Over Rev'd 292 Inline 6 Tear-down - What will I find inside? EP.15
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- Опубліковано 3 лис 2024
- None of the problems I find inside this engine are what I expected. And I doubt seriously any of the problems I did find were due to being over rev'd. But I'm glad I found at least one problem now. Left unaddressed, it could have done a lot more damage.
You can’t just blame the cam. I’m retired mechanic have rebuild gas diesel engines all my career of all kinds. It’s hard to put your finger on just one thing. If the valve spring was weak well there you go. Or if the cam was soft ok then there you go. Including the roller lifter even though it may look good. If the pin in that roller lifter was a little loose it would cause a high rpm chatter causing the cam to start to wear away at a certain rpm. The cure for it would be to replace the parts involved in that rotating line of movement. There are so many variables to rule out. So replace the lifter cam valve spring making sure that it is checked and followed through in installing in going back together. I really like watching a man going through the same things that I did for 50 years. Hang in there you can do it. Now let me watch the rest of your video……
I had a 460 built. Got it back, and had a shop install it. The thing would shake like mad and turn the exhaust red hot at about 55 mph. After checking some things, I suggested to the engine builder that it was a bad cam. He didn't believe it, but after checking everything else (and then some, cuz he didn't want it to be the cam), I finally told him to pull the damn cam. Keep in mind, this was a van, so it was a pain in the ass. He swapped a different cam in and those problems went away. But since it was a van, it was hard to work on, so from then on, it leaked oil around the intake manifold. Just saying, bad cams happen.
The reason for the lines in the mains is debris being pumped through. The reason it's worse at the front and better at the rear is the oil feeds from the front to the rear.
I would have thought that also, except the oil pump didn't show any signs that it was moving any material.
@@SquaredAwayGarage oil pump has hardened gears in it, the bearings are soft in comparison and are designed to be sacrificial wear items.
I know the cam was delaminating. So the material was from it. But it had to be very fine. Outside of some very fine "glitter' I didn't find much. I caught it early thank goodness.
Do you think removing the bosses for the lump port had anything to do with the warpage? I'm building a 292 with a Ryan Falconer V-12 head (12 port crossflow 340I/220E). I have a billet crank, billet solid roller cam and steel billet rods by Crower. 6-71/NOS. duel Quick Fuel 650 DP. 5 stage dry sump. Electromotive direct fire EMS. For me Crower has been a joy to work with. Crower told me it was the first billet crank they had ever made for a 292. I have the engineering fees to prove it. The next guy will get it for about half of what I had to pay. Your welcome. Thank you for your time.
No, I don't think that was the cause. The current thinking is that there wasn't enough air flow on the dyno. Even though the engine never indicated a temp of more then 200 degrees, it is believed that it may have heat soaked badly. That is my primary reason for not putting it back on a dyno. It was street tuned this spring after being reassembled.
Alot of $$ for a turd
Wow that's an incredibly Clean Machine Shop they must be real professionals there 😁
Yes. They. Are!
If they are that good they are probably self- taught.
Your videos are very clear especially with the close ups.
Thank you!
Good video but the music is too loud to hear you speak
Dumb question...did you seal the head bolts that go into the water jacket?
Now I'll watch the rest of the video.
Not a dumb question really. I didn't build this engine originally. But during disassembly I found thread sealant where it should be.
Major bummer. Good job of not spitting out a lot of working words!
Maybe one or two off camera.
Seen a lot of engine videos, most of them rebuilding old dirty engines.Clean oil passages,line up cam oiling bearings.cant always see clogged passages.
It's sad to see a roller cam going like this, roller cam should be life time warranty.. I almost bougth this cam too, but i've decided for comp cams hydraulic flat taped cam because of cost benefit. My engine has many parts from Tom, like Ross pistons, comp rocker arms, and lump ports, they are all good, my only doubt is about spring pressure, but its was not beehive.
The cam definitely wasn't due to over reving it. I haven't said much about it yet (next video) but Crower did see it as a warranty issue and agreed it was a heat treat or material issue.
I think the '78 Custom Deluxe we owned for almost ten years had a 292 in it. My father sold it to a coworker who put the engine in an F100. It had just over 200k on it, and I think he ran the thing up to 600k before he got rid of the truck.
Not likely, since a 292 is GM, and an F100 is a Ford, but possible. Stranger engine swaps have been done.
Blow them out good with air and cleaner,clogged oil passages would heat it up pretty good.ask others for opinion!
The springs are right, but is the spring installed height on the heads 1.8"?
No electronic rev limiter? Any prevention to keep it from over revving? Builidng a 292 currently and want to avoid this happening
It actually did have electronic limiting set in the ECU when it rolled into the tuner that day. He looked at the tune from the previous guy and wanted to start over. I agreed and didn't think to make sure that he duplicated that setting. I had gone to the bathroom when he hit it hard.
Always mill heads. And block, i have no problems when i do especially on SBC s , 1 head will be bowed , 1 will be twisted , probably because of uneven heat distribution in the block ?
All of that was done by the original engine builder, and was done again during rebuild. Some sort of heat issue had to have been the problem, but I honestly couldn't tell you when it ever got hot enough that there was potential for a problem. The engine temp pretty much stays solid at 180, with the exception of the winter months when it struggles to warm up. The cooling system is set up for summer when the truck is on the road. It cools the engine extremely well.
Were your pushrods straight? You won't get a smashed lobe on a simple over rev.
Pushrods were straight. Didn't have a smashed lobe.
Can you do a video explaining the differences between the 292 and 250. How to identify, what parts interchange, what speed parts are available, and what are the weak points? I can’t seem to find any videos explaining chevy’s late inline six.
I should probably do a video like that! But since I don't have anything in the works, I'll suggest that you checkout the "GM Inline 6' Facebook page instead. There is a lot of information there.
@@SquaredAwayGarage thank you, I’ll go check them out.
Hey buddy I've been watching you for a while I got a couple questions for you is that the original motor that came out of that truck and if it is the motor mounts on the block do you know where I can get us out of those at or what kind they are and might help with maybe the year of the truck if it's the same year block and motor and stuff So if you could please help me out I'd really appreciate it thank you sir
Get on the GM Inline 6 FB page or your choice of I6 page and ask if anyone has a set of 292 mounts for your year of truck. My truck originally had a 250 in it. I got the 292 motor mounts out of a local salvage yard. They are more common in the C20's.
Now that I have watched the rest of your video and see that the rest of the cam lobes are damaged. I would have to say the engine has been ran very hard. But maybe you did not do that and if so you have cam problems big time. But looking at it it shows chatter in high rpm. If you have not done that then stress it very hard to the cam people. I think they will give you another complete cam with the lifters and valve springs. BUT check your valve springs very carefully. Now if you had your motor built then you need to get the builder on your side. Good luck as they say.
The cam manufacturer checked the cam, and it was bad. They suspected a bad heat treat. We weren't sure if we were getting a good reading when we were testing the hardness, but they got similar readings.
@@SquaredAwayGarage awlsome!
Tom should make good on the cam leave nothing for doubt
Hey buddy sorry to bother you again I got a couple questions for you where did you get that distributor at and where did you get that harmonic balancer at and your water thermostat at and I got another couple questions for you Will 250 parts fit on a 292 parts or will 292 parts put on a 250 part motor
Some 250 and 292 parts will interchange. For instance you can interchange the heads. They are the same except the newest 250s have what is called an "integrated" head. On the other hand you would not want to put a 250 harmonic balancer on a 292. My harmonic balancer was purchased from Summit. The distributor is a custom made item. And the thermostat housing is from MrHotRod6.
The heads are the same, as are the tining gears, the front cover, the rocker cover. The smaller 6s water pump and thermostat housing will bolt up, but you never try to use them on a 292.
@@michaelbenardo5695 thank you
Probably not the cam!! it's the lifters which flake on the edges of the crowns.
It was the cam. Crower confirmed it.
Okay. To bad cams an lifters are failing all the time. I'm retired from my earliest memories of my dad and then my okder brothers and me new cans and lifters never failed. Some soft mid seventies Chevy cams failed usually 30 to 50 k miles then things stayed good until recently..PS almost no one ever did came break in. Put some cam lube or grease on the engines after a rebuild some set the idle up let the engine run a couple hours in frame. Changed oil an filter reset valve lash/ lifter . Check timing carbs and drive and forget. Seems Things are much more difficult now. My thoughts and experiences for What Little they are worth.
Any updates on the cam?
Did you use any special break-in procedure with the roller cam? If so, which oil(s) did you use?
No news just yet. Hopefully soon. No special break-in required for a roller cam.
@@SquaredAwayGarage how about now, anything back from the manufacturer?
@GIITW.5OKC The cam manufacturer (Crower) was not able to get the cores for the long 6 cyl cams at the time this was all going on. They did give my original engine builder a full refund since he purchased the cam from them. He had stage 3 cams on the shelf that he was willing to give me. But he felt it necessary to make money on the situation, so it wasn't a straight up warranty situation. I think if Crower would have been able to replace the cam at the time, it wouldn't have cost me anything. Needless to say I wasn't impressed with the builder.
What rockers are you running? I’ve been having a hard time finding a set that will work with my turbo 292
The rockers where in the engine when I picked it up from the builder. I can't say for sure, but I suspect they are Crane maybe. Most companies that offer cams over lifters and rockers to go with them. Check with your cam manufacturer and see if they can help you.
Good luck
It's all back together and running like a champ now.
nice video
Thank you
It’s obvious the cam is bad or the wrong spring pressure. Your video could be edited to more b roll to shorten it.
Do you know if that is the stage 4 cam Tom's sells or a different one. I bought the stage 4 but haven't got to run her yet (I'm about 2-3 months out) and I'm very curious about your turn out. Also curious what piston heads you're running.
My cam is a stage 2. He suggested that I wouldn't like the 3 or 4 for street use. I assume you're building a race engine?
I'd like to drive it often but it looks like it's heading in that direction. Turbo, large CAM, 18cc heads, lump kit, enlarged valve train, 3/8 pushrods, and balanced everything.... I just realized my son has taken over my Google account, 😆....Anyway, sounds like it may be a bit more aggressive than I initially thought but I guess we'll see.
Is the spring coil binding?
They were not. But the VTG was incorrect due to improper pushrod length from the builder.
Background music makes it very hard to hear what he’s saying.
Understood. At the time that video was made I was attempting to use a feature that turned out not to work very well. Nothing I can do about it now.
UA-cam must be acting up. Every few minutes the video skips 1 or 2 seconds backwards...
I'm about a 3rd of the way through with no issues? How often were you see it?
@SquaredAwayGarage Kinda often. I'm actually thinking it's buffering, but I've never watched a video that's buffered like this. May have something to do with my cellular connection, but usually I don't have issues on 5G. As long as I get to watch to the end I can deal with it.
@@SOU6900 I believe you are correct. I watched it all the way through and didn't see any skipping. Hope you made it through and enjoyed it.
How do u clean your engines?
The engine was chemically/hot tank cleaned by the builder originally. It has since been done again for the rebuild.
We don't want music, we want to here all about the engine. Also, looks like you have the wrong water pump for a 292.
You're correct. It's a 250 pump. And the block was drilled for the bypass.