him look like Ian McKellen as much as we can get away with", though that would be dumb. But this show is dumb, so never say never!
we have to dumb ourselves down to watch the show it's sad and pathetic. 😒
I just finished the Silmarillion and really understand just how wrong this show is! I knew it was trash, but didn’t know just how trash!
this show sucked so hard that viewers ears popped... total travesty - gross, woke, weak, wrong, and staggeringly dumb!!! Glad to see ratings continuing to plummet insuring that even Joff Bozos will not pay to renew next season.
The fact you had to turn off your brain to plough through this absolute slop…
I can’t believe this was written, signed off on, and aired.
It felt an like improvisational comedy skit.
I feel like I’m going mad that this is happening.
Is this really where we’re at with entertainment?
This episode was written by the showrunners, no less. Hilarious. And frustrating. But it does track.
this is epic 😂 ❤ love the intro
The dialogue you mentioned at the beginning from Celebrimbor is a repurposed dialogue from The Hobbit movie of Gandalf saying the same to Galadriel. The series can't have that sorry. But you really need to downgrade your expectations to far beyond zero to like this episode. It was the worst out of 7 so far . Kinda surprised with you TODAY💀
I think Sam Hazeldine finally got some good opportunities to show his acting chops and has begun to win me over, even though I was initially disappointed that Joseph Mawle left. I'm now rooting for the Balrog to destroy everything and put us out of our misery.
I have to agree this was probably the best episode so far. Mainly because they had only two plotlines going on, which were related: Eregion and Khazad-dum. If they had been doing this kind of thing all along, instead of stuffing each episode full of as much jumping around as possible, it would have been way better. Charles Edwards finally got to do something good at last; good actor but bad characterisation, and it's not his fault. Show decided Celebrimbor would be a doddering old fool, and there's not much you can do with that handed to you. That's the good parts out of the way, now the bad. The big battle wasn't as good as it could have been. The siege tactics didn't make a lick of sense, and the catapults can take down a mountainside miles away to dam the river, but can't knock down the walls they've been battering for days? (or hours, given the way they compress here). The troll, after the big build-up, didn't do anything. And today I learned that Elf horses come with brakes, so that they can all stop at once in a neat line instead of having the ranks behind crashing into the ones in front when they screech to a halt 😁
I ’ve seen people saying "well I know quite well Tolkien’s books and I can say ROP is mostly faithful to the source material" and it seems they weren’t even paid for such a statement.
Human brain is an amazing thing.
The Old Man is also good.
I got really bored towards the last 20 min or so. The battle was boring to sometimes cringe. I also was only interested in the Annatar/Celebrimbor story. Celebrimbor was the only character I could relate to. And even that story part could have been done better. The dumb elves do not help. The way they build up Sauron did also not help.
I agree with you, would have been better if they would have went with Annatar/Saurons scheming than this shite.
Rían in the Silmarillion, was the wife of Huor and mother of Tuor. I can't believe that ROP used her name for a minor elf character. What an insult to Tolkien!
This was the worst episode of a TV show I've ever seen, and I've seen the Bells. Celebrimbor somehow not figuring out he is being tricked when he walks out in the middle of the night and it's broad daylight, but then he DOES figure it out when he sees a mouse repeats an action, is a clear sign of a writer trying to be smart but failing.
I had to turn my brain off so much that I fell asleep mid battle 😂 what an abomination! So cheap, so contrived. Absolute nonsense. Bless you for trying to pull out a few positives.
Now now, a channel that talks about good and bad points, and make some good reason mentally without throwing sh*t around or loving it acritically? Subscribed.
I felt like I was watching a cartoon during the battle, too many ridiculous actions, too much bad choreography...
I’m not watching this show but seeing reviews this episode might be the dumbest episode ever. They can knock down a mountain from miles away but cannot knock over some walls.
Turning off your brain is the only way to watch this show.
Entertainment on the next decade is going to be so sad. Utterly soulless cash grabs by billionaire companies who don’t know how to make TV.
Thanks 4 the video
This show is shockingly bad considering all the stories in the Appendices Amazon has the rights to (but refuses to utilize in any meaningful way).
@9:31 There are so many people who have Googled the family tree of Galadriel because of this show who haven’t read the books, and I’ve seen their reactions online. They were all shocked.
I still think the kiss was written in for a reason. There are so many problems with second age Galadriel in the text. She’s tempted to marry Celebrimbor in front of her husband, even continuing to hang out with Brimby after refusing him. 🙄 She takes and loses power she craves. Everyone falls in love with her the second they meet her (even in LoTR). This is a trope of Venus. The first person who sees Aphrodite come out of the ocean is the herald of Zeus, Hermes.
I think RoP’s kiss is an exploration of a different kind of love, and asking us to question what love means. Is love flirting with a girl and throwing her off a wall? Is love avenging your dead horse? Is it grabbing a chick’s hair when she’s shackled and under your power?
The scene was also making us the orcs. We turned away or zoomed in on the kiss. Now, we are asked to question either how the orcs are like us or how we are like orcs.
Anyway, RoP’s Elrond is an established lore master/geek, and he knows the detrimental effects Finwe remarrying had on Feanor, and that couples can reunite in Valinor. He has also stated how he met Galadriel when he was but a child, acknowledging that he has respect for Galadriel. I truly find nothing wrong on his part.
Though Galadriel has always been suspicious to me, even outside of this show, I am relying on that look of, “You bastard,” afterward. 😅😂
"I still think the kiss was written in for a reason." It certainly was: To trash the lore and bring in some more viewers who like soap opera (they hope).
Elrond kissing his mother in law...nah...for whatever reason just...nah
No single Director or Showrunner. Committee diarrhea.
Consider: Donald Trump is better than this show.
I think the Annatar-Celebrimbor sequence works well because 1) it is a key part of the actual Tolkien story (even if it isn't done exactly as it is in the text), 2) Charlie Vickers portrays his character quite well, to be honest, and 3) there is a compelling psychological drama between the characters and real consequences of the characters actions.
I can't think of any other storylines in the show with those elements... Elrond and Durin probably have the next best chemistry, but there still doesn't seem to be anything of bigger consequence going on between them (maybe this will come after this episode).
Why can't this show have more than one intriguing storyline?
Yes - it was the first episode where Sauron actually felt scary/horrifying to me. Taking the creative process - an act of joy, exploration, and creation - and warping it so sadistically was very effective imho. But now that that storyline is wrapping up, I’m not sure where else the show can go to recapture that magic. So far none of the other storylines or performances have been half as good as Sauron/Celebrimbor.
Tolkien MADE ME turn on my brain.
I can imagine the meme about tony stark in a cave but it's: peter jackson did it!, 25 years ago, without a BILLION dollars!
Erik, but how can you be even remotely okay with the kiss, ruse or not? It's despicable and should have never happened.
I was forgetting what had to be my most favouritest bit of this episode. Elrond and Vorohil discussing their TOP SECRET HUSH-HUSH NOBODY SAY ANYTHING battle plans out loud, in the middle of the enemy camp, surrounded by Orcs. Good job nobody there speaks Sindarin, even though half the conversation was helpfully in English! Nobody at all! Not even, say, *one* guy we know for *sure* speaks Sindarin! Boy that would have been awkward if the TOP SECRET THIS WILL SAVE OUR ASSES information had leaked out to the enemies! (I was sitting there going 'shut your dumb whore mouth, Peredhil, look around you, you idiot, at all the enemy soldiers listening in' during all of this. He certainly did *not* inherit any of Melian's wisdom for sure!)
Just on the battle... why does Elrond have about a thousand cavalry when he meets Adar, then there's only a couple of dozen elves at the walls of the city running defence? Lost your army, hmm? Full diversity marks for making the Asian elf pay for her outrageous skill and competence by falling under a rain of arrows. Nice.
Thanks for the tip about Slow Horses!
I really hated the Darkness/Light speech. Another stolen member berry. This one was from Sam in PJs Fellowship of The Rings. The Rings of Puke writers can't seem to pen their own half decent speeches, so they continually steal someone else's better work and hope we won't notice.
After claiming Episode 7 has few callbacks/"member-berries," which I thoroughly disagree with, the whole ridiculousness with the siege engine - it seems to me - was merely another callback to Jackson's portrayal of Helm's Deep. Instead of destroying the wall with explosives where it was weakest (culvert), they used another piece of engineering (weird reversed ballista type thing) where the wall was weakest (random spot declared by Celebrimbor).
Also, that kiss was just pathetic . . . so contrived. Deliberately provocative. If you must show some display of affection, even if as a ruse, he could have easily kissed her forehead or something.
Elrond sharing a romantic kiss with his mother in law. Yay. The Tolkien estate would be happy because this series is probably driving a resurgence in book sales. Does Peter Jackson profit from undoubted new sales of the movie dvds
Grading on a curve is really all we can do-look for the good (the cast, the set design, the score, the practical effects) within the overwhelmingly bad (the writing). At this point I'm watching the series for the heck of it, not because I'm expecting things to get better. A missed opportunity for sure.
I remember commenting on one of your Night Country videos that that show was surprisingly worse than Rings of Power. It seems the folks over at Amazon saw that comment and took it as a slight - and a challenge to outdo themselves and HBO.
Any single action scene of Legolas in lor is much greater than any battle scene in rop
How many orcs,elves were there ?
Was there no defending army for eregion the second most important province in middle Earth for elves
Re. novelty: they said in interview - want to change things to have surprises; proly meant it more deeply than anyone'd want; maybe thinking they're not pro if sticking to story as is
That troll was my favorite character in the show so far. Not even kidding. Go back and watch him again.
Why is there no commander for eregion s defence , it's funny to see there was no defense /attack machines created by epven smiths for their defense
Look at the tone of the show. Look at the storytelling. There is absolutely nothing Tolkien about this crappy show.
Have you watched Colin From Accounts? So dumb but very funny.
I could forgive all the changes if it wouldn’t be such a bad show in general.
I left this show when the orc babies showed up. I just can’t do it.
I can tell this is a decent episode because Erik didn’t roll a single R.
Robinson Steven Thompson Barbara Davis Sandra
what really bugs me about the kiss, was the swell of music as if some great revelation just happened.
I understood why he kissed her in that moment(still hated it) but the music made me feel rage!!!
The music in general is really bad and obtrusive, which pains me to say as I’ve loved a lot of Bear’s work.
Anyone else was bothered that the daming of the river was done using a mountain that didn't exist their prior to this episode?
That was the least of my objections. The shot showing the gigantic rock *just* held in balance by the small round rock that can be knocked out of the way by the catapult shot with precision aim from miles away, so the big rock falls and starts the avalanche of material to dam the river? I didn't need to turn my brain off for that, it decided it wasn't going to stick around and be insulted for the rest of the episode 😄
@@maryokeeffe3528between that, the kung-fu horse, and the slow moving elves, i really thought i was watching a cartoon for young children
@@namenloss730 I've said all along, the horses are the only beings in this show permitted to be smart and achieve things 😁
@@maryokeeffe3528 i just got hammered on 6 pints, i still think my brain would have a hard time enjoying the show
@@namenloss730 My brain is not angry with me, it's just disappointed, it expected that I would know better 😁 I admit, I can't wait for the final episode as they shovel in the six different plot lines to tie them up or rather, give us CLIFF HANGERS to make us watch the third season.
I have found a strange feeling of fun watching this show. I just like Adar. Every one else is so dumb compared. They really should not kill him off. I am not alone in this :D
You cant stand what the others are doing :) This is such a strange show.
Team "Adar for High King of All Middle-earth" here. Even Ar-Pharazon has to come second to the Lord-Father, he can stay on Númenor and build all the aqueducts he wants 😀
Can’t believe Elrond didn’t also pass Nenya to Galadriel. It’s just par for the course.
Also, scale is a glaring problem in most every set piece. Seems so cheap!
This show is very doodoo. But sometimes you people are looking to criticize. It was quite clear that the kiss was meant as a distraction. Could’ve gone another way but they set this up well.
It is not clear at all that the kiss was meant as a distraction. He passes the pin to her in full view of the watching orc.
What is clear is that this was just trashy writing at a soap opera level. Throw in some rage bait in an attempt to get viewers due to the shock value.
Hence the camera lingering on them as they kiss, and the romantic music overlay.
Elves can remarry. The Valar allowed Finwe to remarry and his second wife is Indis of the Vanyar, the Fair-Elves of Ingwë. She bears him two sons: Fingolfin and Finarfin, and two daughters: Findis and Írimë. This is part of Tolkien lore, that Finwe remarried. So Elves can remarry and love another Elf in Tolkien's world.
Tolkien's general rule is that Noldor cannot remarry - they are faithful to their partner for eternity, even if the partner dies.
There are only two exceptions mentioned (one of them being Finwe), and both ended badly.
Not that this should matter - Galadriel in the show says that her husband has disappeared. He is not dead, so even what you have written above is irrelevant to excuse the kiss, which just smashes canon.
@@alexg3434 In ROP Galadriel told Theo that her husband Celeborn went to war in the war against Morgoth and never came back. So Galadriel is saying that Celeborn is presumed dead. Celeborn has been missing for centuries when Galadriel has been hunting Sauron in those centuries.
Do you expect Galadriel to be single for thousands and thousands of years? Elves are supposed to be near immortal so will live thousands and thousands of years. Do you truly expect Galadriel to live without affection for the rest of her days? Isn't that a bit unrealistic and downright cruel?
the best answer to "they couldn't do it the right way because they didn't have the rights" is
"Why would they try to tell a story they don't have the rights for?"
Correct. And in fact they do have the rights - all the rights they need for this story.
Its just another excuse attempt by Amazon.
13:26 thats why I am upset.
THIS.WILL.BE.CANCELED.
In Season 1, Galadriel told Theo that her husband Celeborn went to war and never came back. So Celeborn is presumed dead by Galadriel. So Galadriel has no husband and there is no daughter Celebrian. So Galadriel is free to love or express love to whomever she wants especially to a such a beloved friend Elrond who is going to battle Adar and his Orcs, who outnumber the Elven forces 10 to 1. So the kiss is also a deeply felt farewell between 2 friends who love each other lots and know that they are in very real danger of dying. And know that this might be their last embrace.
Noldor marry for eternity, even if she knew her husband was dead, which she doesn't. Just another way this show trashes Tolkien's literature. No, Adar and his orcs don't outnumber the elves "10 to 1": There are about 20 elvish extras in this show and about 30 orcs. God knows what they spent the money on. And no, its not a "farewell kiss": its meant to be romantic, as this show descends into soap-opera level schlock.
@@alexg3434 Elves can remarry. The Valar allowed Finwe to remarry and his second wife is Indis of the Vanyar, the Fair-Elves of Ingwë. She bears him two sons: Fingolfin and Finarfin, and two daughters: Findis and Írimë. This is part of Tolkien lore, that Finwe remarried. So Elves can remarry and love another Elf in Tolkien's world.
@@lydiaparam2566 There are only two exceptions, Finwe and one other, and both end badly.
Nevertheless, Tolkien said that the norm for the Noldor is to marry for eternity. Not ignore their husband who is merely missing...
@@alexg3434 Just because the 2 remarriages end badly is due to the individuals in the marriage, not due to the practice of remarrying another Elf itself.
@@lydiaparam2566 Noi, its more than that. Tolkien says that Noldor normally marry for eternity. They stay faithful to their partner even after death.
Not that this is even relevant since Galadriel in the show says her husband is not dead.
So this attempt to excuse the trash writing in the show also fails.
They kissed because they thought they would never see each other again.,
I'm pretty sure it was to distract Adar while he passed her the lock-pick though.
It was.
@@evgeniytsarkov5679 they kiss because this show is made for the fan fiction shippers and because for some reason the showrunners like to antagonize the fans.
There are thousands of ways they can resolve the plot and not have them kiss. They just love to ship(and destroy)characters
If they die, their souls will meet again in the Halls of Mandos and recover a physical body some time later. Good elves do not have to worry about their fate after being slayed. Ooh, wait, we are dealing here with a nonsensical show made by Am4zon the Lore-butcher.
When Bezos said bring me Game of Thrones, you think he just meant make out sessions with the in-laws?
how could it be good even if they got the chronology right qith that casting? this celebrimbor is the worst actor and character in history
You don't have to lead the mob, we've already mobilized.