Not nearly enough, indeed. He has spent a life of service to the community and all he wants this channel to be is a portal for his gifts to further help the community. I call it selfless integrity. You don't find it much anymore.
Not trying to sell anything.. he is trying to say that his opinion is the only one we should be listening to.. he' thinks he's a gun God.. Not saying he's not knowledgeable, but it only an opinion.. and that is my opinion.
I'm 61 years old my dad was a Korean war combat Marine you remind me of some of his friends as a boy I used to love to listen to these guys I'm sure you're a bit older than I am I like your UA-cam channel and I am subscribed you're a wealth of knowledge this old army veteran appreciates it be safe and be well thank you sir
@@Sako75.7mm08 with a suppressor...5 deer? meh...shooting fish in a barrel. considering..you only get two tags, an then one doe if the county says its ok.
Discussing the pros and cons of various cartridges is a time honored tradition around the hunting camp fire. Not surprising is that various hunters extoll the virtues of their own rifle's chambering. Where I live in north central British Columbia, moose and mule deer are No. 1 name of the game. Black bear, elk, caribou, mountain sheep and goats are also on the menu. Not knowing anything about hunting or cartridges, the first rifle I acquired was a bolt action in .270 Win. I could have stopped there but a few years later, wanting something with a bit more oomph, I got a bolt action in .300 Win Mag. This was followed by a bolt action in .243 Win. As far as big game in my neck of the woods, I've got it covered. Back when grizzly hunting in BC was allowed, I got yet another bolt action in .375 H&H. For reducing the population of coyotes on local farms and ranches, a heavy barreled .22-250 was added. While I do most of my grouse hunting with a 20 gauge, I occasionally use my .22 LR. Any one of those centrefires could be replaced with something similar and I would be just as well served. (.30-06 for the .270, 7mm Rem Mag for the .300 Win Mag, .257 Roberts for the .243 Win etc.) For any game animal there is no such thing as the 'perfect cartridge'. A wide variety will get the job done. That said, it's still fun to pretend to be the best judge of cartridges while around that campfire.
G'day from Australia. I agree with you. People get too caught up in hype about effectiveness of calibres on game and forget that the shooter is the main factor. Thank you sir, for your insight.
Bingo! Bowhunters call, stalk, conceal, wait. They hunt, instead of pretending to be military snipers shooting at a terrorist 500 yards away. Get close and shoot straight!
I know your post is older but I like your statement.I have come to the conclusion that the whole" sniper"mentality has entered the hunting world. Give me a flat based , pointed soft point, or round that will mushroom decently and you have a good deer round.
Thanks for the common-sense unvarnished assessment of the 6.8 Western. Over the years, (seventy years of shooting) I've had several magnums, including the 270 WSM, 300 WSM, and lots of standard 30s and 7 mm rifles. I also have tried the very new 6.5 PRC, and shot it head-to-head with a 270 Win. for several years, until I realized that when using all-copper bullets, they are virtually the same ballistically - including B.C.! I am also a hand-loader. Currently, I am using a 270 Win. for everything from antelope to elk. I really WANT to buy another rifle, just for the fun of it, but not because I can find anything that is functionally better in any way, so I am saving my money. It's almost impossible to fault the old 270 Win. For you new hunters, especially, this cartridge is everything you could want: flat-shooting, insanely accurate, has plenty of power, readily available and relatively inexpensive ammunition, and very manageable recoil. Jack O'Connor was right!
I admit when the 6.8 Western was first announced I got goose bumps and wanted to buy a rifle really bad. Of course it was during the middle of the pandemic so inventory was nowhere to be found. Now two years later I am less enamored about the cartridge for the same reasons you explained in the video. To me the 6.8 Western is like the 280 Ackley. It's a neat invention and it might be nice to own a rifle chambered for it but it doesn't do anything for me that my 270 Win, 7 mm Rem Mag or 300 Win Mag can't do already. The latter three cartridges cover just about anything I could ever want to do for big game hunting out west because I simply won't shoot out past 400 yards. For whitetail hunting in the eastern woods of north America I will grab my 308 Winchester every time. Thanks for sharing the video!
You speak the facts ! I bought into the snake oil of the 270 wsm with model 70 super grade when it first came out. nice rifle, very accurate, but zero no ammo available, nor reloading brass now. The old 270 win is just as accurate, cheaper ammo and no notable difference in killing big game in Alaska, ammo is every where right now. The model 70 super grade 270 wsm is a safe queen with no new new brass, nor ammo available in this country. I am thinking about rebarreling the rifle. Thank you for keeping folks informed.
1 year later it's plenty ammo out there I have bought 140 accubonds n 150ablr from nosler 140 gr tsx 130gr copper impacts 140gr tip strike 145gr eldx and 130cx 150gr power points and 130gr power shok when last year all I could find was copper impacts
Good wisdom Sir! Love my .270's (Remington 721 & 700 BDL), both have taken too many deer to count. Flat shooting, hard hitting and accurate as hell. Jack O'Connor had it right.
After this last review I’ve watched about the 6.8 Western, I’ve finally made up my mind. I will be ordering my new rifle in 6.8 Western. If even these most experienced, veteran skilled and cartridge knowledgeable experts like Blue can say that the 6.8 Western is an excellent cartridge with very high potential then that’s all I need to make my decision. If I already owned a .270 Winchester then maybe I wouldn’t but because I’m in the market for purchasing a .277 caliber why not choose the 6.8 Western because of its range of options all throughout the bullet weight and range of BC. Thank you Blue for giving me all the information I needed to make my decision. I always respect your point of view on these issues.
Such a pleasure to listen to common sense display of information, well done. It’s great to air out the outhouse with a breath of fresh air. And you my friend are just that, a breath of fresh air. Take care
After I got my Breakfast and coffee, I sat down and opened my Google/UA-cam and was pleasantly surprised to see this new video. Thank You so much for this. As a traditionalist I love these comparison studies and I trust you to be honest. And now I will watch the rest of it.
Been shooting the .270 with 140 grain Hornady Interlock's for 15 years. Love it and have never lost a deer out to 400 yards on numerous occasions. Great round.
I have been listening to you for a few years silently. Really enjoy your videos. I appreciate your wisdom and knowledge and learned a lot from you. Your one of the best out there, at least on youtube.
I have a Browning 1885 in 270 win. The 28” barrel takes the 270 to new heights. I have chronographed Hornady 143 gr. ELDX at 3050fps, with no pressure issues. That is enough for me, and likely anything I will ever shoot here in MT. Thanks for the reality check, and rationale behind this video. Good job!
I do see the merits of the 6.8 Western bullet weight that is available and agree completely. But I still think that I will stick with my dear 270 Winchester. One of the most commercially available, flattest shooting, and most accurate cartridges in my gun safe. I love the 270 as you do Captain and and the hunting situations that would cause the Westerner to excel would only cause me to step over to my 30-06 which is also very commercially available. I enjoy listening to your pragmatic perspectives on issues like these as I always do!
I believe I'll stick to the 270 also. I may try to build a custom 270 with a faster twist barrel and hand load the heavier bullets. Thinking 1 in 8 twist 24 to 26 inch barrel.
I would favor that idea above the 6.8 Western, if I needed the bullet length/weight if for no other reason than cost. Those western rounds. By the time you buy the rifle, dies (and other reloading items), and any high-priced factory ammo you'd probably be happier with your decision. Plus, the recoil is more manageable, as the captain pointed out. And I like to build too. But here in Texas Hill Country our deer are smaller than many of the other hunting zones. Rounds between 243 and 270 are plenty for these animals.
@@borkwoof696 Because it's questionable whether it will even be around in ten years. As a 300 Win Mag shooter...I remember when all the writers said the 300 WSM and RUM would dethrone the WM! 20+ years later the WM is still the king. I bet in another 20 years all these new fangled cartridges will be gone...and the old tried and true cartridges will still be going strong. It's all hype and marketing by the manufacturers to sell more rifles.
@@Master...deBater Exactly. So many cartridges come and go, some of them for good reason, others because for whatever reason no one ever took notice. I currently own a .338 Federal, absolutely love the cartridge, but it's on its death bed, and even if we ever see normal ammo supply again, I doubt the .338 Fed will even be supported by then. Not going to make that mistake again by replacing the .270 with a 6.8W, or .243 with one of the many 6mm's that have come out lately. Especially when a custom barrel with faster twist revitalizes these old cartridges anyway.
The Real Gunsmith said essentially the same thing as you in his own way after this video. It's nice to hear a concensus from educators I trust. Thank you.
One thing not mentioned as an advantage for the 6.8 Western is wind drift. It’s higher BC allows it to shoot straighter in the wind. It’s not hard to range a target and find the drop (gravity works equally from the muzzle to impact) but knowing what effect the wind will have over the entire distance is something that even well practiced shooters sometimes struggle with. But as the range decreases, there will be less of a difference. That in itself is a good reason to keep your shots on live game inside of 400 yards.
@@timk4502 The biggest problem is to find a place to shoot 500 yds. Very few ranges have 500 yds. If You want to go hunting somewere were it's hard to get within range. Practice helps. Forget dial in for range. Often there is no time. Experience sights you on the target at distance( A range finder helps, if you got time). Before BDC, Kentucky windage(Experience) got the game👍
Wind drift dont happen until you get out pass 500yards so these new high BC bullets are really useless at hunting range so stick with the old cals 243win 6.5swed 260rem 7mm08 270win 280rem 25-06 30-30 308 30-06 7rem mag 300win mag and so on
@@warrengreen3217 I hear what you’re saying and generally agree. At any ethical range, the wind isn’t going to be too much of an issue. But there are times when the wind isn’t just 10 MPH or so. If it’s blowing 20 MPH or more, that can make an otherwise routine shot much more challenging. I wouldn’t trade good terminal performance for a better BC but with bullets that perform similarly on game, I would prefer a better BC. And I wouldn’t trade away a trusted old school caliber just because of a potential upgrade in BC. But if I could add one to the stable, that could be interesting.
@@Dennisthemenace40 your missing the hole point at under 500 yards like 300 or 400 yards even a 40 mph wind dont have enough to blow that bullet off, 500 yards and under that bullets there in under a second its been proven wind is not a factor at them ranges
A .270 Winchester is all that and a bag of chips ! Hundreds of reasons why it is one of the greatest hunting cartridges of all time. I use a .300 wm for big game but rifles in that cal. tend to weigh more and yet still recoil enough to cause temporary blindness. My 84 year old Dad still swears by his 700 rem in .270 win. He has taken many moose, elk, brown bear, mule deer, and pronghorn. You can buy ammo EVERYWHERE ! BTW , Your 700 is absolutely BEAUTIFULL !
I love all of your vids sir and have learned quite a bit from putting the time into watching your vids which are extremely interesting to me . 👍👍 I appreciate you sharing your knowledge of firearms and the history and all the aspects . I will certainly pass down the things I have learned to anyone who will listen . I prefer the wood and steel guns and rifles to pistols . Born in 70 so been shooting a while and I like to keep using what had been working for me like 30.06 amd the other rounds gun enthusiasts have grown to love over the years . 30.06, 30-30, 7 mm , 270 , 243 , .22 , 5.56 , You are a good man . May God bless you and your family . I hope your pup Benny is doing ok . I lost my white lab and it breaks my heart when I hear of someone losing their companion or any death for that matter . Lately things have been rough around here with my parents having surgeries and being unable to be mobile . Everything was fine last year and then all of a sudden both of them having problems and it’s been going for awhile now . I have no problem stepping up and taking care of things around the house , going to the store and doing laundry or anything for that matter for my family . I really do with you the best in everything . I can see you are a good family man .
The only time I ever felt undergunned with my 270 was my first trip to Idaho in the early 80's. Every shot was consistently well over 500 yds it was like shooting a 81mm mortar high angle hell. When I got back home a friend got me hooked on the 300wm for long range outta state work, but to me the 270 is still my favorite rifle for anything that will be 300yd shooting maybe even 400yds. Anyway I've had alot of calibers in over 50 yrs hunting but my favorite ones are the 270 and 300wm.
6.5 PRC has also shown good results at range against elk, given the proper bullet, such as a Nosler Partition or the Norma version. Less recoil and I believe less wind deflection than the 300WM but shorter barrel life. Always trade-offs.
It's not always that the latest is a bad thing but the manufacturers can throw a lot of dope on the box that means very little in the real world and I'm not buying the hype. I love the tried and true proformance of cartridges that work at 200 yards and for hunting 300 absolutely tops. For long range target the 6.5 can definitely ring the bell at one mile.
@@waynecastleman1363 Well it's like 6.5 creedmore , does it do anything 260 Remington or 6.5 Swede can't do ? Sure it's has a few small inherent design feature that may benefit accuracy but overall it doesn't add much for the average shooter. The best thing most people could do is a decent bedding job , tune some handloads and get more trigger time. Accuracy issues are mostly the individual behind the trigger 90% of the time.
Well researched and stated. You presented some honest facts and practical things to consider. It makes perfect sense. Thanks for sharing and God Bless.
I've been a long time subscriber to your channel, but never commented. Just want to say thank you for sharing years of knowledge, I've learned more on your channel than any other. Thank you and God bless.
Covered a lot of ground . The general information less specific to the .270 is excellent. That’s what makes your videos so exceptional. The input you offer is particularly helpful to newer shooters and helps to give depth; even for experienced shooters. To be able to make good evaluations and maintain proper perspective is conducive to preventing nonsense and waste. When I started taking an in depth interest to learn more about firearms,ballistics,reloading,etc., your videos answered many questions. Good stuff as usual GUNBLUE-Thanks
You are a treasure, sir. So glad you have made your wealth of information available to us! I have been on the fence with the 6.8 and your comment about the cost of powder & recoil vs performance should be the main consideration. Your approach makes so much sense. That makes it simple.
Your knowledge is valuable and enjoy watching your videos. I have a 300 win mag it's all I have ever owned since a young man. I enjoy it and would shoot more but prices are over the top now. My wife has a youth model 243 and to me the recoil is felt more than my rifle. I have never shot a deer further than 300 yards. It has always amazed me to see my impact before recoil moves the sight picture. It's just my choice of rifle and I am not degrading anyone for what you use as long as it's ethical for the game. Thank you again and keep up the good work. God bless
300 win mag has been my favorite for a long time. I have a 270 win, and I always thought the recoil was worse than my 300 win mag. I can shoot the 300 far more accurately.
Well, Sir GunBlue490…..you’ve done it yet again! You’ve given me personally a wonderful historical & factual based on the .270 & the 6.8mm Western. Very informative & eye opening. Thank you! Also, you mentioned the 6.5 Creedmoor vs. the .260 Remington, of which I have to admit I’m a very big fan of the latter, the .260 Rem. A couple years ago (maximum), just receiving my latest issue of “Shooting Times”, I began to read the cover page & the stories & overviews of rifles & pistols. As I began to read I noticed that this particular issue contained 5-FIVE, yes 5 different stories/reviews of the 6.5 Creedmoor in the same magazine. I was perplexed to say the least but thinking of columns past, I recalled the enormous amount of articles covering the 6.5 Creedmoor. It seemed as EVERY firearm writer out there was proclaiming the Creedmoor the “End-All/Be-All”, cartridge & all others should cease production now that the Creedmoor had arrived. I do not deny it’s good points but as a fan of the .260 Rem., I couldn’t help but feel as the .260 Rem, 6.5x55mm Swede, 6.5 Grendel, 6.5 Remington Magnum, 6.5x47mm Lapua & the .264 Win Mag (& the wildcat 6.5x06’), were being deliberately overlooked by these so called writers. As I dug into the relationship between Hornady & the majority of magazines for firearms & the writers therein, I found it would be nice to have either the money $$ or the “FREE”, hunting trips to closed game ranches & Africa for dangerous game, that Hornady has spent to push their baby, the 6.5 Creedmoor as the 1 & ONLY 6.5/.264 you ever will need, end of story. Of course I’ve never read a gun writer that ever found or tested/reviewed ANY firearm they didn’t like. I did however think my irritation based on Hornady’s swooning over the gun writers & the free firearms & hunting trips was more than warranted as NONE of the current Magazines & the writers that review firearms within, NEVER compared (as you say), Apples-to-Apples comparisons against the 6.5 Creedmoor. I’ve found that out of the 3 rifles I own chambered in .260 Rem, in a Savage Model 10-Predator Max 1 w/AR-10 magazine from AICS & bedded stocks, a Remington Model 7 “Mountain Rifle”, w/Thumbhole stock & my Tikka T3 .260 “Forrest”, model will all shoot very accurately w/various different factory loads & even better with hand loads, but none of the 3 shoot the exact same primer, powder & bullet combo the exact same. I’ve heard you speak different times about the .260 Rem., and you’ve always refused to condemn it or the many other 6.5/.264’s out there. In my humble opinion Hornady only came forward with the 6.5 Creedmoor as they stood upon the shoulders of the many GIANTS that have came before them. They were one of the last or later to introduce their own 6.5mm offering & to me they actually hamstrung the cartridge by what could be used to reload for it my shortening it’s case. I think it’s personally one of the few 6.5mm’s that are extremely “limited”, in terms of loading it for performance. That’s not to say it can’t be done, but one must be good @ reloading & have more skills than the average home hand loader. As always thank you for your straightforward reviews & wish you well and all the luck for this upcoming hunting season. Thank you!
I can also say that the 6.8 western probably does a lot better in the wind. I'd put wind deflection above drop at ranges. I have never needed more than a .308 myself, so I don't have a horse in this race.
bc is always changing as a bullet moves through the atmosphere. its a fools errand chasing BC. but ppl like to be parted with their money. So tbe industry will always market something different.
I purchased a Browning a-bolt in .270 WSM many years ago and at that time I didn't know much about that particular cartridge. The main reason I purchased it was that it was on the rack as a used but never fired rifle and the price was right. A local doctor had purchased the rifle to take on a African safari trip then returned the next day to trade it for the .300 WSM. To my surprise when I came to pick up the rifle after my 10 day waiting period (California) they also gave me two boxes of Failsafe ammo and leupold bases and rings still in the package! As a hand loader I've really enjoyed the .270 WSM it's all the rifle I will ever need. I currently shoot the Barnes 129gr lrx because of the NON-LEAD bs that Cali makes you shoot. But that bullet performs very well and is very accurate too.
Thank you for your well thought out and knowledgable videos. I am 67 years old and am totally new to rifle shooting and rifle care. Last summer (2021) while visiting my uncle out in Montana, he decided to give me his dad's (my granddad's) deer rifle. It was interesting, but had this weird side loading magazine. I was traveling around the country for the summer and went from Montana all the way to New England. (I live in Alabama.) I was touristing and while in MA I decided to visit the Springfield Armory NP. Lo and behold as I'm walking around looking at exhibits, I see an exhibit that had my granddads rifle in it! Turns out my uncle gave me my granddad's 30-40 Krag Jorgensen rifle (actually it is the carbine type). When I took another look at my granddad's rifle, I saw it had a stamp on it for JSA 1902. Needless to say I was kind of excited. But I also wanted to see if I could use the carbine (a couple of videos showed me it is a carbine), so I started YouTubing for videos on how to care for rifles. I have watched your videos on how to clean and care for rifles and have followed very carefully how to do it since I'm brand new to caring for guns. I managed to find a manufacturer that is still making 30-40 Krag ammo and I was able to get some. I took the Krag out to the range last week and put 20 rounds down range. As a newbie I was able to get a grouping of about 5" at 25 yds for all 20 rds. Someone (my granddad or
I always enjoy your videos. I think I recall in one of your videos you mentioned being an MP in Vietnam. My father was in the 23rd MP company Duc Pho 1968-1969. God Bless you sir!
I have high reguards for your knowledge and ability to convey it to me and others . God bless you and your family and Benny . Always a pleasure Sir . Thank you .
As you mentioned, faster twist rates are required to stabilize longer bullets. Where I see another advantage with the 6.8 Western would be when loading copper alloy bullets. It will probably push a 150 grain one at the same velocity as a 130 grainer in a 270 Win. You would probably have the same penetration as the 175 factory load. I think that's the next load they should offer in the 6.8 Western. As you know, lead free bullets are significantly longer than cup and core and will probably eventually be required. This is where the 6.8 Western will have an advantage. That's if it hangs on long enough for them to support it better.
I love all copper in my muzzleloader as they are devestating without risk of blowing up on impact causing lost injured game. The petals turn razor sharp hemorrhage creators just like a broadhead creating a quick ethical harvest. I am not sure how they act in high powered rifles but penetration will be there.
I think the 270 is iconic and still totally relevant for a reason. If 270 wasn't enough and I needed more horsepower I go with it 3006. The biggest problem I see with the 6.8 Western is Hornady and nosler are not choosing to adopt it. I think currently the only ammunition for it is Winchester. I think there's many other choices in the same ballistic range as the 6.8 Western with much more aftermarket support. Like 6.5 PRC 280 Remington 280 Remington AI 7 mm Magnum 3006 + + there's many other great options. Thank you 👍
All these new cartridges have done is double the cost. And make it harder to find ammo in their new offerings. I wonder if the marketing team finds out, rifle sales plummet due to no ammo available. Legacy hunting rifles are now marked up 400% on GunBroker now. 25/06 been on the shelf for a long time up here in AK. New shooters stick with the old school cartridges, don't get sucked into the hype.
@@ValcoBayrunner Definitely agree 👍. I think a classic 3006 can do just about anything you want in North America including Alaska where you're at. I lived in Alaska for 7 and 1/2 years and I thought I needed the biggest baddest thing and I bought a 300 weatherby Magnum. Big mistake it's a great cartridge but it's really more than I needed and I couldn't shoot it accurately to be honest. I ended up buying a 3006 H& R and I could shoot it super accurate I can hold three to five inch groups all day with it at 300 yards. And I used it for moose caribou sheep everything I mainly shot factory Nosler 165 grain partitions and it did the trick no matter what. Thank you 👍
@@r3tr0sp3ct3r I can't disagree the 3006 is very versatile and flat if you drop down to 150s. I always used 165 grain partition nosler when I lived in Alaska It was a great compromise. Probably not as good as 180s for moose but every moose I ever shot with 165 dropped in its tracks. Thank you 👍
I'm a 270 "nut", as it was my first rifle and my favorite cartridge. However, I bought a 6.8 Westen and personally feel it is what the 270 WSM was always meant to be. I love the heavy for caliber bullets and my factory Browning rifle is lights out accurate with the factory 175 gr. Sierra Tipped Game kings. I have 165 Accubonds, 160 gr. Partitions and all the 130 gr. Bullets I have loaded for years in my 270 Win to experiment with. I have lots of brass and components that I will be working up loads with in the 6.8 and cany wait to get it out in the field o. Elk and big mulies and long range whitetails.
Reading your post was exactly how I felt. I love all .277 calibers! So the 6.8 Western was intriguing to me. I hunt in canyon areas out west, so it had a lot of appeal. Well, I couldn’t be happier with my 6.8 Western. I purchased a Christiansen And Ridgline FFT that only weighs 5.3 pounds. Once I got it broken in, the accuracy has been outstanding. I have ordered my ammunition from Pendleton Ammunition and from Choice Ammunition. Both have quality ammo for the 6.8 Western with the 165 grain Nosler Accubond as my favorite. Happy hunting
Enjoyed the discussion. Was able to follow the various wgts and velocities. Suggest you consider a visual table. So the figures are up for a few moments. Perhaps an erasable white board, off to one side. Would allow time for pondering the variables. Listening and seeing the info reinforces understanding and learning. Thanks for the review. 🤔
I'll stick with my 270 wsm. Once the barrel shoots out, or sooner if I get impatient, I'll swap a faster twist barrel on and load these now available heavier bullets for the .277
I've hunted with the 270 Winchester for many years, and have taken many animals, before I started loading my own rounds I used the Winchester silver tip ammo. I load my own rounds now and I really like Nosler, the partition, ballistic tip, and ballistic silver tips all work well for me.
Where have you been all my life? I stumbled on your channel going down the 35 Whelen rabbit hole. Your videos are captivating and so informative, and remind me of the America I love. God bless you always, sir.
Fantastic VDO - I admire the no bashing or waving of pennants. I like you brought about the fact the 6.5 Creedmoor fits in an AR-10 magazine. That was the impetus for me purchasing an AR-10 in 6.5 CR and a Mauser chambered in 6.5 CR. Barnes VOR-TX 127 GR will be tested in short order.
You raise a lot of good points. I think the current industry focus on long sectional density bullets is shooters turned off to the hot magnums that were such a focus of the mid-late twentieth century, both for expense of ammo and heavy recoil, and expense of the firearm itself, and sometimes destruction of meat with those high velocity rounds at close ranges. But what has kept me on the fence is the limited range of chamberings, and particularly bullet weights. I'd actually begun to wonder if the fast twist rates just made it nonviable for accuracy with the light bullets or pushing light bullets with the full powder load on those necked down cartridges burned out the fast twist rifling too fast, but you raise an interesting point about manufacturers not wanting to compete with their other loads. Unfortunately, that also reduces the attractiveness of these new "do everything" high sectional density cartridges, at least to me as a consumer. Always appreciate the content and your eye to history, and particularly your insights as a reloader, an area I'm not particularly knowledgeable myself.
For the last 3 years. I’ve been building my own rifles. I love listening to the older generation. I abuse my rifles. Push them hard. Fire back to back. Targets. I use the same rifle to hunt. I find that you. And the real gunsmith are way more accurate to what I see then these newer guys. Thanks for the info.
Love your content! It is the best honest channel on YT! I am rebarreling my .270win right now(the barrel is done) in a 1:8 twist. I would like to state with the worn out barrel and chamber I could safely shoot 130gr SGK with IMR4350 @ 3400fps! So maybe I will give those heavy bullets a go. Only shooting the plains here in sunny South Africa. 250-500yard shots but taken from very stable platforms. Thanks again for the great advice.
Speaking of the Hodgdon 2022 reloading manual, they also don't have the parent cartridge of the 6.8 Western - the 270 WSM. In this part of the West., the 270 WSM is far from obsolete. There's a whole list of missing cartridges in addition to the .257 Roberts, including the .44 special. ??? They're coming out with new temp-sensitive, non-fouling powders, but leave handloaders hanging. ??? Someone was asleep at the wheel when Hodgdon printed this latest offering. Thanks GB, for yet another solid review.
Well said. I've got my old 270. When I started to get the 6.5 bug, I looked at the books and saw it wasn't doing much more than what the 270 was doing- for my uses. Not knocking 6.5- just saying newest and best is fun but not always needed if you've already got that niche filled.
And I just picked up a Remington 700 257 Roberts 1970 collectors edition from a buddy of mine. It’s only ever been fired at the factory, he got it off a friend and I offered him a little more then he paid, it’s a beautiful fire arm!! I like normal cartridges but but I also like the odd balls as well.
Good discussion. Agree with your comments on realistic range. I've tried 6.5x55 140 grains, liked it a lot. Loved .270s but never bought one. Always thought 264 and 270 were too close to declare one better than the other. I've realized barrel length and speed don't matter much. Precision, projectile type and grain size matters much more to me. Nor does a flatter trajectory matter now, as with an LRF, anyone can dial a precision correction, plus many scopes now have a ballistic calculator and memories for rifles + rounds. Plus recoil and muzzle-jump are so much easier to manage now. As a result I settled on using a short and light .308 rifle. Short barrel with a still fast 110 grain, 168 to 175 grain for larger, or 190 grain subsonic (but no suppressor). This covers it all. I prefer 130 grain monolithic coppers and use a barrel tuner--excellent precision and more than enough killing power. It's that range of projectile grain sizes and projectile types, plus a wide velocity range that means far more to me than the caliber does. Why would I walk away from that easy to obtain flexibility? So I have no attraction to other calibres. I far more appreciate having all that, within a light carbine-sized rifle.
Yes Sir! Your Pet Peeve is VALID! I have Loved .260 Remington since it gained SAAMI approval. I have watched it succumb to Big Money Marketing after Hornady launched the 6.5 Creedmore. First it was Hornady that scaled back production on any .260 offerings, then I noticed published loading data from "Reputable" companies actually started to change...in favor of the Creedmore. We're all suckers for MARKETING on some level. In recent Rifle cartridge History, Nosler was the first to try to re-create the wheel by offering a full line of Calibers that are all just a bit better than the average for every bullet weight. It was Weatherby who originally Capitalized on this marketing scheme. Now most recently, Hornady has offered calibers that do nothing better than anything on the market...but supposedly have a "better, more efficient" case design. All these schemes are simply companies trying to get a piece of the market share.
Greetings, I am so glad that I stumbled upon you sir. I am in the process of getting my PAL in Ontario and am watching every one of your videos. Thank you for doing what you do. I am learning so much from you. Kind regards from Ontario, Dave
I’ve been waiting for you to do this video!!! Just looked it’s an hour long… awesome! But I’m going to have to watch it tomorrow when I get time on my drive to work.
Enjoyable analysis! Thank you. Space is precious in my gun safe. Also, another specialized round is little interest to me as it would drain resources from my more regular standard hunting guns and gear. I will be passing on this offering. Personally speaking, I see a grievous error happening in the gun manufacturers market. They are spreading their resources way to thin on these specialized guns and gear when supplies for the regular standard guns and gear cannot be met. Just my observation and opinion!
My memory of the .270 Win factory velocities is somewhat different from what you stated. Yes, it started out as a 130 grain at 3130, or 3150, or 3160 fps (sources disagree) and Jack O'Connor's loads may even have exceed this. But manufacturers realized that they were overdoing things a bit and the velocity was eventually dropped to 2990 fps and stayed that way for many decades. In the 1990s, Federal's Superformance line lead a new endeavor into higher velocities and boutique manufacturers followed. Eventually the big manufacturers raised the velocity to 3060 fps and that's where it sits now. With new powders it is possible to exceed 3200 fps, at least in my rifle.
I enjoy the way you do simple factual comparisons. The way I see it, if I already own a Lamborghini I’m not buying a new model for 10 more Hp and slightly better aerodynamics. If I didn’t already own one why not at least consider the shinny new one. Great video.
Thanks for your analysis , I just bought a Browning X 2 Speed: I've had it for one week, and have taken 4 deer, and two coyotes with it. All shots have been with factory loads with 175 grain Sierra bullets, and ranges have been between 30 and 275 yards. You are correct there is no big advantage with light bullets, but I for one don't want to shoot light bullets anyway, I have a 270 WCF as well and have taken many deer with the 130 grain bullets with that rifle. I can tell you there is less meat damage with the 6.8 with the 175's I can also tell you that recoil is less because of the muzzle brake it wears. Shooting it without hearing protection with that brake would be a bad deal, so I do not do it, nor do I shoot any rifles without protection any more. All in all I would buy the 6.8 every time over the 270 wcf because of its increased versatility.
Just found your channel and have been watching ever since. I enjoy the talks and instructional videos as well. It's kind of like the talks I have with my friends. Thank you.
My guns of choice that make sense to have are: .22LR, 12 gauge shotgun, .22-250 w/60 grain bullet, 25-06 w/100 grain bullet, .270 w/ 140 grain bullet and 30-06 w/180 grain bullet. These will easily take anything in North America and Alaska. There is a BIG difference between HUNTING and BENCH SHOOTING!!!
The reason I bought a WSM was I appreciated having a slightly shorter rifle for some of the locations I hunt. Most of the friends and relatives I hunt with are using the good old 270 Winchester and I've yet to hear a single deer complain about being shot by either.
I like that ammo and rifle manufacturers like Western and Browning are interested in bringing out a new caliber that might be highly specialized in terms of the type of game one wants to hunt. But, in all honesty, any rifle chambered in .308 WIN will take down nearly all North American game animals with the right ammo and excellent shot placement. Yes, .270 WIN and .30-06 Springfield will also work for most hunters, but I just like the fact that we do get new caliber hunting and/or target rounds just to spice up life. I hope the 6.8 Western does catch on if only to add some variety for those buying hunting and/or target rifles. Yes, you're right: The advantage for using the 6.8 Western is the heavier bullets that would have greater BC numbers and obviously create somewhat larger wounds than a standard .270 WIN hunting round. Thanks for the videos!
AMEN. I'm a big believer in sticking to something that's been around and proven and put to the test for YEARS..... Why change.... 243...3030...308...270...3006....300........these guys have been here for years and Proven... Why change to a odd ball high dollar ammo caliber..... GREAT Video... Thank You. And GOD Bless
Im a firm believer in tried and true cartridges, but... with your logic, why did we ever stop using horse and buggy, or steam engines? The black and white tv's did the job? Technology advances, and room for improvement shows, knowledge gets deeper and deeper. Why sit on 60 year old tech just because it works? Thats where new cartridges have their place, they fill gaps traditional carts didnt. People like less recoil, flatter shots, paper punching, less deflection etc. And the market serves thaf up to the consumer. I used to dismiss the latest and greatest cartridges, whats wrong with .243 right? Well if a person actually shoots something beyond that lone 243 they own theyd see there is room for impovement. Whether it be for hunting, or for target. Staying hung up on traditional cartridges and dismissing higher bc, lower recoil, flatter shooting rounds because "my .308's been killin deer every year since 1974" is just insane. Support improvement in the firearms industry!! But go ahead and kerp your traditionals, they are tried and true, no doubt!! But are they the best? Not after 40 years of technology advancement. Its just what it is.
@@whiskerbiscuit99 Do you always call people who have a different opinion "insane"? Why don't you stop trying to brow beat people who are perfectly happy shooting what they like? That's their right.
@@alanhigh8125 i called nobody insane. Im not into name calling. Name calling is childish. I stated that i thought passing off new tech because old tech worked is insane. And just as anyone making comments here, its pure opinion. Open for dialogue. And to double down on your statement again. I never said someone cant shoot what they prefer... hell i used to be traditional. If i cant call out someone ragging on other methods, practices, products, then how is it you give someone a pass for hacking in the first place? Hmm double standard much? Nobodys gonna take your .308 away, nobody wants it, and if they do have it, its collecting dust, waiting to be needed. Chill.
Great video as usual. The .270 Winchester is still an incredible cartridge as it approaches 100 years old. Anyone who is a reloader needs to look into the 140 grain bullets. Look at the Hornady interlock 140 grain btsp. Run the ballistics on that bullet at 3,000 fps which is pretty easy to get and it’s just an incredible load for the old .270.
Love your videos, fun to watch very informative. One of these days I would like to find a 270 possibly with iron sights to put see through scope mounts on for close quick shots in the woods, last season I was sneaking through the woods in the rain to sit in my spot and had 5 deer run right to me all within 50 yds 4 does and a buck I had my scoped 300 win mag. Looked at them but wasn’t able to take a shot at any of them, lil too much gun for the thick cover I was hunting+ it’s public so you never know where other hunters are. 3030 and 35 Remington would be better in those areas occasionally I have 200 to 250 yd shots where a 270 would be nice. Also looking at the 360 Buckhammer and 400 legend since I do hunt straight walled only areas too. So many options out there fun to know there capabilities strengths and weaknesses hard to make one cartridge do everything, Videos like yours definitely help deciding
One thing to consider is the available magazine length for reliable feeding. The .270 Winchester and .270 WSM can't seat those long heavy bullets and maintain adequate COAL for most commercially available rifles without seating the bullet back into the powder column. Even with a faster twist barrel this is still a limitation unless single loading. I've run into this with my Remington 700 CDLSF in 270 WSM. I have a load for 150gr Berger VLD and it's at it's limit. Much like the 6.5 Creedmoor's design I think this is a similar feature of the 6.8 Western's design with it's bumped back shoulder and longer neck that the 270 WSM doesn't offer.. same situation with the long action rifles commercially available in the 270 Winchester. I've had great satisfaction with this caliber loaded to a conservative 3000 fps but I can also verify as you say; "it's not a plinker." Thanks for this video.
@@cbsbass4142 Throat is rarely the limitation with bullet selection. It's almost always the magazine length in a factory rifle that's limited to the COAL (Cartridge Overall Length) set out by SAAMI it's designed around. Historically rifle manufacturers design their rifles and magazines around this universal blueprint for the most reliable feeding of factory ammunition and bullet weight selections that are typical for that cartridge; rarely do they consider hand loaders. On a separate note, while it's good to find JAM or where the bullet's ogive engages the rifling as a starting point, if you can't, don't worry about it. Start with the farthest out you can seat and run your bullet seating tests to find your accuracy nodes; all things being equal your pressures will only drop as the bullet backs out of the throat. I have a Weatherby MKV deluxe in 257 Wby mag for example, and the bullet is almost falling out of the case mouth before it engages the rifling and yet, with the proper loads will shoot sub MOA @ 100yds any day of the week.
@@ironDsteele That's what I figure too so I'll check my mag length (fit) with my dummy rounds even before backing off the lands which seem way out there, based on my OAL gauge. If they wont fit the mag, and I like the 5 round mag, I'm not going to load them. I mean its these Hornady 150 gr SSTs, that are plenty long so they're seated well down in the case all the way to the shoulder. They do fit the mag I see, just barely-- but I'll be seating them a wee but deeper, just for reliable feeding. Got a couple boxes: Hot Cor speer (both BTSP and Hot core flat base) in 130 gr, Hornady SST in 150, so, being without a chrono, we have ourselves a project. :)
This video was exactly what I needed. I grew up on 30-30 but switched to 270 win after letting more walk than I cared to admit at 250 to 300 yards. Filled my freezer many times on the tried and true. I'm planning to buy a suppressor this year for hunting, and figured I'd rather buy a new rufle with threaded barrel as host than have my pencil barrel threaded. I have been looking at all the options, and was waffling between a few. I liked the extra grain weight with the Western, and was considering going with that, but I'm hesitant to have to stock another cartridge. After listening to this, knowing 95% of my shooting is white tail (unless I get one of Virginia's elusive elk tags), I think I can eliminate the Western as a choice. Now I'm still waffling on the two big 6.5s, 308, and 270.
Thanks, for your educated analysis. I share your opinion on hunting game within reasonable distances. There is nothing better than getting within 35 to 40 yards of big game and respectfully harvesting the animal. Keep up the good work.
I've had my 6.8 western for going on a year. No complaints. Took a nice cow at 300 with the 175gr Sierra TGK. Looking forward to my handloads. This round is perfect.
So will be the next round in about 2 or 3 years. All of the best cartridges to fill in any gap were done almost a century ago. These things are all replicating ballistics found in older cartridges.
@@cchcch-jw9dw I disagree. My 6.8 Western can outshoot my 270. It has greater energy down range due to the heavier bullets. It deflects wind better. It penetrates better, especially at longer ranges. My 270 Winchester drops below 1,800 ft lbs of energy at 350 yards. My 6.8 Western doesn’t drop below that till it passes 550 yards, almost 600. Yes, I can duplicate those energy levels with an older cartridge, but they are using more powder to accomplish those numbers. The Western uses bullet design instead of using the largest casing it can stuff into a long action chamber. The 6.8 does it in a short action and with less felt recoil. Those two things alone help improves accuracy. Point is, the 6.8 Western can do the exact same thing a 7mm REM Mag can do, and it does it better at longer ranges. Technically, you’re still correct, but for real life applications, I’ll take the 6.8 Western. I own both, and I prefer shooting and hunting with the 6.8 Western over all my other cartridges. I’ve been hunting for over 40 years, and I love my classics. A 40 year old car that’s been well maintained will still get you from places to place. A newer car can do it as well, but with more comfort, and better fuel economy. Are you still driving your grandpa’s truck? Didn’t think so
Thank you Sir as always for your shared wisdom. I've been researching my first hunting rifle for about a year now. And I am considering 6.8 Western as I live in southern New Mexico (from Dallas Texas) and it seems like a good round for the game locally. The only bolt action I own is an old Mosin Nagant and I haven't had any issues with recoil so I think this would be doable if I end up going that route
I love your content. Thanks for doing it. I'm new to hand loading and your channel is a wealth of information. What I find most valuable is the manner in which you give instruction. For lack of a better way of putting it it's like being an apprentice. Every step is explained in detail. While other channels kind of gloss over details as if it's common knowledge. For someone new to things like me it's very reassuring to get very clear and concise instruction on the terminology, processes, and order of operations. Once more you're greatly appreciated. God bless and thank you.
I don’t need a new 6.8Western, what I do need is someone to start producing and getting ammo for the guns I have. Ammo companies please start putting out some cartridges like the 32 Win Special, 7mm Rem Mag, 308 Win, and 357 Mag etc. (this may be a local issue here in Saskatchewan maybe everyone else can find it) Once I have that ammo, maybe I would look at a new rifle and cartridge. Great video!
Anyway, I am using your cleaning methods each time I come back from the range. Thank you for your detailed instruction videos. BTW the Krag shoots just fine, even though it is 120 yrs old now.
I look at things this way that most all hunting takes place at 400 yards and under. There is hunting and then there is sniping. So at 400 yards and under, the 270 Win has all the energy it needs to take elk, deer, sheep, antelope, since 1925. It was engineered right. I don't need a 6.8 Western or 270 WSM. The 270 Win is all I need and works as designed.
I was also very disappointed with the Hodgdon 2022 annual manual. Maybe us old guys aren't their target audience anymore. Lots of good info on their powders but no loads listed for the 7x57,8x57, 7.5x54 MAS, 7.5 Swiss or my 35 Whelen. I know it's all available on line but this was the first manual I have purchased in years and I was expecting the basic cartridges to be covered. Thank you for another great video. Wish you and your family the best. Off topic, my son recently moved to Weare, NH and I think of you every time I drive down that way.
I would like to add that a 2 MOA rifle has a much greater chance of sucess in real hunting conditions at 300 yards than a 1 MOA rifle does at 500 yards. Sub MOA rifles are still very much desired if the user is going to occasionally use his big game rifle for coyotes or prairie dogs but more than that a psychological benefit of confidence. There is no equipment available that will tell the sportsman all the wind conditions at long range. There may not even be time to get the bipod setup. I have seen people being successful at long range but you never hear about the gut shot game or the ones that got their nose or lower jaw blown off.
@Craig Sanford Very true, most guns outshoot their owners. Any group over 1 MOA at under 200 yards disappoints me; but I shoot to reload, not the other way around. That being said, my hunting rifle rarely shoots under 1 MOA and, as a result, it rarely shoots paper. It does, however, shoot meat effectively; a 35 year old A-bolt .308 with a Tasco Scope on top of it. 1 lost animal in those 35 years.
That's actually not true, there are scintilometers and laser crosswind measurement devices that provide firing solutions for complex wind conditions. Your analysis also doesn't make much sense, the premise is wrong. People taking long range shots (who are competent) aren't shooting 1MOA rigs, they're sub 1/2 and likely 1/4 MOA. This isn't 1990; modern manufacturing has changed the hardware game. People who shoot long range look at 600yd as a chip shot, and yes in unknown wind conditions. While there are other factors that make such a shot on living targets a bad idea, the ability to make the shot itself is there in spades. For the shooters who aren't up to the task, well, they shouldn't be shooting game at any range until they are, don't care if it's 600 yards or 40 from a tree stand. Further, discussion of "groups" with hunting rifles is bizarre. How many shots are you taking against that game that you need a tight group? The real measure is cold bore point of impact matching point of aim, across the intended usable range.
@@silvermediastudio There are high dollar lidar systems used in the wind farms and possibly NAVY, but can you provide a link to a system available to the sportsman? Same with the scintillometers? Without a precise solution for wind it is just a guess. A better guess can be had by observing mirage effects of wind every 50 yards or so and totaling it up but still a guess negating some of the exceptional accuracy at long range we can expect today. You are absolutely right about the cold bore shot being most important however your presumptuousness is on display here. Many people let the barrels cool between shots and make sure the barrel is fouled before hunting. One final note, a properly maintained rifle of yesteryear gives up little to todays rifles. On average I think there has been enough pressure on manufacturers to make better rifles and ammunition because of the reviewers on the internet, but again in real world hunting conditions it hits the law of diminishing returns for benefit. In conclusion, extreme distance regardless of technology will at some point become unethical for all shooters regardless of skill level.
@@silvermediastudio For the $8000 price it will get you 5 readings out to 500 yards. For me this is long range but many are shooting well beyond this. I am impressed they got the size of that unit as small as they did. I admit to being ignorant of its existence as well. I still stand by my statement " There is no equipment available that will tell the sportsman all the wind conditions at long range". 100 yard increments are not enough for a unit most hunters can not afford anyway. It would not change how I hunt but possibly with future improvements it can extend ethical shooting ranges and cost may come down to within affordable range and give 50 yard increments. Thank you.
Honest, thorough, common sense discussion from a man whose not trying to sell us something. Not nearly enough guys like Gun Blue around! 👍
Not nearly enough, indeed. He has spent a life of service to the community and all he wants this channel to be is a portal for his gifts to further help the community. I call it selfless integrity. You don't find it much anymore.
In time memorium no less. I sit in awe and learn, and check my ego. This is the teacher Dad/Grandpa we all need. I would had Hickok 45 to that list.
I agree
Not trying to sell anything.. he is trying to say that his opinion is the only one we should be listening to.. he' thinks he's a gun God..
Not saying he's not knowledgeable, but it only an opinion.. and that is my opinion.
@@ralphyoung9296I couldn’t disagree with you more. I’ll just leave it at that.
I'm 61 years old my dad was a Korean war combat Marine you remind me of some of his friends as a boy I used to love to listen to these guys I'm sure you're a bit older than I am I like your UA-cam channel and I am subscribed you're a wealth of knowledge this old army veteran appreciates it be safe and be well thank you sir
Thank you for your service. God bless.
@@GunBlue490 I appreciate that sir again thanks for your channel I really enjoy it immensely God bless you and yours good evening from the West Coast
@@Sako75.7mm08 what are you thinking or what are you saying. I just don’t understand! I don’t want to sound like and a ass hole but l don’t get it.
@@Sako75.7mm08 with a suppressor...5 deer? meh...shooting fish in a barrel. considering..you only get two tags, an then one doe if the county says its ok.
He’s what a man is supposed to be.
Discussing the pros and cons of various cartridges is a time honored tradition around the hunting camp fire. Not surprising is that various hunters extoll the virtues of their own rifle's chambering. Where I live in north central British Columbia, moose and mule deer are No. 1 name of the game. Black bear, elk, caribou, mountain sheep and goats are also on the menu.
Not knowing anything about hunting or cartridges, the first rifle I acquired was a bolt action in .270 Win. I could have stopped there but a few years later, wanting something with a bit more oomph, I got a bolt action in .300 Win Mag. This was followed by a bolt action in .243 Win. As far as big game in my neck of the woods, I've got it covered. Back when grizzly hunting in BC was allowed, I got yet another bolt action in .375 H&H.
For reducing the population of coyotes on local farms and ranches, a heavy barreled .22-250 was added. While I do most of my grouse hunting with a 20 gauge, I occasionally use my .22 LR.
Any one of those centrefires could be replaced with something similar and I would be just as well served. (.30-06 for the .270, 7mm Rem Mag for the .300 Win Mag, .257 Roberts for the .243 Win etc.) For any game animal there is no such thing as the 'perfect cartridge'. A wide variety will get the job done. That said, it's still fun to pretend to be the best judge of cartridges while around that campfire.
G'day from Australia. I agree with you. People get too caught up in hype about effectiveness of calibres on game and forget that the shooter is the main factor. Thank you sir, for your insight.
I keep thinking of Backfire when you speak of those 500 yard guys. If you can’t kill within 300 yards then hang it up. Fred Bear did it at 20 yards
Bingo! Bowhunters call, stalk, conceal, wait. They hunt, instead of pretending to be military snipers shooting at a terrorist 500 yards away. Get close and shoot straight!
I know your post is older but I like your statement.I have come to the conclusion that the whole" sniper"mentality has entered the hunting world. Give me a flat based , pointed soft point, or round that will mushroom decently and you have a good deer round.
Thanks for the common-sense unvarnished assessment of the 6.8 Western. Over the years, (seventy years of shooting) I've had several magnums, including the 270 WSM, 300 WSM, and lots of standard 30s and 7 mm rifles. I also have tried the very new 6.5 PRC, and shot it head-to-head with a 270 Win. for several years, until I realized that when using all-copper bullets, they are virtually the same ballistically - including B.C.! I am also a hand-loader. Currently, I am using a 270 Win. for everything from antelope to elk. I really WANT to buy another rifle, just for the fun of it, but not because I can find anything that is functionally better in any way, so I am saving my money. It's almost impossible to fault the old 270 Win. For you new hunters, especially, this cartridge is everything you could want: flat-shooting, insanely accurate, has plenty of power, readily available and relatively inexpensive ammunition, and very manageable recoil. Jack O'Connor was right!
Thanks for your valued input!
These videos are better than anything on TV. Great wealth of knowledge.
I admit when the 6.8 Western was first announced I got goose bumps and wanted to buy a rifle really bad. Of course it was during the middle of the pandemic so inventory was nowhere to be found. Now two years later I am less enamored about the cartridge for the same reasons you explained in the video. To me the 6.8 Western is like the 280 Ackley. It's a neat invention and it might be nice to own a rifle chambered for it but it doesn't do anything for me that my 270 Win, 7 mm Rem Mag or 300 Win Mag can't do already. The latter three cartridges cover just about anything I could ever want to do for big game hunting out west because I simply won't shoot out past 400 yards. For whitetail hunting in the eastern woods of north America I will grab my 308 Winchester every time. Thanks for sharing the video!
Very well put. 👍
@@nmelkhunter1
same for me...308 for lr..30 30 for brush country...but the 45 70 is peaking my interest now.
I just ordered a 6.8 Western. I really like the short action. Thank you for your common sense analysis.
You speak the facts ! I bought into the snake oil of the 270 wsm with model 70 super grade when it first came out. nice rifle, very accurate, but zero no ammo available, nor reloading brass now. The old 270 win is just as accurate, cheaper ammo and no notable difference in killing big game in Alaska, ammo is every where right now. The model 70 super grade 270 wsm is a safe queen with no new new brass, nor ammo available in this country. I am thinking about rebarreling the rifle. Thank you for keeping folks informed.
1 year later it's plenty ammo out there I have bought 140 accubonds n 150ablr from nosler 140 gr tsx 130gr copper impacts 140gr tip strike 145gr eldx and 130cx 150gr power points and 130gr power shok when last year all I could find was copper impacts
Good wisdom Sir! Love my .270's (Remington 721 & 700 BDL), both have taken too many deer to count. Flat shooting, hard hitting and accurate as hell. Jack O'Connor had it right.
After this last review I’ve watched about the 6.8 Western, I’ve finally made up my mind. I will be ordering my new rifle in 6.8 Western. If even these most experienced, veteran skilled and cartridge knowledgeable experts like Blue can say that the 6.8 Western is an excellent cartridge with very high potential then that’s all I need to make my decision. If I already owned a .270 Winchester then maybe I wouldn’t but because I’m in the market for purchasing a .277 caliber why not choose the 6.8 Western because of its range of options all throughout the bullet weight and range of BC. Thank you Blue for giving me all the information I needed to make my decision. I always respect your point of view on these issues.
I'd buy a reloading kit and a bunch of brass...because that cartridge might not be around for very long!
The rifles are sorta hard to find what model are you gonna get?
@@Master...deBater Pretty much. It will likely go the way of the .270 WSM...just a has been.
@@austinreddick1875 picked up a browning xbolt a couple days ago
@@cbsbass4142 Has been?
I love mine. She's a keeper.
Such a pleasure to listen to common sense display of information, well done. It’s great to air out the outhouse with a breath of fresh air. And you my friend are just that, a breath of fresh air. Take care
You are a Great Guru to me and I greatly appreciate the knowledge you share.
God bless you and your family.
After I got my Breakfast and coffee, I sat down and opened my Google/UA-cam and was pleasantly surprised to see this new video. Thank You so much for this. As a traditionalist I love these comparison studies and I trust you to be honest. And now I will watch the rest of it.
Been shooting the .270 with 140 grain Hornady Interlock's for 15 years. Love it and have never lost a deer out to 400 yards on numerous occasions. Great round.
The .270 Win and those 140 grain bullets are a fantastic combination! I reload and shoot that same bullet in my .270.
B. Z.,
Those 140 grain bullets are the cat's meow in the .270 Win.
@@fjb4932 They sure are a fantastic combination.
I have been listening to you for a few years silently. Really enjoy your videos. I appreciate your wisdom and knowledge and learned a lot from you. Your one of the best out there, at least on youtube.
Thank you, God bless.
And also with you!
I have a Browning 1885 in 270 win. The 28” barrel takes the 270 to new heights.
I have chronographed Hornady 143 gr. ELDX at 3050fps, with no pressure issues.
That is enough for me, and likely anything I will ever shoot here in MT.
Thanks for the reality check, and rationale behind this video.
Good job!
I do see the merits of the 6.8 Western bullet weight that is available and agree completely. But I still think that I will stick with my dear 270 Winchester. One of the most commercially available, flattest shooting, and most accurate cartridges in my gun safe. I love the 270 as you do Captain and and the hunting situations that would cause the Westerner to excel would only cause me to step over to my 30-06 which is also very commercially available. I enjoy listening to your pragmatic perspectives on issues like these as I always do!
I believe I'll stick to the 270 also. I may try to build a custom 270 with a faster twist barrel and hand load the heavier bullets. Thinking 1 in 8 twist 24 to 26 inch barrel.
I would favor that idea above the 6.8 Western, if I needed the bullet length/weight if for no other reason than cost. Those western rounds. By the time you buy the rifle, dies (and other reloading items), and any high-priced factory ammo you'd probably be happier with your decision. Plus, the recoil is more manageable, as the captain pointed out. And I like to build too. But here in Texas Hill Country our deer are smaller than many of the other hunting zones. Rounds between 243 and 270 are plenty for these animals.
@@travissmith-wz5nc not trying to discourage you but at that point why not go with the Western?
@@borkwoof696 Because it's questionable whether it will even be around in ten years. As a 300 Win Mag shooter...I remember when all the writers said the 300 WSM and RUM would dethrone the WM! 20+ years later the WM is still the king. I bet in another 20 years all these new fangled cartridges will be gone...and the old tried and true cartridges will still be going strong. It's all hype and marketing by the manufacturers to sell more rifles.
@@Master...deBater Exactly. So many cartridges come and go, some of them for good reason, others because for whatever reason no one ever took notice. I currently own a .338 Federal, absolutely love the cartridge, but it's on its death bed, and even if we ever see normal ammo supply again, I doubt the .338 Fed will even be supported by then. Not going to make that mistake again by replacing the .270 with a 6.8W, or .243 with one of the many 6mm's that have come out lately. Especially when a custom barrel with faster twist revitalizes these old cartridges anyway.
Of your commentaries cartridge lore is my favorite content. Thank you for this rationale comparison of pros, cons, and marketing mythology.
The Real Gunsmith said essentially the same thing as you in his own way after this video. It's nice to hear a concensus from educators I trust. Thank you.
Man weather I’m watching you or Peter Schiff. I watch you guys because you both stick to the numbers. Thank you for sticking to the numbers
One thing not mentioned as an advantage for the 6.8 Western is wind drift. It’s higher BC allows it to shoot straighter in the wind. It’s not hard to range a target and find the drop (gravity works equally from the muzzle to impact) but knowing what effect the wind will have over the entire distance is something that even well practiced shooters sometimes struggle with. But as the range decreases, there will be less of a difference. That in itself is a good reason to keep your shots on live game inside of 400 yards.
Maybe so but Not All Hunters have equivalent Skills.
Some can make those shots, some can't.
@@timk4502 The biggest problem is to find a place to shoot 500 yds. Very few ranges have 500 yds. If You want to go hunting somewere were it's hard to get within range. Practice helps. Forget dial in for range. Often there is no time. Experience sights you on the target at distance( A range finder helps, if you got time). Before BDC, Kentucky windage(Experience) got the game👍
Wind drift dont happen until you get out pass 500yards so these new high BC bullets are really useless at hunting range so stick with the old cals 243win 6.5swed 260rem 7mm08 270win 280rem 25-06 30-30 308 30-06 7rem mag 300win mag and so on
@@warrengreen3217
I hear what you’re saying and generally agree. At any ethical range, the wind isn’t going to be too much of an issue. But there are times when the wind isn’t just 10 MPH or so. If it’s blowing 20 MPH or more, that can make an otherwise routine shot much more challenging. I wouldn’t trade good terminal performance for a better BC but with bullets that perform similarly on game, I would prefer a better BC. And I wouldn’t trade away a trusted old school caliber just because of a potential upgrade in BC. But if I could add one to the stable, that could be interesting.
@@Dennisthemenace40 your missing the hole point at under 500 yards like 300 or 400 yards even a 40 mph wind dont have enough to blow that bullet off, 500 yards and under that bullets there in under a second its been proven wind is not a factor at them ranges
A .270 Winchester is all that and a bag of chips ! Hundreds of reasons why it is one of the greatest hunting cartridges of all time. I use a .300 wm for big game but rifles in that cal. tend to weigh more and yet still recoil enough to cause temporary blindness. My 84 year old Dad still swears by his 700 rem in .270 win. He has taken many moose, elk, brown bear, mule deer, and pronghorn. You can buy ammo EVERYWHERE ! BTW , Your 700 is absolutely BEAUTIFULL !
Thanks! Actually, it's a new Winchester Model 70.
I love all of your vids sir and have learned quite a bit from putting the time into watching your vids which are extremely interesting to me . 👍👍 I appreciate you sharing your knowledge of firearms and the history and all the aspects . I will certainly pass down the things I have learned to anyone who will listen . I prefer the wood and steel guns and rifles to pistols . Born in 70 so been shooting a while and I like to keep using what had been working for me like 30.06 amd the other rounds gun enthusiasts have grown to love over the years . 30.06, 30-30, 7 mm , 270 , 243 , .22 , 5.56 ,
You are a good man . May God bless you and your family . I hope your pup Benny is doing ok . I lost my white lab and it breaks my heart when I hear of someone losing their companion or any death for that matter . Lately things have been rough around here with my parents having surgeries and being unable to be mobile . Everything was fine last year and then all of a sudden both of them having problems and it’s been going for awhile now . I have no problem stepping up and taking care of things around the house , going to the store and doing laundry or anything for that matter for my family . I really do with you the best in everything . I can see you are a good family man .
The only time I ever felt undergunned with my 270 was my first trip to Idaho in the early 80's. Every shot was consistently well over 500 yds it was like shooting a 81mm mortar high angle hell. When I got back home a friend got me hooked on the 300wm for long range outta state work, but to me the 270 is still my favorite rifle for anything that will be 300yd shooting maybe even 400yds. Anyway I've had alot of calibers in over 50 yrs hunting but my favorite ones are the 270 and 300wm.
6.5 PRC has also shown good results at range against elk, given the proper bullet, such as a Nosler Partition or the Norma version. Less recoil and I believe less wind deflection than the 300WM but shorter barrel life. Always trade-offs.
I love your honesty and knowledge. It’s crazy how many people love “the latest and greatest”.
In the words of the late Jeff Cooper , ' Why do company's keeping bringing out new products, why to sell it to you. '
It's not always that the latest is a bad thing but the manufacturers can throw a lot of dope on the box that means very little in the real world and I'm not buying the hype. I love the tried and true proformance of cartridges that work at 200 yards and for hunting 300 absolutely tops. For long range target the 6.5 can definitely ring the bell at one mile.
@@waynecastleman1363 Well it's like 6.5 creedmore , does it do anything 260 Remington or 6.5 Swede can't do ? Sure it's has a few small inherent design feature that may benefit accuracy but overall it doesn't add much for the average shooter. The best thing most people could do is a decent bedding job , tune some handloads and get more trigger time. Accuracy issues are mostly the individual behind the trigger 90% of the time.
@@thehopperhopes6365 I agree 👍
Well researched and stated. You presented some honest facts and practical things to consider. It makes perfect sense. Thanks for sharing and God Bless.
I've been a long time subscriber to your channel, but never commented. Just want to say thank you for sharing years of knowledge, I've learned more on your channel than any other.
Thank you and God bless.
Covered a lot of ground . The general information less specific to the .270 is excellent. That’s what makes your videos so exceptional. The input you offer is particularly helpful to newer shooters and helps to give depth; even for experienced shooters.
To be able to make good evaluations and maintain proper perspective is conducive to preventing nonsense and waste. When I started taking an in depth interest to learn more about firearms,ballistics,reloading,etc., your videos answered many questions.
Good stuff as usual GUNBLUE-Thanks
You are a treasure, sir. So glad you have made your wealth of information available to us! I have been on the fence with the 6.8 and your comment about the cost of powder & recoil vs performance should be the main consideration. Your approach makes so much sense. That makes it simple.
Your knowledge is valuable and enjoy watching your videos. I have a 300 win mag it's all I have ever owned since a young man. I enjoy it and would shoot more but prices are over the top now. My wife has a youth model 243 and to me the recoil is felt more than my rifle. I have never shot a deer further than 300 yards. It has always amazed me to see my impact before recoil moves the sight picture. It's just my choice of rifle and I am not degrading anyone for what you use as long as it's ethical for the game. Thank you again and keep up the good work. God bless
300 win mag has been my favorite for a long time. I have a 270 win, and I always thought the recoil was worse than my 300 win mag. I can shoot the 300 far more accurately.
Well, Sir GunBlue490…..you’ve done it yet again! You’ve given me personally a wonderful historical & factual based on the .270 & the 6.8mm Western. Very informative & eye opening. Thank you! Also, you mentioned the 6.5 Creedmoor vs. the .260 Remington, of which I have to admit I’m a very big fan of the latter, the .260 Rem. A couple years ago (maximum), just receiving my latest issue of “Shooting Times”, I began to read the cover page & the stories & overviews of rifles & pistols. As I began to read I noticed that this particular issue contained 5-FIVE, yes 5 different stories/reviews of the 6.5 Creedmoor in the same magazine. I was perplexed to say the least but thinking of columns past, I recalled the enormous amount of articles covering the 6.5 Creedmoor. It seemed as EVERY firearm writer out there was proclaiming the Creedmoor the “End-All/Be-All”, cartridge & all others should cease production now that the Creedmoor had arrived. I do not deny it’s good points but as a fan of the .260 Rem., I couldn’t help but feel as the .260 Rem, 6.5x55mm Swede, 6.5 Grendel, 6.5 Remington Magnum, 6.5x47mm Lapua & the .264 Win Mag (& the wildcat 6.5x06’), were being deliberately overlooked by these so called writers. As I dug into the relationship between Hornady & the majority of magazines for firearms & the writers therein, I found it would be nice to have either the money $$ or the “FREE”, hunting trips to closed game ranches & Africa for dangerous game, that Hornady has spent to push their baby, the 6.5 Creedmoor as the 1 & ONLY 6.5/.264 you ever will need, end of story. Of course I’ve never read a gun writer that ever found or tested/reviewed ANY firearm they didn’t like. I did however think my irritation based on Hornady’s swooning over the gun writers & the free firearms & hunting trips was more than warranted as NONE of the current Magazines & the writers that review firearms within, NEVER compared (as you say), Apples-to-Apples comparisons against the 6.5 Creedmoor. I’ve found that out of the 3 rifles I own chambered in .260 Rem, in a Savage Model 10-Predator Max 1 w/AR-10 magazine from AICS & bedded stocks, a Remington Model 7 “Mountain Rifle”, w/Thumbhole stock & my Tikka T3 .260 “Forrest”, model will all shoot very accurately w/various different factory loads & even better with hand loads, but none of the 3 shoot the exact same primer, powder & bullet combo the exact same. I’ve heard you speak different times about the .260 Rem., and you’ve always refused to condemn it or the many other 6.5/.264’s out there. In my humble opinion Hornady only came forward with the 6.5 Creedmoor as they stood upon the shoulders of the many GIANTS that have came before them. They were one of the last or later to introduce their own 6.5mm offering & to me they actually hamstrung the cartridge by what could be used to reload for it my shortening it’s case. I think it’s personally one of the few 6.5mm’s that are extremely “limited”, in terms of loading it for performance. That’s not to say it can’t be done, but one must be good @ reloading & have more skills than the average home hand loader. As always thank you for your straightforward reviews & wish you well and all the luck for this upcoming hunting season. Thank you!
I can also say that the 6.8 western probably does a lot better in the wind. I'd put wind deflection above drop at ranges. I have never needed more than a .308 myself, so I don't have a horse in this race.
bc is always changing as a bullet moves through the atmosphere. its a fools errand chasing BC. but ppl like to be parted with their money. So tbe industry will always market something different.
I purchased a Browning a-bolt in .270 WSM many years ago and at that time I didn't know much about that particular cartridge. The main reason I purchased it was that it was on the rack as a used but never fired rifle and the price was right. A local doctor had purchased the rifle to take on a African safari trip then returned the next day to trade it for the .300 WSM. To my surprise when I came to pick up the rifle after my 10 day waiting period (California) they also gave me two boxes of Failsafe ammo and leupold bases and rings still in the package! As a hand loader I've really enjoyed the .270 WSM it's all the rifle I will ever need. I currently shoot the Barnes 129gr lrx because of the NON-LEAD bs that Cali makes you shoot. But that bullet performs very well and is very accurate too.
Thank you for your well thought out and knowledgable videos. I am 67 years old and am totally new to rifle shooting and rifle care. Last summer (2021) while visiting my uncle out in Montana, he decided to give me his dad's (my granddad's) deer rifle. It was interesting, but had this weird side loading magazine. I was traveling around the country for the summer and went from Montana all the way to New England. (I live in Alabama.) I was touristing and while in MA I decided to visit the Springfield Armory NP. Lo and behold as I'm walking around looking at exhibits, I see an exhibit that had my granddads rifle in it! Turns out my uncle gave me my granddad's 30-40 Krag Jorgensen rifle (actually it is the carbine type). When I took another look at my granddad's rifle, I saw it had a stamp on it for JSA 1902. Needless to say I was kind of excited. But I also wanted to see if I could use the carbine (a couple of videos showed me it is a carbine), so I started YouTubing for videos on how to care for rifles. I have watched your videos on how to clean and care for rifles and have followed very carefully how to do it since I'm brand new to caring for guns. I managed to find a manufacturer that is still making 30-40 Krag ammo and I was able to get some. I took the Krag out to the range last week and put 20 rounds down range. As a newbie I was able to get a grouping of about 5" at 25 yds for all 20 rds. Someone (my granddad or
I always enjoy your videos. I think I recall in one of your videos you mentioned being an MP in Vietnam. My father was in the 23rd MP company Duc Pho 1968-1969. God Bless you sir!
Very good info. The 270 is a great all around cartridge.
I have high reguards for your knowledge and ability to convey it to me and others . God bless you and your family and Benny . Always a pleasure Sir . Thank you .
You are incredibly knowledgeable and the way you carry yourself is something missing from this generation
As you mentioned, faster twist rates are required to stabilize longer bullets. Where I see another advantage with the 6.8 Western would be when loading copper alloy bullets. It will probably push a 150 grain one at the same velocity as a 130 grainer in a 270 Win. You would probably have the same penetration as the 175 factory load. I think that's the next load they should offer in the 6.8 Western. As you know, lead free bullets are significantly longer than cup and core and will probably eventually be required. This is where the 6.8 Western will have an advantage. That's if it hangs on long enough for them to support it better.
I love all copper in my muzzleloader as they are devestating without risk of blowing up on impact causing lost injured game. The petals turn razor sharp hemorrhage creators just like a broadhead creating a quick ethical harvest. I am not sure how they act in high powered rifles but penetration will be there.
Thank you for another great video. We will keep our 270, mainly because it works for me. Take care and God bless you and your family
I think the 270 is iconic and still totally relevant for a reason. If 270 wasn't enough and I needed more horsepower I go with it 3006. The biggest problem I see with the 6.8 Western is Hornady and nosler are not choosing to adopt it. I think currently the only ammunition for it is Winchester. I think there's many other choices in the same ballistic range as the 6.8 Western with much more aftermarket support. Like 6.5 PRC 280 Remington 280 Remington AI 7 mm Magnum 3006 + + there's many other great options. Thank you 👍
All these new cartridges have done is double the cost. And make it harder to find ammo in their new offerings. I wonder if the marketing team finds out, rifle sales plummet due to no ammo available. Legacy hunting rifles are now marked up 400% on GunBroker now. 25/06 been on the shelf for a long time up here in AK. New shooters stick with the old school cartridges, don't get sucked into the hype.
@@ValcoBayrunner Definitely agree 👍. I think a classic 3006 can do just about anything you want in North America including Alaska where you're at. I lived in Alaska for 7 and 1/2 years and I thought I needed the biggest baddest thing and I bought a 300 weatherby Magnum. Big mistake it's a great cartridge but it's really more than I needed and I couldn't shoot it accurately to be honest. I ended up buying a 3006 H& R and I could shoot it super accurate I can hold three to five inch groups all day with it at 300 yards. And I used it for moose caribou sheep everything I mainly shot factory Nosler 165 grain partitions and it did the trick no matter what. Thank you 👍
Yep! .30-06 is practically the ideal round for Alaska for the average sourdough. That don't mean that the collection HAS to stop there though! Haha
@@georgewhitworth9742 Yes definitely 👍
@@r3tr0sp3ct3r I can't disagree the 3006 is very versatile and flat if you drop down to 150s. I always used 165 grain partition nosler when I lived in Alaska It was a great compromise. Probably not as good as 180s for moose but every moose I ever shot with 165 dropped in its tracks. Thank you 👍
I'm a 270 "nut", as it was my first rifle and my favorite cartridge. However, I bought a 6.8 Westen and personally feel it is what the 270 WSM was always meant to be. I love the heavy for caliber bullets and my factory Browning rifle is lights out accurate with the factory 175 gr. Sierra Tipped Game kings. I have 165 Accubonds, 160 gr. Partitions and all the 130 gr. Bullets I have loaded for years in my 270 Win to experiment with. I have lots of brass and components that I will be working up loads with in the 6.8 and cany wait to get it out in the field o. Elk and big mulies and long range whitetails.
Reading your post was exactly how I felt. I love all .277 calibers! So the 6.8 Western was intriguing to me. I hunt in canyon areas out west, so it had a lot of appeal. Well, I couldn’t be happier with my 6.8 Western. I purchased a Christiansen And Ridgline FFT that only weighs 5.3 pounds. Once I got it broken in, the accuracy has been outstanding. I have ordered my ammunition from Pendleton Ammunition and from Choice Ammunition. Both have quality ammo for the 6.8 Western with the 165 grain Nosler Accubond as my favorite.
Happy hunting
Enjoyed the discussion. Was able to follow the various wgts and velocities. Suggest you consider a visual table. So the figures are up for a few moments. Perhaps an erasable white board, off to one side. Would allow time for pondering the variables. Listening and seeing the info reinforces understanding and learning. Thanks for the review. 🤔
These videos are truly the very best --thank you so much for your time!!!
I'll stick with my 270 wsm. Once the barrel shoots out, or sooner if I get impatient, I'll swap a faster twist barrel on and load these now available heavier bullets for the .277
My thoughts exactly
I gotta say thanks, I learned how to reload from your channel. I find it to be a very very relaxing hobby.
I've hunted with the 270 Winchester for many years, and have taken many animals, before I started loading my own rounds I used the Winchester silver tip ammo. I load my own rounds now and I really like Nosler, the partition, ballistic tip, and ballistic silver tips all work well for me.
Where have you been all my life? I stumbled on your channel going down the 35 Whelen rabbit hole. Your videos are captivating and so informative, and remind me of the America I love. God bless you always, sir.
Fantastic VDO - I admire the no bashing or waving of pennants. I like you brought about the fact the 6.5 Creedmoor fits in an AR-10 magazine. That was the impetus for me purchasing an AR-10 in 6.5 CR and a Mauser chambered in 6.5 CR. Barnes VOR-TX 127 GR will be tested in short order.
I hope you are well my friend. We are worried about you. Please give a shout as soon as possible. God Bless you and your family...Happy Spring!!!
You raise a lot of good points. I think the current industry focus on long sectional density bullets is shooters turned off to the hot magnums that were such a focus of the mid-late twentieth century, both for expense of ammo and heavy recoil, and expense of the firearm itself, and sometimes destruction of meat with those high velocity rounds at close ranges. But what has kept me on the fence is the limited range of chamberings, and particularly bullet weights. I'd actually begun to wonder if the fast twist rates just made it nonviable for accuracy with the light bullets or pushing light bullets with the full powder load on those necked down cartridges burned out the fast twist rifling too fast, but you raise an interesting point about manufacturers not wanting to compete with their other loads. Unfortunately, that also reduces the attractiveness of these new "do everything" high sectional density cartridges, at least to me as a consumer. Always appreciate the content and your eye to history, and particularly your insights as a reloader, an area I'm not particularly knowledgeable myself.
Love this guy , he has absolutely no bullshit with him. Not trying to sell us something we don't need.
For the last 3 years. I’ve been building my own rifles. I love listening to the older generation. I abuse my rifles. Push them hard. Fire back to back. Targets. I use the same rifle to hunt. I find that you. And the real gunsmith are way more accurate to what I see then these newer guys. Thanks for the info.
Love your content! It is the best honest channel on YT! I am rebarreling my .270win right now(the barrel is done) in a 1:8 twist. I would like to state with the worn out barrel and chamber I could safely shoot 130gr SGK with IMR4350 @ 3400fps! So maybe I will give those heavy bullets a go. Only shooting the plains here in sunny South Africa. 250-500yard shots but taken from very stable platforms. Thanks again for the great advice.
Speaking of the Hodgdon 2022 reloading manual, they also don't have the parent cartridge of the 6.8 Western - the 270 WSM. In this part of the West., the 270 WSM is far from obsolete. There's a whole list of missing cartridges in addition to the .257 Roberts, including the .44 special. ??? They're coming out with new temp-sensitive, non-fouling powders, but leave handloaders hanging. ??? Someone was asleep at the wheel when Hodgdon printed this latest offering. Thanks GB, for yet another solid review.
Well said. I've got my old 270. When I started to get the 6.5 bug, I looked at the books and saw it wasn't doing much more than what the 270 was doing- for my uses. Not knocking 6.5- just saying newest and best is fun but not always needed if you've already got that niche filled.
Great info!!! As a long time hunter and shooter ,You are right on the Mark !!
And I just picked up a Remington 700 257 Roberts 1970 collectors edition from a buddy of mine. It’s only ever been fired at the factory, he got it off a friend and I offered him a little more then he paid, it’s a beautiful fire arm!! I like normal cartridges but but I also like the odd balls as well.
Good discussion. Agree with your comments on realistic range. I've tried 6.5x55 140 grains, liked it a lot. Loved .270s but never bought one. Always thought 264 and 270 were too close to declare one better than the other. I've realized barrel length and speed don't matter much. Precision, projectile type and grain size matters much more to me. Nor does a flatter trajectory matter now, as with an LRF, anyone can dial a precision correction, plus many scopes now have a ballistic calculator and memories for rifles + rounds. Plus recoil and muzzle-jump are so much easier to manage now.
As a result I settled on using a short and light .308 rifle. Short barrel with a still fast 110 grain, 168 to 175 grain for larger, or 190 grain subsonic (but no suppressor). This covers it all. I prefer 130 grain monolithic coppers and use a barrel tuner--excellent precision and more than enough killing power. It's that range of projectile grain sizes and projectile types, plus a wide velocity range that means far more to me than the caliber does.
Why would I walk away from that easy to obtain flexibility? So I have no attraction to other calibres. I far more appreciate having all that, within a light carbine-sized rifle.
I have learned so much from you, I'm going to call you Dad. Thanks, and God Bless.
Yes Sir! Your Pet Peeve is VALID!
I have Loved .260 Remington since it gained SAAMI approval. I have watched it succumb to Big Money Marketing after Hornady launched the 6.5 Creedmore. First it was Hornady that scaled back production on any .260 offerings, then I noticed published loading data from "Reputable" companies actually started to change...in favor of the Creedmore.
We're all suckers for MARKETING on some level.
In recent Rifle cartridge History, Nosler was the first to try to re-create the wheel by offering a full line of Calibers that are all just a bit better than the average for every bullet weight.
It was Weatherby who originally Capitalized on this marketing scheme. Now most recently, Hornady has offered calibers that do nothing better than anything on the market...but supposedly have a "better, more efficient" case design.
All these schemes are simply companies trying to get a piece of the market share.
Greetings,
I am so glad that I stumbled upon you sir.
I am in the process of getting my PAL in Ontario and am watching every one of your videos.
Thank you for doing what you do.
I am learning so much from you.
Kind regards from Ontario,
Dave
I’ve been waiting for you to do this video!!!
Just looked it’s an hour long… awesome! But I’m going to have to watch it tomorrow when I get time on my drive to work.
Once again the voice of reason is also full of wisdom. Thank You Sir!
You're quite welcome.
Enjoyable analysis! Thank you. Space is precious in my gun safe. Also, another specialized round is little interest to me as it would drain resources from my more regular standard hunting guns and gear. I will be passing on this offering.
Personally speaking, I see a grievous error happening in the gun manufacturers market. They are spreading their resources way to thin on these specialized guns and gear when supplies for the regular standard guns and gear cannot be met. Just my observation and opinion!
My memory of the .270 Win factory velocities is somewhat different from what you stated. Yes, it started out as a 130 grain at 3130, or 3150, or 3160 fps (sources disagree) and Jack O'Connor's loads may even have exceed this. But manufacturers realized that they were overdoing things a bit and the velocity was eventually dropped to 2990 fps and stayed that way for many decades. In the 1990s, Federal's Superformance line lead a new endeavor into higher velocities and boutique manufacturers followed. Eventually the big manufacturers raised the velocity to 3060 fps and that's where it sits now. With new powders it is possible to exceed 3200 fps, at least in my rifle.
I enjoy the way you do simple factual comparisons.
The way I see it, if I already own a Lamborghini I’m not buying a new model for 10 more Hp and slightly better aerodynamics. If I didn’t already own one why not at least consider the shinny new one. Great video.
Thanks for your analysis , I just bought a Browning X 2 Speed: I've had it for one week, and have taken 4 deer, and two coyotes with it. All shots have been with factory loads with 175 grain Sierra bullets, and ranges have been between 30 and 275 yards. You are correct there is no big advantage with light bullets, but I for one don't want to shoot light bullets anyway, I have a 270 WCF as well and have taken many deer with the 130 grain bullets with that rifle. I can tell you there is less meat damage with the 6.8 with the 175's I can also tell you that recoil is less because of the muzzle brake it wears. Shooting it without hearing protection with that brake would be a bad deal, so I do not do it, nor do I shoot any rifles without protection any more. All in all I would buy the 6.8 every time over the 270 wcf because of its increased versatility.
It's your videos like this that make me subscribe to and love this channel so much. They are so incredibly insightful and useful.
Just found your channel and have been watching ever since. I enjoy the talks and instructional videos as well. It's kind of like the talks I have with my friends. Thank you.
My guns of choice that make sense to have are: .22LR, 12 gauge shotgun, .22-250 w/60 grain bullet, 25-06 w/100 grain bullet, .270 w/ 140 grain bullet and 30-06 w/180 grain bullet. These will easily take anything in North America and Alaska.
There is a BIG difference between HUNTING and BENCH SHOOTING!!!
The reason I bought a WSM was I appreciated having a slightly shorter rifle for some of the locations I hunt. Most of the friends and relatives I hunt with are using the good old 270 Winchester and I've yet to hear a single deer complain about being shot by either.
I like that ammo and rifle manufacturers like Western and Browning are interested in bringing out a new caliber that might be highly specialized in terms of the type of game one wants to hunt. But, in all honesty, any rifle chambered in .308 WIN will take down nearly all North American game animals with the right ammo and excellent shot placement. Yes, .270 WIN and .30-06 Springfield will also work for most hunters, but I just like the fact that we do get new caliber hunting and/or target rounds just to spice up life. I hope the 6.8 Western does catch on if only to add some variety for those buying hunting and/or target rifles. Yes, you're right: The advantage for using the 6.8 Western is the heavier bullets that would have greater BC numbers and obviously create somewhat larger wounds than a standard .270 WIN hunting round. Thanks for the videos!
Thank you for your time, research and great information. God bless you and yours!
So interesting! Really appreciate your approach to the subject. Thank you!
Another great review. All I need is my 7mm-08 shooting a 120 grain Barnes TTSX. Moose, black bear, mule deer. Bang, flop.
AMEN. I'm a big believer in sticking to something that's been around and proven and put to the test for YEARS..... Why change.... 243...3030...308...270...3006....300........these guys have been here for years and Proven... Why change to a odd ball high dollar ammo caliber..... GREAT Video... Thank You. And GOD Bless
Im a firm believer in tried and true cartridges, but... with your logic, why did we ever stop using horse and buggy, or steam engines? The black and white tv's did the job?
Technology advances, and room for improvement shows, knowledge gets deeper and deeper. Why sit on 60 year old tech just because it works? Thats where new cartridges have their place, they fill gaps traditional carts didnt. People like less recoil, flatter shots, paper punching, less deflection etc. And the market serves thaf up to the consumer.
I used to dismiss the latest and greatest cartridges, whats wrong with .243 right? Well if a person actually shoots something beyond that lone 243 they own theyd see there is room for impovement. Whether it be for hunting, or for target.
Staying hung up on traditional cartridges and dismissing higher bc, lower recoil, flatter shooting rounds because "my .308's been killin deer every year since 1974" is just insane. Support improvement in the firearms industry!! But go ahead and kerp your traditionals, they are tried and true, no doubt!! But are they the best? Not after 40 years of technology advancement. Its just what it is.
@@whiskerbiscuit99 Do you always call people who have a different opinion "insane"? Why don't you stop trying to brow beat people who are perfectly happy shooting what they like? That's their right.
@@alanhigh8125 i called nobody insane. Im not into name calling. Name calling is childish. I stated that i thought passing off new tech because old tech worked is insane. And just as anyone making comments here, its pure opinion. Open for dialogue. And to double down on your statement again. I never said someone cant shoot what they prefer... hell i used to be traditional. If i cant call out someone ragging on other methods, practices, products, then how is it you give someone a pass for hacking in the first place? Hmm double standard much?
Nobodys gonna take your .308 away, nobody wants it, and if they do have it, its collecting dust, waiting to be needed. Chill.
Great video as usual. The .270 Winchester is still an incredible cartridge as it approaches 100 years old. Anyone who is a reloader needs to look into the 140 grain bullets. Look at the Hornady interlock 140 grain btsp. Run the ballistics on that bullet at 3,000 fps which is pretty easy to get and it’s just an incredible load for the old .270.
I run 140gr accubond handloads in mine at 2980 fps. Groups great!
@@Mattclay29 That's a killer load. The 140s are often overlooked but I think they are superb in the old .270!
Love your videos, fun to watch very informative. One of these days I would like to find a 270 possibly with iron sights to put see through scope mounts on for close quick shots in the woods, last season I was sneaking through the woods in the rain to sit in my spot and had 5 deer run right to me all within 50 yds 4 does and a buck I had my scoped 300 win mag. Looked at them but wasn’t able to take a shot at any of them, lil too much gun for the thick cover I was hunting+ it’s public so you never know where other hunters are. 3030 and 35 Remington would be better in those areas occasionally I have 200 to 250 yd shots where a 270 would be nice. Also looking at the 360 Buckhammer and 400 legend since I do hunt straight walled only areas too. So many options out there fun to know there capabilities strengths and weaknesses hard to make one cartridge do everything, Videos like yours definitely help deciding
One thing to consider is the available magazine length for reliable feeding. The .270 Winchester and .270 WSM can't seat those long heavy bullets and maintain adequate COAL for most commercially available rifles without seating the bullet back into the powder column. Even with a faster twist barrel this is still a limitation unless single loading. I've run into this with my Remington 700 CDLSF in 270 WSM. I have a load for 150gr Berger VLD and it's at it's limit. Much like the 6.5 Creedmoor's design I think this is a similar feature of the 6.8 Western's design with it's bumped back shoulder and longer neck that the 270 WSM doesn't offer.. same situation with the long action rifles commercially available in the 270 Winchester. I've had great satisfaction with this caliber loaded to a conservative 3000 fps but I can also verify as you say; "it's not a plinker." Thanks for this video.
For some reason, my Mossberg 4X4 has such a deep throat I could load any bullet length they make. I'll have to check the magazine.
@@cbsbass4142 Throat is rarely the limitation with bullet selection. It's almost always the magazine length in a factory rifle that's limited to the COAL (Cartridge Overall Length) set out by SAAMI it's designed around. Historically rifle manufacturers design their rifles and magazines around this universal blueprint for the most reliable feeding of factory ammunition and bullet weight selections that are typical for that cartridge; rarely do they consider hand loaders. On a separate note, while it's good to find JAM or where the bullet's ogive engages the rifling as a starting point, if you can't, don't worry about it. Start with the farthest out you can seat and run your bullet seating tests to find your accuracy nodes; all things being equal your pressures will only drop as the bullet backs out of the throat. I have a Weatherby MKV deluxe in 257 Wby mag for example, and the bullet is almost falling out of the case mouth before it engages the rifling and yet, with the proper loads will shoot sub MOA @ 100yds any day of the week.
@@ironDsteele That's what I figure too so I'll check my mag length (fit) with my dummy rounds even before backing off the lands which seem way out there, based on my OAL gauge. If they wont fit the mag, and I like the 5 round mag, I'm not going to load them. I mean its these Hornady 150 gr SSTs, that are plenty long so they're seated well down in the case all the way to the shoulder. They do fit the mag I see, just barely-- but I'll be seating them a wee but deeper, just for reliable feeding. Got a couple boxes: Hot Cor speer (both BTSP and Hot core flat base) in 130 gr, Hornady SST in 150, so, being without a chrono, we have ourselves a project. :)
Been waiting on your take on this caliber for a while now, glad I waited. Thanks
This video was exactly what I needed. I grew up on 30-30 but switched to 270 win after letting more walk than I cared to admit at 250 to 300 yards. Filled my freezer many times on the tried and true. I'm planning to buy a suppressor this year for hunting, and figured I'd rather buy a new rufle with threaded barrel as host than have my pencil barrel threaded. I have been looking at all the options, and was waffling between a few. I liked the extra grain weight with the Western, and was considering going with that, but I'm hesitant to have to stock another cartridge. After listening to this, knowing 95% of my shooting is white tail (unless I get one of Virginia's elusive elk tags), I think I can eliminate the Western as a choice. Now I'm still waffling on the two big 6.5s, 308, and 270.
Thanks, for your educated analysis. I share your opinion on hunting game within reasonable distances. There is nothing better than getting within 35 to 40 yards of big game and respectfully harvesting the animal. Keep up the good work.
I've had my 6.8 western for going on a year. No complaints. Took a nice cow at 300 with the 175gr Sierra TGK. Looking forward to my handloads. This round is perfect.
So will be the next round in about 2 or 3 years.
All of the best cartridges to fill in any gap were done almost a century ago.
These things are all replicating ballistics found in older cartridges.
@@cchcch-jw9dw the 6.8 western replicates not past calibers other than a parent case the closest thing to it is a 280 AI and it slightly out does it
I took a cow too with a sledge hammer
@@cchcch-jw9dw
I disagree. My 6.8 Western can outshoot my 270. It has greater energy down range due to the heavier bullets. It deflects wind better. It penetrates better, especially at longer ranges. My 270 Winchester drops below 1,800 ft lbs of energy at 350 yards. My 6.8 Western doesn’t drop below that till it passes 550 yards, almost 600.
Yes, I can duplicate those energy levels with an older cartridge, but they are using more powder to accomplish those numbers. The Western uses bullet design instead of using the largest casing it can stuff into a long action chamber. The 6.8 does it in a short action and with less felt recoil. Those two things alone help improves accuracy.
Point is, the 6.8 Western can do the exact same thing a 7mm REM Mag can do, and it does it better at longer ranges. Technically, you’re still correct, but for real life applications, I’ll take the 6.8 Western. I own both, and I prefer shooting and hunting with the 6.8 Western over all my other cartridges. I’ve been hunting for over 40 years, and I love my classics.
A 40 year old car that’s been well maintained will still get you from places to place. A newer car can do it as well, but with more comfort, and better fuel economy. Are you still driving your grandpa’s truck? Didn’t think so
A new solution (caliber) searching for a problem. They use to make new calibers to fill a need. Now they make new calibers to make sales.
Love the wealth of knowledge I get from this channel. Thanks! Subscribed.
I'd like to hear what Nathan Foster has to say about the 6.8? His books go over all this stuff. He's one of the best out there.
Thank you Sir as always for your shared wisdom. I've been researching my first hunting rifle for about a year now. And I am considering 6.8 Western as I live in southern New Mexico (from Dallas Texas) and it seems like a good round for the game locally.
The only bolt action I own is an old Mosin Nagant and I haven't had any issues with recoil so I think this would be doable if I end up going that route
I love your content. Thanks for doing it. I'm new to hand loading and your channel is a wealth of information. What I find most valuable is the manner in which you give instruction. For lack of a better way of putting it it's like being an apprentice. Every step is explained in detail. While other channels kind of gloss over details as if it's common knowledge. For someone new to things like me it's very reassuring to get very clear and concise instruction on the terminology, processes, and order of operations. Once more you're greatly appreciated. God bless and thank you.
Terrific, detailed commentary. 270 Win for me.
I don’t need a new 6.8Western, what I do need is someone to start producing and getting ammo for the guns I have. Ammo companies please start putting out some cartridges like the 32 Win Special, 7mm Rem Mag, 308 Win, and 357 Mag etc. (this may be a local issue here in Saskatchewan maybe everyone else can find it) Once I have that ammo, maybe I would look at a new rifle and cartridge. Great video!
You should look at a reloading setup!
Anyway, I am using your cleaning methods each time I come back from the range. Thank you for your detailed instruction videos. BTW the Krag shoots just fine, even though it is 120 yrs old now.
The store clerk.... "270 and 6.8 Western are totally interchangeable!! Its awesome!!!
I look at things this way that most all hunting takes place at 400 yards and under. There is hunting and then there is sniping.
So at 400 yards and under, the 270 Win has all the energy it needs to take elk, deer, sheep, antelope, since 1925. It was engineered right. I don't need a 6.8 Western or 270 WSM. The 270 Win is all I need and works as designed.
I was also very disappointed with the Hodgdon 2022 annual manual. Maybe us old guys aren't their target audience anymore. Lots of good info on their powders but no loads listed for the 7x57,8x57, 7.5x54 MAS, 7.5 Swiss or my 35 Whelen. I know it's all available on line but this was the first manual I have purchased in years and I was expecting the basic cartridges to be covered. Thank you for another great video. Wish you and your family the best. Off topic, my son recently moved to Weare, NH and I think of you every time I drive down that way.
Another great video, thank you!
Hope Benny is doing well.
I would like to add that a 2 MOA rifle has a much greater chance of sucess in real hunting conditions at 300 yards than a 1 MOA rifle does at 500 yards. Sub MOA rifles are still very much desired if the user is going to occasionally use his big game rifle for coyotes or prairie dogs but more than that a psychological benefit of confidence. There is no equipment available that will tell the sportsman all the wind conditions at long range. There may not even be time to get the bipod setup. I have seen people being successful at long range but you never hear about the gut shot game or the ones that got their nose or lower jaw blown off.
@Craig Sanford Very true, most guns outshoot their owners. Any group over 1 MOA at under 200 yards disappoints me; but I shoot to reload, not the other way around.
That being said, my hunting rifle rarely shoots under 1 MOA and, as a result, it rarely shoots paper. It does, however, shoot meat effectively; a 35 year old A-bolt .308 with a Tasco Scope on top of it. 1 lost animal in those 35 years.
That's actually not true, there are scintilometers and laser crosswind measurement devices that provide firing solutions for complex wind conditions. Your analysis also doesn't make much sense, the premise is wrong. People taking long range shots (who are competent) aren't shooting 1MOA rigs, they're sub 1/2 and likely 1/4 MOA. This isn't 1990; modern manufacturing has changed the hardware game. People who shoot long range look at 600yd as a chip shot, and yes in unknown wind conditions. While there are other factors that make such a shot on living targets a bad idea, the ability to make the shot itself is there in spades. For the shooters who aren't up to the task, well, they shouldn't be shooting game at any range until they are, don't care if it's 600 yards or 40 from a tree stand.
Further, discussion of "groups" with hunting rifles is bizarre. How many shots are you taking against that game that you need a tight group? The real measure is cold bore point of impact matching point of aim, across the intended usable range.
@@silvermediastudio There are high dollar lidar systems used in the wind farms and possibly NAVY, but can you provide a link to a system available to the sportsman? Same with the scintillometers? Without a precise solution for wind it is just a guess. A better guess can be had by observing mirage effects of wind every 50 yards or so and totaling it up but still a guess negating some of the exceptional accuracy at long range we can expect today. You are absolutely right about the cold bore shot being most important however your presumptuousness is on display here. Many people let the barrels cool between shots and make sure the barrel is fouled before hunting. One final note, a properly maintained rifle of yesteryear gives up little to todays rifles. On average I think there has been enough pressure on manufacturers to make better rifles and ammunition because of the reviewers on the internet, but again in real world hunting conditions it hits the law of diminishing returns for benefit. In conclusion, extreme distance regardless of technology will at some point become unethical for all shooters regardless of skill level.
@@Strutingeagle Trijicon Ventus
@@silvermediastudio For the $8000 price it will get you 5 readings out to 500 yards. For me this is long range but many are shooting well beyond this. I am impressed they got the size of that unit as small as they did. I admit to being ignorant of its existence as well. I still stand by my statement " There is no equipment available that will tell the sportsman all the wind conditions at long range". 100 yard increments are not enough for a unit most hunters can not afford anyway. It would not change how I hunt but possibly with future improvements it can extend ethical shooting ranges and cost may come down to within affordable range and give 50 yard increments. Thank you.
Always enjoy your perspectives and knowledge. I think I have seen most of your videos, some twice.
Thanks for your support!