Islam : The Untold Story (Tom HOLLAND)
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- Опубліковано 7 сер 2015
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Documentaire de Tom Holland pour la télévision Channel 4, diffusé en aout 2012 (tous droits réservés Channel 4)
Tom Holland pointe le "trou noir" des origines de l'islam et enquête comme un détective sur les incohérences des sources musulmanes, l'absence de sources anciennes, l'absence de mention à Mahomet ou à La Mecque avant la fin du 7e siècle, le caractère très tardif de la 1ere biographie de Mahomet qui date de 200 ans après sa mort ... Il rencontre les spécialistes, les chercheurs et archéologues (Seyyed Hossein Nasr, Patricia Crone, Guy Stroumsa, Fred Donner et Tali Erickson-Gini), visite les lieux, contemple les vestiges pour confronter le matériel historique au discours islamique.
Pour aller plus loin : legrandsecretdelislam.com la synthèse des dernières recherches historiques sur les origines de l'islam (dont celles de Patricia Crone), pour comprendre enfin d'où vient l'islam, comment il est apparu, pourquoi il est comme il est.
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Documentary film by Tom Holland for Channel 4 television, broadcasted in August 2012 (all rights reserved to Channel 4)
Tom Holland points to the "black hole" of the origins of Islam and investigates as a detective on the inconsistencies of muslim sources, the absence of ancient sources, the absence of any mention of Muhammad or Mecca before the end of the 7th century , the very late nature of the 1st biography of Muhammad (dated from 200 years after his death). He meets specialists, scholars and archaeologists (Seyyed Hossein Nasr, Patricia Crone, Guy Stroumsa, Fred Donner and Tali Erickson-Gini), visits the sites, contemplates the vestiges, looks for historical material, which he confronts with the Islamic narrative. - Наука та технологія
i’m gonna be honest i thought it was gonna be spider man teaching me about Muhammad, but this is wonderful.
On his podcast they make sometimes make that joke.
Me too, ✋🏽guilty
Bruh 😂
Would be an interesting career move for him...
They kinda sound the same?
Maybe he should look in some of the Ancient Chinese accounts and writings in their ancient history. The Chinese were trading in that area and even with the Romans through various tribal Merchants including Arabs and desert peoples etc from very Ancient times. The Chinese may have some interesting writings about these Arabs and early Islam peoples/religions/practices. Chinese were always guarding their border lands against invaders, they had many tribal vassal states as well so the Chinese were great historians and record keepers, they are sure to have accounts worth reviewing.
By the 8th century or earlier Chinese ceramics were exported to Egypt and Western Asia, and of course much silk was exported to the Roman and Byzantine empires. I don’t remember when the first reference to Islam occurs in Chinese sources, although members of the Sassanian royal family fled to China after their defeat by the Arabs. I The Battle of Talas in around 750 was when the Chinese and Arab armies first encountered each other. The Arabs won.
@@malin5468 Thanks for that , what did they win? Did they win against the Mongols?
@@edmurks236 The Arab Abbasid empire was expanding east and the Chinese expanding westward. There is a description in Wikipedia. You can Google it.
@@edmurks236 that was before the Mongols i believe
@@mikefitzpatrick43 Ok but did the Islam army ever fight the Mongols? I must research it.
I read Holland's book, "Dominion"....what an incredible book.
"in the shadow of the sword" is also amazing and is focused on the rise of Islam.
Wow, I just got that one recently and had no idea it was the same guy. Very cool. I will have to look into him more.
I'm going to seek this book out. Tom Holland is fantastic.
Stories that never happened can be infinitely more powerful than stories that did.
which stories 'never' happened?
@@auhmav04 most of that 1 houe clip! Mohammad wasn't really a prophet of Allah! The whole thing is designed to stop the Arab world from imploding. What part of it is hard to understand? Faith is different to fact 🤷♂️
the same with mormon..
or any religion@@fatcrruise6508
And what's your evidence?@@mightyhabib1182
Am i the only one who thought Tom Holland from Spiderman was somehow involve in the documentary?
No you re not the only one hhhhhhh
Hhhhh
@@chafikrabai646 second!
Manuel Valencia you are right Allah may fit as the Spiderweb of the Quran comics
because he's got mosquito nose he's not spiderman
Dear Mr. Holland , i will try to be just and subjective and I will ask some questions: you made it to the desert of Wadi Rum in Jordan 🇯🇴 met some bedouins and heard from them about Islam, but never met some well known scholars in Jordan like Dr. Zaghlol AlNajjar , Dr. Mohammad Nouh and many others who would definitely enlighten you about your inquiries, why? One hour and 11 minutes I saw 4 people talking about Mohammad and kept saying “I do not know” as an answer for most of your questions and comments, are you convinced that you interviewed the right people? What are you trying to tell us here? Do you think that this work had been produced based on a proper scientific research? I need answers please!!!!
Check my comment above
You’ll never get the answer cause this was made to make us Muslims look bad to justify the occupation of Palestine simple as that
Search out who Tom Holland is, his scholarly accolades and his stance on religion/ideology and find he has no agenda, he simply goes where the actual evidence leads... not simply relying on the islamic insistence of a history with no archeological evidence to back it up.
He has written a book as well, the perusal of which , ought to be a more oppurtune
correspondence.
what you consider "enlightening" is merely evasive answers.
the question that has been repeated since the beginning is " how do we know it was like that?" this question applies to all religions and all old historical events; we are sure of nothing unless we look carefully where we need to
Correct. Merely narratives & motives until the reality is maybe revealed. All mankind is like this. What would miraculously set this people apart or make them immune. God ? Truthfully...what is that anyway ? Monotheism - corruption & divisiveness. Convenient really.
Hi there, there have been thousands of canonised Saints and Miracles performed by God's Mother Mary.
Faith is a virtue 🙏🏼 ✨️
Please keep safe 😷
@@StRaphael-we9qn”how do we know it was like that?”
@@TheTyTyXDcan you pick up Quran and just read it? It will answer your questions. Not sure where you living. You might be able to Google one for free in a Quran will be shipped to you you will find the answer. How do you know if it’s true what you asked thank you.
@@zarghona7491The quran is one of the last places we need to look in.
All that nonsense about flying donkeys and the such.
It does shed light on muhammad killing jews and raping children tho
The cinematography is just pure transcendence
well .. looks like a normal TV style documentary to me.
not to say its bad .. but transcendant? well ok .. each to its own!
ITS EASIER TO DECEIVE THE MASSES THAN IT IS TO CONVINCE THE MASSES THAT THEY HAVE BEEN DECEIVED.
Yousef Ghaneemah this vid is total Islamophobia
Your statement contradicts itself, not si wise are you
Scott Losey ... bullshit beats the truth every time ... shame 👀
DreamsIntoReality ... can’t spell so ?
ricky elvis typo smartie, got nothing to do with my spelling.
Radical islam is the snake..moderate Islam is the grass.
exactly they are all moderate in public, but that is only to keep up appearances!....
once you get too many of them they show their true colors, and than it is too late!.
its a cult that brain washes people, and the earlier the better!.
The War Between Light and Darkness.
"The war of Light and Darkness sounds well, but in this post-Freudian world, men realize that the Darkness ascribed to one's enemies is a projection of the Darkness in oneself that is not fully admitted. So in this way the distorted image of ISLAM is to be regarded as a projection of the shadow side of European Man."
[Prof.(Reverend) William Montgomerry Watt in his "Influence of Islam in Medieval Europe" page 83].
Islam is out to kill all non-Muslims.
@@wayupnorth9420 then how do they get more Muslims on their side ? Manufacturing them
excellent analogy
Change of the qibla (Arabic: تحويل القبلة) is the event in which the qibla of Muslims (direction of performing some rituals) was redirected from al-Aqsa mosque, in Bayt al-Maqids (Jerusalem), to the Ka'ba (in Mecca). The event occurred in Rajab, 2/January, 624, after the revelation of al-Qibla Verse. According to the majority of historiographers, the change of qibla occurred in Masjid al-Qiblatayn in Medina in the middle of the noon prayer. One interesting point about the redirection of the qibla is how people turned in the middle of a congregational prayer to over 160 degrees.
This was an eye opener meaning that we generally have to dig for answers if we are expected to accept and believe in anything. I found this video to be good , objective. But there is still a long way to go in looking for answers and I pray that we as humans get at least some of those answers, personally I don’t judge which is right or wrong, only to be able to find peace for at least myself. This video might or might not be it but it’s good to know there are efforts being made .
I am not a Muslim. However, studying extensively that religion and its history, it seems Dr. Holland tip toed around Islamic references that documented extensively the period he is examining. Our understanding would be very poor if we ignored early Christian historians and commentators. In the corpus of what is written by Muslim historians are also records of scientific knowledge, literature, philosophical ideas, theological analysis, etc. that enriched our world to this day. The views of the film are very limited to satisfy a certain audience not an academic one.
Exactly. Orientalism in a nutshell.
Well said, I also find it weird that some have knowledge about how Islam spread and that there is a story about it.
Your assumption being that an academic audience's satisfaction should be the primary goal of this or any documentary.
Keep in mind that Jews and Christians thought of early Islam as a dangerous cult. Most of them didn't have anything positive to say about it; similar to how many American Baptists and Protestant Evangelicals view Mormonism.
What sources exist during that time?
@@cedricroney1475
Highly unreliable, highly biased sources. People weren't concerned with accuracy in the past. They were more interested in telling tall tales and BSing their way, becuz humans are attention seekers. In essence, not much has changed. Humans were and have remained unreliable, baised sources. It may be the way our brains are wired.
They were only allowed to show this once in the UK, because of massive protests from Muslims. So I can only recommend "In the Shadow of the Sword" by Tom Holland, that is the book he basically are "advertising" for here, to get the full story of what he gives the "headlines" for here. (I've read it probably 4-5 times!)
This video also has been refuted by scholars and historians as well. He seems to be more ignorant and close minded to bother to look further more research.
@@AFGsultanZLet me guess....rEfUtEd by highly biased Islamic lunatics that present some idiotic philosophical mumbo jumbo without ANY material historical evidence....
The Aisha story alone shows that Islam is just another stone age delusional cult....of course the prophet had to be an Arab lol😂
As stupid as the virgin born resurrection ascension white Jesus or the circus show gods of Hinduism.
Alone this anthropomorphic and cultural stupidity of these abrahamic religions make them so stupid....can only shake my head in disgust.
@@AFGsultanZ
The video was refuted by scholars by using taqquiya
Incredible! The supposed "religion of peace" censoring through threats and civil unrest any bad press or uncomfortable facts about the religion's history. Tsk tsk, muslims...
@@Quijote-Salvaje yes the outer or exterior Islam will always be at odds and miss some of the key points as well
I like the ridley Scott sounding eerie when he questions things
Is the lack of historical evidence right after the life of Mohammed more to do with the schism in leadership (Sunni vs Shia) rather than how Tom portrays it as an unknown? He never really touched on that in any great detail.
ITS NOT THE EYES THAT IS BLIND BUT THE HEARTS
Abdol denying their own holy book, go read ur own qoran to prove it by ur self
@@mrjean9376he didn't say anything to offend you , and why are you even angry ?
@@alaao82is grandson is only 2 wdym
@@alaao82 IM SAYING
@@dimasnarendrarafifpurwanto lmao
Some say Tom is still searching for the answer
10 min of drama followed by a simple statement. Rinse and repeat. This could be 15 min long if it weren't for all tge filler
I lived in The Kindom of Saudi Arabia for just over 3 years as a civilian just After Retiring from the United States Air Force Feb 28, 1994. My story starts with the Gulf War of Desert Storm for which i was originaly assigned to deploy from Okinawa in Dec 1990 to Jeddah, KSA (Kindom of Saudi Arabia). But i did not deploy until just before the end of Desert Storm and the beginning of Desert Calm to Riyahd, KSA. And then Returning to Okinawa in July 1991 after having deployed to Daharahn, KSA.
Now fast forward to my civilian time living in Jeddah, KSA. working for Lockheed/Martin on the Royal Saudi Airforce Base in Jeddah from Dec. 1995- Feb. 1999. Having experienced life living in the Kindom of Saudi Arabia these years is just as confusing to myself as it is now to all of you in this documentary.
what confused you lilving there? and what's the connection with this documentary?
Wow.
What was so mysterious about these dates and locations?
You should have saved your keystrokes, you don't say anything.
Thank you for posting I enjoyed watching it love seeing all the places you filmed at loved the old film footage
what about the informations you stupid fuck
@@Akrammfk manners please.
@@nemesis1291 sadly that’s not written in THE BOOK!
Propoganda video .... Proves nothing apart from ignoring archeological, physical , written, verbal and historical facts.
Even a 12 year old can get his history straight
Man makes his own stories and history for everything else, there is a mystery.
So much internal repetition. Seems each scene and clip is reused three or four or more times in the course of the flick. Could be edited down to 20 min. or less with no loss of content.
41:40 where Dan Gibson's idea comes in; Petra in Jordan the original Mecca
I'm a 62yo Chinese Malaysian teacher. I'm not sure if I gained much from what was intended by Tom. Maybe he's trying to convey the "truth" that there's no historical records or sources. Even historical records of other histories are basically premised on presumptions constructed from sources that are "flawed". My sense is that all history is based on presumptions made from the little information unearthed.
He pretty much implicate this,.. ua-cam.com/video/4EaopH_EPfc/v-deo.html
Yes, this is steeped in modernist/rationalist assumptions that determine the frame of inquiry
Tom Holland's documentary "Islam: The Untold Story" was heavily criticized by scholars and experts for its numerous inaccuracies and factual errors.
One of the most significant inaccuracies was Holland's assertion that there was no archaeological evidence to support the traditional Islamic account of the life of Prophet Muhammad. Holland claimed that no physical evidence of Muhammad's existence or the early Islamic community had been found, and suggested that this was evidence that the traditional Islamic account of Muhammad's life was a later fabrication.
However, this claim was widely refuted by scholars and experts. Islamic studies professor Jonathan Brown, for example, wrote in a review of the documentary that Holland's claim "reflects a rather bizarre ignorance of the field of early Islamic history and archaeology."
Brown explained that while there is relatively little archaeological evidence from the early Islamic period, there is abundant written evidence from the time that supports the traditional Islamic account of Muhammad's life and the early Islamic community.
Other experts also pointed out factual errors in Holland's documentary, such as his claim that the Kaaba in Mecca was originally a Christian shrine, and his suggestion that the early Islamic conquests were primarily motivated by economic gain rather than religious ideology.
In response to the criticism, Holland issued a statement in which he acknowledged that some of his claims had been "unhelpfully phrased" and expressed regret for any offense caused. However, he maintained that the central thesis of his documentary remained valid.
Overall, the controversy surrounding Holland's documentary highlights the importance of careful and rigorous scholarship when exploring complex historical topics like the origins and development of Islam.
Is this done on purpose?
Do Universities and academia only give a certain diatribe, and everything else is put aside?
Do you honestly believe we descend from Homo Sapiens?
Have we as a people evolved?
Or...
Were we all Created?
Did we all descend from Noah's Ark?
Yes, I have faith in...Almighty God.
The God from The Holy Bible.
Glad I saw this before I wasted an hour lol😂
I can`t believe that Tom hasn`t mentioned Medina throughout this documentary, even though all of the Korans surahs are divided into the Meccan(surahs that were revealed anytime before the migration or the Hijra) and the Medinan suras, that are those supposed revelations that occurred after the migration to the city of that name. Mecca is(and was I suppose) barren, while Medina IS much greener, with fertile soil to grow fruits and vegetables.
Exactly.
Precisely, Tom Holland's idea is that if Islam was passed off as having appeared in Medina or in another place close to Jewish and Christian influences, that would make Islam less original and there would be nothing miraculous to convert to him. Presenting Islam as being born in the depths of the Sahara far from any religious influence would give more credit to this religion as being a divine revelation.
It doesn't fit the descriptions, however. It has no olive trees, for instance - how do you explain that?
@@alialmunguy316 it would, if it were. However, all you need to do is do some source criticism to rule that out.
He came to this study with an attitude there's nothing he gone get. He doesn't even know the surahs are devided into two and goes ahead as far as Israel to place the context of the Quran SMH!
I'm not sure what I expected from this at the start, but what I found was that spending over an hour telling someone that there is no evidence for something can be pretty boring.
Counting can put you to sleep. Counting money changes that. If you debate islam v Christianity, this is gold.
Very fascinating. It's very surprising that there is no written description of the religion of the Arabic conquerors of Jerusalem. Interesting that they targeted the Temple Mount. The coin was very fascinating as well. I'm not an archaeologist, but why is someone allowed to handle an artifact like that with their bare hands?
That's the strange thing. I am always watching historical and archeology documentaries and I've never actually seen that with something that old (touching it with bare hands). Maybe they can with coins. Idk. I don't remember seeing people touching coins at all. Just looking at them in their cases
We've all heard about it being the religion of peace! We also know actions speak louder than words!
Chuck & Maxx, you should see "HyperNormalisation" by Adam Cutris.
@Maxx Fleischer yeah? I missed the news about The West starting the war.
@Maxx Fleischer the one this crap hole started in 2001. None of those you mention are relevant to the "religion of peace". Please don't deflect try and stay on topic.
Yes, just be careful not to cherry pick verses from the Qur'an or The Bible without understanding the context.
Aggression of the USA was First you invaded and supported terrorists in Afghanistan in Syria in irak so stop acting innocent - the us empire is the biggest bullshit the world has ever experienced - you sacrifice your own people for money and Kapital- you are the biggest unethical murderers and rulers ever - lies lies lies and all you people are manipulated from head to bottom by your fucked up rulers who are fachist and money greedy - humanity you don’t know! Respect you don’t know ! Fachism at it’s Peak!!!
"Stories that never happened; can be infinitely more powerful than stories that did!"
10/10
Yes, totally unconstrained by fact.
Underrated comment .. this is 100% true .
Yes you nailed it.
Are you a historian lol, don't talk about something you don't know honey😂😂
Jesus crucified on cross for your sins never happened,but this story more powerful enough to fool Entire European & American continent 😢✌
Profound.... so much to learn, process and understand. Nice balance in providing content and context for consideration. Excellent video for those reasons...well done sir.
Emotionally driven and unbiased way of researching, if you have at least bothered yourself to look the prophet wasn’t at all a bedouin or nomad neither were most of his companions, but you needed that image to strengthen your argument and belittling the subject. I’m not even discussing the topic of the prophet lifestyle and history recordings which are authenticated throughout a strictly scientific standards more than any previous nation even more detailed than the history of America which almost a century later and i can give you all the resources and evidences you need . Me not the bedouins of Jordan whom they had nothing to do the prophet’s life. Don’t make a joke of yourself speaking of science yet desperately misleading the audience
5:33 we have the history of how. They placed the implement of the conversion on their flag.
I have always been fascinated by the notions that Mt Sinai the Christian monastery is there, and I have a book called “Where Moses Walked”.
Sinai is where God spoke. Sinai is where God stopped talking. Then I realized that guess what? If God is God? God is everywhere and don’t have to pay admission to be close to God.
1 Corinthians 3:16 “Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?” So we don’t need to pay admission or go on a hadj or pilgrimage to the Holy Land to be close to God. God is everything, everywhere and in every believer.
True enough, as He is omnipresent. But many Christians enjoy visiting the Holy Land where our Lord lived. LIkewise, Muslims enjoy making the journey to Mecca. It's no different (for them).
That’s what Hinduism is! Creating positive energy! Everything is God and you’re self is the other side of god! you can never see yourself truly but only feel it!
Your Worst Nightmare - Facts What you’re saying is true! Language is a curse becarfull of what words we use daily! GOD=DOG
The kingdom of God is humanity itself. We created God. We are God.
Too bad you hang your position on Paul/Saul's perversions of Jesus' teachings.
This guy encountered some of the same things I encountered. In the end, islam betrayed itself to me as a parasitic system of philosophy that rests on two main pillars; political and religious. It feeds off what it has conquered. There's nothing remarkable about it worthy of our admiration.
I'm wondering if Tom Holland is still alive or has been taken out!
Truth will prevail and falsehood demonish as it is the nature of falsehood to demonish itself.
Despite what you may say, insult what you may, debase what you may think about ISLAM, curse what you may of its sacred book and its Prophet ... yet it is the fastest growing belief system in the world today ! Open your eyes, your heart and your mind and contemplate why is it so ?!
the same can be said about any institutional relgion
@Quentin Dunn cite references. Plus, devils/demons are separate created entities from humans. Do your homework.
It is no longer what Mohammed envisioned. Remember he brought the people back from polytheism to the One True God, the God of Abraham, which Jews and Christians also accept. When he wrote the Quran, he said not to write anything else down, even if he said it. Yet, after his death, power-seeking MEN wrote down the Hadiths, traditions, against Mohammed's will - just like the Jews wrote down the Talmud, which is NOT Scriptural. Both Jews and Arabs descended from Abraham and both are Semites as they came from Noah's son Shem.
What you can say is that his capacity to memorize and to keep the verses in chronological gives an equivalence of his brain capacity
I see you’ve never read the Kora, Islam = total corruption.
no way our spiderman is now a historian, anyway best of luck for your new career bro
With great power there must also come great responsibility
Legendary 🏆 Word's 🔥
I'm quite sure that the Emperor in Chang'an would have disputed the Emperor in Constantinople's claim to be Master of the Universe.
Agreed .
Do you have more research on it? Would be interesting to watch or read.
I find this fascinating but as an atheist, where would mankind be if religion had never taken a foothold in our past?
Oh I think the world would have been much better place, no hate for women or communities would have existed and countries wouldn't have been fighting or divided in the names of gods.
No casteism, divisions or the stupidity
Every thing is not bad , good & bad is life , no if & but's
Wondering, Wondering, and still Wondering..... 😪😵
Can someone share the soundtrack?
A mystical place in the desert would be a "mirage" to these early humans
@Immortalsoldier Imortalsoldier why are you throwing out insults like an edgy 12 year old?
It was foretold that lshmael would be:“a wild ass among men; his hand shall be against every man, and every man’s hand against him. And he shall dwell over against all his brethren” (Genesis 16:12).
Pray for his descendants
@Maynard Runkle I believe old scraps of writing that people who were here BEFORE me wrote that have historically and scientifically been proven accurate thousands of times; yet YOU are here watching and commenting on a video that derived from dusty old scraps of paper... the freakin IRONY! Got to be a milinial...🤦🏽♀️😅
@Maynard Runkle If you wasn't so slow, you'd know that different people including Ishmael had their OWN lineages and he was NOT an Israelite he was clearly an Ishmaelite that had 12 princes of his own. God said that ALL valid prophets would come from the seed of Israel... stay in a child's place, this is Chess not checkers! 🖕🏾
pray for the will of God upon the descendants of Jacob who became "Israel" who tricked his brother out of his birthrite, as the Synagogue of Satanites are conning the West as I write.
Hey.hey.hey.hey.hey.... I was told that Muhammad was given instructions to write the Koran by the Angel Gabriel, the messenger of God. I know Gabriel. He told Mary she was to give birth to Jesus. So unless the Koran had a different Gabriel, why wouldn't he tell Muhammad Jesus was the son of God?
@@thebloopsound4241 Then what about david?in the OT he was mentioned that he was the begotten son of god,why dont christian worship him?
4.50, wrong already. Istanbul was not the capital of the Roman empire, it was always Rome.
But wen the Roman empire was divided into two, or better, collapsed, Istanbul was the -capital- of the Eastern Roman Empire.
Since i am not allowed to post links,youtube considers this advertising, i just copied a few lines from WIKI.
Following the collapse of the Western Roman Empire in the late 5th century, Constantinople remained the capital of the Eastern Roman Empire (also known as the Byzantine Empire; 330-1204 and 1261-1453), the Latin Empire (1204-1261), and the Ottoman Empire (1453-1922
That is true. There were two competing capitals.
A god that cannot talk to his own creations himself and needs messengers is not worth worshipping. That’s my position on all religions.
After a while in I couldn’t wait to read the comments, wasn’t disappointed
I think that it may have been Benjamin Franklin who said that religion in the hands of the good is a force for good, and in the hands of the evil it is a force for evil.
The man that set free slaves of christian people... it applies to it all
I pray for Peace….and the Truth to be known to all! Surely, Truth will set you free! Thanks for the film.
Emotionally driven and unbiased way of researching, if you have at least bothered yourself to look the prophet wasn’t at all a bedouin or nomad neither were most of his companions, but you needed that image to strengthen your argument and belittling the subject. I’m not even discussing the topic of the prophet lifestyle and history recordings which are authenticated throughout a strictly scientific standards more than any previous nation even more detailed than the history of America which almost a century later and i can give you all the resources and evidences you need . Me not the bedouins of Jordan whom they had nothing to do the prophet’s life. Don’t make a joke of yourself speaking of science yet desperately misleading the audience
A respectful and sensitive documentary on the topic of the historical origins of Islam. Thank you.
Seriously Tom.....From an academic and Historic perspective, your "Untold Story" is simply like McDonald's Value Meal !!!
@@kolitmas624 apparently in my comment you only read McDonald...To answer your question yes i did many researches and studies....Markus i have an idea for you...The truth is there, hiding it is easy, finding it is difficult..i hope that helps you
Roboryx what truth would that be?
@@josharaujo9589 That is an open question to make it short truth is Veritas.....Human are Human Truth is truth.. I hope that answer your question....
He made this documentary like this to protect himself, trying to be as indirect as possible, but coming out with the message..
@@kolitmas624 people are dumb.
Showing him walking and standing in the middle of the desert to give it more authenticity. What a joke.
He's there and your not, so your going to hate on him? Because he is stand and walking there while you watch him do it. You just might pay him for doing it if this video documentary has commercials. Be of sound mind when hating on help with understanding bud. P_out
@@crismiller1750 no hard feelings mate. Imagine if I tell you that the Greeks were all wrong about where Athens is, and in reality it is in Zimbabwe.
dinoone dinoone
You are intentionally mixing things.. The report did NOT say that Kaaba wasn’t in Saudi.. the same Kaaba that was rebuilt 10 times after complete destruction by natural causes and by Arabs themselves. The report says that there is a HUGE blind spot in the Islamic history where no any archaeological evidences were found. And that’s very true.. we both know it 😉
Today we had attacks again. Some women beheaded in a church because of western values.. Islam is a fascist religion, and absolutely in our modern age the lowest and most horrific religion. Seems to me like they worship the devil.
🤣🤣🤣
Whenever Holland talks about its “weight,” you can’t help but think, “Yeah, of course. Islam is oppressive, not liberating. It’s the worst iteration of the monotheistic patriarchy in history.”
"For the first 100 years after the founding of "Islam", none of the Mosques "Qibla" faced towards "Mecca", for the first 120 years of Islamic history, none of the surrounding Nations knew about the existence of "Mecca", the word "Mecca" appears only once in the Quran, the most revered site was referred to as "Mashjd al Haram", "forbidden gathering place". The Al Aqsa Mosque "Qibla" does not point to "Mecca", the Khirbat al Mafja Mosque built 724 AD, 103 years after the founding of "Islam", its "Qibla" does not point to "Mecca", all Mosques built in first 100 years after founding of "Islam", pointed to Petra in Jordan... There is no record of "Muhammad" being "born in Mecca", the Quran describes "Gardens, Orchards, Fields" surrounding "Muhammad's birth place", soil tests have shown that there have never been fertile ground around "Mecca"...to the West, Northern Africa, Spain, the Umayyad-(traditionallists) built Mosques facing Petra, in Iraq, to the East, the Abbasid-(reformers) built Mosques facing "Mecca", 683 AD Ibn Zubayr destroyed the original "Kaaba" in Petra....."
Reference: "The Sacred City". Timeline World History.
Controversial, and absolutely worth considering....
Question is: How Authentic, Adequate and Authorize is The Sacred City". Timeline World History? What if, I say this reference is self-created and full of Lies, nonsensical, baseless and lunatics and fools of lexicons?
What if, we challenge the Bible and Jesus like that? How would you prove then?
@@iq2823
"What if"..... How about, you search the "Timeline World History" Documentary "referenced" for yourself...?
"Self created lies, non-sensical, baseless, fools lexicon...". !?
What do you think Religious dogma is......"Divine". !?!!?
What is written in the Bible is clearly not the best that Humanity is capable of in the ethical domain. Not by people who claim the authority of fabricated pieces of primeval myth and fiction and want me to believe that these are "Divine", that, I won't have, and it is the original repudiation.
The first rebellion against mental slavery comes from saying ; this is man-made, it is not "Divine". The age of subscribing to the dictates of Parables, Prose, Fantasies and Fables, prescribed by morality signalling hypocrites who presume to speak on behalf of a Celestial Patriarch in whose "name" they cast aspersions, judgements, condemnation and prejudice while claiming that these are "God's verdict", is over
Conciousness has recognised an authentic understanding of knowledge free from the conceit and contrivances of an ultimatum based superstitious hysteria prescribed by lies, fabricated fiction. The age of ignorance is over.
@@iq2823
"Lies, fools of lexicon, baseless, nonsensical, self created....". !?
"What if"...... How about you research "Timeline World History" Doco for yourself.... and form your opinion on actually deciding for yourself instead just being outright dismissive ..... seriously, the epitome of ignorance is to dismiss outright without having any experience, knowledge, insight yourself.
What is written in the Bible is clearly not the best that Humanity is capable of in the ethical domain. Not by people who claim the authority of fabricated pieces of primeval myth and fiction and want me to believe that these are "Divine", that I won't have, and it is the original repudiation. The first rebellion against mental slavery comes from saying ; this is man-made, it is not "Divine".
The age of subscribing to the dictates of Parables, Prose, Fantasies and Fables prescribed by morality signalling hypocrites who presume to speak on behalf of a Celestial Patriarch in whose "name" they cast aspersions, judgement, condemnation and prejudice while claiming that these are "God's verdict", is over.
Conciousness has recognised an authentic understanding of knowledge free from the conceit and contrivances of an ultimatum based superstitious hysteria, the age of ignorance is over.
@iq2823...."What if" !?
How about, you research the references for yourself, the title is provided, the epitome of ignorance is to dismiss something outright without having any knowledge or experience of that you dismiss.
What is written in the Bible is clearly not the best that Humanity is capable of in the ethical domain. Not by people who claim the authority of fabricated pieces of primeval myth and fiction and want me to believe that these are "Divine", that I won't have, and it is the original repudiation. The first rebellion against mental slavery comes from saying ; this is man-made, it is not "Divine".
The age of subscribing to the dictates of Parables, Prose, Fantasies and Fables prescribed by morality signalling hypocrites who presume to speak on behalf of a Celestial Patriarch in whose "name" they cast aspersions, judgement, condemnation and prejudice while claiming that these are "God's verdict", is over.
Conciousness has recognised an authentic understanding of knowledge free from the conceit and contrivances of an ultimatum based superstitious hysteria, the age of ignorance is over.
@@iq2823 How Authentic, Adequate and Authorize is the books of hadith? What if their reference is self-created and full of Lies, nonsensical, baseless and lunatics and fools of lexicons?
There is a book. In which there is no doubt. A guidance for those who believe in the unseen.
The Oxford English Dictionary.
@@tryarunm quite funny ha
Laughing at ppl who thought this was the other TOM HOLLAND
who?
@@philosoftfurkitusjunkyard2462 the guy who played Spiderman in MCU.
@@whisperingwind7 im not well conversed in many topics including superheroes.
no worries, superheroes topic is not for everyone.
theres ton of more interesting topics out there better than superheroes.
@@whisperingwind7 i most interested in solving stupidity problems, i'm not interested in many things including super stuff. insert dry smiley face here.
His video is like his books: too long, too wordy. Having said that, his books are must-read if you have any interest in ancient history. Absolutely eye-openers.
Emotionally driven and unbiased way of researching, if you have at least bothered yourself to look the prophet wasn’t at all a bedouin or nomad neither were most of his companions, but you needed that image to strengthen your argument and belittling the subject. I’m not even discussing the topic of the prophet lifestyle and history recordings which are authenticated throughout a strictly scientific standards more than any previous nation even more detailed than the history of America which almost a century later and i can give you all the resources and evidences you need . Me not the bedouins of Jordan whom they had nothing to do the prophet’s life. Don’t make a joke of yourself speaking of science yet desperately misleading the audience
@@abal6671Have you read Holland's books?
Yeh,
Having been in the hotel industry, I have had the fortune of working with many, many persons from many, many culture’s, countries and ethnicities. Retired now for ten years, I regularly golf with Asian golf partners from Taiwan, Korea and those that actually lived in China and owned a factory in China. I very much enjoy hearing about their experiences, opinions, cultures and families. In “79”, I had many Iranian young men work for me. They needed to work due to assets being frozen and not being able to get back to Iran. 45 years later, I know for a fact some of these men have raised families in the U.S. and are as “Americanizes” as can be.
Although I recognize there are many Muslims in the U.S., they DO NOT want to over-assimilate or have there families, descendants effected by the American culture. My neighbor is one. He will not shake hands with someone such as I. I have encountered this many times interacting with persons of that culture. So- although in our country and our culture, their religion does not allow to integrate. This is segregation. Just saying. Definitely now a religion of love in my humble opinion.
Huh? In the US? I could see if it was Europe. The vast majority of Muslims in the US are thoroughly assimilated and will shake hands with anyone who respects them. Hell, they even celebrate the fourth. The only difference I know is that they may forego the hot dogs in favor of a burgher or a beef alternative.
I hesitated reading the comment section, coz i know itll be a frenzy.
Lol same. Not surprised by what I find haha. It seems we have a clash of civilizations continuing into the virtual world. I know it's a long shot, but hey Muslims and non Muslims, why don't we just chill and be friends and talk about all the dank memes we've been browsing during lockdown?
Same same same lol
Lololol.truly!!the world is in trouble bc of these idots....
Emotionally driven and unbiased way of researching, if you have at least bothered yourself to look the prophet wasn’t at all a bedouin or nomad neither were most of his companions, but you needed that image to strengthen your argument and belittling the subject. I’m not even discussing the topic of the prophet lifestyle and history recordings which are authenticated throughout a strictly scientific standards more than any previous nation even more detailed than the history of America which almost a century later and i can give you all the resources and evidences you need . Me not the bedouins of Jordan whom they had nothing to do the prophet’s life. Don’t make a joke of yourself speaking of science yet desperately misleading the audience
Did anyone ever tell you you look exactly like Ellen DeGeneres
So true! 😂
hahahaha hehehe agreed
What has the "look" to do with all these?!!!
michael learns to rock
As a boy, I belonged to the Boy Scouts. We had a a ritual that included a procedure similar to the Islamic praying for which we recited: I know my heart. I know my mind. I know that I ... stick up behind.
Mohammad is mentioned clearly in the Quran , Surah Alfath , verse 29, and it says:
Muḥammad is the Messenger of Allāh; and those with him are forceful against the disbelievers, merciful among themselves. You see them bowing and prostrating [in prayer], seeking bounty from Allāh and [His] pleasure. Their sign is in their faces from the effect of prostration [i.e., prayer].
Also it would be more objective to bring an Islamic Theology scholar to present the Islamic view on this, with all respect to prof. Nasr , but he is more of a philosopher and we needed a theology point of view as well.
I noticed that you haven’t mentioned the science of Hadith, this is not just stories, there are strict rules to follow so you can know if the story is correct, corrupted, or a lie.
Seriously, when he said he can't find anything from 7th centaury, it felt so weird. There is so much history from the start.
Islamic history and sayings of prophet Muhammad is preserved under such strict rules that no history rules can match.imams(researchers who studied every auspect of prophets life)has spent their lives to analyze each and every hadiths.proving certificates for each saying and rejected if it not fullfilling the criteria...when u study u vl come to know this way of research is far more authentic than ordinary history
Without lies islam dies
@@giovanni512 please use your mind
ROFL science 😂
In a thousand years, if we are still here, people will think of us as absolute wack jobs.
In 1000 years humans would be living under the millenial reign of Jesus Christ
They think that now
Music at 8:00 please?
I hope a lot more people can see this video so that people can see how we all used to be able to live together regardless of differences and origins.
The Brit’s and the US mucked it all up
B.S. it is from Roman Catholic Church.
All roads lead to Rome.
We would be way better without religions. they are just a big pile of BS, all of them
@@saardfetner8620No.. The French and the British wanted to control land by Suez Canal.
They settled the Jews on the Palestinian land.
@@saardfetner8620 The Christians that the Arabs were fighting first were actually "Orthodox" from Byzantines. They were the continuation of Roman Empire who have already lost the western part of it to the visigoths, lombards, carolingans and more. The church in the west hasn't yet picked itself back up to act as an equal ally to the powers only starting to settle in western europe. Status of the city Rome was LONG GONE by the time of Arab conquest. True power of the late roman empire (if we include byzantine) was first and foremost Constantinople (Istanbul). The islamic power that the Brits and US were trying to topple was in fact, mostly turks, not arabs. Not all muslims are arabs, even as early as 1500.
Tom Holland develops on the lines of Patricia Crone, who decisively spoke on the muddled history of Mecca. This documentary based on Holland's work was aired only once by Channel4 and taken down after protests of fundamentalists. It's good to see this documentary back again on UA-cam.
M Vyas 🤣your funny what diffence dose it make like people are dumb and can’t search for themselves press of a google dear you can see who converts and why is it the fastest growing religion
It's not Mecca it's Makkah
I watched the whole documentary and it's pretty fine... He only kept on focusing on Quran when their is another parallel tradition we can "Hadith", he should've followed it.
@@naveedsolangi8704 the proper word mentioned in the holy Quran is Bacca, which means weeping place and this refers to Petra in Jordan !
@@praneshramachandran8745 Can you prove that Brother?
I laughed when he said why any arab would walk pass the remains of the city of Lot. I mean there was no Jordan at the time. The entire Middle east was a free reign. People WALKED long distances if that actually made sense to you 😂😂😂
@Gary Allen In a sense there wans't any barrier between nations around that part.
they knew what they were doing including Tom Holland in the title😂
Father Justin perfectly embodies what made Muslims believe Christians weren't *too bad. What a beautiful man.
Qur'an 5:82:
'You will surely find the most intense of the people in animosity toward the believers [to be] the Jews and those who associate others with Allāh; and you will find the nearest of them in affection to the believers those who say, "We are Christians." That is because among them are priests and monks and because they are not arrogant.'
Cute that he ignored that Jerusalem fell during the 2nd Righteous Caliph, Umar ibn Khattab. (he jumped directly to Muawiyyah).
He ignored also that Mecca has at least one Oasis.
He also can explain how in Jupiter's name, Rome can let a center of resistance bloomed right in the center of Syam.
BTW, the fertile crescent trumped canaan.
Of course he skipped over the obvious. This video was made for Christians to feel better about themselves lol
They have done archeological research into what grew in Mecca. It wasn’t much of anything as they found no evidence of trees as described in the Quran. What is obvious is that the original holy site was not in current day Mecca. You only have to look to the oldest Mosques to determine which direction they prayed and it was not toward current day Mecca. This does not mean Islam is false, it simply means that their holy sites have changed. Jerusalem was never a holy site for Muslims prior to their conquering of Jerusalem. Jerusalem is mentioned ZERO times in the Quran.
@@alexanderealley9992 *Atheists claim that they are intellectually superior to religious people because they are willing to question their beliefs, whereas religious people are dogmatic and refuse to question their deepest beliefs and won't consider evidence that could potentially undermine those beliefs.*
.
Well, have you ever heard an atheist say:
"I wonder if constantly increasing individual freedom is a good thing."
"I was wrong about democracy being a viable system."
"Maybe the sexual revolution was a mistake."
"The evidence shows that equality of the sexes is destructive."
"Let's have a debate on if freedom of speech and religion is good for society."
"Could it be that women need fewer rights?"
I have never seen an atheist raise these questions or hold these positions up to serious scrutiny. Nor do they provide any evidence for their beliefs on these matters. They simply assert them and ridicule and mock anyone who disagrees with them.
Don't talk through your hat. The most holiest site in Islam after mecca and madina is the Al aqsa mosque, which is mentioned in Quran.
"Muhammad rested under a tree"...
(Not a tree to be seen in any direction...)
@Piper Mccoy ohh man,u talk like u never learn a damn things,why r u questioning about tree?is that all the point u got to insult muslim?u gotta read more,muhammad was prophesied in the NT and OT,not only that he was prophesied in hindu scripture in the book of kalki purana,he was addressed as kalki avatar,it mention his name his birth place his cousin name his parents name where the holy spirit gave revelation take place and and the amount of his enemy
@Piper Mccoy
Not only that.. Mecca is in the wrong place.
It's all man written bullsh*t
Really buddy ? Out of the hour and 20 minutes of this program that's all your narrow mind could grasp. All you idiots making comments about Islam should actually read a book and stop learning about shit off UA-cam. Islam was no more militant then Christianity during the Crusades or Judaism or paganism
Jesus
@Edmund Your ether a very stupid person your your a lier... Jesus is less then the illiterate man Mohammad at least in their own scriptures...
There are two distinct periods in Quran.
That is before conquer of Makka and after.
The sura’s are also split in those two era.
These are because both periods has distinct social parameters.
An excellent documentary! Is the cinematographer and/or editor enraptured with Mr. Holland? He is lovingly kept in frame (in various filters and angles) for 65% of the footage. 😂
Nonetheless, a fascinating journey.
This is actually ridiculous 😅. Holland seems to visit people, places not to inquire but ask how what they say relate to what he presumes. He literally gives his own meaning to what he finds out.
Literarily, he talks about Islam without using any Arabic text as reference, that was his biggest blunder
While I think the questions he asks about the early historicity of Islam are important and useful, so so much about some the things he says just reaks of eurocentrism and a certain type of white superiority complex. It comes out when he speaks about other empires and compares them to largely Western/Christian ones. So terrible
This the character of a non believer! How can he expect to see when he chooses to shut his eyes & arrogant enough to want to see without listening first!
"visit people, places not to inquire but ask how what they say relate to what"...Religion..."presumes. "...Religion..."literally gives"...its..."own meaning to what "...it..:"e finds out",
@@junsu21reeks*
Even though I understand the majority of it, there are certain parts I don't understand, so please add English subtitles or turn on the automatic subtitle.
Then Learn English
The author looked at the wrong places & sources
What were they first. I would love to hear full history
This doc is about one person trying to find it's own doubt about a single person and one religion...its more about a journey of finding something...something that can give answer to his own opinion to the way he think and to the way how he realize...the real stories is at the end of this doc...it's more about himself rather than the history it's self...ask the right question and find the right path..and you may find what you're looking.
Very nice summary. This documentary is about a guy trying to find a new angle to attack Islam. The method chosen here is Mecca didn’t exist and Mohammed was not a real person. Therefore, it’s all made up.
Lol hilarious
You are absolutely right..
Stopt after 5 minutes..... Can not bare the formulation of the presentation , not scientific at all
So true.
@@roelienpostma2367I don’t see it like that, these are issues that I struggle with all the time, not just Islam, Christianity or any religion.
Great presentation. I lived in Abqaiq, Saudi Arabia, working in the oil industry from 1978 to late 1981. I was in a compound where only supervisory Saudis lived among us, with Americans, British and a few of us Canadians.. I have read the entire Quran given me as a gift. I keep it with my Bibles, Catholic and Protestant. While living there I learned to read, write and speak Arabic although my reading was at a grade school level. Beyond my fellow Saudi workers and other X patriots with whom I worked, I gained a good relationship with a Muslim Mutawa, Hadi Sala, who was also an oil works Superintendent making him powerful. To me the competition between Rome and Constantinople caused the Prophet Mohammed to 'do his own thing' if I may use such an expression.
Jihad (conquest) was done for material gains but wisely disguised under "the word of God".
"the competition between Rome and Constantinople" as you said has nothing to do with Islam progress, Allah plan things the way he wish.
in armies of Roman Byzantine Empire and that of Pasian all outnumbered that of Muslims in hundred of numbers, then which rivalry are you talking about?
before he even migrate to Madina he has been promising his people they will take over the Empire of Rome and Pasian yet they laughed at him while calling him mad man doing hallucination.
So islam is about conquer war and slavery ! Jihad in the name of God ! What a disgusting religion ! Islam is nothing than a politic of supremacy, conquering and discrimination. A nazzi religion. And the same like nazzi , islam want to exterminate all the jews ! 🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮@@UAUmar-ll2pj
It’s just his perspective!
As a Christian, I am always trying to understand where the divide happened. And I know it started when Abraham kicked out Ishmael and his mother after Isaac was born, at least that’s my perspective from all the history books I’ve studied and documentaries I’ve watched. If we all follow the same GOD, what has caused our corruption as one people?! If GOD loves us all, why are we still fighting after 2500 (or more) years!
Fu
Does the state of the building speak volumes?
The Austin School YT channel has the best most factual teachings on history
It would be great if it just remained untold..
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
😂😂
Actually if it was truly told.. everyone will discover its ugliness
@@bassamahmed1466 Wonder what is your source of truth in this matter. From your comments so far, they seem rather partial and vitriolic. Then again, if you are partial it will not make any difference.
Wonderful Tom.
The conclusion is simplistic. The Prophet somewhat acquired a couple of texts from the Jewish religion and Christianity while traveling as a merchant around Syria, and took them all way back to somewhere in the Arabia desert. There he constructed the book by editing those texts. When he died many had converted but not sure where was the 'somewhere' so early mosques have diverse directions. Many years later some big warlords decided to be as cool as Roman emperors and felt like a cool religion was needed. The current holy city was designated as the original 'somewhere' and everyone in the following hundreds of years who doubted the decision was either killed or banished.
Thats why, its very diffrent and more logical to correct old versions of the same message, its an upgraded version of the same religion I think
Nice dream 🌏😃.Goes to show you havn't the faintest idea what you wrote about .
If simplistic, accurate. Your summary of what he says is brilliant and I mean that. It is what those skeptical of Islam fail to say in millions of words but which you've done in a few.
Your comment is brilliant.
@@bilalabdulsamad9152 Hmmm, sounded pretty convincing to me.
@karlwalters3763 it must have sounded pretty convincing for someone who doesn't know a thing about islam. Don't blame you . Because if you knew anything about islam you would know everything he said contradicts the history and every sentence can be disproven . A simple google search or youtube search will show you the evidence for all the stuff thats being said. And quran and hadith is available free online if you want to check any of the claims. Making up stories and calling them as facts and people who are convinced by them is the biggest joke i see in this world. Its amazing the stuff people comes up with without an atoms worth of facts and evidences.
Whoever added that retalier, item barcode scanning sound effect, needs to be left alone in the worlds quietest room, with only that sound effect playing the same number of times it plays here.
“Not being able to know something doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist”.
That means I am the God
Bow down before me
Child logic
Not being able to know something doesn't mean that it does exist.
*Atheists claim that they are intellectually superior to religious people because they are willing to question their beliefs, whereas religious people are dogmatic and refuse to question their deepest beliefs and won't consider evidence that could potentially undermine those beliefs.*
.
Well, have you ever heard an atheist say:
"I wonder if constantly increasing individual freedom is a good thing."
"I was wrong about democracy being a viable system."
"Maybe the sexual revolution was a mistake."
"The evidence shows that equality of the sexes is destructive."
"Let's have a debate on if freedom of speech and religion is good for society."
"Could it be that women need fewer rights?"
I have never seen an atheist raise these questions or hold these positions up to serious scrutiny. Nor do they provide any evidence for their beliefs on these matters. They simply assert them and ridicule and mock anyone who disagrees with them.
A good quest for an answer to his questions. Appreciate his patience and persistence in keeping asking questions until he himself became confused about his questions. Good exercise, but it must be very expensive one. Congratulations. Finally you know what you don't know.
Lmao
Hahha
😂😂😂😂...
😅
Tom Holland's documentary "Islam: The Untold Story" was heavily criticized by scholars and experts for its numerous inaccuracies and factual errors.
One of the most significant inaccuracies was Holland's assertion that there was no archaeological evidence to support the traditional Islamic account of the life of Prophet Muhammad. Holland claimed that no physical evidence of Muhammad's existence or the early Islamic community had been found, and suggested that this was evidence that the traditional Islamic account of Muhammad's life was a later fabrication.
However, this claim was widely refuted by scholars and experts. Islamic studies professor Jonathan Brown, for example, wrote in a review of the documentary that Holland's claim "reflects a rather bizarre ignorance of the field of early Islamic history and archaeology."
Brown explained that while there is relatively little archaeological evidence from the early Islamic period, there is abundant written evidence from the time that supports the traditional Islamic account of Muhammad's life and the early Islamic community.
Other experts also pointed out factual errors in Holland's documentary, such as his claim that the Kaaba in Mecca was originally a Christian shrine, and his suggestion that the early Islamic conquests were primarily motivated by economic gain rather than religious ideology.
In response to the criticism, Holland issued a statement in which he acknowledged that some of his claims had been "unhelpfully phrased" and expressed regret for any offense caused. However, he maintained that the central thesis of his documentary remained valid.
Overall, the controversy surrounding Holland's documentary highlights the importance of careful and rigorous scholarship when exploring complex historical topics like the origins and development of Islam.
Omg who is this singer in the background at the beginning? I'm transfixed and I must know
You could use soundhound or some other song recognition software. Might help...
@SP-ct2rj hahaha that's so obvious i'm embarrassed 😆Thank you LOLZ
@@rheannahoffmann385 hey no worries. If I had a cent for every time something obvious evaded me I'd be rich.
@@SP-ct2rj 🪶🫶🏻
last 15 min was good example of how to be genuine and honorable, unbiased researcher/scholar
Mr Hollands book "Sword of Islam" - I think it's called - covers the subject of this video in some depth and is very good.
Most un professional documentary I’ve ever seen. A 10 year old arab kid who is muslim can tell u from A to Z how islam came and started
Today we had attacks again. Some women beheaded in a church because of western values.. Islam is a fascist religion, and absolutely in our modern age the lowest and most horrific religion. Seems to me like they worship the devil.
That’s where he went wrong, should have asked a 10 year old, all the men didn’t have a clue ….
how can you find something that doesn’t exist….you won’t!
Why did you check the different Coraans? One is in Istambul, but check the others, Mekka was not on the oldest maps.
What gets me is how Islam takes credit for scientific discoveries. If anything, religion has mostly stifled science. People made discoveries regardless of it
He didn't include stamp of Muhammad (pbuh)? Letters sent to Roman and Persian empires?
Accurately identified
That has been long discarded as authentic
Also not included the truce where "Muhammed" was used: Treaty of Hudaybiyyah.
I'm sure that Mr. Holland's trip to the Middle East for this Documentary didn't include all of the trips to various sites in order too authenticate the relationship to him being a prophet called by God as it is written in the Quran, again as God instructed to be done. May I ask when was the Quran written? And from what text was it taken from that Muhammad knew about Adam, Eve, Abrams, and his sons including his nephew Lot in Sodom/Goliath. Was that taken from the history found in the cave that Mr. Holland visited that showed the cross in that cave?? However, too enlighten the person who wrote that Tom Holland majored in English, doesn't mean he is not a Historian. My B.A., is in Social Work, but my major was Law!! Like law you have to research the facts if their out there, if you want to verify the truth about something or someone. Historians have been interested in this as well as the public forever or it wouldn't be called History without documented facts like DNA!! Another question I read about after listening to another Documentary that included his marriage to a 6yr., but didn't have sex with her until age 9 Aisha, and the story I just read in the comments about how this mother an brother beat his sister, when she didn't comply with them for whatever reason. What sin had she commited? Has the Islamic community read the book of REVELATION from front to back so they have a good take on what the day of judgment is all about?? I'm just curious.......
ua-cam.com/video/v-xWBEuUQ40/v-deo.html - please go through this and decide who the prophet was - a suggestion.
This is one of the most poorly researched documentaries ive ever seen. I was willing to see a different side regardless of the bias but this just leaves out too much.
Fully biased
which is a good documentary about lslam? Please say
Fernando Ramoa its a horrible documentary about islam.
@@Ramoa111 Islam empire of faith.you should watch it.its a well researched documentary made by Richard Gardner in year 2000.its will clear all doubt's and misconceptions about the Islam.
@Sigma Geranimo You criticize the Quran and Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. See the movie" The Massage"of Islam,2.58 hours length and"Plagues of Egypt", 4 to 5 minutes. In UA-cam. You can understand the true history.
Makkah aka Bakkah aka Mecca , is mentioned directly eight times, one example is Chapter 48, Surah Al-Fath, Verse 24. This Surah was revealed when the Holy Prophet (peace be upon him) was returning from Makkah after the Treaty of Hudaibiya.
Not 8 times, only once. An "hapax", which means one can give it any interpretation they want
A brilliant presentation by Mr. Tom Holland!
Lies again? DC Marvel Los Angeles Movies
Where does this fall in the MCU?
I'm an hour in and spiderman still hasn't shown up
😂😂😂😂
Muhammad is thanos
This is the part where Spider-Man converted to Islam.
Man talks a lot but doesn't say much, does he?
Yeah, "weakness" and "honesty" OFTEN sound the same....
I mean, if you demand POWERFUL arguments even though there are little evidence (of ANY sort), wouldn't you then just invite demagogues and manipulators to the conversation? I bet THEY would be more than happy to offer certainties… Don't you think?
@@busylivingnotdying If someone doesn't actually have something to say, why would they bother spending 20 minutes saying it? That would be time better spent presenting whatever evidence DOES exist, if any.
@@plumsink He does say something: conquest may have come FIRST, before THE BELIEF. Now you have a POWER that needs a doctrine to make sure people KEEPS obeying "the powers that be"
But there is a problem:
If the answers are clouded in various traditions, you must first extricate the audience from preconceived ideas (step one) …. already we are in a more complicated place…
Sorry, but there are no shortcuts
@S C in other words: most people :)
I know we can say:
Look how stupid people are, let's ignore them! (or something like that)
But why is that a bad idea?
Because "dum" people don't disappear. They are still there… and sometimes they become powerful (ouch)
And sometimes WE are the dum ones and WE would need someone to be patient with US! (double ouch) :)
@@busylivingnotdying "If the answers are clouded in various traditions, you must first extricate the audience from preconceived ideas."
Proceeding from the assumption that you need to change what people think is problematic to start with. That sounds a bit totalitarian. Present evidence: let people decide whether their own minds are changed or not.
I always find it odd how Muslims believe the Bible is corrupted yet we don’t even know who wrote all the different quran versions. It comes from thousands of miles and centuries away. Who truly was Muhammad? Was there a Muhammad? Super interesting question.
Interesting research. Most people that are religious believe not because something is proven but because they feel it or have an inner conviction to follow it. Once you receive the gift of faith life takes on new meaning and somehow makes sense of life...in my experience.
How come this documentary does not reveal the names of the “scholars” who provided their expert opinion? Was this deliberate so that their lives would not be at risk? Not knowing their credentials takes away some credibility to the whole documentary and all that they kept saying is “I don’t know”. I was expecting more substance honestly
I think the woman interviewed is one of the contributors. She died few years back. Her name is Patricia Crone. Fear of retribution is the main reason why. Subscribe to @pfanderfilms, CIRA international you will understand further
Well Tom "Scholars" are the bedouins is the desert...At least from this angle
+