A Reflection on Madoka Magica Review
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- Опубліковано 7 вер 2024
- Spoilers Ahead
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The "gaaahhhhh" crying dub scene is modified from a video • Aldnoah.Zero - DEMO's ... by Demo Senpai- / douchebagchocolat
If you enjoyed this video you might enjoy his work as well.
The question of Sayaka freaking out about being a zombie often makes Americans go 'meh'. There are two points here: (a) I think in American culture people feel that others have to "earn" their empathy, because there is 'good' (?) suffering, which is not your own fault and thus deserves empathy, and 'bad' (?) suffering, which is your own fault and thus doesn't deserve empathy; this is more of an American (or rather Anglo-Saxon) cultural assumption than anythiing deep about the world; and (b) the idea of the body-soul dichotomy is more accepted in Anglo-Saxon and Judaeo-Christian) culture in general than in Japan, where the soul is felt more as a part of the body (remember Kyūbē talking about it to the girls in Ep. 6, after the secret of the soul gems was revealed?); so Sayaka's reaction is perhaps more understandable to Americans if you imagine that, instead of her soul, it was some other part of her body she had to drag around -- let's say Kyūbē had placed her heart in a transparent container and now she had to walk around with her heart hanging off her neck... that probably would creep Westerners out, too.
Returning now to the idea that empathy has to be 'earned' by the victim's showing the 'right' kind of suffering, I think this comes from the belief that people have to do something to improve their own situation by themselves. Which means that Anglo-Saxon (to a lesser degree all Western) culture is bad at handling people who came to their limit if said limit is not widely regarded as such. If you think 'I could have solved that problem / taken that blow', then the fact that the character couldn't becomes somewhat despicable to you. I imagine an entire book could be written about this perspective, what motivates it and whether or not it is fair and justified; but since in the end this boils down to individual opinion, then everybody is of course allowed to think / feel whatever s/he wants about this particular issue. Personally, I will only say that I prefer to think, when I consider other people's suffering, not about whether or not it is 'justified' or 'earned' ("did you do something about it?" "aren't you exaggerating?") -- because I don't see the point of measuring my own emotional reactions by this criterion -- but whether or not it is sincere ("are you really suffering, or is this just some sleazy scheme to get empathy out of me? are you telling the truth, or are you lying?"). If sincere suffering is based on some motive that would not have caused me to suffer, or that I could have handled well, it doesn't follow that I should deny empathy. It just means, to me, that there is something logical I can say to try to make the sufferer feel better ("you are still alive! you can still live! don't look at it like this -- there are other interpretations, you know', etc.).
You raise an interesting point - however, I didn't go "meh," because I didn't sympathize or empathize with Sayaka's character - on the contrary - of all the characters in the show I believe (if I had to) I identify with Sayaka the most. But the reason I was a little dismissive of her plight was because I didn't really think very much had changed to warrant her response. She isn't a zombie - she may not have a soul but she's still a walking, talking person who could very well talk to boys if she wanted to. The only fundamental change to her was that she would eventually become a witch (which she didn't know at the time).
But from her viewpoint, everything that she is or was is now contained inside her soul gem, and the body that she uses to walk and talk is merely the vessel that she uses to interact with the world while she's trapped inside her soul gem. So, in that sense, she really _is_ no longer human: She's just this little, blue, glowy thing that is remote controlling her now soulless body.
And when you view it like that, one would likely question their sense of self-worth; I mean, they're literally less than human now. And that's why she doesn't go after Kyosuke: This revelation has killed her self-esteem and she believes she's no longer worthy of his love because of what she's been turned into.
Now, I myself am a pretty utilitarian kind of guy, and, in her position, would ultimately view it in the same way that Kyouko does. But even I will admit that the idea of holding in your hand all that you are, all your feelings, your hopes, your dreams, and knowing that it is no longer a part of your "self" (that is, your body), but contained inside a little object... Well, that would give even someone like me pause, even if I wouldn't reach the same conclusions as Sayaka. I mean, there is a reason why she spends her day home from school in E7 obsessively staring at her soul gem: Because she's thinking about that very thing; that this object is, for all intents and purposes, who she is now; what she's been turned into.
The point about the cultural difference in this particular topic is that Americans (like most Westerners) have lived in a culture that accepts the body-soul dichotomy, i.e. the soul is not part of the body, so the soul could be somewhere else (as a ghost, or as an angel in heaven) without the body and this doesn't make people feel disgusted. If my understanding is correct (those who know Japanese culture better than me please opine), to Shintō believers, the soul being a part of the body makes it more similar to an organ (remember Kyūbē talking about the body as a 'wonderful structure, with lungs, a heart, and a circulatory system', right before talking about the soul?). So having your soul in a tiny container right in front of you would seem creepy in the way that having your beating heart in a glass container right in front of you might seem to Americans (Westerners) -- an important part of you (your body-soul complex) is now in this grotesque form, outside of its normal place...
Asehpe Interesting. I must admit, at the time of the review, I did not really consider the cultural differences when viewing anime. thanks for the info
Departed Reflections You're welcome! We often forget that animē is made in a different culture, with different values... which sometimes explains some of the surprising things in it.
IT IS VERY DARK.......but it is very well written and it is honestly one of my favorites
I agree, it was pretty good
cried a lot during this anime
You sir, are a perfect mix of explanation, seriousness, Humour, not to mention your kickass voice. Hope you do more reviews in the future.
+Malus Thantos I hope to do so too, thank you : )
Excellent review! Very well done. That's a lot of fantastic editing, 2:18-2:29 made me laugh.
Thank You for your kind comment, I'm glad you got something out of this work
did you call me a sensei? i kind of like it. Sensei Kyubey has a nice little rhyme going on.
+Kyubey gtfo devil spawn
Departed Reflections why would I leave I just got here
Kyubey deh shorter stay the better : P
Departed Reflections Man you really want me to leave don't you? For the right price I can go away.
Wow, this was really well done. One of the best I've seen. I saw the comment where you said you put about 20+ hours of work into one of these. I completely believe it. Good analysis too. I agreed with most of the points, and appreciated the way you articulated them.
capitalist88 Thank You for your kind comment, I'm glad you enjoyed the video
I fell into the Modoka Magica trap. I stopped watching minutes before it got good.
And when I started watching again I finished it in one sitting.
Can't say I loved the ending.but it was built up to so conclusively that once it happened I was just left with my mouth hanging open like Ok... you win show.
It's not even a deus ex machina it's just like Deus Ex because I said so!
I actually did the same thing, started watching the first episode, stopped, picked it up a year later, glad I did
You know its funny but I came back to video to actually watch it and I must say you really bring a very unquie perspective with this anime that I have yet to see in any other review regarding it...truth me told I don't understand why someone like you does not have more subs. I really love the way you presented all this especially as it relates to the texts and all refrences you made in the video with the pictures etc etc....was that hard to learn how to do? XD
Thanks Sexual : ). yeah it took some time and practice - everything does doesn't it
its because he doesn't make more videos. that is the main reason
True, if you wanna get subs you gotta be consistent - but I haven't the time as of late. I hope to return to making videos this year tho-
+Departed Reflections thank goodness. you are still alive!
Silvio Grijalva Aww thanks, just barely
The question of Homura saying "four words" to radically change the timeline: you're not taking her perspective into account. She tried saying those four words at least once, and it didn't work. You can of course say that she should have tried it again and again (which she probably did, failing every time), but the point is Homura wasn't able to do it. Now, if she was Madoka or even Sayaka, someone with better communcation skills who was better at convincing others, then that might work. But for her -- who is not good at communicating (she couldn't even convince Mami to let her fight Charlotte!...) -- it wasn't.
You could even argue that if she kept trying to convince the girls she'd eventually succeed. But that's not how humans act. After a few defeats using a strategy that doesn't come easily to us, we give up. And we try something else, something we are better at -- in Homura's case, being a silent loner who solves everything by herself. If her personality were different, things would have been different.
I remember considering that rationale after I had finished the show - but I still felt that the biggest problem was a lack of communication. oh well you may be right in this regard
Indeed, and that's the point. Some people are better at communication, and others aren't. It's a pity -- I've seen situations in life where someone was obviously not handling the communication part well, but s/he just didn't know how to do it any better. If Homura had a different personality...
+Departed Reflections does it get better after the first episode?
5:05 that part was much better when its subbed
shaft head tilt is best character.
As far as I know, it was stated that Magical Girls usually work alone. This is why Kyoko only appeared when Mami was dead. It isn't really that surprising then they they don't know much about MGs, since Kyubey spoonfeeds incomplete information about them and they trust Kyubey.
Sayaka's ideal about being a zombie so she can't love anymore may be incomplete and not properly explained, but its her ideals anyway. She's "idealistic", as you said.
I see that you are a RWBY fan(like moi), how did you feel when Monty died?
I did not know Monty personally, but as a fan of his work, I am very sad that he died.
Anyway, you make some good points, but I'm still unconvinced that an experienced magical girl wouldn't find out about her transformation, Kyubey may be cryptic, but he doesn't generally go out of his way to hide facts- most of the time he's like "how come you didn't know about this/why are you so emotional about this/didn't you read the fine print?
Thank you for your comment
~Peace
Still, nobody ready the whole "Terms and Conditions" and usually skip past them, don't they? Even if you have used a "program" for a veeerrrryyy long time, you may be unaware of some things about the program's "secrets" and "scams", even.
I don't actually find it surprising at all, the MG's just do what they're told and what is told is reinforced by what they see.
You're welcome.
AzureDaora X The way I see it with Sayaka and the zombie belief is Sayaka unable to accept circumstances or other points of view. This is a flaw in her character that ultimately leads to her demise like in tragedies. There are more instances of this, like being unable to accept the fact that Mami tied down Homura believing that Homura was selfish and waited for Mami's death. Sayaka is unable to accept that Hotomi likes Kyosuke, believing that she has no chance against Hitomi. Back to the zombie thing, Sayaka is unable to accept that her soul in inside the soul gem, believing she has no chance in life with Kyosuke.
+ssbbshadowplayer1
Yep, you can't look at it from a rational perspective, because Sayaka isn't in a rational state of mind during these moments. You also have to keep in mind that these girls aren't adults, so you can't expect them to think like adults.
It really bugs me when people say that Homura should have tried to get help from the others, because she did, and it got her nowhere. Mami and Sayaka are too fragile and idealistic to believe that Kyubey is tricking them without the proof right in front of them, and we all saw what happened to Mami when she figured out the truth. Kyoko *might* be more reasonable than the other two, but she's not going to care to help unless Sayaka is there to turn her character around.
darkprinc979 good point(s)
Okay.. on a slightly unrelated note, I really need to ask, how long did it take you to edit this video? You visualize like... like every fifth word or so. ^_^||
Ashadow Reviews Thank you for your appreciation. it generally takes my 20+ hours to edit a reflection video.
Departed Reflections 20+ hours? Wow, that's some series dedication right there. Also, it's nice to see that you're getting some decent attention for your videos, you've got talent =)
+Ashadow Reviews Thanks man, I do hope to continue this after school
the sad part every screen on here is real.all she dark ones
these reviews deserve 10k+ views, at least
Maso Luo Thanks for the compliment
subbed is so much better than the dubbed version
+kulspak in retrospect I wish I watched it in Japanese
Departed Reflections ^^
+kulspak I disagree. Strongly.
Asehpe thats sad
No, it's just a viewpoint. Care to discuss?
I have a theory about why they don't know they will turn into witches.
Magical girls don't form groups with other magical girls, every magical girl has her territory where she hunts witches. More magical girls at the same plase is harmful because than there are less grief seeds per magical girl. Mami made an exception because she didn't want to be alone anymore.So because they are mostly loners, most of them couldn't have noticed.
lol dat demo d sound clip
gr^pe : )
Now, how do the girls not know about all those secrets? Well, you see, as Mami points out, they're all loners. They don't team up, they don't work together... so how exactly would they find out that the new Lovecraftian monster they are fighting against used to be one of them? How exactly would Mami find out if she's always alone?
I just find it difficult to believe that no-one found out before blue hair turned. devil spawn never really tried to hide it - it just didn't make sense to me thats all.
Departed Reflections Not everything makes sense to everybody. If you're the kind who figures these things out by yourself before the reveal episode, congrats. I'm not this kind, and I didn't. I guess it takes all kinds, eh? If that surprises you, the you're going to go on being surprised by the different kinds of people there are in the world...
The only reason Urobuchi made a statement saying this was supposed to be heart warming and all, is because it was leaked that he was on the project and the show was supposed to be marketed as a standard magical girl show. With Urobuchi's reputation, people would never have believed the marketing otherwise.
+darkprinc979 interesting, I never heard of that
Sorry DepartedReflections, but I have to criticize your review on one point. It is too similar to Jesuotaku's review, and while you did put in effort to make this review unique by bringing up your own points, altogether it still feels like a majority of points were reiterated from Jesuotaku. When reviewing a show that is a classic, is really old, or has been reviewed many times over already, it is imperative that you include or emphasize something different that others have not already. Despite having similar points with Jesuotaku, you did bring up important points that highlighted where the show especially worked and did not work, so good job on that.
I have a big dumb smile on my face, because Jesuotaku is one of my favorite anime reviewers (sadly shes not doing vids anymore) and I really can't take any comparison to her negatively.
Regarding the originality of my review, I'd be lying if my opinion on the series wasn't at all influenced by her review (which was the reason I watched it in the first place). However, the thoughts expressed in this video are certainly my own and are a my holistic reflection of the series, whether my sentiments are shared by other people or not.
Dat Yellowline doe.
+Bavarian Banshee From dat Demo
Mami could've leaped back
Good review tho
+HoddTodd my point tho- amiright
Departed Reflections You were correct on all of your points, I agree.
Yes, that will teach you to challenge my vast intellect----- : ) also thank you
Departed Reflections I don't think you even mentioned how Mami died in your review though lol
But you're welcome.
that beginning reminds me of demo
+Ion Barbu Eremia same as fuck
+Ion Barbu Eremia The intro is from an excerpt from the song "yellow line" - Demo used the same song in his "Redline review"
Departed Reflections ah, ok. Thanks for telling me
Now, just to avoid misunderstandings: I'm not condemning your taste. I'm pointing out that I think you missed certain things; but hey, I may be wrong myself. If what I'm saying doesn't make sense to you or doesn't seem justified, it's OK by me for you to ignore it. I'm saying this just on the off chance that something I say might seem logical or significant to you.
your cool bro, no worries
Fist bump! :-)
Pretty good. Gotta disagree with a few points.
So you don't count the ending as an ass-pull? Because why? Karmic bonding was mentioned two episodes before? Does that make SAO's plot-twist of star-burst stream good because Kirito found it in his inventory an episode before? *sigh* Foreshadowing a character has power is not the same thing as establishing a consistent rule throughout the universe. Karmic Bonding is not an established rule. The ending was the definition of a deus ex machina. How was it not an ass pull to you? To escape fate--just wish to become a god. Problem solved. It especially flies in the face of everything previous when good intentions always lead to bad outcomes. This is why Rebellion exists--even though I hate that film it at least is somewhat consistent with the series' thematic intentions.
Another point. I like how your character descriptions were similar to my own. It shows how simple the characters really are. In fact, if I were going off of this review, I'd say they sound REALLY boring. Urobuchi even wrote the characters in after the story with placeholder names--Magical girl A--magical girl B... So you can really tell that he just kinda' threw them on the scene. Kyoko's sacrifice was sad to you? It's fine if you thought that. I really don't think so. There was no point to sacrificing yourself when Homura appeared. No reason not to retreat or get help. A redemption story only works if it makes sense.
Anyway. It was good that you tried to give some criticism instead of making the review irrelevant. Saying things that everyone else has said before is really pointless--so this review wasn't irrelevant. I definitely don't agree with it completely. I already addressed what I mainly had problems with from a subjective viewpoint. The rest I do think is completely true to my own feelings.
The editing was a bit of a mess though. It's not really coherent at all and vaguely hard to look at. Editing should have a theme in my opinion. This was very rough. It was exactly like Demo's editing style except not as expertly crafted. Random fonts were used and cut outs were fading out in simple ways and all that jazz. It just didn't appeal to my sense of creativity. Your voice was pretty ho humm--but not in a bad way. It was somewhat relaxing in a sense.
Anyway. Keep it up. I think you did good.
Hey there GoatJesus,
Thank You for your kind and constructive comment.
To your first point, Yes, In part, I did not consider the ending as ass pull because of the explanation about Madoka's karmic something being tied down to her because of Homura's ground hog days. if this was suppose to be a scientific explanation than I might want more techno babble but I'ts a story about magical girls. and in that, I accept a level of amorphousness when explaining the characters' abilities. In this case, "Karmic bonding" was enough justification for me. And its not like the world got away Scot free. the characters still fight monsters and die in the new world. The difference between Madoka MAgica and SAO in this regard is that SAO supposedly takes place in the near future/ our world/ our understanding of universe. He's not really in a magical universe, he's in a computer game, so I expect more rigid and definite rules.
Point 2: While I agree with you that story arc seems to be more important that fleshing out the characters, I think the characters have a bit more depth than you do. This is okay. In your review, you considered Kyoko's development into a more caring person a 180 flip flop- I didn't, As I pointed out in my own review, I think her own relationship with Sayaka was one of the best parts of the show.
Thank You for your feedback on editing, I'm still trying to find my Identity- with this review I decided to experiment with quick half second cuts for humor- and I think it had mixed results. I'm also working on my voice as well- for my next review I'm going with a more casual approach.
Anyway, Good luck with your own work
~Peace
Departed Reflections Thanks for the response~ Have a lovely day.
Yeah, I can't exactly say I agree with you GJ. Madoka's overwhelming potential was indeed hinted at throughout the show (Kyubey telling Sayaka that she has the most potential in episode 6, Madoka getting told that she has the potential to become God in episode 8), and the whole Karmic Bonding thing just gives an explanation as to why she as the amount of potential she has, which also fits in with the whole "good intentions lead to bad outcomes" in the case of Homura, since this also means that she made Madoka a much greater target for Kyubey, and also means that she will also become the most dangerous witch.
She couldn't just wish to become a god anyways. After all, we all know how these wishes can backfire if worded the wrong way (as was demonstrated with both Kyouko and Sayaka). Madoka's wish was to get rid of wishes before they were even born, which basically means that she will shoulder the burden on her own shoulders, and she knows exactly what she will get in return. It is essentially her wish after having gone through and seen how messed up the system is, and how it affects the girls.
And even though she did become a god, the world she created still has problems that need dealing with, the magical girls will still have to suffer, and entropy is still an issue. She gave the girls hope, and a less cruel system, but the fight still goes on.
In other words, Karmic Bonding is just a descriptive used to explain why she has so much potential (which again, is mentioned throughout the series).
Still though, good constructive comment. I wouldn't mind debating you on this.
"Kyoko's sacrifice was sad to you? It's fine if you thought that. I really don't think so. There was no point to sacrificing yourself when Homura appeared. No reason not to retreat or get help. A redemption story only works if it makes sense."
I have to disagree on this point. This one episode is a great example of exactly how a tragedy should work. On the outside, that one decision seems utterly stupid, but when you actually watch the show, the decision makes the viewer sad because she chased a noble ideal and failed. Undoubtedly, attempting to save Sayaka is noble and certainly is idealistic. Already, viewers are emotionally attached to the battle because it holds idealistic and virtuous values. When she is losing it saddens the audience because the audience guininely wants the battle to be victorious for Kyoko. Even at Kyoko's last resort, even though she realized that she could not win, she tries to find one last way to comfort Sayaka, (to go out with her) and to most viewers this is considered honorable. But she doesn't win, so to viewers this is an important scene because she tried something so noble even though she ultimately failed. Sure, at the end of the day, that move might have seemed stupid, but the first thoughts when the audience watches this isn't "that was stupid" but rather "you did your best to do something honorable but failed."
The way you described this scene is how I originally (in ninth grade) described Romeo and Juliet's scene where Romeo commits suicide with the poison only to have Juliet wake up and do the same. Originally I thought that it was utterly stupid to commit suicide because his lover was perceived dead. There certainly was no reason for Romeo not to leave and find a new wife while he can, but it worked as a tragedy. Romeo attempting to bridge the gap between the warring families is virtuous, especially by his means. So when Romeo thinks Juliet is dead, the audience is captured by what this means for Romeo trying what he believes is best. When Romeo takes the poison, the audience isn't immediately questioning that "that was stupid" but rather "you tried to bridge the gap; you tried to be with your lover, but it didn't work."
I have seen several of your (GoatJesus's) reviews and some of them I agree with, some of them I don't. I certainly don't agree with how little depth you give the characters credit for. Because you argue so vehemently that the characters have little depth, I don't really feel like debating with someone who probably won't listen; here since there is little debate so far, I am willing to go the extra mile.
ssbbshadowplayer1 Um. Okay? Yeah. I really don't feel like arguing something subjective like this. If it didn't work for me, it didn't work for me and I explained why. Feel free to disagree.
Zach Reed My problem wasn't that they didn't foreshadow her power--they just never established the system properly so it inherently feels cheap to me as an explanation to bring in a random mechanic like Karmic Bonding. Power was foreshadowed--Karmic Bonding wasn't established. That's my problem.
If either of you kept up with me at all, you'd know that I don't feel that the characters are devoid of depth completely anymore. I do think a lot of their dynamics are well done, but you'd be amiss to say that they're perfect in my mind.
The anime is overhyped like SAO. It's just better than SAO. But it still has it's issues. Like what tension am I supposed to have for a show with a WISH granter? It's not like in the Frieza saga of Dragon Ball where EVERYTHING rode on defeating Frieza or stalling. Even the life of the wish granter.
That, and the characters have way too many stupid things going on for me to agree with the hype.
+Kaiser Trigger a lot of people have the same problem. that's k.
This is why I ignore hype
that ending of the first season was a little disappointing but still a great show
+ainsley swale ...was there a second season?
well there are 3 movies the first two are the first season from the anime and the 3rd movie is the second season
it might not be called the second season and it's not as long as the first but i still call it that
ainsley swale I see what your saying - I haven't seen rebellion (or the sequel tho-)
also there is a 4th movie in the making
Why would you watch it on dub?
I am filthy casual
Ah why of course. do you even know how to parry in darksouls? Filthy casual
Ahh yes an anime with the most BS ending since Maken-Ki
: ) hmm...
Although I'm glad the movies are getting dubbed so I can finally watch them
Any Veiwer a fellow dub lover, nice to meet you
same here, it kinda hard to find some one who doesn't say a dub sounds disgusting after 2 words spoken
Karra Arryne than that just makes me glad I got into anime summer of freshman year
i got bored by the first episode
The first two episodes are boring but necessary. (Though I argue it better to watch the first episode after you've finished the series once)