When you build your system, build it to go off grid with batteries, get a hybrid wind/solar controller, then get a charger/ inverter, run your home off the inverter, but now hook your grid connection to the charger on the inverter, now you have a off grid system that is still hooked to the grid and it will keep your batteries topped off , also you can have a grid connection to power high amp appliances like AC , you may have to do some creative wiring to get away with it, don’t sell anything back to them and have a main shutoff to compleatly go off grid if the grid goes down
And thats why i love ENTERGY my power provider with them i have a 1:1 net metering rate and 100% of my overproduced kwh that are fed back into the grid run a daily credit that i can claim anytime i wish.
I have really enjoyed your video series, it’s clear and concise. I’m in the early stages of my own installation and have found many of your topics reinforce my thought process. I chuckled at your permitting costs. Our municipality charges $300 just for them to allow (review) us to put a solar installation on our property, then promptly asks for another $250 for a building permit. The challenges don’t end there, our utility requires a comprehensive engineering study for our entire electrical system before they will talk to us about grid tie. They basically price themselves away from working with homeowners…Then if we make it through all their hoops they will only credit energy from us at wholesale prices (1/2 the res rate). Needless to say I plan to redirect those thousands of $$ into a battery system.
Dave, I enjoyed your installation video. Good design and very nice installation. I had to laugh at (most) of the kibitzing comments you have received. However I’ll add my own here. In my jurisdiction, the SqD unfused AC disconnect AT THE MAIN PANEL is not required. The 40A 2-pole circuit breaker in your 200A service panel is the point of interconnection and can serve as the disconnect. However, AC isolation is required within sight of and 10’ of the inverter (in the garage) - NEC 690.15(A). So in my jurisdiction, as an inspector, I would have expected to see the unfused disconnect in the garage (on the AC side of the inverter). And the wires connecting to your main panel would be connected to the line side (top) connections in that disconnect (which is actually the way your plan 1-line diagram shows the connections).
Find More information for this project and others on my website: projectswithdave.com Other Helpful Solar Videos: Super Cheap Solar Panel Review: ua-cam.com/video/qu4iGxBhqzs/v-deo.html Full Solar System Install: ua-cam.com/video/_xA6qOwnYbM/v-deo.html Check out the first year performance results here: ua-cam.com/video/BatTeSq05rU/v-deo.html See the total system cost here: ua-cam.com/video/PNTO83FvaL4/v-deo.html And How to size your solar system here: ua-cam.com/video/rbFnZqA0GCI/v-deo.html 4 Things to Know About Solar in the Snow: ua-cam.com/video/vY3PufzPUnI/v-deo.html Ground Vs Roof Mount Solar: ua-cam.com/video/w-iS_8e7n60/v-deo.html How to Get A Permit For Your Solar System: ua-cam.com/video/imiEYDHLG4A/v-deo.html How to Crimp MC4 Connectors: ua-cam.com/video/oH3LqTu4B8E/v-deo.html 3 Solar Panel Wiring Issues Answered: ua-cam.com/video/i7vHEHB3a-M/v-deo.html Net Metering Explained With Actual Data: ua-cam.com/video/IwUK1dNJ3n8/v-deo.html
@@muchmuchmore Disagree. It's to get permission from a state actor. If what you said was true, then why do these same people ask for a permit to build a shed on your property? How's that affecting others?
@@AntonioCunningham The interconnect agreement is with the utility not state or local government. While they may be a pain, expecting anyone to operate a utility and not have any control around the quantity or quality of what is transmitted by it is just silly.
Thanks much Dave, that's helpful. Question though, how many times did the inspector come out to inspect. If you did a concrete footer, I imagine that the inspector would come out for that and at the same time inspect the trench and conduit. And then a second time for the final. Is that about right?
Because I didn't have to pour footers, the inspector only came out once for a final inspection. I put sticks in the trench that could be pulled out to check the depth of the trench which was a recommendation by my inspector.
@@ProjectsWithDave I'm trying to imagine the stick method and how it would reassure the inspector of the proper depth of a trench? Is there some type of technique used here I'm not understanding? If it's just an honors system step illustrating where the trench is and how deep, ok, I get that. Can't anyone pound in a stake and claim its at the depth and location of the run?
Just received my Application from the Utility company I'm confused by some of the question, were any of these on your application or if you know the answer I would appreciate it. 1. Metering (voltage, location, losses adjustment due to metering location and other: 2. Facilities to be furnished by cooperative. 3.Facilities to be furnished by DG owner/operator. 4. Cost responsibility. 5. Control area interchange point. 6.Supplemental terms and condition attached. 7. Delivery voltage. Thanks
First, I would recommend contacting the engineer that manages solar install for your utility, they will be able to help you get the answers they are looking for since I didn't have most of these. #1 I didn't have, but I guess it only applies if your meter is far away from the utility transformer. #2 I expect this is in refence to the installation of a two way meter, usually provided by the utility. #3 this is likely the equipment you will provide, inverter, AC shutoff etc. #4 I guess this is to clarify who is paying for the two way meter and AC shutoff, equipment that may not be clearly the Utility's or yours. #5 This probably refers to the 2 way meter, the place where the power is managed between what is yours and what is the utility's. #6 This sounds like there is an attachment with the terms for selling power back to the utility. Usually it includes the price the utility will pay for your excess power, how much over production they are willing to accept, and what the net metering agreement will be. #7 is the voltage you will deliver back to the utility, for most homes in the US it would be 240v. Hope that helps. Thanks.
Hi Dave, I live in West Chester, OH so I believe we are neighbors 🙂. Could you share how you got the drawings approved by an engineer to get the permit? Also, is there a link to the codes (structure & electrical) that apply to installation in Ohio? Thanks a lot for your feedback and keep up the great work! I love your videos.
Hey neighbor! The Ready Rack drawings come pre-approved by an engineer from the manufacture, as is the case with most racking. Most areas in Ohio, that I'm familiar with, follow the national electric codes, but it's best to review your proposal directly with your inspector. I find they all have some "preferences" of their own. Thanks!
You said they paid you a $.04 on your net metering and I believe you mentioned it cost you $.10 - if you had it at $.074 and it cost you $.09 would you put it back on the grid- just curious-
I pay about $0.14/kWh and I get 100% of that back for what I use over a month. I get $0.04/kWh for the amount I produce over my monthly usage. I explain it in more detail in this video: ua-cam.com/video/IwUK1dNJ3n8/v-deo.html
Did you have to show receipts, did the utility company want to make sure everything is new- some say that grid tie has to be new any truth you saw to this when you spoke to them- did they just want to to see the connections-
Neither the Utility company nor the inspectors asked for receipts. I imagine the UL listing is all that matters. If you have a concern, call and talk to your utility and inspector. Mine were very helpful.
I installed mine myself with inspections and final approval. You need to talk to the building inspection office in your area and ask what your options are.
I've found that the Electric Co. looks at your last years bill and will not let you put in an array that's is larger than your total consumption (in my area). This is because once you are producing more electricity than you can consume...you become a competitor. I'm not sure how they handle a situation where you're approved for a certain array (based on consumption) and then through energy conservation efforts (new windows, HVAC, insulation, etc.) you end up "over producing".
Are you in city limits? I'm not and wasn't planning on dealing with the county. Maybe I need to find out if it will please the crown to pay for permits to build something on my own property.
@@ProjectsWithDave Man I got lucky, I just got off the phone with my county assessor and they don't give a crap about solar lol so no permit required for me! Thank you for the video anyways though because I would have never known to even check on this.
My documents are just for reference. Everyone will have different paperwork depending on the requirements for your area. The video is more about the process of successfully getting a permit.
If they are doing net metering by the month, and only pay you the low rate for overage you can still make it work using the method of minimizing overproduction I show in this video on sizing your array for net metering: ua-cam.com/video/rbFnZqA0GCI/v-deo.html
@@ProjectsWithDave Here's the kicker, the few cents they "pay you", it's a revolving credit to your account which you cannot cash out, unless you close your account!
@@ProjectsWithDave That's my take as well... We historically had a pretty decent NM arrangement, but the electric company renegotiated a new contract with the state last year, and it's certainly not in the consumer's best interest going forward!
I think it's only a matter of time before the lavish NM programs fade away as solar gets cheaper and it begins to cut into their profits in a more significant way...
I Think I will Just Get it Done, Then The Government can Pound Sand, and I have no intention of selling Power to the Grid, for 10 cents on the Dollar. if you build it they will not come ...
You have to consider the utility splits the rate you pay into at least two categories. For example: Part of the rate is distribution, the cost of installing and maintaining the lines $0.10/kWh. The other part is power production $0.04/kWh. They can't pay you more for your production than what is purchased on the open market, it wouldn't make good business sense. Over production moves you from a consumer saving $0.14/kWh to a wholesale producer earning $0.04/kWh. That's why it makes the most sense not to overproduce too much if you want your system to pay off quickly. You can see the analysis in this video on net metering: ua-cam.com/video/IwUK1dNJ3n8/v-deo.html
@@ProjectsWithDave well this is what i see happening everyone getting on solar com ed doesn’t need to make power and still charging people sorry but com ed can kiss my rear end staying in business and they should of had lines buried decades ago that money going into their pockets no way they spend all that extra on line maintenance
The utilities are only going to give you less and less for your energy as this technology disruption happens. You are much better off financially today investing in enough storage to carry your house in the evening, than relying on solar credits to offset your consumption.
Are you saying that you paid someone to get the plan set done for you? Because in that case, I'm a little disappointed seeing how I was under the impression this was a DIY channel and maybe you knew something we didn't. You're not the only one that knows how to make a phone and pay to have someone make plan sets for our solar solution, I was simply trying to save a little cash with DIY. I mistakenly assumed you knew something more that us newbies did or that maybe could save us from having to pay exorbitant fees for wiring diagrams and paperwork. NO offence pal, I didn't mean to bother you, I'll just continue searching to see if I can find someone that knows something about it. Thanks.
When you build your system, build it to go off grid with batteries, get a hybrid wind/solar controller, then get a charger/ inverter, run your home off the inverter, but now hook your grid connection to the charger on the inverter, now you have a off grid system that is still hooked to the grid and it will keep your batteries topped off , also you can have a grid connection to power high amp appliances like AC , you may have to do some creative wiring to get away with it, don’t sell anything back to them and have a main shutoff to compleatly go off grid if the grid goes down
You should make a video explaining this in detail.
it seems very interesting
Thanks for posting this.. I'm working through this process now.
And thats why i love ENTERGY my power provider with them i have a 1:1 net metering rate and 100% of my overproduced kwh that are fed back into the grid run a daily credit that i can claim anytime i wish.
Wow! That's a great deal!
I have really enjoyed your video series, it’s clear and concise. I’m in the early stages of my own installation and have found many of your topics reinforce my thought process.
I chuckled at your permitting costs. Our municipality charges $300 just for them to allow (review) us to put a solar installation on our property, then promptly asks for another $250 for a building permit.
The challenges don’t end there, our utility requires a comprehensive engineering study for our entire electrical system before they will talk to us about grid tie. They basically price themselves away from working with homeowners…Then if we make it through all their hoops they will only credit energy from us at wholesale prices (1/2 the res rate). Needless to say I plan to redirect those thousands of $$ into a battery system.
Wow! It's amazing all the unnecessary expense that can be added to install a system. I'm glad the videos have been a helpful resource for you.
Dave, I enjoyed your installation video. Good design and very nice installation. I had to laugh at (most) of the kibitzing comments you have received. However I’ll add my own here. In my jurisdiction, the SqD unfused AC disconnect AT THE MAIN PANEL is not required. The 40A 2-pole circuit breaker in your 200A service panel is the point of interconnection and can serve as the disconnect. However, AC isolation is required within sight of and 10’ of the inverter (in the garage) - NEC 690.15(A). So in my jurisdiction, as an inspector, I would have expected to see the unfused disconnect in the garage (on the AC side of the inverter). And the wires connecting to your main panel would be connected to the line side (top) connections in that disconnect (which is actually the way your plan 1-line diagram shows the connections).
Thanks for adding your feedback!
Excellent video, thank you very much for putting this together, it will help so many people follow your example.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Incredibly helpful. Your videos are all excellent and totally on topic addressing the questions that I have. U are my go to reference now. Thank you!
Fantastic information as always!! This is Very helpful for my DIY install this summer. Thank you, Great content - looking forward to more videos.
Awesome! Thank you!
Great video, the content and presentation are always great on this channel!
Much appreciated!
Very helpful video. Thank you for producing and posting this.
Glad it was helpful!
(Alex) Thank you for your video. All those details are very helpful.
Great Video, thank you very much that what I was looking for you answer me question.
Glad I could help
Find More information for this project and others on my website: projectswithdave.com
Other Helpful Solar Videos:
Super Cheap Solar Panel Review: ua-cam.com/video/qu4iGxBhqzs/v-deo.html
Full Solar System Install: ua-cam.com/video/_xA6qOwnYbM/v-deo.html
Check out the first year performance results here: ua-cam.com/video/BatTeSq05rU/v-deo.html
See the total system cost here: ua-cam.com/video/PNTO83FvaL4/v-deo.html
And How to size your solar system here: ua-cam.com/video/rbFnZqA0GCI/v-deo.html
4 Things to Know About Solar in the Snow: ua-cam.com/video/vY3PufzPUnI/v-deo.html
Ground Vs Roof Mount Solar: ua-cam.com/video/w-iS_8e7n60/v-deo.html
How to Get A Permit For Your Solar System: ua-cam.com/video/imiEYDHLG4A/v-deo.html
How to Crimp MC4 Connectors: ua-cam.com/video/oH3LqTu4B8E/v-deo.html
3 Solar Panel Wiring Issues Answered: ua-cam.com/video/i7vHEHB3a-M/v-deo.html
Net Metering Explained With Actual Data: ua-cam.com/video/IwUK1dNJ3n8/v-deo.html
Very much appreciated. Very informative
Yeah, I'm definitely never going grid tie. I'm not asking anyone for permission for producing power on my own property.
The permit isn't to produce the power. It is to be able to send it into the grid which is owned /managed by someone else.
@@muchmuchmore Disagree. It's to get permission from a state actor. If what you said was true, then why do these same people ask for a permit to build a shed on your property? How's that affecting others?
@@AntonioCunningham The interconnect agreement is with the utility not state or local government. While they may be a pain, expecting anyone to operate a utility and not have any control around the quantity or quality of what is transmitted by it is just silly.
Diy. No permits. And forget the utility company. A 15 to 20kw lifepo4 battery bank will get you through the night.
Lucky you mine fees were twice that plus I had to buy and have them install a two meter which costs $1000.
Wow! And I thought my fees were a lot!
Thanks much Dave, that's helpful. Question though, how many times did the inspector come out to inspect. If you did a concrete footer, I imagine that the inspector would come out for that and at the same time inspect the trench and conduit. And then a second time for the final. Is that about right?
Because I didn't have to pour footers, the inspector only came out once for a final inspection. I put sticks in the trench that could be pulled out to check the depth of the trench which was a recommendation by my inspector.
@@ProjectsWithDave I'm trying to imagine the stick method and how it would reassure the inspector of the proper depth of a trench? Is there some type of technique used here I'm not understanding? If it's just an honors system step illustrating where the trench is and how deep, ok, I get that. Can't anyone pound in a stake and claim its at the depth and location of the run?
@@bokchoy335 Another method I've seen used is to put a few short pieces of conduit in the ground over your trench large enough to fit a tape measure.
Not if you're on a small co-op electric co in Mississippi. They make it practically impossible for DYI.
Sorry to hear that. Some utilities are not friendly to solar. Then your only option is off grid systems.
Just received my Application from the Utility company I'm confused by some of the question, were any of these on your application or if you know the answer I would appreciate it. 1. Metering (voltage, location, losses adjustment due to metering location and other: 2. Facilities to be furnished by cooperative. 3.Facilities to be furnished by DG owner/operator. 4. Cost responsibility. 5. Control area interchange point. 6.Supplemental terms and condition attached. 7. Delivery voltage. Thanks
First, I would recommend contacting the engineer that manages solar install for your utility, they will be able to help you get the answers they are looking for since I didn't have most of these. #1 I didn't have, but I guess it only applies if your meter is far away from the utility transformer. #2 I expect this is in refence to the installation of a two way meter, usually provided by the utility. #3 this is likely the equipment you will provide, inverter, AC shutoff etc. #4 I guess this is to clarify who is paying for the two way meter and AC shutoff, equipment that may not be clearly the Utility's or yours. #5 This probably refers to the 2 way meter, the place where the power is managed between what is yours and what is the utility's. #6 This sounds like there is an attachment with the terms for selling power back to the utility. Usually it includes the price the utility will pay for your excess power, how much over production they are willing to accept, and what the net metering agreement will be. #7 is the voltage you will deliver back to the utility, for most homes in the US it would be 240v. Hope that helps. Thanks.
Permits
We don’t need no permits live out of town
Hi Dave, I live in West Chester, OH so I believe we are neighbors 🙂. Could you share how you got the drawings approved by an engineer to get the permit? Also, is there a link to the codes (structure & electrical) that apply to installation in Ohio? Thanks a lot for your feedback and keep up the great work! I love your videos.
Hey neighbor! The Ready Rack drawings come pre-approved by an engineer from the manufacture, as is the case with most racking. Most areas in Ohio, that I'm familiar with, follow the national electric codes, but it's best to review your proposal directly with your inspector. I find they all have some "preferences" of their own. Thanks!
You said they paid you a $.04 on your net metering and I believe you mentioned it cost you $.10 - if you had it at $.074 and it cost you $.09 would you put it back on the grid- just curious-
I pay about $0.14/kWh and I get 100% of that back for what I use over a month. I get $0.04/kWh for the amount I produce over my monthly usage. I explain it in more detail in this video: ua-cam.com/video/IwUK1dNJ3n8/v-deo.html
Did you have to show receipts, did the utility company want to make sure everything is new- some say that grid tie has to be new any truth you saw to this when you spoke to them- did they just want to to see the connections-
Neither the Utility company nor the inspectors asked for receipts. I imagine the UL listing is all that matters. If you have a concern, call and talk to your utility and inspector. Mine were very helpful.
Is there any way to get a permission if we do by ourselves?
I installed mine myself with inspections and final approval. You need to talk to the building inspection office in your area and ask what your options are.
Does your Electric Company limit the size of the array you can install, perhaps based on the amount of electricity your home uses?
I've found that the Electric Co. looks at your last years bill and will not let you put in an array that's is larger than your total consumption (in my area). This is because once you are producing more electricity than you can consume...you become a competitor. I'm not sure how they handle a situation where you're approved for a certain array (based on consumption) and then through energy conservation efforts (new windows, HVAC, insulation, etc.) you end up "over producing".
Yes, no more than 120% of annual consumption.
Are you in city limits? I'm not and wasn't planning on dealing with the county. Maybe I need to find out if it will please the crown to pay for permits to build something on my own property.
I'm not in city limits, but where I am there is still a county and township permit that is required.
@@ProjectsWithDave Man I got lucky, I just got off the phone with my county assessor and they don't give a crap about solar lol so no permit required for me! Thank you for the video anyways though because I would have never known to even check on this.
Fantastic!
what is the point of showing a permit that is not readable.
My documents are just for reference. Everyone will have different paperwork depending on the requirements for your area. The video is more about the process of successfully getting a permit.
The permits have sensitive info, so it is redacted for privacy purposes.
And this is why I never bothered, lol! My local net metering pays about $0.02-$0.04/khw. Nope...
If they are doing net metering by the month, and only pay you the low rate for overage you can still make it work using the method of minimizing overproduction I show in this video on sizing your array for net metering: ua-cam.com/video/rbFnZqA0GCI/v-deo.html
@@ProjectsWithDave Here's the kicker, the few cents they "pay you", it's a revolving credit to your account which you cannot cash out, unless you close your account!
Sounds like they don't want solar on their grid...
@@ProjectsWithDave That's my take as well... We historically had a pretty decent NM arrangement, but the electric company renegotiated a new contract with the state last year, and it's certainly not in the consumer's best interest going forward!
I think it's only a matter of time before the lavish NM programs fade away as solar gets cheaper and it begins to cut into their profits in a more significant way...
I Think I will Just Get it Done, Then The Government can Pound Sand, and I have no intention of selling Power to the Grid, for 10 cents on the Dollar. if you build it they will not come ...
You must live in California? I’m glad I went off grid, I didn’t have to do any of this BS!
I live in Ohio, still plenty of red tape, even here.
Yeah pay you half for what you give them then they charge twice as much selling it they wont get one kilowatt second from me
You have to consider the utility splits the rate you pay into at least two categories. For example: Part of the rate is distribution, the cost of installing and maintaining the lines $0.10/kWh. The other part is power production $0.04/kWh. They can't pay you more for your production than what is purchased on the open market, it wouldn't make good business sense. Over production moves you from a consumer saving $0.14/kWh to a wholesale producer earning $0.04/kWh. That's why it makes the most sense not to overproduce too much if you want your system to pay off quickly. You can see the analysis in this video on net metering: ua-cam.com/video/IwUK1dNJ3n8/v-deo.html
@@ProjectsWithDave well this is what i see happening everyone getting on solar com ed doesn’t need to make power and still charging people sorry but com ed can kiss my rear end staying in business and they should of had lines buried decades ago that money going into their pockets no way they spend all that extra on line maintenance
@@ProjectsWithDave and thank you for the reply
The utilities are only going to give you less and less for your energy as this technology disruption happens. You are much better off financially today investing in enough storage to carry your house in the evening, than relying on solar credits to offset your consumption.
Lights where are the lights? Solar panels need lights! Just add lights! Wind power just add a fan! Hydro power just pump the water back into the lake!
Are you saying that you paid someone to get the plan set done for you? Because in that case, I'm a little disappointed seeing how I was under the impression this was a DIY channel and maybe you knew something we didn't. You're not the only one that knows how to make a phone and pay to have someone make plan sets for our solar solution, I was simply trying to save a little cash with DIY. I mistakenly assumed you knew something more that us newbies did or that maybe could save us from having to pay exorbitant fees for wiring diagrams and paperwork. NO offence pal, I didn't mean to bother you, I'll just continue searching to see if I can find someone that knows something about it. Thanks.
how much did you pay unbound solar?
You can see my whole cost breakdown in this video: ua-cam.com/video/PNTO83FvaL4/v-deo.html