@@js5072, paycalls were usually at the Headquarters building. All hands mustered then split to two lines based on last name. Step up to the table, show ID, sign the pay roster and get handed your paper check. No direct deposit in my early career. Navy Federal Credit Union was where most jarheads banked. Fair winds and following seas to all.
Yeah, the Marines kind of followed Army conventions through the 1800s and early 1900s (with the exception of specific cultural things like Gunnery Sergeants as gun captains on warships). They diverged a bit as the Army updated their rank structure shortly after World War I while the Marines kept a more World War I-style system. The modern Marine rank system/insignia that you served with came about in 1959
For a rough pay comparison, multiply by 14. $1 in 1945 adjusted for inflation equals $14 today. This makes the enlisted pay grades look very low, but also remember that the cost of living was lower and that the Corps also provided food and lodging.
it would be multiplied by about $19.45 since the dollar was 26.73 grams of silver at the time. This is using the current price of silver in usd as of this writing. You can start using inflation calculator after 1964.
it also stands to reason that service members didn't see their bank account until after the war. For example, if you enlisted in 1939 and didn't get back home until 1945, you had a pretty hefty bank account when you got back. Another example, when I went to Afghanistan as an E-4, I had roughly $700 in my account, after a 9 month deployment, I came back home with roughly $9000, would have had more but my mother decided to steal from me, but that's a story for another day.
My grandfather was a CPL with the second and fourth Marines in WWII. He was on Iwo Jima, Saipan, Guam, and other islands. RIP Grandpa. Fly High and Semper Fi.
How would you even tell the difference between a 1sgt and a Gunny when you walk by and try to greet him? Just take a guess and take the ass chewing after?
they were probably easier on the names due to the lack of knowing the individual. For example, you generally know who your Gunny is and who your 1SGT, so you'd probably get told, "I'm a 1SGT" or something along the lines if you didn't know.
I wonder if the USMC in that time had a custom like they currently (and also did then) in the army where rather than addressing by specific rank as they now do, they would have just used the catchall "Sergeant"
Well by 1972 the number of personnel in Vietnam was down to 24,200 the prior year it was around 156,800 and by end of March 1973 the Us had withdrawn all combat troops from nam. sixty American service members where killed in those last three months. After the last troops withdrew there only remained 250 personnel that still in country with 200 of them marines assigned to guard the US embassy or while the rest were assigned to Defense attaché office (DAO)Saigon. You had low likelihood of a Vietnam assignment upon completion of OCS. Most of those 50 assigned DAO Saigon were responsible for administering military assistance and support to the South Vietnamese armed forces, the gathering and distribution of military intelligence and the performance of normal Defense Attaché functions and that staff included officers from the Army Navy Marine and AF personnel. . Unless your MOS was that background mentioned and even then most of the officers were usually pretty experienced for that assignment. But that's hindsight.
I never got above E-3 LCp..I was discharged with a 100 % disability from Vietnam....the best 2 years of my life..when I was a Pvt I only got 96 dollars a month and I could live on it really good.......Oohrah...
Officers, even 90 day wonders of WWII generally required advanced education of some sort hence they were compensated accordingly. Been that way since Christ was a Corporal.
Renegade I did not know that! Thanks for sharing that. Do you remember that years that took effect? Always good to learn more history about my beloved Corps.
Interesting! Renegade, you have the reference for that? The Navy, from 1886 until 1913, had Petty Officers on starboard watch wear their rate on the right sleeve, while those on Port Watch wore their rate on the left sleeve. Fair winds and following seas.
@@renegade2556 There is an interesting history article titled "Shoulder Patches In WWII" at usmcu.edu. I used to have a large usmc literature collection, but the ex trashed it. So, if you happen across a reference for usmc enlisted rank on the left sleeve only, please update us. Also, I checked my ID card and nowhere on it does it have the word "Dear" on it. As you were. I'll be in the area all day. Semper Fi, Mac Fair winds and following seas to all.
@@renegade2556 usnhistory.navylive.dodlive.mil has an informative article titled "The History of Navy Rank (or Rate): Enlisted Personnel". The reference for port/starboard is there. Aside from that, your deportment, Marine, seems to have taken a turn for the worse. There will be no further discourse. You are dismissed.
@@GySgt_USMC_Ret. will do ,Gunny,, Unfortunately a broken water main trashed all the 1930's'40's and 50's Leatherneck Magazines, personal Pictures and artifacts from My Father and Grandfather and turned everything into a mouldy pile ,which I went through and saved everything I could, but most of the Paper and Photos were completely destroyed, A sewer line broke previosly. The basement is a lousy spot to store things but sometimes there's no alternative. Semper Fidelis, Cpl. Mac.
LCpl rank was created in the Korean War era, and it was a the introduction of those cross rifles we know today, and it made a whole mess of the ranks and there were ‘acting’ ranks without the cross rifles that had a deadline to be promoted or wear the rank below, and the ones that made it. Interestingly enough this is where “Sergeant E-5” comes from as it was a easy way to introduce yourself as a real Sgt and not an Acting Sgt
Late on this, but the equivalent of a terminal lance or a senior lance corporal back then was a Pvt or PFC with a service stripe or two... There are pictures of guys in their service alphas with no chevrons but like two hash marks lol. Different kind of salt back then.
My grandfather who was at pearl on December 7 was an aircraft mechanic. I never met him for obvious reasons but I read dads birth certificate and it said t sgt when I was in the corps in the nineties this was not a rank. I always thought it meant what you confirmed thanx.
Is there an Army version of this coming? This was a super cool, heavily researched video. I know the Army was both complicated and Interesting back in WW2 with Multiple Specialist grades going along with the Sergeant grades.
Thanks. An Army ranks video won't be the next thing but it may come in the future! The Army's system was actually a little less complex, because they ditched the "different grades for different occupations" method of the World War I era for the Technician grades by WW2
Great Video! However at 1:04 The Alphas "Green Coat" is for Reporting into your next duty station or attending a class that has orders attached to it and for Official Marine Photos. I could be wrong but Being in the Marines for a long time and understanding what all uniforms are for I wouldn't be surprised to be wrong.
I Like ur videos :) A video explaning alle the ranks and structures etc of the E-Company 101st Airborne and here upper structure (Batallion/Regiment)(Band of Brothers) trough the hole series would be great. I tryed to find something in the net, but theres no good one. Maybe theres a an example of a Unit in action, which ist not straight from the TOE, because of loses in the field and so on. From start to end of the series, which named charater had which rank and postion and hos they changed over time, eventually without have the right rank from the TOE for the position. I think an nice Ornigram of that would help much to unstand the strucktures and their changes. :) Its every time funny, how simple the US military ranky system ist :D If u compare it with the german, with the many HAUPT/OBER/UNTER/STABS-ranks
Thanks for posting this My Late Father was a WW2 Marine in the Second Air Wing. Here's a quick question I have heard him mention about what he called Buck Sergeant, is that a long ago term for a Sergeant? He told me about the Buck Sergeant had gotten drunk out of his mind one night and the MPs escorted the Buck Sergeant down the street. Lol
Buck Sergeant is basically slang for the lowest Sergeant rank. So a Buck Sergeant wouldn't be a Staff Sergeant, and a Buck Private wouldn't be a Private First Class.
I worked with a Marine who earned a battlefield commission in Korea. After the cease fire in 1953 his rank was reduced to a Warrant officer, (don’t remember what grade); I was wondering how the pay of the Warrant officers compared to commissioned officers.
Basically it was because of back in the 1800s when epaullettes with lots of fringe plus varying numbers of lace on the cuffs were used to denote officer ranks, there wasn't a single rank insignia for Majors and Second Lieutenants. Lieutenant Colonels got the silver oak leaves (in addition to the stuff Majors got to signify rank) while First Lieutenants got the silver bar (in addition to the stuff Second Lieutenants got). In the late 1800s Majors were authorized the gold oak leaves as well; the choice of gold was basically to minimize the number of changes that would have to be made to the overall rank structure. So Lt. Col. stayed silver while Majors got the new gold. In 1916, the Second Lieutenant got its gold bar insignia, again so the First Lieutenant rank didn't have to change its insignia. This change was because the olive drab service uniform was being worn more often and the Second Lieutenant didn't have an insignia to differentiate them from a no insignia private. I believe the extension of the gold being the lower grade to new Warrant Officer rank insignia is just keeping consistent with the precedent, which was mostly out of convenience.
I don't understand why this explanation is way off the mark from my 1944 era Guidebook for Marines. This has a comparative explanation and chart of the three branches of the service and the rank patch for each, including pay. And it most certainly does not correlate with what you show here. And neither jibe with what we used in 1970. SEMPER FI
I don't know what guidebook you're referring to so I can't comment on exactly why. Discrepancies between publications and the things publications were explaining weren't uncommon. The pay in the video is 1942 minimum annual pay, so it may have changed by 1944, or your guidebook may be something different than the minimum annual. This website is one of our sources and lays out the different rank insignia that existed at the time (and what each branch within the Marine Corps called them) pretty well: uniform-reference.net/insignia/usmc/usmc_enlisted_ww2.html And the modern enlisted/NCO ranks didn't exist until 1959, which would explain why this wasn't how it was when you were in
Technical Sergeant is in the Air Force, not the Marines Correction, there is a Tech Sgt in the Marines, however, gunnery Sergeant is the main ranking title, my apologies
In the modern form, 1959. It was on again off again for a while. It existed for a brief time in the 1800s and from 1914-1918, after which it was replaced with Private First Class. During that WW1 era it was represented by a single chevron
My dad was in the Marines the end of World War II. He was stationed in the Panama Canal. He told me he was a carpentry sergeant I'm still not sure what that means. Does anyone have any info.
Technician Grades, similar to Cold War-era Specialist grades (although the modern Army Specialist is different). Basically they were instituted to give specialists (e.g. drivers, radio operators, medics, draftsman, mechanics, etc. etc.) additional pay without the responsibility of being an NCO technically. So 3 stripes plus a T would be a Technician 4th Grade, equivalent in pay to a Sergeant but without the official command responsibility in tables of organization (although they were still referred to colloquially as Sergeants). In tables of organization Technicians were typically included in the junior enlisted section (lumped together with Privates and Private First Class) so even though a Technician 3rd Grade may have Staff Sergeant pay and be called a Staff Sergeant by the boys they were technically not NCOs
It was more or less a specialization thing. It wasn't like today where the progression is SSgt > GySgt > branching off to the line or technical Sgts It was more like, PSgt > branch off into either 1st Sgt or GySgt depending on whether they're line infantry or ordnance > 1st Sgt goes to Sgt Maj and GySgt goes to MyGySgt (typically, although I think before 1st Sgt rose to the same grade as Sgt Maj either 1st Sgt or GySgt could be promoted to Sgt Maj, but not after). Gunnery Sergeants started as an actual role (a gun captain on a naval vessel or artillery gun) so the rank had an actual function rather than just being the next rank on the progression tree for all NCOs as it is today. Same as how the NCOIC of a company is the "First Sergeant" whether they hold the First Sergeant rank or not.
No, there have only been a handful of 5 star generals ever in the Army (five), Air Force (one), and Navy (four). Only Marine Generals holding certain appointments (such as Commandant, Assistant Commandant, and other joint commands) can hold 4 star rank; the Navy's 5 star admiral I imagine would cover the Marines
@@redleader4876 Nah, they were basically created to be on par with UK/French five-star general ranks and command multiple country's Army Groups. For example, the Supreme Commander of all allied forces in the Pacific (MacArthur) was a five star, while the Marine commander of the Fleet Marine Forces Pacific (basically consisting of two Corps) was a Lieutenant General, similar to Army practice for a unit that big.
Wait I'm confused, I just watched the army version and they got paid like 100 dollars while these guys are getting paid 600. Are you doing what they would be paid now or back then
Deadeye 1250 the Army video shows MONTHLY base pay at below 3 years of service, as is probably more accurate. This video shows a sources esimation of ANNUAL base pay
How come weapons companies are commanded by majors instead of Captains? Was it a more senior position to command? Same question with weapons platoons being commanded by 1st LT instead of 2nd LT. Thanks for the video!
Most likely because the training required and complicated nature of the tactical employment of crew served weapons (whether as a whole company or as split up elements) requires more experience in US thinking. Same reason why in modern US Army rifles platoons the Weapons Squad leader is typically the senior squad leader
It’s a good video… but the us military did not have 81mm mortars at the time we only had 60mm mortars during World War Two the us military did not adopt the 81mm mortar system till 1953
Might want to use google next time before assuming the US was the only major country without a mortar in the 80-82mm range en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1_mortar
In the current iteration, 1959. It had come in and out of existence briefly a couple times in the 19th century and during WW1. By the end of WW1 Lance Corporal was replaced with Private First Class. Traditionally the "Lance" ranks, both in America and UK, were men of a lower pay grade or rank filling the role of the rank above them. So a Lance Corporal would be a senior Private doing Corporal's work and temporarily granted a chevron, and a Lance Sergeant would be a Corporal doing Sergeant's work. Nowadays they're permanent ranks, but they used to be temporary and could only be allotted if there was an NCO shortage.
Interesting only pay structure was minimum most would be somewhere above minimum. I retired as E 7 gunnery Sgt in 1971 I make in dollars more a month the a E6 gunnery Sgt in 1943 did annually.
Here is a better source on the different pay for the different grades depending on time in service. The source I was using when writing this video was a little less detailed: www.navycs.com/charts/1942-military-pay-chart.html
Its pretty wild thinking that all of this was made up by some people. Just strange imagining the amount of effort that went into each rank and role, I almost wonder where we'd be if that effort went into things like schooling or science. Regardless, Semper FI.
lol, to be fair they didn't come up with it all at once. It was more like every now and then over the course of one to two centuries they'd say "We need a new rank to handle this new duty" or "we have this new uniform the only insignias don't work on" and they'd slap another chevron or rocker on it or change the colour and size a bit on existing insignia.
There is no "Staff Colonel" rank. If he was actually a Colonel he probably meant that he was a staff officer that was the rank of Colonel (as opposed to holding a command)
Article II, Section 3 of the US Constitution says otherwise: "he [the President] shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed, and shall commission all the officers of the United States." This includes military officers. Officer commissions derive their authority from the President, although the task of approving them is delegated to the secretary of their service. These offices must either exist as per the Constitution or be created by law (like Congress establishing the rank of General), but then the individuals that fill those offices are commissioned under the authority of the executive.
Well, not really. All publications I've read describe them as gold bars. It wasn't like they thought out "the lower ranking metal should have the lower rank". The silver insignia of the Lt. Col. and 1st Lt. existed before Major and 2nd Lt. had insignia (their rank was indicated through other means, like fringe on epaullettes and collar lace). When they needed to give those ranks an actual insignia (partially because of WW1 in the case of the 2nd Lt. when they were using the plain service uniform in the field much more often without all the fancy officer stuff that differentiated them from enlisted men) they went with gold purely so they didn't have to change the insignia of Lt. Col. or 1st Lt. When the Chief Warrant Officer grades were introduced they got the gold bars. The convention of "silver outranks gold" for officer insignia is still a thing today, and is the opposite of how medals are ordered
@@BattleOrder I guess you never heard of the "Big Brass"? Or "the orders came from the Brass." Brass was the metal, But Brass tarnishes, So those who could afford it bought Gold. or Gold plate.
@@mikmik6684 The term "brass" describing high-up generals most likely does not refer to the material of the rank insignia in the American military. For the Marines at least (who followed the Army's rank standards fairly closely) officers gradually started getting silver (for evening dress) and gold (for field uniforms) rank insignia in the 1800s to go along with all their other adornments. Shortly before the American Civil War, it was simplified to having silver insignia across the board (except for Majors who got gold leaves to differentiate them from Lt. Col. and 2nd Lt. who at this time did not have an insignia). More likely the term "brass" referring to high-level officers originates from the British Army, as they actually did use brass for badges. Even if Major and 2nd Lt. rank insignia were physically constructed out of brass, they are universally described as "gold"
@@mikmik6684 This website has a couple of theories on the origin of "top brass", which is derived from "brass hat". It most likely came from British or French uniform practice: idioms.thefreedictionary.com/brass+hat
I recall that as a PFC, my paycall was about $90 after taxes and an allotment to Mom. Semper Fidelis
Fair winds and following seas to all.
Rah
That's fascinating Gunny! How did pay work? Was it a check or did they have some sort of bank system like today with navy federal?
@@js5072, paycalls were usually at the Headquarters building. All hands mustered then split to two lines based on last name. Step up to the table, show ID, sign the pay roster and get handed your paper check. No direct deposit in my early career. Navy Federal Credit Union was where most jarheads banked.
Fair winds and following seas to all.
@@GySgt_USMC_Ret. Semper Fi Gunny!
I entered the Marine Corps in January 1959. My private's pay was $76/month or $912/year. 52% increase in 17 years! That's ~2 1/2%/year. Semper Fi
I was an enlisted Marine, avionics tech, during the late 1960s, I had not realized the rank insignia had changed so much over time.
Yeah, the Marines kind of followed Army conventions through the 1800s and early 1900s (with the exception of specific cultural things like Gunnery Sergeants as gun captains on warships). They diverged a bit as the Army updated their rank structure shortly after World War I while the Marines kept a more World War I-style system. The modern Marine rank system/insignia that you served with came about in 1959
Bless you, sir!
For a rough pay comparison, multiply by 14. $1 in 1945 adjusted for inflation equals $14 today. This makes the enlisted pay grades look very low, but also remember that the cost of living was lower and that the Corps also provided food and lodging.
And clothing
and medical
it would be multiplied by about $19.45 since the dollar was 26.73 grams of silver at the time. This is using the current price of silver in usd as of this writing. You can start using inflation calculator after 1964.
it also stands to reason that service members didn't see their bank account until after the war. For example, if you enlisted in 1939 and didn't get back home until 1945, you had a pretty hefty bank account when you got back. Another example, when I went to Afghanistan as an E-4, I had roughly $700 in my account, after a 9 month deployment, I came back home with roughly $9000, would have had more but my mother decided to steal from me, but that's a story for another day.
My grandfather was a CPL with the second and fourth Marines in WWII. He was on Iwo Jima, Saipan, Guam, and other islands. RIP Grandpa. Fly High and Semper Fi.
I guess it was a CIS Gender head!
My grandfather was in the marines and on Okinawa and guam
My Dad was a Navy Corpsman attached to the 4TH Marines during WWII. He was wounded on Iwo while attending to a wounded Marine on the beach.
How would you even tell the difference between a 1sgt and a Gunny when you walk by and try to greet him? Just take a guess and take the ass chewing after?
Gunny's got a beard and a cigar.
they were probably easier on the names due to the lack of knowing the individual. For example, you generally know who your Gunny is and who your 1SGT, so you'd probably get told, "I'm a 1SGT" or something along the lines if you didn't know.
@@zebradun7407 If you Have the Balls to open your mouth, you know the man's rank.
I wonder if the USMC in that time had a custom like they currently (and also did then) in the army where rather than addressing by specific rank as they now do, they would have just used the catchall "Sergeant"
1stSgt is technically a billet. GySgt was probably the catchall title for two rockers.
When I was in the Army 1972-1975. As a SP4, my annual salary was $3000.They wanted me to go to OCS but I didn’t want to be a 2Lt in Vietnam.
Well your life expectancy as a 2Lt would’ve been a week
@Christopher Smith Over? Over Macho Grande?
Coward
I wouldve loved to see you get drafted to Vietnam
Well by 1972 the number of personnel in Vietnam was down to 24,200 the prior year it was around 156,800 and by end of March 1973 the Us had withdrawn all combat troops from nam. sixty American service members where killed in those last three months. After the last troops withdrew there only remained 250 personnel that still in country with 200 of them marines assigned to guard the US embassy or while the rest were assigned to Defense attaché office (DAO)Saigon.
You had low likelihood of a Vietnam assignment upon completion of OCS. Most of those 50 assigned DAO Saigon were responsible for administering military assistance and support to the South Vietnamese armed forces, the gathering and distribution of military intelligence and the performance of normal Defense Attaché functions and that staff included officers from the Army Navy Marine and AF personnel. . Unless your MOS was that background mentioned and even then most of the officers were usually pretty experienced for that assignment.
But that's hindsight.
I never got above E-3 LCp..I was discharged with a 100 % disability from Vietnam....the best 2 years of my life..when I was a Pvt I only got 96 dollars a month and I could live on it really good.......Oohrah...
Good day to everyone who got this recommended.
Good day.
Gd
Good day
Good day young fella!
waaaaaaaaaaaaa
can we talk about the fact that a boot ass butter bars is making more than a Sgt Major?
😂 He’s now an E-1 I guess 🤷♂️
Bastard BUTTR BARS!!! Lol
Officers, even 90 day wonders of WWII generally required advanced education of some sort hence they were compensated accordingly. Been that way since Christ was a Corporal.
Officers are Officers dude. If you’re not happy about your pay, become one.
Barış Doğukan Karakoyun working in it
This is very needed as a video reference for whoever wanted to learn about this, great video, can't wait to see Army
When I was in Nam 68-69, as an E-2, I was getting $182.50 a MONTH before all of my deductions. Then it was $139 a month.
The enlisted rank insignia was only worn on the left sleeve for a short time also.
Renegade I did not know that! Thanks for sharing that. Do you remember that years that took effect? Always good to learn more history about my beloved Corps.
Interesting! Renegade, you have the reference for that? The Navy, from 1886 until 1913, had Petty Officers on starboard watch wear their rate on the right sleeve, while those on Port Watch wore their rate on the left sleeve.
Fair winds and following seas.
@@renegade2556 There is an interesting history article titled "Shoulder Patches In WWII" at usmcu.edu. I used to have a large usmc literature collection, but the ex trashed it. So, if you happen across a reference for usmc enlisted rank on the left sleeve only, please update us. Also, I checked my ID card and nowhere on it does it have the word "Dear" on it. As you were. I'll be in the area all day. Semper Fi, Mac
Fair winds and following seas to all.
@@renegade2556 usnhistory.navylive.dodlive.mil has an informative article titled "The History of Navy Rank (or Rate): Enlisted Personnel". The reference for port/starboard is there. Aside from that, your deportment, Marine, seems to have taken a turn for the worse. There will be no further discourse. You are dismissed.
@@GySgt_USMC_Ret. will do ,Gunny,, Unfortunately a broken water main trashed all the 1930's'40's and 50's Leatherneck Magazines, personal Pictures and artifacts from My Father and Grandfather and turned everything into a mouldy pile ,which I went through and saved everything I could, but most of the Paper and Photos were completely destroyed, A sewer line broke previosly. The basement is a lousy spot to store things but sometimes there's no alternative. Semper Fidelis, Cpl. Mac.
So Terminal Lance was not a thing back then.
I just learn something new and I do like your educational videos.
Keep up the good work on educating.
LCpl rank was created in the Korean War era, and it was a the introduction of those cross rifles we know today, and it made a whole mess of the ranks and there were ‘acting’ ranks without the cross rifles that had a deadline to be promoted or wear the rank below, and the ones that made it. Interestingly enough this is where “Sergeant E-5” comes from as it was a easy way to introduce yourself as a real Sgt and not an Acting Sgt
Late on this, but the equivalent of a terminal lance or a senior lance corporal back then was a Pvt or PFC with a service stripe or two... There are pictures of guys in their service alphas with no chevrons but like two hash marks lol. Different kind of salt back then.
My grandfather who was at pearl on December 7 was an aircraft mechanic. I never met him for obvious reasons but I read dads birth certificate and it said t sgt when I was in the corps in the nineties this was not a rank. I always thought it meant what you confirmed thanx.
Is there an Army version of this coming? This was a super cool, heavily researched video. I know the Army was both complicated and Interesting back in WW2 with Multiple Specialist grades going along with the Sergeant grades.
Thanks. An Army ranks video won't be the next thing but it may come in the future! The Army's system was actually a little less complex, because they ditched the "different grades for different occupations" method of the World War I era for the Technician grades by WW2
very interesting overview. Especially the pay is interesting to know
You covered that very good, and I thank you for that video.
Love these ranks videos, especially the deep-dives you’ve done (“E-4 Mafia”). Keep ‘em coming!
I still want to see what the SPACE FORCE RANK STRUCTURE look's like.
Great Video! However at 1:04 The Alphas "Green Coat" is for Reporting into your next duty station or attending a class that has orders attached to it and for Official Marine Photos. I could be wrong but Being in the Marines for a long time and understanding what all uniforms are for I wouldn't be surprised to be wrong.
There used to be a khaki version with khaki trousers too until I think the 70’s maybe it was discontinued
Very good video, simple very informative.
I'm glad you guys seem to be posting semi-regularly now :)
Your presentation made this interesting, I have seen other channels show this, but it was pretty dry and more vague.
i was an E-4' who hit the exit door with his 4' ( plus 1' ) and an RE-1' code and hon disch and a Com Act Rib
I recognize the music, as being from Medal of Honor Allied Assault!
Also he included the Music from Medal of Honor Pacific Assault
It's interesting that the marine corps' rank structure is almost identical to the army despite basically being naval infantry
Peasant
Perfect For Cleaning
Lance Colonel
Carpool
I Like ur videos :)
A video explaning alle the ranks and structures etc of the E-Company 101st Airborne and here upper structure (Batallion/Regiment)(Band of Brothers) trough the hole series would be great. I tryed to find something in the net, but theres no good one.
Maybe theres a an example of a Unit in action, which ist not straight from the TOE, because of loses in the field and so on.
From start to end of the series, which named charater had which rank and postion and hos they changed over time, eventually without have the right rank from the TOE for the position.
I think an nice Ornigram of that would help much to unstand the strucktures and their changes. :)
Its every time funny, how simple the US military ranky system ist :D
If u compare it with the german, with the many HAUPT/OBER/UNTER/STABS-ranks
Informative. Thank you.
For a future video, can you cover the unique marine units during ww2? Like the raider/para marines weapons structure in the previous video
Certainly possible! We have a few articles on the pre-1943 Paramarine and 2nd Raider company/battalion organization at our website battleorder.org
Welcome back !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would like to see a video that goes more in depth on the warrant officer rank of the USMC, WWI and WWII.
Thanks for posting this My Late Father was a WW2 Marine in the Second Air Wing. Here's a quick question I have heard him mention about what he called Buck Sergeant, is that a long ago term for a Sergeant? He told me about the Buck Sergeant had gotten drunk out of his mind one night and the MPs escorted the Buck Sergeant down the street. Lol
Buck Sergeant is basically slang for the lowest Sergeant rank. So a Buck Sergeant wouldn't be a Staff Sergeant, and a Buck Private wouldn't be a Private First Class.
I worked with a Marine who earned a battlefield commission in Korea. After the cease fire in 1953 his rank was reduced to a Warrant officer, (don’t remember what grade); I was wondering how the pay of the Warrant officers compared to commissioned officers.
1st and 2nd LT have always made me wonder. You would think a 1st LT would be gold and 2nd be sliver like medals are
Same with major and lt col
Always thought of it as brass vs silver.
Basically it was because of back in the 1800s when epaullettes with lots of fringe plus varying numbers of lace on the cuffs were used to denote officer ranks, there wasn't a single rank insignia for Majors and Second Lieutenants. Lieutenant Colonels got the silver oak leaves (in addition to the stuff Majors got to signify rank) while First Lieutenants got the silver bar (in addition to the stuff Second Lieutenants got). In the late 1800s Majors were authorized the gold oak leaves as well; the choice of gold was basically to minimize the number of changes that would have to be made to the overall rank structure. So Lt. Col. stayed silver while Majors got the new gold. In 1916, the Second Lieutenant got its gold bar insignia, again so the First Lieutenant rank didn't have to change its insignia. This change was because the olive drab service uniform was being worn more often and the Second Lieutenant didn't have an insignia to differentiate them from a no insignia private.
I believe the extension of the gold being the lower grade to new Warrant Officer rank insignia is just keeping consistent with the precedent, which was mostly out of convenience.
I don't understand why this explanation is way off the mark from my 1944 era Guidebook for Marines. This has a comparative explanation and chart of the three branches of the service and the rank patch for each, including pay. And it most certainly does not correlate with what you show here. And neither jibe with what we used in 1970. SEMPER FI
I don't know what guidebook you're referring to so I can't comment on exactly why. Discrepancies between publications and the things publications were explaining weren't uncommon. The pay in the video is 1942 minimum annual pay, so it may have changed by 1944, or your guidebook may be something different than the minimum annual.
This website is one of our sources and lays out the different rank insignia that existed at the time (and what each branch within the Marine Corps called them) pretty well: uniform-reference.net/insignia/usmc/usmc_enlisted_ww2.html
And the modern enlisted/NCO ranks didn't exist until 1959, which would explain why this wasn't how it was when you were in
you should do a video on how a U.S ww1 field artillery regiment was made up, I had a great uncle who was a farrier in the 335th.
9:22 There is a spelling mistake for Commandant (Commandt) bottom right.
I Remember the Movie "D.I." with Jack Webb He was Called a Tech. Sgt. Not Gunnery Sgt.
Technical Sergeant is in the Air Force, not the Marines
Correction, there is a Tech Sgt in the Marines, however, gunnery Sergeant is the main ranking title, my apologies
@@uuu12343 Touche' (smile)
Can you explain (S-1 to S-6) ???
S1 is Admin
S2 is Intel
S3 is Operations
S4 is Supply
S5 Security and Badging
S6 is Communications.
In your enlisted 1943 section of the webpage you have an error in the First Sergeant (Line, Feb 1943 to Feb 1943)
True thanks
The sound track sounds like it’s from Medal of Honor Vanguard.
Close...MOHAA
Super cool to learn
Captain is still my favorite rank.
When was Lance Corporal implemented?
In the modern form, 1959. It was on again off again for a while. It existed for a brief time in the 1800s and from 1914-1918, after which it was replaced with Private First Class. During that WW1 era it was represented by a single chevron
Could you do one of these for the Army, Navy, and Coast Guard for WW2 as well?
Now do the navy next
My dad was in the Marines the end of World War II. He was stationed in the Panama Canal. He told me he was a carpentry sergeant I'm still not sure what that means. Does anyone have any info.
A colonel only took home 4k a year in pay? That's like $66000 adjusted for inflation... thought it would be more
In Band of Brothers there was the letter T underneath the Sargent chevron. what was that
Technician Grades, similar to Cold War-era Specialist grades (although the modern Army Specialist is different). Basically they were instituted to give specialists (e.g. drivers, radio operators, medics, draftsman, mechanics, etc. etc.) additional pay without the responsibility of being an NCO technically. So 3 stripes plus a T would be a Technician 4th Grade, equivalent in pay to a Sergeant but without the official command responsibility in tables of organization (although they were still referred to colloquially as Sergeants). In tables of organization Technicians were typically included in the junior enlisted section (lumped together with Privates and Private First Class) so even though a Technician 3rd Grade may have Staff Sergeant pay and be called a Staff Sergeant by the boys they were technically not NCOs
Wow. No cross rifles. I never knew it was like that then.
The crossed rifles came into play in 1959 after a couple more rank structure changes
I’m mildly confused, but the 1stSgt being the same pay grade as a gunny kind of makes sense if you also know AF ranks.
It was more or less a specialization thing. It wasn't like today where the progression is SSgt > GySgt > branching off to the line or technical Sgts
It was more like, PSgt > branch off into either 1st Sgt or GySgt depending on whether they're line infantry or ordnance > 1st Sgt goes to Sgt Maj and GySgt goes to MyGySgt (typically, although I think before 1st Sgt rose to the same grade as Sgt Maj either 1st Sgt or GySgt could be promoted to Sgt Maj, but not after).
Gunnery Sergeants started as an actual role (a gun captain on a naval vessel or artillery gun) so the rank had an actual function rather than just being the next rank on the progression tree for all NCOs as it is today. Same as how the NCOIC of a company is the "First Sergeant" whether they hold the First Sergeant rank or not.
I’m only saying this probably because my comfort zone is the way it is now. Good information because I would have never known any of this.
Very interesting!
Were not the horizontal stripes called "ties"?
In the case of Marine aviation didn't Majors also command squadrons ?
Wasn’t there any five star generals in the Marine Corps just like the Army, too?
No, there have only been a handful of 5 star generals ever in the Army (five), Air Force (one), and Navy (four). Only Marine Generals holding certain appointments (such as Commandant, Assistant Commandant, and other joint commands) can hold 4 star rank; the Navy's 5 star admiral I imagine would cover the Marines
@@BattleOrder Oh. I've never seen a five star USMC general before; I was hoping there would be at LEAST one in the entire history of the USMC. :(
@@redleader4876 Nah, they were basically created to be on par with UK/French five-star general ranks and command multiple country's Army Groups. For example, the Supreme Commander of all allied forces in the Pacific (MacArthur) was a five star, while the Marine commander of the Fleet Marine Forces Pacific (basically consisting of two Corps) was a Lieutenant General, similar to Army practice for a unit that big.
The USMC isn't/has never been big enough to justify a 5 star general. It's pretty small when compared to the Army.
US Air Corps next- PLEASE!!!!
Wait I'm confused, I just watched the army version and they got paid like 100 dollars while these guys are getting paid 600. Are you doing what they would be paid now or back then
Deadeye 1250 the Army video shows MONTHLY base pay at below 3 years of service, as is probably more accurate. This video shows a sources esimation of ANNUAL base pay
How come weapons companies are commanded by majors instead of Captains? Was it a more senior position to command? Same question with weapons platoons being commanded by 1st LT instead of 2nd LT. Thanks for the video!
Most likely because the training required and complicated nature of the tactical employment of crew served weapons (whether as a whole company or as split up elements) requires more experience in US thinking. Same reason why in modern US Army rifles platoons the Weapons Squad leader is typically the senior squad leader
Battle Order explained very well thank you
Marine Enlisted Pilots wore the bars instead of rockers for years after WWII
WWII Naval ranks next??
Possibly not your forte but do you know rank structure of troops from medieval times? Wanna make my dnd gaming more accurate.
It’s a good video… but the us military did not have 81mm mortars at the time we only had 60mm mortars during World War Two the us military did not adopt the 81mm mortar system till 1953
Might want to use google next time before assuming the US was the only major country without a mortar in the 80-82mm range en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1_mortar
I wondering what rank USMC Sniper and Medic Usually is??
Does the US Merchant Marine have it’s own rank structure?
I didn't see a lance corporal rank - when was that introduced?
In the current iteration, 1959. It had come in and out of existence briefly a couple times in the 19th century and during WW1. By the end of WW1 Lance Corporal was replaced with Private First Class. Traditionally the "Lance" ranks, both in America and UK, were men of a lower pay grade or rank filling the role of the rank above them. So a Lance Corporal would be a senior Private doing Corporal's work and temporarily granted a chevron, and a Lance Sergeant would be a Corporal doing Sergeant's work. Nowadays they're permanent ranks, but they used to be temporary and could only be allotted if there was an NCO shortage.
Interesting only pay structure was minimum most would be somewhere above minimum. I retired as E 7 gunnery Sgt in 1971 I make in dollars more a month the a E6 gunnery Sgt in 1943 did annually.
Here is a better source on the different pay for the different grades depending on time in service. The source I was using when writing this video was a little less detailed: www.navycs.com/charts/1942-military-pay-chart.html
Its pretty wild thinking that all of this was made up by some people. Just strange imagining the amount of effort that went into each rank and role, I almost wonder where we'd be if that effort went into things like schooling or science.
Regardless, Semper FI.
lol, to be fair they didn't come up with it all at once. It was more like every now and then over the course of one to two centuries they'd say "We need a new rank to handle this new duty" or "we have this new uniform the only insignias don't work on" and they'd slap another chevron or rocker on it or change the colour and size a bit on existing insignia.
Dat MOHAA soundtrack
What year did the Marines add the crossed rifles to their rank insignia??
Doug The Eliminator 1959
@@BattleOrder Thanks.
So why is major general < lieutenant general?
www.quora.com/Why-is-Lieutenant-General-a-higher-rank-than-Major-General-while-the-rank-of-Major-is-higher-than-Lieutenant
So when exactly, was Jesus a Lance Corporal?
1834-1839 (rank abolished)
1914-1918 (replaced with PFC)
1959-now
@@BattleOrder Thanks. It was more of a rhetorical question. HE must've been in the first group, as that's closest to Biblical Times. SF
Thanks Guns..Semper Fi
red on green not green on red
No the chevron itself is green stripes on red backing. They are correct.
You can tell who the pogs were
Someone told me he was a staff colonel. Wheres that rank
There is no "Staff Colonel" rank. If he was actually a Colonel he probably meant that he was a staff officer that was the rank of Colonel (as opposed to holding a command)
Commissions are from Congress. Not the President.
Article II, Section 3 of the US Constitution says otherwise:
"he [the President] shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed, and shall commission all the officers of the United States." This includes military officers.
Officer commissions derive their authority from the President, although the task of approving them is delegated to the secretary of their service. These offices must either exist as per the Constitution or be created by law (like Congress establishing the rank of General), but then the individuals that fill those offices are commissioned under the authority of the executive.
Great, now Army, or known Officers tactics during omaha Beach landing.
The "gold" bars were actually supposed to be BRASS.
Well, not really. All publications I've read describe them as gold bars. It wasn't like they thought out "the lower ranking metal should have the lower rank". The silver insignia of the Lt. Col. and 1st Lt. existed before Major and 2nd Lt. had insignia (their rank was indicated through other means, like fringe on epaullettes and collar lace). When they needed to give those ranks an actual insignia (partially because of WW1 in the case of the 2nd Lt. when they were using the plain service uniform in the field much more often without all the fancy officer stuff that differentiated them from enlisted men) they went with gold purely so they didn't have to change the insignia of Lt. Col. or 1st Lt. When the Chief Warrant Officer grades were introduced they got the gold bars.
The convention of "silver outranks gold" for officer insignia is still a thing today, and is the opposite of how medals are ordered
@@BattleOrder I guess you never heard of the "Big Brass"? Or "the orders came from the Brass." Brass was the metal, But Brass tarnishes, So those who could afford it bought Gold. or Gold plate.
@@mikmik6684 The term "brass" describing high-up generals most likely does not refer to the material of the rank insignia in the American military. For the Marines at least (who followed the Army's rank standards fairly closely) officers gradually started getting silver (for evening dress) and gold (for field uniforms) rank insignia in the 1800s to go along with all their other adornments. Shortly before the American Civil War, it was simplified to having silver insignia across the board (except for Majors who got gold leaves to differentiate them from Lt. Col. and 2nd Lt. who at this time did not have an insignia). More likely the term "brass" referring to high-level officers originates from the British Army, as they actually did use brass for badges.
Even if Major and 2nd Lt. rank insignia were physically constructed out of brass, they are universally described as "gold"
@@mikmik6684 This website has a couple of theories on the origin of "top brass", which is derived from "brass hat". It most likely came from British or French uniform practice: idioms.thefreedictionary.com/brass+hat
Oorah!!!
I would like to execute some orders
Should have user rank
Rah
Do you know why i have none vieweroneverymyvideo on my channelmy channel is lost in in the ocean😑
This video is awesome. Very informative. Would you a version with the army as well?
Yes, probably in about a week
I was gonna join the marines but I’d beat a drill instructors ass the first time he got in my face lol
@@a.m.8410 Sure tough guy.
Love the video
It would be cool if we had a soveit to Russian squad tactics 1917-2020
your about to brake 100k on this video :D