Very interesting. However I don't understand the part about having the barrel angled up or down in relation to accuracy. A do understand the barrel being 'free floating' and that's where I believe you are getting the better accuracy. This is a well known fact. Moving the barrel up or down is simply related to the weight of the projectile, the power pushing the projectile and the distance the projectile needs to travel. If you truly think otherwise, please explain in a more specific detail. Much appreciated
Regardless if you dropped barrel you would have to compensate bty tilting gun up to make up slight drop, the accuracy changed due to harmonics not the fact that you lowered barrel unless you also change velocity
When the barrel is pointing too far up using slugs the downrange impact velocity is less then when the barrel is level or not pointing high...did it with pellets and shows up to a ~30fps difference per shot @ 50yd ...when you take it out to 100yd its even more...
I agree with Jose, you solved the issue with something else, has nothing to do with the angle of the barrel. The angle being changed might have may solved harmonic or other issues. Your comment about shooting at a higher arc and gravity having more of an effect is incorrect as well.
Air Velocity Sport slugs size .216 & .2165 shoot incredible out of these Nova Vista barrels as do the same size in NSA and mine prefer slugs between 17-22 grains. Right now I’m using NSA 20.2 grain .2165s and they are extremely accurate at 100 yards. Hopes this helps.
do i need to point out that is the barrel shroud not the barrel? or that in your newest video you are selling a barrel band which will defeat everything you just said in this video.
Good you found that improvement on that particular rifle,as with many standard firearms,freefloated barrels are the ticket to accuracy.It’s all about Harmonic vibrations 👍🏻
My Armada is deadly at distance with pellets but all goes to crap with anything that resembles a slug. I may play with shroud removal or removal of the front support, to see if I can get the barrel to resonate properly.
Every bullet, pellet and slug, heavy or lightweight, drops downward at the same speed, for some reason. To know that speed, hold one of those in the hand and let go. From the barrel it drops at exactly that speed, regardless of forward velocity. The greater the distance to the target, the more time the pellet is in the air, so the more time the pellet has to drop. A sniper has to maintain a very big holdover, because his bullet has to cover so much time and distance. A high curved trajectory effects bullet/pellet/slug accuracy zero. Some of the most accurate pellet guns shoot quite slowly by design, so must be aimed higher than a fast shooting gun. Yet they're very accurate. The artillery given by the western countries to Ukraine are exceptionally accurate, yet some rounds are sent at a very high trajectory. Again, high trajectory, per se, effects round accuracy Zero. You made 1 change to the rifle, James. The environment didn't change. Your noteworthy abilities likely didn't suddenly improve. So removing the set screws may have caused the increase in accuracy, by effecting the barrel harmonics. Maybe not if the barrel is held by the shroud anywhere along the shroud length. But you didn't demonstrate the gun/slug accuracy to us before removing the screws.
Thanks brother. Mine in 177cal loves Nielsen 12.5 slugs. 🎯 This is extremely interesting. This is the engineering at its finest. You just presented something I haven't seen before. This is exactly why I watch your videos. ❤💯
So how would I shoot an elevated shot using slugs and get performance? Hmm I can do with my 22 lr. And my 17 hm2. How does the slug know it’s pointed upwards? Must be a smart slug. Hmmm The slug is also pointed upwards above line of sight. Why? Cause it drops too just like a pellet and bullet out of a centerfire.
This is a classic example of logical falacy. There is a difference between Cause and Correlation, my friend. If the point of impact and velocity are constant between the before and after tests, the barrel remains on exactly the same axis.. Your result was not due to barrel axis / angle.
I am having trouble understanding your technic. The barrel does not touch the shroud. If anything I use grommets to stiffen my bull pup barrel to the shroud to stiffen the barrel. Shoots great. I have the 25 cal. I use the terminador Air guns kit. Have had point of impact shift with stock chassis flex. Now gun is ridged. But whatever works for you have at it. Good hunting.
Moving the shroud does not move the barrel since the shroud is attached to a spacer at the rear of the barrel that can pivot a little on the barrel itself. No barrel on anything ever made is "free floating" if it touches anything but the receiver. 10 minutes worth of gibberish because you changed the barrel harmonics without understanding what you're doing. Everything you said was nonsense.
@@jimihendrix5576 oh I definitely understand...see the newest uploads after this video just to prove my point with the barrel being angled higher or lower with a bore sighter with or without the barrel band set screws "moving your scope pt2"....also shooting completely free floating barrel no shroud getting 1/2moa at 50yd because I can...
Nothing you said made sense. The barrel is still not free floating. The arce of the shot doesn't affect the bullet proformance at all. It's not the slugs flight is nose up.
Greetings, Great information and thank you for taking your time. Q: Can you make a video showing step by step on how to adjust the trigger? I want to take the long play of the trigger so it would be short instead of a long pull to reach the 2nd stage. So, far nobody has explained step be step. We all owners of the Avenger will appreciated your expertise. Thank you.
On my Avenger .22 cal bullpup I use a barrel band and NSA .2165 dia 20.2 grain slugs reg set at 2300 psi and the hammer spring about 3 turns in and it holds MOA at 100 yards. It also has the adapter/moderator combo from Buck Rail that cost like 38-40$ shipped to me. For the money these Avenger series long and bullpup are very hard to beat.
Your wrong bro you doing that didn't change the barrel angel that's just thr shroud the barrel is not attached to the chroud in anyway inside that gun sorry boss your barrel sits like 4 inches inside the end of the shroud. So you doing thar to the shroud isn't adding any down angle to you barrel
Took too long to get to the point... It was like watching an addict scour the ground because he dropped his pocket. Or some click bait... "You wouldn't believe what removing this one thing can do... And 5000 clicks later it's still the same story. You might be right you might be wrong... I'll never know. Later bro.
@@coryb6722 True but fast forwarding through such click bait for the hope of finding the point without the help of Timeline markers is tedious at best... And a complete waste of time if you either can't find it or the author never gets there... I understand build up to help with algorithms but that tactic is a bit outdated since the arrival of TikTok. Now you're expected to get to the point a little sooner. And yes that includes me and my tendency to write books for txt, etc. Of course I'm old (44) and going senile lol. But I bet the longer I write the less interested you are in listening to what I have to say... Which is my only point. Particularly when I'm not really saying much of anything... And only try to lead to a point of saying that at some point I may say something. And as you use your brain to fast forward these words to see if I have yet to of said. Anything in the midst of my saying things. What if I already said the thing I was supposed to say... Should you rewind to try and find what was said. And how long would you say, that you would care to stay.. and spend your hard earned day... Caring to listen to anything I have to say. If I clearly don't care enough to say it. Or maybe I just don't have any attention span. So yeah I was rude my apologies but it felt like wasted time I will never get back... Just like it is for anyone who reads this 😜
So why didn't you call the first shot as a "sighter"? Try it again with your action cam mounted. Call the shot/group before you start shooting and show all 3 camera angles. Awful quick walk for 100yds, and no pic of a laser yardage. Hmmmmmm.....
Very interesting. However I don't understand the part about having the barrel angled up or down in relation to accuracy. A do understand the barrel being 'free floating' and that's where I believe you are getting the better accuracy. This is a well known fact. Moving the barrel up or down is simply related to the weight of the projectile, the power pushing the projectile and the distance the projectile needs to travel. If you truly think otherwise, please explain in a more specific detail. Much appreciated
Not sure in subsonic speed if it matters the same as in a rifle, but I would guess it’s a barrel harmonica thing more than anything else.
Regardless if you dropped barrel you would have to compensate bty tilting gun up to make up slight drop, the accuracy changed due to harmonics not the fact that you lowered barrel unless you also change velocity
When the barrel is pointing too far up using slugs the downrange impact velocity is less then when the barrel is level or not pointing high...did it with pellets and shows up to a ~30fps difference per shot @ 50yd ...when you take it out to 100yd its even more...
I agree with Jose, you solved the issue with something else, has nothing to do with the angle of the barrel. The angle being changed might have may solved harmonic or other issues. Your comment about shooting at a higher arc and gravity having more of an effect is incorrect as well.
Air Velocity Sport slugs size .216 & .2165 shoot incredible out of these Nova Vista barrels as do the same size in NSA and mine prefer slugs between 17-22 grains. Right now I’m using NSA 20.2 grain .2165s and they are extremely accurate at 100 yards. Hopes this helps.
I am using the .217 slugs in my NOTOS with great success so far short range and really need to go and pay $20 for a range day.
James, how is pellet accuracy affected after this change?
Slugs absolutely do not burn energy as fast as pellets.
This dude makes me lol. While he may have a great understanding of pneumatics, his understanding of ballistics is comical.
James you put out some of the best Avenger content. Always stretching the envelope! Thanks
Thanks!
thank you james ........ more great content ...... please keep the videos coming
Nice shooting. I have been test free floating barrel on my Avenger.22 to shoots slugs and I have good results...
Right on thanks Nuno
do i need to point out that is the barrel shroud not the barrel? or that in your newest video you are selling a barrel band which will defeat everything you just said in this video.
Lol ...
Good you found that improvement on that particular rifle,as with many standard firearms,freefloated barrels are the ticket to accuracy.It’s all about Harmonic vibrations 👍🏻
One-hundred-percent inaccurate information slugs do not lose more energy than pellets the heavier they are the more energy they carry to the target.
Thanks for some more great info. Enjoyed the video.
Glad you enjoyed it!
My Armada is deadly at distance with pellets but all goes to crap with anything that resembles a slug. I may play with shroud removal or removal of the front support, to see if I can get the barrel to resonate properly.
Right on!
I am trying to decide between the air ventur avenger or benjamin armada, but tbh i want a semi-Automatic, but can't find a quality one for under $800
Every bullet, pellet and slug, heavy or lightweight, drops downward at the same speed, for some reason.
To know that speed, hold one of those in the hand and let go. From the barrel it drops at exactly that speed, regardless of forward velocity.
The greater the distance to the target, the more time the pellet is in the air, so the more time the pellet has to drop.
A sniper has to maintain a very big holdover, because his bullet has to cover so much time and distance.
A high curved trajectory effects bullet/pellet/slug accuracy zero.
Some of the most accurate pellet guns shoot quite slowly by design, so must be aimed higher than a fast shooting gun. Yet they're very accurate.
The artillery given by the western countries to Ukraine are exceptionally accurate, yet some rounds are sent at a very high trajectory.
Again, high trajectory, per se, effects round accuracy Zero.
You made 1 change to the rifle, James. The environment didn't change. Your noteworthy abilities likely didn't suddenly improve.
So removing the set screws may have caused the increase in accuracy, by effecting the barrel harmonics.
Maybe not if the barrel is held by the shroud anywhere along the shroud length.
But you didn't demonstrate the gun/slug accuracy to us before removing the screws.
Gravity = 9.8 meters/second/second
I don't think the origin has that issue. The barrel sits slightly loose In the barrel band already. Seems to shoot .25cal slugs pretty good.
Awesome!
Thanks brother.
Mine in 177cal loves Nielsen 12.5 slugs. 🎯
This is extremely interesting. This is the engineering at its finest. You just presented something I haven't seen before. This is exactly why I watch your videos. ❤💯
Mine too
Thanks!
Does your POI change from one day shooting until the next shooting?
If there is a significant weather change I don't have poi shift just my groups open up
So how would I shoot an elevated shot using slugs and get performance? Hmm
I can do with my 22 lr. And my 17 hm2.
How does the slug know it’s pointed upwards?
Must be a smart slug. Hmmm
The slug is also pointed upwards above line of sight. Why?
Cause it drops too just like a pellet and bullet out of a centerfire.
I just started shooting slugs short range and already like them.
This is a classic example of logical falacy.
There is a difference between Cause and Correlation, my friend.
If the point of impact and velocity are constant between the before and after tests, the barrel remains on exactly the same axis..
Your result was not due to barrel axis / angle.
So even the newer Avengers you just take those screws out ?
I am having trouble understanding your technic. The barrel does not touch the shroud. If anything I use grommets to stiffen my bull pup barrel to the shroud to stiffen the barrel. Shoots great. I have the 25 cal. I use the terminador Air guns kit. Have had point of impact shift with stock chassis flex. Now gun is ridged. But whatever works for you have at it. Good hunting.
Great shooting.🤠
You removed the two white balls in font of the screws that push the shroud up onto the barrel band ?
I removed the screws all the way out on mine
The newer version has two plastic/silicon balls at the tip of the screw to protect the tube .. the older version doesnt have those balls.
Ola amigo Mi avenger tiene 4 vueltas del martillo en total para 1800 psi cuantas vueltas me recomienda darle al resorte
four to 5 turns is probably good for that...if you're shooting slugs , pellets you can turn it back
@@ALLABOUTAIRGUNS para diablos 14 gr tengo el regulador a 1800 y dos vueltas de afuera asia dentro qué tal está
Well done, new information again,thank you so much for your time and effort and all you do for the airgun world ,you are appreciated
Thanks!
Moving the shroud does not move the barrel since the shroud is attached to a spacer at the rear of the barrel that can pivot a little on the barrel itself. No barrel on anything ever made is "free floating" if it touches anything but the receiver. 10 minutes worth of gibberish because you changed the barrel harmonics without understanding what you're doing. Everything you said was nonsense.
Lol ok ...my shooting speaks for itself
@@ALLABOUTAIRGUNS I agree, you can shoot well without understanding.
@@jimihendrix5576 oh I definitely understand...see the newest uploads after this video just to prove my point with the barrel being angled higher or lower with a bore sighter with or without the barrel band set screws "moving your scope pt2"....also shooting completely free floating barrel no shroud getting 1/2moa at 50yd because I can...
Nothing you said made sense. The barrel is still not free floating. The arce of the shot doesn't affect the bullet proformance at all. It's not the slugs flight is nose up.
ok that's funny cause what I can do with slugs and pellets is unheard of...especially in budget guns, and I have valid of proof of my methods
7:01 😆 nice group though
Does this relate to the .177 also?
Not sure, I havent checked just seen most people have problems with slugs in 22
Greetings,
Great information and thank you for taking your time.
Q: Can you make a video showing step by step on how to adjust the trigger?
I want to take the long play of the trigger so it would be short instead of a long pull to reach the 2nd stage. So, far nobody has explained step be step. We all owners of the Avenger will appreciated your expertise. Thank you.
The bullpup shoot slugs diff than the rifle ?
when using the barrel band, the position is different per instructions in the manual than the rifle
On my Avenger .22 cal bullpup I use a barrel band and NSA .2165 dia 20.2 grain slugs reg set at 2300 psi and the hammer spring about 3 turns in and it holds MOA at 100 yards. It also has the adapter/moderator combo from Buck Rail that cost like 38-40$ shipped to me. For the money these Avenger series long and bullpup are very hard to beat.
Get the avenge x. It'd be better at shooting slugs
8:00 TO FIND OUT WHAT HE DID
Your wrong bro you doing that didn't change the barrel angel that's just thr shroud the barrel is not attached to the chroud in anyway inside that gun sorry boss your barrel sits like 4 inches inside the end of the shroud. So you doing thar to the shroud isn't adding any down angle to you barrel
Hmmm...the following videos I did after this proved it changed, I know the Avenger very very well
Slugs being much heavier will drop faster.
😂🤣😂🤣
Took too long to get to the point... It was like watching an addict scour the ground because he dropped his pocket. Or some click bait... "You wouldn't believe what removing this one thing can do... And 5000 clicks later it's still the same story. You might be right you might be wrong... I'll never know. Later bro.
the funny thing about youtube is you can fast forward the video
@@coryb6722 True but fast forwarding through such click bait for the hope of finding the point without the help of Timeline markers is tedious at best... And a complete waste of time if you either can't find it or the author never gets there... I understand build up to help with algorithms but that tactic is a bit outdated since the arrival of TikTok. Now you're expected to get to the point a little sooner. And yes that includes me and my tendency to write books for txt, etc. Of course I'm old (44) and going senile lol. But I bet the longer I write the less interested you are in listening to what I have to say... Which is my only point. Particularly when I'm not really saying much of anything... And only try to lead to a point of saying that at some point I may say something. And as you use your brain to fast forward these words to see if I have yet to of said. Anything in the midst of my saying things. What if I already said the thing I was supposed to say... Should you rewind to try and find what was said. And how long would you say, that you would care to stay.. and spend your hard earned day... Caring to listen to anything I have to say. If I clearly don't care enough to say it. Or maybe I just don't have any attention span. So yeah I was rude my apologies but it felt like wasted time I will never get back... Just like it is for anyone who reads this 😜
@@barney8567 lol
So why didn't you call the first shot as a "sighter"? Try it again with your action cam mounted. Call the shot/group before you start shooting and show all 3 camera angles. Awful quick walk for 100yds, and no pic of a laser yardage. Hmmmmmm.....
Count the steps...I dont lie about my range and shoot at 100yd in several other videos at same spot
My avenger loves slugs shoots them perfect I didn’t have to do that.