CRASHING a CNC Machine... $15,000 Damage in a Second
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- Опубліковано 5 вер 2021
- Always double check EVERYTHING... You do not want this happening to you! Don't be that machinist in the machine shop...
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#CNC #Machining #Machinist - Наука та технологія
As AvE says, “you’re the softest thing in the shop”.
I just had a drill bit removed from my foot. I've lost the ability to move all toes upward, except for my big toe.
@@1992jamo sorry to hear that. Does it effect you a lot or do you think you’ll get used to it.
@@PDPIE1029 Because it's tightly bandaged and I can't really walk on it at the moment I'm not sure what effect it will have on my walking to be honest.
It's upsetting to see part of your body not working, but I can still move my toes downward, so hopefully it's not going to affect me much.
@@1992jamo best of luck my friend!
This is true. He’s as wise as he is funny
When I was just starting out I crashed an auxiliary spindle because the programmer interrupted me just as I was setting the Z offset. Plunged straight into the magnetic base... I look to the side and there he is, the owner... He looks at it, and goes away.
5 min later he is back with two Budweisers, opens the bottles throwing the caps in the scrap bin, gives one to me, and asks "so... what's the plan now?" LOL chillest boss ever.
And what did you do?
@@platin2148 This was in a VMC, in a moldmaking company. The spindle was there to raise the max RPM for a raster finish OP (it got rebuilt at a later date). Here's what I did:
-Checked the entire machine for additional unseen damage
-Checked the perpendicularity if the main spindle to the table using a precision granite square
-Stoned out the high spots on the magnetic chuck
-Re-aligned and re-centered the part
-Removed the damaged spindle, put a new endmill on Kojex toolholder (TRIPLE CHECKING THE Z OFFSET THIS TIME) and then ran the program at a reduced feed to account for the reduced RPM. Job turned out fine.
Might I add, this all happened at 4:30PM on a friday LOL!
That's a good man right there. Knows how to treat his humans. Hope he was a good boss after that too, thanks for sharing this story man.
@@OwnerOfOwn He did treat us all really well. But unfortunately his company ran into financial trouble due to a few not so great employees. I left shortly before he went bust.
EVERY operator has a crash... I started my first ever CNC job ever three months ago and was cruzing through training. I was just starting basic programs and made a slip in my G code. G0W-5. Ill never forget that line of code. Five inches into the face of a 50 inch spindle going 340 rpm... I brought hell to earth for a split second...
Not a machinist here just an operator, but while being trained on making offset changes my supervisor accidentally added a couple zeros on the feed rate and depth of cut on the y axis. 1000% feed rate and 2 inches turned to 20. I've been to concerts and never felt the building shake that much
Lol
Always single block through and make sure you have tool clearance. Remember hebdidnt hit cycle start you did lol
@@Tnj8228 actually I was simply watching at the time, he did literally everything from start to crash lol
@@quinthightower95 nice 👌
And so they say: "Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted."
If this day was not your friend, it was your teacher.
That's a very good saying. I love it.
"I did this thing and all i got was this stupid tshirt"
"Experience is a cruel teacher; it gives a test before presenting the lesson"
As a self taught progammer/machinest who got let loose on a £500,000 machine. I still remember the feeling from the first time I crashed it. I was afraid of G91 for a while after it, G91 used well is a powerful tool. but with great power comes great boomabilty.
Haha perfect analogy.
Great Boomability. LOL... Wrapping G91 Code in a Subprogram For Facing, slotting, Soft material Profile roughing is one of the favorite things I taught myself.... I even use G91 in 4kw laser when cutting long strips of material to prevent warping. I can copy paste the special code until it reaches the end of the cut.
Yeah don't use G91 triple check your CAM and setup use single block turn your rapid down and you'll be good. If your lucky the only thing you'll break is a tool.
For those who don't know, G91 triggers relative positioning. It is also disabled on my machine.
G96 facing of 500 dia got up to over 600rpm job almost came out absolutely Shat it
Being a tradesmen in Machine Tool Repair. I've had to repair many operators mistakes. Many of them were experienced craftsmen. The most memorable one was we just rebuilt a 50' gear slasher and the operator, while setting up the machine, forgot to move the steadyrest out of the way and jammed the table. Done horrible damage to the machine. Luckily, most of the damage was to the differential gearbox and the main workwheel on the table wasn't damaged. The operator had 25 years in the craft and it goes to show that mistakes can happen to the best of them.
Confidence kills. Fear keeps you alive.
"that machine will go though flesh" if something goes through forged steel like someone inserting a birthday candle into a cake, it'll go through you like you weren't there lol.
There are two kinds of machinist -- those who have crashed, and those who WILL crash. Those who say, "I've never crashed a machine," either haven't been in the industry long enough or they're bald-faced liars.
Observation from nearly forty years in The Greatest Trade on Earth -- machinist. And yes, I had some pretty bad crashes in my career.
Never let a fresh program rip. I always run graphics first then single block and slow her down using the override. Feed hold when close to part and use distance to go on position page. Been running cnc since early nineties and people always get bit in the butt when they get too comfortable. Better to adhere to safe routines for new programs, new tools, any changes really. Never seen anyone ram a Facemill thru a vise an into a table yet tho. That must've been a sight
I follow that exact same process even when setting up a proven program. But as soon as I hit that M30 and all my dimensions are good, it's straight balls to the walls, 100% rapid and tweaking speeds and feeds to get that program going faster
@@v6turbobuick Same and even when i continue the same program and parts the next morning, i always slow down the feed to 40% for the first one and then if everything is good i do one full speed watching it to make sure everything is good. Then i can start running the cnc along with a milling (or two) all at the same time.
This is truth. We had a new programmer come in and his programs were absolutely dogshit. Not because he was a bad programmer but because he wasn't used to going back and forth on FANUC and OKUMA consoles. The G codes are different and a single typo can send your tool rapid into a spindle doing 4000rpm. We had a few crashes in his first months but he became a solid programmer. It's (usually) not an operators fault when there's a crash, he's just there to change inserts, change offsets, and press the green button. Usually that's on the setup guy or the programmer. Unfortunately it's the operator that will get a jaw thrown through his skull or his arm ripped off on someone else's mistake. Please stay safe in the shop.
Two things: The biggest thing I tell people is, if it doesn't look right, it probably isn't.
The other thing is, the only time I will EVER get upset at someone in a shop, is when they don't respect the fact that the machines will kill you. Things like opening the door while it's running, loosening a vice while it's rapiding. Sticking your head in the machine while it's stopped but on memory mode ON 100% rapid. I'm huge on that. Always put the machine on edit mode if you have to put yourself in such an unfortunate position. There's so much more, and it's the only time I use the word 'fired', as in, in any other shop, that would have gotten them fired, because it's better than the alternative, which is death or disfigurement.
My shop teacher makes it a point to show us the after effects of what lathes and other machines can do to soft squishy humans... im mentally scarred for life from what i saw but ill never goof off around any equipment in my shop. i think people need to see these videos so they dont end up in one.
@@GinjaNinja93 Agreed, it's one thing to say "don't wear baggy clothes around a lathe" it's another to see it on video. It's the safety lesson that requires no explaining.
I operated a CNC lathe. I didn't program it. But I could make adjustments for tool wear and replacement. It wasn't as scary as the mechanical lathe which had no safeties except emergency stop. But you still had to respect it and follow rules. I messed up a few times on paper. Fortunately those mistakes are easy to fix.
I always turn the rapid down to zero unless I want it moving. Nothing happens unless I let it. I am the gatekeeper of the code.
Safety safety safety. Respect that you could get annihilated without the machine missing a beat. I used to run a 39”x255” open lathe. 20’ of spinning 10” thick death, all day.
@@GinjaNinja93 the scariest machines personally are lathes, its so easy to kill someone, my step-uncle got his arm taken by a lathe, he needed a cage due to his bone being almost fragmanted to dust(he was conventional machinist)
ive seen quite a few LiveLeak lathe death and you can die in a second by having your sleeve being taken by it
if i have something to say to save your life while working on a conventional lathes, do not wear sleeves
The first step in learning cnc is to learn how a crash can happen and what are the results of a big crash.
G0 = crashy time
Regarding the results of a big crash, even though that $15,000 price tag for repairs sounds bad by itself, that's not even the true cost. Machine down time for repair (or sitting idle if it cannot be used until repaired) is a 'hidden cost,' not to mention potential scrap costs of making parts that are out of tolerance due to the damaged machine's inability to hold tolerances/make accurate parts.
This may not seem like a huge issue in a larger operation with multiple machines, but if it's a one-person shop and you just crashed your only machine...OUCH! And then there is the 'fear factor,' the operator's drop in confidence as they may now be unsure of what happened and how to prevent it from happening again, resulting in longer setup times, running everything at 10% rapid, etc. Of course, this would be the least of my worries as I'd want people to be confident in what they are doing, not just because they THINK they set it up correctly, but because they KNOW, after physically checking, etc.
@@Dyna78 Fear is a good thing. I work with some machinists who have zero fear. The tool vendors LOVE them.
On the subject of CNC accidents, don't look for lathe fatalities if you're faint of heart.
Not something you can forget...
Fuck that
"I always go top down" That should be a cardinal rule. My take on that same idea is to develop a sequence, check this, check that and do it the same way every time so that it becomes habit so if your mind is on something else, your autopilot will catch a lot of potential mistakes. When when you become a go to guy with responsibilities beyond that one machine, you will increasingly have to stop to answer a question, or go take care of something else, when you come back to the setup, start back at the top of your checklist and go line by line to make sure you dont skip anything. Once the whole setup is completed, go over each step in your setup sequence again. I cant tell you how many times I prevented a blow up by going through my setup sequence again and catching that an offset was not changed or recorded, I skipped over changing out a tool or tightening a clamp, it happens when you are pulled 40 directions. For me it is an emotional moment when I catch my own mistake, kicking myself for missing it on the first pass, knowing what could have happened if I had not double checked and at the same time celebrating that I caught it and didnt blow anything up. It can happen, it will happen if you become overconfident and dont double check so dont get cocky about it or you will be humbled, and as this video describes it can be severely humbling. The big boss might write off a chipped 1/2" endmill as normal wear and tear but if you wreck a clamp and warp a spindle, the big boss will never forget that and it will take years to earn back trust. Not everyone is capable of being a machinist, a few just arent smart enough to grasp it all, some dont have the attention span, perception and sustained focus to notice when something isnt quite right or too slow to abort properly when they do notice, some cant handle the physical aspects of it, but the main issue that precludes someone being a good machinist is that some wont accept full responsibility for their own actions.
Wow, that was a great read and excellent advice. Thank you.
Great story!
I have been a manual machinist most of 20 years, CAD CAM programming for 8 years and do the setup 99% of the time. I STILL slow the rapids on first runs!!
Same here, been at this for 25 years. I always go slow on the first rapids. One mistake a $2mil part is toast so bad idea to go fast right away.
You'd think that's common sense. Whenever i press cycle start on a new program or tool I've set the feed override to 0% before lol
@@chas1878 You would think wouldn’t you. I’ve had guys actually hit cycle start and walk away from the machine. Or leave in the middle of a run. It’d be one thing if it was just a small part that had a minimal cost, but we machine very expensive parts. So it’s not worth the risk, one reason we will never go lights out or anything like that.
5% rapid is how I use bathroom brakes
@@MegaCabCummins6 Your company is losing money that is on the table and most likely not getting work it could have had.
Forty plus years in the trade - top machinist in the shop, one of the top programmers, and still every so often I destroy something (usually because of a distraction), once a thirty thousand dollar detail.
This is exactly why I take issue with running any more than two machines or them not being near each other. I've had to run as many as four machines at once - none near the others.
I've butt heads with managers and owners over the above problem as well as the habit of some operators paying more attention to something other than their machines, all it takes is one broken tool/insert, an improperly setup job or a hand tool left in the machine to end up costing thousands of dollars.
Too much 'multitasking' is false economy, one healthy mistake wipes out any money saved by overloading operators and machinists!
They sometimes have us running 6 machines at our place, I hate it cause I know I can’t get to the other machine quick enough if I hear something 😂
Welcome to the club... 3 machines for my 1st job and my 3rd job $14/hr (2018) and $16/hr (2020). I was extremely unhappy at that point. I have trust issues with aerospace companies now.
@@themattrixrevolution
Welcome to?
I was more like a charter member...
Some shop owners have been doing it since I started - 1977.
Back then was different - not worse or better, just different.
They'd have you run both standard and NC machines several at a time.
I say NC because only a few shops had CNC machines - which are closed loop vs. NC which didn't measure it's moves to double check it's moves.
It made things REAL interesting.
@@willyharris4199
Amen, they probably blame you if there's a problem too...
Needless to say, sometimes we work for greedy people.
@@Motor-City-Mike yeah, they got me doing it right now, I’m by myself on the shop floor there’s two machines need setting up and 4 to operate, perfect start to the Monday morning 😂
Our old metal work teacher was missing his right thumb and index finger.
Dont ask he would say..lol
There are two types of machinists, those who have crashed and those who haven't crashed yet.
Does cutting a channel 1" wide by 1/4" deep and 6 inch long count as a crash? If yes, I may have crashed.
I crashed too😭😅
I ran Bridgeport VMC in the mid 90's, and it was nerve wracking every time the first run of the program. I never had a serious crash, but it caused me to switch jobs because of the stress I caused myself on the first runs. I hated that one aspect of the job and wished I could have handled that stress better...
I hate to hear that man, handling that level of stress is what sets a machinist apart from everybody else. Give the trade another shot, it's detrimental to your mental health but damn it's a good time.
I always make sure the setup guy/operator knows exactly what happened after a crash. I can usually reverse their setup and find out if it was the physical setup or programming or tool/machine offset issues. Even if a setup takes 3 hours, that’s better than the machine being down for days and thousands spent on repairs. With time, you’ll get a groove going during setups and you’ll be faster AND more confident.
I find such situations so serious that I’m prone to laugh too.
My brother told me stories about when he worked at "this place" . They would turn semi brake drums and some dill hole would load them wrong and the machine would throw the part and blow the door off the machine. So yes, super dangerous work. I spent a year doing it, tears up your hands, and back! Thank you for the video, great story, stay well!
The number one thing that has made me successful in machining is double checking my work, taking my time, doing it right and listening to my mentors. You could be faster than me but if you're crashing machines and parts are out of spec you're costing the company valuable time and money.
Boom Time Stamps from "smallest" to "biggest"!
2:47 (smallest) "boom"
3:18 (medium small) "Boom."
3:23 (Medium Boom) "Boom!"
3:07 (Ultimate, Over 9000 Boom with a pre-smack) *smack* "BOOOOOMMMMM!!!!!"
Crashing a machine. Titan: haha
Used to run an Okuma 5 axis Bridge Mill in a german auto company. Remember drilling holes for guide pillars in a car panel press tool cast iron base. 120mm diameter spade drill, Cat 50 and 600mm long. Z height was off by 25mm - when a spade drill that size rapids down in Z and crashed on a machine that size. Moved the entire casting. Brown trouser moment. Safety first. Check the Z, check the Z. CHECK YOUR Z.
Machine damage ZERO - that machine could take 1 400mm diameter facemill with a 10mm depth of cut in cast iron with no problem. New insert needed for the drill lol.
Bloody hell. That's probably the biggest crash i've heard.
@@harindugamlath There was an offset in the G54 Z value from a previous setup. You will only do it once !!
Hey Titan, I want to thank you because I was in a dark place and I stumbled on one your talks. It inspired me to get it together because there is always light at the end of the tunnel.
There a a few rules in my company:
- Never talk to a person who has his hands on the machine. Wait until he's ready.
- Never trust a new program or a program you run the first time that day. Stay at the machine, hand on the feed regulator.
- If you tamper with the safety equipment of a machine, you are fired.
The only really bad crashes we had so far was a faulty CAM post processor (no tilt table reset when changing the coordinate system) and a bug in the machine controls (not stopping the spindle after resuming an interrupted tool change): A complete geometry overhaul and a new tool changer gearbox.
Fortunately there was a machine insurance covering these damages.
The other crashes were below 2k (mainly on the CNC lathe).
Love the content you put out man, really appreciate it.
Love from Australia
I am so glad I found this chanel. Thank you, Titan. I am starting so late in this game but I finally found something I am passionate about. I hope I can accept all the challenges and not quit persuing the skills of being a machinist.
I work in screen printing on an automatic pneumatic press. Lotta moving parts and you work incredibly closely with the machine. You have to have rhythm to be an operator to load the press. A lot of people don't TRULY respect it, I've seen a press tear an aluminum pallet (about 1/4" thick billet aluminum) in half like it was Nothing. Tissue paper. Once we had someone thrown into the press in what I believed to be the "kill zone". They survived somehow, but with a VERY fucked up back. I still have the security footage. Gives me goosebumps thinkin about it
Titan-BEST talk ever. Our newish VF-1 arrives tomorrow.
The rumors are , new Haas are trouble. Please let me know.
right on. I have been a machinist for 30 years.Seen too many accidents by distractions.
There's not an engineer worth his salt that wouldn't laugh whatever the cost, short of injury or worse, given that moment and especially the perfect kiss of death administered beforehand. Beautiful.
Sometimes I still see the mill crash the probe on the table with the rapid feed in my dreams.
We spun the probe at 8500 last month. Seems to still work.
In 100 years this video will be in some kind of museum and it will be called art.
I ran a 1/2 in endmill into a 1/2 collet on a HAAS trunion. Luckily for me, I was at center of part, and all I did was strip a collet and a Z servo alarm. My boss just told me to go outside and take a smoke break to cool off and come back in 10. Was my first crash ever on my first 5 axis setup.
Edit: That was two months into my "apprenticeship" and I've been there for 4 years now, doing very well. Haven't crashed a spindle into the table since. *Knocks on wood*
I was running parts a while back, typically I run most of the program at 5% rapid, i missed putting a G01 after a G00 and because of the 5% I didn't catch the difference in speed. My boss decided to come out for the second run and i went 100%...neither him nor I were thrilled with the results.
Don't judge me, but the second you said "BOOM", I busted out laughing.. Only because I have been there, seen that and been alternately Doubled over with laughter and Sick to my stomach... Yep, When I was teaching my son, I told him that as much as these machines are amazing, and capable of incredible work... They DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU ONE WHIT... THey will KILL YOU as soon as WORK FOR YOU.... You are an Inspiration.
Reminds me about when I worked at a company whos name I cannot mention here.
They had multiple CNC lathes.
Some colleagues and I had gone, taking our break, when we all of a sudden we here one of the lathes change speed and short after there came a boom and the electricity cabinet throw sparks.
What had happened was, that the lathe had loosened the element after it had come up to speed, and even though the worked had pressed the emergency stop, the element kept on spinning and was thrown through the shield of the lathe, into the cabinet that provider electricity and control to the lathe.
Non got hurt, but damn it was scary.
From the point we heard it go bad, it only took seconds for everyone to get down on the floor.
Early in my career I learned this lesson the hard way. Was working on an FMS, running 6 Makino Mag1s and 2 workstations. We had a job that was set on a wide fixture surrounded a 5' billet of aluminum that had multiple floating clamps. There was a probing program that probed clearances on those clamps to make sure they were out of the way of the toolpath. So set the job and sent the fixture into a machine to pick up datums and run the probe. So I was trained to adjust the clamps to the probing path because if you'd send it back to the workstation, you'd lose all reference for the probe path. I did that and everything was done. Now here comes the brain fart. Since I was at the machine I became complacent and thought it ran like any other standalone machine. There was a Z retract at the beginning of the program for safety so I could close the door and press start. Neglecting the fact that this was an FMS and by pressing the start button the server would erase the current program and load a different program to run the toolpath. In a fraction of a second before I could look up at the screen, BOOM! The first move in the toolpath was a b axis rotation that had the fixture slap the spindle upside the head. Probe went flying, housing cracked and the 120kw spindle cocked in a way I've never seen spindles moved before then or anytime after. I just stood there dumbfounded in shock and when I realized what happened, I knew it was the end of my career. Went back to a workstation to fill out a crash report and called my supervisor. Well after the investigation they found that they couldn't blame me and it was due to a procedural issues and bad training. Cost of the crash was north of 300k and I was surprised that I was just told to be more careful. I still blame myself for being so complacent and have changed my process to reflect that. Every action you take must be intentional and you must KNOW the result of it. Making assumptions and being complacent during setup is unnecessarily risky. I've made other mistakes but that was the most damage I've ever done.
$40,000 crash for me. I wanted to throw up. It all went well for the week I was drilling holes on this huge transfer roller. All I had to do was rotate the a axis and reset zero. I had been doing this all week. Well I rotate the 4th axis, set a to zero, and hit the start button. WHAMMM!!!! First drill rapids straight into the part. They said I must have set the z axis to zero instead of a, but it crashed right where it was supposed to drill the next hole. Till this day I still don't know for sure what happened. I was running a Fadal. We had one that I ran in the other shop that would occasionally lose its zero and I thought it was a quirk of that particular machine. Now when I change any setting I always turn down the rapid and slowly turn the dial up when I see it ain't gonna crash.
One friend had a 5 axis Hermele....and the feed knob was just worn out....
Always with first time running a program he reduced feed from 30 m per minute to slow...and when finally through program he left it 100 percent.
But 1 time I saw an sk40 toolholder cracked from top to bottom. Dont ask he said...... there was a huge T-drill of 50mm in a workpiece still 15 mm in it. It had to be lifted out in manual mode then moved in either x or y axis then lifted 15 mm down. Then automatic tool change could be done. But customer came walking in asking : is it ready??
He answered: yes ...only have to retract the 50 mm T-drill out ... And he pushes on the automatic tool change knob.... Then in high speed the y axis pulled the tool behind for bringing it to toolchanger in highest speed....completely ruining the sk40 cone , the spindle bearings , the geometry of the z and y axis.....and the workpiece which off course was expensive and a complete factory was standing still.... Damage : 55000 dollars..... only on the milling machine.
wow, that was intense and sounds like more than one mistake
@@NARKISDUDE it just was 1 mistake. Being distracted by customer asking or piece was ready...then he switched himself to auto-mode pushing the automatic tool chance button......
Aaaahhhhhhh...
Do double check everything! Even small things in a machine shop that are not even the machine itself can be LIFE ALTERING!
I ran a CNC lathe for a company 5 years ago that moved everything from a plant in Virginia they shut down to our plant in Ohio.
They had my lathe that I used for barrels set up and a straightening area to get the barrels running concentric by jacking up the barrel and hitting the "high side" with a hammer.
Well the jack wasn't fixed to the floor and it tipped over and a 2 ton barrel I had jacked up crashed down with my hand inside the barrel.
My left hand middle finger and ring finger were split in two and my pointer finger was completely crushed off.
Double check everything and even if something just feels unsafe, bring it up to management and be a thorn in their side to get it fixed!
I'm sure Titan and anyone else worth their weight in this industry will be the first to tell you: Nothing in this industry is worth someone's life, or limb. If you can't do it safely, don't do it at all!
Intelligence is known a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is knowing it doesn’t belong in a fruit salad.
So....did Billy go on to become a Great CNC machinist?
I hope so!
Awesome videos!
I saw the owner of a shop crash a big 4 axis machining center pretty mush as you saw that crash.
"Green button. BOOM!"
AS loud as any car door slam I've heard (plus the echo). $10,000 to repair. Plus a month or so.
Once the machine was fixed...
He did it again. First thing. This time the spindle was noisy after, but we were still roughing on that machine when I quit a few months later.
Reason for the 2 crashes.
Mom and Pop shop. Literally.
Plus their kids and 5 of us non-fam.
Pop did all the programming. Every program had errors when first loaded. We all had to catch and debug the crashes out during slow/line by line first piece runs.
When I started pop normally stayed in the office. For some reason he decided to get back in the game on the floor. He was losing his edge. And... He drank with lunch.
Luckily only machines were hurt.
I started laughing when he said I started laughing 😂😂😂
i was drilling something on a horizontal table mill. BIG ass mill. well when we chucked a part up to start over, we must have hit the table feed lever with a fork because it's sort of out of the way where you can't bump into it easily. anyway, the feed was going so slowly that you couldn't really tell it was moving with your eye without sitting still and looking at it for a while lol. so i am waiting for this big spade bit to creep through the part and i'm sweeping the floor. depending on the bit, it can take a pretty long time to get through there. well the table feed was moving roughly at the same speed that the drill was feeding in, so it just scooped a big chunk laterally away from center toward the outer bolt circle. it's the craziest looking piece of scrap metal ever. everybody asks, "what in the hell happened to that thing," when they're walking through the shop.
When i was inspecting for the Big Orange Helicopter company they decided to start making their own blade spars and had just bought a new machine to run them on and they had written a program and put the material in the machine and hit the green button and in a few seconds we heard the most gawd awful sound known to any machinist or inspector. i looked around and every inspector in the rooms hair was standing on end and all together now "DAMN, there's one we won't be inspecting.
Is it me or Titan is a big bro, I would love to work by his side!!!
Sometimes it's best to not be friends with a boss. I worked for my best friend for a couple years and I slacked off at times. Working for a hard boss that will fire you in a heartbeat is good for you, you learn a lot faster and you work much differently. I had another boss that was a terrific guy, but he had his hard side when you messed up. The worst thing you could do is make a simple mistake that would have been avoided by taking 5 seconds to ask a question instead of charging ahead. A little bit of fear and respect helps on the job sometimes.
Like 2 weeks ago.my turret wont rotate i one direction but will rotate in the other.so i have to rotate to the next 2 or 3 tools so it can rotate to the tool i need.so i change the program and i crashed twice i 2 hours..first one i for got to take in account of the length of my drill the 2nd one i for got to put a decimal point behind the z.so it went up 8 inches .100 infront and not 8 or 10 inches and rotated in to the chuck.so i went home for the rest of the day.i was sooo mad at myself.im usually good at checking over the changes i made.
I was always taught "Don't stick your fingers where you wouldn't stick your 🐓" It is even useful outside of machining 🤣🤣🤣
Some one bothered me one time in a machine shop...I sawed into my finger on a band saw...I learned
I have dreams of crashing my cnc. I'm pressing feed hold and it keeps moving, I press E STOP and it still keeps moving, I turn machine off and it still keeps moving, what a nightmare
No way. I crashed one time and had a dream like that after it happened. Hit E stop and it was still crashing and trying to feed.
@@matthewbest1104 horrible dreams aren't they. You just can't stop it from crashing no matter what you do 😂
As my old milling teacher used to say: "Now, you might be big. You might be tough. But these things don't fucking care, because if you mess around, son, you're not gonna need lube, you're gonna _be_ the lube."
...
And he was right. Not 12 weeks later, one of my classmates damn near lost his hand from a lathe chisel snapping off and a 2" shard of metal blew through his left hand. If his hand had been turned 50 degrees more, he'd have lost it. It 'only grazed it', cutting his entire palm to the bone, and chipping part of the bone as well.
And the lathe didn't care.
It just kept going.
Luckily i never witnessed it in person, but i've seen what these things can do online.
People wrapped around a chuck in ways that they shouldn't.
Take safety seriously.
Respect the machinery, and it will respect your right to live.
My worst damage was 5k euros
Z axe in G0 at F30000 without H utensil corrector
Writing in rush is always dangerous XD
Brother! Your content is SO Good!!! It’s not only great technical education, but also tremendous life ministry!
It's like driving a car. One moment distracted, not looking and then - as you said - BOOM!
So, the red STOP button right next to the green START button is your best friend in a test run if you don't want to run single blocks.
Always your hand right beside it, so you can stop immediately, especially when the tool is coming down to the part. (I can't count the times my employees push the start and then turn around to do something else in a test run)
Bad things can also happen, while the machine runs in a series. Always be in a 5-10 sec. range to your machine and don't let it run, w/o being at least in hearing distance
I am just an operator that started a few months ago but have had some
Gnarly crashes already, a couple of months ago I was boring a steel log and had stepped away momentarily to deburr a part and when I stepped back there was a waterfall of sparks coming out of the part, still spinning and before I could even press e-stop the machine had stopped itself, and the tool had friction welded itself to the part, more recently I got distracted while editing the premade program with a new part I had to run quickly and had forgot to change the height value from 1.3 inches to 5.5. You can guess what happened
MAN! You made my morning! THank YOU! Love the channel. Rock on
Details are very important, even a decimal point can be disastrous. About 10 years ago I was near a Cincinnati Maxim that a tool was off by a decimal point. The tombstone took the tool holder right out of the spindle. 40 feet away was too close on that one.
Just did that a couple of weeks ago. Floating tap holder, 1/4-20 threaded hole . . . was talking to a guy while I was modifying the program in the post-editor and trying to finish up this part. Instead of 0.400" deep I missed the decimal place and it actually ended up being 4.000". Had my finger on the e-stop but it didn't matter. By the time I realized it looked weird, it had already driven the toolholder into the part. Luckily it was aluminum so it only destroyed the part, the tap, and the collet (checked runout on the holder, it was fine). Could have been way worse but now I make sure if I'm talking to someone (customer or employee) I make them wait until I am done with the post editor.
Been there done that :D Trained more than 10 machinists over 10+ years on two big CNC machines and we have had those 10-30k crashes many times. And not always by the apprentice XD
Good talk. Hopefully he learned from the experience and you helped settle him down. Hopefully he will be back in the saddle and be a great CNC programmer and operator thanks to you.
Btw...
You can consider yourself as experienced machinist, when you are able to listen to your machine while you are not in sight and still being able to identify which tool is currently running, at which part of the operation the tool already is and if everything runs as it should. Only then it is ok, to get out of sight.
Artis has a product called GEMCMS that can't avoid collisions but can stop them within .001 second.
99% of crashes will be on the first move or the first move with a new tool. I always instruct my operators to watch the first move, stop when 1" above the part in the first Z down to the part, check distance to go, check the following move in the g-code, make sure those numbers make sense, then proceed. If we have run this through Vericut the rest of the program is good to go, you can walk away. We run Makinos and DMGs only, so no cheap machines. We seldom run Vericut on our VMC so proving that out is more involved. We also have the machines check the length of tools via a 'first use' macro. We have put so much work into preventing this it is hard to believe. In 15 years we have lost one spindle due to a crash and it was because the operator violated SOP and didn't measure the raw stock he loaded (Makino cell) and it crashed at 10:30pm. It is really hard to overcome violated procedures no matter how hard one tries...
That’s a good one! We all got those big ones but as my current boss says ‘this is how we learn…’ we all make mistakes even the best of us
On our Okuma LB 15, we had a clamping failure amd the part (5" dia by 1 inch thick MS) left the chuck and lifted the sliding guard off the machine. Had to have a new chuck, new rear sliding guard and a headstock re build. Oh happy day!.
Thanks for sharing. There are safeties. I never setup machines. But I saw set-up and engineering take things slow and one step at a time. It didn't run full speed or more than one step at a time until checked and rechecked. My tool adjustments were always recorded on paper along with the previous setting. It takes a little time. But it also saves mistakes. Mistakes on paper are easier to fix.
Single block after setup. Double check your setup every time. Doing this for over twenty years, got burned as well.
Single block wouldn't have stopped that crash. Lol it's a bad offset. You can't see that in the program. I always feed hold and check position visually during the first rapid down close to the part to make sure all is good.
@@joshmdmd I‘ve forgot to mention that I always go in at 5% of the rapid feed rate, so I can see trouble
coming when the tool comes too close to the part. I also program a 2” above zero, so trouble can be avoided. Mostly the 2” above zero turns the coolant on as well, then rapid to .1” to start the actual machining. You are correct that offsets are the real killer.
I watched an operator plunge a 6” facemill RIGHT into the T-slot base FIRST program on a BRAND new haas VM lol the machine was NEVER right…….
being a HAAS it probably never was to start with
I was a welder, green, but great with MIG. But new and paid 15$ an hour. I was shop cleaner too, low man on the totem pool. But I was going to school so to speak while working there. Others were paid more, but I made more mistakes, nothing THAT expensive Lol, but just a time delays which add up. Be patient, take your time and learn and listen.
Shoot, that's one single shift where I work. Non-stop crashes. Yes it's a large manufacturing plant, so they soak it up and move on. I've seen a brand new $250k Okuma crashed on first run, so bad it cracked the base casting and was junked. Never even ran a part! And with the employment shortage it's getting worse. No accountability enforced since they are afraid of losing anyone else. Oh the stories I can tell. Actually, it doesn't even phase me anymore when a tool room work order comes in. Entire pallets wrecked, all tooling destroyed.
This will surely help me pass my finals.
If you've never fucked something up REAL bad, then you don't have the experience to deal with the after aftermath.
Sometimes, you gotta take that "L"...
And I don't mean Loss, I mean Lesson. It's only a loss if you don't learn anything 😉
Simple fix…always drive with your “distance to go” page pulled up,feed rate and rapid dials turned down and drive slow.
My worst mistake ever was a simple program of just drilling holes in a tube sheet on a carbon and titanium clad that was about 1 inch.
Was running 3 machines and then1 machine acts differently when single blocked to check insert.
Started in back up after check pushed start and it came back down in-between two holes. Drilled just below the titanium clad. Had to be welded. Was told it cost the company almost 300k.
Made the mistake because of the way the machine operates differently compared to the other two not to mention all the overtime I put in and things going on at home.
They give ya shit for a mistake but never praise you for running more then one machine on the night crew.
Frigging epilepsy warning needed lol
Crashes are the worst. But it happens to the best of us.
The great thing about CNC machines is they do just what you tell them to do. The worst thing about them is they do just what you tell them to do!
I run a Vertical Bullard with a 4 foot chuck. Sometimes I warm myself up to it by just standing next to it while it's running
My colleagues work faster than me usually , but atleast i can laugh alot when they crash LOL
I know the feeling, I changes a tool number in the propram and fprgot to change the H to the new tool number. It rapided down and broke a 4 dollar 3/16 drill bit. I was horrible. I still wake up un a cold sweat thinking about that day. ( honestly, Ive done a bit worse)
Godbless on our machine it reads the tool length from the tool library when the tool is called
Titan, I like your thinking and the stories . It all makes sense. I literally agree with everything you say in your videos, I've gone from being an operator to setter to programmer. Now working as applications engineer for Sliding Head company STAR Micronics. I wish I could speak to you in person. You're doing a great job from what I can see. Keep going 💪 and well done 👏
So what caused it? Was it a user error or just a freak accident system malfunction?
@2:00 you explained the problem with most people, the lack of experience and understanding the magnitude of things leads to serious failures.
Oh I remember the first time I hard crashed the machine. I’d been an operator for 2 months and I just started my program, went through safety sub and I realized I it was time to change the rougher. I stopped the machine mid program before the “T” value was taken and changed the cutter. I put in the offset, hit reset in memory mode and pressed go…
You can guess what happened next
We’ve all made mistakes and hopefully learn from it and move on. I still have the necklace maintenance made for me from a heavy chain and one of the 4 broken locking pins that use to hold my half ton tombstone in place.
we had someone at my work do $500,000ish of damage in one crash on a Chiron 6000. every axis knocked out, spindle toast, gear boxes (yes BOXES) broken, all in tight crunch timeframe. that machine has never been the same since. and its been 7 years.
I would say you knew enough to get someone killed. Saw a shop lead, who was supposed to have 15 years under her belt, tell a know nothing to turn on the spindle at 1800 rpm without chucking on something. The machine door saved that kid when the 20lb pie jaws started to let loose. One went down into the bed, and the other flew into the door and caught the kid in the chest, through the dang door. The 150lb door crumpled, flew off the machine and still caught that kid square in the chest. Thankfully some bruised ribs and bruised egos were the only damage anybody took. If that kid had left the door open he’d be dead.
Had my orientation for precision Machining today.
This is a good lesson to have going in.
I took a massive dump while watching this.
Everyone has different terms for different machines, Im a woodwork cnc operator, I slowed down the feed too much on a complicated 4X8 sheet and started a fire. My butt puckered and I had to remember to move the gantry before shutting down and extinguishing.
I buried the B side turret at 100% into a 3000rpm A side spindle on a super quick turn Mazak once. Went off like a .45 next to your head. Dropped the turret into the chip pan and I dropped a turd in my Fruit of the Loom's.
Have seen a Mazak 300 series lathe rip it's own chuck straight from the machine. Had a buddy toss a tombstone in a small horizontal that took two hours of prying and rigging to get back on the swivel. Had a buddy leave too much out the back of a spindle, whipped the bar, which then scooped up a a piece of scrap laying on the transformer and launched it into the air about eighty feet, dropping down next to my machine after bashing the air duct into shit.
Titan is correct, these machines will kill you if you let them. It's up to you to keep the metal in the machine.
Brand new Mitsui Seiki HU50. Massive 15k RPM spindle thermally mapped for ultra precise positioning. My colleague and I were setting up a new line. Had sister tooling setup, but we had not loaded any sister tools. Used preset tools, so zero was the spindle face. Had a problem in one of our custom macros, so we were restarting the program to figure it out. The counter kept counting until it got to the set point and switched to the sister tool. The tool that didn’t exist and had no offset. The machine then tried to mill the part with an empty spindle with the face (double contact to make things better) of the spindle. $43k gone in the blink of an eye
Titan getting paid by the word.
Just 15k damage ?
Damn .... not even crashing is done right over there :P
IT was a lot tougher to crash a Bridgeport back in the day :-) LOL
Crashing a machine is the fastest way to program your nervous system. It's best to get it out of the way early and hope it isn't big enough to lose your job.
This person has a good story to tell 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Saw a guy forget to tighten the softjaws on a Haas ST40 and throw a 90lbs part through the door as soon as the boring bar touched the part. Pulled the carousel out of alignment, broke the tool holder, boring bar, door, door rails, and dented the machine in front of it. Good times were had by none. Immediately had to do a Huggies check.