Rust Removal Experiments: Citric Acid, Cider Vinegar, Rostio
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- A video about using citric acid, cider vinegar and "Rostio" for rust removal purposes.
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Holy cow, that vintage lathe you showed at the end looks so art deco, so thirties. From a time when even steel tools were made not to just work, but to be beautyful as well.
I really enjoy your videos. Your voice has an interesting effect on me. I hope you don't mind me saying... It cheers me up a lot, partly because it amuses me. It is a lovely voice, with a gentle and musical lilt - but it makes me smile.
What is as important as the wonderful delivery though, is the content and the information conveyed to the viewer, and this is of excellent quality too. Thank you for great entertainment. From one of your British fans. :-)
Very well put Martin. He just comes across as such a very nice bloke and certainly has wonderful ideals. Now more than ever we need people to teach us about recycling and re-use and he's a great teacher : )
Good video. I usually use Baking Soda mixed with Water to neutralize any acid that I use to clean rust off of metal. Works great for Citric Acid. Then rinse with water, dry and usually spray down with WD40 to stop flash rusting.
I have had very good results with 10:1 diluted molasses.
It takes weeks, so falls outside your parameters, but it is both gentle and very effective.
It allows you to treat rather large parts at reasonable cost and at the end you have sugary water, not hundreds of litres of acid.
I use destilled vinegar which is stronger (8º) and cheaper (0.50€/liter). You can make it work faster by heating it by the way.
Same. Quite cheap and effective. I let it go 24 hours. Plus, salt will turn it to hydrochloric for etching for plating.
Cleaning vinegar is stronger because it has 10-20% acetic acid instead of 2-5%
I've used citric acid numerous times in rust removal purposes. As a joiner, I mostly use it to derust hinges and so on in windows and doors. Anyways, citric acid doesn't eat the iron too much nevertheless if you use it for more longer period of time. When derusting tractors or cars, just add gypsum or plaster and "paint" it to somewhere.
About neutralizing, just wash with water and dip in thinner. Citric acid is used in agricultural so big bulks are available for cheap batches. Propably the _best_ rust removal method for every day use! My favorite method :p
If there's paint. Just make batch of water and lye and paint-be-gone for one day, next day just wash with water and submerge in citric acid. Wash with water and dip in thinner and after that just paint or oil the parts and that's all to it. Best way, and cheap!
Dont forget its not just rust removal, but for sharpening files for instance. Though i have run into interesting and rather annoying problem where after few uses acid starts to crystallize on the sides of the container and the part it self, witch after process wont continue in areas that are covered by it. To get over this issue i have another container with water, where file goes after crystals start to form, so those melt into water and i can continue sharpening process. After while even that water start to be acid so some sharpening can be done in that container. From my experience 4-5 files is max for minimum amount that covers the file, of a nearly 100% acid (so much that can melt on the water) and it takes 24hours to do its job, possible two days if there is serious damage on the file and one or two cleanings where black stuff is brushed off with brass brush.
20 minutes on some old lightly rusted spanners, excellent results. Thank you.
Seen people use fish tank heaters to keep the water warm which speeds u the process.
I use a plastic centrifugal pump from an evaporative cooler to recirculate the liquid in the tank. Works really well for the electrolysis, would probably help for citric acid as well. Only uses a few watts of power. Speeds up the process/makes the process more uniform. Great set of videos as usual.. Michael in Colorado.
Glad I have my centrifugal pump and evaporative cooler at the ready
Thank you for another informative video. My comments may be 3 years late, but for what they are worth ...
The gelatinous rust remover product used in California is called Naval Jelly, and its counterpart for aluminum corrosion is Aluminum Jelly. I have not used either, and don't know their chemical base.
Most of our liquid commercial rust removers are based on phosphoric acid, which works very well and leaves the metal looking black .
I commonly use vinegar, or acetic acid which is equally effective in the white or distilled form as cider vinegar. Since white vinegar is used as a cleaning agent, it is much less expensive, never more than $3.00 per gallon. You can afford to use it in quantity.
I have only recently learned of using citric acid, as it appears to be popular in European countries and Australia. I don't intend to change, as the white vinegar works and is inexpensive.
I have concluded that any of the common weak acids work as rust removers. Some may be less reactive than others, but what does that matter? Most of us are happy to leave parts soaking overnight, and when you consider the bulk of the tool, a little extra corrosion is negligible. These are weak acids and the metal they will dissolve is far less than that taken by the rust itself. Of course nitric, sulfuric, or hydrochloric acids in concentration would be a very different matter.
Thank you for giving those of us who haven't been exposed to the metric system enough to understand it right of the top of the head the information in gallons.
egal ob alte oder neue Videos, sie sind alle extrem sehenswert
Danke
You left out some info regarding your experimentation and I don't agree with you 100% on your conclusions, but this was my own take from my use of various methods of rust removal for Model A Fords and other makes. You didn't mention putting your clear plastic tray out into the direct sunlight. I can tell you that the process of rust removal works much better when that is done. Most of my parts are left outside for anywhere from a couple of hours to 3-7 days, with no real issues over any metal loss at all. Flash Rusting is the main culprit, but a lot of folk have cleaned up Model A carbs and left them on their shelves for years afterwards with no significant flash rusting noted. Oiling the part immediately after a water rinse seems to be the best result to stop the flash rusting, but if appropriate, painting or priming the part is also helpful.Apple cider vinegar is okay, but you can increase the acidity of the vinegar and there are UA-cam videos on how to do that. However, a better medium in my opinion is dry molasses which I generally use in my mix at a 4-5 scoops per gallon of water. Nothing else is required and this mixture can be poured into a flower bed with no problems, but I would not do so into a vegetable garden. It is a sludge mix after just a few hours and the odor is not too great, but it works very well for rust removal. Although I also use various mixes as my electrolysis mixture, the problem for electrolysis is all the equipment required. The vinegar or molasses mixture just requires mixing the brew, inserting the parts and then putting the clear plastic bin outside in the direct sunlight. The Texas hot sun does a wonderful enhancement to this process.I also frequently use a plastic kiddie pool to handle larger parts as fenders or engine block parts. They are cheap and easy to find for such a project.I am assuming that the Ristio is essentially the same as naval jelly and I have had little satisfaction with the use of that product over the years. Lye or Red Devil is easier to mix in water and use, but these chemicals are caustic and to me, dangerous If you have animals or kids about. Pool acid works, but it too is highly caustic, allows for more fumes and is a total danger to pets or kids when not supervised closely. The fumes from such can also entrap other metal items if left uncovered in a hot garage or such. I did that once with a Model A I was working on in my garage and got called away. I had pushed the open container of pool acid under a workbench thinking I'd be right back. Well, I forgot about it and it was about 3 days later when I opened up that garage. Everything inside the garage had flash rusting on any part which was not protected by paint. Over $10,000 in damage to that Model A, as even the chrome on the bumpers had turned into an ugly green goo and flaked off. Virtually every screw, nut and bolt was rusted over on that Model A Ford and it taught me a grand lesson in using acid of any kind to clean up car parts or other metal objects. Do not leave it unattended and in an enclosed area.I also had a unique experience with a bunch of screws I had put into a metal sieve and dipped into a vat of lye. The acid quickly ate the metal sieve away and dropped all the screws, nuts and bolts down to the bottom of the vat. Again, the lesson is to learn what the product may do to various types of metals and don't leave the mix unattended. It does not hurt to check the progress of any dip often, but the length of time the part is in a bath is likely not to ruin it by any real metal loss of significance. If a part still has rust after the bath, you can use stock oven cleaner and a wire brush to remove any additional scale. Even a quick once over with a sand blast medium can easily remove any residual rust the mix does not remove.Me, I prefer the dried molasses mixture over any of the products you use in your experimentation. It is cheaper and works every bit as well and often better than citric acid and such. These parts may develop a darker color once the mix brew is doing it's work, but most parts will ultimately be primed, oiled or painted anyway, so that is not a real issue.I am not knocking your experiments at all, but I have used these same products for over 40 years and this is what I feel about their use. My results are not experiments, but tried and true methods which worked best for restoration projects on vintage autos. As I said, you left out the idea that this mixture works best when used under the hot sunlight, but it sure does. Thanks for posting your results.
Great reply, but just one small point - lye is not acidic, it is alkaline.
Your sieve only dissoved because it is aluminium, you should have checked if it was aluminium before putting it in.
Sorry, I'm from the UK. What is this "hot sun" you speak of?
Great showcase. You show real examples, and you include details needed to ensure good results (ie pre soaking and wire brushing before using a chemical solution). Critics might complain "But that's not showing power chemistry!". I didn't notice the aluminum risk, but I'll re-run the vid to try and spot it.
To use less liquid put the part in a ziplock bag, pour in vinegar and squeeze out the air. Then submerge the bag in water. You get total coverage for way less liquid.
Vielen Dank. Most commercial rust removers available in hardware stores have phosphoric acid as the active ingredient. In English speaking countries, this product is referred to as 'Naval Jelly.' Most hardware stores will also sell 30% acetic acid vinegar as a cleaning agent. Combined with table salt, it's an effective rust remover, and good at polishing copper, bronze and brass. Both of these products are caustic, and generate slightly dangerous fumes. Thanks for mentioning the hydrogen gas, and further oxidation of the metal. The dark or black residue is FeO, which can be wiped off. For smooth surfaces, such as saw blades, I recommend using a paste wax as opposed to a machine oil. The wax won't attract dust and moisture, which lead to further rust. I will view your electrolysis experiment. Amazon accidentally sent me a spare packet (250g) of citric acid, which will now be used for rust removal. As my Bundeswehr roommate in Bosnia once advised me, "Zweimal messen, einmal schneiden."
Thanks for this little overview, though only a couple things apply here in the states. I have been restoring some old car parts made out of steel and it's good to know what I should use.
It's also really interesting to see what old tools you have, and what odd things you have found. Personally, I'd like to see a video detailing some of the stories of some of those odd, 100+ year parts you have.
The best rust removal product is called Naval Jelly. It's sold it he US, and was used for years on the rust that formed on navy ships. It's basically phosphoric acid. You paint it on, let it set, then wash it off
Did you make your vinegar?
In another video, he said the Rustio was like Naval Jelly. No matter what it is, shouldn't there be a list of active chemicals on the label?
I forgot the name of the stuff I use. It is phosphoric acid based too, but a liquid instead of a gel.
Yeah, phosphoric acid (smile)
Really Silky TP, the best? Ok, if you say so. NOT! UA-cam is filled so many armature's as yourself.
Some additional remarks: Could I have chose a different kind of vinegar? Yes. Could I have chosen a cheaper kind of vinegar? Yes. Could I have performed the same experiments with about a hundred other substances? Yes.
I really just picked some of the various substances that were recommended to me by the viewers. This is just a smaller project that is only a means to an end and stuff like this often just needs to get done in the shortest time possible.
An experiment with molasses rust removal will be shown in a future video.
There also could be more extensive tests using all kinds of substances in the future, but I want to finish the lathe restorationj and the EDM project first.
If you're interested in an ecological way of cleaning, just give a try to sodablasting. It's a bit like sandblasting but use baking soda (_Natriumhydrogencarbonat_ in german, i think) and it doesn't harm the part you have to clean (ex: will remove paint and rust on a car, but won't harm plastic joints nor glass from windows ;) ). The main difference with sandblasting is it requires a bigger airflow, so just be sure your air compressor is efficient and sufficient enough). UA-cam is full of videos about this process. Enjoy ! :)
The Post Apocalyptic Inventor have you tried Pine Sol? Im curious because im currently trying this technique trying to remove rust from my carburetor and videos on youtube show it works but my question, does the same principle apply for Pine Sol as it does for citric acid as to not leaving in solution for a long while? Thx
One other vinegar to try is distilled (or White) vinegar, cheap, plentiful and easily available in most places, it's the stuff they use when making cheap pickled eggs & onions and similar low-budget vinegar-pickled yuckiness... :)
Ramon Garcia I soak carburetors in it overnight and never had a problem.
I just de rusted some iron parts with white vinegar. i tried it with cold vinegar and with warm vinegar. The best was the warm vinegar, if i have to put a number on it i should say the warm vinegar is 4 times better then the cold...
Thanks for this. I'm just about to clean some old planes myself and bought liquid Rostio to do it. I'll try the citric acid method now first, because the Rostio was 20 EUR per litre. Thanks for sharing. Very well done, well structured and explained very clearly.
+Andreas Kalt You could try with dilute hydrochloric acid (Salzsaeure). You can get it from Baumarkt or Apotheke stores. It's cheap and stronger than citric so you can dilute it a lot. But take proper precautions with HCl, since it is strong stuff.
+Robert Seviour Thanks for the suggestion.
Thank you for the informative video. You can 't imagine how many videos are on UA-cam that DON'T give the mixture ratios!!! Thank you, Thank you, Thank you.
guten Tag! Thank you for your informative videos. Having worked in an electroplating shop for 10 years, I have restored multiple vehicles and engine parts using such resources. By trial and error, I have found that the solution didn't exist in cathodic / anodic cleaners or just straight acid / caustic reactions -- the secret to my success was the ultrasonic cleaner in a citric acid / soap solution. This offers no Hydrogen embrittlement issues (quite serious) and also if you add a brass part to the UC, the part will have a thin coating of Cu on the cleaned areas - ready for a flash coat of Cu or Ni to prevent further rusting.
Great video!
Evapo-rust! I use it for bike parts. Non toxic. I like that you pointed out dealing with parts you can't submerge.
I think that for normal people it's best to use citric acid as shown in the video!
I have recently bought an old vise which is caked in rust, I will also be zinc plating it through electrolysis.
These videos are a gem to us DIYers!
Very informative, thanks for going into rust removal with so much detail. This is definitely going into my "keep" drawer!
Just to share some info with you: I have been using citric acid off ebay (because cheap) to derust motorcycle tanks from inside. I have the impression that a surface should first be degreased (I use dish soap and water) and the loose rust removed (I use small SPAX screws and a cement mixer). After that, rust removal works quite well just as you described. concentrationwise I use 200g/L when I work at room temperature and 20g/L when I can heat up the solution to about 80°C. Note that the warmer the solution, the less concentration can be achieved, but the faster it "chooches", as AvE would say. If I wash out the tank with tap water after derusting I have found that the surfaces flash rust immediately. Since then I use acetone or isopropanol to wash out the tank after derusting. I have not yet found a homebrew DIY way to passivate the surface after succsessfully derusting it.
Im in the same boat, going a bit mad derusting my tank using citric acid, just to see the flash rust come as soon as i try to dry it. I need the tank to be bone dry so i can line it. Ive tried dumping baking soda and water in after to neutralize the acid, but it does not really do much. Did dumping a litre of acetone in the tank actually dry it all out??
@@kingkelly44 i have been using isoprop with sucsess. Multiple rinses, no need to fill the tank completely.
@@kingcasi75 Thanks. So you just wash out the isoprop with water, let it air dry, and no rust comes back? How long did you have to swish around the isoprop in there for?
@@kingkelly44 no, i wash out the remains of the citric acid with isoprop multiple times and let that flash off / dry
If you live close to any Polish shop, I would recommend using the Polish vinegar for de-rusting as it is 10%, not 5%. I leave the metal in the 10% vinegar overnight and with a little help of a wire brush, even the heavy rust comes right of :)
Nicely made video!
Looks like the Rostio product kinda sucks. I mean that part on the lathe would have been less than 5 minutes with a reusable wire wheel on a drill motor.
Like you, I have found chemical rust removal kinda limited.
I use acid to clean the inside of rusty steel tanks(where you can't get inside to scrub). These are usually air tanks that weren't drained regularly.
I fill the tank with an acid solution and put a more rusty piece of metal in a cup of the same solution. When the part in the cup looks pretty good, I figure inside the tank is. I empty and flush the tank with water. I then put a bunch of moth balls in the tank with a pint or two of 91% isopropyl alcohol and turn the tank over and around, using the moth balls to scrub the inside from agitating the whole thing. I drain this out and do the same thing with about a pint of mineral spirits (by itself, no moth balls). When I drain this out, I pour in about about a Quart of oil based paint and turn the tank over and on all sides many times to thoroughly coat the inside with paint. I remove my plugs and drain the excess paint and then let it dry overnight. I have done this a number of times with good results. I don't own a bore scope but have used a friends and found really great results. This also works good for mildly rusted fuel tanks. For very rusty fuel tanks, there is a special product for coating the inside, using the same method.
I hope you find this useful.
Take Care and be safe, John
Endlich mal einer, der grammatisch richtiges, elaboriertes und gut ausgesprochenes Englisch spricht.
This restoration is getting really impressive, congratulations !
I used vinegar a lot. Cheaper stuff, meant for cleaning. I will try citric next time i need to get rid of rust. Nice review!!!
As a chemist, I'm very much impressed by your knowledge about the reactions going on.
Thumbs up 👍
I have 3 brands of rust remover on my shelf, all of them have phosphoric acid as the active component. It has a distinctive smell you can easily recognise once you know it.
I've had a lot of luck with a phosphoric acid based CaCO3 remover gell. But that was for removing rust from an enamelled surface.
"Apfelessig" is a great word... I love German "compound-words".
Elektrochemie ohne Stromquelle: Die rostigen Teile in Salzwasser mit Aluminiumfolie abreiben. Die Alufolie oxidiert, das Eisen reduziert, der Kontakt sichert die elektrische Verbindung und das Salzwasser die Ionische Verbindung. Somit ist der Materialabtrag minimal und die Teile hast du vermutlich zu Hause. Bei dicken Rostschichten dauert das allerdings sehr lange - also am besten den groben Rost abtragen und dann rubbeln.
With the gelatinous removers I've seen people pull out a layer of plastic kitchen wrap, lay the work piece on that, slather it in the jelly and then roll it up, pressing the plastic up against the surface and sealing it into a little rusty jelly package. Helps counteract the dripping effect.
Thank you for your video. It was very instructive. You have a great command of the English language. Your information was presented clearly and easy to understand. Very well done!
Super Darstellung - und nebenbei: hervorragendes Englisch!
That black iron 3 oxide coating following citric acid bath is protective against further oxidation. I've used it as a protective finish with good results.
Black oxide (common name) is a coating used on drill bits, tools and other ferrous metal products.
+tiporari That sounds like Iron 3 phosphate; Iron 3 oxide is red rust, but iron 3 phosphate acts as a protective finish.
I think I got iron 3 oxide and Fe3O4 (magnetite) mixed up.
Anyway, when you do this process, I've found that it leaves behind a surface coating like gun bluing which is Fe3O4.
The coating is mostly inert, and doesn't quickly rust again. Rubbing it off with steel wool strips away the thin magnetite layer and unless you seal it will quickly rust again.
Thanks for pointing out my error anyway, forced me to challenge my flawed recollection.
Thank you. That was very informative.
As you say in Germany, "There are many ways that lead you to Rome"
As we say in Wales, "There are many way to skin a cat"
Thanks for the video BTW. Very interesting and informative.
Rostio is likely comparative to 'Naval Jelly' by Loctite here in the US. It's main active ingredient is phosphoric acid and it's gel form w/brush.
I'm really looking forward to the rest of the lathe restoration.
For the jelly, use plastic wrap to keep the jelly tight against the item.
That would squeeze all the jelly off, leaving only a very small amount in contact with the rust. In order to work properly, there needs to be a LOT of the chemical present... in other words a thick coating will work much more effectively than a thin coating. That's why they make it a thickened gel rather than a thin liquid.
Hard to beat the electrolysis method; the catalyst is never consumed, the reaction won't attack the iron, and it's fast.
Doesn't salt water produce clorine?
@@dimmacommunication if you use washing soda you produce hydrogen
@@darronjknight Sodium carbonate?
darronjknight and,,,,,,
@@drewjohnson4673 Hydrogen?
When you do the molasses, please address the sulphured vs unsulphured. thanks.
Regular cooking molasses works just fine. Sulphated molasses is cheaper in large quantities (it's used for livestock) which is why it's used for larger dip tanks.
Hi TPAI, Good information, video. As you may know , the 3 jaw chuck jaws come out 1, 2, 3, and, of course go in 3, 2, 1. Good job on the Lathe restoration. Be good, C.
vinegar is great to remove rust BUT the real trick, as you learned, is the timing. If you over hold it, the acid will eat into the metal. I assume that is because the rusted metal is already weakened at the surface so what I do is check it ever 3-4 hours and make sure I time myself to place an item in vinegar only if I am able to take it out and clean it no more than 12 hours if I cant check every 3-4 hours. Great videos, thanks for sharing.
If Rostio is like the naval jelly we have here in the states it's phosphoric acid based
+Jacksonkellyfreak It didn't seem to act like phosphoric acid would: H3PO4 reacts with red rust to make black ferric phosphate, which, unlike rust, adheres to the iron and prevents further corrosion.
In other words, a phosphoric acid based formula turns rust black.
Nevin Williams
Ah ok. I don't deal with rust too much other than surface rust so I'm only familiar with what some of the chemical makeups are
+Jacksonkellyfreak I first thought it was based on phosphoric acid as well and I had that suspicion in of the lathe restoration videos, but then some guys that that they believe it's based on citric acid and I guess they were right.
+Nevin Williams
Yeah, here it's called rust converter instead of rust remover and should passivate the rust before priming and painting, ensuring it can't continue underneath a new paint layer
Naval Jelly IS the common product name here in the United States and its chemical composition is as follows:
Naval Jelly is made from Phosphoric Acid (10 to 30 percent by composition) and minute amounts of Sulfuric Acid (0.1 to 1.0 percent by composition), as well as other hazardous chemicals-Phosphate ester (1 to 5 percent), Polysaccharide (1 to 5 percent), and Isopropyl alcohol (1 to 5 percent). Water makes up the non-hazardous portion by more than 50 percent.
Occasionally, (depending on the manufacturer) naval jelly comes in a distinct pink color due to an otherwise inert additive (colorant). Naval Jelly is intended to be left in contact with the part only for up to 10 minutes. Then use water to rinse. If rust remains, just repeat the process. But leaving it on for longer time will turn the part dark black which may not be desirable.
Naval Jelly will also remove any bluing from steel but again if you have to remove rust, bluing lost its capacity to protect the metal anyway. Hope all this helped!
Btw, I liked the going to Rome expression, is my spelling correct: "viele Wege gehen nach Rome". Grüße von Chicago, Freund aus Deutschland!
We have a similar saying in the UK " There is more than one way to skin a cat " lol. I always enjoy your videos, keep up the good work !
That's funny that you have a similar saying about Rome as we do in English (I've noticed that most sayings are culturally specific). Our saying goes: "All roads lead to Rome". But it's basically identical
I know I might be late, but you can hear up the water to speed up the reaction. I do this with my boiler. I put some vinegar and turn it on, and keep it between the temperature hot, but not boiling. Within a minute all the spots are gone. But if you put vinegar instead of lemon juice it will smell!
nice video man. very useful. i'm just cleaning an old shed full of old rusty gardening tools. this will hep me a lot. keep it up!
best regards from Croatia.
Here's a method I use on cast iron pans with great success: put your oven into "self-cleaning cycle" and lock the piece in there for the several hours your oven needs for self-cleaning. When it's done, the piece will be covered in fine powder that brushes off to reveal clean bare iron. No chemicals or elbow grease necessary.
Rusteo is phosphoric acid in a gelatine substrate. Think I will try the organic acid treatment on some rusty tools, Might at least get it free enough to run again, though I have little hope. But have a lot of vinegar around, used to descale kettles, and I use another acid to clean aluminium piping inside.
I have used white vinegar with good results on deeply rusted parts.
White vinegar is what I usually use too. I've tried both it and apple cider vinegar, and the plain white seems to work better (I believe the cider vinegar is a weaker dilution, which would explain it.) A gallon of distilled white vinegar is only about $4 from my local grocery store, so it's cheap too.
I have occasionally noticed pitting in steel parts (such as plane irons and chipbreakers), so I don't leave those in more than 8 hours or so. Otherwise for cast iron I leave it in for closer to 24 hours and haven't had any issues thus far. I think the pitting I've run into is partially based on the kind of steel used for a particular item, because it doesn't always happen.
In the US, vinegar is typically diluted to 5% acidity. It should state the acidity on the bottle.
Klar,deutlich und sehr erbaulich!Danke!
I don't know if anyone has said it yet but the american equivalent to rostio is naval jelly which is made from Phosphoric acid there are also rust converters that are made from tannic acid
German guy speaking English (American English), German accent, German cadence, some German syntax, excellent vocabulary, excellent diction, idiomatic expressions are plentiful and accurate and used properly.......language proficiency is excellent. Where and how did he learn to speak English......so well.......? ? ? ? ? ? ? Best regards, fm
I would love to have that Mauser adjustable wrench!! Awesome video!
professional formulations contain EDTA (Ethylenediaminetetraacetic). it is better than acid etching and can be just as cheap. gentle, gentle cleaning of thin instruments.
Rostio's active ingredient is sulphamic (NOT Sulphoric ) acid. It is also sold as LimeAway and Lime light in UK. You will find that if you dissolve it in water and then use it in a similar way to that of Citric acid it will be faster. It is also much safer than Hydrochloric acid other in that it does not release noxious gases and is safe to release in public drains
It depends on what I'm trying to get the rust off however I normally use for the heavy stuff a large container filled with hydrochloric acid at 40% strength, and that works well for the really heavily rusted items, for the next down the list sulphuric acid at 24% and for the light stuff I use vinegar at only 7%.
Electrolysis with some vinegar added works well for me and is prettly fast. A quick soak in Hydrochloric acid first for anything heavily rusted.
Interesting. You can use malt vinegar which is dark brown and sold for food use. To avoid using a huge amount, soak paper towels in it, wrap the rusty object in the soaking towelling and then cover in plastic bags to avoid the towels drying out. Remove next day and most of the rust will be on the towel , not left on the object. For very thick rust, I have used a cardboard box with plastic dustbin bag lining because you can make the box fit the object and so have a good depth of vinegar.
Cool! The jelly-type remover looks similar to "Naval Jelly" but not the same color
chemical reaction info : my Nexus tablet( maybe most other have these) has a translation icon . Great video and thanks for the hard work .
30% Pure Vinegar - Home&Garden (1 Gallon)
by Eco Clean about $55 CND off of amazon 30% is the highest consumer bought vinegar mostly used on farms. Which is ideal for removing rust from your projects over a time period.
I've had good luck with "Drano" drain cleaner (in crystal form) which is mostly Sodium Hydroxide. I put several gallons of water in a plastic container.. add the Drano and then leave the (iron) parts overnight. It will turn aluminum parts black.. so you might not want to dip those. I have yet to try heating the water to see if it is more effective. For more information on Drano, Wikipedia has an article on the product.
Im using vinegar for almost every derusting I have done so far. It removed rust from a lot of stuff from different time preiods: wrought iron, 70 years old relic, fireman axe from 1910, bolt nuts from 1930, a lot of tools from the 80´and 60´... What Im trying to say is that vinegar is really good de-rusting tool. It just doesnt work in 24 hours. De rusting usually takes around 3-4 days. However if my country would sell Evaporust I would buy an excesive amount almost immediately.
If you go to oriental food shops, they often sell the citric acid pretty cheap.
Oxalic acid is the cheapest and most effective rust remover I have found. If you don't find it effective enough, add more powder. The stuff is so cheap, it doesn't matter. It particularly likes iron oxide, more than other things, so unless you just forget about soaking things, it should cause very minimal secondary damage, unlike vinegar. I really don't like vinegar being used for this reason, it may clean the rust, but at the cost of extra deterioration of the chrome or nickel coating, or worsened pitting, which very well may do more damage than good.
Great video thank you. I used Coca cola when I was a kid to get rust off my bike. Worked really well. It has phosphoric acid in it.
I was wondering why a corrosive acid like acetic acid can be used to derust ferrous metals. thanks for the explanation!
I use an additional heat gun after toweling to dry. That gets rid of all moisture in hidden spots & heats it up to aply linseed oil. That's quick enough to prevent new rost😜
I was thinking of this video this past weekend when I was buying some old rusty tools at an antique store. I'll send pictures of the results if you are interested.
use white vinegar, and it does not need to be 5 percent, you can dilute it to a 3d of that, and it will work as well with less damage to the metal
It would have been interesting to see the finish on the dividers if you had used a much finer steel wool. You used what I call pan-scrubber steel wool. 000 and 0000 wool might have given you a much cleaner finish. Nice work, interesting experiment. Thanks
I love those "sayings" in foreign languages... In portuguese we have almost the same: "All paths go to Rome" and its use is the same as in this video, when you can achieve the same result using diferent methods.
Argentinian here we have "Todos los caminos conducen a Roma"
di3g04 In France, '' tous les chemins mènent à Rome ''.
The cider vinegar results look no better, in fact worse, than my efforts using malt vinegar which is a fifth of the price. I get good results soaking nuts and bolts in malt vinegar for 24 hours. Great work as always my friend, thank you so much.
+InnaSoulSounds Makes sense - same active ingredient (acetic acid).
You soak your nuts in malt vinegar....?? I just use soap, warm water, and a flannel....
SInce you are in Germany you should be able to get Surig Essig Concentrated vinegar which is 25% acid and either use it straight or better dilute it to perhaps 10%.
Also most commercial rust removers at least in the US use oxalic acid
Use a brass bristle brush. Steel wool like that doesn't infiltrate crevices well and can leave scratch marks.
how would you compare the chemical versus the electric rust removal methods, in terms of efficiency/cost/effect? Great videos, thanks.
would be a nice conclusion to the episode!
Make your own "rustio" by mixing citric acid with wallpaper paste! Mix with a little water and make the consistency you want.
I found that using trisodium phosphate (T.S.P.) and dishwashing soap is an excellent way to remove oil and grease from metal or any other surface. Brake cleaner can also be substituted. I think gasoline is a bad alternative.
Very nice . I enjoy all your videos . Thank You Sir. Keep up the great work.
This will definitely help me in the future.
I successfully use vinegar essence (25%) since over a decade on heavily rusted metal stuff (OLD once-burried axe heads and even boat propellers). Dirt cheap and highly recommended
BEWARE THE VINEGAR!
About a year ago, I learned vinegar could be used to sharpen old metal files. I soaked 3-4 files in white vinegar, and it seemed to work. I then mixed some bicarbonate of soda solution and neutralized the acetic acid.
Since the files seemed to brought back to life, I put them in my mechanic's toolbox, with my other files. This was in late fall, so It was 4-5 months before I got happened to get back into my toolbox, because of the winter. What I found made me want to track down the person who posted the 'sharpen your files with vinegar', and pour a bottle of vinegar down their throat, and put the files, elsewhere.
Turned out, the files really didn't get that sharp, (I didn't get a chance to really test them thoroughly.), but every bare steel tool in my box had a heavy coat of rust. These tools are been in this box, winter after winter for twenty years, in this location, without rusting.
It was a complete rust coat, and I STILL don't have everything restored. And I neutralized the damn vinegar. Imagine what it would have been like, if I hadn't neutralized the vinegar!
Watch out where you store the parts soaked in vinegar!
I just emptied a gallon of commercial rust remover a month ago, 'Metal Rescue', and was pleased with it's results, except it was not as reusable as claimed. I thoroughly cleaned all the dirt and grease from the items, but ended up with a weird goo in the bottom of every de-rust batch I did.
By the time I separated it from the fluid, I had lost about 50%. When I tried to re-use the left over, it didn't work very well. I ended up having to mix it with 2 parts new fluid to get decent results.
I'm going to try 'Evapo Rust', next, user reviews on Amazon say it is very re-useable.
Both brands are biodegradable. Metal Rescue claims to be all natural. Neither brand will attack your skin.
I still have got the best, and most economic results using Rustoleum's rust remover/primer for rust removal. It is a horse shit primer, but a coat of it on cleaned rust makes wire wheel removal on the bench grinder an easy task.
Re: gray color of metal
In researching Evapo Rust and other brands yesterday, I learned the gray color, (as long as it is NOT powdery), will act as a rust preventative, so don't remove it.
GeoD
the rust removing gel I have some of a different brand the trick is to use cling film over it to hold it in place and to get right thickness
I got some very good experience with citric acid in combination with an ultrasonic cleaner wich is sold for cleaning glasses. Rust was removed after 10 minutes. Even cleaning some aluminium parts was great - just try.
How much time did it take?
Rostio is just phosphoric acid jelly. the best result I have got so far was with oxalic acid, although it takes very long time compared the phosphoric acid.
Acid does not "corrode" the iron - it does not form *oxide*.
It dissolves iron - Fe becomes Fe2+ ion and goes into solution, whereas H+ ions take resulting electrons and turn into H2 gas.
This is why it does not form more rust. (But of course, it's not better than rusting, the effect is the same regarding damage to the surface - the iron is removed)
Molasses works great, but gets nasty looking. I used it on a very rusty piece of metal I found in the ground. I think it took two weeks, but the rust washed off with a garden hose. The metal was completely rust free.
Sandblasting method is unbeatable!
You could also try phosphoric acid that you can get cheaply by buying PH- products meant for pools.
Again : A soaking White Vinegar ( Much better then any other Vinegar's ) works amazingly well . I've saved tool I would have deemed DEAD MEAT before learning of the trick. When you placed dissimilar metals in the acidic bath you created a battery. Electrolysis Actions would take place . That could deteriorate one of the objects in a negative way.
To get the most of vinegar.
Heat it
Use concentrated
Use one drop of dish soap
And use baking soda to neutralise the acid to prevent further damage
I found phosphoric acid worked very well, though did attack the iron a little. apparently though the iron phosphate it leaves behind has corrosion inhibiting properties. It would be interesting to see how quickly the parts you have cleaned to rusty again from any trace chemicals left behind in the metal.
Very good video... Seems like citric Acid is a good choice.
I would not recommend long soaking times for springs or other thin parts. I destroyed a few parts by making this mistake once; they became brittle and broke in use.
Citric acid is great for removing light scale as well.
Hydrochloric acid is very good, and fast at removing rust. It may be hard to get in high percentage but you can get "Brick Cleaner" and it should contains 10-20% HCL.