By end of year? That charlatan Elluswamy didn’t say what year! 3 days left and it hasn’t even gone to employees! Tesla_AI posts long lists of upcoming features for AI4 releases, we got zero details. It’s not looking good for us.
@@saisrujanch I’ll take that as a compliment, I guess! 😅 I don’t mean to be so critical. I think it’s the engineer inside of me that focuses on the nuances. I try to provide a good balance with a bias toward the positives. Always. Tesla faces enough criticism from the MSM as it is.
The hate on NIO and China 🇨🇳 in general is ridiculous. All thine high 😅. But watching your video at least I can so you have practical commentary. You don't sugar coat things you just are honest. My big frustration with Telsa is when Elon came out on Autonomy Day and flat out said they were pivoting away from the sub $25k vehicle and going to robo taxis 🚕 with no steering wheel. It's really out of touch with people that want to go electric but can't afford to. If they come out with cheaper car 🚗 even a subrand they will DEFINITELY sell more cars because they have the best EV we can get in America 🇺🇸 so there is no comparison. But if most people saw what people are driving in China 🇨🇳 they'd be angry at what out choices are here in the US (all you gotta do is search UA-cam). For Tesla to say "who cares about the people who need a sub $25K" and our government keeping out Chinese EVs... its disingenuous at best.
I’m on version 12.5.4.2. Have you received the 12.6.x? I’m disappointed I bought my model Y in December 2022, but I still enjoy it every day and I love the FSD. For me, the city street driving was much smoother in a few versions back . . . 12.5.4.2 is really jerky, sits at green arrows, and totally stops in the middle of intersections. But I’ll take it over any other EV!
@@techgeektesla Yes exactly, Yashu Sharma (youtube. com/@ HitThatBid). He always warns about issues like the illusion that stock prices could go constantly up and never down or tech progress being predictable and timeable, and similar stuff. He also understands what Wall Street is doing what it's doing and will not adapt to a strategy of pure optimism of longterm investors. And he's an absolutely likeable guy!
Still with ya to the end of the video 😂 mannn I needed to hear this. Definitely a lot of down time with the holidays and seeing so many v13 videos does indeed make me feel like I’m missing out. Will be sure to remember this video and I appreciated a lot of the points you made 🙏🏼
Would be nice to get a third-party solution for IR blasters for the internal cameras. I’m sure there’s a homebrew project that could set up something cheap. Just for those early morning/late night drives where FSD makes you put your hands on the wheel because it can’t see your eyes
I can totally relate to your experience of being "this close!" to buying a new Tesla before the 0% APR expired! I had exactly the same feelings, but don't have a wife reminding me to be practical. I would have had to sell a significant % of my Tesla stock to do it, so it just made more sense to wait for the stock to go high enough so that what I would have to sell would be much smaller percentage of my investment. Actually, my 2018 M3LR is still the very best vehicle I've ever owned! And at 77 I've owned quite a few.
I have a 2018 Model 3 LR. I love FSD. Sure, I'd like to get what AI4 people have right now, but I've waited 6 years to get what I currently have. After 6 years, I'm not going to complain about a few more months. I do think Elon will upgrade HW3 folks. For them, the HW upgrade would cost less than the legal and good-will expense.
I bought my Tesla 9 months ago with HW3. I’m not stressing too much because unsupervised FSD is not out and I don’t believe it’s going to be out for at least five years. That means it’s not going to work on HW4. I’ll keep my Tesla for at least another three years by then probably HW5 will be out and that should support unsupervised FSD. Upgrading to HW4 Just so you can stay up-to-date for the latest version of FSD is silly unless you can drop that kind of money without second thought. Most of us aren’t buying new Teslas like they’re coffee at Starbucks
I’m still with you and will be watching your videos just the same going forward. There are still a lot of HW3 owners (myself included) who I’m sure won’t be jumping ship to HW4, and your content will be helpful in showing AI3 FSD’s current state [and possibly vs the latest builds on AI4]. Love your take and fully stand by you.
Jon, thanks for your acknowledgement of HW3 angst. There are two adults in my house, too. Sometimes, 1 adult challenges the other adult to examine “does it make sense”. It has worked for us. I joined your Patreon page as free for now. For your info, I would have hit $1/mo immediately, but I held off on $2 (seems silly). But, there are so many creators that I can’t budget for each one. Thanks for your videos.
There's been a few of the Tesla faithful ditching HW3 for HW4 but I'm with you. Best case is to wait for HW5 where there's a chance of fixing systemic issues like the b pillar camera location, add rear cross traffic, rear emergency braking, extra sensors, etc.
I’m with you. Unless you have significant income to buy a new car every year, don’t waste your money on a HW4 Tesla. I suspect unsupervised FSD is going to require HW5 at a minimum. Don’t try to keep up with the Tesla influencers that are buying new Teslas every year like it’s an iPhone. If you’re making high six figures or seven figure salary sure go ahead but if not, just wait. Cross traffic alert was an update a while back, but I have not tested it. Tesla is only about a decade late on this one but better late than never.
I find on v12.5.4.2 AI3 that if I wear sunglasses I can get away with not looking at the road for longer periods of time. The other day I put them lower on my nose so I could look at the navigation screen (they are distance glasses), and in about 3 seconds it started squawking at me. Later I tried with the sunglasses and no squawk and I looked at the nav for at least 8 or 9 seconds. Like you I'm waiting for AI5, although I think Tesla will find a solution for all of us. Not worried.
My MYP, manufactured Feb 2024 shortly before Tesla's mass layoffs this year, has the current holiday update. I can see "Autopilot computer" showing as "Full Self-Driving Computer 4" in the "Additional Vehicle Information" screen that can be brought up in the "Software" section. My guess is, my MYP has what the Tesla marketing types like to call it: AI4 🤣
Thanks for your honest assessment. I paid $5k for FSD on my 2019. I wish my M3 had a hand hold to help me in and out. The Teslas seem to be made 😢for the younger set.
Well, I think people are jealous because they’re following their favorite Tesla influencer who is buying a new Tesla every year. If you have that kind of money to buy a new Tesla like it’s an iPhone, then that’s great but most of us buy a new car at best every 3 to 5 years
The ISSUE is simple: WE NEED COMMUNICATION! Even in gaming or directors making movies, if there's a delay or a change, they communicate with the fans/buyers (of the game if that's the case) and TALK to them, let them know what the status is. Even with the new 12.6 update, it's going to be the new year soon and we've heard NOTHING. That's the issue. Period.
@@brokenneck so true. Tesla overpromised and misled their buyers of FSD into believing that the company was on the precipice of rolling out unsupervised FSD. Hard to support any company that takes your money and has not actually delivered. Surely their FSD development teams knew better, while Musk raked in cash and promised the moon! It is for this reason that I’ll not be buying another Tesla until there is accountability, and not long drawn out promises while my vehicle ages.
I live in Australia where fsd is not available yet but i am still happy with EAP, and it is getting better and better. I am pretty sure they will upgrade your ota to HWx if HW3 is not suitable for fsd.
There will come a time when people will be very interested in seeing content of people driving FSD on HW3, especially when everyone has moved on to HW6 or newer hardware. It will be fascinating to see if 10-15-year-old hardware is still capable or perhaps even better than the competitors of that time.
Somehow people missed that Elon said there would be upgrades to Hw4 for owners of FSD. Does this sound familiar? Formerly there was an upgrade to hw3 for owners of FSD.
Great analysis, thank you! I need some advice: I have a SafePal wallet with USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). How should I go about transferring them to Binance?
Hard to call HW3 early adopters considering this HW was sold under 12 months ago. My MSP has HW3 and I'm completely and utterly disgusted at this whole situation. 15k was the price for FSD in my MSP and we're the idiots who get left behind. Now I've thought a bunch of times of just upgrading to a HW4 MSP but the devaluation of these vehicles is massive. My car doesn't even have 15k miles and has already lost 2/3rds of its value. I don't know, I love my MSP but its almost an impossible pill to swallow to purchase a new one only for AI4. And to boot, all of us idiots who decide to upgrade to probably be told in 2025, guess what, AI5 will be released now.
You are still an early adopter for full self driving. Most vehicles do not have this on the road. Most people manually steer their cars. You’re only bothered because you’re paying attention to Tesla influencers that buy new cars every year. Most people cannot afford this. Your Tesla did not get any worse. It’s actually gotten better, but it’s not as good as the latest and the greatest. Take a step back, take a breath and enjoy your car. Don’t even think about wasting money on HW4. Wait and be patient. Is it really worth it to have earlier access to a slightly better version of supervised FSD? I don’t think so. I also don’t think HW4 will support unsupervised FSD. Wait for HW5 at least. Right now, I’m enjoying my HW3 Tesla. If the Tesla is your only car, sometimes you forget how it is to drive a normal car. I have a second car so about once a week I drive it and that reminds me. If you don’t have a second car rent one for a couple days. You’ll be glad to be back in your Tesla
@@calvinwalker4654 disagree. Musk overpromised, knowing full well that unsupervised FSD is much further away. Loyal customers paid between $8000-12,000.00 for what? Eventually, unsupervised FSD will arrive. But many early adopters won’t soon forget how much we were misled. In 2021, when I purchased a Model Y, Musk stated that Unsupervised FSD was less than a year away, and raked in billions. Has he no shame?
Regarding the 3,3 rule, I get into trouble when I’m looking for radio stations on Tunein radio. I wish there were a way to select channels with FSD engaged without fear of FSD jail…
You should have your daughter play the violin as your Tesla drives you guys around on 12.5.4.2, it would be a funny video, like you're in a rolls Royce with a chauffeur.
As long as Tesla is working a AI3 to AI5 hardware upgrade (Those purchased HW3/preHW3 with FSD) to compensate, then it will be worth the wait. Hardware being limited, better safe than sorry and AI3 not handle the model safely etc.
We have been using FSD for years to drive 90% of our miles. Version 12,5.6.3 I have yet to have a safety intervention, and many drives where my hands are in my lap the whole drive.
I think that skit was "The Black Death". I have 2023 MYP with HW3...I hope Tesla comes up with a path to upgrade the HW3 cars to HW4. I do feel left out of FSD Version 13.
With no recent comments about HW3 from Tesla, how do we know it is not dead? Tesla is saying nothing and no upgrades to HW4 have been announced. We do feel we have been screwed and Tesla does not seem to care.
hw3 has been out for 5 years... Imagine something like an OS windows, linux etc. There will (most likely) be support and improvements for HW3 for at least a few more years. Could be even 5 years or so.
I got a strike, I think, because it could not find my eyes because of my ball cap and it kept giving me the "pay attention" alert. It's interesting to see you are wearing yours in this video.
You do have HW3, your computer is 2.5 When I bought mine used I paid to have the computer upgraded to the FSD computer. Bumped my AP2.5 to "FSD Capable". I currently have 12.5.4.2 in my 2018 M3P.
I bought a 2022 Model Y with the FSD software license, with the expectation that the HW3 computer may never be fit for unsupervised self-driving. If so, they'll probably offer FSD transfers again alongside the upgrades - chances are they'd rather sell a new car than give away a computer.
I've been saying for years that Tesla buyers might qualify for a class action lawsuit. Elon has been promising FSD for a decade. Definitely understand the frustration!
They should do the computer upgrades NOW! It’s obvious HW3 will never get autonomy with the current set up, when they can’t even give us E2E highway now. What happened after the first 12.5 rollout, when we were told going forward HW3 & HW4 updates would roll out together? Well, they got 12.5.6.3, and were stuck on 12.5.4.2 which still has lots of problems.
That’s not going to happen. They will do upgrades when unsupervised FSD comes out. It would be silly to upgrade now then upgrade again when it’s released. I mean, sure I would love a free upgrade. Heck, I would love for them to take my Tesla and give me a new one. Everyone loves free stuff, but you cannot expect this
alot of people are like you with older hardware 3 teslas, I feel like the tesla community on twitter shows alot of high income owners who are always constantly changing out their cars so they do have hardware 4. Its just not realistic, I like that you show how hardware 3 is preforming on fsd.
I find it difficult to believe that some of the best software and hardware engineers in the world didn’t see this coming. So they are either willing to abandon HW3 altogether, or they will have a hardware retrofit in a year or two. Good way to gather the older vehicles, on the cheap, to create the robotaxi fleet, no?
Yup EVERY new release and next version was unbelievably perfect. Until it went wide release and you find out that wow it slams on the breaks at green lights etc now. If I buy a new Tesla it will be when HW5 comes out.
I have a thesis that FSD wont be fully solved until HW5. I use v13 often and its great and all but it still has blonde moments and even scary times where i feel i need to take over. They need to bring back a second type of sensor it cannot be vision only.
Right now there's no need to be jealous about v13. It's a little smoother but still makes a ton of mistakes, ignores traffic signs and finds all potholes.
I have a feeling that even HW4 owners like me won’t ever get unsupervised FSD (an oxymoron if ever I’ve heard one). The robotaxi development is including radar and lidar (from Luminar).
True but they had to map the area before the cybercab could drive it. Either Tesla is going to have to include the sensors with the vehicle or have special vehicles mapping every street so Teslas without it can drive
Have HW3 and paid for FSD 4 years ago because I'm a senior citizen (almost 80 years old) and thought it would help me and spouse drive better. I now feel by the time I get HW4 or HW5 I might not be around. By the time Tesla finely admits that HW3 won't cut it (in the next one or two years) I will be in my 80s. I wonder why Tesla won't admit it? Everyone knows HW3 is outdated and will never support unsupervised FSD. Tesla, please quit trying to stall another one or two years. I feel that some of us will never see FSD in our lifetime.
Dude ur smoking something if u think v12 is better than 13. V13 is so natural and human like that I’m actually gonna subscribe it. Currently I got free trial. V13 is a bigger leap from 12 than 12 was from 11
I bought my 2023 MY before HW4 came out. I’m renting FSD instead of purchasing. I wonder if people who pay monthly as opposed to PIF FSD customers will be eligible for hardware upgrades….
Anybody who buys something on the promise that it will eventually will be delivered, with no guarantee, is responsible for their purchase. Salesmen take advantage of naive people all the time. Some people learn their lesson, while others don’t.
OK, let’s see Elon said in his call that he would be providing hardware for for all the hardware three people fantastic. Has Elon ever told a lie? Yes is the answer. Does he even care about that? No is the answer. This is what I was sold when I bought my car and said even if the full self driving required hardware upgrades, you would get them. I think they might’ve forgot about that by now. and you’re right many people have large amounts of disposable income and for majority just look at that trade-in value you got right now now is it a half or a quarter of what you paid for it?
Its coz the latest version in Hw3 is the first version to be trained natively in HW4 and compressed to Hw3. 12.3.6 didnt have these said issues much coz till then were Hw3 trained models. Now that they have started training only in Hw4 and trying to make it fit hw3, regressions are absolutely bound to happen. My 2018 Model X has regressed so much from 12.3.6 that the advancements dont shine through at all but i still use it all the time. However the phantom braking, braking on green, stopping n going on red, lane selection issues are real continuous issues owing to camera differences too i feel coz i didnt have these issues before. So its training hardware change coupled with low res cameras thats causing these issues. I dont think thats going away, ie. Unless the engineers are closely looking into optimising to version to make sure it doesnt happen during or after the compression.
Was ist schwer daran die HW3 Rechner in drei bis vier Jahren auf HW5 Rechner aufzurüsten? Es dürfte für rund 2000 Dollar für Millionen Fahrzeuge schnell möglich sein, man muss es nur machen @Tesla 😏
The "high levels of disposable in come" is of course the simplest solution. Next year, I plan to sell my 2020 Model Y, hopefully transfer my FSD, and buy a 2025 Juniper Model Y a few months after the first release. The Model Y I paid almost $70k for in August 2020 is now worth as a trade in $22k (not including the $7k for the FSD) Big drop? Yes, but as a Tesla investor my only complaint is that I can't write any part of either vehicle off for taxes. Clearly buying and driving a Tesla is a critical part of informing my investment strategy. And a used Tesla with or without FSD is still a great car and the safest ones on the road. One strategy for teenager insurance rates, that may still be true, is get your license as soon as you turn 16. Then don't drive for a year. Don't be insured. No cost. No driving, no chance of an accident. Your insurance company will make you sign a waiver meaning you can loan your car to your neighbor, but not to your daughter. After a year your daughter will no longer be a new driver, she'll be a driver with a year's 'experience' and no accidents. Rates will be lower. And yeah, don't oversell FSD. I've been driving 12.5 for a few months and it is absolutely amazing. Totally does 90% of my driving. If I go up to my boat, 65 miles I don't feel as though I've done any driving at all. Mistakes? Yeah, it still makes mistakes. The progress over the past four years has been absolutely amazing. For more than the first year it could only drive straight on streets. (I've also driven coast to coast and back twice. And several other long trips. Even in 2020 it handled the winding Pacific Coast Highway with few interventions.) My son doesn't want a Tesla, but if he and my daughter in law have a baby? Grandpa's buying them a Model Y. He can sell his Audi or I can set fire to it. Either way. Dirty Tesla seems very honest. I'm even familiar with the streets he drives on in and around Ann Arbor Michigan.
Eventually all older Teslas will be left behind as tech evolves and grows, just as old computers and phones at some point cannot be updated any more. Just an unfortunate fact of life . Personally , I skip up to 3 generations on my iPhones and iPads before upgrading and they don't cost anything close to a Tesla. I know , not apples and apples but no need to replace a relatively new car just because FSD won't work as well. I mean how often do you use FSD and is it really vital to your life?
I can buy a new Tesla, I own a model Y 2022. I want the new Y refresh. I never bought FSD, but I tried the free trial. Im still with you. I have a daughter that plays the violin, and I have to 100k college tuition for her.
36 Km/h = 22.5 mph = 36000 metres per hour = 36 metres per second. So 3 seconds = 108 metres of distance at 36 km/h and 216 metres (236 yards) at 72 km/h or 45 mph imo that seems like a hell of a lot of distance to not be watching the road.
Totally agree about HW3 supervised FSD creating a lot of negativity towards Tesla and Elon. I have a 2020 model Y and have experienced actual regressions in my FSD performance to the point I don't want to use it. I am to the point of wanting to buy the Juniper Y when it comes out just for all the upgrades. My wife says forget it but she won't drive with FSD because it is "not'' perfect and she can see how it frustrates me! We will wait and see what Elon & Tesla come up with to make FSD unsupervised as promised! I am also waiting for the non founders series Cybertruck to be released shortly in Canada and hope I don't have buyers remorse since it will be used to tow our 7500 lb holiday trailer due to short range performance. I will option for the range extender battery if my 1200 watts of solar on the trailer and my 10,000 watt gas generator can't help me charge up when parked. Will have to avoid long trips IMO but am willing to take the risk since I can't go back to an ICE vehicle. My house and Model Y are powered by the sun for free from our roof top solar. I have been spoiled to own a TESLA for 4+ years + the profits I have made with Tesla stock also hasn't hurt! 😎🇨🇦 💎🙌 TESLA 2562 stocks 💪
I am a HW3 owner but feel that HW3 doesn’t have the horsepower to solve FSD. Tesla will upgrade us to HW4 or HW5 eventually… Thanks for the great video!
Till FSD is allowed here in Germany, i bet i get a new Hardware 5 or 6 kinda for my 2019 Model 3. :D So i just wait, and be happy driving my model 3. :) But i really want to see FSD on my "old" Car, even supervised would be mind blowing, and i could say for exaple to my coworkers, can your audi, vw, skoda do that? No? My 6-7 (or more) can do that now! :D would be fun.
v13.2.x is outstanding and highly superior to v12.5.x. I used to experience phantom braking, overreaction to traffic lights or high beam from ongoing cars. All is gone with v13. Additionally I cannot explain with words how smooth it is in comparison with v12x If I were you, with the quality and fairness of your videos, I would buy a Model 3 2024 in a heartbeat. Get an inventory or demo car + all the current promos and your UA-cam monetization will pay for it and keep your 2019 as a second car (as I did) You won't regret. My teenager son is driving my 2019 now. Safest car on earth and peace of mind for me as his dad. Hope my 2 cents helps. Keep it up with your great videos!
Thanks for a good grounded video.. 22Y Pro I had the exact same thoughts going through my head as far as pulling the trigger on a HW4 car. You are right we will get a chip and camera upgrade. I paid $7,500 FSD... I guess we need to hang in there and be patient. It's hard to do though when you see all these other videos out there.. Still on my first set of tires in obsolete.. 😂 come on!! Good video needed. I truly believe a big part of the problem is the lack of communication on Tesla's part. Or just being able to get the accurate information needed from Tesla not a secondary source!! That's not a knock on you.. Thx ✌️🇺🇸
Tesla Hardware 3 vehicles are more widely distributed worldwide than one might think. Even in Korea, where I am, there are many Hardware 3 vehicles, and among them, some are equipped with FSD. While there is a negative perception of Hardware 3 vehicles, Tesla will never abandon them. Tesla sold these vehicles globally, and if they were to give up on Hardware 3, they would likely face lawsuits worldwide. Therefore, Tesla will continue to support these vehicles, and I believe the company should operate in this way. It is similar to how 2G phones gradually disappeared as smartphones became the majority.😊
yes u should hold out for getting the ai4 car as buying car isnt as cheap as getting a new phone plus we all know ai5 will be release very soon, it is not like 5 to 10 years away so just wait for it probably wait for ai5 on model Q if it suits you and u have more new stuff to talk about
Thank you for bringing this issue up. We have paid $18,000 for FSD ($8000 for our 3 and $10,000 for our Y) We are definitely being left out. Musk said 12.6 is as high as HW3 will go. Musk can pay for this upgrade himself. It would be just a rounding error for him. We have been waiting for FSD since 2019. We paid Tesla, $18,000 to develop this tech, now we can’t get full FSD on HW3. Come on Musk do the right thing. You are worth over $400 billion. Spend some of you wealth on your loyal Tesla customers and less time on politics, and get all the FSD HW3 Teslas upgraded to AI4-AI5 chips.
My prediction they will never admit HW3 can’t do FSD Supervised. Then they never have to spend money on HW3 cars. You don’t believe me you only have to look at Model S&X with HW2. These are Tesla flagship cars and they never got upgraded for FSD features.
My nagging worry is that HW3 will not be able to achieve FSD unsupervised and Tesla won't upgrade HW3 cars until HW5 comes out in case HW4 can't achieve unsupervised FSD.
Us early adopters with HW3 also were also buying TSLA stock at $20 or $50/share. We are used to waiting for rewards. No regrets or hate here.
Appreciate your openness, I sometimes feel most of the UA-camrs would be praising Tesla if it drove off a cliff.
As soon as 12.6 comes out your content will be the most relevant. 😅
By end of year? That charlatan Elluswamy didn’t say what year! 3 days left and it hasn’t even gone to employees! Tesla_AI posts long lists of upcoming features for AI4 releases, we got zero details. It’s not looking good for us.
Monty Python was referring to the Bubonic Plague "Black Death" 1346 to 1353.
@@HarshColby plague!!! That was the word I was so desperately searching for. Not famine or pandemic. 😆 Thank you! 🙏
I love your videos. I think you're the harshest critic for FSD. You say as it is. No sugar coating.
@@saisrujanch I’ll take that as a compliment, I guess! 😅 I don’t mean to be so critical. I think it’s the engineer inside of me that focuses on the nuances. I try to provide a good balance with a bias toward the positives. Always. Tesla faces enough criticism from the MSM as it is.
The hate on NIO and China 🇨🇳 in general is ridiculous. All thine high 😅. But watching your video at least I can so you have practical commentary. You don't sugar coat things you just are honest. My big frustration with Telsa is when Elon came out on Autonomy Day and flat out said they were pivoting away from the sub $25k vehicle and going to robo taxis 🚕 with no steering wheel. It's really out of touch with people that want to go electric but can't afford to. If they come out with cheaper car 🚗 even a subrand they will DEFINITELY sell more cars because they have the best EV we can get in America 🇺🇸 so there is no comparison. But if most people saw what people are driving in China 🇨🇳 they'd be angry at what out choices are here in the US (all you gotta do is search UA-cam). For Tesla to say "who cares about the people who need a sub $25K" and our government keeping out Chinese EVs... its disingenuous at best.
I’m on version 12.5.4.2. Have you received the 12.6.x? I’m disappointed I bought my model Y in December 2022, but I still enjoy it every day and I love the FSD. For me, the city street driving was much smoother in a few versions back . . . 12.5.4.2 is really jerky, sits at green arrows, and totally stops in the middle of intersections. But I’ll take it over any other EV!
You are one of very few adults in the room of the Tesla community. 👍
Another one (finance centered) is Yashu "Hit That Bid".
@@charangohabsburg1 ooh, adding him and going to watch his stuff. Thanks for sharing. Is it Yashu Sharma that I’ve seen on X?
@@techgeektesla Yes exactly, Yashu Sharma (youtube. com/@ HitThatBid).
He always warns about issues like the illusion that stock prices could go constantly up and never down or tech progress being predictable and timeable, and similar stuff. He also understands what Wall Street is doing what it's doing and will not adapt to a strategy of pure optimism of longterm investors. And he's an absolutely likeable guy!
I know one content creator that said FSD is flawless with every single release. That's Omar. 😂😂😂😂.
Still with ya to the end of the video 😂 mannn I needed to hear this. Definitely a lot of down time with the holidays and seeing so many v13 videos does indeed make me feel like I’m missing out. Will be sure to remember this video and I appreciated a lot of the points you made 🙏🏼
Would be nice to get a third-party solution for IR blasters for the internal cameras. I’m sure there’s a homebrew project that could set up something cheap. Just for those early morning/late night drives where FSD makes you put your hands on the wheel because it can’t see your eyes
I can totally relate to your experience of being "this close!" to buying a new Tesla before the 0% APR expired! I had exactly the same feelings, but don't have a wife reminding me to be practical. I would have had to sell a significant % of my Tesla stock to do it, so it just made more sense to wait for the stock to go high enough so that what I would have to sell would be much smaller percentage of my investment. Actually, my 2018 M3LR is still the very best vehicle I've ever owned! And at 77 I've owned quite a few.
I have a 2018 Model 3 LR. I love FSD. Sure, I'd like to get what AI4 people have right now, but I've waited 6 years to get what I currently have. After 6 years, I'm not going to complain about a few more months.
I do think Elon will upgrade HW3 folks. For them, the HW upgrade would cost less than the legal and good-will expense.
I bought my Tesla 9 months ago with HW3. I’m not stressing too much because unsupervised FSD is not out and I don’t believe it’s going to be out for at least five years. That means it’s not going to work on HW4. I’ll keep my Tesla for at least another three years by then probably HW5 will be out and that should support unsupervised FSD. Upgrading to HW4 Just so you can stay up-to-date for the latest version of FSD is silly unless you can drop that kind of money without second thought. Most of us aren’t buying new Teslas like they’re coffee at Starbucks
I’m still with you and will be watching your videos just the same going forward. There are still a lot of HW3 owners (myself included) who I’m sure won’t be jumping ship to HW4, and your content will be helpful in showing AI3 FSD’s current state [and possibly vs the latest builds on AI4]. Love your take and fully stand by you.
Jon, thanks for your acknowledgement of HW3 angst. There are two adults in my house, too. Sometimes, 1 adult challenges the other adult to examine “does it make sense”. It has worked for us. I joined your Patreon page as free for now. For your info, I would have hit $1/mo immediately, but I held off on $2 (seems silly). But, there are so many creators that I can’t budget for each one. Thanks for your videos.
@@SolarWork443 Thanks for that! You’re awesome. 🫶
There's been a few of the Tesla faithful ditching HW3 for HW4 but I'm with you. Best case is to wait for HW5 where there's a chance of fixing systemic issues like the b pillar camera location, add rear cross traffic, rear emergency braking, extra sensors, etc.
Rear cross traffic is CURRENTLY here.
I’m with you. Unless you have significant income to buy a new car every year, don’t waste your money on a HW4 Tesla. I suspect unsupervised FSD is going to require HW5 at a minimum. Don’t try to keep up with the Tesla influencers that are buying new Teslas every year like it’s an iPhone. If you’re making high six figures or seven figure salary sure go ahead but if not, just wait. Cross traffic alert was an update a while back, but I have not tested it. Tesla is only about a decade late on this one but better late than never.
I find on v12.5.4.2 AI3 that if I wear sunglasses I can get away with not looking at the road for longer periods of time. The other day I put them lower on my nose so I could look at the navigation screen (they are distance glasses), and in about 3 seconds it started squawking at me. Later I tried with the sunglasses and no squawk and I looked at the nav for at least 8 or 9 seconds.
Like you I'm waiting for AI5, although I think Tesla will find a solution for all of us. Not worried.
A violin ? 10,000 dollars. sosket !! Nice.
How to check the hardware version?
My MYP, manufactured Feb 2024 shortly before Tesla's mass layoffs this year, has the current holiday update. I can see "Autopilot computer" showing as "Full Self-Driving Computer 4" in the "Additional Vehicle Information" screen that can be brought up in the "Software" section. My guess is, my MYP has what the Tesla marketing types like to call it: AI4 🤣
Thanks for your honest assessment. I paid $5k for FSD on my 2019. I wish my M3 had a hand hold to help me in and out. The Teslas seem to be made 😢for the younger set.
Yes, it is truly sad. But keep your good explanations and encouragement going.....it helps us all. Thank you for what you do.
more jealousy than hate, imo
Well, I think people are jealous because they’re following their favorite Tesla influencer who is buying a new Tesla every year. If you have that kind of money to buy a new Tesla like it’s an iPhone, then that’s great but most of us buy a new car at best every 3 to 5 years
The ISSUE is simple: WE NEED COMMUNICATION!
Even in gaming or directors making movies, if there's a delay or a change, they communicate with the fans/buyers (of the game if that's the case) and TALK to them, let them know what the status is.
Even with the new 12.6 update, it's going to be the new year soon and we've heard NOTHING.
That's the issue. Period.
@@brokenneck so true. Tesla overpromised and misled their buyers of FSD into believing that the company was on the precipice of rolling out unsupervised FSD. Hard to support any company that takes your money and has not actually delivered. Surely their FSD development teams knew better, while Musk raked in cash and promised the moon! It is for this reason that I’ll not be buying another Tesla until there is accountability, and not long drawn out promises while my vehicle ages.
I live in Australia where fsd is not available yet but i am still happy with EAP, and it is getting better and better. I am pretty sure they will upgrade your ota to HWx if HW3 is not suitable for fsd.
Great information on the 3/3 vs 7/1. I’ve found it varies on the situation as well. Looking forward to the video.
There will come a time when people will be very interested in seeing content of people driving FSD on HW3, especially when everyone has moved on to HW6 or newer hardware. It will be fascinating to see if 10-15-year-old hardware is still capable or perhaps even better than the competitors of that time.
Somehow people missed that Elon said there would be upgrades to Hw4 for owners of FSD.
Does this sound familiar? Formerly there was an upgrade to hw3 for owners of FSD.
Great analysis, thank you! I need some advice: I have a SafePal wallet with USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). How should I go about transferring them to Binance?
Hard to call HW3 early adopters considering this HW was sold under 12 months ago. My MSP has HW3 and I'm completely and utterly disgusted at this whole situation. 15k was the price for FSD in my MSP and we're the idiots who get left behind. Now I've thought a bunch of times of just upgrading to a HW4 MSP but the devaluation of these vehicles is massive. My car doesn't even have 15k miles and has already lost 2/3rds of its value. I don't know, I love my MSP but its almost an impossible pill to swallow to purchase a new one only for AI4. And to boot, all of us idiots who decide to upgrade to probably be told in 2025, guess what, AI5 will be released now.
You are still an early adopter for full self driving. Most vehicles do not have this on the road. Most people manually steer their cars.
You’re only bothered because you’re paying attention to Tesla influencers that buy new cars every year. Most people cannot afford this. Your Tesla did not get any worse. It’s actually gotten better, but it’s not as good as the latest and the greatest. Take a step back, take a breath and enjoy your car. Don’t even think about wasting money on HW4. Wait and be patient. Is it really worth it to have earlier access to a slightly better version of supervised FSD? I don’t think so. I also don’t think HW4 will support unsupervised FSD. Wait for HW5 at least. Right now, I’m enjoying my HW3 Tesla. If the Tesla is your only car, sometimes you forget how it is to drive a normal car. I have a second car so about once a week I drive it and that reminds me. If you don’t have a second car rent one for a couple days. You’ll be glad to be back in your Tesla
@@calvinwalker4654 disagree. Musk overpromised, knowing full well that unsupervised FSD is much further away. Loyal customers paid between $8000-12,000.00 for what? Eventually, unsupervised FSD will arrive. But many early adopters won’t soon forget how much we were misled. In 2021, when I purchased a Model Y, Musk stated that Unsupervised FSD was less than a year away, and raked in billions. Has he no shame?
In a few years, I think that the owners with hw4 now will be in a similar situation when Hw5 becomes the standard.
Regarding the 3,3 rule, I get into trouble when I’m looking for radio stations on Tunein radio. I wish there were a way to select channels with FSD engaged without fear of FSD jail…
The rumor mill says that Optimus will use Ai5. I believe the Tesla cars will transition when Optimus is being mass produced.
You should have your daughter play the violin as your Tesla drives you guys around on 12.5.4.2, it would be a funny video, like you're in a rolls Royce with a chauffeur.
As long as Tesla is working a AI3 to AI5 hardware upgrade (Those purchased HW3/preHW3 with FSD) to compensate, then it will be worth the wait. Hardware being limited, better safe than sorry and AI3 not handle the model safely etc.
We have been using FSD for years to drive 90% of our miles. Version 12,5.6.3 I have yet to have a safety intervention, and many drives where my hands are in my lap the whole drive.
Good conversation.
I think that skit was "The Black Death". I have 2023 MYP with HW3...I hope Tesla comes up with a path to upgrade the HW3 cars to HW4. I do feel left out of FSD Version 13.
With no recent comments about HW3 from Tesla, how do we know it is not dead? Tesla is saying nothing and no upgrades to HW4 have been announced. We do feel we have been screwed and Tesla does not seem to care.
hw3 has been out for 5 years... Imagine something like an OS windows, linux etc.
There will (most likely) be support and improvements for HW3 for at least a few more years. Could be even 5 years or so.
I got a strike, I think, because it could not find my eyes because of my ball cap and it kept giving me the "pay attention" alert. It's interesting to see you are wearing yours in this video.
I wish I had hardware 3 in my model 3. Mine is only v2.5. I feel left out.
You do have HW3, your computer is 2.5
When I bought mine used I paid to have the computer upgraded to the FSD computer. Bumped my AP2.5 to "FSD Capable". I currently have 12.5.4.2 in my 2018 M3P.
I would ask for a refund if I spent 12k for it and keep it moving.🤷🏾♂️
I bought a 2022 Model Y with the FSD software license, with the expectation that the HW3 computer may never be fit for unsupervised self-driving. If so, they'll probably offer FSD transfers again alongside the upgrades - chances are they'd rather sell a new car than give away a computer.
10:20 who is that person
Dan O’Dowd
I have a 2017 MS HW3 and a Cybertruck HW4 V13. They both pretty much drive me where I need to go. So I’m not worried about it.
I've been saying for years that Tesla buyers might qualify for a class action lawsuit. Elon has been promising FSD for a decade. Definitely understand the frustration!
I just need the highway NN and no wheel nag. Who knows when unsupervised will be ready for prime time.
Riding in my HW3 2020 model 3 with 208,000 miles with full self-driving
They should do the computer upgrades NOW! It’s obvious HW3 will never get autonomy with the current set up, when they can’t even give us E2E highway now. What happened after the first 12.5 rollout, when we were told going forward HW3 & HW4 updates would roll out together? Well, they got 12.5.6.3, and were stuck on 12.5.4.2 which still has lots of problems.
That’s not going to happen. They will do upgrades when unsupervised FSD comes out. It would be silly to upgrade now then upgrade again when it’s released. I mean, sure I would love a free upgrade. Heck, I would love for them to take my Tesla and give me a new one. Everyone loves free stuff, but you cannot expect this
They are probably holding off to see if it will be a hw4 or hw5 upgrade. Cost savings
Well comparing to us in Europe, you have FSD with HW3. We don't have it even with HW4 Teslas.
That’s in your regulators in the EU, not Tesla.
Can you do a test drive of an AI4 from your nearest tesla shop? Or hit me up and use mine, I want to see your tests on AI4 ❤
Will be filming this tomorrow (12/30)!
@techgeektesla awesome 💪
alot of people are like you with older hardware 3 teslas, I feel like the tesla community on twitter shows alot of high income owners who are always constantly changing out their cars so they do have hardware 4. Its just not realistic, I like that you show how hardware 3 is preforming on fsd.
I find it difficult to believe that some of the best software and hardware engineers in the world didn’t see this coming. So they are either willing to abandon HW3 altogether, or they will have a hardware retrofit in a year or two. Good way to gather the older vehicles, on the cheap, to create the robotaxi fleet, no?
Richtig, es könnte sogar sein das in drei bis vier Jahren die HW3 Rechner auf HW5 Rechner schnell aufgerüstet werden können.
@ Hope so.
@ 👍
Yup EVERY new release and next version was unbelievably perfect. Until it went wide release and you find out that wow it slams on the breaks at green lights etc now. If I buy a new Tesla it will be when HW5 comes out.
I have a thesis that FSD wont be fully solved until HW5. I use v13 often and its great and all but it still has blonde moments and even scary times where i feel i need to take over. They need to bring back a second type of sensor it cannot be vision only.
Right now there's no need to be jealous about v13. It's a little smoother but still makes a ton of mistakes, ignores traffic signs and finds all potholes.
I'm Waiting for AI-5 !
I have a feeling that even HW4 owners like me won’t ever get unsupervised FSD (an oxymoron if ever I’ve heard one). The robotaxi development is including radar and lidar (from Luminar).
No it's not using g liar. Those are verification vehicles
True but they had to map the area before the cybercab could drive it. Either Tesla is going to have to include the sensors with the vehicle or have special vehicles mapping every street so Teslas without it can drive
Same it is good but I think we need a lot more horsepower in the hardware.
Have HW3 and paid for FSD 4 years ago because I'm a senior citizen (almost 80 years old) and thought it would help me and spouse drive better. I now feel by the time I get HW4 or HW5 I might not be around. By the time Tesla finely admits that HW3 won't cut it (in the next one or two years) I will be in my 80s. I wonder why Tesla won't admit it? Everyone knows HW3 is outdated and will never support unsupervised FSD. Tesla, please quit trying to stall another one or two years. I feel that some of us will never see FSD in our lifetime.
Dude ur smoking something if u think v12 is better than 13. V13 is so natural and human like that I’m actually gonna subscribe it. Currently I got free trial. V13 is a bigger leap from 12 than 12 was from 11
I bought my 2023 MY before HW4 came out. I’m renting FSD instead of purchasing. I wonder if people who pay monthly as opposed to PIF FSD customers will be eligible for hardware upgrades….
You’ll have to pay for them. There’s no free lunch for freeloaders.
Anybody who buys something on the promise that it will eventually will be delivered, with no guarantee, is responsible for their purchase. Salesmen take advantage of naive people all the time. Some people learn their lesson, while others don’t.
OK, let’s see Elon said in his call that he would be providing hardware for for all the hardware three people fantastic. Has Elon ever told a lie? Yes is the answer. Does he even care about that? No is the answer. This is what I was sold when I bought my car and said even if the full self driving required hardware upgrades, you would get them. I think they might’ve forgot about that by now. and you’re right many people have large amounts of disposable income and for majority just look at that trade-in value you got right now now is it a half or a quarter of what you paid for it?
HW3 has regressed terribly!!! Stopping, slowing down, and terrible lane selections for no reason!!! Unusable!!!
I haven’t noticed it get any worse. It’s always been bad in those areas for me. Perhaps it depends on your region
Its coz the latest version in Hw3 is the first version to be trained natively in HW4 and compressed to Hw3. 12.3.6 didnt have these said issues much coz till then were Hw3 trained models. Now that they have started training only in Hw4 and trying to make it fit hw3, regressions are absolutely bound to happen. My 2018 Model X has regressed so much from 12.3.6 that the advancements dont shine through at all but i still use it all the time. However the phantom braking, braking on green, stopping n going on red, lane selection issues are real continuous issues owing to camera differences too i feel coz i didnt have these issues before. So its training hardware change coupled with low res cameras thats causing these issues. I dont think thats going away, ie. Unless the engineers are closely looking into optimising to version to make sure it doesnt happen during or after the compression.
Was ist schwer daran die HW3 Rechner in drei bis vier Jahren auf HW5 Rechner aufzurüsten? Es dürfte für rund 2000 Dollar für Millionen Fahrzeuge schnell möglich sein, man muss es nur machen @Tesla 😏
The "high levels of disposable in come" is of course the simplest solution. Next year, I plan to sell my 2020 Model Y, hopefully transfer my FSD, and buy a 2025 Juniper Model Y a few months after the first release. The Model Y I paid almost $70k for in August 2020 is now worth as a trade in $22k (not including the $7k for the FSD) Big drop? Yes, but as a Tesla investor my only complaint is that I can't write any part of either vehicle off for taxes. Clearly buying and driving a Tesla is a critical part of informing my investment strategy.
And a used Tesla with or without FSD is still a great car and the safest ones on the road.
One strategy for teenager insurance rates, that may still be true, is get your license as soon as you turn 16. Then don't drive for a year. Don't be insured. No cost. No driving, no chance of an accident. Your insurance company will make you sign a waiver meaning you can loan your car to your neighbor, but not to your daughter. After a year your daughter will no longer be a new driver, she'll be a driver with a year's 'experience' and no accidents. Rates will be lower.
And yeah, don't oversell FSD. I've been driving 12.5 for a few months and it is absolutely amazing. Totally does 90% of my driving. If I go up to my boat, 65 miles I don't feel as though I've done any driving at all. Mistakes? Yeah, it still makes mistakes. The progress over the past four years has been absolutely amazing. For more than the first year it could only drive straight on streets. (I've also driven coast to coast and back twice. And several other long trips. Even in 2020 it handled the winding Pacific Coast Highway with few interventions.)
My son doesn't want a Tesla, but if he and my daughter in law have a baby? Grandpa's buying them a Model Y. He can sell his Audi or I can set fire to it. Either way.
Dirty Tesla seems very honest. I'm even familiar with the streets he drives on in and around Ann Arbor Michigan.
😮 22k for trade in OMG
Man it will be fixed so what who else takes care of the Customers like Tesla!
Eventually all older Teslas will be left behind as tech evolves and grows, just as old computers and phones at some point cannot be updated any more. Just an unfortunate fact of life . Personally , I skip up to 3 generations on my iPhones and iPads before upgrading and they don't cost anything close to a Tesla. I know , not apples and apples but no need to replace a relatively new car just because FSD won't work as well. I mean how often do you use FSD and is it really vital to your life?
I am not afraid I don’t hate Tesla I want what I paid for
Good Stuff! Still here! :)
I am sill with you.
I can buy a new Tesla, I own a model Y 2022. I want the new Y refresh. I never bought FSD, but I tried the free trial. Im still with you. I have a daughter that plays the violin, and I have to 100k college tuition for her.
36 Km/h = 22.5 mph = 36000 metres per hour = 36 metres per second.
So 3 seconds = 108 metres of distance at 36 km/h
and 216 metres (236 yards) at 72 km/h or 45 mph
imo that seems like a hell of a lot of distance to not be watching the road.
15:39 I don't think so
Yup still here
Totally agree about HW3 supervised FSD creating a lot of negativity towards Tesla and Elon. I have a 2020 model Y and have experienced actual regressions in my FSD performance to the point I don't want to use it. I am to the point of wanting to buy the Juniper Y when it comes out just for all the upgrades. My wife says forget it but she won't drive with FSD because it is "not'' perfect and she can see how it frustrates me! We will wait and see what Elon & Tesla come up with to make FSD unsupervised as promised! I am also waiting for the non founders series Cybertruck to be released shortly in Canada and hope I don't have buyers remorse since it will be used to tow our 7500 lb holiday trailer due to short range performance. I will option for the range extender battery if my 1200 watts of solar on the trailer and my 10,000 watt gas generator can't help me charge up when parked. Will have to avoid long trips IMO but am willing to take the risk since I can't go back to an ICE vehicle. My house and Model Y are powered by the sun for free from our roof top solar. I have been spoiled to own a TESLA for 4+ years + the profits I have made with Tesla stock also hasn't hurt! 😎🇨🇦 💎🙌 TESLA 2562 stocks 💪
I am a HW3 owner but feel that HW3 doesn’t have the horsepower to solve FSD.
Tesla will upgrade us to HW4 or HW5 eventually…
Thanks for the great video!
Till FSD is allowed here in Germany, i bet i get a new Hardware 5 or 6 kinda for my 2019 Model 3. :D
So i just wait, and be happy driving my model 3. :)
But i really want to see FSD on my "old" Car, even supervised would be mind blowing, and i could say for exaple to my coworkers, can your audi, vw, skoda do that? No?
My 6-7 (or more) can do that now! :D would be fun.
v13.2.x is outstanding and highly superior to v12.5.x. I used to experience phantom braking, overreaction to traffic lights or high beam from ongoing cars. All is gone with v13. Additionally I cannot explain with words how smooth it is in comparison with v12x
If I were you, with the quality and fairness of your videos, I would buy a Model 3 2024 in a heartbeat. Get an inventory or demo car + all the current promos and your UA-cam monetization will pay for it and keep your 2019 as a second car (as I did)
You won't regret. My teenager son is driving my 2019 now. Safest car on earth and peace of mind for me as his dad.
Hope my 2 cents helps. Keep it up with your great videos!
You’re kidding, right? 🙄
I was going to trade in my 3 but Tesla made it too hard to do and I only have 23000 miles on my 3
I sold my 2019 Model 3 RWD with 87,000 miles for $18K, four months ago. Private sale.
Just borrow or demo fsd4 cars and let us know if you need to upgrade or not lol
Thanks for a good grounded video.. 22Y Pro I had the exact same thoughts going through my head as far as pulling the trigger on a HW4 car. You are right we will get a chip and camera upgrade. I paid $7,500 FSD... I guess we need to hang in there and be patient. It's hard to do though when you see all these other videos out there.. Still on my first set of tires in obsolete.. 😂 come on!! Good video needed. I truly believe a big part of the problem is the lack of communication on Tesla's part. Or just being able to get the accurate information needed from Tesla not a secondary source!! That's not a knock on you.. Thx ✌️🇺🇸
Tesla Hardware 3 vehicles are more widely distributed worldwide than one might think. Even in Korea, where I am, there are many Hardware 3 vehicles, and among them, some are equipped with FSD. While there is a negative perception of Hardware 3 vehicles, Tesla will never abandon them.
Tesla sold these vehicles globally, and if they were to give up on Hardware 3, they would likely face lawsuits worldwide. Therefore, Tesla will continue to support these vehicles, and I believe the company should operate in this way. It is similar to how 2G phones gradually disappeared as smartphones became the majority.😊
I watched til the end. What is your HW version? I don't have a car, trying to decide what EV to get. Tesla FSD is not relevant in my country.
It’s a shame that Elon is not being more transparent and proactive in upgrading HW3 to HW4’
Is it entirely possible that he doesn’t have any plans and that’s why he’s not sharing them with you?
Das liegt vielleicht daran das HW3 direkt mit einem neuen Rechner auf HW5 aufgerüstet wird 😏
yes u should hold out for getting the ai4 car as buying car isnt as cheap as getting a new phone plus we all know ai5 will be release very soon, it is not like 5 to 10 years away so just wait for it
probably wait for ai5 on model Q if it suits you and u have more new stuff to talk about
Haha...glad I bought a Tesla just this week and am not involved in this drama...distance yourself from all this and drive your car😅
elon chose hate, conservatives hate consequences!
And people who paid for a hw3 upgrade out of pocket. Had i known i would have saved my money for a hw4 computer upgrade
Thank you for bringing this issue up. We have paid $18,000 for FSD ($8000 for our 3 and $10,000 for our Y) We are definitely being left out. Musk said 12.6 is as high as HW3 will go. Musk can pay for this upgrade himself. It would be just a rounding error for him. We have been waiting for FSD since 2019. We paid Tesla, $18,000 to develop this tech, now we can’t get full FSD on HW3. Come on Musk do the right thing. You are worth over $400 billion. Spend some of you wealth on your loyal Tesla customers and less time on politics, and get all the FSD HW3 Teslas upgraded to AI4-AI5 chips.
_Musk said 12.6 is as high as HW3 will go._
I'm not aware of this. Would you please share a link to this quote?
Why are Tesla owners so obsessed by self driving cars?
If Tesla does not address it soon there will be a class action especially those who paid for it. $15k a year later deprecated.
I was going to trade to more mile new warranty heat exchanger but I bought Tesla stock instead
I don't even have a Tesla 🤷♂️
My prediction they will never admit HW3 can’t do FSD Supervised. Then they never have to spend money on HW3 cars. You don’t believe me you only have to look at Model S&X with HW2. These are Tesla flagship cars and they never got upgraded for FSD features.
But. Tesla is going to 30 trillion they say in a couple years 😂😂😂😂
You bought the whole pig
On a certain moment HW4 will become irrelevant... That's the way things go....
My nagging worry is that HW3 will not be able to achieve FSD unsupervised and Tesla won't upgrade HW3 cars until HW5 comes out in case HW4 can't achieve unsupervised FSD.