Star Wars Novel FINALLY Confirms Who Snoke Is and FULL ORIGINS
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![Darth Plagueis's Master [Darth Tenebrous] - Star Wars Explained](/img/n.gif)
"Star Wars finally confirms" sounds a lot better than "Disney finally came up with enough contrived lore to justify the previous cluster fuck"
Yeah, especially if it refers to Snoke, Rey etc 😂
@@kagari1426 While Stupendous Wave does have a habit of repeating topics, I have too much respect for him to agree w/ that!!!
O
Disney didn't do shit. Blame Kennedy and the directors. The extra content creators at Lucasfilm are just trying to clean up the mess. Disney could care less about justifying anything.
That’s what Star Wars has done from the beginning, clusterfuck or not.
I still say that Snoke should have been revealed to be Darth Plagueis and his body was damaged due to the attack by his apprentice in his sleep - but it turns out he HAD discovered the secret to extending his life, even if he was pretty beat up. It could have been revealed that he'd been manipulating events all along (just as in the Plagueis novel) and he could have even revealed to Luke that it was HE and Palpatine who were behind the birth of Anakin Skywalker (again, like the novel). He could have told Luke that because of this fact - darkness would always follow the Skywalker bloodline and it would have been perfect - THIS is what caused Luke to hide himself on that planet - to keep his family safe. He could have even gone so far as to tell Luke that this dark taint is part of why Anakin felt compelled to follow Palps in the first place and why they had a "father/son" type of relationship at first - and also why Luke went for the lightsaber on the Death Star 2 when Palps was goading him. These facts could have really messed Luke up emotionally and turned him into the broken JEdi we saw in the sequel trilogy - and also been why he actually tried to kill his nephew that night.
Could you imagine Plagueis finally telling Luke "have you ever heard the Tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise?" But with a twist..."then his apprentice foolishly believed he'd killed him in his sleep...." Or something to that effect. OR EVEN BETTER - imagine Plagueis telling Luke the story of DARTH SIDIOUS THE ARROGANT.
Bringing back Palpatine was just the epitome of lazy writing and takes away from Anakin's redemption because of the actions of Luke in the original trilogy. It's not like the fans didn't know who Plagueis is. That scene is one of the most memorable Palpatine/Anakin moments in the prequel trilogy.
Bravo.
That's the movie we were expecting. Those who prayed attention also expected jar jar to be dark side apprentice. Cause of his animations. In the first movie.
THIS is why Star Wars fans should write scripts.
Exactly!
Dont know why you weren’t the writer for the film
In my opinion smoke is one of Star Wars’s best examples of how to drop the ball on a character
The other example is Captain Phasma.
I would add: the stupid Knights of Wren, Rose Tico, DJ, Adm Pryde, the wierd worm looking alien who's in 3 scenes.
And Boba Fett and Darth Maul…
Let's not forget Finn....such a waste.
Disney fumbled the new saga so bad it causes me physical pain.
My consensus was
Too much nostalgia baiting in the first film to be worth watching
Tried to hard to be different in the second film
What the actual fuck is going on? For the third
Funnily enough I did actually enjoy my 2 and 3 films despite their faults
Snoke=Pickled Palpatine. No wonder people don't care for him. From a potentially larger than life antagonist...to fluff character; what a monumental failure in character/story development.
You win
I totally forgot Snoke existed until I seen this video.
@@spencersanderson1894 And that is their fault.
@@spencersanderson1894 So many characters who could have been great just literally forgotten about lol no lasting memories or anything Disney dropped the ball hard
Remember how all the theories and speculation on who Snoke was turned out to be better then the next two movies? 😂
There is also a theory that the creators of Snoke had no idea what they were doing. This resulted in the most disjointed, terrible screen writing in history. It became obvious that they had no long term plan and were just making it up as they went.
cloning was planned i feel. Going back to things about his expierments on jakku. It's like they ripped of Dark Empire,but didnt have a plan on how to do it exactly.
Nailed it
They had a very accurate idea of what they were doing. They needed a Palpatine rip off to give TFA as much resemblance to the OT as possible. Then they added in a "mystery" to keep the nerds entertained and talking about it. I am almost glad Johnson flipped them all off by killing Snoke and dismissing his role. It's not like it was ever clear where the first order came from, why they did their shit or how powerful they actually were.
the whole new trilogy is done like this.
There's also a theory that we have such disjointed fans they can't enjoy anything new. All the imperfections they ignored when they were kids are once again in their faces but now they are adults and can't accept them seeing them for the first time. Pretty sad really.
The mystery of the identity of this character was one of the coolest and most intriguing parts of the sequel trilogy at the start. Who was he? How did he know about Luke and all that had happened before? Was he a fallen Jedi? A familiar face from the prequels, twisted by the Dark Side? A disciple of a line of the Sith who had been in hiding during the time of the Empire? Or maybe a remnant of the ancient Sith Empire from the uncharted sectors of the galaxy? So many answers that could’ve added to the Star Wars lore and mythology in awesome ways.
Instead, he was just a clone of Palpatine and was killed unceremoniously. The biggest disappointment and waste of story and character development, probably ever!
To be fair the whole sequel trilogy is the biggest disappointment and waste of story and character development.
I was hoping he was some ancient dark side user that lead a dark side order different from the sith and was freed after the Jedi orders remide in EP 3 and played the long game after escaping. Shame it was just a Palpatine cop out.
@@MrKoraboras I'm still torn between the sequels and prequels for worst place, but yeah. When something is that bad, what's the difference? Poor Lucas, upset that fans hated JarJar... ffs how can someone be so our of touch with what people loved about their own shit?!
I said basically the same thing. Its week and bad story telling.
@@martinbranditch1128 I have come to love the prequels after watching this big pile of crap. jar jar was bad and they had Hayden Christensen do too much overacting but everything else was great.
would have liked the idea of him being one of the younglings surviving through hatred of anakin and the jedi who failed to protect anyone. His wounded twisted visage woould have fit that well. His turning kylo would have also fit that narrative.
"Snoke had seen the fall of the republic and the rise of the empire." That sounded so good 6 years ago, until they shit the bed.
Man, you hit the nail on the head. I was so hyped when that info came out. Could have had a lot of lore come from it.
All facts 🤣🤣🤣
Well, he IS a clone of Palpy. And Palpy saw the fall of the Republic and the rise of the Empire.
So what they told you was true...from a certain bullsh*t point of view.
@@toddkurzbard Smart ass lol
rightt i was thinking he was gonna be someone from the outer regions but turne out he just some clone of old palpy
His true identity is a poorly thought out plot device
So...the usual for Star Wars?
@@allnamesaretakenful lmfao
Snoke was a mystery box filled with sewage.
@@allnamesaretakenful For the sequel trilogy, yes.
Yeah, they shouldn't have taken a dead Lord of the Rings character and made him force sensitive.
Snoke could have been such a cool villain. It really sucks that they just made him an throwaway NPC with no more and no reason for even being in the movie. They need to just toss those trash movies and do something different.
Snoke looks like a kid that I knew in high school.
he looks abit like Joffrey baratheon (that rude child king) in game of thrones loL like that actor
Man they should redo that whole fucking trilogy. Holy hell was it a non-sensical mess.
I feel that I've done wonders for the story in my script for Episode 10.
I've got pages on Facebook and MEWE where I'm going to post it for fans to read.
Got am intro crawl there too.
@@Real_Deal Link?
Honestly, like I was so excited and wanted people like o watch it with me and then it was “wtf did i just watch can you explain?”
And my answer is “no” like i feel like a donkey
The official correct answer 👏
I mean, disney basically confirmed that there was no plan for the triology and that is the worst thing you can do with such an elaborated universe. I'm so sad about that massive potential they just threw out of the window without hesitation. Imagine what they could've done instead. Even without using a single member of the original character cast, the Universe held so much space for them to create a whole new storyline, and they just ruined it. Snoke alone held so much potential. Why not make him a dark sorcerer (like Darth Zannah), who attempts to rebuild the empire under his control and rallies fanatics and a traumatized Ben behind him? Just an example. As I said, so much waisted potential. I'm not even angry anymore, just generally sad.
This could’ve been Plageuis which would’ve tied all 9 movies together. So much hope for this character in TFA to have it 💩💩💩💩 on for the remainder. Should’ve just have been JarJar
@koobmoon 745 and Sideous "died" on the Deathstar. Plageuis would of been one of the best choices for Snoke, but jar jar was my favorite.
@koobmoon 745 and palpatine got thrown down a reactor shaft in ROTJ and yet survived…and Maul gets cut in half but yet survived…and then Fett gets tossed into a Sarlac pit and survives 🤷🏽♂️🤷🏽♂️ guess it’s not so far fetched in fairy tale Star Wars land
@koobmoon 745 ...
I too wish he was Plageuis, that dude was all about cheating death and it would’ve made so much sense for it to be him all along. This would keep Palpatine dead as he should have been, while introducing a character we have heard of but don’t know much about. Like you said it would’ve tied all 9 films together
Plagueis was a Muun, remember? snoke was no Muun.
I wouldve thought smoke was Ed Harris..lol
They really ought to write a book that fully explores what it was that was calling out to Sideous on Jakku. As well as the Acolytes of the Beyond.
The sequels just continues to disappoint and infect established lore with it's nonsense.
But kylo is cool and i love the designs and the CGI
@@HENNY_22 You're right, the sequels are visually beautiful. But they're hollow inside. Nihilism with a Star Wars skin.
It's like the reverse of the prequels
@@HENNY_22 but he's just a shittier version of Jacen Solo from the EU too
It's the Covid of Star Wars.
They should of kept snoke as a separate character instead of him being a clone of palpatine
Round Head Rian Johnson screwed up any plans/potential for the character.
Yeah, snoke. More like joke.
@@glent5659 that was George Lucas's idea for tros tho I agree Brian Johnson fucked it up
@@TheAverageGamer1 No it wasn't lol.
Same goes for clones/Boba Fett.
This sounds good 👍
Great video, it would have been cool if they explained this in the actual movies.
This is an underwhelming revelation written to support the last minute decision to bring Palpatine back. Snoke had so much potential to actually add something new to the lore before Rian Johnson's decision to kill him off.
@@runningbear6391 At the very least, he should be made to apologize and never direct anything related to Star Wars.
If they were going with the clone plot, JJ could've brought him back via cloning. That Snoke is a clone of another clone. It would be a better 'subverting expectations' than bringing back Palpatine for no reason.
@@runningbear6391 giga cope
JJ should have used him in episode 9 and had him say to kylo you are not the first apprentice to kill me
@@kingssman2 JJ could have brought Snoke back a variety of ways. 1) The Snoke we saw killed by Kylo was just a clone modified to appear nothing like it's original template. 2) The code breaker in episode 8 was the real Snoke. The mishapen clone being the figurehead of the First Order would allow him to rule while he travelled the universe undetected. 3) Showing us a mist filled cloning cylinder and revealing a new Snoke.
When they created Snoke there is NO WAY this was the plan for him
And ppl got confused why some of TROS seemed to just be a snide remark towards TLJ this trilogy wont even be meme'd like the pt
I didn't watch the Vid, but i still confidently agree with you.
@@seretith3513 😂
That's the problem. There was no plan. They made it up as they went along with no story written to guide the films.
They didn’t even pay attention to the film immediately before for plot points and character arcs. They made 3 unrelated fan factions that should never have been made.
What soundtrack did you use in this video, I need to know please :)
I guessed as much during the Mandalorian when you see the clones on that Empire base he attacked with Greef Karga on Navarro - those clone experiments in the big tanks looked a lot like Snoke
They retconned "force dyad" onto 40-1000 years of Sith history because they needed to explain abilities created for plot convenience in the sequels, what a franchise
It's lazy writing
@@Scrublord96 it's much worse than lazy writing.... it's breaking the past to justify present mistakes.
Yea it looks like their gonna make the Rule of Two revolve around the fucking Sith trying to create a dyad lol further alienating fans
O1
Whatever; it's NOT CANNON, NO MATTER WHAT DISNEY SAYS. Currently listening to Star Wars Theory ( I love you both Stupendous Wave and SWT) and he (Theory) states that according to this new retcon, this force diad was practiced thousands of years by the Sith. This was NEVER part of George Lucas mythology, so if the Creator (of Star Wars) never intended this, then it is not.
Should have kept him as a returned Plagues. Especially after establishing his goal of immortality. If he had survived it would have made sense at that point to go into hiding and wait. As an immortal he could wait out palpatine eventually allowing him to build him an empire and then take it back once he died. Knowing no other being would be able to stand against him. It also made sense why he’s be so strong with the dark side, being that he may have abandoned the Sith ideology of the rule of 2. Believing with his immortality that he transcended the Sith. But….. Rian Johnson and company said nah we’re good.
It would have gotten my 12.50 plus popcorn.
Disney seemed to keep the prequel trilogy away from the sequel trilogy and only use the OT for any reference in their lackluster storytelling
Forreal man
According to the Rise of Skywalker Visual Dictionary, Snoke was a clone of Plagueis. In his old age, Palpatine developed an appreciation for his old master. Having the spirt of Plagueis inhabit Snoke's body would explain why he was freakishly powerful.
Totally Agree. Well said.
It is disappointing, but it's not the idea itself so much as the execution. But also just making him a clone of Plagueis would have massively improved it. Palpatine's need for control leading him to resurrect his former master as his own servant/apprentice and it also ties into the "sith alchemy" cloning and the dyad concepts
No, the idea is pretty retarded, even in “legends”
This proves 100% beyond any doubt that the Disney sequels are a complete and TOTAL failure .
Even in a fantasy world of make believe , the Rat Squad can't can't come up with a decent explanation about why they can't continue a epic story .
George Lucas even gave them a freakin story , but the evil rat empire thought that they knew better ..............
They were wrong .
They actually thought that they knew Star Wars better than the man who created it .
How patheticly arrogant .
Lucas’s contribution to Star Wars always had a lot of holes in it and some of it didn’t make any sense but Disney should have kept him on as a creative consultant. The story they came up with sucked because it was just lazy writing with a ton of social justice BS thrown in.
They didn’t know Star Wars and they didn’t understand Star Wars, but their arrogance was that they believed they could somehow write better Star Wars without that knowledge and understanding.. they honestly believed Star Wars fans to be stupid, but the reality is that they only entertained the non-fans or what they mislabel as “casual fans” when referring to them. Those people that neither follow or have any knowledge of Star Wars canon beyond what they picked up over 1-2 viewings of each film but enjoy the films enough to want to watch any new Star Wars movie when they release. However, they stop short of actually purchasing any merch like the real fans. Until Kennedy is gone, I’m refraining from getting any new Star Wars merch.
some people prefer to think that the disney movies dont exist
Yeah, I am one of those people. Lol.
Kryptdomi you are in the minority unfortunately, it’s fine to like them. But they are inferior to just about everything else Star Wars related out there save for some dodgy 80s specials and the odd experimental EU book. I’m a harsh critic of the ST but I admit I could just about tolerate the force awakens but RJ decision to completely disregard the story, disregard lore, actively cuck the OT characters and hyper focus on subverting expectations tore apart the fragile chance the ST could at least match the PT. Nobody should give you hate or abuse for liking what you like, I think the general frustration comes from due hard fans who had waited for some decades to see a canon follow up to the OT. When you wait that long and you get 3 average movies that don’t make sense as a trilogy and destroy decades of lore alongside disregarding fantastic EU stories and characters, tensions run high
Snoke is like almost anything else that was halfway decent in the sequel trilogy. Good ideas ruined by awful leadership.
Exactly !
Yes the evil Leader Darth Kathleen "Karen" Kennedy!
O
P
There is literally only one good part in the entire trilogy and Snoke sure as hell wasn't it
The bag was fumbled and this feels like an after thought due to the backlash. I am glad to have some of the movies and content. You did good piecing this together though
Snoke was created by Palpatine, because he said so, in that movie where he surprised us by appearing alive, in that scene where Ben Solo fought a lightsaber duel with Palpatine's grand daughter.
They've had to jump through so many hoops to justify this nonsense. It's here to stay, I suppose. I just want to move past the whole Palpatine thing. I'm fine learning about how it all happens in Mando and the animated universe. That's all cool. But, after this, we've got to move on, otherwise we're just going to keep cloning Palpatine, then the Luuke and Luuuke clone stuff, and, you know what, just clone em all! hahahah. Anyways, thanks for the vid.
@GlJ 'd like to see some legends Darth kryat the yusang vong etc
Sidious being able to “extend” his life through cloning I think fits his character arc well. He temporarily achieved what Darth Plagueis could not, probably through a few things he learned from his master.
Star Wars trilogies were meant to be about the Skywalker family according to the creator, so I’m fine w more Luke.
Disney decided to ruin it.
Still, satisfying or not, the story arcs are so confusing now, an we will never see Georges idea for the newer episodes on the big screen. 😩🥺
Yea its like the lazarus pit in DC
Snoke could have been an amazing character with so much potential. Before TLJ came out I was obsessed with snoke, his origins and powers. If 14 year old me would have known back in 2017 that he was just a puppet I probably would’ve been devastated and disappointed, I already was when I watched TLJ. Honestly if Disney came out and said that he was a half clone of Plagueis I’d actually be happy. Thanks Disney and the creative writers at Lucasfilm for ruining a creative and interesting character. If the Mandalorian never came out I would have given up all hope on this franchise and that’s coming from someone who is a lifetime fan.
tlj came out in 2015
It is surely one of the greatest examples of how they just cobbled the story together as they went and a ridiculous treatment of an initially fascinating character. And a the visual aid of the giant fish tank full of Snokes to help show the Emperor's work was just a ridiculous sight. I call it the "Box O'Snokes" and more stupid treatment of such a good character I have never seen.
@@xavezeroni8869 no, that was the Force Awakens
@@xavezeroni8869 TLJ came out in 2018
My boy, there is much for you to learn. You will lose your mind with the original Dark Empire arc.
Great video, but do you know when would have been a good time to reveal this? IN THE MOVIE.
It’s amazing how the writers or whoever is involved come up with these answers six years after the fact when they are exactly the type of things that should be answered before pinheads paper on the script. You can’t write a good character if you don’t have any solid backstory for the audience.
😆 People don't care who Snoke is now. Thank you crappie sequel trilogy that now lives in mediocrity.
He's just a force senstive Smegol.
Mediocrity? That would mean the sequel trilogy is mediocre. A better statement would be “crappie sequel that dwells in the sewer”.
@@bretviola6871 you are probably still speaking too highly of these movies…
@@ThatGuyz82 Lol, yeah unfortunately you’re absolutely right!
One major error: the Rule of Two was made by Darth Bane to prevent the Sith from extinction by infighting. One master and one apprentice. The master shall rule until the apprentice becomes more powerful and kills him/her, becomes the new master and takes on a new apprentice. That way the Sith survives through superior strength. This has nothing to do with becoming one in the Force.
Which means Disney once again has failed to properly explain how a Force Dyad works, and in the process fucked the very foundation of the main villains in Star Wars lore, canon and legends. Well done.
But was he really intended to be an apprentice? Or a vessel? An extension of Palpatine, since he (palpatine) can’t be out and about. Therefore using Snoke to do what he can’t. Not defending Disney, just thinking out loud. Idk.
Look at the people in charge and writing/creating content for current Star Wars, and there's your answer.
If you gave these dipshits a golf club, they'd either call you a toxic male, or try to fuck the gold club.
I like your idea. I think you are correct, Bane's rule was put into effect to both strengthen the Sith and guarantee its survival. With the events episodes IV-V-VI, the Jedi order, for the first time is able to do away with both Master and Apprentice. Throughout episodes I-II-III, the Jedi still view the Sith order in mystery and are never sure about who is who. When Maul is revealed, they had no clue as to if he was the master or apprentice. It is only because of Skywalkers that we get a full immersion into both the Jedi and the Sith inner circles that we (the audience) knows both Master and Apprentice were eliminated by the end of episode VI. Any content after this was the perfect setup to introduce the "other" sith in the galazy. Sidious was many things, but he was never that strong of a force user to become what the new trilogy movies wanted us to believe. You could make a case where it is possible for a Sith to elaborate a plan like that; however, there are far too many things Sidious would need to be and do in order to accomplish that. Sidious was a master strategist and manipulator, and he dealt one of the major blows to the jedi order in all known lore: almost wiped out the jedi. That is an extremely and immense feat in itself. If anything, Disney should've brought a new Sith order that exploited this weakness. To bring Palpatine back, almost by "any means" necessay, is just lazy writing.
You are right. This whole explanation, down to the rule of two being an asteroid at a "force dyad," is someone's discuss attempt to keep the sequels relevant. They're not. They suck. And Filoni is out there showing everyone how to do the sequels the right way.
Good to see someone point out more errors in the so call canon. The lack of oversight over what is being put out as canon is astonishing. Not only did they mess up the last trilogy but now letting the writers and show runners rewrite things as well. Star Wars needs new leadership who actually cares about it.
This makes warhammer lore sound coherent and well thought out
A proper step in personal stakes would've simply been The Wise revealing himself, telling the audience that he knew his pupil was ambitious, far more than he. Once thought to be unchained after the death of his Master, Palpatine would enact his schemes to overthrow the Galactic Federation and allowing his (The Wise)new pupil, Anakin Skywalker whom he created in his vision to send the Jedi chasing its tail with their failed attempts to interpret the prophecy that he himself had created. This would give way more weight to Luke's fall into existential crisis , and new direction for Ben Solo to accept after having been abandoned and conditioned (tortured).
Oh and get rid of Light speed tracking, they really wrote themselves into a corner with that one.
I loved how Snoke was portrayed as being a far different from, more powerful than, more manipulative, and more intelligent than Emperor Palpatine in TLJ, and I seriously thought that he'd be the one good part of what was turning out to be a train wreck of a movie..... and then he got cut in half. Yeah lets build up his character and then kill him in a way that totally goes against the character traits you just established in the first part of the movie. Good one.
Sboke was never portrayed in comparison to Palpatine. He was portrayed as someone that wasn't known to anybody. The first order and snoke are so poorly fleshed out that it hurts. Originally, Palpatine himself wasn't really fleshed out, but we had a clear notion of the threat posed by the Empire, and by Darth Vader, long before he shows up on screen. On TFA, Snoke shows up on the first act on a bad replica of Palpatine's first appearance in Empire Strikes Back. Everyone says "he must be very powerful", but we're never shown anything to lend credibility to thay belief. And Kylo Ren also reads as quite a few steps below Vader. Weaker, more fallible, his training is explicitly said to be incomplete when Snoke first appears. So the things we actually see all point to Snoke not being so smart or powerful after all.
@@moscanaveia It's more implied by what he does than what is explained. He bridged the minds of Rey and Kylo both mentally and physically through the force, and it was all a brilliant scheme to get the two of them aboard his ship so they could come face to face with each other and so he could find Like. Granted, one of the reasons behind this scheme didn't make sense (as in killing Rey somehow completes Kylo's "training," whatever that means), but he clearly had Kylo and Rey wrapped around his finger in a way that was really well thought out and really well executed, and played more on Rey and Kylo's character than Emperor Palpatine's attempt to swing Luke to the dark side (he offers Luke power, something Luke didn't want). He also had a very different demeanor than the Emperor in the Force Awakens that made it seem as though there was some ulterior motive to what he was doing, rather than a simple lust for power that was Palpatine's motivation. All in all, it came off as being more complex and menacing than Emperor Palpatine, and I was really hoping it would be, but the Last Jedi dashed any hopes of that being the case.
I miss the days when we all thought snoke would end up be plagueis or someone cool like that
@@judebarry3739 True. a good villain like that would have probably saved the saga to not the best, but at least an incredible new character being added to the roster. I bet we would watch a lot of videos about Palpatine vs Snooke videos.
I call it: Game of Thrones-ification.
The biggest issue with the new trilogy was that they went into it knowing they were making a trilogy without bothering to set a road map of what they were doing. And then changing directors while letting the directors do whatever they wanted to including changing the direction of the trilogy...
Shows exactly how much Disney cares about long established companies and fandoms
And this, right after establishing a SW STORY GROUP who's only job was to keep SW lore from turning into an incoherent mess. HARD FAIL.
yep .. they didnt even have a plan. ha.
Now starwars is cheap.
A new film every year has made everyone totally sick of it forever.
Also how many sequal toys stayed untouched on the shelves and the kids dont even know or care about these characters!
@@adrianburns7975 at are you talking about? Do you mean the shows? The shows that have been absolutely amazing? Cus those are not movies bud... And the shows are actually good.
Have ya’ll ever seen the Goofy Movie? It’s like when Goofy gives Max the map lol. They basically set out to create something which at first glance was already not great anyhow and then basically just had a child draw random lines to get them to the end. Coincidence that Goofy and Star Wars are disney property? I think not.
I thought that was made clear when Palpatine pretty much says it in the last movie and there's other Snokes in tanks on Exogol?
I see some similarity to Final Fantasy VII story about clones and connections to their master(Sephiroth)
You know, if would be nice to get a coherent trilogy that answers these questions instead of waiting for novels after the fact.
Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, ✌️
@@undisclosed_branding9714Source?
Yeah gotta be honest, I’m firmly in camp “don’t care.” I would have loved to know 6 years ago, now I just can’t be bothered. The sequels aren’t cannon, none of the supplemental material Disney is making takes place during the sequels era or involves the sequels cast anyway. Just very high budget spin-off movies if you ask me
I haven’t even bothered to watch rise of skywalker as it’s all been ruined for me. They did an amazing job on killing an entire franchise didn’t they?
The Sequels are canon though and The Mandalorian seems to be heading towards the Sequels.
Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, 🤙
Remember when we were excited about the sequel series after force awakens… that was fun.
The Empire shouldn’t have destroyed Kamino and killed the people they were professional cloners… they probably would’ve created a perfect palpatine clone
Agreed. Leave cloning to the professionals.
@@scottboa2738 😂
Bad Batch confirmed that the Empire secure the most talented professional cloners before destroying the cities.
The Force comes from a combination of Midi-Chlorians & the deeds of your ancestors in the new canon, meaning that Force sensitivity can’t always be transferred to clones. & when you can, which usually involves strand-casts rather than actual clones, there’s always the risk of them drawing too much power into their bodies until it destroys them, because they’re not just taking the Force from your cells, but from others as well. That’s why Kaminoans aren’t good enough & why Snoke looks so weird - because he doesn’t just come from Palpatine cells & he is still taking in too much dark power into his body.
Yeah, such a simple & excellent explanation that current LucasFilm writers can’t seem to articulate very well. Apparently they run on the very outdated rule of “no exposition”, which isn’t always so bad for storytelling & was a rule that was abandoned by others, such as George Lucas, for a very good reason - it’s better to slow the story down for a minute than to leave the audience confused.
@@grant9589 That actually fits more with the eastern themes of Star Wars, does that mean that the force is literally just the Dao now and the Asla and Bogan are Ying-Yang. If that's the case then where are the force gods all we ever see are the ones and we don't really know if they are gods or not.
Wow, this convoluted BS is actually passed off as cannon. Another reason I pretty much gave up on the sequel trilogy. I'd love to see Jaina Solo or Ben Skywalker wake up sweating from a fitfull sleep and tell Grand Master Luke Skywalker about the alternate reality that the Force had revealed to them.
I hope that the Disney+ stuff builds up to Ben Skywalker and Jaina Solo being born and that Favreau or Filoni get the head Lucasfilm job because Kennedy has no idea what Star Wars is. Spoilers ahead...
Star Wars is basically Shakespear in space with Samurai movie twist hence the term Space Western.
And with that, they should hire you as a writer. Seriously.
@@KRYMauL in my headcanon, Palpatine’s room of mirrors (the room with Dark Rey) was actually enchanted by Palpatine, and is where Palpatine lives and creates the galaxy in his image. He is stuck in this clone body. And makes two failed clones. Snoke (an abomination from pieces of himself, and Luke Skywalker (Vader issue 12)) and his son, who has no force sensitivity. Through these, when he needed to clone himself next, he’d be able to create a successful clone, and he would. In his death in RoS, he, Ben Solo, and the KoR are shot back out of this mirror, to his new cloning facility on Byss, in different times for honestly plot convenience. Through this facility on Byss, Palpatine would eventually goad young Luke Skywalker to be his apprentice in Dark Empire. Yes I am connecting the sequels and legends. Because the sequels should get Rey to carry on the Jedi if Luke isn’t allowed to. But Kylo Ren would make his goal to kill the knights, and get another chance with his family. And legends goes the same as it would. Then I see the new Mando verse as new canon in its own universe.
@@wheattoast1971 My head cannon is that those movies don't exist and are a mockery of George's Shakespearean and Kirosawa inspired epics.
as if most of the eu shit isnt convoluted
I once heard that snoke was mace windu, but he had fallen to the dark side completely. That would be pretty cool to see.
Nice back story
There was so much potential and it was lost I remember how curious I was about Snoke in TFA especially when Snoke says he witnessed the rise and fall of the empire that part really intrigued me. Could have been a way better explanation of who Snoke was poor story telling on Disneys behalf proven that a trilogy should have the same direction
Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, ✌️.
Hope this gives you closure
Exactly you got that completely right he could of been so much more
I wanted him to be plaguies so bad, it would have tied all the movies together. Rey could have passed for a Kenobi or escaped Jedi trainee from Luke’s temple….bummer
How could you get that far having absolutely no idea who your big bad was? How could they give total idiots the reins?
I think its all pretty cool and glad to finally get a full explanation
It's confirmed, he's irrelevant. Was irrelevant as soon as they decided Palpatine was behind it all and in control.
It's from the story: Dark Empire which was a graphic novel from the old EU.
John Williams hinted it was Palpatine in Force Awakens, but full on says it in The Last Jedi. When Snoke lift's up Rey, "Give me EVERYTHING" etc. Palpatine's theme is played it all it's glory, not even subtly.
Yeah, and what's funny is the fact at first when I got TLJ score I tried to listen to that particular moment just to find it wasn't anywhere.
If they followed the Darth Plagueis theory they could have made something new and incredible that tied all the trilogies together. The writers should have looked at all these fan theories online, determine the popular ones and incorporate them into the scripts. That's not cheating but inspiration like everything else they work with, it's also a way of reaching out to the fans. Instead they ignored them and miserably failed at producing pale imitations of the originals and did one more to undermine them, the worst possible move they could have made.
Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, ✌️
Satisfied
The reason ppl (like myself) dont care for the sequel trilogy all together is because ppl like Ryan Johnson and Lucasfilm told fans we were stupid for caring who snoke was
They completely miss managed the story and made a horrible mess of things and then told us that the fans were the problem for not liking their movies 😂😂
So why should we care then?
I didn't care for the trilogy for multiple reasons. But to get to your comment, I would ask the producers what is the point and purpose of bringing this character into the story, for the extremely limited amount of screen time that he had, only to have him die a totally lame death.
Don’t forget JJ and KK also. They started this shyte ball.
Yeah, sorry. Johnson gets credit for trying hard to do something interesting with the story and save it from the uncreative re-hash that JJ was steering it into being. Johnson did a commendable job trying to keep the boat afloat in a movie stuck in between two shipwrecks. The sequel trilogy is terrible because JJ is a hack who thinks compelling story telling involves doing the same story that worked before, but bigger. The man can do a fine job imitating the style of better directors while filming individual scenes, but lacks the ability to stitch those scenes into a coherent framework, or to do anything which even vaguely resembles something original or creative.
That damn lady miss managed
@@Frankenstyleish I totally agree. I think if the point of Snoke was to propel Kylo Ren into the emperor role, his character makes sense. Only, he gets replaced by the revived Emperor in the next film, ripping away the plot developed by Johnson and erasing any chance at a cohesive story.
I was really unsatisfied by this, I was hoping he’d end up being darth plaquious the wise and have it revealed that his scars come from when palpating “killed” him, having him end up being a major villain rather than a dummy to be cut in half
I was expecting Snoke to be Plagious clone.
i am honestly tired of franchises cashing in on old villains, please for the love of god create something new and prove to us you can actually set up stories without relying on the works of people who are already dead or retired.
@@scottcayouette6829 me too.
It's worth asking though: were people upset about Snoke dying in "The Last Jedi" because they didn't like the narrative, or were people upset because what they though was going to happen _didn't happen_ ....?
I feel like certain people (admittedly, not all) got upset because they didn't get what they "wanted". I'm just not sure that's a fair way to assess any kind of storytelling.
@@TheInfectous Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, ✌️.
Imagine if u had gotten legends Jacen solo, a skywalker level force user who turns because of his ability to see potential future events. Rey is Jeana instead, & u get the legendary final battle. The sith dies, and in doing so gets what he wants almost like kenobi. Could of been amazing.
P.s. the last stand of gannor rhysode should of closed out movie 1 or 2. "None shall pass."
Its clear that he was originally meant to be Plagueis, but they just didnt want to reveal it in the first film, and only had a vague idea about him, but he was killed off.
Now hes a clone, but that answers nothing. Who is he a clone of? How was he present for the last 60+ years, had many apprentices, knew Han, Luke, and Leia, met them in person?
They cant even commit to a clone origin, so they just say "oh.. he's an amalgamated clone. There's no specific donors that we need to be concerned with."
What was the plan?
"Oh, it was a failed plan that Palpatine didnt end up using. Palpatine is also a clone of sorts, but not really, but he could be. We cant really say, and who cares anyway? Somehow Palpatine returned!"
All this should've been in the movies. Instead we get a two hour side quest with Finn and girl going to a space casino to do a heist.
It was at MOST 25 minutes, rather.
You sunofabitch I'm in
Honestly, Snoke's identity is moot at this point, considering how easy it was to call it after ep 9
Most things in SW is moot after Ep9. Dunno why the OT heroes even bothered to fight the empire
Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, 🤙
Snoke used to play golf in the 60s
when Snoke died I quite lieraly deflated in my seat and was just so disapinted. I went into that film hoping to learn what snoke was. i was genuinly like a disapinted dad.
Christ those movies where handled so poorly. They could of been great if the writers agreed on the characters stories not just the half stories and lots of effects. I do like the idea of mixing genetics to make a new clone though. Guess it would make Snoke something of Reys uncle?
Damn, that could've even gave a nice uncle-niece dynamic between the two. Maybe snoke could've had his own mind, just was trapped to be a puppet by Palpatine. And snoke would have his own thoughts, maybe even forming a connection with Rey, bring conflict into Rey having to destroy him. Wouldve also been a nice parallel between the relationship dynamic of uncle and nephew that Luke and Kylo Ren had.
@@OscarASevilla man that sounds awesome!!!!! Have you ever considered writing?
Originally, in a book released after TFA, snoke was someone calling out to palpatine, am entity of unknown power
Yeaaa I remember that, other stuff too implying he was “searching for something” in the unknown regions
A good story for another time
Then it’s retconned a million times
Apparently that was the Sith Eternal on Exogol calling to him or something. Idk
@@arronprestwich2813 terrible retcon
All i know, F episode 7,8, and 9! Good day sir!
What book? When did it release? Was it after the movies?
The reason why people do not care about Snoke, or Phasma, was such a wasted villain. Thanks to the Last Jedi.
The Phasma book is pretty good though.
@@jakewheeler6014 That just makes it worse as you build up a character to be this badass but gets her head handed to her in a fight that last less than five minutes.
Can we PLEASE get a “do over” of the last 3 movies? PLEASE? 😭😭😭
So so so bad.
Considering they were merely do overs of the Original Trilogy... ignoring them and watching the Original Trilogy should do the trick! 😀
the saddest part is we will never get carrie fisher back or han solo
The problem of too many cooks. Abrams came up with snoke because the story line needed a villain. In the second movie he gets killed off to Abram’s surprise and now the fans want a back story which gets embellished by the Star war novel writers.
so mysterious , that even the writers didn't know who he was!
Snoke would have ultimately been a lot more interesting if Rian Johnson hadn't ruined literally almost every single thread of the story in episode 8. Abrams had little choice but to completely retcon the story and characters to try to bring it back around to some kind of conclusion in ep 9.
It really all boils down to horrible leadership at Disney.
I'm convinced that Rian Johnson intentionally drove the ST off the cliff. Like a selfish little child who didn't get to tell the story he wanted from the beginning. I vaguely remember Kennedy promising Rian a trilogy before the ST even started filming.
Idk, I could be mistaken but Rian Johnson should never be allowed within 100 yds. of Star Wars set or script ever again.
I'd love to know the real story behind the whole Abrams, Johnson and Trevorrow debacle. 🙏
Kathleen Kennedy lost her job because of crap like this. Disney DID NOT buy Star Wars for over $4 billion, just to ruin it.
Abrams should have written the storyline for all three. The different directors could have had input but Abrams should have had final say over the arcs. Then the other directors could have written the screenplays but like Lucas had done, with his first trilogy, it would have been a more unified story.
Rian Johnson fixed all of JJ's idiot mystery box nonsense and set up a perfect 9th movie with Rey as the hero and Kylo as the big bad villian. JJ sucks though and ruined it.
@@Loki_Yogi The last jedi is the only decent movie of the trilogy. Abrams is garbage.
Nice ! We finally got our answer ! Even if this revelation is quite disapointing...
I called it honestly I said to everyone in the comics he had clones
Snoke almost looks like Ventress, could he also be a human/zabrak hybrid, a rare male without horns?
Would’ve been cool if Snoke was more alien-like and his own separate character as opposed to a puppet of The Emperor. I like seeing new characters and reading up on their lore. Snoke’s lore just isn’t that in-depth imo
Some people said Snoke should've been one of the Jedi younglings that Anakin had slain but he survived somehow. Would that have been more interesting?
@@bryanferratt6598 No. We already got that from the Obi Wan series.
@@jwill5892 okay well Snoke happened before the Obi-Wan tv show.
It makes total sense to me that the most powerful ruler and sith, who's also capable of stopping death for others, would want to life forever himself. The ultimate narcissist. Owning a clone army, makes sense he would use similar technology to clone himself, but he would not clone more than one since it would be a potential adversary, and would only activate the clone upon his death.
Are they ever going to deal with that, the time between episode 6&7? They should show how Snoke came about and influenced Ben Solo and turned him to the Darkside but also cover everything else important to the Galaxy for that time between.
This would have been cool to know 6 years ago
The fans are literally giving Disney gold with their theories but no Disney had to make it another one of Palpatine's plans like wtf how do you fumble great concepts
This reminds me of a D&D campaign I ran. I threw certain things in with half-baked ideas what they were and let the players figure out my "intentions" and ran with it towards the end.
Isn't that most d&d campaigns 😂😂😂
I can't remember the last time I was satisfied with anything star wars.
1:45 Nooooooo.
Snoke should've just fully been his own character with no relation to Palpatine
I totally agree, the Star Wars movie sequels are just poorly written by people who don't know what they're doing and different opinions. The Rise of Skywalker was so bad and cringy.
Well Ryan Johnson put the kibosh on that idea, after he trampled all over the story they had no choice but to bring Palps backs. Lol
@@adamzullo3624 not necessarily, they could've just developed Kylo better and made him the big final threat.....but nope
@@salopro86 no. Palps is a great character who had no impact because of poor planning and just throwing him in because episode 8 threw everything out the window
@@adamzullo3624 Palpatine was always my favorite character, but they ruined him in Rise of Skywalker, and I think him coming back at all kind of cheapens the whole arc of the original trilogy. Just my opinion
The destruction of Luke’s character was the final straw for me . The last 3 of the 9 Star Wars movies were awful . All those years to plan a great finale and this is what the fans got .
You got that right.
Yep, can’t disagree
Well, tbf, Lucas had all those years to plan a great finale, but Disney just threw spaghetti at a wall and called it done.
A truly hideous ending to a story that started with such Hope….
Rogue One is the only good new Star Wars films
I love Snoke’s backstory
I followed the new star wars trilogy very closely since it was first announced. The original plan was to have different directors and writers for each film, to give each film a unique feel over each other. This backfired heavily with episode 8 when that director did not originally know where the story was headed from episode 7, only what was supposed to be the final outcome. The overall vision may never be released but both Disney and JJ were not happy with the direction Kennedy went with snoke and Luke. Scrapping their idea of a new director for the final film, bringing back JJ to salvage as much of the story as possible for episode 9. Episode ruined the new trilogy and because of snokes extremely limited screentime and quick death, the canon obviously had to come out way later than sooner. There were many rumors but one that had come from a source that was extremely credible, was that snoke was not a clone but something powerful enough in the dark side of the force that awakened by the massive burst in sith energy given off by palatine's force burst that saved him during the fall. This awakened him from an ancient slumber. Snoke in episodes 7, 8 and 9 was to be hunting palpatine, discovered in episode 9 that palpatine was in "hiding" trying to recover or something from snoke who he feared. Palpatine would obtain a new replacement for Vader who would have been introduced in episode 8.
But back to snoke... Snoke could sense Kylo's connection to Vader and knew he could use Kyle as his apprentice to hunt down Rey who he knew he could use to track down palpatine. Anyways I'm rambling, and some of those details could be faded from what I remember, but it was supposed to be palpatine that killed snoke, showing that he had learned a lot since episode 6 and just how much more powerful he was now than ever before, essentially making snoke appear extremely weak. But episode 8 building up showing how much more powerful snoke was than the palpatine we knew from every previous film, giving a new kind of fear for palpatine. Making the final battle feel that much harder to wine, creating a lot of tension in the final battle. It was even rumored that Rey would have the ability to absorb all the energy from every Jedi who was able to turn into pure force like obi. Giving a callback to what obi said right before Vader struck him down, "If you strike me down, I'll become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.". this would explain what he really meant, knowing that a true Jedi would be able to use his energy, along with Yoda and every powerful Jedi before them to cleanse the galaxy of any sith who stood in the way. Making Rey the one. Anakin and Luke only being consider "the one" because of their ability to become force ghost which made Rey that much more powerful to take down palpatine who by episode 9 would have officially been the most powerful sith every to exist.
The end.
They messed up with writing. Ok. Everyone knew this part at least. Thx for sharing the background information.
Snoke was Ezra Bridger.
Rebels sets everything up to revealed the mystery of Snoke.
There wasn't enough communication between Animation and Live Action Divisions however and what was set up in Rebels from it's beginning to it's Finale, just before the release of The Last Jedi was all derailed by the LA devision.
No Snoke reveal, No Mortis connection, No revealed about how Thrawn and Ezra created the first order... Live action then couldn't fix what they had broken and we got Rise of Skywalker, ✌️
JJ fucked everything up, RJ made it worse JJ wrapped the piece of crap produced by episodes 7&8 in a paper bag, then lit it on fire and that was episode 9.
Despite the shortcomings of episode 1, at least by the time it got to episode 3 it all made sense while leaving plenty of room to expand on side stories.
What was Abrams reason for putting luke on that island ?
@@owensanfordstuff we will never know. Unless Abrams talks about it more during interviews. They've been vocal about how the purpose and flow of the story was laid out for all 3 episodes but the director of the second film basically went rogue. The failure of the new trilogy pretty much all falls on the second film.
Honestly, I think that the background story of Snoke (who he was) changed by the time we got to "The Rise of Skywalker," due to the backlash against the Last Jedi.
I don't mind this explanation, but what bothers me is the avalanche of supplementary material that needs to be retroactively added in order to give the sequels a cohesive plot.
Already knew this cause of Lego Star Wars the Skywalker Saga lol
There’s no way that was the original plan! They had to shoe horn that ridiculous story when JJ Abrams had no idea what to do after that Rian Johnson debacle. Such a massive shame
Should have just left Snoke alone after TLJ and let Colin Trevorrow make Duel of the Fates. Kylo should have just become the villain
I am pretty sure the real question people wanted to know was, "Why did anyone think these character drafts were acceptable?"
In my head canon he is a clone of darth plagues that palpatine failed to full kill but still had damanged and made run away while acting for high grandmaster yoda and grandmaster Windu
Without watching the video, what's the book called?
I thought Snoke being Plaguis would’ve been cooler, even if it was a new vessel for the disembodied spirits (or spirit fragment) to fight over.
We could explain Snoke’s ghoulish features with
1. Underdeveloped cloning tech
2. The fact Plaguis was an alien whose spirit was having to inhabit a near human body, artificial and flawed
3. The sheer amount of dark side energy twisting the body, especially in the cloning process
4. A fight with Luke Skywalker
If we fuse legends with Canon, the Dark Empire Saga explained that Palpatine already came back as a clone and his spirit was destroyed when he tried to get a new body.
However, fragments of his consciousness, or simply programming emulating it, could be applied to a new clone in the same way the early empire of legends used flash memory clones.
This would mean the clones could go on autopilot mimicking the general behavior of Palpatine, even when it wasn’t inhabited by a spirit (Plaguis or hypothetically Palpatine, or parts of Palpatine, possibly other entities).
Said clones could be like medieval lords ruling on autopilot in isolated outer rim planets that didn’t know any better. They would have to be taken care of by clone handlers, since they would be auto piloted drones that were empty vessels to be filled by Snoke’s force ghost when he saw fit. It would also give him a back up body to transfer essence to if his body was slain, and, if his spirit was destroyed, low tier management as a substitute to hold his Empire over until they found competent leadership as an heir.
As you can see, this would lead to a sort of occult, technocratic crypto feudalism much akin to many Illuminati conspiracy theories.
This would make sense for Plaguis to present himself as a reincarnated Palpatine, because a lot of First Order and Sith Eternal loyalists were loyal to Sheev and not Plaguis, if they even heard of him.
Plaguis wanted eternal life, it makes sense him picking up where he left off with cloning immortality project.
There would also be an ironic justice in him inheriting the project of the apprentice who killed him, almost at the same step as where they both were before he was murdered.
The First Order and Sith Eternal could have shown what the Galactic Empire might have been like if Plaguis still reigned supreme. Perhaps it would’ve been more like Orwellian feudalism on a galactic scale, between 3 factions constantly at war, not realizing they are controlled by a hidden 4th faction (think metro and 1984), and maybe Plaguis’s version of the empire would start to look like if the CIS had won the clone wars (he is an alien banker).
Are you hinting rothschilds or any other banking family with that last comment? 🤔🤨🧐
You’re right on the money. I said something similar : He’s obviously Plagueis. When he says those lines in The Last Jedi how he could not be beaten, he was mocking Palpatine, not Kylo. Here was the spirit of Palaptine’s master, gone through many experiments and cloning procedures, imbued in Vaders body to create Palaptines ultimate plan, which actually was Plagueis living on through him. I’m pretty sure Johnson sat around in those coffee shops writing a character that everyone would pan off as nothing, just like Jar Jar.
I was a fan of the "Snoke is Windu, seeking revenge on the Skywalker family" theory and I'll admit I'm pretty bummed that didn't come to be
I've been holding out for windu's survival from Anakin's push for years. Like what if he lived? What if he Jolee bindo'd and went gray Jedi? Saw the fall of the order? Who knows? It's hard to believe his lightsaber style is lost forever
Especially when Samuel L Jackson wanted that to be the theory 😅