Why The SU57 'Felon' Sucks
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- Опубліковано 4 чер 2024
- In this video, we take a closer look at the overhyped and underwhelming SU57 Felon - and why it might not be quite the impressive fifth-generation fighter that many think it is. Despite its sleek design and impressive manoeuvrability, this aircraft falls short in key areas such as stealth capabilities, outdated systems, and limited production numbers. Join us as we delve into the specifics and explore why the SU57 Felon might not live up to its hype as a dominant force in modern air combat.
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RCS Simulation - F-35, SU-57, J-20.
basicsaboutaerodynamicsandavi...
SU57 Patent translated 1.0m2 - 0.1m2 RCS.
archive.org/details/ru-250264...
archive.org/details/ru-250264...
web.archive.org/web/201410231...
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Correction 1: The F-117 shoot down was far more nuanced than I explained here and not just down to open bomb doors, here is a great video that does a far better job at explaining it. • F-117’s 1999 downing w...
0:00 Opening
0:31 Modern air doctrine
0:59 The SU57’s shortfall
1:34 How is stealth calculated?
2:54 How does it compare?
4:39 Why is it so bad?
4:55 Shape and Simulation
6:20 IRST dome
7:26 Outdated philosophy
7:51 RAM coating
8:16 Exposed screws?
9:08 Bubble bath cockpit
9:39 Low Production
10:57 Greater implications
11:57 Conclusion.
12:38 Outro
13:30 Patrons - Наука та технологія
Thanks for watching! This video seems to have popped off, so if you wouldn't mind checking out my channel it would be hugely appreciated! :)
There are now 26 Sukhoi Su-57 Felons, along with 10 test planes.
I think you made a lot of russian bots unhappy in the comments
@@Rorywizz do you believe bots got emotions? :)
Sadly, that's a "double-fail, under 0:30 seconds" video.
1) who is Tom Clancy (Wikipedia: a novelist, genre: Techno-thrillerspy fiction, crime fiction, realistic fiction, historical fiction)
2) "replaced by who can detect who first" - stealth does not work for long-range (waves) radars (but there are other benefits, of course).
I don’t use Tom Clancy as anything but a way to set the scene, I do it on all my videos if you take a look.
As for long wavelength radars, you’re trying to debunk stealth’s implementation but it’s those radars are not that simple, and are much more difficult to use for a target lock. In an air to air battle this won’t really change things, both sides use this technology.
However, if you’re going to be the first detected by said technologies then you’re going to lose. You didn’t debunk any mistake, you just tried to brush off valid criticism with invalid rebuttals.
I’d have to say the 57 is actually pretty darn stealthy considering how no one has ever seen it operate in a combat theatre.
Can hiding in a hangar be considered "stealth"? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Well yeah. It hasn't exactly been operating in a combat theatre. Allegedly some were damaged or destroyed on the ground though
Since Russian isn't busy with wars around the globe, as the US/NATO seem to be, why would you see it in a combat environment?
@@feedyourmind6713ehem, Ukraine. Ehem
@@feedyourmind6713 me when I have Alzheimer’s
My congratulations to Sukhoi for designing a formidable answer to the F-15.
I'm thinking it's still no match for newer F15s with better trained U.S. pilots....
F15E or EX would stomp
@@Pablo_lens I mean it depends on the type of fight they get into, The F-15 is more of a missile truck rather than a intense dogfighter. So if they got into close combat, the Su-57 has the advantage. At long range however, assuming the F-15 detects the Felon, which it probably would, that 57 is going to have 14 AMRAMs coming for its ass
@@Prodagist Maneuverability is the only thing that's helping the Felon.
At long last, the russians are ready for desert storm
The checkmate is amazingly stealthy, like the aramata: totally invisible on all battlefields for decades to come.
The femboy
Oh, the famous F-22 - the king of air battlefields. And of every battlefield it came to: none with competent adversary. Bravo. Ameryquan sytyzen quan sliip qualmlii!
@@worldoftancraft ain't it great how the US has such superiority in fighters that it does not even need to use their best plane to shit on any other airforce.
@@skrattzerat5831 boot muh togzpaiers manii. Or now they are military industry money?
and yes, if all the conflicts you're engaging in are your controlled chaos in poorer contries - you don't need the higher league hardware. But among respected people it's not an accepted norm to physically assault lower rank personal. But in US it seems it's a norm when senior lieutenant is beating a private.
I don't recall seeing that while in the army. @@worldoftancraft
The old saying "never interrupt your enemy when they are making a mistake" comes to mind
You mean the delusion of such videos? True. No wonder US fascism loses against rice farmer and goat herders. Imagine they would fight an actual army...
@@miriamweller812but russians too got defeted by talibans (guerrilla fhiters)
Top Gun Maverick is the best thing that happened to this plane. It made non-plane nerds think this is the best plane ever made.
EDIT: Y’all can’t take a joke
You're thinking of the F-14...
@@user-fw2dd2cy3c Nope. The F-14 actually has a combat record. And has proved itself as a good aircraft. Not the SU-57.
a movie that made a 5th gen fighter lose to a dynosaur made the Su-57 look like best ever made. how dumb must you be. Also in my comment I proved this idiot youtuber has lied about mostly everything he said.
OMG, I blew root beer out of my nose!! @NotPlebis, you nailed it! That’s exactly what happened! 🤦🏻♂️😂
Well, two ex US fighter pilots 'reacted' to the final dogfight and deemed it completely unrealistic and impossible.
F-22: Radar cross-section of a Bee
SU-57: Radar cross-section the size of an SU-57
The Mach 2 Bumblebee-HLC
when was the last time you saw a f22 raptor in a combat you never lol
@@pinochioo5678 the reason why you never see any F-22s in combat is because there's no aircraft that requires THAT level of capability to counter. The SU-57, J-10 and J-20 all suck massively when compared to western fighters like the F-22 and to a mildly lesser extent the F-35, Eurofighter Typhoon, Saab Gripen and Dassault Rafale.
@@dopecat4012 I'll admit, the Gripen is probably the least effective of the fighters I listed above. But I'm more than willing to bet that it can still run rings around anything Russia has in a straight up air-to-air engagement.
@@pinochioo5678when was the first time you saw su57 in production numbers? Never
I'm starting to think the reason that we call it the felon is because the people who built it were criminally negligent
And the people who oversell it.
"The SU57 'felon' sucks"
-a random dude laying on his bed who doesn't even have a SU57
Lol you have no counterargument
Not even russia has a su57
The exposed screws is an enormous problem. Ben Rich describes in his book "Skunkworks" that when they were developing the F-117, it could consistently fly within a few miles of the radars they had access to without being detected until one day they got a clear lock onto the F-117 at more than 50 miles away. An investigation found that an engineer had left three screws partially loose.
That was the photo of the prototype jet. Some of the 8 Su-57 prototypes had exposed screws and rivets, unlike the production model.
@@MrJahbuddha doesnt matter, no S-Duct so its fucked in a frontal engagement
@@TheWizardGamez Yeah I do recall reading during the Korean War the Mig back then had a high radar cross section because of the in-line engine. the Ruzzians being slow learners, I guess in over 70 years they've not engineered around that problem.
@@MrJahbuddha Fair enough, the (pre-)production Su-57s don't have exposed screws.
But they still have terrible front-aspect stealth compared to the competition. Even non-stealth 4.5 gen fighters like the Gripen and Rafale do a much better job of hiding their fan blades than the Su-57. Most of the Su-57's other flaws seem like they should be fixable in future upgrades with relatively little difficulty, but the lack of s-ducting is a catastrophically bad design choice that would require much more significant alteration to the airframe to rectify.
I have that book, it's one of my favorites. The fact they covertly bought Titanium from the Soviet Union to make the SR-71 so they could spy on the Soviet Union is hilarious.
This plane is so stealthy, most Russian test pilots haven't seen it yet.
That’s a good one
The plane is so stealthy, that even the largest Russian air bases can't see any coming :D
theres one holding station over the white house right now.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@jackwilliamson6018Sure thing kid
You know, one thing I can say positive about the SU57 is that it does look really good as a fighter. Like, looks good, visually.
I like fighter jets, they're amazing flying things. I think currently the F-22 takes my favourite spot at the moment, but that's nothing to say of the good looks of the SU57
The pod sticking out it's tail is really faken ugly though. Reminds me of a roach carrying an egg sack.
@@zelkuta I guess one gets used to that.
You know, when I first saw the F-16 (as a young person), I found it ugly.
Because I was so used to only seeing twin-engine jets, that a jet with just one engine looked so weird and wrong to me.
Eventually I got used to it and could appreciate the Viper for the beautiful marvel that it is :)
There seems to be a bit of F23 in the design of the Su 57.
If this logic work, J - 20 will be the most powerful one.
@@julianfell666 except if i recall the US rejected the 23 because it was too expensive, even tho it was stealthier and faster than the F 22. McDonnel Douglas manages to make some of the best military equipment out there (F 15, F 23, Apache helicopter)
One addition about effective radar range:
For F35 vs SU57, its even more extreme in practice that the 6-10x distance you mentioned. Lets say its 8x for math simplicity.
Because of the geometry of circles and spheres, the same radar station covers the 8^2=64 times more ground area and 8^3=512 times more airspace against a SU57 vs the F35.
It's even more pronounced in terms of the 3D space covered.
@@lostalone9320don’t think you’ll ever be flying more than 27000 meters above a radar instillation lol
@@alexantone5532It does eventually matter in 2070 when 1st Gen Space fighters begin flying around
Being a former Plane Captain in the U.S. Navy, we spent a lot of time making sure there were no "anomalies" on the canopy. That kind of thing can drive a man(pilot) insane.
if you watch that video, the bubbles seem to be moving soooo maybe its the air conditioning?
@@zahnatom It's some kind of condensation pooling, the only way to mistake it for flaws in the canopy is to only look at a picture. Which is probably how this particular myth started spread around, as an easy "believable" way to make it seem way worse than it really is. Even the cheapest glider canopies don't have freaking bubbles.
@@zolikoff No, those are clearly inclusions (bubbles) in the canopy.
@@zolikoff Sorry dude but its not, you can clearly tell theyre inclusions within the canopy itself
I'd never seen that picture of the bubbles in the glass before. It made me physically cringe. That's insane! I know Russia has subpar manufacturing standards, but I figured they were at least better than China!
My favorite story about the F-117 is that when they were testing the airframe, they put up a model of the airplane on a pole and tried to detect it on a radar. The first time, the radar operator complained that the model must have fallen off the pole, he couldn't find it at all. One of the Skunk Works engineers went to look: the model was still up on the pole.
Another time, they were getting an unusually good radar return from the model. When they went to go look, they found a bird sitting on the model.
Actually, I believe they were shocked when the model took flight.
i believe that they didnt believe that it would fly, but after they seen the rcs, they said that they would 'make it fly'.
The engineers and program managers were finally sold on the F-117’s capabilities Re: low observability in the real world (vs on paper) when they kept finding dead bats laying around on the floors of the -117 hangars.
The bat’s use of echo location to “see” was rendered completely useless and the poor things kept flying full speed head first into the parked airplanes and dying from head trauma.
All these top experts here...outstanding
The first time they meassured the RCS, it wasn't anything from the other world or anhthing. In the end, it was the pole they put the plane in.
The SU57 is like the guy with the sword from Indiana Jones
And most American equipment is like the people: obsolete, oversized, overhyped, hated and useless. I heard some Abrams provided some much needed fire kindle.
@@wellardmeUseless and hated is a stretch.
@@wellardme so much cope, lol
Telling everyone they chose poorly? Or living since the crusades? Which would mean the SU-57 would last hundreds of years.
@@wellardme lmao the cope is real
If the definition of stealth is not being visible, then the SU57 is a success. There's so few of them; you can't see what's not there in the first place.
indeed, its a myth.
any stealth jet can be visible on radar
@@Spartan1-1 Well yes but obviously there is a gradient. That's the entire point of the video. It's not just a binary of "enemy has radar therefore stealth is now rendered uselesS". The Su-57 *is* stealthy, if it was being put up against radars from 40 years ago. The F-35 is stealthy against even the best radar systems.
Open your eyes, there's footage of multiple Su 57 in the video you've watched.
It's called sarcasm...
There is a meme about calling the Su-75 "Femboy" instead of "Checkmate".
If that doesn't become the official NATO designation then I'm writing an angry letter.
@@KabodaOfficial Just call it the Femboy. Ignore the NATO designation that they give.
@@KabodaOfficial 😜yeah Femboy would fit perfectly with their anti-LGBTIQ(XLHDUO) crusade.
LazerPig came up with that, right?
@@WinVisten YES lol
‘They couldn’t get the fucking glass canopy right’
Brilliant. X
Gonna have to correct something here regarding the IRST. IRST isn't actually a targeting module but rather a method of targeting. The targeting module on an SU-57 is only capable of IRST while the EOTS system on the F-35 is capable of IRST in addition to other capabilities. The mere presence of IRST is not what causes the stealth issue either, rather that the enclosure is spherical in shape, which is pretty bad for stealth. The lack of a ram coating is likely overstated as it would have a miniscule effect on stealth compared to the giant cockpit canopy if Russia lacks the capability to produce a transparent RAM coating.
This is further supported by the fact that the J-20 also has an IRST only module. Despite the visual similarities in enclosure between the J-20 and F-35, the one on the J-20 is IRST only as evident by the fact that only the front panels are transparent on the J-20 enclosure.
Otherwise, great video on why the SU-57 sucks.
Some great points, thank you for taking the time to comment!
The thing is, Russia is still trying to catch up to the US when it developed the very first F-35 prototype. Not only has the US built hundreds of them, they've been receiving and will continue to receive massive upgrades in tech and capability. Even if Russia produced the Felon in any serious quantity, it's already last gen compared to the current state of the F-35.
@duimpjeneerRussia is almost One generation behind. when did F22 come out?
@duimpjeneer umm, no, they haven't had the need to use f22. expensive? yes, but that's not the reason why they didn't use it. no, they don't sell it to anyone. it's their right to do so. it's the most advanced technology. some of it, st least. it's getting old now. just shows you how far ahead are the Americans.
@Aku you're right, we haven't used the F-22 in combat. Why you ask? 2 reasons, 1 we never had to because the war it was built for never happened, and 2 all you commie bastards are afraid of it, running for home whenever one shows up. The F-35 continues that legacy and is being used by everyone who isn't a communist dictator
@Aku The F-35 is a US plane, other countries justed helped fund the project and some of them want their planes built in there country
F-35 is a lame duck. How many F-35s are flyworthy and issues free? None (!) of them are issues free and majority aren't flyworthy. As for F-22, they can't wait to retire it. Su-57 has combat record shooting down 4th gen fighters in Ukraine from hundreds kilometers away with R-37 missile. Do F-22 and F-35 have combat record? They don't (not counting baloons).
_Even if Russia produced the Felon in any serious quantity,_
Russia can produce cruise missiles be them supersonic or hypersonic ones that can destroy majority of F-35s on air-fields, then those F-35s that have survived would have to face Russia's superior air-defence that can see stealth with L-band radars from very far. Su-57 isn't even that necessary here. All Russia's fighter-jets will have targeting data from ground radars and will fire at F-35s that survived cruise missiles on the ground.
_it's already last gen compared to the current state of the F-35._
Dude, F-35 can't even fly supersonically for prolonged time. It is slow and is relativelly poorly armed.
The SU57 is so stealthy most of them exist in another universe.
the Su-57 is so stealthy you'll never even see it in combat!
(because Russia is crippingly afraid of losing even a single one)
@@InitiateDee yet can use T-90Ms... What sense does that make?
@@lemieux-z8933 They use Su-57s too, just in such roles that don't compromise the aircraft whatsoever
All of them are stuck in strangereal
Like the original F-35. The ones built have their specs revised down, several times. Lockheed Martin has been lying about the F-35 because the plane was sold before it was produced to several countries (so much for stealth). It failed all of its trials, and had to take new watered down trials. The only thing that is unique is the F-35B. It has no equals.
they call it the felon because it sucks so bad it should be a felony to own
According to FMV (Swedish Defense procurement agency) documents that has been circling online, the Gripen 39A had an RCS of 0.1m2 in clean config. Both C and E updates have recieved additional signature reduction modifications, where estimates put them at the same RCS with A2A config (0.1m2). That would make it more stealthy than the Su57 with its 0.1-1m2
SU RCS numbers are used wrongly since those are straight from SU 57 designer and in sukhoi they measure RCS differently. All they said it is as stealthy as f22.
@@MarkoLomovic lmao continue coping
@@rammusannus5364 Stop projecting it is sad.
@@MarkoLomovicShow us your source.
@@oluwatosinopawoye5695 All information we have is numbers given by Sukhoi and it is not even in official capacity.
And number they gave is not best RCS from most optimal angle(like F22 number we have) but overall average or something which makes it seem like it has shit values.
From that same statement I recall designer comparing it to F22 and they had similar values.
So it is irrelevant if you believe it or not but if you are going to use their numbers you can't use it in bad faith.
It may suck as a stealth fighter but it makes for a great-looking acrobatic plane.
That is one thing I'll give it - however the engines are a bit of a let down aesthetically.
I don't think anything compares to the F-22 though, that's just beautiful.
tbh Su-47 is a better choice if you want an aircraft to look pretty
Russian planes in a nutshell. Look amazing and do Cobra's. Thats it.
@@KabodaOfficial I think if you look harder, you'll find information about the Su-57's implementation of radar blocking for the intakes. I hate Russia with a passion but at the same time, I like being accurate and this video is somewhat misleading on it's core point.
Agree. It has been designed and built only for propaganda - flight characteristics are impressive, which makes it the perfect airshow participator. And that was it. To participate on airshows, including the one on Red Square once a year, 10 aircraft are sufficient.
Probably, at some point Red Bull will buy all of them for a penny for their fleet in Salzburg 🤣then they can showcase F-4U vs SU-57 dogfights 😏
step 1: eastern countries claim to have the best jet ever made
step 2: western militaries go bonkers and spend 7 quinshittion dollars on a gen 69420 child vaporizer jet
step 3: eastern countries want to save face, claim to have the best jet ever made
repeat
step 2.5: Third world countries buy eastern jets that get deleted in the first conflict they're in
@@lordbrain8867 1973 in Egypt was the Soviet Air Force's equivalent experience to what the USAF faced in 1968 in Vietnam. Even though Soviet involvement in Egypt was far less than America's in Vietnam, the Soviet pilots attached to the Egyptian air force there faced similar problems, especially since the Soviets had initially blamed Egyptian pilots for being the weak link in the fight against the Israeli AF.
Common and classic Eastern L
Strategy works economically, somewhat less successful when you actually need combat sorties. XD
extra step : eastern country update 2 never deploy something they claim it's best keep loss to 0
A little backstory about the plane: The project started in the late 80's but lack of funds made the Soviet union (Which later collapsed) put the project on hold. Later Russia continued the development as a Russian-Indian co-project. As the first planes flew and tests were conducted on the plane (wich at this point was still called T-50 PAK FA) India started to back out from the project, first reducing the number of orders for the plane, then completely backing out from the project. The Russians "finished" (more like rushed) the project due to lack of funds and the plane became the SU-57. The reason why India backed out is unkown, either the plane didn't bring the expected results or it was too expensive, maybe both.
Also unlikely Russia will be able to produce any more of them anytime soon. As far as I know, the plane has western (French in particular) avionics. Its even a question how long the existing ones will be able to fly.
And let me put this here at the end... Whoever says whatever about this plane... It looks cool af.
What did India end up going with?
@@daniel_dumile I think they are developing their own ''fifth'' generation fighter . But it seems the only real fifth generation fighters are going to be either American or Chinese
Raphale@@daniel_dumile
This isn't true though. The Indian funding was for an India specific version, the funding never had anything to do with the domestic model.
India backed out cz of 2 major reasons that were firstly the plane was not that good and neither we’re Russians making improvements in the sector which Indians mentioned to
Secondly the project was 60-40 funded, 60% funds from India lol😂 and yet Russians didn’t agree for even 50% tot
Indian here btw 🤞🏻
In the F-22 and F-35, different radar scattering materials are used in their canopies to obscure the pilot's helmet return. In order to reduce the radar cross section (RCS) of the aircraft, the F22 canopies are coated with a thin layer of Indium Tin Oxide (ITO), which gives it a golden tint. The newer F-35 uses a different materials technology that causes its canopy to appear rose or purple tinted.
Yup Rafale also uses Indium Tin Oxide hence gold hue on the canopy.
F35 is a scam😂
@@hugo-di6xm A "scam" that has produced 960+ aircraft, out of an eventual 3,100+ 5th Gen stealth fighters. A "scam" that has allowed Japan and other countries to field aircraft carriers with modern air wings. A "scam" with the most advanced avionics and sensors of any operational fighter in the world, one that acts like a mini AWACS. A "scam" that has high exercise kill ratios against the most advanced 4+ Gen fighters, like the Typhoon, Rafale, F-15C, FA-18E and Su-30?
@@hugo-di6xmand Russia is a joke
@@hugo-di6xm The Russian MIC is a scam, judging from their terrible performance in modern combat lmao
Another huge issue the Felon has is the fact that it would be carrying a super light arsenal just to remain partially stealthy. Even if it scratches stealth completely and carries weapons externally, it would be at a huge disadvantage against the 4th gen missile truck fighters.
That's the case for all stealth fighters
@@ballisticmenace8091 Not exactly, the F-22 can carry 6, and the F-35 can carry (internally) 4, with option for external stores.
@@ballisticmenace8091 Except, the F-35 and F-22 don't sacrifice having a heavy arsenal for the sake of semi stealth. They can achieve a very high degree of stealth.
The su-57 carry the 6 r-77s and 2 r-74 internally. So it's even with the air to air payload of an f-22
@@ballisticmenace8091 Yup, and that is a small payload for both planes.
However, it's worth it to carry a small payload when you are in an F-22 coz you can now achieve a high degree of stealth.
But a Felon would never achieve a high degree of stealth. So now, it's carrying a light arsenal AND not being very stealthy.
And if I'm not mistaking, Felons can carry 4+2 missiles NOT 6+2.
10:16 those f-35's on the runway in this context just really looks like that one kid that did their homework really well
russian fanboys are real silent
They are stealthy, unlike their jet
One thing I really like doing is opening videos critical of russia in any way and sort the comments by new. Love seeing tankies seethe and cope lmao
I do the same lmao
Me too
Same here buddy
I like how the video was generally pretty professional throughout, with technical language and discussion of hardware specs, and then he just pops off at the bubbles in the cockpit part.
Indeed. To be honest, you kind lost me there.
Because that's where this whole charade of "technological superiority" completely falls apart. I mean, come on! They can't even produce a canopy for their show models? What are we even talking about here? How cash-strapped is this operation?
It's a little hard not to, since bubbles mean the build quality on the SU57 canopy is lower than the caanopy of a gondola on the London Eye.
@@TohaBgood2 Russian paper tiger was actually half eaten squash and russian bear was old potato
Sad that such a beautiful jet is basically obsolete right off of the production line. They will never have enough of them in service either. Nonetheless, she is gorgeous!
They evolved it into the SU35. Be afraid. Be very afraid
@Russell K. Bonney I'd be more afraid of a potential exchange of nukes. Russia knows its not winning a conventional war with us, so they threaten to use nukes. I don't think it's an empty threat either.
@@russellk.bonney8534 wait but ins't the bigger serial number supposed to be better? wtf
@@toninhosoldierhelmet4033 wtf??
@@russellk.bonney8534 what this is confusing, how is the older thing better than the new thing, thats not how you make fighter aircraft, i dont even know if the SU35 came before or after the SU57, whats going on here?
The Su-75's Nato name isn't Checkmate. As a fighter, its name has to start with an F. It is called the 'Fiction'.
It's the marketing name. Until NATO gives the proper reporting name, it's likely going to be called that or femboy.
@@naksachaisaejane1982i like femboys
Su-75 Failure
So now we can called it Su-57 "Fail-lon"
The Su-57 Felon kinda sounds like the MiG-25 Foxbat. Felon doesn’t have a small radar cross section, it’s engines are exposed to radar, its infrared tracking system is the old dome shaped thing, its rivets are visible. The Foxbat had these enormous wings just to get it airborne, the engines couldn’t sustain Mach 3 speeds for long periods of time unlike the Blackbird. The Foxbat was kinda manufactured in a hurry and the Felon also sounds like it was manufactured in a hurry.
And the engines apparently overheat.
To be fair to the MiG-25, it was designed for a specific purpose (high-speed interception) that was misunderstood by Western intelligence, and subsequently hyped up by the West as a superweapon for a role that it was never intended to serve. It was also somewhat competent in its designed role and was able to be salvaged into the more refined MiG-31 design.
Meanwhile, the Su-57 is hyped up for the exact thing it was supposed to be, which it can't live up to, and most likely never will.
@@Mattoropael I respectfully agree with your opinion.
@@Mattoropael The US military likes to hype up the Russian military's equipment. It makes it easier to get more money for their own budget.
You don't have to look any further than Ukraine to see the capability of the Russian military on full display. They're still conducting trench warfare and their equipment sucks.
That's an understatement. Just a few seconds at Mach 3 and the Foxbat needed brand new engines 😭💀
The Felon in my opinion looks really cool. I just like the look of the thing. It might be obsolete already but it's still cool to look at.
Well, almost anything produced by the CCCP and then Russia is propaganda first. So yes, it looks cool but they cannot maintain, cannot secure its operational airspace to be effective, do not have enough pilot training hours. etc. etc. So its good for Americans to keep doing movies where Russia is the enemy and the military industry to point fingers when asking for more money.
true
I'm like 90% sure the 57 is just a purpose built airshow machine
@Desperate Psycho they did let it fly like a mile into Ukraine and then ran like hell sooo they can technically say its seen combat
It just looks like a squished F-22 mixed with a SU-35
"Russia no longer has the industrial capacity of the Soviet Union" aka they can no longer strong-arm or force Eastern Europeans into giving them all their resources.
That scream is enough to scare off any potential hunters. Plus, it’s the pilot, not the plane - Fred Dibnah.
Ok. Try fighting raptor with sabre then. I guarantee that you won't like it.
It has been about who can detect who first since the earliest days of aerial combat. It's why you attack from the sun, or from behind. You want to see your enemy from as far away as possible and delay him seeing you as long as possible.
You're enemy can't counter attack if the first clue he has that you are there is his aircraft disintegrating from the effects of your weapons.
Your*
fair point. now its all just stoopid ranges tho lol
I am no soldier or pilot but I have experiences with this on CoDM because my hardware is so old that I have to close the distance to basically point blank to even see the enemy on a *FLAT* surface with *NO* visual obstructions
@@RX0_GundamUnicorn i can only presume that you didn't have good luck with getting kills
@@gsamov quite the contrary, I adapted and instead I rely on AUDIO cues before the visual cues pop up because the audio cues appear first
the primary advantage of stealth coatings is that it is optimized against weapon radar to make aircraft difficult to lock, even after detected by long wave radar
yep. Not only RAM, but the whole RCS thing is for K-band radar that provides firing solution. The aircraft can be detectable by other wavelengths but you need the fire control radar. He is talking out of his ass in this video, you can see it on his comparison of IRST (which is designed to look for enemy aircraft) and EOTS (which is designed to guide bombs). He is confusing distributed aperture infrared search and track system and EOTS (although they are integrated, they have different purpose - obviously, you will be what, flying belly up to search for an enemy stealth fighter up above you while in a notch or just flying low to reduce enemy's missile range?)
@@thrustvectoring8120on Lockheeds website it says "The Electro-Optical Targeting System (EOTS) for the F-35 Lightning II is an affordable, high-performance, lightweight, multi-function system that provides precision air-to-air and air-to-surface targeting capability."
Seems to me like the EOTS can do both air to air and air to ground
Старая песня самолётов у нас нет ракеты и снаряды закончились ЭТО хорошо что вы так думаете и не до оцениваите противника .
Пупсик, 1000 ф35 против дюжины 57? Вынь путьку изо рта, а то думать мешает.
Well yes and no. The B2/21have stealth coatings and those are as I understand it true stealth aircraft (invisible even to low frequency search)
My understanding is the primary difference between having a no track fighter and a no detect bomber is the decision to include the vertical tail pieces.
The f117 and b1 was just no track because of this while the B2 and our new raider are no detect because of how important the tail loss is to reducing radar bounces. This is actually why the f35 has the two tilt vertical tails because they are better at reducing radar cross section than a straight up and down tail.
This does however greatly reduce the aircrafts mobility which is why it's not done in fighters.
at least not yet.
The new NGAD Next Gen Air Dominance renderings that have been released by the military seem to indicate an aircraft that does not include any tail assembly.
But then the NGAD seems almost more of a f22 replacement than a f35 with only a could hundred expected at full strength though they will have the AI wingman drones but even then 200 will leave many bases without any squadrons of NGADs at all.
So the US will still be relying on f35 for decades to come as it's primary air frame.
Hopefully though they do aquire a decent number of the new f15.
The f35 is honestly too expensive to use for homeland defense missions like just intercepting routine Russian bomber flights and in a non near peer conflict the f15 is awesome for the amount of firepower it can carry. It's also nice this way as a stand off weapons platform.
NGAD or F22 or B21 penetrates and locates enemy aircraft or SAM sites and the f15 piggy backs the track to launch attacks from 500 miles away with some of the newer very long range missiles.
It may suck, but it's a cool looking bird.
Great video. I was a crew chief on the Raptors at Tyndall and Langley for 4 years. I always thought the Felon looked cool, but could not compete with the Raptor or Lightning when it came to stealth.
The F117 was actually shot down by simple luck. Zoltan Dani, the commander of the Neva missile battery said he got extremely lucky and couldn't do it again even if his life depended on it.
A lot of things went into the downing of the F117. First up until now the F117s were escorted by EA-6B prowlers which could jam radars. Because of the repeated success, the decision was made to stop jamming enemy radar using electronic warfare. Zoltan's missile battery was moved to cover an area near another sam site (S-75 Dvina). His positioning there was actually random and only done because it was one of the predetermined available locations. That location survived solely because was inactive up to this point in the war. Had the radar been activated, it would have been destroyed by coalition forces earlier in the week. This radar (P-18) was an older radar belonging to a decommissioned SAM system. It's target acquisition radar has a max range of 250km for a F-15 instead of the 120km range of the P-15 radar. If Colonel Dani did not have the unique opportunity of using a P-18 than he would have never detected the F117 to begin with. He was the only one with access to a P-18 that night. The other locations were using the P-15.
The luck part begins with which SAM sites were active at the time the F117 was downed. The government was more concerned with preserving assets rather than shooting down planes. Therefore, only some of the deployed sam sites were considered "on alert" while the others had strict orders not to activate radar or engage the enemy. One of the sam sites on alert was Colonel Dani's. At the time the F117s bombed Belgrade, only 2 SAM sites remained. Because there were no EA-6B escorts jamming the P-18, it could detect the F117s. It could detect them because they were only 23km away. While the F117 has a system that can operate as a radar warning receiver, it does not function while on a strike mission as it increases RCS. This is not a common problem among newer generations of stealth fighters. Had the pilots detected a radar or if they had their EA-6B escort than they would have dropped to below 6km, making the P-18 useless for detection.
This is the important part. The P-18 target acquisition radar could detect the F117s, but the fire control radar could not. The F117s flew incredibly close to the sam site because they were unaware it was still active. The detection range had a max of 14km and the engagement range had a minimum of 8km. Therefore, the plane had to fly within a 5km corridor near the sam site (between 8 and 14km away) for a minimum of 90 seconds. Had the F117 turned just 1 degree to the left when leaving Belgrade, than it would have never been detected by the fire control radar. Which means, Colonel Dani's only option was to wave as it flew away. Alternatively, if the pilots dropped below 6km, left the engagement corridor (in either direction) or went defensive than the missile would have lost contact. One missile did lose contact and crash because of how difficult the F117 was to track.
This would be like jumping out of a plane over the ocean and landing within feet of a shark as it was hunting.
This part is to dispel the myths related to the downing of the F117:
Opening the weapon bay only reduces the RCS for the few seconds it is open. This is not enough time to acquire a plotting solution, fire and make contact with the plane. The moment the bay closed it would have reduced the RCS and the missile would have lost contact again.
Another Myth was Colonel Dani "changed the radar frequency" and improved the range. This was disproved by Colonel Dani himself. He stated he made no changes to the fire control radar and very minor changes to the target acquisition radar.
Brilliant write up, thank you for taking the time to type this.
@@KabodaOfficial agreed. It's well written, and informative!
@1Kusari Here are some facts that you missed and misinterpreted:
- The reason why Zelko's F117 was downed lies in the complacency and bad planning on behalf of the USAF. And then in part of the skills and good fortune of the Serbian SAM unit.
- EA6B's didn't fly that night cause of the bad weather. EA6B's were paired with F117 because the planners were aware that F117 is not as stealthy as advertised (hence it could
be "seen" with P18's different wavelengths). In Iraq war i.e., USAF flew without the EA6B's or F111's.
- Serbian intelligence had timely information on F117 takeoffs from Aviano (that's why it was later decided to move them to Germany)
- There is no such thing as a random deployment of the SAM battery during wartime - especially when you're a primary target of a 1000 jets lurking above you
- No, the radar's been active but in the "combat" mode. The battery was operational throughout the war. It survived the 78-day day war unscathed.
- Col.Dani knew what HARM is capable of from Iraq and Bosnia. Iraqis lit up the radars and it was game over in a week. Plus, the Serbs were expecting an invasion so they were conserving assets.
- Col.Dani was studying how to bring down the stealth aircraft. That's why he made changes to his radar in advance. In one of his interviews, he said he observed (multiple times in fact) the radar returns of a stealth jet in the designated flight corridor, but not sure which stealth jet is flying out there (F117/B2).
- No, the first missile's proximity fuse didn't go off because the F117 was hard to track. The system was simply too old, and luckily, it was a common glitch.
- There was a confirmed 2nd and 3rd hit of F117 a month after Zelko was shot down. The second hit was confirmed two years ago, by the pilot Charlie "Tuna" Heinlein.
In both incidents, SAM commanders and their crews worked with Col.Dani. This fact alone means that the F117 is not so stealthy after all. Since it was repeatedly taken down by well trained SAM crews and obsolete Soviet era equipment, USAF never flew them after the campaign in Serbia in 1999.
-Fun fact, pilot Dave Zelko and Col.Zoltan Dani became good friends after the war. Dani said he had several job offers to work as a military consultant. Instead, he decided to stay in his hometown and open a bakery.
@@KabodaOfficial lots of cold war regurgitation content your posting here, Russia and China are actively pursuing and in RND stages for Quantum radars, making stealth absolete, the doctrine of Russia is to he a ground power while maintaining a the best air defense systems, f-22 can't take on s-500 and s-550, Russia is said to have the best EW as seen in the Ukraine conflict, the only reason Russia is even in the stealth scene is because they just want to compete, they can't be seen as the only superpower that doesnt have a stealth program where as China and the U.S have one, f-117 was shot down using 50s air defense systems, and the arm chair generals in the comments giving their excuses on why it was shot down, but nonetheless do better with your content enough of this cold was mentality.
You can write novels that we will read for decades! The fact remains "The Spirit of Missouri B2, and the F117" are worth billions of dollars, and they smoked a cheap rocket, they were shot down by the owner of a bakery. One fell in the Spacvan Forest on the very border of Croatia, and the other in the village of Budjanvci in Serbia. It will hurt you as long as you're alive, and I hope that NATO members will also feel what it's like to be bombed.
The conclusion I have drawn so far about the SU-57 is that it was meant to impress potential buyers like India and bring in extra funds for the design to be improved.
As shown by the massive budget overruns of the F-35, designing a concept is far less expensive than actually refining and upgrading it to full operational capability.
India backed out and Russia was left with less than a dozen prototypes and no money to further improve the design.
Even with the cost overruns of the F-35 project, since they've achieved full rate production now, each new fighter built means a reduction in production cost. The F-35 is now close to some other modern 4.5th gen fighters in price.
@@Schnittertm1 Shame we here in Australia decided to help fund the development project resulting the the highest unit price for the aircraft. Gotta pay our protection money I suppose.
Yeah, it is amazing how much better the engineering is when you have an unlimited budget ;-)
@@SurmaSampo ay remember we are the Americans bitch
Many potential buyers of Russian aircraft are in risk of facing sanctions from the US and their NATO allies, this is why India cancelled the deal
2:52 you also have to mention that the F117 that was shot down was not being assisted by an F-111 for electronic jamming which it normally would have been.
Also from what I heard they detected is using linked radar stations.
Radar stations would receive and interpret the radar rays that bounced of the planes belly.
(Stealth planes/RCS is about not reflecting radar back to where it came from, but a radar at another location might pick up the reflected rays - the question is just whether or not it knows how to interpret those.
Modern RAM coating certainly helps prevent that kind of indirect detection though)
The serbs also had spies by the airfield of where the F-117s took off and they took off and went on the same path pretty much every single night - so when the serbians saw that tiny blip when the bomb bay doors opened they knew for a fact that's what they were looking for, and they also knew exactly when to start looking for them
The serbs also had spies by the airfield of where the F-117s took off and they took off and went on the same path pretty much every single night - so when the serbians saw that tiny blip when the bomb bay doors opened they knew for a fact that's what they were looking for, and they also knew exactly when to start looking for them
The serbs also had spies by the airfield of where the F-117s took off and they took off and went on the same path pretty much every single night - so when the serbians saw that tiny blip when the bomb bay doors opened they knew for a fact that's what they were looking for, and they also knew exactly when to start looking for them
The serbs also had spies by the airfield of where the F-117s took off and they took off and went on the same path pretty much every single night - so when the serbians saw that tiny blip when the bomb bay doors opened they knew for a fact that's what they were looking for, and they also knew exactly when to start looking for them
SU-57 exists only on simulated software.
The shot of all the F-35s sitting on the tarmac is so hard
Just to put things into context:
Italy, the country where i live, will soon complete the aquisition program for 90 F35. This means that Italy, alone, would be capable of winning the air campaign against Russia in a conventional conflict. By 2030 a coalition between Poland, Finland, France, the Uk and Italy would curb stomp Russia so hard it would not have a single operative military vheicle at the end.
It is not that simple, there are other air defenses than jets. Also F-35 is only as good as pilot flying it.
@@duhni4551 A new pilot who has maybe done one season of squadron work-ups is immensely-more deadly than the best pilot in an Su-57. There are certain barriers that can’t be crossed with pilot skill, and this is more true with the 5th Generation revolution than any other time in air combat history.
@@LRRPFco52 As i said, air defenses are more than just the jets, which brings us back to the pilot.
@@duhni4551 Which brings us back to the fused and interleaved sensor network with the living threat library, and every single IADS node on the ground, air, sea, and space indicated with TGT designate boxes in the HMDS, and threat sensor/WEZ bubbles displayed on the PCD.
This brings us back to my initial response, where the new pilot with less than a year in his/her squadron is immensely-more lethal and survivable than the best Wild Weasel crew that ever lived in legacy platforms.
@@LRRPFco52 You completely miss the point, more there are "moving parts" more there are room for errors, less you have experience more likely you are to make those errors and so on, you get nervous from the mistake you make and make more of them, you get my drift. One error costs you your life when you fly against a pro, no matter what your plane is.
russians simply built a Lada variant of the fighter jet, you can't make a great fighter jet if you can't build a good car.
Interestingly, car production capability is often the greatest civilian industry that can be used as a reflection of military production capacity.
@@KabodaOfficialSo Japan is no1 world superpower when we come to jet production? Or it is Germany?
Lada is a good car tho what do you mean. Like there’s newer models too if you think they only make old ones😂
@@darkonojic7494 Japan probably could produce a world leading fighter, and for exactly the reason they are a top car producer - They have a very modern, automated manufacturing industry and have plenty of engineers who know how to use it. They don't have much military industry for political reasons, and that's the same reason why Germany doesn't do it either. But in principle, yes they have the skills and people that you'd need to start a high tech defence aerospace industry.
Cars are not just an engine on a chassis; there is a lot of aerodynamics going on, sensors being integrated, and a central control unit to run automated systems. There are very very few products that have to fuse all of this together, and which needs to "just work" for decades. More broadly, cars are also these super complex things with very convoluted supply chains that span the whole world, and managing that is a specialised profession by itself. And of course, outside of road car production, motorsport is one of the few places where advanced composites and exotic materials actually get used in live projects instead of testbeds.
Of course you can't just take Honda and tell them to make you a stealth fighter, but if the Japanese government decided to start a domestic fighter project they would absolutely work with companies like Honda. There is a reason why Saab, for example, produces both road cars and military jets.
While fairly true, I'd argue Saab hasn't really made any good cars but their fighters are pretty spiffy.
Finally, someone calling the F-117 a stealth bomber. I mean I'd personally use like "stealth attacker" or something but still, yes!
The reason the F-117 got the F-designation was because a 4-star general was concerned that the top-notch fighter pilots of the time wouldn't be very enthusiastic about flying a bomber ot attacker.
F-117 is a stealth armor
@@JCDFlexWhile that may or may not be true, the Nighthawk was also preemptively given an F designation while it was still unacknowledged so as not to count against bomber forces in strategic treaty negotiations once its existence was revealed.
Shouls have been called a "concealed carry bomber" or "pocket bomber"
Robert Donaldson, a former pilot of the aircraft on the Fighter Pilot Podcast states that the aircraft was capable of holding just about anything in the USAF arsenal, including air-to-air missiles short of the aircraft radar guided sparrow missile, and had a potential role of being used against AWACS type platforms. This is why it got the F designation.
The dogfight died when the Vietnam war ended. You still need to have the capabilities but it is doubtful you'll ever use them. My father worked on composites for the stealth program. When they finally announced the existence of the F-117 nighthawk I told my dad this plane is amazing. He said the F-117 was nothing compared to what's in the pipeline. He never said a word about his job unless it was already presented to the public.
Perhaps not quite dead. But it certainly got put on life support. Nowadays you could make a much better case for it being dead proper
yeah I have a family member who used to work in Rolls-Royce and MOOG and some of the things that she CAN say about her job is fucking insane, even if the SU-57 is a 5th gen plane it will be a generation behind within a few years. The USAF really enjoys that 1 gen+ advantage and by god are they not losing it anytime soon
Even at the sorts of range where guns can reach, if you're in an F-35 your goal would still be to hit the opponent with a missile. And in the near future any F-35 will probably be flying alongside a bunch of "wingman" drones, anyway, and those aren't limited by g-forces...
@@Registered_Simp even in the 90s, only about 3% of a2a kills were by guns, the dogfight is dead
People do indeed put the experiences in Vietnam on a pedestal as the definitive argument as to why dogfights and guns will still reign. However in the decades since Vietnam, especially conflicts in the Middle East and elswhere, the majority of air-to-air kills were made by missiles shot from long range. And even in Vietnam, only a small portion of kills were made with guns just based on public record. Dogfights with guns is less becoming a military reality, and more becoming relegated to movies, TV, and video games. The modern gun dogfight is a capability in the same vein as infantry knife fights: useful for incredibly niche situations, but if you have to rely on it to fight then something has already gone extremely wrong.
What are these sh*t called F-22, SU-57?
Im gonna be flying in my 11th gen Cessna 152 😎
Finally, the one comment here that isn’t a war starter on its own and is actually original
A lot of american people here.
The 57 stands for how many blind people were able to see it when it was first revealed
Of the total Su-57s built, always remember that as of today there are two just sitting at a graveyard at 55.571136366171075, 38.14588376704553
based
What of the ripples in the wing surface at 9:09? Making it look like it had a badly applied wrap?
I'm sorry, but the Su-75 isn't the Checkmate. It's the Femboy.
I would love to see a comparison of a radar cross section from the rear and the sides, it would be hilarious, they didn't even try to hide the exhaust, it's like the rear of an SU-37.
Either classic Russian laziness or classic Russian corruption. Either someone got lazy with the design and hit copy-paste or an oligarch needed a new superyacht.
its side facing aesa radars also significantly increase its side rcs
@@zahnatom They're not AESA, the Russians (to most everyone's knowledge) haven't developed an AESA system to date. It could be PESA, which is honestly a piece of trash.
@@lwgrazi Do you have any evidence to suggest this? Most sources I've looked into suggest they have developed plenty of AESA technology, especially the VVS's SU-35 fleet.
I think it's just distinctly behind NATO and China in terms of actual processing and frequency direction, and quantity and quality.
maybe because trying an engineering stub, did it work for the f-22, f-35 or j-20? not really, so why even making compromises
The only good thing about the Felon is its silhouette icon you are about to paint on your own jet as a kill.
Felon? More like a misdemeanor!!!🤩
What's the music playing during the conclusion?
At least they got the name right with “Felon.” Because this whole aircraft is a Felony against all stealth aircraft and 5th gens a like.
It's a shame considering the potential of the design. The majority of the issues seem rather evident to fix and improve it, and the worst part is that I'm 100% POSITIVE Sukhoi's engineers know all of the shortcomings you mentioned.
100% hypothetical and will never happen but i would love for an american company to have developed this design, to just see what it would look like at max potential
that might be something i have to draw now lol
@@AxisCorpsRep dewit
Knowing is different than being able to do anything about it. Even if the US handed the Russians the plans for the F-22 and F-35, Russian industry couldn’t replicate them. Not even close. The US is just that far ahead in manufacturing the components and materials needed for advanced weapons. That’s especially true for aircraft. And the US can actually produce them at scale.
@@bluemarlin8138 Yeah, people greatly underestimate the complexity of modern technology. When talking about stealth coatings for example, you can't just mix something together and spray it on.
It's a complex matter of combining different materials, which sometimes don't want to stick to each other, surface micro and macro topography, buildup of inner tension in the coating, complex geometries combined with resistance to the extrem conditions military jets have to face. For this you need a well defined and repeatable process, with many process parameters to balance against each other.
I know a company which moved to a different place some miles away from their old factory.
The didn't get their coating process to work for months until the realized, that they used refined tap water in a process step and that at their new place their tap water had a little different ion concentrations. The temporary solution was to bring water from their old place with tanker trucks. This way they could start the production again.They figured out the process with the new water after several more months.
It’s crazy how once the iron curtain fell russia became complete incompetent on their aeronautics division!
I love how he absolutely loses it over the cockpit glass 😂 9:07
its probably just condensation from the AC running in the cockpit
@@JuliusCeasar224 thats exactly what it was lol, if you look up and find cockpit vides of the Blue Angels you can see some water/condensation forming around the same spot due to the high G's
Sad because it really is a gorgeous aircraft… but they totally fumbled the execution.
I don't get the exposed engines outside the fuselage. Probably got to do with ease of maintenance or cooling? However wouldn't they be massive targets for heatseekers? Outside the fuselage they can't take advantage of radar absorbing materias as well.
Is there something I'm missing?
There was a design choice and we do not know why exposing the engine was chosen. I am not sure that the inlet would attract heat seeking missiles as much as the exhaust would. However, if Sukhoi did not bother to shroud the engine inlet (which is an easy thing to do), I do not think they did anything to reduce the heat signature of the exhaust which is more difficult technologically.
So one of the things to keep in mind about RCS reduction is that detection range and cross-section are not linearly correlated. Instead the way the radar equation shakes out is that to halve detection distance you need something like a 16-fold reduction in RCS. This means that obsessive lowering of RCS is needed to get really big improvements in stealth.
As an example, using the rough specifications of a WW2 airborne search radar set (the SCR-720), the poor pilot from 1945 could expect to pick up a B52 (RCS: 100m2) at around 5km. They could pick up an F15 (RCS: 25m2) at around 4km. An F18 (RCS: 1m2) could be picked up from around 1.7km away. An Su57 (perhaps 0.1m2) could be picked up at around a kilometre. So even taking the designers at their word, the Su57 is still only getting a 40% advantage over the previous-gen aircraft.
This isn't bad, mind - I'd rather get detected when I'm 40% closer to the target than not. But it illustrates how stealth is a game of technological perfection that doesn't map neatly into our intuitive understanding. It should also be borne in mind that RCS is in and of itself a bit of a lie, as stealth is about more than just some sort of overall RCS reduction. Instead it's about carefully shaping where emissions are going (and across what frequencies) and involves consideration of a range of esoteric aspects of radio frequency stuff that only a few very specialised technical people really have a good grasp on.
Indeed, and the ability to *detect* an aircraft isn’t the same as *targeting* an aircraft. The S-400 radar can probably see something as stealthy as an F-35 is up there, but it can’t say exactly where, at least with enough precision to hit it with a missile.
Sure. Except geometric stealth relies on the transmitter and receiver being in the same place. What if you now have a network of receivers? Combine that with meter-wave radar (to at least know where to focus the search) and you've got a workable solution for both detection and targeting as part of your integrated AD, which is what the Russians emphasize (defensive war -- yeah I know, sounds funny at the moment, but that's what their doctrine is built around).
@@azamatbagatov7161 Except that such a capability doesn't exist and Russia can't target stealth aircraft using distributed or passive radar networks. Meter-wave radar is also completely useless for targeting.
Do you think sukhoi would tell the truth in public accessible information?
@@timothyvu7006do you think Russia would tell the truth? No, not in a public statement, just generally.
If you do, go sign up for the Russian army, I heard they'll be in Kyiv soon
Many of the issues I have with the Su-57 are also present on the J-20 as well. Normally you just have to get close up images of these aircraft that are not photo shopped in any way to see just how terribly made they often are. For example, the Su-57 and J-20 are covered in exposed rivets everywhere across the aircraft. J-20 is more offensive when it comes to this than even the Su-57. Whole point of stealth is removing surfaces that can bounce back radar, and having visibly exposed rivets doesn't make me very optimistic on these aircraft's ability to be stealthy. Though the F-22 you can argue has some, normally they're only at access panels and they're screws that can be covered up with radar absorbing paint when sent out. J-20 and Su-57 they're literally rivets poking out of the frame all over the place. J-20's entire top between the wings is covered in rivets for example.
Worst image of a Su-57 I've seen clearly showed rust coming out between two panels of the air frame. Making me wonder what was underneath that would 'rust.' Why would it be rusting to begin with?
oh great, Sukhoi hired General Motors to build their aircraft.
@@lsswappedcessna "Where did the SU-57 go is it actually stealt- oh there it is burning in a field"
People in the fighter community generally pronounce the Sukhoi designators “Sue" versus “Ess-U". Or just Flanker, Felon, etc.
How many times have you flown the thing??
I sometimes think the Czech and Ukranian engineers were doing all the lifting in the Soviet Union. Russia seems lost on its own. Its all talk and nothing to show.
Actually. Yes pretty much
The SU-67 is the worlds best looking and most expensive...
...Stunt plane.
Maybe, but this video is about the s-57.
Engineers, test pilots and DCS players sure know what they're talking about in the comments below. 🤣
I think an aspect that’s pretty important but overlooked is how good the missiles are that the aircraft is able to carry. Even if the aircraft has good enough radar and sensors to find the other, it’s not going to matter much if it’s missiles either can’t reach it, or don’t have a good enough seekerhead to track it
Fights are fought in bvr combat now dude you have to have radar and plus medium-to long range missiles use radar so stealth is extremely important
America has AIM-9Xs which are some of the best. Also the F-35s radar would allow its missiles to shoot from crazy impressive ranges
@@MANTUEFLIE2 aim9x is heat seeking no one will get that close the aim-120 is what’s going to score all the kills
@@MANTUEFLIE2 Sidewinder? lol, those are crap missiles with way too short range for any serious enemy. Meanwhile still super expensive.
@@miriamweller812”those are crap” citation needed
Su 57 confirmed jet fighter killer
F 22 confirmed hot air balloon killer
That's quite an achievement considering Su-57s haven't been in **actual** combat (simulated bombing runs in Syria don't count), let alone aerial combat with other aircraft. They're not even in service at an operational level yet. They're still in development hell.
@@PopulismIsForBottomFeeders yeah true dude, Cuz su 57 confirmed Ukrainian fighter jet kill was in belgorod october last year against western air defense in Ukraine. while f22 has been around since ages but no real combat. Only for show
The lack of opportunity means absolutely nothing about capability.
This logic you’re using is childish.
@@KabodaOfficial get out with not having opportunity, f 22 was launched on 2005. They had multiple chance to use it on the frontline. But that did not. It was never a frontline jet. They even produce a documentary on that and multiple article has been publish on reason and problem with f22 and why they retiring f22 and replaced it with f35.
It not really battle tested. Its a good logic. Just like how leopard was so good on paper, but got destroyed on battle field. And how challenger2 was so go on paper but was to heavy for ukraine soil. How s 400 was so good on paper but have loop hole. How switch blade was good on paper but get radiojam. How jadam er was good on paper. But got jam. How russian ak 12 was good on paper. But russia didnt proceed with replacement.
Active battle testing is crucial and it is logical. You butthurt because your favourite plane get criticise is the children behaviour.
Can you name a conventional foe the US has faced in aerial combat since 2005 that necessitates the use of the F-22?
The F-22's issue was not capability, but cost and logistics, the F-35 is also not replacing it, that is a different aircraft with a different role.
Not battle tested means nothing in terms of equipment, that term applies to humans, not steel. A gun can be sat on a table for a decade, it may not have proved it's lethality - that say's nothing about it's capability, and instead - it's lack of opportunity.
The Challenger 2 was used in Iraq to great success, it has not proven to be an issue in Ukraine thus far.
The soldier is good on paper, but then the bullet exists - does this make soldiers redundant?
Your logic is that the F-22 is bad because it hasn't been used, that logic makes absolutely no sense and is quite childish, I am not American, and my own country does not use the F-22, nor is it my favourite plane. I simply can't stand seeing such utter nonsense being spouted.
I don't know how this is so hard to understand, and your answer to my first question will make it very clear why the F-22 hasn't seen action in air to air combat.
It's a pretty airplane. Have a few in my model collection. But it is more of a stepping stone. If even it's able to be learned from.
agreed, as much as we can all agree its not fit for the performance standards that today's environment demands, it is undeniably beautiful
If I'm mistake the 57 and the Chinese J-20 had about the same start for development, their first flights were a year apart, with the Felon flying first. Yet there are a lot more of the Chinese J-20's in service. Seems to me that Russia has more issues than just the design.
It’s so advanced that it still uses engines from the 80s
It doesn't though
Actually the stealth on the Su-57 is so good that its never been seen in the wild.
Whatever else turns out to be true about the PAK-FA (as I'll always think of it)--it's one sexy-ass aircraft.
True, good looking, not so great working
Where did Tom Clancy say the line at the beginning of the video I can't find the source of the quote
What about the huge IR signature from the engine nozzles not being cover and cooled?
Let's give it it's due people, that's the best damned 4th gen fighter out there
Not when F-15EX, Eurofighter Typhoon, and Rafale exist.
Hell, I'd even take the Grippen over the SU 57.
@@genericgamer9910 85 million 4.5 gen? Really?
@@lwgrazi Pricey but at least it's more available and maintainable
Yeahno
Ayy nice video! I dont want to defend the SU-57 but the screws/rivets showing on the outside was a prototype model, still doesnt change the fact that any production variant would be hot garbage. Some good points were made in the video and in general was enjoyable to listen to :) Glad i found your channel
it was designed as a stealth killer rather than a stealth fighter
The F-117 was not accompanied by the usual electronic warfare aircraft nor SEAD aircraft as per doctrine. There were no other planes or birds in the sky, and the radar was able to look for as long as it wanted to with no fear of reprisal and minimal interference from other airborne targets. So the F-117 didn't fail. It was an operational failure, and I don't believe that the F-117 carried countermeasures.
Idk what your talking about, its a great stealth aircraft, I've never seen one in the air :D
😅
It’s so stealthy even the Russian Air Force hasn’t seen one!
Anyone else notice all the riveting not being flush on the Felon? It might have only been the initial prototypes, but if not, that doesn't bode well.
Well, it's not likely that they are capable of doing it for a fleet of planes if they can't with 1.
Yeah I saw that. Something the west started doing en masse almost a century ago at this point, the Russians still aren't able to utilize at scale today. Wtf?
Maybe it's supposed to be like that so they can put RAM putty over the screws - that's what we did on the HAVE BLUE prototype and the F-117. Not that there's any proof that they ever tried to do this.
The rivets are not visible on the serial production models they were only on the prototype.
@@voidtempering8700 What are serial production models? There's like 10 of them.
They could be the best plane in the world (they aren't) and it wouldn't matter. They won't get past the first waves of A2A missiles and "Loyal Wingman" AI drones. There's simply not enough of them to matter.
The rest of the Russian air force is going to be used as cannon fodder to protect them.
That’s why Indian Air Force ditched the project and went ahead with their domestic project.
When India won't buy your plane because of its ancient avionics you're worthy of all the jokes...
I'm officialy declaring your channel discovery of the month, excellent videos man, great job! :)
You seem extremely well educated and well researched. I'll definitely be returning to your channel often. Also the SU-75 Femboy likely won't be much better
Unless he is the planes engineer. He doesn’t know anything about the plane and is just going off of propaganda.
@@FXIIBeaver Okay Vatnik
you unironically watch fox. Your opinion on what is and is not propoganda is literally invalid to me
@@the_legendary_vin I love how you just assume a whole bunch about me, and it took you two comments?
@@FXIIBeaver I can literally see your subscriptions mate
Thank you for that information.
LOL... Love your comments on those pesky bubbles in the canopy!!
Hey there, Creator, ive just found your content and I immediately love it. The sources you use are fairly good and the facts you present show clear and concise evidence. Def earned a sub from me. ❤
The Su-57's competitor is the F-22. The F-35 is a dedicate ground-attack aircraft. It simply is so damn advanced that it also dominates at air superiority and scouting. Which should make people wonder how godlike the F-22 must be at air-superiority and the F-35 must be at ground attack.
The Su-57 would likely lose in a fight to the F-35 as well. Sorry, but RCS is the most important thing. The F-35 is simply smarter and stealthier than an Su-57.
The F-35 is not a dedicated ground-attack aircraft, it's a multirole aircraft.
@@DogKacique was going to comment this. The F-35 is definitely a multirole. The SU-57 is a no role.
>F-35
>dedicated ground attack aircraft
So you don't know shit about either of these aircraft
@@wadopotato33Not just RCS, but all the advanced sensors and jamming equipment on the F-35. It totally outclasses the Su-57 in that regard. And it’s not THAT much worse at dogfighting either, since those air show maneuvers don’t really factor into a real fight. The F-35 sustains energy in a turn better than any fighter except the F-22, and can maintain absurd AOAs even without thrust vectoring. It is much more maneuverable than people give it credit for.
SU-57, the T-14 Armata of the skies
One thing is stealthy about the Felon, I can't find anything good about it.