I really appreciate when people are humble enough to post such "far from perfect" rescue video. It help people realize that whitewater is not Disney Land and nasty shit can happen FOR REAL. I'm a whitewater rescue instructor and I will use this to teach. Thank you from the heart, Alex de Matane, Montréal
I think a few more people helping could have got her out quicker. I was on the American river and a lady died a few boats in front of us. She wasn’t wearing her vest tight enough she slipped out of it when they went to pull her into the raft. People need to respect the water.
I know this is old but I live near the cheat and have paddled it for years. I dont understand why the other paddlers didnt help with the rescue. Anyway, I was a raft guide for a while. I've seen some dangerous situations and helped out with the rescue of a couple people. This one girl was paddling a duckie and I watched her fall out of her boat right above the big rock on river left at wind rapid and she got sucked under it. 3 other the other guides paddled thier rafts over swiftly and we were rescuing her in less that a minute after she went under. I hooked a rope to the back of another guy's jacket, he jumped in the undercut and about 10 seconds later he tugged the rope signaling he had her and we pulled them out and immediately started cpr. She was in there less that 2 minutes but was already drowned. Luckily after some compressions and breathing she spit out the water and started breathing and crying and asking what happened. She was purple, So your absolutely right seconds are crucial. Training and safety are very important.
Frankly I was shocked to see that only one guy got out of his boat to help. This was a deadly serious event perhaps unrealized (somehow!) by the other boaters. Kudo's to the one serious guy. Time to change boating crews if that's all the help you can expect when you're about to die.
@@georgewilliamssr5230 yeah i was upset the guy took the time to stop turn away from victim and say watch my boat "who the fuck cares about your plastic dinghy" SUN TZU
In the heat of the moment, you will lose your sense of perspective. Give it a rest you toxic arm chair experts & just thank the good lord that she is OK.
@@shark8996 Been whitewater kayaking for 30 years, not an armchair expert. If you're going to kayak you also need to be practiced and ready for this kind of thing - with all hands on deck. A minute of "losing your perspective" can mean life or death. If you're not ready, don't kayak with other people because you endanger their lives.
These pins require Everybody to get out and get involved with rope. Get ropes hooked to the boat and the victim before doing any movement if they are able to breathe where they are pinned, which is how this one seemed to me. Only move victim once everyone on the crew is at optimal spots for ropework and hands on assistance. I had a friend go through a similar pin where we got lucky that he washed out the other side, but the main lesson I took away was that if they can breath where they are, DO Not Rush the rescue, Keep them stationary and set up. Do it right. As soon as you start moving them the water will pull them down unless you have a real strong system to counter it.
the rest of the crew needed to realize that seconds matter in an underwater pin and their inaction could have proved fatal. there was more to do than just collecting paddles and boats. If cold weather has you more worried about losing a paddle or boat than someone's life... reevaluate.
@@rstats2127the more people out of a boat, the more that become potential victims. Any rescue course will cover that. Even swift water rescue teams don’t send everyone they have into the water. It makes it more dangerous for everyone, and the ability for someone else to get lost and not even seen is highly likely. Having others that are not involved, and can not do anything, stay in the boats is the right thing. They have the high ground and can see a lot more than those in the water. Those collecting paddles did exactly what they needed to as well, if you lose your equipment, no one is leaving that spot. Paddles is rapids are one thing you need.
@@PTRRanger951I guess you didn’t watch the video or you watched it on mute, he asked for help more than once, one other person out of their boat was not detrimental. She passed away on another run on another day so maybe she was over her head in decision making and picking lines.
@@rstats2127 doesn’t matter if he asked for help or not. If they didn’t want to help, or couldn’t, they didn’t have to. Even trained rescue professionals won’t and can’t do things all the time. Point is, if you become a victim yourself, you won’t help anyone, and now others have to risk their life to save not just the original victim but now additional. It’s common sense and one of the first things any first responder is taught. People get tunnel vision and see one thing, a person needing help, they don’t look at what is actually going on, what other dangers there are, their capabilities, the surroundings. They just react, and are often killed.
Bill, that must have been scary, and Nancy, especially for you. Thanks to both of you for writing it up in the AW reports and for sharing this video. Both of you kept it together, persisted through it all. Hind sight is 20-20, but until you face something like it, you can't know how you'll respond. Bill will replay this a thousand times in his mind. The pros get in lots of practice, teach some of the skills regularly, and the rest of us typically don't. We figure we're good if we took a class. Maybe not. If we took time to practice regularly in realistic settings (not a boat leaned up against a tree in the park), we might be more competent and more confident when these situations pop up. And we may approach things more realistically when running the river. I think the biggest lesson here is to practice more, and that lesson applies to myself as much as anyone.
Important video. Everything else has been said in other comments about the reactions of the other boaters aside from the one main rescuer. I am an EMT, and two things I really have to note is that there should have been way more communication with the primary rescuer to the other boaters. Second off, after having unpinned her, the first goal is to get her out of the cold water, somewhere warm and safe to assess and prevent hypothermia and in case she passes out in the water/cant maintain her own airway. There didn't appear to be any urgency in doing that even though they end up in a shallow eddy where one can walk. My two cents
I was a bit blown away by how quickly everyone relaxed once she was free from the pin. Definitely should have tried to get her out of the water quicker in case she went in to shock or had inhaled some water. Plenty of accident reports of out there of people seeming fine in one minute, and incapacitated the next from a flush drowning and water being in their respiratory system.
Sadly the same woman pinned in this video died in an accident less than two years later. I'm frankly surprised anyone would get back in a kayak after this close call.
Watched this 3 times -a lot to learn here. At --0:24-- probably pinned; --0:41-- Bill 1st realised she's pinned; --0:43-- 1st whistled (good!); --1:31-- established she's breathing; --2:23-- her head's submerged; --2:47-- Bill 1st yell's for help; --3:11-- her head's above water. I'm not sure if anyone helped rescue her beside Bill - could have set up secure line to keep her in breathing position from upstream. As she was in the lead, could have used some rescuers upstream, some downstream - focused on securing the breathing paddler 1st, with a safer extraction (without 48 sec. submerged! The yellow boater running the same line didn't help- probably wedged her tighter!). They needed an experienced leader with SRT training to direct others - I know I'll be taking this course - no matter what the cost!
Two minutes, forty-five seconds. That's a long damn time to be pinned like that. Only one guy is able to recognize the immediacy of this mortal situation? The others should have improved their swift water rescue skills by now. They didn't exhibit any that day. No sense of urgency.
Good hands on Bill. But what the hell were the rest of your crew doing sitting useless in the eddy. If you weren't there, would the others have been able to step up? They seemed rather shocked into inaction.
Nathan Nahikian when talking to people afterwards, there was confusion and uncertainty about what was happening or whether it was ok to proceed down the drop. One of the mistakes I feel I made was when I abandoned my boat I told the other person in the eddy I was and to watch the gear. Should have given better instructions to assist once more people came or gear was secure.
Thats too kind Bill. In situation like that while you are doing all you can, the rest of the crew needs to step in and seek alternatives and ways to support the ongoing efforts. Not just sit in the eddy looking clueless. If you had not been there, I have no doubt it would have been a far grimmer outcome.
Bill Durr, Nathan is spot on imo. This isn’t on you at all. You were the one trying to rescue. Yes, perhaps you could have communicated more to your crew, but I was astounded to see them just sitting around watching your efforts. And yellow boat doesn’t even seem to be watching!! WTF! 🤬🤯😳 There wasn’t much communication or game-planning, but it was clear enough what was going on, and someone at your back pulling you while you struggled to pull pinned boater would hand been a good start. Scary and very frustrating to watch.
Moral arguments are the most infeasible arguments with the least utility you can make in situations like these. It doesn't matter how you feel about "whose fault" it was. It matters what happened and what could have been done differently.
Thank you for sharing the video, Nice response Bill and glad to see the end result was not fatal. It is too often that a situation occurs and most folks are dumbfounded and don't react at all such as the remainder of the crew. Others should have also been getting out of their boat immediately and assisting.
I lost my best friend in August 2015 because his ‘buddies’ thought he was fooling around & left him alone until enough time had passed for them to realize he was in trouble & couldn’t get out by then it was too late!
Wow, I paddled for years with friends on the Kern River.. and never witnessed anything that serious..good work mate! She is alive today because of her fellow paddlers.. thank you for sharing because there’s so many things we can learn from us. Number one it’s great to paddle with friends versus doing it alone… Number two is anytime someone is in trouble it should be all hands on deck.
RIP to this lady. She had this scary, phobia inducing event happen and still decided to continue with her hobby. She died 2 years later in another kayaking event
Probably with the same group of heroic rescuers. I'm a complete amateur and i was shocked by their inaction. It literally looked like they didn't care she was drowning, i would have moved faster then that to save a complete stranger, and she was a part of their group. shameful.
The detailed story of her death as told by her fellow paddlers, can be found at: American Whitewater - accident database - report ID#46312 She got snagged apparently.
I’ll be using this vid on my Swiftwater Safety Institute courses in Australia. Nice job. Ditto other comments re scouting and no help from rest of crew. But super on the fly thinking amigo.
@@loganlewis7083 Of course it is always very easy to be a "Monday Morning Quarterback", and not everything is visible in the vid... having said that: The videographer clearly says he "doesn't know what's over there".. and yet someone ran it without scouting. This rescue wouldn't have needed to happen if the time and energy to scout had occurred. That's a common mistake. After that, super quick and effective action by videographer/paddler, including 3 whistle blasts. He finds a safe place to exit his boat to provide the help that made the difference between life and death. Blue and yellow and multi-colored boaters just sit there, in one case even looking away from the action, remain in their boats and do absolutely nothing to help while their comrade is drowning. Crazy. Videographer does great work, including trying many different techniques and hand reaches, and yelling for help again. At long last yellow boat exists to try to help, but the videographer has accomplished the rescue basically on his own. I agree with the other comments, I'd never paddle again with the others. Great work, Bill! I'd boat with you any time. My students all agree! ;-)
Ideally, (and it’s true. About hindsight being 20/20 so good job acting, Bill, which is more important than sitting around thinking too much), I’d say it was more Important to maintain her in a heads-up position while rescuer directed others to get a line on her boat. She went from heads-up to heads-down with no real plan to change that other than trying things and hoping the boat came free with the next attempt). She was heads-down for awhile. My 2 cents since you’re using This for teaching…
@@Jeffe01 There are a couple of things worth noting that support your 'lessons learned'. 1. Apparently that particular has pinned other kayakers before and claimed lives. 2. The survivor in this video (Nancy Kell) sadly lost her life whilst kayaking with the same group in 2019. The story can be found at: American Whitewater - accident database - report ID#46312
I watched again just to make sure I didn't miss something the first time and my conclusion is reaffirmed, except for Bill the rest of that crew is absolutely worthless. They need to find a different pass-time if that's all they are going to put into it. Absolutely ridiculous.
Glad she got out. Two big things wrong, at least. 1). Guy says he has no idea what's over there (the drop). Well then, get out and scout and have someone in your group that know the lines. 2). Starting the rescue he tasks one would be rescuer with the job of watching his boat. So the guy sits there the whole time doing just that, watching the guys boat. Needless to say dude, the hell with your boat, save that womans life! No plan in place either and took her from where she could breath to being underwater. Realize hindsight is 20 20 and this is a combat situation, but this crew and this girl were both extremely lucky this ended the way it did.
sirshibboleth the two of us did know the lines, and have run the river multiple times. The video started towards the tail end of our discussion. We were deciding on creative lines to take, and were not sure the right side of the boulder had dried out. Forgot to include the AW incident report in the description. In there I do mention that I should have told the person minding my boat to assist instead. A better way of putting the things I list as 'could have done better' would be communication.
Unfortunately this is a sport to risk your life. It's sort of like selfies at the edge of the grand canyon. Was it really worth it ? Anyway I'm guessing that Bill was the leader and he said "watch my boat" . He was probably the only knowledgeable person there and luck just happened to be on his side . Thankfully she was saved but I bet she was seconds from drowning .
that was a close call. what a difference a little bit of a trying can make... breath or not to breath. Respect for staying calm and getting the shit sorted.
Definitely not people I'd ever paddle with. Looks like only 1 person with an actual head on their shoulders, all the other idiots sat in their boats and watched.
Absolutly what I am familar with crews that dont understand the crucial of securing space while accident. My situtations are mostly thanksfully not that serious, but people positioning always wrong, even guides. One thing I was noticing that the guy who helped her got her into a much more serious situation by trying to pull her sideways. That pushed her more under water.
With some of these rescues on kayaks pinned against rocks like this, is it an issue of releasing the skirt or not being able to move in a way that allows getting the legs out? It seems like the kayaks wedge and while I understand the hydraulic force on the body it also seems like if the victim wasn't constricted in the kayak, they'd roll off to one side or the other and down into the pool. I just don't understand if its the kayak or the skirt or what but would like to know. Don't have any whitewater really but do get mostly flood related swiftwater incidents and would like to understand it better.
Bill Durr , is it even a rapid?! I think Even Nastier is before Cue Ball. I ran Cheat so many times and have hard time imagining where that is at. Is it at the very top of Even Nastier?
Thank you so much Bill Durr to report the accident on AWW. With your mistake, we make this place a safer one. Respect from Montréal, Canada Alex de Matane Whitewater kayak and ww safety instructor
Watched in suspense, holding my breath, body tensed up. I couldn't stand to watch it, so I fast forwarded to the end. I still don't know how he managed to get the person out. That was a miracle! I'm shocked they made it out, but so glad the person made it to safety! If I were there, I would have decided to never go with those other people again since they were so inactive in helping. Though tere was one or two people behind the guy with the camera that were seemingly slightly helping.
Addendum: It is worth reading the accident report if for no other reason than to see what you can learn from it. Unless you have a good number of SRT classes under your belt, I'm sure you'll find things of use in the report, and even if you do have, it never hurts to reinforce what you know. Both the rescuer and the rescued took the time to assess the situation as best they could, and both are to be commended for it. Take advantage of their commitment to creating a safer environment for all kayakers. It is a gift, and should be welcomed as such. It is also one very small part of why the AWA is such an important organization, and why it is as much worth the membership, dues, and contributions as a good paddle and great boat is to our passtime. It is as important as your boat and your PFD. If you're smart, you won't be on the water without them, and if you are going to be a good citizen on the water, you should not be on the water without them and all they offer either.
So glad she’s ok. I’m just kinda shocked that the one guy was only one in water at the time. I can’t even imagine how scary that was to live through it
I was squirming in my chair. That was horrible. You are so helpless in that situation. The more you try to get out, the more you wedge yourself even worse. Ugh.
2:20 he pulled her from being pinned and able to breath to being pinned completely underwater. If she got pinned even tighter down there this could have been the last help she got.
Great, response and realize she was pinned. I see alot of neg comments about the other guys. Unfortunately, Some, people can be trained and just freeze. Some, go Gun-ho. when there isnt no need for high level response. Some, even forget what they train for. I've even seen bystanders give great response to something they were never trained for. Each rescue is unique, you can only hope you will and will remember your training. You don't know how you will respond, to any rescue, until it happens. Even Search & Rescue workers freeze from time to time.
I've seen more people trapped under that same rock than I care to think about, both in person and on video. Thankfully, I've never seen anyone die there, though I've heard of several people who did parish under it. It is definitely one which anyone who boats on that river should know about. If you're not a strong paddler, get out and walk that bit, or maybe don't even run it in the first place. Strong paddlers should just go as far left of it as possible. Once you're close to that rock you stand a good chance of getting sucked in no matter how good you are. Let's avoid future carnage at that spot!
What a bad ass that kiyaker was... She stayed calm, collected and relaxed the whole time... Sure criticisms can be made in hind sight, but that was a sticky little spot right there and more help could've easily been too much help if people kept loosing footing and wiping everybody out.... The important thing is she made it... I was on the edge of my seat
Seems like initially he thought he could do it alone but damn she was wedged in there tight! I do not see how anyone else would be able to fit in there to help.
that crew ALL need to go on a rescue course ASAP, why did only one of them get out to help?!?! that could of ended so different, but well done for the rescue either way.
And.....this is why I'll stick to my nice 17 foot sea kayak in calm rivers, lakes an an occasional paddle in the ocean on calm days. Jesus, the thrill just isn't worth the risk.
I knew a woman who's dead like that in a race in Kighizistan... It was raining a lot, the night before and the river was in flood... unfortunatly someone had cut threes a few days before to close... With the current her kayak was stuck under a three on the way down, and we were never abble to get her out... She was very experimented... Take care at the forces at current!...it's not a children's game ....
OK first of all the guy that goes to rescue the lady he gets an A+ for guts and courage while everybody else is just watching so that’s first but having run around with guys who seem to always be getting in jams like this not in water but let’s say with height situation or fast cars fast motorcycles pinned under things etc. Sometimes if the person is safe for the moment it’s better to think about what you’re going to do than just acting. The lady was obviously cold and freezing but her head is above water and she can breathe that water is coming so fast and it’s got a Her pinned against the rock…. I understand what the guy did he grabbed her arm and probably he thought he could pull her and the boat through but what happens is the boat turned slightly and she goes under and now you’ve turn the situation into a full panic situation because she doesn’t have that long now she’s underwater and now there’s nobody in position to help even when he yells help nobody comes so this crew either needs to work on courage or what they’re going to do in an emergency or something. Have you been in the situation‘s I will say that your adrenaline is pumping and sometimes it almost makes it impossible to move and you just have to try to remain focused and do what you have to do which is exactly what he did he thought through the bad situation and he got her out he didn’t panic because even if she’s underwater for a minute or two you can always bring her back and you’ve got to get her out at that point. Frankly I don’t know why she just didn’t abandon the boat from the get go dive out of the boat and go in the water and get clear of the rock I don’t know why she stayed with the boat nor do I understand why they tried to pull her and the boat through but hindsight is 2020 and again if I’m in that spot I want the guy who comes to help. I will say that for my friends we would get aall kinds of jams but at the instant when there was an issue whether people were drunk or whatever all heads turned to the problem…. We all were quite for a moment and inevitably the person who was the most experienced in that particular endeavor would step forward make a decision on what we were going to do and there was no discussing it we just did what that person said and it always seem to work. To me, it seems like nowadays kids are so bubble raft that they get in a situation like they’re in a pool and the waters over their head and they just panic and they’re going to drown rather than what we were taught as kids which was well you can sing to the bottom and then push off of your feet come up get air and repeat until somebody comes to get you and you can do that for about a half hour if your life depends on it
This person will have PTSD from this. They're lucky to be alive. Those idiots who couldnt even get out of their boat should be charged with reckless endangerment.
@vavanade She died about 2 years ago, don't have the info, but some other comment said it was on the Red Creek after an equipment trap... edit: it was one year ago. full report: www.americanwhitewater.org/content/Accident/detail/accidentid/46312
that damn strong ass droplet, gonna say herculean effort there,pls call for help sooner it's a thing people do in these situations basicly doe in headlights as long as someone else is already helping the key to break that as the rescuer is to call for help let them know you dont got this on your own. people aren't bad for being in standby mode they just don't always know if they're needed or what to do
Smart he got out of his kayak. The water isn't too strong for a swimmer there, it is the surface area of the kayaks which make it dangerous, and what trapped the kayaker. I see why she didn't want to lean her body downstream, as that put her head underwater unless the kayak moved with her and it looked stuck. A case where a sit-on-top kayak would have been safer.
I really appreciate when people are humble enough to post such "far from perfect" rescue video.
It help people realize that whitewater is not Disney Land and nasty shit can happen FOR REAL.
I'm a whitewater rescue instructor and I will use this to teach.
Thank you from the heart,
Alex de Matane, Montréal
I think a few more people helping could have got her out quicker. I was on the American river and a lady died a few boats in front of us. She wasn’t wearing her vest tight enough she slipped out of it when they went to pull her into the raft. People need to respect the water.
I know this is old but I live near the cheat and have paddled it for years. I dont understand why the other paddlers didnt help with the rescue. Anyway, I was a raft guide for a while. I've seen some dangerous situations and helped out with the rescue of a couple people. This one girl was paddling a duckie and I watched her fall out of her boat right above the big rock on river left at wind rapid and she got sucked under it. 3 other the other guides paddled thier rafts over swiftly and we were rescuing her in less that a minute after she went under. I hooked a rope to the back of another guy's jacket, he jumped in the undercut and about 10 seconds later he tugged the rope signaling he had her and we pulled them out and immediately started cpr. She was in there less that 2 minutes but was already drowned. Luckily after some compressions and breathing she spit out the water and started breathing and crying and asking what happened. She was purple, So your absolutely right seconds are crucial. Training and safety are very important.
@@zachthorn237 wow! Im afraid of rafting for this very reason
Frankly I was shocked to see that only one guy got out of his boat to help. This was a deadly serious event perhaps unrealized (somehow!) by the other boaters. Kudo's to the one serious guy. Time to change boating crews if that's all the help you can expect when you're about to die.
I thought the same
I was also surprised that there was a lot of equipment concerns??? Dump your paddled and use both hands for Gods sakes.
@@georgewilliamssr5230 yeah i was upset the guy took the time to stop turn away from victim and say watch my boat "who the fuck cares about your plastic dinghy" SUN TZU
In the heat of the moment, you will lose your sense of perspective. Give it a rest you toxic arm chair experts & just thank the good lord that she is OK.
@@shark8996 Been whitewater kayaking for 30 years, not an armchair expert. If you're going to kayak you also need to be practiced and ready for this kind of thing - with all hands on deck. A minute of "losing your perspective" can mean life or death. If you're not ready, don't kayak with other people because you endanger their lives.
These pins require Everybody to get out and get involved with rope. Get ropes hooked to the boat and the victim before doing any movement if they are able to breathe where they are pinned, which is how this one seemed to me. Only move victim once everyone on the crew is at optimal spots for ropework and hands on assistance. I had a friend go through a similar pin where we got lucky that he washed out the other side, but the main lesson I took away was that if they can breath where they are, DO Not Rush the rescue, Keep them stationary and set up. Do it right. As soon as you start moving them the water will pull them down unless you have a real strong system to counter it.
absolutely correct
Well stated. Priorities. Think fast.
That man that took the initiative is the man I want on my team. God bless.
the rest of the crew needed to realize that seconds matter in an underwater pin and their inaction could have proved fatal. there was more to do than just collecting paddles and boats. If cold weather has you more worried about losing a paddle or boat than someone's life... reevaluate.
Check out American Whitewater - accident database - report ID#46312
Poor Nancy wasn't so lucky the 2nd time.
Those other people needed to be out of their boats helping not spectating, please take a swiftwater rescue course
@@rstats2127the more people out of a boat, the more that become potential victims. Any rescue course will cover that. Even swift water rescue teams don’t send everyone they have into the water. It makes it more dangerous for everyone, and the ability for someone else to get lost and not even seen is highly likely. Having others that are not involved, and can not do anything, stay in the boats is the right thing. They have the high ground and can see a lot more than those in the water.
Those collecting paddles did exactly what they needed to as well, if you lose your equipment, no one is leaving that spot. Paddles is rapids are one thing you need.
@@PTRRanger951I guess you didn’t watch the video or you watched it on mute, he asked for help more than once, one other person out of their boat was not detrimental. She passed away on another run on another day so maybe she was over her head in decision making and picking lines.
@@rstats2127 doesn’t matter if he asked for help or not. If they didn’t want to help, or couldn’t, they didn’t have to. Even trained rescue professionals won’t and can’t do things all the time. Point is, if you become a victim yourself, you won’t help anyone, and now others have to risk their life to save not just the original victim but now additional.
It’s common sense and one of the first things any first responder is taught.
People get tunnel vision and see one thing, a person needing help, they don’t look at what is actually going on, what other dangers there are, their capabilities, the surroundings. They just react, and are often killed.
I can't believe that those other paddlers just floated there and watched... Unacceptable when someone is in a life-threatening pin.
They're kayakers.
They were probably all loaded.
@@robgrey6183 🥴
Glad she is ok. My heart was in my mouth when she went under the water
@braindead sheep First i thought are you joking, but sadly you didnt.
@@pepefin ? im confused by this reply
@@deltaraven She went another paddling trip in 2019 and it was her last.
@@pepefin she was an amazing person and died in a freak accident.
Went rafting on the Cheat last May. Got talking to the guide about this and he said she died in another kayak accident. Not sure how
Nice rescue, Bill. This was among the scariest videos I've seen.
That would be the last day a paddled with that crew!
Kyle Keeler *I
Except for the one dude who helped her.
Why no one helped?!?!?
Yeah only for that chap saved her the others useless she's a lucky lady
Yeh they suck
Bill, that must have been scary, and Nancy, especially for you. Thanks to both of you for writing it up in the AW reports and for sharing this video. Both of you kept it together, persisted through it all. Hind sight is 20-20, but until you face something like it, you can't know how you'll respond. Bill will replay this a thousand times in his mind. The pros get in lots of practice, teach some of the skills regularly, and the rest of us typically don't. We figure we're good if we took a class. Maybe not. If we took time to practice regularly in realistic settings (not a boat leaned up against a tree in the park), we might be more competent and more confident when these situations pop up. And we may approach things more realistically when running the river. I think the biggest lesson here is to practice more, and that lesson applies to myself as much as anyone.
So glad your ok Nancy! Bill, amazing job! That was a horrible situation. I’m glad your all safe.
Important video. Everything else has been said in other comments about the reactions of the other boaters aside from the one main rescuer. I am an EMT, and two things I really have to note is that there should have been way more communication with the primary rescuer to the other boaters. Second off, after having unpinned her, the first goal is to get her out of the cold water, somewhere warm and safe to assess and prevent hypothermia and in case she passes out in the water/cant maintain her own airway. There didn't appear to be any urgency in doing that even though they end up in a shallow eddy where one can walk. My two cents
I was a bit blown away by how quickly everyone relaxed once she was free from the pin. Definitely should have tried to get her out of the water quicker in case she went in to shock or had inhaled some water. Plenty of accident reports of out there of people seeming fine in one minute, and incapacitated the next from a flush drowning and water being in their respiratory system.
@@derekdellinger9589 I have heard it referred to as "parking lot drowning" in the old days. 😬
Sadly the same woman pinned in this video died in an accident less than two years later. I'm frankly surprised anyone would get back in a kayak after this close call.
Holy shit what a terrifying pin. Kudos for your quick reaction. Glad she is okay!
Watched this 3 times -a lot to learn here. At --0:24-- probably pinned; --0:41-- Bill 1st realised she's pinned; --0:43-- 1st whistled (good!); --1:31-- established she's breathing; --2:23-- her head's submerged; --2:47-- Bill 1st yell's for help; --3:11-- her head's above water. I'm not sure if anyone helped rescue her beside Bill - could have set up secure line to keep her in breathing position from upstream. As she was in the lead, could have used some rescuers upstream, some downstream - focused on securing the breathing paddler 1st, with a safer extraction (without 48 sec. submerged! The yellow boater running the same line didn't help- probably wedged her tighter!). They needed an experienced leader with SRT training to direct others - I know I'll be taking this course - no matter what the cost!
I don’t see how anyone could have gotten upstream or gotten a secure line on her since she is so far under the rock
RIP Nancy. She died 2 years later on the Red Creek after an equipment trap... Such a sad thing to happen to a fellow boater
I guess she should have learnt her lesson from this time and not kept doing this shit.
Thank you for sharing this info. I'm sorry to hear of this fatal accident.
Wow - how fast it can go from fun to a fight for your life. Will share with kids as a much watch. Thank you for sharing!
Two minutes, forty-five seconds. That's a long damn time to be pinned like that. Only one guy is able to recognize the immediacy of this mortal situation?
The others should have improved their swift water rescue skills by now. They didn't exhibit any that day. No sense of urgency.
Good hands on Bill. But what the hell were the rest of your crew doing sitting useless in the eddy. If you weren't there, would the others have been able to step up? They seemed rather shocked into inaction.
Nathan Nahikian when talking to people afterwards, there was confusion and uncertainty about what was happening or whether it was ok to proceed down the drop. One of the mistakes I feel I made was when I abandoned my boat I told the other person in the eddy I was and to watch the gear. Should have given better instructions to assist once more people came or gear was secure.
Thats too kind Bill. In situation like that while you are doing all you can, the rest of the crew needs to step in and seek alternatives and ways to support the ongoing efforts. Not just sit in the eddy looking clueless. If you had not been there, I have no doubt it would have been a far grimmer outcome.
yep man, cold lesson....
Bill Durr, Nathan is spot on imo. This isn’t on you at all. You were the one trying to rescue. Yes, perhaps you could have communicated more to your crew, but I was astounded to see them just sitting around watching your efforts. And yellow boat doesn’t even seem to be watching!! WTF! 🤬🤯😳
There wasn’t much communication or game-planning, but it was clear enough what was going on, and someone at your back pulling you while you struggled to pull pinned boater would hand been a good start.
Scary and very frustrating to watch.
Moral arguments are the most infeasible arguments with the least utility you can make in situations like these. It doesn't matter how you feel about "whose fault" it was. It matters what happened and what could have been done differently.
Thank you for sharing the video, Nice response Bill and glad to see the end result was not fatal. It is too often that a situation occurs and most folks are dumbfounded and don't react at all such as the remainder of the crew. Others should have also been getting out of their boat immediately and assisting.
I lost my best friend in August 2015 because his ‘buddies’ thought he was fooling around & left him alone until enough time had passed for them to realize he was in trouble & couldn’t get out by then it was too late!
Heart stopping footage man. Great job saving her life. It wasn’t perfect, but you made it happen.
Wow, I paddled for years with friends on the Kern River.. and never witnessed anything that serious..good work mate! She is alive today because of her fellow paddlers.. thank you for sharing because there’s so many things we can learn from us. Number one it’s great to paddle with friends versus doing it alone… Number two is anytime someone is in trouble it should be all hands on deck.
She died in 2019 when she was entrapped by her tow-tether in a strainer
That video gave me anxiety. Wow! You're amazing!!
RIP to this lady.
She had this scary, phobia inducing event happen and still decided to continue with her hobby. She died 2 years later in another kayaking event
sad to hear that she ultimately died from another kayaking incident. May i know which kayaking event that she passed away?
Probably with the same group of heroic rescuers. I'm a complete amateur and i was shocked by their inaction. It literally looked like they didn't care she was drowning, i would have moved faster then that to save a complete stranger, and she was a part of their group. shameful.
The detailed story of her death as told by her fellow paddlers, can be found at: American Whitewater - accident database - report ID#46312
She got snagged apparently.
I’ll be using this vid on my Swiftwater Safety Institute courses in Australia. Nice job. Ditto other comments re scouting and no help from rest of crew. But super on the fly thinking amigo.
Care to share any evaluation on what was done well and what could be done better? Thanks and much love from Tennessee
@@loganlewis7083 Of course it is always very easy to be a "Monday Morning Quarterback", and not everything is visible in the vid... having said that: The videographer clearly says he "doesn't know what's over there".. and yet someone ran it without scouting. This rescue wouldn't have needed to happen if the time and energy to scout had occurred. That's a common mistake. After that, super quick and effective action by videographer/paddler, including 3 whistle blasts. He finds a safe place to exit his boat to provide the help that made the difference between life and death. Blue and yellow and multi-colored boaters just sit there, in one case even looking away from the action, remain in their boats and do absolutely nothing to help while their comrade is drowning. Crazy. Videographer does great work, including trying many different techniques and hand reaches, and yelling for help again. At long last yellow boat exists to try to help, but the videographer has accomplished the rescue basically on his own. I agree with the other comments, I'd never paddle again with the others. Great work, Bill! I'd boat with you any time. My students all agree! ;-)
@@Jeffe01 thank you for the time to share that!!!! novice paddler here... I've spent more hours studying than boating haha! Thanks again!!!
Ideally, (and it’s true. About hindsight being 20/20 so good job acting, Bill, which is more important than sitting around thinking too much), I’d say it was more Important to maintain her in a heads-up position while rescuer directed others to get a line on her boat. She went from heads-up to heads-down with no real plan to change that other than trying things and hoping the boat came free with the next attempt). She was heads-down for awhile. My 2 cents since you’re using This for teaching…
@@Jeffe01 There are a couple of things worth noting that support your 'lessons learned'.
1. Apparently that particular has pinned other kayakers before and claimed lives.
2. The survivor in this video (Nancy Kell) sadly lost her life whilst kayaking with the same group in 2019. The story can be found at: American Whitewater - accident database - report ID#46312
I watched again just to make sure I didn't miss something the first time and my conclusion is reaffirmed, except for Bill the rest of that crew is absolutely worthless. They need to find a different pass-time if that's all they are going to put into it. Absolutely ridiculous.
If she died thise people would be held partially liable. Sitting in their kayaks while someone is literally pinned underwater. Unbelievable
I can't breathe when I watch this video. It's so scary, man! Glad that everyone is okay.
Oh that scared the hell out of me! Good job on the rescue. Thank god
Excellent footage. Really scary situation. Big Ups for saving her 💪🙏
Wow, amazing job, you literally just saved someones life. That's pretty amazing.
How to drown a friend,
1. Push them further underneath the water.
2. Stand back and watch.
Glad she got out. Two big things wrong, at least. 1). Guy says he has no idea what's over there (the drop). Well then, get out and scout and have someone in your group that know the lines. 2). Starting the rescue he tasks one would be rescuer with the job of watching his boat. So the guy sits there the whole time doing just that, watching the guys boat. Needless to say dude, the hell with your boat, save that womans life! No plan in place either and took her from where she could breath to being underwater. Realize hindsight is 20 20 and this is a combat situation, but this crew and this girl were both extremely lucky this ended the way it did.
sirshibboleth the two of us did know the lines, and have run the river multiple times. The video started towards the tail end of our discussion. We were deciding on creative lines to take, and were not sure the right side of the boulder had dried out.
Forgot to include the AW incident report in the description. In there I do mention that I should have told the person minding my boat to assist instead. A better way of putting the things I list as 'could have done better' would be communication.
Unfortunately this is a sport to risk your life. It's sort of like selfies at the edge of the grand canyon. Was it really worth it ?
Anyway I'm guessing that Bill was the leader and he said "watch my boat" . He was probably the only knowledgeable person there and luck just happened to be on his side . Thankfully she was saved but I bet she was seconds from drowning .
Oh man, nice rescue , close call in the end almost thought u were guna give up. Nice one dude 👍
What do you guys do when you get to the end of a run? Have someone meet you?
legendary job by the rescuer. hats off to you
Man, it was scary just watching that. Well done on staying composed in an intense situation.
I am amazed at the lack of concern the guys in the boats showed. Even after she was rescued they seemed more annoyed then concerned.
"Time spent in reconnaissance is seldom time waisted". Field Marshal Rommel
Nice rescue. You did a great job!
that was a close call. what a difference a little bit of a trying can make... breath or not to breath. Respect for staying calm and getting the shit sorted.
This made my eyes water! She went from breathing to drowning in seconds! The two worst ways of dying:
1.)Drowning.
2.)Burned alive.
Definitely not people I'd ever paddle with. Looks like only 1 person with an actual head on their shoulders, all the other idiots sat in their boats and watched.
too worried about losing their recyclable plastic boats
Absolutly what I am familar with crews that dont understand the crucial of securing space while accident. My situtations are mostly thanksfully not that serious, but people positioning always wrong, even guides. One thing I was noticing that the guy who helped her got her into a much more serious situation by trying to pull her sideways. That pushed her more under water.
great case study
Jeezus, how the hell...? You guys are amazing!
With some of these rescues on kayaks pinned against rocks like this, is it an issue of releasing the skirt or not being able to move in a way that allows getting the legs out? It seems like the kayaks wedge and while I understand the hydraulic force on the body it also seems like if the victim wasn't constricted in the kayak, they'd roll off to one side or the other and down into the pool. I just don't understand if its the kayak or the skirt or what but would like to know. Don't have any whitewater really but do get mostly flood related swiftwater incidents and would like to understand it better.
Nasty pin which rapid is that? Glad Nancy was able to hang in there, thanks for sharing.
Three Amigos. It's right before Cue Ball
Others have also called that drop sasquatch
Bill Durr , is it even a rapid?! I think Even Nastier is before Cue Ball. I ran Cheat so many times and have hard time imagining where that is at. Is it at the very top of Even Nastier?
Thank you so much Bill Durr to report the accident on AWW.
With your mistake, we make this place a safer one.
Respect from Montréal, Canada
Alex de Matane
Whitewater kayak and ww safety instructor
The others just chill-axing in the kayaks looking on.. Top..
Watched in suspense, holding my breath, body tensed up. I couldn't stand to watch it, so I fast forwarded to the end. I still don't know how he managed to get the person out. That was a miracle! I'm shocked they made it out, but so glad the person made it to safety! If I were there, I would have decided to never go with those other people again since they were so inactive in helping. Though tere was one or two people behind the guy with the camera that were seemingly slightly helping.
Addendum: It is worth reading the accident report if for no other reason than to see what you can learn from it. Unless you have a good number of SRT classes under your belt, I'm sure you'll find things of use in the report, and even if you do have, it never hurts to reinforce what you know. Both the rescuer and the rescued took the time to assess the situation as best they could, and both are to be commended for it. Take advantage of their commitment to creating a safer environment for all kayakers. It is a gift, and should be welcomed as such. It is also one very small part of why the AWA is such an important organization, and why it is as much worth the membership, dues, and contributions as a good paddle and great boat is to our passtime. It is as important as your boat and your PFD. If you're smart, you won't be on the water without them, and if you are going to be a good citizen on the water, you should not be on the water without them and all they offer either.
Props to the guy filming the POV but wtf was the rest of that crew doing just sitting in their boats
Omg, you are really a hero ♥️
So glad she’s ok. I’m just kinda shocked that the one guy was only one in water at the time. I can’t even imagine how scary that was to live through it
I was squirming in my chair. That was horrible. You are so helpless in that situation. The more you try to get out, the more you wedge yourself even worse. Ugh.
Wow, you are the man.
2:20 he pulled her from being pinned and able to breath to being pinned completely underwater. If she got pinned even tighter down there this could have been the last help she got.
He also slipped off and let go of her after she was face down. So for a second, she was face down in the water, pinned, with no one holding her.
Is this cheat river wv?
Wow. Not sure what to say. That was scary. Glad she is OK. Easy to judge from here, but was not there.
Just glad the end result was good.
Good job alerting other crew members
Crap that no one else helped. God bless that man who did
Amazing rescue
Great, response and realize she was pinned.
I see alot of neg comments about the other guys.
Unfortunately,
Some, people can be trained and just freeze.
Some, go Gun-ho. when there isnt no need for high level response.
Some, even forget what they train for.
I've even seen bystanders give great response to something they were never trained for.
Each rescue is unique, you can only hope you will and will remember your training.
You don't know how you will respond, to any rescue, until it happens.
Even Search & Rescue workers freeze from time to time.
why did the other guys not help?
Good job on rescue, have across from carnifax, this river averages a death a year
Holy Smokes. Glad you were able to save them
kayaking just came off of my bucket list
How did only one person help????
I take my hat of 2 that 1 guy struggling to help her while all the others just watching her drown unbelievable 👍
I've seen more people trapped under that same rock than I care to think about, both in person and on video. Thankfully, I've never seen anyone die there, though I've heard of several people who did parish under it. It is definitely one which anyone who boats on that river should know about. If you're not a strong paddler, get out and walk that bit, or maybe don't even run it in the first place. Strong paddlers should just go as far left of it as possible. Once you're close to that rock you stand a good chance of getting sucked in no matter how good you are. Let's avoid future carnage at that spot!
What rapid on the canyon is this?
"I don't know what's over there". Someone found out. Glad the rescue was successful. Be safe, have fun.
What a bad ass that kiyaker was... She stayed calm, collected and relaxed the whole time...
Sure criticisms can be made in hind sight, but that was a sticky little spot right there and more help could've easily been too much help if people kept loosing footing and wiping everybody out....
The important thing is she made it...
I was on the edge of my seat
This is good video.. should have more views!
Seems like initially he thought he could do it alone but damn she was wedged in there tight! I do not see how anyone else would be able to fit in there to help.
that crew ALL need to go on a rescue course ASAP, why did only one of them get out to help?!?! that could of ended so different, but well done for the rescue either way.
And.....this is why I'll stick to my nice 17 foot sea kayak in calm rivers, lakes an an occasional paddle in the ocean on calm days. Jesus, the thrill just isn't worth the risk.
These people are crazy
How inconsiderate of him to not wipe the water off his lense before he went to save her.
my thoughts aswell lol
I knew a woman who's dead like that in a race in Kighizistan...
It was raining a lot, the night before and the river was in flood... unfortunatly someone had cut threes a few days before to close...
With the current her kayak was stuck under a three on the way down, and we were never abble to get her out...
She was very experimented...
Take care at the forces at current!...it's not a children's game ....
Wow that one guy was amazing. I wouldn’t run a river with those other people especially when they just strolled over.
OK first of all the guy that goes to rescue the lady he gets an A+ for guts and courage while everybody else is just watching so that’s first but having run around with guys who seem to always be getting in jams like this not in water but let’s say with height situation or fast cars fast motorcycles pinned under things etc. Sometimes if the person is safe for the moment it’s better to think about what you’re going to do than just acting. The lady was obviously cold and freezing but her head is above water and she can breathe that water is coming so fast and it’s got a
Her pinned against the rock…. I understand what the guy did he grabbed her arm and probably he thought he could pull her and the boat through but what happens is the boat turned slightly and she goes under and now you’ve turn the situation into a full panic situation because she doesn’t have that long now she’s underwater and now there’s nobody in position to help even when he yells help nobody comes so this crew either needs to work on courage or what they’re going to do in an emergency or something. Have you been in the situation‘s I will say that your adrenaline is pumping and sometimes it almost makes it impossible to move and you just have to try to remain focused and do what you have to do which is exactly what he did he thought through the bad situation and he got her out he didn’t panic because even if she’s underwater for a minute or two you can always bring her back and you’ve got to get her out at that point. Frankly I don’t know why she just didn’t abandon the boat from the get go dive out of the boat and go in the water and get clear of the rock I don’t know why she stayed with the boat nor do I understand why they tried to pull her and the boat through but hindsight is 2020 and again if I’m in that spot I want the guy who comes to help. I will say that for my friends we would get aall kinds of jams but at the instant when there was an issue whether people were drunk or whatever all heads turned to the problem…. We all were quite for a moment and inevitably the person who was the most experienced in that particular endeavor would step forward make a decision on what we were going to do and there was no discussing it we just did what that person said and it always seem to work. To me, it seems like nowadays kids are so bubble raft that they get in a situation like they’re in a pool and the waters over their head and they just panic and they’re going to drown rather than what we were taught as kids which was well you can sing to the bottom and then push off of your feet come up get air and repeat until somebody comes to get you and you can do that for about a half hour if your life depends on it
Gracias a dios todo bien estuviste super bien en el rescate grande
Damn bro. That was sketchy. I've had a buddy get trapped under a rock. It is no joke.
I shat my pants when she went under. Great rescue bill.
Way to go! Thanks for posting. Ditch most of that crew.
This person will have PTSD from this. They're lucky to be alive. Those idiots who couldnt even get out of their boat should be charged with reckless endangerment.
R.I.P. Nancy
@vavanade She died about 2 years ago, don't have the info, but some other comment said it was on the Red Creek after an equipment trap...
edit: it was one year ago. full report: www.americanwhitewater.org/content/Accident/detail/accidentid/46312
Damn! Just came a cross this and it was scary just to watch. You get a solid for your actions. What was with the other boaters? Wow!?
This is terrifying
Wow I'd get some new kayaking buddies since only one got out to help.
Holy S one more minute and it could have been lights out! Luck was on her side today..
Holy shit😮 that was way too fucking close. You saved that woman’s life . That was hard to watch.
that damn strong ass droplet, gonna say herculean effort there,pls call for help sooner it's a thing people do in these situations basicly doe in headlights as long as someone else is already helping the key to break that as the rescuer is to call for help let them know you dont got this on your own. people aren't bad for being in standby mode they just don't always know if they're needed or what to do
My god thats a sieve if I have ever seen one.
Cant believe that one guy is still in his kayak - in a situation like this you cant freeze up - you need to HELP! all of you take note:!!!!!
Is this Nancy Kell?
Yes
Holy shit, when she was moved out of the small air pocket and nobody was ready to help the rescuer, I felt like screaming. WTF!
Yikes 😬 Glad everything turned out ok
very hard to watch, but great job getting her out!
Blows my fucking mind that not a single other person helped.
Smart he got out of his kayak. The water isn't too strong for a swimmer there, it is the surface area of the kayaks which make it dangerous, and what trapped the kayaker. I see why she didn't want to lean her body downstream, as that put her head underwater unless the kayak moved with her and it looked stuck. A case where a sit-on-top kayak would have been safer.