Clashing Free Markets, Decentralization, A Bitcoin Economy | Erick Brimen | Bridges #32

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  • Опубліковано 26 гру 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 116

  • @BridgesStudio
    @BridgesStudio  22 години тому +1

    piavpn.com/BridgesPodcast, for a special discount-83% off

  • @MFMegaZeroX7
    @MFMegaZeroX7 12 годин тому +36

    Some things not mentioned:
    1) Propspera has and will continue to have veto power in ZEDE as long as it exists, even if the council votes otherwise
    2) Unlike anywhere else in Honduras, Prospera doesn't need to be public with how it handles labor disputes
    3) It has 120 million in investments, primarily by Peter Thiel, Sam Altman and Marc Andreessen. This is no ESG investment.
    4) While yes, half of the employees are Honduran, they have only 58 employees. I can't find anything on the population of the ZEDE, but I can't imagine it is over 100, and I'm not sure that Hondurans are even a majority there.
    I wish you asked about any of this. Yes, I don't expect a grilling on this show, but at least do some basic research beforehand and ask in a polite way about it.

    • @AdamDunebugDunas
      @AdamDunebugDunas 8 годин тому +6

      1) A short look-up of this also shows that above the council (5 elected, 4 appointed by Prospera) is a Committee of Best Practices who are appointed by the Honduras government and have the power to approve internal regulations and provide policy guidance.
      2) idk, could be bad.
      3) Just because they're not ESG investments doesn't mean they're not beneficial to a country that wouldn't otherwise recieve those investments, or the Honduran people who might benefit from them.
      4) Pretty sure that'll grow as the city grows and more investment comes, but in the current situation, not much more is going in due to the uncertainty.
      I'm not saying this system is perfect but there are very expectable answers and they're not new ideas, there have been very very successful and strong examples of these types of economic zones, like the ones in Dubai, like the one in South Korea, like the ones in China, (Hong Kong, Shanghai and Macau notably) though those have gone backwards somewhat since China has taken more control.

    • @ErickBrimen
      @ErickBrimen 8 годин тому +5

      1) misleading. That quasi-veto (it’s not a legal veto pero se, and only holds if all members of the council nominated by Prospera vote in block against some new action or rule) only holds true for a period of time while population builds up. Then, residents can do a referendum and change the charter. Moreover, at any point in time residents have a referendum power that can veto any action by the council (in this case, the veto is indeed enshrined in the Charter).
      2) also not true. Labor disputes are in first instance handled by the labor tribunal of the PAC and the proceedings are public, unless both parties agree otherwise (sometimes much preferred by employees who are bringing forth issues they would rather keep private without losing their ability to bring employers to justice).
      3) “ESG investing” has been a failure generally IMO, but in any case, Prospera is the epitome of an investment that drives good governance and lifts people up. It is fundamentally about creating the foundations necessary to catalyze prosperity. And it has been working.
      4) The people who live inside are indeed less than 500, but that is bc residences are less built than employment opportunities. Thousands of people have jobs thanks to Prospera - even if they live outside for the time being - with minimum wages higher than required outside, and salaries much higher than the national average.
      More FAQs: www.prospera.co/news/prospera-faqs

    • @willmichael4033
      @willmichael4033 7 годин тому +3

      All those sound okay.

    • @gaarakabuto1
      @gaarakabuto1 6 годин тому +1

      I mean based on the responses you can see that the subject is not a very simple one. Even the core that they covered is not sufficient for me an outsider to fully understand how the place operates and what are the nuances of the collaboration between the semi autonomous area and the country.
      Those questions even though important are digging deeper than the surface and I wouldn't consider them part of "a basic research". If anything I'd say that these few questions would probably make about an hour of a podcast in itself going back and forth.

    • @nickdranias695
      @nickdranias695 5 годин тому

      Plus the charter is subject to total revision by referendum after the first 35 years.

  • @JUNO-69
    @JUNO-69 17 годин тому +16

    Jared from subway really has turned his life around

    • @mulatso7959
      @mulatso7959 16 годин тому

      Do some research into the world record podcast

    • @doubleFay
      @doubleFay 13 годин тому

      Lol I had the same thought when I saw the thumbnail

  • @rreeeekk
    @rreeeekk 6 годин тому

    Finally a Bridges video that is available during the work day!

  • @user-fy7ri8gu8l
    @user-fy7ri8gu8l 4 години тому +1

    Biology is time-constrained with results. The idea that you can tell something is safe with a high level of confidence in a short period of time is highly relative to the subject you're studying. A better question to pose to both these new sandboxes and old is what mechanisms they use to differentiate?

  • @MyCipherComplete
    @MyCipherComplete 16 годин тому +8

    Welcome back Kyla! Just tuned in, expect another fascinating poddy

  • @WrathOfTheShaft
    @WrathOfTheShaft 18 годин тому +43

    This guy seems like one of those doctors that would say camels are the healthiest cigarettes on the market.

    • @FiloVFX
      @FiloVFX 9 годин тому +2

      I feel like the analogy applies better to the American explaining the benefits of redistribution to a Venezuelan.

    • @mybuddyphil8719
      @mybuddyphil8719 8 годин тому

      ​@FiloVFX thats more like an american explaining to a starving holocaust survivor the benefits of eating less and moving more.

    • @nickdranias695
      @nickdranias695 5 годин тому

      that comment is the sort of ad hominem that evidences a lack of any legitimate points to make

    • @chad872
      @chad872 4 години тому

      @@FiloVFX amongst developed nations United States has some of the highest income inequality amongst its citizens. I think we are perfectly entitled to talk about the merits of a regulated economy.

    • @FiloVFX
      @FiloVFX 3 години тому

      @@chad872 Are you proving my point or are you trying to flex income inequality? A US citizen explaining the wonders of redistribution to a Venezuelan is a bit tone deaf...

  • @costbubbles8336
    @costbubbles8336 20 годин тому +11

    Plug and play economies sounds crazy, im in.

  • @j.robertson7228
    @j.robertson7228 10 годин тому +2

    Great discussion!

  • @Swagonslayuh
    @Swagonslayuh 16 годин тому +3

    1:45:25 "Seeked" 🗣

  • @mukkaar
    @mukkaar 13 годин тому +5

    I don't mind voluntary system. But anyone not paying for those services, should not get benefits from it. For example, educated populus. Company or individual should pay premium for doing anything that involves educated people, if they won't pay taxes that contribite to education. Same is for infrastructure, they should pay individually for every road they use, and ofc, it should be on them to also bear the cost of having systems to charge them for it.
    Overall, any government service they benefit from, directly on indirectly existing in the country, they have to pay for. I'm not going to call it taxes for their benefit, but lets call payment for government services.
    I think this is fair deal, as long as company does not interact with the country, they don't have to pay anything. Again, this is not taxes, just compensation paid to the host country for providing platform to do business in.

    • @FiloVFX
      @FiloVFX 7 годин тому

      That sounds fair. It would also logically follow that any country that wishes to take inmigrants should pay beforehand for the education costs to the country of origin as to avoid freeriding. Of course the citizen in question would not be free to leave until the discretionary amount has been paid in full, otherwise it would be an obvious loophole, but worst case scenario you just have to build a wall.

    • @ErickBrimen
      @ErickBrimen 7 годин тому +2

      I agree. And that is the way it should work. It’s the way Prospera seeks to operate and does to the full extend permitted legally and in practical terms.
      Btw when one pays a highly skilled worker a much higher wage than a low skilled one, and 20-30% of the cost is related to payments that go to government, the dynamic you describe is already in play.
      Something else to consider: if someone can’t opt out of using or receiving a service, then the case to require them to pay is no longer as clear. So I agree with you fully, to the extent that “services” are not imposed. Then it stops being a voluntary exchange. But just as I’m against coercion generally, I’m also against free ridding.

  • @Dr.EgonCholakian
    @Dr.EgonCholakian 15 годин тому +4

    Beautiful.

  • @chad872
    @chad872 4 години тому

    I’d like to see a discussion between this guy and Robert Kuttner

  • @franciscomarquez1312
    @franciscomarquez1312 18 годин тому +8

    Great episode showcasing innovation in governance and new ways of creating economic development in Latin America.

    • @wandarah
      @wandarah 16 годин тому +2

      OK bot bro

    • @jamesmitch9792
      @jamesmitch9792 13 годин тому

      tax havens don't benefit anyone, look at Panama,

  • @leg2424
    @leg2424 17 годин тому +6

    Excellent interview-Erick is a visionary and Prospera is going to improve the lives of millions one day

    • @wandarah
      @wandarah 16 годин тому +4

      Lol ok bot bro

    • @jamesmitch9792
      @jamesmitch9792 13 годин тому

      no it won't, it is just a tax haven.
      even the locals hate it.

  • @RonJohnsonLemDonSwanson
    @RonJohnsonLemDonSwanson 11 годин тому +2

    Preferred how the conversations flowed with a single host

  • @cityofquartz1465
    @cityofquartz1465 Годину тому +1

    holy a 1v1 convo would be much better

  • @somebody9577
    @somebody9577 13 годин тому +5

    Was Rapture already copyrighted?

  • @Grassroots_Hegemon
    @Grassroots_Hegemon 9 годин тому +8

    It is super funny how terminally white this comment section is
    The Zete operate paying a land tax to constrict the physical space they use, and are internally self sufficient. This is the fundamental precept of georgism and it exists to remedy the fact that private property existing makes people own physical space on the earth that then loses its capacity to be used by others, but that is true everywhere. The difference is they are voluntarily participating in the remediation.
    Im Puerto Rican and the problem that happens there is people literally dont want to work anywhere other than the private companies because it substantially raises the quality of life of its employees because it pays ridiculously more than average for the same position.
    And when steven asks about the roads and bridges and who provided them, and hears "No we built them, we are internally self sufficient" you can watch him struggling to accept it.
    The problem in reality is that these people live really hard lives, and the response of "Why doesnt the government just give it to them" doesnt work in a country where everyone is poor. The government is then also, piss poor.
    What you need is the capacity to build infrastructure FIRST and these companies arrive and literally do the job the government is already failing to do for the people living there, because they come with the anticipation and capacity to provide it.

    • @Johnjackjack
      @Johnjackjack 5 годин тому +1

      You are leaving out that the governemnt then has created a seperate state within their state i can see why many dont like this especiaully with laws not being allowed to be inforced inside and a private police force responsible for enforcing certain laws

    • @Grassroots_Hegemon
      @Grassroots_Hegemon Годину тому

      @Johnjackjack Sorry who pays for that part again?

  • @RoxasReviews
    @RoxasReviews 14 годин тому +6

    When I saw this thumbnail I thought you were interviewing Jared from Subway

  • @arotobo
    @arotobo 22 години тому +22

    Actually giga based guest, I wish them luck in their mediation with the world bank and the Honduras government.
    P.S. If destiny was right about more regulation = more innovation every startup would be in Germany. Who could’ve thought that needing a scrivener to read out every contract out loud for 10 hours with all stakeholders present before signing doesn’t facilitate innovation???

    • @mukkaar
      @mukkaar 16 годин тому

      Did he say that? I don't recall he did.

    • @Swagonslayuh
      @Swagonslayuh 16 годин тому +5

      I don't think the argument is that more reg. = innovation. It's more so that regulation exists to protect consumers from the potential cut corners made in the efforts for innovation. When the guest referenced the industrial revolution as a time of great prosperity with little regulation he forgets, conveniently, to note that the quality of life for the average American in the face of urbanization and the industrial boom wasn't the greatest, be it at the factory or in their dwellings, until gov. Regulation kicked in. While listening to this it sounded to me that these economic zones are great for entrepreneurs because they're made to operate without the burden of generating welfare for a population of broad socioeconomic standings. I'd wager to say that the majority of people living in the zone are entrepreneurs and their relatives, as were a majority of workers, as the guest suggested at one point, live outside the zone and commute to work. This is clearly not the situation a proper nation state is responsible for governing.

    • @gaarakabuto1
      @gaarakabuto1 13 годин тому +1

      Germany is a terrible example that doesn't fit well in anything. They don't have the hardest regulation but also the problem is not on regulation but on entrepreneurship and support on it.
      Sweden, Finland and Estonia have higher regulations than Germany in most regards but they have much higher amounts of start ups. The reason is simple, Sweden has a very beneficial and low cost scheme for start ups and entrepreneurs through taxes. Finland has an amazing infrastructure and a beneficial legal scheme with some tax benefits for start ups. Estonia has infrastructure and infrastructure regarding citizenship, easy access to European funds, infrastructure regarding internet and remote working environments which are vital for start ups.
      For all three cases the regulations that are targeted to start ups are what makes them favourable and easy for a start up to begin and have success. Ironically enough the problem is making a succesful start up into a growing company, in which there is no regulatory system about it nor any infrastructure, as a result most start ups end up becoming small companies with a couple of tenths of employees with the rare case of Spotify, Skype and Zoom coming into play every now and then mostly due to luck.
      Regulation if done properly and is not just there for people to carry papers around in a building can be much more effective than a special economic zone that is proned to be interfered with by bigger investors and governments.

    • @jonathanwilson8809
      @jonathanwilson8809 9 годин тому

      Good in general is not the same as good for startups

    • @nalivai4862
      @nalivai4862 7 годин тому

      Not every startup in Germany mainly because Germany has corporate taxes, strong workers protection, and cost of living is higher than average. Techbro startups prefer paying less taxes and abuse their workers, that's how they get margins.

  • @SP-ww8hv
    @SP-ww8hv 3 години тому +2

    Yay! Kyla’s back

  • @drradzig81
    @drradzig81 10 годин тому +2

    Erudite is back! Yay

    • @Hyperllam4
      @Hyperllam4 4 години тому

      That makes one of us

  • @Long_Boy420
    @Long_Boy420 14 годин тому +5

    I feel like destiny gave very light push back and he immediately pivots to talking about regulation bad

    • @user-fy7ri8gu8l
      @user-fy7ri8gu8l 3 години тому +1

      I think he was just exploring how it was handled rather than being reactionary-immediately oppositional to something he doesn't know how it works-which is why he was asking.

  • @Dex2R7
    @Dex2R7 10 годин тому +7

    He posits that regulations reduce safety because they act as a safe harbor from liabilities for companies that operate within the law. But if companies all operate under certain safety guidelines for it's workers then there will inherently be less hurt workers, right? I feel like his portrayal of "safety regulations = bad" is a pretty convoluted take.

    • @carsoncraft
      @carsoncraft 8 годин тому

      It has to be convoluted, because any data and research will tell you that safety regulations lead to reduced workplace injury and death. You literally must create a convoluted argument that doesn't rely on data or truth. I wish these bad faith actors would simply say "I don't care if more people die at their job, it would lower labor cost". Just own your stupid position.

    • @Johnjackjack
      @Johnjackjack 5 годин тому

      if the regulation is written badily then yes it will but the bird flu safety measures for chicken and cattle seem good and i would say 99% of the others are just as good.

  • @purkz1
    @purkz1 3 години тому +3

    It's time to stop this failure of a podcast

  • @falkram10
    @falkram10 12 хвилин тому

    Isnt the entirety of this argument about regulatory bodies and safety what the US was like in the 19th century? (e.g. the direct sale of snake oil to the populace, company towns, bank runs, etc.?) Have we not seen that for-profit companies do not have the consumers' best interests at heart - ever? The consumer cannot be expected to know everything about any product or service and honestly determine whats best/safest/efficacious, etc. The lack of historical perspective here is staggering.

  • @dejectedfrogcat2840
    @dejectedfrogcat2840 24 хвилини тому

    Basically it's mostly libertarian utopian vision, aka, "herp derp the industry can regulate itself" and "the consumer will always have choices".

  • @TheGokuend
    @TheGokuend 14 годин тому

  • @jamesmitch9792
    @jamesmitch9792 13 годин тому +2

    anyone who opens with "Venezuela should be the richest country"
    is clearly trying to sell you something.

  • @Unsure_salmon
    @Unsure_salmon 14 годин тому +11

    What a snake. I hope the Honduran government expropriates every cent he has and uses it to actually fund things that would make Honduras better.

    • @nicholasjones6227
      @nicholasjones6227 14 годин тому

      Sure, like all the great things the Honduran government has done in the past to make Honduras better.

    • @JavierD.Briceño
      @JavierD.Briceño 13 годин тому +4

      As a Honduran, I can say you are wrong.
      1. ZEDEs are one of the best policies created by the Honduran State in the last couple of decades.
      2. The Honduran Government would (as it has done it in other cases) just use the money to hire more political allies, let the project die, and/or use the facilities as a freak show.

    • @jaidengill5588
      @jaidengill5588 9 годин тому +2

      ​@@JavierD.Briceño bot spotted

    • @Unsure_salmon
      @Unsure_salmon 8 годин тому +3

      I am open to being wrong.
      1. Best for who?
      2. How is a privatized system of courts, police, and taxation system where prospera can LITERALLY explicitly use extorted money to hire more allies not so much worse?

    • @FiloVFX
      @FiloVFX 7 годин тому

      @@jaidengill5588 user = agree?human:bot;

  • @AyubuKK
    @AyubuKK 20 годин тому +2

    The free market is like a balance that has to be maintained between all the people participating in it. So no one person or group has the most influence in the market.

    • @henrytep8884
      @henrytep8884 17 годин тому +1

      ??? The people with capital has the most influence, and is concentrated in 10% of the population

  • @rahallde
    @rahallde 15 годин тому

    Buy Bitcoins with US dollars and then pay taxes with Bitcoin.
    Buy hardware and electricity with US dollars to mine Bitcoins and then pay with Bitcoins.

  • @mulatso7959
    @mulatso7959 16 годин тому +2

    So good to see Kyla back!

  • @Dorothy-g4e
    @Dorothy-g4e 11 годин тому

    I really appreciate your efforts! Could you help me with something unrelated: I have a SafePal wallet with USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). What's the best way to send them to Binance?

  • @Johnjackjack
    @Johnjackjack 18 годин тому +5

    Doing a coup of the land is bad due to treaties of the agreement and not the countries laws. Yeah i can see why people have a problem with this system. I would want you in a jail for life in my country for bracking our laws on our land not some bs agrement

    • @gsockpuppet2490
      @gsockpuppet2490 3 години тому

      Prospera has not broken any laws. All land has been voluntarily purchased.

    • @Johnjackjack
      @Johnjackjack 2 години тому

      @ you can also bite away democracy doesn’t mean it’s right or good

  • @Stereotype3
    @Stereotype3 11 годин тому

    2:09:46 The fade to black while NSE is still talking is so disrespectful lmao

  • @apeirotopecrow7957
    @apeirotopecrow7957 16 годин тому +1

    can you guys yell at eachother or crack a joke or something I'm falling asleep over here

    • @Swagonslayuh
      @Swagonslayuh 16 годин тому +2

      Show might not be for you bud. Jk, this dude was light on the charisma fs.

  • @dannypisano1662
    @dannypisano1662 17 годин тому +1

    I thought this was Jared fogle smh

  • @alexanderg9670
    @alexanderg9670 11 годин тому

    Elysium is likely inevitable. Make sure to end up on the right side of war robots

  • @Wauce00
    @Wauce00 14 годин тому

    This new color grade is depressing

  • @Gewsfrahba
    @Gewsfrahba 17 годин тому

    at first glance i thought you had jared fogle on the podcast

  • @lucid4058
    @lucid4058 15 годин тому +2

    This is the type of executives that used to tell people smoking cigarettes were good for you. I'm all for economic prosperity but this shit does not pass the smell test.

    • @dranelemakol
      @dranelemakol 6 годин тому

      Because he's Latino-looking? Lol

  • @jamesmitch9792
    @jamesmitch9792 13 годин тому +2

    this is just another Panama-like tax haven, it is still poor and no one wants to live there.
    the locals hate this project too.

    • @ErickBrimen
      @ErickBrimen 7 годин тому +2

      Prosperity clearly does not emerge out of “low taxes”, it emerges out of a combination of economic freedom and rule of [good] law.
      These are the conditions fundamentally that Prospera delivers in partnership with host nations.
      …and most locals love it! For once they are able to aspire and attain self realization without corruption, favoritism, cronyism, and with reliable rights and access to justice.

    • @gsockpuppet2490
      @gsockpuppet2490 3 години тому

      Locals actually seem to like it based on polling data that's available. But since it's all voluntary and doesn't cost Hondurans anything, it shouldn't be an issue for those who don't like it

    • @jamesmitch9792
      @jamesmitch9792 2 години тому

      @@ErickBrimen by locals you mean rich people in Honduras? who now have a tax free zone.

  • @chad872
    @chad872 4 години тому

    Economies are inherently complex systems and as with any complex system it will invariably fall into disarray. Anyone who argues for uncontrolled economies is literally brain dead. A just and fair economy that works for everyone doesn’t just happen at a thin air. It’s not a underlying force of the universe. It’s a choice that we put in a practice through policies and regulation.

  • @MauveGun
    @MauveGun 8 годин тому +1

    I also love snake oil.

  • @solainarewayzone4095
    @solainarewayzone4095 20 годин тому +7

    Eric "Brimen". I wonder why hes building a Hyper-Capitalist exclusionary zone that banks and financial institutions dominate ? Just asking questions as a Latin American

  • @Guanyinhennasea
    @Guanyinhennasea 13 годин тому

    Less nerds; more Kyla.

  • @solainarewayzone4095
    @solainarewayzone4095 20 годин тому +9

    would love a follow up with a Prospera worker, Tons of Allegations of abuse among the Honduran Natives go unquestioned in this video with Erudite staring at Brimen like a wide eyed Puppy. Paints a bad picture of bridges, No different than Lex Friedman

    • @a.ndreasz
      @a.ndreasz 19 годин тому +8

      i’m a honduran and i live and work at Próspera! ask me anything.

    • @dranelemakol
      @dranelemakol 17 годин тому +1

      What particular allegations do u have in mind

    • @wandarah
      @wandarah 16 годин тому +3

      She's pushed back and asked questions far more than Lex does and I'm 10 minutes in.

    • @Squibtorious
      @Squibtorious 16 годин тому +2

      ​@@a.ndreaszare the "tons of allegations of abuse" that OP mentioned real? As in, the abuse is real?

    • @a.ndreasz
      @a.ndreasz 9 годин тому +2

      @@Squibtorious no, as far as i know they’re not true. reciprocity and mutual consent are core values at próspera, and everyone here is kind, hardworking, respectful and driven. it’s actually exciting to be part of a community where we all know we’re building something bigger than ourselves. what specific allegations are you referring to?

  • @deathpresent101
    @deathpresent101 7 годин тому

    Is that Jared from subway?

  • @sisyphean0
    @sisyphean0 12 годин тому

    OOOO