TF2: Team Fortress 2 is NOT Garry's Mod
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- Опубліковано 3 лис 2023
- guaranteed to be my most disliked video yet, but I can't keep quiet about this
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People need to play on community servers. If you want TF2 to be a digital hangout place to show off your hats in any possible gamemode on any possible map, you already have that option. Let's not fuck with the games core identity and purpose to put trash at the top of the queue with a valve checkmark to appeal to a tiny minority.
About that, I've noticed a lot of the fun wacky gamemodes in the community servers has disappeared. Balloon races, deathrun, VSH and even Prophunt.
All I see in my server browser is 24/7 map servers, is it just me?
@@JoNarDLoLzfilter by map prefix (vsh, dr, jb, etc.)
The community browser is garbage bloated by Skial 24/7 servers with fake ping and fake players (bots) and servers of the like also its just ass to use in general using the steam browers is better but still the same servers its hard to find actual full servers with custom gamemodes
Yeah thats because Gmod is actually TF2
And even then, community servers don't hit the same anymore.
It's just full with 24/7 stuff because people want to get the casual experience but can't because of the bot problem that exists due VALVe's anticheat sucking major ass.
So what should we do to get rid of bots and to revive casual? It's simple, we ask valve to either give a damn about their outdated anticheat, or we come up with our own anticheat that actually kicks bots whenever they try to join
The idea of someone pocketing someone in *PROP HUNT* is genuinely the most insane thing I’ve ever thought of. It’s prop hunt. How did we get here
Easy: laziness and low effort
That’s insane meatriding
Oh hey it's the Sydney man!
what happens when you force 9 classes that were not designed for prop hunt, into prop hunt
How did we get here you say?
Letting the days go by
It's funny. When you say stuff like this, people get angry. But when Uncle Dane, Soundsmith, Funke, or anyone else echo the same sentiment, it's okay.
People get angry because Zesty is apparently bad… for reasons nobody even remembers.
I mean yea Zesty was public enemy number one for saying Sniper was OP, but now it’s an opinion that’s as commonly held as “Remove Critical Hits”. Weird world we live in.
@@onemorescoutsorry but I am relatively new here so i don't know my zesty lore. Why is he controversial other than stating his opinions?
@@geckoking74he said some stuff that one half of the political spectrum disapproved of
People get mad at Zesty because he doesn't mince words or beat around the bush just to be pleasant.
Also, he's said slurs in the past... but, like, it's TF2. You don't even have to play the game to know how TF2 players speak to each other in game.
I think its fucking ridiculous that some people have unironically compared prop hunt (a glorified gimmick from gmod) to MvM in any capacity
MvM was a master class in balancing, map design, boss design (sentry busters were straight up copied to OW), power ups, and rewards. It took actual effort to design MvM. Prop hunt is just a glorified minigame undeserving of officiality in TF2.
@@limptoastgas passer, heavy's upgrades being broken,spy on MvM,
@@elecman748gas passer was added YEARS after MvM and it did get a nerf.
Heavy is a good class in MvM, nothing wrong about that.
Spy is also viable, you're just bad.
@@derp6443i thinkthe person means that certain heavy upgrades are broken like im pretty sure the firing rate upgrade doesnt work on the secobd upgrade tier on the minigun
@@xboxstudentThat's... What he said.
We have GOT to add game modes which will die in 3-6 months! That is surely what our players want!
Careful! Valve might read your comment and ONLY your comment and take it as face value
But TF2 is a fun and wacky game!! Therefore it should be implemented in the game or else you just don't like updates!!!
3-6 months for a new game mode is a major exaduration.
@@carotte9581 The wackiness of TF2 only works if it takes itself seriously. If everything in TF2 is wacky, it becomes absurd humor. The majority of the game modes in TF2 are just mercenaries fight over control points, payload and briefcase over... fucking gravel. On top of that, their employers RED and BLU are just man babies being petty against each other. You might argue Halloween mode is absurd, but it sticks to the lore and even expands it.
Any game mode is fine honestly. It's just prop hunt is a very niche idea that doesn't even fit TF2 at all. Unless it's Merasmus turn everyone into props but then... why would you even want to play prop hunt when you can fight Headless Horseman, Giant Eyes and Merasmus instead.
@@something1122 that is not how you spell exaggeration lol
Seriously? That idiot mapmaker could't force the class switch and implement MvM class switch prevention?
Vscript does allow it ya know.
because they just lazy and don't want to risk for being late for when Eric Smith surf down the workshop, and definitely WILL let these broken game mode released first then fixing them later after receiving backlash from the players that actually plays the game just like the zombie mode and saxton hale
gotta flood the workshop for the holidays!!!!!!!!!!
It really is just trying to get in with the least effort. Do you even earn anything when your maps get added? It's not like anybody's gonna buy map stamps for fucking prop hunt.
@@RayanfhoulaBR You get a self-made map stamp (and bragging rights i guess). Like you said i'm pretty sure nobody would buy prop hunt map stamps, so the creators probably are doing this just for the sake of getting their gamemode in tf2.
He doesn't care. He just wants to make more maps fast so they will be chosen for Christmas update.
This is the main issue with the usage of VScript. It should NOT be used to create experimental gamemodes that feel more like "minigames" than actual gamemodes, VScript is best utilized when adding quirks or something unique to maps to spice up an already-existing gamemode. Perks from Scream Fortress 2023 for example was a more fun minimal addition than the Zombie Invasion maps.
Ironically some of the better usages of VScript was from those Zombie Infection maps, not in anything major like the zombies themselves, but just little map features like working ladders or elevators.
God I loved Perks.
That map was 1000x better than whatever tf graveyard was
@@dajokahbaby1506 Valve got working ladders before Bethesda put ladders in. xD
@@dajokahbaby1506did they use VScript for the elevator? Knowing hammer it’s something I could do without it, using a couple of trigger_multiples
@@dajokahbaby1506 Someone should make a King of the Hill map that takes place in an elevator where the teams are fighting for which floor the elevator stops on, that'd be funny.
Meet Your Match seems really pointless now that official and community servers are almost indistinguishable. Keep up the good work Zesty.
Community servers are honestly better than valve servers at this rate. More and more servers like uncletopia will probably show up if valve keeps adding random things for no reason
We've come full circle
bu-but ma competitive prophunt!!
Meet Your Match was the worst update ever, killed tf2. Absolutely butchered it.
@@ivanthehighman177Quickplay being removed changed nothing.
Vscript can force classes and weapon restrictions, the map makers simply didn't want to make wacky new habilities for to dIvErSiFy te gameplay, which failed, and if one prophunt map gets added there will be 6 nano-updates trying to fix it
no its because forcing you to play scout and scout only is too far even for their standards
Time to play a JRPG in a fps made in 2007! Thanks Gaben, love you! ❤
Honestly a crpg set in the tf2 universe with the mercs as party members would be rad.
@@cmoon2718the last TF2 comic releasing in 2025 as a Visual Novel
I would unironically play a tf2 CRPG, loosely based on the plot of the comic series (the last one is CRPG-only)
Deep groot but it is in houjin
@@cmoon2718 an rpg in the style of what STBlackST do will be fun fan project.
Kinda amusing how Star_'s "What game is this?" video is now more relatable than ever
We unironically need to pray for Eric Smith and Valve in general, because he has no idea the kind of desperate freaks trying to change tf2 for selfish ends with little love for the game. Your rant was intense but needed.
Eric, like many of the creators on the workshop, don't actually care for TF2 at all
I'm sure Eric only works on TF2 because he probably played a poker match, lost, and the rest of Valve made him the unlucky sod who aha to work on the 17yr old game by himself instead of making and cancelling VR games every year
@@burgertanker7970 You having a Shrek avatar is so funny because I remember reading TF2 is like Shrek in that devs who are to be "punished" are sent to work on the game, like bad animators for Prince of Egypt at DreamWorks were made to work on Shrek.
Those fucking selfish freaks adding prophunt to TF2, I can't stand how they're adding their favourite decades old gamemode instead of mine.
shrek is in limbo and practically living off memes. Like tf2
It was just intense. Thats literally it. It wasnt needed.
I honestly wonder how exactly are you supposed to rationalize this gamemode from a story perspective. The base game is mercenaries fighting over land, Mann Vs Machine is those merceneries defending that piece of land from a robotic third party, scream fortress, while ridiculous is those merceneries defending their land against a supernatural force, exactly what is prop hunt supposed to be? Has this setting just become a playground?
Even VSH works because canonically Saxton Hale loses ownership of Mannco because he refused to fight Gray mann's daughter
Zombie at least has justification during Scream Fortress because Merasmus does a lot of strange things around then. It would've worked great if they just made a tie-in comic to explain it.
@@MrJoeyWheeler Or they could have just introduced some Merasmus lines into the gamemode's intro, would have established his presence directly, like in Scream Fortress
@@MrJoeyWheeler For ZI, some of the UA-cam tutorials about it just made up the premise that the whole mess was Medic's experiments gone wrong and used that framing to explain stuff.
We can explain prop hunt like some smissmas curse, when some kind of smissmas merasmus or old nick spell red or blue team to prop and some team need to destroy them for snacks and smissmas stuff. If they don't, so the team, who was prop, return to human, win and revenge. I think its sounds much of tf2 story for one smissmas season, like Halloweens maps.
What? You mean you DON'T like being given slop and told it's actually a good thing?
Oh boy! My favorite, more broken, unfun gamemodes that will die after the update they came out in is over. Why can't we just keep these gamemodes to community servers? Community servers, do what ever you want, but we don't need "Scout eats a hotdog and dies" as an official gamemode. Somethings should just remain as community content, not "official".
Ah yes, Scout eats a hotdog and dies, my second favorite gamemode, second only to Heavy slams his [redacted] in the spawn room door and contracts sepsis.
The community servers version of prophunt on TF2 was the only one I liked outside of Gmod because the semi-cartoony style fits it well and the creators made it actually pretty balanced between the props and hunters, but I agree that it shouldn’t be an actual official game mode
be scout
have prop hunt on outside map
disguise as control point
find highest point of map, perch
you can't be seen from below. profit.
@@ChronoSquare nah bro Red Motionless Pyro is the real top meta pick.
Zesty being bitter but he is right.
There are reasons why certain things need to stay as community and not offical, adding these things just turning the game into something it isnt
The objective of hunting and eliminating props is also just too demanding of a task for some crowds. When prop hunt was added to call of duty 4 remastered, the props won every single match due to all the pea brains in the community. This resulted in the devs being forced to nerf the props by limiting how many times they could change appearance and making them whistle every one in awhile to give away their location to the hunters
Oh my fucking god.....
And the hunters still lose constantly. But that's mostly because of the rounds being very short.
I'm impressed that the version of prop hunt being described is so terrible and yet there's a worse version of it in a different game. As if getting garbage tier maps like wutville wasn't bad enough, we can now expect entirely terrible game modes.
If only they at least had the decency to put this trash into its own server rotation.
That’s pathetic 😂
Also, the average communication between players of the same team in a casual lobby is so minimal that playing prop hunt in TF2 would either be too hard or too easy depending on how good (or bad) the props co-operate. But even then, playing PropHunt in TF2 does not feel like playing TF2
What I’m wondering is why Fort Wars hasn’t been brought back via VScript. I guess one could argue that Fortnite covers that niche nowadays, but Fort Wars as a community mod predates it by quite a while and it was really fun. The basic idea of it was that the maps had very little clutter, and during setup you could build different destructible props on the defending team(s) but otherwise it was still TF2.
Separate tangent here: adapt some of the old Arena maps into regular KOTH maps please. A lot of theme were very fucking cool aesthetically.
bringing Arena modes back in Alternative game modes and giving some Graveyard improvements like Dispenser Ghosts and Last Man standing buffs would have been great.
Koth variants of Arena mode maps would also be interesting. Offblast and Watchtower for example would be cool to see. plus if we think about it, Arena mode is Koth with the "take and hold control point or kill opposing team to win, but you all have a single life" version.
I want to see Lumbyard as a KOTH ngl.
@@drivanradosivic1357or... have respawns.
I wholeheartedly agree. The closest we got to a VScript gamemode that fit TF2 was VSH, because it was still based on in-universe characters and events, and still functioned as TF2 (classes with their weapons). And even that fell off massively after the initial hype of the summer update. This really is the end game of TF2 and it couldn’t be sadder to see
It's definitely that game mode where the community version is a million times better than the casual version. You only play as Hale, and it doesn't give you the same freedom of movement the OG version has. It's really cool regardless, but the classic version along with Freak Fortress will always be played over Vscript VSH.
Would you rather we got no new game modes at all?
@@Fanboy-hf1iu yes
Bro this is a workshop SUGESTION. It's not in the game and this game isn't going to die because VSH has less players than payload. In fact, I queued for 100 matches with all maps on and got VSH 11 times, the same amount as CP, with 6x less maps. And zombie survival is a seasonal mode that plays rather well. And before you argue that it doesn't fit tf2, it's literally a bunch of guy with melee trying to kill guys with guns, not to mention that pass tike, manpower, and medieval mode are all in the game and not Halloween restricted.
@@tides8464Pass Time is dead, and Mannpower has waaayyy less players than CTF. The only misc mode that's still alive and well is Medieval
9:50 If we're defining TF2 as a game focused on classes fighting over territory control and defense (as defined at 10:57), technically speaking Zombie Infection does follow that principle, though admittingly a bit more loosely. Survivors (for the most part) defend a fortified location to stay alive as long as possible. The zombies attack that location trying to get kills to increase their ranks. The game mode is a twisted version of Attack/Defend maps where instead of attacking or defending an objective, your attacking or defending other players (and yourself). Implementing that into the game, by the definition presented in the video, makes at least some logical sense.
Prop Hunt on the other hand... yeah, it is not even close to Arena maps.
Even the zombie have class that need other to win. A team full of zombie scout is useless, they are too weak, a team full of heavy and they are too slow
Prophunt team full of one class are.... the same you just hide
I'd personally much prefer if Stop That Tank was added as a VScript mode, since at its core it's still Payload just with a few twists in that the cart moves on its own and can be destroyed by RED, as well as the CTF-like part when the cart is destroyed where a random BLU becomes a giant. But sadly this is what'll be added instead along with 25 new (reskinned) maps and a cosmetic case that screams "I LOVE CHRISTMAS, I LOVE CHRISTMAS".
Also did anyone else notice how like 90% of the items added at Halloween were all submitted to the Workshop this September?
STT was shutted down by it's creators in 2019, check their group
If Valve adds prop hunt then it will actually be joeover. This is ultimately what happens to desperate games who try to remain relevant to as many as possible. But in this instance Valve is just having absolutely no QA
Fuck, even fortnite added prophunt and a TTT (among us) clone
@@tellyg7985do NOT call trouble in terrorist town among us😭😭
If prop hunt is added to casual, then valve opens the Pandora’s box and we’ll never be able to close it
@@tellyg7985fortnite is basically roblox now so who cares
For next halloween we'll get among us
I love seeing myself pop up in the background. It was honestly laughable that I could just play engie, tap fire every prop I saw with my pistol, and then just build a dispenser to reset my health. All challenge: gone.
Game mode: if you miss you lose health !
Medic: hold my beer
Man i feel sorry that you had to go through that boredom
Seeing this happen hurts. Porting this haphazardly shouldn't be the world we live in.
The community evidently don't deserve him because of how much they bitch and moan about him spitting facts.
@@thebreadbringer9522 which is pretty sad. People can't listen to reasoning or see how design is anymore because emotions come first. At least there's people that try to understand admist the emotion.
Its like if they made surf an official game mode
wouldnt work because tf2 players have yet to figure out how to airstafe, let alone surf
if its in the never to be finished training mode, A: smack in the face, B: where surf belongs.
The sad part is that a toy factory could totally work as a Smissmas map. Like, make it payload, with the mercs going in to blow away Old Nick's workshop after he died.
They did make a map about this, it's called Wutville.
@@evdestroy5304 but the performance was *ss so we need a better one with good optimizations
@@30.lehoanggiaphuc61 How about we just don't get one at all
Yea I agree with this, VSH and Zombie are marginally acceptable because they still follow the basic tf2 formula of "shoot enemies alongside teammates", but random arena mode gmodshit just doesnt work. genuinely cant think of any more established community modes that actually would work, mostly as i havent played them all
All I can think of is like, maybe a christmas map where you pick up presents on the ground and it activates a RollTheDice effect? Maybe give us a more well-made and mechanically involved TerritoryControl map than Hydro by using the power of vscript?
So many games in the last 6 years have tried adding prop hunt to their game type selection and all of them have ended in failure or mediocrity. Game modes designed for gmod should STAY in gmod. It’s the best version of prop hunt and helps give gmod its own identity outside of being a digital playground for children
"wahhh wahhh zesty is being mean by hating on workshop creators"
Nah. Uh-uh. The workshop is tailor-made for those trying to get maps officially in the game. If something goes up on the workshop with hopes of making its way into TF2, criticism is absolutely warranted if it's low-quality.
In retrospect, the Summer update was the biggest Monkey's Paw I've seen since 2017, we did in fact get an official update done by "the community", and that's all we're gonna until Valve personally shuts item servers down for good, hope you're all ready another year workshop slop in 2024 👍
vscript is cool for alot of things that i think can properly fit in tf2s bounds, like vsh. but its also making things a little weird and goofy and shitty.
We did not need zombie infection we needed more support for VSH, they basically showed us it's already being ignored/forgotten and that instead they are fine putting weird gamemodes as unfitting as they may be
They already crossed the line so i can only hope they stop with this bs
how does adding zombie infection remove support for vsh
yeah its 2 diff community devs what. its not valve making these maps and splitting time to improve it.
@@nonyabusiness5186less attention to vsh causing the mode to die
I fucking hate the argument of "Hey, this piece of slop is in the game! Then why can't we get this other piece of slop too?!"
It wouldn't even be playable for most people because of the bots. I can't believe Valve still adds stuff to this game when there are hundreds of bots ruining casual mode.
As much as I agree that zombie infection doesn't really fit tf2's style that much, I do really enjoy the mode, and with some changes it could hopefully become something like degroot keep. But prop hunt is absolutely the kind of thing for community servers, not the main game
Yeah Zombie infection at least still tries to maintain the mercenary identities in a pretty TF2-like gamemode at least. I don't think any of the maps are particularly good though, they're either too chokey and cluttered or way too open with nothing inbetween. Makes it hard to really tell how much any class needs to be changed to be balanced better
@@OmegaRC59 The maps definetly need some work, but I think it's a good first debue for the mode.
It would have been great for a single, polished halloween map with a comic to accompany it.
9:28 prop hunt as an end-of-round gimmick sounds really cool actually
And it should remain a gimmick at the end of the round, if at all
There is a very old plugin that do that. I rarely see it tho
Zesty saying facts, nothing new
IF YOU SAY "JUST DONT PLAY IT", READ THIS:
Screw this guy! Lets add every game mode to casual! Prop hunt? Trade servers? 200 rocket jump maps? Randomizer? Friendly servers? Deathrun? Jailbreak? MGE? x100? Smash Bros? Dodgeball? Surf? BHop? Class Wars? Sniper Fort? Chuck it all in!
You may think this is extreme, but how far from the base game is too far? Where do you draw the line? Prop hunt is way further from "TF2" than something like VSH. Clearly if workshoppers see valve is adding a new gamemode every update they are gonna keep creating a gamemode every update, I mean the calculus is easy for them as it gives the highest chance of getting their maps added. Of course quality just goes down over time (VSH > Zombie Infection > Prop Hunt) as all the good ideas have been done and development time is stretched thin.
To the people who say "Just Don't Play It", here's a list of reasons (in no particular order) I came up with in just a few minutes as to why that's an awful argument. I wasn't on the debate team in high school, but hopefully this rambling can give someone a better understanding of where people are coming from when they try to gatekeep the content that gets added to TF2:
- Stretching the Playerbase Thin: They are adding maps at a ridiculous rate, and these maps either stay year-round and/or will show up in all the future years' seasonal events. We've all seen this through this years Scream Fortress, the amount of maps and contracts is just insane, with very few of the maps standing out as being fun. Diluting the player base like this makes it hard to find a server for a specific map (or get one with good ping), and of course this affects those who aren't playing the "new content" as well.
- New Player Experience: These goofy gamemodes are pushed to the top of the featured queue at update time, making it one of the first things players try out when they boot the game. Just imagine how much of a chaotic and awful experience it would be for a new player (or a returning player upon hearing about an update) to be thrown into a zombie infection map, or even something like saxton hale where they die right away and then sit there doing nothing. For me personally a close friend who plays CS a lot tried TF2 for the first time during the halloween update and he said it really didn't click for him. I don't know what his exact experience was, but I can say if I were playing the game for the first time I would not want to be thrown into these maps full of goblins and gimmicks. Of course, a terrible new player experience harms us all whether we play the new game mode or not.
- Cannibalizing Community Servers: Since the release of Meet Your Match people have been complaining about how valve is killing community servers by having the majority of the playerbase on their official servers. From that point onward community servers have become mainly a place to play gamemodes that you cannot find in casual. Once all the big gamemodes get added officially, how can community servers continue to exist, and what benefit do they provide to the playerbase? We don't need these wacky gamemodes officially because they already exist in community servers. If you want to play prop hunt so bad, guess what? You can! In fact, you can play it right now, no need to wait until Christmas! Or perhaps more accurately, you can't .... the servers that host it are dead because its a gamemode that has little replayability and really isn't that fun.
- Novelty Wears Off Fast: Even VSH, a well made gamemode with over a year of development time (and many more years to learn lessons through the community version before VScript) has failed to keep people playing in casual mode, and we are only a few months after its release. We see the same thing with Zombie Invasion mode already having significantly less players than the other halloween maps (which aren't anything special mind you), and its been out for less than a month. The reality is the people here who say they want prop hunt will play it for an hour or two and then never touch it again. These maps will just pollute the casual menu and be a stain on the game like the other failed gamemodes that came before (e.g. pass time)
- Wasted Development Resources: Clearly, from the botched launches of VSH and Zombie Infection we can see that adding these VScript gamemodes to casual is more than just a copy and paste job for the dude working on tf2. After update day there are several days of fixes that need to be pushed out to get them to a playable state. This chunk of the tf2 team's very limited time can be put towards things with a much better return on investment. Of course, they don't do this now, but imagine if the tf2 team spent just one work day picking out a few items from the mountain of trash weapons in the game and tweaking their stats slightly. Something like a caber buff and a few other weapon rebalances would take so little effort and would make seasonal updates more enjoyable for everyone. Even if they don't do this, they can always put more time into going through the higher-quality community fixes or picking better cosmetics / war paints (notice how we didn't get a war paint case for halloween?). Now that I think about it, its kind of sad how we can get several rebalance updates for things like VSH and Zombie Invasion but haven't gotten any changes to the base game in so long.
- Complacency: TF2 has a grim future if all our updates three times a year are just going to look like this. Did valve have anything in the works after blue moon? Who knows, but if they did its probably never going to see the light of day now. Why would they need to lift a finger if they can just get the community to make everything for them. And when valve no longer does anything, they don't have power to enforce any quality standards, as when there is nothing but garbage on the workshop, they either add garbage or add nothing, and the playerbase is left holding the L. It seems like valve wanted to try something different in this years summer update (seen though the blog post before it was edited, and adding the community fixes tab to the workshop), but in the end this didn't materialize and valve realized they can just copy paste the new gamemode from the workshop instead to try and make the update feel special. To this day, workshop community fixes are left dying on the vine and who knows if we will ever see them in game.
- Bloat: The amount of maps getting added into the game is just insane, and now we have each seasonal update adding hundreds of megabytes to the file size for next to no reason. For a game with a large casual audience and many people that don't have powerful computers (me included) I think this a very real concern. Additionally, with non-existent quality control on valve's end we get lots of maps in the game that are just horribly optimized and basically unplayable for those who play TF2 for the actual gameplay.
- There is also a lot to be said about not turning TF2 into a sandbox, as there are already plenty of games out there with that exact purpose where you can play things like prop hunt and billions of other generic minigames already. Why do we need another? TF2 is a very stylized game, and a unique one at that and its sad to see that charm fade. Anyway this topic has been discussed to death already by people who can express this thought much better than I can so I will leave it at that.
Pin this comment zesty
TL;DR
"Just don't play it!!!"
"ok i wont play it"
*Maps end up being played by barely anyone and it dies out like mannpower/pass-time, ending in just bloat for the game*
"did you winned or not"
addendum: literally the only real "community fix" we got was the teleporter particles fix after so many years, since them we just get "community fixes" so minuscules they are barely anything (like a recent patch, which one of the community fixed was just a minor fix to the fucking ARENA hud, lmao) no stuff like BLU scout pant fix, no other class fixes, viewmodel fixes or anything, is fucking sad and depressing
You *should've* been on the debate team.
It's sad to think about how the game is in the state that it's currently in due to the lack of gatekeeping. Thank you for being one of the few modern content creators to have a positive influence on this game.
Gatekeeping is the wrong word, quality-control is what you're looking for.
@@anapia5051Begone foul beast! Back to the slop pits of Fortnite and Roblox with ye! I cast thee down, tourist!
@@anapia5051 gatekeeping ruins a community and fresh stuff would never happen. Besides, TF2 is heavily gatekeeped by how maps are made (hammer)
@@cewla3348Good, because if someone wants to make a map they better put some goddamn effort in instead of baby's first TF2 map (wutville)
@@cewla3348 The only people who complain about gatekeeping are those the gate was meant to keep out.
The only way I could see prophunt making sense in TF2 would be in the context of Merasmus wizard shenanigans as part of a Halloween map gimmick, much like the bumper cars, and there's already a precedent given he does it himself in Ghostfort. (EDIT: Zesty beat me too it in the video lol.) But as its own dedicated game mode in official servers? Just why? It's way too out there to make sense from a lore and core gameplay loop perspective.
Personally... I've always been the type of person who stands by the opinion, that TF2 should only add content that contextually makes sense.
The argument of Vs Saxton Hale works, as the entire idea of Mercenary Park, was to get the Mercs fighting for amusement. Having Saxton himself get involved fits the spirit of TF2 to some extent. The same can be said for Zombie fortress to a lesser extent. We already had the Voodoo souls, and it could be explained that Merasmus or the Mann Brothers are responsible (maybe after dying, they hired Undead Mercs to kill the living ones). I'd even tolerate something like The Hidden as it can work in certain ways... but at the same time; this stuff was fine tuned for Garry's Mod for a reason... we don't need them to add TTT to TF2.
Prop Hunt makes 0 sense in TF2, no matter how you slice it. It was fun as a joke in Community servers, alongside most of the gimmick modes, but in the main game... playing this feels like TF2 is just being disrespected.
who the heck would install a class based shooter game just to play hide and seek
Makes me think about new players who instantly choose Spy
@@Halevolt I mean, you still play the main game as Spy, who would want to play ONLY hide and seek in a CLAss based shooter.
This is the first time I've seen tf2 gameplay footage that''s actually boring as shit. Why the ever flying fuck would anyone want to play a gamemode that's entirely static in a game that focuses on fast paced mobility and High octane gameplay. Do people really want to stand still as a chair for 5 minutes straight before the round ends? You want that as an official gamemode? as opposed to all of the other cool shit on the workshop that further enhances tf2's gameplay, you want a gamemode that you can not only play in community servers but also in loads of other games? Why?
It just further bloats the game and makes it harder for people who play on craptops to actually handle the game itself. There's already a boatload of content that we only see once a year that's taking up space. We don't need more time restricted content when the game's size is as big as it is. Even if it wasn't, It would still die off like VSH or Mannpower, People want to play their favoriite game with fun new additions, not an entire overhaul.
TF2 is starting going the route of every other major multiplayer game right now where they just keep constantly bloating the game with unfinished and rushed content in order to try and keep the game relevant for a bit longer.
5:09 that guy trying to run away and turn into another prop then turning into a massive truck instead
This kind of reminds me of what happened to Hearthstone. Originally, everything revolved around this one card game with a standard and competitive mode (effectively the same thing) and an arena mode. Overtime they started to make slight spin offs with moderate amounts of popularity. Now there are multiple games within this same game. Some of them kind of work, like MvM in TF2. But others have fizzled out.
The difference is, Hearthstone doesn't suffer as much from all these wacky shot in the dark gamemodes because most matches only require 2 or 8 players at once and they have a decent sized team actively working on most of the game.
There are more players who have won 142 rounds on powerhouse than players who have won 10 rounds of PASS time.
Do these people play ONLY TF2? Like, if they want to play something like this just buy another game or whatever. Next time we’ll get Need For Speed or fucking Mortal Kombat
They should all these too, actually
tf2 never actually played another game, and it really shows
I cant wait for the summer 2024 update to add achievement\_idle\_awesomebox to the map pool
I’m so glad Valve didn’t add Slop Hunt. I just hope the workshop will push for gamemodes that actually fit within the game instead of gmod role play garbage.
I love G Mod, I love all the 9 classes of G Mod and the team-based gameplay
this games biggest problem has, for years, been a lack of actual long term direction and the community is so hell bent on making it worse
If you look at old updates, you'll pretty clearly see that it never had much direction in the first place, just the most random additions, like do you remember the old soda popper? Or the BFB when it was first added? Or how about the very existence of the pomson and righteous bison? Even in development, it never had much direction, they initially were gonna give the game a serious modern military theme. But everyone forgets that because they like to parrot what all the big youtubers are whining about this month.
I hope valve adds DarkRP to the misc area.
Only new gamemode I'd think of adding is tdm. Mainly because a bunch of koth maps devolve into tdm until the timer gets low
Every mode is already TDM in Casual, all an official mode would do is make the time limit shorter
Player destruction is probably what you are looking for and gives an objective on top of the tdm
2Fort:
Player destruction.
@@slyseal2091 hightower:
As a Saxton fan and a Zombie Infection tolerator, I really hope prop hunt doesn't get in. Its just crossing a line I don't think tf2 needs
I was cool with vsh because it was very tf2 oriented and has been part of tf2 since almost the beginning. Zombie infection I was iffy on because it's not really tf2 and doesn't feel like it fits as much. Prop hunt is stupid lmfao.
imagine if Valve doesn't add prophunt. I think that would be funny
We have come to a time where i would genuelly love whoever is accepting this kind of stuff in the game to have some sense and literally scold workshop creators
I don't want to reach a point where they make more harm than Velve's neglect
I actually like it if valve just STOP adding updates to tf2. L4d and half-life had gotten no update for years and are doing strong
Feel like at this rate the "community" just hate him cause of past shit and cant let it fuckin go at all and it bothers me considering the fact that Zesty makes really good points in his videos and then the god damn "community" just blows away the points cause they cant let go of old shit and its stupid
I never thought id see the day where TF2 tries to be left 4 dead and gmod
I'm just here waiting them to add Horsemann jr. and Vagineer to VSH.
Hey Vscripters, remember the Stop That Tank plugin? Maybe we could try making that an actual game mode instead of just randomly throwing things at the wall. I'm just saying, that could be an actual fun game mode where the robots are trying to take over some of the land Redmond and Blutark already have by Graymann, plus it would mark the first time the robots are actually playable outside of plugins and such.
that was basically crasher but i will not mind to see an fully fledged vscript version
yeah that what I'm saying. that would be a twist on normal playload. along some changes have to be made since I remember the defending side had a edge given they had revie stuff
if this get added we absolutely need a #StopFckingTF2 hashtag, maybe we'll get a new tf2's twitter post
I like to believe valve gave us vscript to enhance community servers specifically. The only way these things should be allowed in TF2 casual is through adding a twist into a new map with an already established gamemode. Like Payload but each cap has 1 of 3 branching pathways. CTF but each cap spawns an mvm boss outside the losers spawn. 5 CP but every so often 3 players from each team are put in an MGE cage match against each other with the winner getting 15 seconds of Uber and crits. Basically just add small twists to established gamemodes. Don't make new ones for casual that don't feel like a team class based shooter.
I fear it's only a matter of time before I start chasing a low HP scout and he just builds a fucking wall in front of me.
Man it's almost like game designer is an actual job title and can't be done by anyone who has played a video game once.
I'm calling it now...we are getting slender fortress next halloween.
Cannot wait for mario to be officially added to the game alongside shrek.
I disagree on zombie infection and prophunt being on remotely the same level.
Zombie infection, while taking extreme liberties in some areas, generally keeps many of the core concepts of the game intact. The classes have the same roles (on red, and on blue they have unique individual roles), most of the mechanical skills from normal play transfer and teamwork is essential for both teams. As a seasonal gimmick that puts a wacky spin on typical TF2 content, it works, at least conceptually. The lack of play testing and the heavy handed last minute balancing is a serious problem, but it lies with the team which ported the gamemode to vscript and not the gamemode itself.
The spirit of TF2 is still alive in zombie infection, even if the mode deviates extremely from the norm. Prophunt, on the other hand, feels like a completely different game murdered TF2 in its sleep and is now walking around wearing its skin. There's nothing in the game mode that resembles anything you would ever see in normal TF2. What remains of TF2's unique design acts as a detriment to the game mode instead of adding depth. TF2 zombie infection provides a new, TF2 flavored experience compared to other zombie infection games provide. TF2 prophunt is just normal prophunt made worse by what little of TF2's personality remains.
Normalise and encourage gatekeeping, protect the game's identity.
9:10 did you slap your desk with your hand to bring the point across?
i mean yes vscript is a heaven for tf2 modding, but we're straying away from the core game too much.
it's an first person SHOOTER, not a first person spend-10-hours-of-your-life-waiting-er.
so modders, incorporate some more shooting and actual action into the game, will ya?
Y know, I am a huge fan of Dunkey, and one thing I distinctly remember him saying is that critics don’t criticize things as harshly as they should, and I agree with it entirely. Many members of the TF2 community like to tell Zesty that he’s too harsh or rude about real problems TF2 has, and I hate that, because the truth is that Zesty is absolutely right, and people hate to think that he is because he critiques it with full honesty and objectivity. Thanks for having balls, Zesty.
You know it's serious when Zesty drop 3 videos in the last 4 weeks
V-Script gamemodes peaked with VSH. Instead of getting Zombie Fortress this halloween, we should've gotten more VSH maps. I believe the only problem with VSH is that most of it's popularity at the start was hype. However, it deserves much more than that. It, by all means was a perfectly fine gamemode, and I'm sure everyone would've loved to see a new map or two for Scream Fortress. We should've just stuck with it, instead of trying to cram more into TF2.
Gonna be honest, this entire video completely misses the point of how to even have fun in a video game.
Tearing down tf2 to it's bones and reconstructing it into some new and barely recognizable pile of gimmicky and novel ideas IS the future of this game. Just picture it:
The year is 2037, tf2 is now at 700,000 players, and it's still climbing up the ladder of steam's popular games page. There is now only one or two servers at most per gamemode, with the vast sea of content being too large even for this massive new player base. The most popular modes are now: 10RJ (10x randomizer jailbreak), which still runs on the same 3 maps (cp_orange, plr_highertower, and ctf_2fooooooort) despite the new surplus of maps, giving older players the perfect 2007 experience they remeber from 30 years prior;
FRP (furry role-play), where you play through a visual novel in which you can find your furry soul mates;
24/7 Casino, where you can gamble and earn in-game currency in order to become rich off of hats and unusuals, with microtransactions that will lead to many of the 30 year old tf2 players who stuck around losing their homes from poverty;
TF3, which completely removes anything recognizable except for the characters, and turning the game into a fun match-3 game that you can play on your steam deck in order to obtain currency for 24/7 casino;
finally, you've got a gamemode that's actually dedicated to making maps and gamemodes, and those gamemodes can be put directly onto the workshop for them to be added to the game. This might sound like it'd lead to a lack of quality control, but luckily the emporium is now in complete and absolute legal control over anything that gets added into the game, so it will be guaranteed that everything added next (which has now gone up to 45 maps minimum per update) will be the objectively with the highest tier of quality.
How could you possibly be against something as great as this? TF2 would maintain it's status as one of the greatest games ever. You clearly just want to stomp and tarnish this game until it dies, there's obviously no other reason out there as to why you'd be so heavily opposed to updates or any kind of content. You are clearly a tyrant who is abusing this platform to attack and harass individual workshop creators. It's disgusting how you think you could possibly take over the workshop sphere and force everyone into believing your arbitrary beliefs.
Amazing comment, had me in the first half ngl
You little goblin. You almost had me there.
You really had me with this one, until it got too ridiculous and I knew it was a joke comment
i hope your watching these kinds of videos, eric smith. listen to the people that actually give a fuck about the game in the long term, not the tiny (albeit vocal) minority that doesnt give a fuck about the core mechanics of the game and ONLY cares about the AESTHETICS of the game, thereby twisting the core mechanics into only something THEY care about.
Can't wait for Smissmas 2024 where they add achievement_idle as a casual map.
I can’t believe someone looked at Merasmouse hiding as a pine tree in a map and thought “Let’s have a gamemode that does this and nothing else”
Does anyone actually like playing hide and seek on ghost fort?
9:10 and I'm going to say it, the only reason people haven't abandoned MvM like they did Passtime, Mannup, and VS Saxton Hale is because it is gambling.
you’re the hero we need but don’t deserve
Facts. We need Zesty now more than ever
PUT SLOP ON IT AND MAKE IT GOOFY
AND MAKE (it) LAME! RANDOM OBJECT ON HEAD HAT
i thought it was cool that we got an official VSH gamemode, then thought they were pushing it with zombie infection, but why tf do we need prophunt?
right? if they're gonna add any "out there" gamemode it should be tfdb, at least then you'd get better at airblasting
@@SanaeKochiya that honestly wouldn't fit either, we really just dont need anymore "minigames". like zesty said, vscript should be used to add small things into normal tf2
@@SanaeKochiyaah yes a gamemode where youre restricted to 1 class, fits perfectly
"JUST DONT PLAY IT IF YOU DONT LIKE IT!!!" Is probably the best advice if it gets added in the game. Dont even try it, keep the playercount as dry as passtime at the peak of the Smissmas event.
new passtime map on smissmas
I finally get why your username is "ZestyJesus". It's because they hated you for telling the truth.
TF2 is its own thing while Garry's Mod is a derivative of Half Life 2. It's that simple. Calling the two the same is like saying Team Fortress 2 and Half Life 2 are the same thing.
Consume mid game modes, consume tacky hats, consume degenerate bait, consume product
Angry man ends up actually having a point.
Gary's Mod exists.
We see the same issue with Dungeons and Dragons 5e.
Yeah, you can homebrew it to hell and back to make a sci-fi gun & tech based RPG, but at that point just play the Cyberpunk TTRPG.
The added insult to injury is the inherent staleness that is prop hunt. Eventually, within each map, the pattern of what is actually inside each map can be learned and easily defeated by anyone who spots the difference. I don't know any easy cures for this, which is GUARANTEED to happen if this becomes official.
Plus, there are no cheesy half exploits such as being the capture point prop - which is see-through from the bottom - and hiding at the very extreme top of the map. Man, I forget what server that was, but the fact I'm recalling those days this easily after thinking about prop hunt this quickly... dang, man.
Hammer guy here, the easy cure is to place an abundance of props and randomly hide half, which is a thing you can do when making a map.
It was also used in an innovative way to create a randomly generated underworld for that one halloween map I forgot the name of.
@@ViciousVinnyD I wasn't sure if such a trick could be accomplished. I don't know if these current uploaded prop hunt maps do this; they almost need to do so in order to not instantly start growing stale.
Neat.
the sad thing is you fucking know they're going to add it
I find it disturbing that creators are trying to flood the map section of the workshop with this garbage, in attempt to brute force a pick. Absolutely terrible.
The worst part is how shameless they are about making things to get added to the game to boost their income or recognition (in the case of cosmetics and maps respectively). Honest workshop content is a scarcity now...
Can’t wait for Zesty to be seen as this oh so terrible villain for the umpteenth time because people misconstrue his passion for this game and its integrity to be vitriolic, hate filled gatekeeping. Oh, and that some big name TF2 content creator to share these same sentiments months after Zesty was lambasted for them.
I can't wait for furry rp servers to be officially added to TF2
Discounting it's ill fitting place in the lineup of official TF2 modes, prop hunt is also something terribly dull unless you're doing it with friends. It's a social game mode, which isn't really something to be attempted in casual tf2. Prop hunt with randoms just seems to devolve into find a spot, sit there, afk until you win or not. There's a level of metagaming and trolling you can do but only if you're already interacting with the other players.
You ever stop and wonder : _What happened to the Original Team behind TF2 ???_
Fun fact : the mode was playtested with real players in a real "casual like" environment the day it released. It wasn't tested before as we all discovered it at that point. Within minutes we found a map that wouldn't work, a way for props to softlock the hunters in spawn and most players agreed that we would rather have something else.
Vscript clearly makes mappers rush developpement and ignore testing. Im glad VSH at least was made with tons of testing beforehand, but I can't say the same with ZI of PH.
i am waiting for vscript battleroyal inside tf2
Thank you Zesty for being the voice of reason in this community. Doubt Valve will improve but one can dream
So they have time to add new game modes but no new weapons?
Hot Take: *_NOTHING_* in TF2 will ever be as interesting to play around with as occasional balance changes making us change and try out new loadout combinations. Not a bloated amount of maps, not a bloated amount of gamemodes, *_NOTHING._*
...Well ok, l would genuinely play the hell out of FortWars if it was brought to vscript, but *_NOTHING ELSE._*
So please Valve, for the love of christ on a goddamned bike, *_GIVE US WEAPON BALANCE CHANGES AGAIN._*
I agree 👍
Thank you, Big Joey Slap Nuts
sweet happy to see big joey here
Zesty x Joey collab???
@@nikolaitheundying big jesus or zesty joey. you pick which is better
The B in Big Joey stands for Based
I totally agree. Stop oversaturating TF2 with weird gamemodes like this.
aren't community servers the place for this?
Yeah i totally concur about gamemodes should NOT stray further away from the core gameplay of TF2.Zombies and VSH was acceptable to say the least.Prop Hunt has no place in Official TF2 servers even in seasonal events.
Maybe it is unrelated to the video but Discord to this day whenever I am playing TF2 still shows as if I am playing Garry's Mod lol.
same