History of WWI Primer 038: Austro-Hungarian Mannlicher 1886 to 1888-90 Documentary
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- Опубліковано 21 сер 2024
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Othais and Mae delve into the story of this WWI classic. Complete with history, function, and live fire demonstration.
C&Rsenal presents its WWI Primer series; covering the firearms of this historic conflict one at a time in honor of the centennial anniversary. Join us every other Tuesday!
Link to the shirts: www.candrsenal...
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Othais and Mae delve into the story of this WWI classic. Complete with history, function, and live
fire demonstration.
C&Rsenal presents its WWI Primer series; covering the firearms of this historic conflict one at a
time in honor of the centennial anniversary. Join us every other Tuesday!
Model 1886
Cartridge: 11x58mmR
Capacity: 5 rnds
Length: 52"
weight: 10lbs
Model 1888/90
Cartridge: 8x50mmR
Capacity: 5 rnds
Length: 50.4"
weight: 9.9lbs
Additional reading:
Die Hand- und Faustfeuerwaffen der habsburgischen Heere
Erich Gabriel
Repetier- und Automatische Handfeuer Waffen
Konrad Edler von Kromar
Mannlicher Rifles and Pistols (tranlated from above)
Walter H. B. Smith
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Music provided by Melissa Hyman of The Moon and You
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Safe range space thanks to Shoot Logic
www.shootlogic....
In collaboration with The Great War
/ thegreatwar
Additional photos thanks to Rock Island Auction
Ammunition data thanks to DrakeGmbH
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"[The Boxer Rebellion] was the imperial social event of the century and every army that was any army had to be there. it was so embarassing if you didn't go and shoot at Chinese people."
So many great Othais quotes this episode.
go me
ya hear it was big.
ya hear it was a big event eh?
If you read anything on the Boxers they deserved it. They were thugs and bullies.
@@AlexKS1992 and the western powers in China weren’t bullies too? China was a violent mess back then (still is a mess but for entirely different reasons)
"Imperial social event of the century."
Bring your best uniform!
@@Candrsenal Und pickelhaube!
@@Candrsenal Please enable Persian subtitles for all your work.
@@Candrsenal gonna get that new Stahlhelm drip
@@Candrsenal and your newest rifle
Austro-Hungarian reaction to the 71/84 was spot on xD
Yes, they adopted a repeater.
Love the shot when Mae shoulders the '86... Gotta love a big bore...
"that's gonna hurt..... you could loose a war.... "..... love it.
Elbows are important.
I cant wait for the patent to run out on the Pokey Hand.
I'm gonna make bank selling generic 'Pointy Hands'
good plan.
"Old dirty Ferdy" had me rolling.
Did you hit any furniture?
"I like the smell of black powder"
- Mae 2016
yes
Is it better than napalm?
@@hangonsnoop Or Cordite?
@@hangonsnoop considering something's dead and not suffering agony, yes
About to go to bed, but 1hr video on old school small arms? Rip sleeping schedule
We hardly knew thee....
my bad
History classes by Othias and Mae. I love you guys. Your channel goes into so much depth!!! Highly informative!!!
Thanks!
I really like all of the context you give to each gun design. The company history, designer bio, military trials and adoption, etc.. It's one thing to just make a "review" of the gun, and many gun channels stop there, but you guys really go the extra mile and teach the history of firearms. Reminds me of the old "tales of the gun" documentary series I used to watch as a kid, back when history channel was a channel about history.
That time seems like a distant memory now
What I really like about these rifles is the magazine system. While it was a compromise from what Mannlicher originally wanted, it works. Also when the clip falls from the magazine. it acts as a warning to the shooter that they are on the last cartridge BEFORE you pull the trigger. In the chaos of war things like this helps you keep your composure for continuing to fire and replace magazines. It also doesn't fly up with a loud "ping" like the M1 Garand, which can alert nearby enemies that you are changing magazines. Great video as always.
Robert Neal seeing a silent clip falling from your rifle during a battle isnt going to happen due to the fact your aiming down sight and the rifle will block that view. During the time of the M1 war was so chaotic that that little ping sound would be the last thing you hear because you know screaming gun shots artillery.
I agree with Krisobro98, M1 Garand are battle rifles, they are not meant for commandos anyway.
and that's WW2, not WW1 where commando operations were not invented tactically.
The Garand clip ping is an absolute myth. No one can hear your ping in battle, the enemy does not recognize the sound, and even if you are out of ammo, your other 9 squad mates aren't. Please stop repeating this horrible lie
I disagree. The M1 was far more reliable than the g41 or g43. It was also more accurate than the svt40. It's easier to load an M1 too
jpc1918 it was the type 38 arisaka.
Maybe in the future you guys could do a "Mae's top 10 rifles", "Othais top 10 handguns" and some other short things like these :)
|T-Bside| Jey XP Maybe not a top ten because everyone and their dad has made one of those already.
We will do some sort of recap episode but probably not "top ##." They do well on UA-cam but I feel like those rankings often lack nuance.
C&Rsenal Mayhaps you could do a "favorites series" also, not necessarily the best rifles. I would just like to see what Mae and Othais' favorite weapons are.
The reichsrevolver would definitely win.
I like the current format and don't want any manpower taken away from it
Thanks for this amazing video about the grandfathers of the M95. Since I'm Austrian, it's always exiting for me to watch vids about austrian military rifles. Own 3 M95's (1 rifle and 2 carbines, 8x56 mmR) myself and boy are they fun to shoot. Also I'm already looking forward to your Werndl and M95 videos ;)
Good to hear you're enjoying it! M.95's are next.
thanks :D
Discovered your channel a few days ago. As an Austrian who is mostly into hunting with classic rifles (especially Mannlicher-Schönauers) but also has great interest in history of firearms and WWI, I must say your research and knowledge is awesome. I knew about all these guns and names but not in that depth and context. Thank you for doing this, keep up the great work.
Not sure if you knew this, "Schritt" means "step" or "pace", in this particular case it means "footstep". An Austrian Schritt equals to 0,8 meter, I don´t think it has anything to do with the anglo-american imperial system. It´s an old unit mostly used by the military. (And up to this day sometimes hunters use it to describe an estimated distance, for example saying: "I shot that deer at a distance of about 100 steps".)
The bicycle ring got me.
I am still at a loss as to how these people can create such long videos and keep them interesting throughout. Props.
Dumb luck
Blood Sweat and Tears :D
Mannlicher is such a amazing man i love him and this gun.
me 2
Hey you nailed the pronunciation of the names Franz and Josef and also the Waffenfabrik congratulations, now you have unlocked the inner German achievement. :D
Also thank you and Mae (hopefully I wrote that right) for the great content. I always wondered about the development during and just before WW1 for small arms.
"Watch out for Prussia, holy crap!" Should come with its own little video like "War were declared". Would also make a great t-shirt with Othais' and Mae's faces going AAAAHH! and the C&Rsenal logo and website.
I'd need a better catch phrase on that....
It's a good one as is IMO. When I heard it on this video, I thought "hey he says that in a lot of videos". So it's catchy.
I am really enjoying these! Keep em' coming!
ok
Josef Werndl had a lovely moustache, just saying :)
right?
Sometimes I go back and rewatch my favorite episodes, this is one of them. I think it’s time to redo the mannlicher series!
You know, I stayed up late working last night, all the while hoping to see the new upload, and mere moments after I relent and go to sleep, you post. Oh this fickle game you play Othais.
render time is a bitch
These have been my favorite looking rifles and I've wanted to learn much more about them. Thank you for putting this out.
We're glad you enjoyed it!
Oh Yes...I have been waiting for this one.
I mean, I've been waiting for all of them, but I've been anticipating this one especially.
How did it go?
Awsome. "Ol' Dirdy Ferdy" Mannlicher was a genius.
Best line of today, "That's gotta hurt. You could lose a war."
well....
I haven't seen every episode yet but this is by far my absolute favorite and you guys are amazing
You guys (and gals) do such great quality work in weapons' education. I am pleased to view and subscribe.
Happy to have you!
Such incredible detail in the presentation, lovely!
It's great to see a more elaborate explanation like these because it gives ppl who aren't familiar with the condition of the time some idea as to why countries did what they did at the time.
some ppl for example could not understand why every country didn't just convert all their primary rifle to use detachable magazine the moment the tech was available...
concepts like resource, time, and general cost at a national scale is not something a lot of ppl have an idea and can imagine and it's great that we get these kind of things mentioned here to help them understand that it's often not as simple and straightforward as it seems.
Also that previous generations might well have known what was ideal
I'm still cleaning up the mess from when my head exploded upon learning the ejecting en bloc clip design wasn't original to the Grarand.
"Dirty Ferdy"
Brilliant
This is my new fav channel
You nailed the pronouciation of gesellschaft by the way!
ANCAP!
Suh dude
ProjectD13X ancoms >>>>ancaps
4
This was an amazing video, I really wish we could get a full video on the Werndl-Holub single shot rifle, specifically it's History in Persia (Austria Hungary tried to supply Persia's Military for a while).
There will be one.
"You could lose a war"
Ever shoot expensive gin out your nose Othias? I don't recommend it.
Liquor Netty Pot.
Sounds painful
@@baanimations3689 i dont wanna imagine
It always amazes me that just some grooves, or in the Mannlicher's case, a wedge, can support a freaken rifle cartridge firing in a pressurized barrel with breaking, bending or flying open.
Take a look at the Degtyarev (?) 28 machinegun.
Glad to see that 3d animations are here to stay.
I liked this one a lot.
I'm glad you're glad you like my work :)
Can't wait until the Gewehr or Mannlicher M95. Looking forward to seeing what is different ergonomically and functionally.
already prepped.
Okay, so one of these days, you've got to hold out your hands as you say "And THIS" and the gun just falls down into them. Sort of like those Old Spice commercials. *Ahem* On a more serious note, I love your channel.
Hope I'm not the first to say: "You could lose a wart!" is one of the best lines I have so far heard on this here t'internet.
An hour long video on election day, thank god.
Yeah, it's been a crazy season.
You really should look into selling your voice for other dubbing/recording work. Another GREAT video. Thanks guys!
ok, this is different from the usual Kermit complaints
Ah words to live by
"Watch out for Prussia holy crap"
They never learn XD
werd
Thank you Mae
You two are a great team! Also treated the country where I was born with respect (not everyone does) ....you didn't mention that the Austrian K.u.K army was considered an "operetta army" by the huns to the north. Anyway, I watched the whole thing beginning to end and never felt bored! At some points in my life I was sniffing around the thought of acquiring a Steyr Mannlicher rifle...but then what? having it hanging there? I was in the Austrian military and didn't like it that much.... By the way you might perhaps mention that the Steiermark....the province where they were made has a steel making tradition that reaches back into ..well the iron age. The first higher quantity steel production for swords, tools and armor in the middle ages took place there due to the local very suitable iron ore deposits. Thanks again! Great video!!!
Your pronunciation of "Jose Manuel Balmaceda" was flawless, very impressed!
Man you're the best! Keep this up!
Btw, every time you grunt i think to myself "now that's a dad noise right there"
The "poum tata" music ine the background when Mae shoots, it is soooo Austrian. I feel like in a village party, drinking Puntigamer beer all afternoon with leather short pants.
This episode definitely needs to be reworked
15:57 Glorous, just glorious.
3:33 ''Joseph and Franz Werndl & Company, Arms Factory and Sawmill''
Up there with "Anaheim, Azuza & Cucamonga Sewing Circle Book Review and Timing Association"
Jan & Dean -
Love the idea of looking forward to future episodes.Great work you guys.
If you're happy, we're happy. and busy.
"Give it a rather hearty yank."
-Othias 2016
I had a hess truck as a child. One of my favorite toys.
*Oh. Oh yes.*
Eric Brown Getting Man licked, huh?
Fantastic presentation as usual! Serbian Djuric Mauser m80/07C episode I hope one day
I don't think there is one in the US?
IIRC someone on gunboards had one in pretty bad state however.
there was someone who had one i decent shape but have not responded to my PM or been active in a few years. MMROTW will have the name of the person who lent thers to be photographed for the book
This channel is great. Keep up the good work!
Thank you, we'll try.
I love when you say "War Were Declared".
25:30 Yeah I got a nasty blood blister the first time I pulled the bolt out of my 88/95.
every. time.
Saw one of these in a museaum in georgia (country). Apperently used in the 1905-7 revolution
I love your series! Please carry on into the wars after WWI!
We will but that's a long way away.
What song is being played while Mae was firing? o3o also ah crap, it's Prussia.
Kärntner Liedermarsch
Straight-pull rifles are fun to shoot. Good review as always.
Thanks!
Well...seems like no history lesson from this Korean history/gun nut this episode. This one was - to say the least - very educational since I had not deeply dug into the history of the Mannlicher rifles. Oh and I do have two questions regarding small arms of navies around the world. One, were there a lot of firearms that were designed/fielded specifically to naval troops? And two, were carbine variants of a standard army rifle issued to naval troops in order to save costs or etc? And the reason why I ask these two is because I signed up for the Navy. Thanks for the video and keep up the good work!
Jack the Korean History/Gun nut
Actually there is a fairly long history of Naval landing forces being test beds for new technology. Navies generally had budgets that included MASSIVE singular costs to the small arms I guess always seemed cheap. They didn't have to plan for sustained campaigns so the notion of repeaters didn't bother them as much.
Cost would be the major issue in unifying with the Army. Standardization of ammo, duplication of training materials, parts etc.
C&Rsenal Ah...now I understand. Looking at examples such as the German naval Lugers the picture becomes much more clear. Thanks for the reply Othias! :D
Well done as usual. You spoil us.
its great to see the derpy Austrian straight pull get some love
Derpy? The thing rocks
oh yeah it does- I love the design- its just looks a little derpy compared to a mauser for instance
Another good'n! Thanks for the work and effort.
Thanks for watching!
Want to say that your animation was quite sophisticated.
Thanks!
Great series! So informative and entertaining.
The detachable box magazine was invented by American John Paris Lee for his 1879 bolt action rifle (Remington Lee Model 1879). The Navy bought them and issued them with 4 magazines; chambered in 45-70.
I am aware and did not say this was the first. I said he put it to the Austrians ahead of anyone else
I'm lucky enough to have the M95 Styer and Hungarian. Both of the carbines. I paid $89 for each about 6 years ago. They look brand new! Cleaned the cosmoline and almost had a stroke with the great condition. Those run about $250 now. I lucked out.
Nice
I need to start a straight pull collection. These are soo cool!
do it
Yay good bye sleep
What's that?
sorry
@@Candrsenal Forgiven and encouraged to continue,
What's your primary source of ammunition for oddball rounds like 11x58r? I'm sure there's a lot of hand loading involved but who makes brass for those rounds?
The brass is made by Bertram.
15:44 Best part of the video. :)
My Muchly cherished Mannlicher,
Soon will be the time for you, again to roar
And Your deadly bolts, to unleash upon our foe
The time will come, up there in our Alexanders Land,
That you will feast upon glory, victory and holy task
Every blazing bolt enemy and foe, to pierce
And our brothers, enslaved hearts, courage and consolation, thouroughly, to fill
Like your first born elder brother
Caryophile the saturnine
That our friends trully cherished
And our enemies, detest
Such the Mannlicher i crave, is, merciless like Aprils hail
So the Great along with Small, will know that Greece
The Land of heroes, still remain!
(Atlantis, year 18th. No.2.868
New York, Monday August 21st, 1911)
James Paris Lee patented the detachable box magazine back in 1879, a couple of years before Mannlicher touted the idea.
Watchin Mae firing rifles at least as long as she is tall is a hoot.
Was about to head to bed, well that's now out of the question.
I'M UP YOU'RE UP
Some people just give their soldiers something cheap and easy to produce. But Ferdinand Mannlicher, he cares about his soldiers. Where some people try to simplify their weapons, Ferdinand Mannlicher escalates things, and just invents a new rifle. Ferdinand Mannlicher, the Soldiers best friend.
othais you are one amazing and funny dude, keep up the good work
Funny? I'm 100% serious man.
I think a person could sit and stare at your back wall for hours!
Having watched all of these episodes multiple times....I actually already have. Probably like a whole days worth of time.
In some of the longer videos, you do.
Are y'all ever gonna do an episode on the Kongsberg Colt? Or will that be included in your 1911 video?
I know how you feel, I'm norwegian so I kinda want them to do it... but I don't think it was used in WW1 :P
***** It's likely it'll be a primer for WW2, as the Germans would have the Norwegians make them a bunch later.
Or it will get a mention in the 1911 episode.
TheGoldenCaulk Doubt it, wasn't used in WW1. At most it will get a mention on the 1911 Episode.
"That little upstart empire"
I lol'd
Own an 1888, never been able to shoot it but I love it
It is interesting that the original Mannlicher straight-pull was a wedge lock. Did James Paris Lee use the same idea in his Winchester-Lee straight pull? His wedge lock was extremely strong, being able to with-stand cartridges of 60,000 psi.
Really neat video, thanks for the history
My father found a rifle of these on an abandoned ranch, it was used in the war of 1890 in Chile...
U.S. patent: 221328. James P. Lee patented the detachable box magazine in 1879. I am sure you already knew that and will be doing an episode on his very well known and traveled British rifle in the futhre.
The emphasis is a bit different, don't worry.
Another classic. You guys are out doing yourself from episode to episode. Mae showing up in Othais-clothing at the end was a nice touch. I too appreciate a pistol grip on my rifles. Have I mentioned I'm waiting for a SMLE presentation?
That's just her shirt?
Clearly you have a monopoly on flannel shirts
Thank you you Mae for all that standing there and then all that shooting you do for us .... We need more Mae yes more Mae and more shooting ... Yes Lots more Shooting
but how would you hear me talk?
Othias, I think you will find that those trucks were marketed by the state to help Hessian industry recover from WW II.
They are VERY closely related . 😁
The M1886 has a smooth action, just like the Krag, for one reason, ONE locking lug
A "schrit" was a pace, indeed Franz-Josef - as were the M91 Mosin Nagants. paces as well "arshins" but one of the Czars
for all the peasant farm bhoys in the infantry
I can't tell if may is looking so happy because of the big bore black powder or the semi-pistol grip.
At 3:35: "Josef and Franz Werndl & Co, SmallArms factory and Sawmill".
I did a little research on the Mannlicher M.88/24. From what very little intel I found, apparently they were made in small numbers by the Belgians who tried to surplus them to developing countries around the world. For reasons unknown, almost all of them were bought by the British who then loaned them to the Greeks in WW2. A small number were captured and used by the Italians in North Africa and later in the war, the German Volksturm. From what i heard they do exist and there are actually pictures of them but they are very rare.
Story is partially correct. It was a Yugoslavian conversion done with Belgian made barrels, just like much more known M.95/24 conversion. Yugoslavia sent some small arms to Greece as a help in late 1940/early 1941, paid by British. That is how you find Mannlicher M.88/24 and M.95/24 in Greece.
Bojan Kavedzic
Okay thank you for the correction. Like I said information on the M.88/24 is very scarce since it is a very obscure rifle.
Mannlicher's playing chess while everyone else's playing checkers.
Also that thing is comically big, reminds me of the scaled up BAR that ForgottenWeapons did a video on.
I dunno, Browning was pretty good.
Great work!
Thanks!
I just got one of these (88/90) in from RTI. I pulled the bolt out and found a pivoting, falling locking block locking lug on the bottom of the bolt and was like "What the hell have I got here!? Better learn more about it." so here I am. A takeaway would be that I should probably load black powder rounds for it and avoid any smokeless.
You can do that for safety's sake, but the 1888/90s were converted to smokeless, although the 8x50r was specifically downloaded to account for the weak action. If you can find original load data for 8x50r, there should be zero problem with smokeless. Plenty of people load it with smokeless and don't have any issues. The downloaded smokeless is similar in power to a .30-30. However, if you can't, the safer bet is the black powder.