From time to time, someone (religious or otherwise) will declare all of atheist activism null and void. Seth Andrews examines that claim. Plus your calls.
Been an Atheist all my life. Will continue to do do for rest of my life. Until there is irrefutable evidence. Science is the field of study which needs to be pursued. It provides answers and, hopefully, more questions. And “Gesundheit” means “health” which is a nice thing to say to anyone getting sick. 😎
@@carolinafine8050 Blind? How? Evidence I can see, that is provable, replicatable, objective. Do you have evidence? And please don’t do the circular reason. “The bible says there is a god and the bible would’t lie. And god wrote the bible and wouldn’t lie.” There is demonstrable, factual evidence for the big bang, evolution, natural selection, etc. Facts! Facts! Facts!
Left church after 40 years. The way I see it, if I react to things like mottos and sneezes, then they still have me. And frankly, 4 decades was enough.
I still say "bless you". It barely meant anything to me before I became an atheist and it certainly doesn't mean anything to me now. It's just a courteous thing. Who gives a sh*t.
When someone around me sneezes I often say “Glockenspiel” Most people don’t notice. If they do notice. I say “it means playing clock. It’s just something funny to say. “
Just thinking, Christian Nationalism and its child, Christian Privilege, to me, are arguably the most clear and present danger to America. These on their own may seem harmless (to some). But my concern is the insidious reach and impact they have on the rest of the non-religious society. Atheists are not a monolith, but to combat the risk to our freedoms, I wish we could unite...
I have come across several comments on threads such as this one which state openly that the 19th Amendment (women's right to vote) should be repealed, that universal voting rights are an immediate target for dismantling, and that, as the founding fathers intended, only white, christian, property-owning males should be allowed to vote. They are a much bigger threat than we namby-pamby kumbaya democrats are prepared to face and fight against.
That there's a pretty good reason why church is supposed to be separated from state. Religion is a large part of the reason why worldwide politics is so corrupt. But I also cannot claim that atheist politicians would be pure innocence 😇 and lilly white honesty, either 😆 Power corrupts any way you slice and dice it. #ReligionIsFiction
The MAGA party and other christians are in no way an example of morality or good intentions to anyone. Just look at them and the way they behave; who would want to be like them?
Important discussion that can’t be had enough these days. I’m about halfway through and am impressed that you have managed to avoid using the term “cancel culture”, which obviously has a heap of political baggage, but is pretty much what all “tribes” seem to do these days.
"Cancel culture" is only something a person with a guilty conscience worries about. It's a bogeyman, a complete farce, and it says a lot that this is your only apparent takeaway.
Let the right-wingers be the only group to utter the abomination, “Cancel Culture.” Free thinking people and progressives would do well to carry forward with the responsible notion that actions have consequences, and in this Information Age dominated by social media and instant info, it should come as no surprise that a phenomenon of a Culture of Consequences (or Consequence Culture) has come into being. You couldn’t eliminate that now any more than you can unsee or unknow egregious behaviors. You will adjust your behavior toward that offender according to your own morality or punitive nature for violators of ethical norms.
I, of course, can only taslk for myself but think this whole cancedl thing is BS. The woke crowd needs to chill, atm they're a rabid dog that will achieve nothing by alienating everybody. Take Marvel Comics as an example, new female powerful character of color? Will turn out lesbian down the road - it becomes bad, if it becomes a trope. On the other hand, the right screaming cancel culture and how bad it is all day forgetting their book tells the story of how their imaginary friend cancelled the whole world.
I think the guy who was talking about labeling people supporting Putin as "communist sympathizers" was not correct in his understanding of what Putin is. He may have been KGB and want to regain the land previously held by the former U.S.S.R, but he is actually very right wing. He actually loathes communism, and wants to reinstate the soviet empire, but with a more right wing ideology.
Loved this one, Seth. Personally, I’m completely unoffended by people who make religious references like the ones you cited. I literally couldn’t give a shit if someone wants to say grace before eating, says “god bless you” after I sneeze and the like. Man, don’t we have bigger fish to fry than getting buggered by someone else’s frame of reference? Likewise, I couldn’t care less about the “in god we trust” inscription. Sure, I’d prefer it to not be there, but I don’t let it generate any angst. And since I’m here, a reiterated “thank you” for contributing to my life in a meaningful way. I greatly appreciate all your hard work.
I must agree that we should pick our stand, for or against appropriately, sometimes however, it feels that theists use the strategy of "death by a thousand paper cuts" meaning anything that is a slow process in which a multitude of small, bad things happen which ultimately culminate in the demise of whatever was suffering the change. Little by little the theists bring in their "little expressions" of "faith", put it on the money, nationalize religious holidays, pass a little law here and there, and before you know it we'll not have any freedom from religion.
My friend, Lloyd Morain, founded the American Humanists. In the last couple years of his life, they tried to take everything he had and stick him in a nursing home.
Just make sure you still vote (not saying you said that you don't) because religion will take over if we don't keep them voted out. I get tired of it all too. But at least pay attention to Freedom From Religion Foundation. They help keep religion out of schools & politics. So pay attention to that because we don't want this country to become a authoritarian theocracy. ✌️💙. I'm with you though, I get sick of all the arguments you've heard over and over and people not wanting to hear anything that goes against what they believe. It's frustrating!
Once, when I was recently de-converted, back in the mid 90s, I was at work (Disneyland) getting changed into my costume (they don't call them uniforms) in the locker room. I sneezed, and from somewhere across the (rather large) locker room, I hear someone call out, "bless you!" I was in my snarky, (you might say angry) phase, and said "no thanks!" in a sarcastically cheery tone. I got some kind of derisive response from the guy. It was deserved, I suppose. He was trying to be nice, and even though I find the "blessing you over a sneeze" notion a bit asinine.... I mean, what a thing to make an issue of, right? I suppose as pushback goes, it was pretty mild, but it wasn't going to produce anything but negativity. It's not like I am guilt-ridden over it, but it was not productive. These days I try to view it in the way it is intended: wishing you the best.
The "bless you" is more likely rooted in the medieval Christian belief that one's soul would fly out of their noses when they sneezed. The thinking at the time was that somehow blessing the person would enable them to haul their souls back into their bodies thereby preventing a demon from zipping in and taking up residence. That bit about the expression being from the Druids is SO wrong, as the Druids didn't leave any written records of their beliefs. It sounds like the sort of baseless claim that loathsome demonic toad Kenneth Copeland would make.
Was an atheist for billions of years before I awoke here on Earth, and certainly will continue to be so over the hopefully many years during my time here on Earth, and will be again for billions of years more after my time here is done.
Fortunately, unfortunately the Supreme Court has ruled several times unequivocally that “ in god we trust “ is not unconstitutional because it just says “ god “ and specifically specifying any particular god or religion but of course as a atheist I believe it shouldn’t be there regardless
If the word "god" is capitalized, it is referring to a certain god and breaks the 1st Amendment. If it is not capitalized, it is a general category. Personally, if it is just regarding the general category, it is meaningless. So, why would anyone object to it being removed?
Ironically Iron Age heathens knew sneezing on others had unwanted results. In 2022 my religious neighbors think it’s unpatriotic to wear a mask to prevent spreading their nasty germs! 🤦🏻♀️
Interestingly enough, in that part of the song, she demonstrated the existence of such a thing as Ma Bell (the Bell System (also known as AT&T)), which is far more than can be said for the existence of such a thing as "Father God".
You can tell Gov. Stitt that a good chunk of Oklahoma is Cherokee Nation and they too must be represented, especially with the sordid history of this massive human rights violation called the Indian boarding schools coming out!
Damn right. If the fundie literalist apocalyptic Christians are going to be allowed to officially lead students in their own special little version of prayer to their Middle Eastern god, then they'd better make time for Native American shamans to pray to traditional nature spirits. Oh, and the worshippers of Baphomet would probably want some time, too.
The US needs us, now more than ever; a country is fighting and sacrificing so much to keep democracy, while we, one of said country’s most vocal allies, are seriously debating whether we should even be a democracy or a Christian Iran
libertarians were supposed to be relatively irreligious, but their need for power against leftist social spending provides justification to partner with godzealots who want government monitoring what we do with our holes&poles. they're traitors to their own philosophy
I agree. I guess I would say I have atheistic tendencies for the last forty years. But I got sucked into the UA-cam conversation by the multitude of atheist YT channels because of the abhorrent religious right. I would be the first to defend religious freedom, but I stop when they step beyond that boundary.
I am thankful for your half hour rant at the beginning of the show. Lately I have been letting myself get irritated by the people who display their christianity, and I assume that they are all bigoted haters, but you reminded me that even when I was a christian I was still not a bigoted hater. Thank you for reminding me that they are not all bad and stupid people.
I don't think the movement is dead, but it most certainly is fractured. I made Atheist videos from 2009-2011 on UA-cam, as TheOtherSide100, aka TOS100. Back then, lots of videos were about debates or pwnage. It was sometimes aggressive. But then there was a split, or schism, when the BS known as "Elevatorgate" happened with RK Watson. PZ Myers picked up on it, and the "two-initial-last name" Atheists paired up seemingly for a scourge known as "Atheism Plus." At the time, I was going to work for an online video educational company, and part of the hiring process involved scouring the internet to see if you make videos [they suggested that people who make online videos were more likely to steal their content]. To get the job, I deleted my UA-cam profile. During this time, I watched some channels, and kept listening to yours. I saw attitudes shift from the pwnage and yelling to calm and factual responses. This inspired me to return, hence my channel name. But I'm finding that I don't quite yet know where I can fit in, or what I can offer up that would be uniquely mine. As I type this, I am sorting out those details in my mind, and working to develop a strategy. Many of the people I used to commune with have changed. Some have even died [RIP Goxster and DPR Jones]. A few are still doing what they have always done, such as yourself, Aron Ra, or Thunderf00t, with little to no change in some cases. I get turned off by the entire thing whenever there is any type of in-fighting. Disagreements are fine, but in-fighting takes things to an unacceptable level. Truth be told, I've never really been a member of a group, and it doesn't feel like there is ever a good time to start. So I work to focus on my own efforts, which are in the very early stages of my re-boot. After all, there is no "barrel." My subscribers have given me some constructive ideas. The hunt continues. Thanks for all that you do, Seth. We talked briefly back when I had my original channel, and hopefully one day I'll have the privilege of doing so again.
As far as atheism vs creationists (which was the main focus back in the late 00's) it's basically beating a dead horse at this point. The few you mentioned are the only ones that are still doing it, though ThunderF00t has shifted to doing more scientific experimental videos and debunking tech after the Atheism Plus crap. All of the arguments seem to have been made, recycled and regurgitated over and over. New people come in to replace the old and start repeating the same arguments and asking the same questions. It is nice to see less focus on pwnage, though. I think it's still important to continue to offer rebuttals to religious claims, because they will never stop, and many people in our society are still alarmingly anti-science.
In Canada our national anthem has the phrase "God keep our land glorious and free". A few years ago there was one phrase change from "all thy sons command" to " all of us command" in order to be more gender inclusive. When the change was made there were some of my buddies in in the hockey dressing room ( of course its Canada ) complaining about the change and I piped up that I was okay with the change but what really offended me was that there was a fairy tale being in our anthem. Of the 10 in the room 8 laughed but 2 were pissed off.Which is about the ratio of religious and non religious in Canada. I wish that there was a member of our parliament that would sponsor a bill to remove God from the anthem not because it offends me but because it make the idiots crazy mad.
Same in the UK, we have that tedious dirge "God Save the Queen/King", but 80-95% of people have no belief in the Christian god (or not enough to go to church). When the ER2 pops her clogs, which can't be too long now, it would be a great opportunity to change the anthem altogether, but they probably won't for fear of offending someone, or just plain apathy. I learned recently that the Church of England could be effectively finished in the next 10-15 years, as attendance is dropping so rapidly. You can't maintain those cold dusty churches if nobody's putting money in the collection every week.
@@ziploc2000 being a Welshman have never sang God Save The Queen! I will stand for it but not sing, my anthem is Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau (Land Of My Father's)
Fellow Canadian here. “God” could easily be changed to “We”. Also the preamble to the constitution needs some secularisation. [edit] the second and third verses of God Save the Queen are pretty rough.
This week in the news. 3 yr old Arely Naomi Proctor dies Sept from asphyxiation due to smothering and suffocation. Her Mother , Grandfather and Uncle were performing an exorcism. The child often woke up screaming at night and it was decided she was possessed by demons Deborah Samuel, Christian student in Nigeria , is beaten, stoned and burned alive by Muslim student mob for complaining about religious posting on What's App. Two examples of why we must never let the atheist movement die.
Stylistically, it was a bit postmodern for my taste. However, I did enjoy the part in the interlude just before the bridge where she was "praying" and the operator came on to say that she had reached a number which was not in service. It well underscored the fact that prayers fall on non-existent, fictional ears.
I wonder why we never bless farts? They seem worse than sneezes to me. Maybe it's the embarrassment factor? If you point it out then they have to address it...
It has to do with illness. A sneeze is seen as a sign of possible illness, and a burp or fart is a sign of health. You don't NEED blessing for signs of health. Actually, for farts, you should bless those near to the one passing wind.
Thanks for your content I would like to say more with you but you have said everything anyway. I am from New Zealand and have been a follower of yours for a while. I agree completely with what you you talk about. Cheers bro 😁
Comment on the public prayer before meetings; I formerly worked in a small city in Michigan (rather a blue state and county) that started every council meeting with prayer. I never got to see what happened when they hired an atheist mayor, I had quit by then, but I hear they forced out that mayor, and probably still pray. It always felt so weird and fake to me.
Regarding the free will question I like what Schopenhauer said, 'You can will what you do but you can't will what you will'. Love your work, Seth. Thanks for the show. PS : The song at the end of the show is fantastic!
I guess it can be said of the same how people get all bent out of shape if you say Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas. I say Happy Holidays because I know Christmas is not the only holiday in December.
When I say Happy Holidays, it's _because_ it pisses off the crazies. Otherwise, I would automatically say "Merry Christmas," since that's just how I grew up. It's the exact same reason why I say "gesundheit" when someone sneezes. I don't even think about it. I didn't know _anyone_ who wasn't Christian - as far as I knew, at least - all the time I grew up. I didn't believe it myself, but there weren't any religious minorities in our small town. And if there were any other atheists (besides myself), they celebrated Christmas just like everyone else. So I have to _remind_ myself to say "Happy Holidays" in order to be inclusive. Or, alternately, to piss off the right-wing Christians who are trying to destroy our democracy. :)
You are perfectly right. If you don't know their persuasion, it is the safest greeting. What gets me is when they claim we are banned from saying Merry Christmas. I'm sure that some companies advise their employees to use a generic greeting with members of the public because of the reason you cite. At the government office where I worked, and we were perfectly free to wish our co-workers Merry Christmas or whatever. My boss was Jewish, and it was fine to stick your head in her door and wish her a Happy Hannukah. On a related note, the guy who bagged my groceries one time--someone I didn't know--wished me a Happy Mother's Day. I have no kids. I didn't really care, but what if he said that to someone who had just lost their only child?
On the question of whether or not we have free will and the nature vs culture debate, the (knowledgeable and entertaining) lectures of Prof Robert Sapolsky of (as I recall) Stanford are fantastic.
I basically have only a problem with "have a blessed day" or something similar when the other person knows I am an atheist and don't want to hear stuff or they use it as a defeater argument, like the "even though you don't believe in god, he loves you" kind of thing. BUT it urks me that this kind of language is used by everyone, it shouldn't be the case. We shouldn't have religious vocabulary in our day-to-day interactions. I don't want to say "Oh my god" when surprised by something. I try to avoid it but because it is so ingrained in our lives I say it accidentally sometimes. I want that to change, not militantly, but naturally.
As I’ve gotten older, and more comfortable in my atheism, I’ve gotten a bit more “live and let live” about the little things (like sneezes, being told they’re praying for me etc). It’s just better to read the intention rather than get caught up on the religious shit, because, I mean… cmon, let’s just be humans to each other lol. I used to be such an angry atheist, but I’m so chill now, maybe it’s because I’ve been among a bunch of non religious folks for the last decade (Australia!). Let’s just try to remember the human, be kind, act how you’d like to be treated, etc without getting up our own asses about it.
I often reply that I no longer worship Middle Eastern gods. If they look puzzled, I then remind them that the bible was written in the Middle East by Iron Age Middle Eastern men.
I had a co worker get mad at me for not saying bless you, after she sneezed. I said that I just don't say it, and I would feel silly. She was not impressed.
As a lifelong atheist I confess I would no more go to an atheist event than I would go to an event for people who don't speak Swedish. It just isn't a way I define myself. People recovering from religion presumably have a greater need to replace the social interaction that came with religion, and like Alcoholics Anonymous, I can see the benefit for people who need that.
Not being disrespectful at all but I think AA is damaging. You give up one addiction for another. I have friends that did this and now they are just addicted to god instead of alcohol. Other than that I agree with everything you said. ✌️💙
If I were younger, I would _definitely_ go to an atheist event in order to meet atheists I see on UA-cam or listen to on podcasts (the Scathing Atheists, anyone)? But it's not just that they don't believe in a god. That's easy enough. It's the _positive_ stuff that inspires me. Admittedly, I'm not very social, anyway. I support the local atheist group here,... sort of. I give them money, occasionally, and I'm technically a member, I suppose. But I've never actually _met_ any of them. They get together at a coffee shop every week - or they did before the pandemic, at least - but since I retired, I don't get up that early. Heh, heh. Well, I probably wouldn't go, anyway. But that's just because I like people better in theory than in practice.
The deciding not to give the "bless you" response to a sneeze, and the crossing out of "in god we trust" on the money is small, maybe even petty. To me, though, it offers a grain of sand to further erode the assumed high status and privileged place of Christianity in the culture. Sure, I don't have an audience of millions, or even thousands... I may have an audience of one, or ten. If I can make that audience... or just part of it... aware that those assumptions of Christianity's primacy don't hold everywhere and at all times, I feel like that's doing some good. The more frequently, and consistently I can do it, the better. To me, having someone say "bless you" to me when I sneeze is, at best, assuming something about me without warrant, and at worst, an aggressive action disregarding a known aspect of my identity. Misgendering or dead-naming someone who is trans has gotten a lot of stink eye, and rightly so. How is assuming I'm sympathetic to "blessings", or expecting me to engage in pointless ritual any better? As a life-long Yankee, I have only briefly been exposed to the "Bless his little heart" vernacular of The South, and as such it is foreign to me. I'm aware of it, and have been for most of my life, but as a trope on TV and in movies. Being there... being immersed in it... makes my skin crawl. Maybe that accounts for the difference in attitude between Seth and myself on this one. Seth has spent most of his life in a part of the country where the prevailing attitude of, "Why wouldn't we put up a 200' cross next to the interstate?!" is so normal as to be unspoken -- assumed. I had no idea there were bonkers, off-the-rails Evangelicals until I dated a girl whose mother was one... and I was 19. I happen to think that the words we use (either by conscious choice, or by tradition) reinforce our attitudes and prejudices. If we're going to influence the minds around us, I think we can do 2 things: 1) choose our vocabulary and phrasing to reflect the attitudes we see as "right", and 2) influence others to use words and phrasing which reflect the attitudes we see as "right". Simply doing the first can start conversations which can result in the second. I choose to be intentional in my speech, and prepared to have "the conversation" if it is triggered.
newsundies Agree 100% I especially like the comparison you made of saying "bless you" or forcing you to say Merry Christmas to dead naming. Words are extremely important. It's about boundaries. It is perfectly acceptable and healthy to have boundaries. People don't get to force their beliefs on another person. Does that mean you have to get in a fight every time? Of course not. But I have a right not to be "blessed on" just as much as I have a right not to be called other names that are offensive to me.
"Why wouldn't we put up a 200' cross next to the interstate?!" is so normal as to be unspoken -- assumed." More airborne debris when a tornado hits the area! And I would point that out to them, too.
thank you so much for your content Seth. I relate to your story so much and your podcasts have helped me much in my journey through skepticism. had a great discussion last night about the question of god with my fiance, he says that if society were atheistic everyone would be killing themselves because there would be no point. what's your take?
He is then confusing atheism with nihilism. Nihilists might not see any meaning in life, and same is the case with religion too due to having a better and eternal socalled 'afterlife', but that's not the case with atheism.
@@lewsouth1539 I think it is because in his mind he would feel that way. while I don't agree with his position on the god question, he is very accepting of me and my beliefs, he's one of the Christians who believes but doesn't go to church, and doesn't take the Bible as 100% fact.
@Vidyanand Baphat - The fiancee is probably thinking about all the religious wars that European Christians engaged in, which were another reason the American Founding Fathers wrote safeguards against allowing religion - *especially Christianity* - to take control of the government.
As a atheist I personally don't don't give a fudged what people believe, as long as they get on my face telling me I'm going to hell, or offend me by telling me that I'm not blessed because I do workship and believe in their god. I turn around and say, you don't see me implementing my atheist ways on you right. So I appreciated if you do the same.
Not a half-hour rant; a needed talk from one of our commanders to the field troops. Thanks Seth. I can't promise I can change my own thinking every time, but I can promise to try and consider my position sometimes. I hope others will as well.
As far as tossing the baby out with the bath water, I was very disappointed when the American Humanist Association yanked an old award from Richard Dawkins. Apparently Dawkins had asked a question about trans people that the AHA considered offensive. I'm fine with AHA criticizing Dawkins if they think it's justified. I don't agree with him on everything, either. But taking back an AHA award for Humanist of the Year that Dawkins had received 25 years ago? That makes no sense to me at all.
I wish more than anything CT had an atheist community that got together. We have a couple humanist groups that have a few members but they only meet online. There’s one chapter of American Atheists but I’ve only seen them have events once or twice a year. I’d love to organize something but don’t know where to start I gotta admit I’ve been angry with the state of this country and have trouble seeing any humanity in the people who are actively seeking to take the basic human rights of others away based on an ancient fantasy book. I have more Mormon friends than Protestant friends and I live in Connecticut! Though my town has like seven Catholic variations 😂
I think that’s certainly a no. We have gotten more people away from religion since 2008 than any other time in American history. The nones are one of the fasting growing groups and young people don’t go to church in many places. When people say some overtly godly talk at me I say “thanks May the force be with you” I say it with goodwill but I will debate proselytizers
Yea, being nice and delivering with a smile is the way go. I struggle at times practicing that good advice. We must recognize that religious faith can be a positive for many people. The urge to proselytize and absolutism are the worst negatives.
I think as a political movement Athiests have a much harder battle against the religious people in this country. While people are leaving religion for a lack of beliefs. It isn't so much the walking away from a dirty as it is people get tired of all the hate and prejudice and restrictions of the religion of their choice. I think we end up spending a lot of time isolated and invisible because the religious folk who would rather we non believers don't exist. The movement is nowhere near dead though.
Great episode, Seth! I've talked about several of your points a few times. I've talked about the importance and benefits of community many times, and like you, am frustrated and saddened by the reaction of far too many atheists.
@Jebus Hypocristos Not at all, Mr. Troll. And if you think you were gonna provoke a reaction out of me with your comment, guess again. Sorry, I don't fall for Troll Bait.
Linking Putin support to Communism is idiotic. Putin is about as Communist as Pat Buchannan. He is one of the most fervent anti-Marxists in the world today. He is strongly Capitalist, Nationalist, and Socially Conservative. He blames Communist leaders for devolving autonomy to ethnic minorities and permitting their secession. The reason he said the fall of the USSR was a disaster was because it was mismanaged so badly that it reduce Russian national greatness while also causing life expectancies to drop by more than a decade.
@@magister343 Not reading or comprehending quotation marks ( *"Communist "* dictatorship ) is also idiotic. Punctuation exists for a reason. Punctuation is used for a reason. Putin considers the fall of the USSR a disaster because he is a dictator who loves personal power and identifies with Russia; he is obviously unconcerned with human longevity, as you are with reading comprehension. I rather like the notion of connecting right wing conservative Republican Christian Nationalist hatred of communism (which they use to mean "different from them") with their devotion to Putin (an imperialist autocrat) because of the delicious contradiction and accent on their abysmal ignorance. The visible cognitive dissonance is delightful.
You have identified the essential group psychology that cannot coalesce around larger social pressures. For example, as an orthodox hedonist we have problems as a group gather for unenforced monthly meetings. As orthodox practitioners of hedonism, any request of us is met with extreme skepticism and exude a condescension towards the requestor. So as herding cats is not a thing, organizing highly skeptical and critical individuals is nearly an order greater then the grouping of cats. Especially if you're trying to produce a musical stage performance.
The whole "free will" thing. it freaked me out when I first considered it, but I have come to the point of thinking it's maybe a nonsensical, broken question, kind of like asking... oh, I don't know... "What does purple sound like?"What is our will supposed to be free of in this notion? We have wills-- things we want and don't want. Is it supposed to be from pure chaos? So many conversations seem to still be framed from an unconsciously dualist position of us being separate from our brains: "Does my brain decide before I do? Is it just a process and I am along for the ride?" But aren't you those processes? All of them, taken together? So, once again, what does it even mean to ask those questions? We have wills. Why do we will what we do? Because we do, I guess. Is there anything more to ask? The more I think about this, the more I am probably not smart enough to talk about it, but oh well.
I agree, but don’t even get me started on Reddit (which was part of our lapse in prominence, along with our naive belief that school prayer, reproductive rights and freedom to be comfortable in one’s body or love without being ashamed of one’s partner’s gender were all settled issues). They’re mostly either Chinese Communist Party shills who cream themselves to China putting Muslims in concentration camps, or people who think all Christians are like their cruel, unloving parents.
Regarding free will: (1) We normally ask people to both consider and take responsibility for the consequences of their actions and (2) any attempt to persuade anyone through reason or logic would make absolutely no sense if all decisions are predetermined or based on pure animal instinct.
Huge Hitchens fan myself. I too often wonder and mourn the fact that he's not around to comment on some of the crazy stuff going on today in politics and our country. Just love how fearless and well-read he was. He had such a command of the English language and could turn a phrase and articulate his ideas with ease and style. As Seth pointed out I also think he had his flaws -- I think he was pretty unabashedly misogynistic towards women in an old-school 50's kind of way. But whatever he thought, you knew that he would and could defend it, and that his opinions were formed by way of the consumption of much reading and knowledge and not sourced from any one place.
Thanks for recognizing the misogyny. I find various beliefs he had about women to be uncharacteristically sloppy, yet characteristically arrogant, assumptions.
Normally i agree with Seth on a lot of things .... but (just a little one) .....religion in all its forms (at least in the west) has had the run of the land since Constantine's time and beyond, about 1600 years via law and war. Finally in the last @50+ years we can speak freely and tell those who have/had the power (religiously) that what your kin did yesterday or 200 years ago should not of happened then or now and we now won't to change those situations if we can. Saying it's too late, you should of spoken up then, or it's not worth the effort as we have bigger fish to fry, is letting them "win". god on money, continue to fight it, bless you on sneezing continue to remind them, churches continue to be tax free f**k no, etc. etc. "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. - G.Santayana. Or in this instance at least allow it to continue.
Druid? Locating a person's spirit in their breath was a widespread belief. You could sneeze your spirit out and let an evil one in. Life is fragile and uncertain, any little appeal to the supernatural is just a kindness. Thanks to human persistence and cleverness, we know about air and allergies and viruses and antibiotics.
A subject beat to death. I have just lost interest in arguments against all the subjective nonsense. Those who believe in myths, superstitions, and dogma all most never want to give up their position. At this point I am more focused on the threats of irreversible climate change, and the collapse of our civilization due to overshoot. I suppose religion has had its guilty part in denial, but even most atheists still believe in the myth of a techno fix. Despite the fact technology fixes and our growth economic systems defy the laws of physics. The only end to this religion, atheist argument will be humanity's extinction due to it focusing on silly symptoms rather than root causation.
The advocacy portion matters, although clearly not his rant focus. Although I don’t live in the USA, it seems that there is some effort to institute a (Christian) theocracy by some. I hope you don’t truly propose that people don’t change; however I understand the frustration when some don’t. I do feel our environmental immortality, it is no longer ignorance, should and will be held against us for a long time. So your case is important and well made.
My understanding about the no meat Fridays is that Elizabeth I was concerned that there wasn't enough fish being sold, so she made it a law in England that everyone should eat fish on Fridays (and I think Wednesdays as well)- an Anglican spin, but fit with the Catholics, too. And a totally economic decision.
According to KOFC 5357, this is what happened: "In the early years of Christianity in Europe, the Church instituted the practice of requiring the faithful to abstain from eating meat on Fridays in memory of Christ’s death. During the season of Lent, the Church also called for abstaining from eating meat on Wednesdays as well as on Fridays. While the Church called upon all of the adult faithful to abstain from meat on these days, the rule really only applied to the rich as the poor generally could not afford meat."
Elizabeth the First was Protestant, so she wouldn't have been able to hand down religious edicts that the Catholics would obey, especially since Catholics were being persecuted (due to fears that they would rise up, seize the English throne and force a return to Catholicism) during her reign.
I usually agree with Seth, but "Have a blessed day" is freaking annoying. Seriously, how much of a religious busybody does one have to be to interject their religion into even the most mundane of interactions?
RIGHT TO TRUTH We expect truthful scientific research Oriented series of discussions on the following subjects on your channel Theology , Metaphysics ,Parapsychology i) What is the history of these subjects? ii) Is there any interconnection within these subjects ?How? iii) What are the similarities and differences within these subjects and religions? iv) Are these subjects reject or support Dharma or spiritual science and its philosophy? How? v) What are the similarities and differences or credibility within these subjects and Charvak philosophy ,Woke theory , communisum ,Buddhism ,Abhrahamic religions and Sanatan Dharma?
its how the religious folks see everybody else so how can you counter that? I ve considered myself an atheist for decades now and I never thought much about it to be honest. Until people probed me about my religious view and attacked me verbally for being a non-believer. I didnt start this. I just defend myself and my freedom to have an opinion and view of my own
I have been atheist all my life and have no plan to change. Religion for me makes absolutely no sence. I have to say that I am quite happy I have born one of the most atheistic country in the world which is Estonia. Now living in Finland and here its also very easy because nobody really talks about religion in everyday life. So I can be in peace kind of. But oh boy, how I have no interest to debate with religious people, I find it too frustrating and pointless. Every religion is preacheng their own, thats it. My last attempt was in instagram where suddenly one woman I follow (not anymore :D) started to preach Jesus and I just posted one simple question, why Jesus? Why not all the other thousends of gods in the world, why not Allah, why not Buddha? Why not Vishnu? And I try to explain that that it is all because you have born here where the Christianity is major religion, when she would of born in Middle-East she would of been muslim. Simple as that. Nothing mind blowing right?? And all I got from other Jesus believer fellows in the comment section was PREACHING, PREACHING AND ONE MORE TIME PREACHING. Jesus is the saver, go and find him, you will find. He loves us, and how I dont know shit about these people and why I care as being atheist when somebody believes Jesus. And oh, I have read the wrong bible or not at all, cus I told that bible is supporting slavery and is full of evilness and killing. So-it was all pointless as F. These people dont have any understanding of logic. Yeah, I save my nerves. And I really appriciate Seth and people who have nerves to stand up for atheist and debate these crazy brainwashed people. Like really, you are pros!!
The problem with atheism is that it is not a thing, which means that atheists will take opposite sides to many things, and many of them are not expecting this to happen. My recommendation is to emphasize the importance of being fact based, evidence based, science based in all things - no exceptions,
Been an Atheist all my life. Will continue to do do for rest of my life. Until there is irrefutable evidence. Science is the field of study which needs to be pursued. It provides answers and, hopefully, more questions. And “Gesundheit” means “health” which is a nice thing to say to anyone getting sick. 😎
Ditto!
Even there is proof of god. I still would not follow him. Read the bible and you will find out what kind of tirant he is.
You neglect the top down and only focus on the bottom up. Don’t be so blind
@@carolinafine8050 Blind? How? Evidence I can see, that is provable, replicatable, objective. Do you have evidence? And please don’t do the circular reason. “The bible says there is a god and the bible would’t lie. And god wrote the bible and wouldn’t lie.” There is demonstrable, factual evidence for the big bang, evolution, natural selection, etc. Facts! Facts! Facts!
Is that the german for health? In spanish it is also "salud" what you say to people sneezing and the like
Left church after 40 years. The way I see it, if I react to things like mottos and sneezes, then they still have me. And frankly, 4 decades was enough.
I still say "bless you". It barely meant anything to me before I became an atheist and it certainly doesn't mean anything to me now. It's just a courteous thing. Who gives a sh*t.
yeah its like have a nice day of take care of yourself
On a similar note, just as we say "bless you" when someone sneezes, I think we should say "how could you" when someone farts.
@@nameforcomments4092 I am all for that
@@nameforcomments4092 I just say "Get any on you?"
When someone around me sneezes I often say “Glockenspiel”
Most people don’t notice. If they do notice. I say “it means playing clock. It’s just something funny to say. “
An episode of Seinfeld taught us that “you’re so good-lookin’” is the proper way to address a sneeze. 😬
My wife and I literally use that here at home. 🤣👍🏼
(Not that there's anything wrong with that.)
Just thinking, Christian Nationalism and its child, Christian Privilege, to me, are arguably the most clear and present danger to America. These on their own may seem harmless (to some). But my concern is the insidious reach and impact they have on the rest of the non-religious society. Atheists are not a monolith, but to combat the risk to our freedoms, I wish we could unite...
I have come across several comments on threads such as this one which state openly that the 19th Amendment (women's right to vote) should be repealed, that universal voting rights are an immediate target for dismantling, and that, as the founding fathers intended, only white, christian, property-owning males should be allowed to vote. They are a much bigger threat than we namby-pamby kumbaya democrats are prepared to face and fight against.
That there's a pretty good reason why church is supposed to be separated from state. Religion is a large part of the reason why worldwide politics is so corrupt. But I also cannot claim that atheist politicians would be pure innocence 😇 and lilly white honesty, either 😆 Power corrupts any way you slice and dice it.
#ReligionIsFiction
Um... no? I am still an atheist. I am still not convinced these scam artists have anything behind their claims of a deity.
The MAGA party and other christians are in no way an example of morality or good intentions to anyone. Just look at them and the way they behave; who would want to be like them?
Important discussion that can’t be had enough these days. I’m about halfway through and am impressed that you have managed to avoid using the term “cancel culture”, which obviously has a heap of political baggage, but is pretty much what all “tribes” seem to do these days.
"Cancel culture" is only something a person with a guilty conscience worries about. It's a bogeyman, a complete farce, and it says a lot that this is your only apparent takeaway.
Let the right-wingers be the only group to utter the abomination, “Cancel Culture.” Free thinking people and progressives would do well to carry forward with the responsible notion that actions have consequences, and in this Information Age dominated by social media and instant info, it should come as no surprise that a phenomenon of a Culture of Consequences (or Consequence Culture) has come into being. You couldn’t eliminate that now any more than you can unsee or unknow egregious behaviors. You will adjust your behavior toward that offender according to your own morality or punitive nature for violators of ethical norms.
I, of course, can only taslk for myself but think this whole cancedl thing is BS.
The woke crowd needs to chill, atm they're a rabid dog that will achieve nothing by alienating everybody. Take Marvel Comics as an example, new female powerful character of color? Will turn out lesbian down the road - it becomes bad, if it becomes a trope.
On the other hand, the right screaming cancel culture and how bad it is all day forgetting their book tells the story of how their imaginary friend cancelled the whole world.
I think the guy who was talking about labeling people supporting Putin as "communist sympathizers" was not correct in his understanding of what Putin is. He may have been KGB and want to regain the land previously held by the former U.S.S.R, but he is actually very right wing. He actually loathes communism, and wants to reinstate the soviet empire, but with a more right wing ideology.
USSR had started becoming Russian empire long back when Stalin ended Communists International.
I'm so glad there are younger people out & being vocal. Small changes makes people re-evaluate that this world consists of ALL people, even Atheists.🙄
When someone tells me to have a blessed day I usually say thanks an you have a magically enchanted day too.
Loved this one, Seth. Personally, I’m completely unoffended by people who make religious references like the ones you cited. I literally couldn’t give a shit if someone wants to say grace before eating, says “god bless you” after I sneeze and the like. Man, don’t we have bigger fish to fry than getting buggered by someone else’s frame of reference? Likewise, I couldn’t care less about the “in god we trust” inscription. Sure, I’d prefer it to not be there, but I don’t let it generate any angst. And since I’m here, a reiterated “thank you” for contributing to my life in a meaningful way. I greatly appreciate all your hard work.
I must agree that we should pick our stand, for or against appropriately, sometimes however, it feels that theists use the strategy of "death by a thousand paper cuts" meaning anything that is a slow process in which a multitude of small, bad things happen which ultimately culminate in the demise of whatever was suffering the change. Little by little the theists bring in their "little expressions" of "faith", put it on the money, nationalize religious holidays, pass a little law here and there, and before you know it we'll not have any freedom from religion.
I did leave the ACA. I think I'm done with organized anything, anymore... Trusting leadership has become my sticking point.
My friend, Lloyd Morain, founded the American Humanists. In the last couple years of his life, they tried to take everything he had and stick him in a nursing home.
Just make sure you still vote (not saying you said that you don't) because religion will take over if we don't keep them voted out. I get tired of it all too. But at least pay attention to Freedom From Religion Foundation. They help keep religion out of schools & politics. So pay attention to that because we don't want this country to become a authoritarian theocracy. ✌️💙. I'm with you though, I get sick of all the arguments you've heard over and over and people not wanting to hear anything that goes against what they believe. It's frustrating!
@@Cookie-ri9pz Vote for your dream candidate in the primary, then for the less religious/religion-owned of the two in the general election.
I find it difficult to trust anything human. But I make choices best I can and hope for the best.
Became an atheist late in life but I've never felt better and truly free .
Same here!
Me too.
DITTO!
Once, when I was recently de-converted, back in the mid 90s, I was at work (Disneyland) getting changed into my costume (they don't call them uniforms) in the locker room. I sneezed, and from somewhere across the (rather large) locker room, I hear someone call out, "bless you!" I was in my snarky, (you might say angry) phase, and said "no thanks!" in a sarcastically cheery tone. I got some kind of derisive response from the guy. It was deserved, I suppose. He was trying to be nice, and even though I find the "blessing you over a sneeze" notion a bit asinine.... I mean, what a thing to make an issue of, right? I suppose as pushback goes, it was pretty mild, but it wasn't going to produce anything but negativity. It's not like I am guilt-ridden over it, but it was not productive. These days I try to view it in the way it is intended: wishing you the best.
The "bless you" is more likely rooted in the medieval Christian belief that one's soul would fly out of their noses when they sneezed. The thinking at the time was that somehow blessing the person would enable them to haul their souls back into their bodies thereby preventing a demon from zipping in and taking up residence.
That bit about the expression being from the Druids is SO wrong, as the Druids didn't leave any written records of their beliefs. It sounds like the sort of baseless claim that loathsome demonic toad Kenneth Copeland would make.
Was an atheist for billions of years before I awoke here on Earth, and certainly will continue to be so over the hopefully many years during my time here on Earth, and will be again for billions of years more after my time here is done.
Fortunately, unfortunately the Supreme Court has ruled several times unequivocally that “ in god we trust “ is not unconstitutional because it just says “ god “ and specifically specifying any particular god or religion but of course as a atheist I believe it shouldn’t be there regardless
Where I am writing on a dollar bill is considered defacement, and illegal.
If the word "god" is capitalized, it is referring to a certain god and breaks the 1st Amendment. If it is not capitalized, it is a general category. Personally, if it is just regarding the general category, it is meaningless. So, why would anyone object to it being removed?
@Spencer - The American writers of the Constitution would agree with you.
@@elainejohnson6955 : Yes, right, but yet they are putting "In god We Trust" signs in the schools now saying it is alright if they are "donated."
Ironically Iron Age heathens knew sneezing on others had unwanted results. In 2022 my religious neighbors think it’s unpatriotic to wear a mask to prevent spreading their nasty germs! 🤦🏻♀️
Russia is not communist anymore. Sounds like the caller was confusing communism with authoritarianism.
You are correct.
The AT&T disconnect bit during the song was brilliant. The song was a lot better than I expected. Very good job.
Interestingly enough, in that part of the song, she demonstrated the existence of such a thing as Ma Bell (the Bell System (also known as AT&T)), which is far more than can be said for the existence of such a thing as "Father God".
Thank you for making these available for consideration.
You can tell Gov. Stitt that a good chunk of Oklahoma is Cherokee Nation and they too must be represented, especially with the sordid history of this massive human rights violation called the Indian boarding schools coming out!
Damn right. If the fundie literalist apocalyptic Christians are going to be allowed to officially lead students in their own special little version of prayer to their Middle Eastern god, then they'd better make time for Native American shamans to pray to traditional nature spirits. Oh, and the worshippers of Baphomet would probably want some time, too.
Its changing as the Conservative atheist presence enlarges. But it may become reinvigorated now that the religious right is becoming more bold.
The US needs us, now more than ever; a country is fighting and sacrificing so much to keep democracy, while we, one of said country’s most vocal allies, are seriously debating whether we should even be a democracy or a Christian Iran
@@badpiggies988 agreed. I weep for the American Dream.
libertarians were supposed to be relatively irreligious, but their need for power against leftist social spending provides justification to partner with godzealots who want government monitoring what we do with our holes&poles. they're traitors to their own philosophy
I agree. I guess I would say I have atheistic tendencies for the last forty years. But I got sucked into the UA-cam conversation by the multitude of atheist YT channels because of the abhorrent religious right. I would be the first to defend religious freedom, but I stop when they step beyond that boundary.
I am thankful for your half hour rant at the beginning of the show. Lately I have been letting myself get irritated by the people who display their christianity, and I assume that they are all bigoted haters, but you reminded me that even when I was a christian I was still not a bigoted hater. Thank you for reminding me that they are not all bad and stupid people.
I don't think the movement is dead, but it most certainly is fractured.
I made Atheist videos from 2009-2011 on UA-cam, as TheOtherSide100, aka TOS100. Back then, lots of videos were about debates or pwnage. It was sometimes aggressive.
But then there was a split, or schism, when the BS known as "Elevatorgate" happened with RK Watson. PZ Myers picked up on it, and the "two-initial-last name" Atheists paired up seemingly for a scourge known as "Atheism Plus."
At the time, I was going to work for an online video educational company, and part of the hiring process involved scouring the internet to see if you make videos [they suggested that people who make online videos were more likely to steal their content]. To get the job, I deleted my UA-cam profile.
During this time, I watched some channels, and kept listening to yours. I saw attitudes shift from the pwnage and yelling to calm and factual responses. This inspired me to return, hence my channel name.
But I'm finding that I don't quite yet know where I can fit in, or what I can offer up that would be uniquely mine. As I type this, I am sorting out those details in my mind, and working to develop a strategy. Many of the people I used to commune with have changed. Some have even died [RIP Goxster and DPR Jones]. A few are still doing what they have always done, such as yourself, Aron Ra, or Thunderf00t, with little to no change in some cases.
I get turned off by the entire thing whenever there is any type of in-fighting. Disagreements are fine, but in-fighting takes things to an unacceptable level. Truth be told, I've never really been a member of a group, and it doesn't feel like there is ever a good time to start. So I work to focus on my own efforts, which are in the very early stages of my re-boot.
After all, there is no "barrel."
My subscribers have given me some constructive ideas. The hunt continues. Thanks for all that you do, Seth. We talked briefly back when I had my original channel, and hopefully one day I'll have the privilege of doing so again.
How many subscribers do you have?
As far as atheism vs creationists (which was the main focus back in the late 00's) it's basically beating a dead horse at this point. The few you mentioned are the only ones that are still doing it, though ThunderF00t has shifted to doing more scientific experimental videos and debunking tech after the Atheism Plus crap. All of the arguments seem to have been made, recycled and regurgitated over and over. New people come in to replace the old and start repeating the same arguments and asking the same questions. It is nice to see less focus on pwnage, though. I think it's still important to continue to offer rebuttals to religious claims, because they will never stop, and many people in our society are still alarmingly anti-science.
In Canada our national anthem has the phrase "God keep our land glorious and free". A few years ago there was one phrase change from "all thy sons command" to " all of us command" in order to be more gender inclusive. When the change was made there were some of my buddies in in the hockey dressing room ( of course its Canada ) complaining about the change and I piped up that I was okay with the change but what really offended me was that there was a fairy tale being in our anthem. Of the 10 in the room 8 laughed but 2 were pissed off.Which is about the ratio of religious and non religious in Canada. I wish that there was a member of our parliament that would sponsor a bill to remove God from the anthem not because it offends me but because it make the idiots crazy mad.
Same in the UK, we have that tedious dirge "God Save the Queen/King", but 80-95% of people have no belief in the Christian god (or not enough to go to church).
When the ER2 pops her clogs, which can't be too long now, it would be a great opportunity to change the anthem altogether, but they probably won't for fear of offending someone, or just plain apathy.
I learned recently that the Church of England could be effectively finished in the next 10-15 years, as attendance is dropping so rapidly. You can't maintain those cold dusty churches if nobody's putting money in the collection every week.
@@ziploc2000 being a Welshman have never sang God Save The Queen! I will stand for it but not sing, my anthem is Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau (Land Of My Father's)
@@andybrace9225 Just listened, definitely a step up from the English National Embarrassment.
Fellow Canadian here. “God” could easily be changed to “We”.
Also the preamble to the constitution needs some secularisation.
[edit] the second and third verses of God Save the Queen are pretty rough.
I pretend its one of the gods of indiginous peoples. The gods who were protectors of the land.
This week in the news.
3 yr old Arely Naomi Proctor dies Sept from asphyxiation due to smothering and suffocation. Her Mother , Grandfather and Uncle were performing an exorcism. The child often woke up screaming at night and it was decided she was possessed by demons
Deborah Samuel, Christian student in Nigeria , is beaten, stoned and burned alive by Muslim student mob for complaining about religious posting on What's App.
Two examples of why we must never let the atheist movement die.
and as a twenty something who enjoys your show, thanks for all you do "dad". ✌️
20:36 All I could think of was a new store: "Baby, Bathwater & Beyond"
Madam Who proves there are young people who have things to say . Very uptempo & well produced. Loved the song 🎵
I liked it too!
Stylistically, it was a bit postmodern for my taste. However, I did enjoy the part in the interlude just before the bridge where she was "praying" and the operator came on to say that she had reached a number which was not in service. It well underscored the fact that prayers fall on non-existent, fictional ears.
"It's okay, we all sneeze, it's all right." ...
Maybe, when someone sneezes, I should say, "I forgive you."
Or "May you be healthy".
Great show, Seth! That was a good lecture, not a rant. Love what you do!
I wonder why we never bless farts? They seem worse than sneezes to me.
Maybe it's the embarrassment factor? If you point it out then they have to address it...
Farts don't spray germs about, sneezes can.
@@ziploc2000 You're not doing it right then...
It has to do with illness. A sneeze is seen as a sign of possible illness, and a burp or fart is a sign of health. You don't NEED blessing for signs of health. Actually, for farts, you should bless those near to the one passing wind.
@@littlebitofhope1489 lol. That makes more sense. Especially after I eat Mexican.
Thanks for your content I would like to say more with you but you have said everything anyway. I am from New Zealand and have been a follower of yours for a while. I agree completely with what you you talk about. Cheers bro 😁
Had me at the whispered, "Nothing!" Never lolled so hard, love these vids, Seth, thanks for uploading!
How does any one love these videos ?
I always shout "LOOK OUT!" when someone sneezes.
Before I listen, I'm a life-long atheist approaching 60, and I'll comment that atheism is hardly dead.
I am not sure what I was expecting, but I am fairly confident I enjoyed Madam Who's song at the end more than I had expected to.
When someone says have a blessed day or God bless you I just say thank you you too I have no problem with anything like that
Thank you for making this Seth. I really appreciate it. I love watching your content, even though I'm a Christian. Keep it up!
Comment on the public prayer before meetings; I formerly worked in a small city in Michigan (rather a blue state and county) that started every council meeting with prayer. I never got to see what happened when they hired an atheist mayor, I had quit by then, but I hear they forced out that mayor, and probably still pray. It always felt so weird and fake to me.
I pick my battles. I ask myself if it's really that important that I get in someone's face about something they won't change anyway. 🙄
Regarding the free will question I like what Schopenhauer said, 'You can will what you do but you can't will what you will'. Love your work, Seth. Thanks for the show. PS : The song at the end of the show is fantastic!
I guess it can be said of the same how people get all bent out of shape if you say Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas. I say Happy Holidays because I know Christmas is not the only holiday in December.
"Happy solstice, the sun returns." The reason for the season.
When I say Happy Holidays, it's _because_ it pisses off the crazies. Otherwise, I would automatically say "Merry Christmas," since that's just how I grew up. It's the exact same reason why I say "gesundheit" when someone sneezes. I don't even think about it.
I didn't know _anyone_ who wasn't Christian - as far as I knew, at least - all the time I grew up. I didn't believe it myself, but there weren't any religious minorities in our small town. And if there were any other atheists (besides myself), they celebrated Christmas just like everyone else.
So I have to _remind_ myself to say "Happy Holidays" in order to be inclusive. Or, alternately, to piss off the right-wing Christians who are trying to destroy our democracy. :)
You are perfectly right. If you don't know their persuasion, it is the safest greeting. What gets me is when they claim we are banned from saying Merry Christmas. I'm sure that some companies advise their employees to use a generic greeting with members of the public because of the reason you cite. At the government office where I worked, and we were perfectly free to wish our co-workers Merry Christmas or whatever. My boss was Jewish, and it was fine to stick your head in her door and wish her a Happy Hannukah. On a related note, the guy who bagged my groceries one time--someone I didn't know--wished me a Happy Mother's Day. I have no kids. I didn't really care, but what if he said that to someone who had just lost their only child?
On the question of whether or not we have free will and the nature vs culture debate, the (knowledgeable and entertaining) lectures of Prof Robert Sapolsky of (as I recall) Stanford are fantastic.
I basically have only a problem with "have a blessed day" or something similar when the other person knows I am an atheist and don't want to hear stuff or they use it as a defeater argument, like the "even though you don't believe in god, he loves you" kind of thing. BUT it urks me that this kind of language is used by everyone, it shouldn't be the case. We shouldn't have religious vocabulary in our day-to-day interactions. I don't want to say "Oh my god" when surprised by something. I try to avoid it but because it is so ingrained in our lives I say it accidentally sometimes. I want that to change, not militantly, but naturally.
Pagans also use "blessed", so you could have some fun with that...
@@WWZenaDo haha lol
There are still atheist channels out there fighting the good fight
As I’ve gotten older, and more comfortable in my atheism, I’ve gotten a bit more “live and let live” about the little things (like sneezes, being told they’re praying for me etc). It’s just better to read the intention rather than get caught up on the religious shit, because, I mean… cmon, let’s just be humans to each other lol. I used to be such an angry atheist, but I’m so chill now, maybe it’s because I’ve been among a bunch of non religious folks for the last decade (Australia!). Let’s just try to remember the human, be kind, act how you’d like to be treated, etc without getting up our own asses about it.
I often reply that I no longer worship Middle Eastern gods.
If they look puzzled, I then remind them that the bible was written in the Middle East by Iron Age Middle Eastern men.
I had a co worker get mad at me for not saying bless you, after she sneezed. I said that I just don't say it, and I would feel silly. She was not impressed.
Great track Madam Who!
I'm jamming to the song you played Seth! Hats off to the singer. Thoughts and prayers you're not swaying anything!
As a lifelong atheist I confess I would no more go to an atheist event than I would go to an event for people who don't speak Swedish. It just isn't a way I define myself.
People recovering from religion presumably have a greater need to replace the social interaction that came with religion, and like Alcoholics Anonymous, I can see the benefit for people who need that.
Not being disrespectful at all but I think AA is damaging. You give up one addiction for another. I have friends that did this and now they are just addicted to god instead of alcohol. Other than that I agree with everything you said. ✌️💙
Safety in numbers.
If I were younger, I would _definitely_ go to an atheist event in order to meet atheists I see on UA-cam or listen to on podcasts (the Scathing Atheists, anyone)? But it's not just that they don't believe in a god. That's easy enough. It's the _positive_ stuff that inspires me.
Admittedly, I'm not very social, anyway. I support the local atheist group here,... sort of. I give them money, occasionally, and I'm technically a member, I suppose. But I've never actually _met_ any of them. They get together at a coffee shop every week - or they did before the pandemic, at least - but since I retired, I don't get up that early. Heh, heh.
Well, I probably wouldn't go, anyway. But that's just because I like people better in theory than in practice.
@@Bill_Garthright Or you just like Atheism and not atheists as people beyond their atheism.
@@Cookie-ri9pz Is AA always goddy? I wasn't aware, l never met anyone who attended, I just knew it was a group thing.
The deciding not to give the "bless you" response to a sneeze, and the crossing out of "in god we trust" on the money is small, maybe even petty. To me, though, it offers a grain of sand to further erode the assumed high status and privileged place of Christianity in the culture. Sure, I don't have an audience of millions, or even thousands... I may have an audience of one, or ten. If I can make that audience... or just part of it... aware that those assumptions of Christianity's primacy don't hold everywhere and at all times, I feel like that's doing some good. The more frequently, and consistently I can do it, the better. To me, having someone say "bless you" to me when I sneeze is, at best, assuming something about me without warrant, and at worst, an aggressive action disregarding a known aspect of my identity. Misgendering or dead-naming someone who is trans has gotten a lot of stink eye, and rightly so. How is assuming I'm sympathetic to "blessings", or expecting me to engage in pointless ritual any better?
As a life-long Yankee, I have only briefly been exposed to the "Bless his little heart" vernacular of The South, and as such it is foreign to me. I'm aware of it, and have been for most of my life, but as a trope on TV and in movies. Being there... being immersed in it... makes my skin crawl. Maybe that accounts for the difference in attitude between Seth and myself on this one. Seth has spent most of his life in a part of the country where the prevailing attitude of, "Why wouldn't we put up a 200' cross next to the interstate?!" is so normal as to be unspoken -- assumed. I had no idea there were bonkers, off-the-rails Evangelicals until I dated a girl whose mother was one... and I was 19.
I happen to think that the words we use (either by conscious choice, or by tradition) reinforce our attitudes and prejudices. If we're going to influence the minds around us, I think we can do 2 things: 1) choose our vocabulary and phrasing to reflect the attitudes we see as "right", and 2) influence others to use words and phrasing which reflect the attitudes we see as "right". Simply doing the first can start conversations which can result in the second. I choose to be intentional in my speech, and prepared to have "the conversation" if it is triggered.
newsundies Agree 100% I especially like the comparison you made of saying "bless you" or forcing you to say Merry Christmas to dead naming. Words are extremely important. It's about boundaries. It is perfectly acceptable and healthy to have boundaries. People don't get to force their beliefs on another person. Does that mean you have to get in a fight every time? Of course not. But I have a right not to be "blessed on" just as much as I have a right not to be called other names that are offensive to me.
"Why wouldn't we put up a 200' cross next to the interstate?!" is so normal as to be unspoken -- assumed."
More airborne debris when a tornado hits the area! And I would point that out to them, too.
thank you so much for your content Seth. I relate to your story so much and your podcasts have helped me much in my journey through skepticism.
had a great discussion last night about the question of god with my fiance, he says that if society were atheistic everyone would be killing themselves because there would be no point. what's your take?
He is then confusing atheism with nihilism. Nihilists might not see any meaning in life, and same is the case with religion too due to having a better and eternal socalled 'afterlife', but that's not the case with atheism.
Has your fiance not noticed that there are already plenty of atheists around who are *not* killing themselves? He sounds pretty clueless.
@@lewsouth1539 I think it is because in his mind he would feel that way. while I don't agree with his position on the god question, he is very accepting of me and my beliefs, he's one of the Christians who believes but doesn't go to church, and doesn't take the Bible as 100% fact.
@Vidyanand Baphat - The fiancee is probably thinking about all the religious wars that European Christians engaged in, which were another reason the American Founding Fathers wrote safeguards against allowing religion - *especially Christianity* - to take control of the government.
As a atheist I personally don't don't give a fudged what people believe, as long as they get on my face telling me I'm going to hell, or offend me by telling me that I'm not blessed because I do workship and believe in their god. I turn around and say, you don't see me implementing my atheist ways on you right. So I appreciated if you do the same.
When others sneeze, I ask them if they would like a spatula
Ok, now I am imagining a tiny little nostril sized spatula to scrape your nose with. LOL
"Would you like a spatula? A squeegee? A wet/dry vac?"
Not a half-hour rant; a needed talk from one of our commanders to the field troops. Thanks Seth. I can't promise I can change my own thinking every time, but I can promise to try and consider my position sometimes. I hope others will as well.
As far as tossing the baby out with the bath water, I was very disappointed when the American Humanist Association yanked an old award from Richard Dawkins. Apparently Dawkins had asked a question about trans people that the AHA considered offensive. I'm fine with AHA criticizing Dawkins if they think it's justified. I don't agree with him on everything, either. But taking back an AHA award for Humanist of the Year that Dawkins had received 25 years ago? That makes no sense to me at all.
The song was great!
I wish more than anything CT had an atheist community that got together. We have a couple humanist groups that have a few members but they only meet online. There’s one chapter of American Atheists but I’ve only seen them have events once or twice a year. I’d love to organize something but don’t know where to start
I gotta admit I’ve been angry with the state of this country and have trouble seeing any humanity in the people who are actively seeking to take the basic human rights of others away based on an ancient fantasy book. I have more Mormon friends than Protestant friends and I live in Connecticut! Though my town has like seven Catholic variations 😂
Pretty much any community or club that isn't based around religion is atheist in nature.
@@vinnyrac northwestern CT
The athiest movement is sometimes live but I usually catch up with it later on UA-cam.
Thank you Seth.
When you sneeze french will say 'a vos souhait' mean 'to your wish'.
I love you Seth Andrews, you should have Professor Dave from Professor Dave Explains sometime!
That's a kinda catchy song. Nice one.
The Irish have a saying " it's nice to be nice "
It's nice to be important, but it's important to be nice!
Good first 30 minute of so rant. Lots of good thoughts in there.
I think that’s certainly a no. We have gotten more people away from religion since 2008 than any other time in American history. The nones are one of the fasting growing groups and young people don’t go to church in many places. When people say some overtly godly talk at me I say “thanks May the force be with you” I say it with goodwill but I will debate proselytizers
Yea, being nice and delivering with a smile is the way go. I struggle at times practicing that good advice. We must recognize that religious faith can be a positive for many people.
The urge to proselytize and absolutism are the worst negatives.
I think as a political movement Athiests have a much harder battle against the religious people in this country. While people are leaving religion for a lack of beliefs. It isn't so much the walking away from a dirty as it is people get tired of all the hate and prejudice and restrictions of the religion of their choice. I think we end up spending a lot of time isolated and invisible because the religious folk who would rather we non believers don't exist. The movement is nowhere near dead though.
Sorry to be "that person," but "none" doesn't automatically mean atheist.
Great episode, Seth! I've talked about several of your points a few times. I've talked about the importance and benefits of community many times, and like you, am frustrated and saddened by the reaction of far too many atheists.
@Jebus Hypocristos Not at all, Mr. Troll. And if you think you were gonna provoke a reaction out of me with your comment, guess again. Sorry, I don't fall for Troll Bait.
I've done the "substitution exercise" thing. It's fun. And I fully agree with the gentleman about Putin/"Communist" dictatorship devotion.
Linking Putin support to Communism is idiotic. Putin is about as Communist as Pat Buchannan. He is one of the most fervent anti-Marxists in the world today. He is strongly Capitalist, Nationalist, and Socially Conservative. He blames Communist leaders for devolving autonomy to ethnic minorities and permitting their secession. The reason he said the fall of the USSR was a disaster was because it was mismanaged so badly that it reduce Russian national greatness while also causing life expectancies to drop by more than a decade.
@@magister343 Not reading or comprehending quotation marks ( *"Communist "* dictatorship ) is also idiotic. Punctuation exists for a reason. Punctuation is used for a reason.
Putin considers the fall of the USSR a disaster because he is a dictator who loves personal power and identifies with Russia; he is obviously unconcerned with human longevity, as you are with reading comprehension.
I rather like the notion of connecting right wing conservative Republican Christian Nationalist hatred of communism (which they use to mean "different from them") with their devotion to Putin (an imperialist autocrat) because of the delicious contradiction and accent on their abysmal ignorance. The visible cognitive dissonance is delightful.
Banger song at the end...hell yeah
You have identified the essential group psychology that cannot coalesce around larger social pressures. For example, as an orthodox hedonist we have problems as a group gather for unenforced monthly meetings. As orthodox practitioners of hedonism, any request of us is met with extreme skepticism and exude a condescension towards the requestor. So as herding cats is not a thing, organizing highly skeptical and critical individuals is nearly an order greater then the grouping of cats. Especially if you're trying to produce a musical stage performance.
The whole "free will" thing. it freaked me out when I first considered it, but I have come to the point of thinking it's maybe a nonsensical, broken question, kind of like asking... oh, I don't know... "What does purple sound like?"What is our will supposed to be free of in this notion? We have wills-- things we want and don't want. Is it supposed to be from pure chaos? So many conversations seem to still be framed from an unconsciously dualist position of us being separate from our brains: "Does my brain decide before I do? Is it just a process and I am along for the ride?" But aren't you those processes? All of them, taken together? So, once again, what does it even mean to ask those questions? We have wills. Why do we will what we do? Because we do, I guess. Is there anything more to ask? The more I think about this, the more I am probably not smart enough to talk about it, but oh well.
I'm encouraged by how often I run across atheists in comment sections of various media. Much more common than I thought was possible.
I agree, but don’t even get me started on Reddit (which was part of our lapse in prominence, along with our naive belief that school prayer, reproductive rights and freedom to be comfortable in one’s body or love without being ashamed of one’s partner’s gender were all settled issues). They’re mostly either Chinese Communist Party shills who cream themselves to China putting Muslims in concentration camps, or people who think all Christians are like their cruel, unloving parents.
I haven't heard of this.
You Tube is full of videos from believers and non believers alike with no sign of dying out.
I have tickets for Star Wars Celebration this year. I suppose that makes me a Jedi.Sweet!
May the Force be with you, brother.
@@onepunch9203 and also with you.
Regarding free will: (1) We normally ask people to both consider and take responsibility for the consequences of their actions and (2) any attempt to persuade anyone through reason or logic would make absolutely no sense if all decisions are predetermined or based on pure animal instinct.
Huge Hitchens fan myself. I too often wonder and mourn the fact that he's not around to comment on some of the crazy stuff going on today in politics and our country. Just love how fearless and well-read he was. He had such a command of the English language and could turn a phrase and articulate his ideas with ease and style. As Seth pointed out I also think he had his flaws -- I think he was pretty unabashedly misogynistic towards women in an old-school 50's kind of way. But whatever he thought, you knew that he would and could defend it, and that his opinions were formed by way of the consumption of much reading and knowledge and not sourced from any one place.
no he wasn't misogynistic, lmao. He spoke pure facts. Just because those facts hurt your feelings doesn't make him a miSoGyniSt
@@AverageAlien my feelings aren't hurt. Just stating my opinion as you did yours.
Thanks for recognizing the misogyny. I find various beliefs he had about women to be uncharacteristically sloppy, yet characteristically arrogant, assumptions.
@@SkySpiral8 Facts about women which you refuse to accept*
@@AverageAlien Opine as you wish.
Normally i agree with Seth on a lot of things .... but (just a little one) .....religion in all its forms (at least in the west) has had the run of the land since Constantine's time and beyond, about 1600 years via law and war. Finally in the last @50+ years we can speak freely and tell those who have/had the power (religiously) that what your kin did yesterday or 200 years ago should not of happened then or now and we now won't to change those situations if we can. Saying it's too late, you should of spoken up then, or it's not worth the effort as we have bigger fish to fry, is letting them "win". god on money, continue to fight it, bless you on sneezing continue to remind them, churches continue to be tax free f**k no, etc. etc. "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. - G.Santayana. Or in this instance at least allow it to continue.
I LOVE that song by Madame Who! She is talented!
Druid? Locating a person's spirit in their breath was a widespread belief. You could sneeze your spirit out and let an evil one in. Life is fragile and uncertain, any little appeal to the supernatural is just a kindness. Thanks to human persistence and cleverness, we know about air and allergies and viruses and antibiotics.
That song at the end was pretty rad. 🐙
When someone sneezes around me...I congratulated them on a" great sneeze."..
A subject beat to death. I have just lost interest in arguments against all the subjective nonsense. Those who believe in myths, superstitions, and dogma all most never want to give up their position. At this point I am more focused on the threats of irreversible climate change, and the collapse of our civilization due to overshoot. I suppose religion has had its guilty part in denial, but even most atheists still believe in the myth of a techno fix. Despite the fact technology fixes and our growth economic systems defy the laws of physics. The only end to this religion, atheist argument will be humanity's extinction due to it focusing on silly symptoms rather than root causation.
The advocacy portion matters, although clearly not his rant focus. Although I don’t live in the USA, it seems that there is some effort to institute a (Christian) theocracy by some.
I hope you don’t truly propose that people don’t change; however I understand the frustration when some don’t.
I do feel our environmental immortality, it is no longer ignorance, should and will be held against us for a long time. So your case is important and well made.
I like the song.
Tissue? Instead of bless you
Yes, I like that response. Also in light of Covid, that the person sneezing would do so in the crook of their arm.
1:05:00 💓 this song!
My understanding about the no meat Fridays is that Elizabeth I was concerned that there wasn't enough fish being sold, so she made it a law in England that everyone should eat fish on Fridays (and I think Wednesdays as well)- an Anglican spin, but fit with the Catholics, too. And a totally economic decision.
According to KOFC 5357, this is what happened:
"In the early years of Christianity in Europe, the Church instituted the practice of requiring the faithful to abstain from eating meat on Fridays in memory of Christ’s death. During the season of Lent, the Church also called for abstaining from eating meat on Wednesdays as well as on Fridays.
While the Church called upon all of the adult faithful to abstain from meat on these days, the rule really only applied to the rich as the poor generally could not afford meat."
Elizabeth the First was Protestant, so she wouldn't have been able to hand down religious edicts that the Catholics would obey, especially since Catholics were being persecuted (due to fears that they would rise up, seize the English throne and force a return to Catholicism) during her reign.
I would be proud to be a member of the lady gaga church
I love that song 🎵
the song was fire!!
I usually agree with Seth, but "Have a blessed day" is freaking annoying. Seriously, how much of a religious busybody does one have to be to interject their religion into even the most mundane of interactions?
Point out to them that Wiccans and pagans also use that expression...
Madem Who? 👏👏👏
We have free will and we're not in a computer
RIGHT TO TRUTH
We expect truthful scientific research Oriented series of discussions on the following subjects on
your channel
Theology , Metaphysics ,Parapsychology
i) What is the history of these subjects?
ii) Is there any interconnection within these subjects ?How?
iii) What are the similarities and differences within these subjects and religions?
iv) Are these subjects reject or support Dharma or spiritual science and its philosophy? How?
v) What are the similarities and differences or credibility within these subjects and
Charvak philosophy ,Woke theory , communisum ,Buddhism ,Abhrahamic religions and Sanatan
Dharma?
the "us vs. them" is big these times...
its how the religious folks see everybody else so how can you counter that? I ve considered myself an atheist for decades now and I never thought much about it to be honest. Until people probed me about my religious view and attacked me verbally for being a non-believer. I didnt start this. I just defend myself and my freedom to have an opinion and view of my own
I have been atheist all my life and have no plan to change. Religion for me makes absolutely no sence. I have to say that I am quite happy I have born one of the most atheistic country in the world which is Estonia. Now living in Finland and here its also very easy because nobody really talks about religion in everyday life. So I can be in peace kind of. But oh boy, how I have no interest to debate with religious people, I find it too frustrating and pointless. Every religion is preacheng their own, thats it. My last attempt was in instagram where suddenly one woman I follow (not anymore :D) started to preach Jesus and I just posted one simple question, why Jesus? Why not all the other thousends of gods in the world, why not Allah, why not Buddha? Why not Vishnu? And I try to explain that that it is all because you have born here where the Christianity is major religion, when she would of born in Middle-East she would of been muslim. Simple as that. Nothing mind blowing right?? And all I got from other Jesus believer fellows in the comment section was PREACHING, PREACHING AND ONE MORE TIME PREACHING. Jesus is the saver, go and find him, you will find. He loves us, and how I dont know shit about these people and why I care as being atheist when somebody believes Jesus. And oh, I have read the wrong bible or not at all, cus I told that bible is supporting slavery and is full of evilness and killing. So-it was all pointless as F. These people dont have any understanding of logic. Yeah, I save my nerves.
And I really appriciate Seth and people who have nerves to stand up for atheist and debate these crazy brainwashed people. Like really, you are pros!!
If someone blesses me, I don’t go into a monologue about why their beliefs are wrong; I just say “Hail Satan!”
I like this response...
The problem with atheism is that it is not a thing, which means that atheists will take opposite sides to many things, and many of them are not expecting this to happen.
My recommendation is to emphasize the importance of being fact based, evidence based, science based in all things - no exceptions,
Wow!!! Madam who’s song “just saying” was badass as fuck!!!! Great song!! Personally I like harder rock music but that song was jammin! 👍👍👍🤘🤘
Lyrics, please. ;)
Love the song! 🤣🤣🤣😎👍🎸