It must and to know your fighting nexts who's weapons are bigger, got more punch to them and they have a shield no wonder most just stood there firing all they could.
Yes there is. How cruel would that be? Well you get the mts that might be able to run away from these new armored cores, but you rookie you get the tank. Have fun.
Piledriver Bunker Buster, I imagine. I've seen other Japanese mech media refer to spike-type weapons as "pile driver" as well. And the Japanese have a convention when making contractions / abbreviations, wherein they take the first half of each component term, and squish them together. The devs applied this to English and got "PileBunker."
Ah, you actuallly did it! Finding info about these little popcorn suits must have been nearly impossible. But it’s always important to remember however destructible they are, real love still goes into even the smallest design. Great video as always!
Ahhh I'm glad you covered this topic, good to see the grunts get some love, that being said, it would of been nices to see some ACs from the Gen 3 universe be fielded in Gen 4 as the normals as more standardise models, like in the original trailer/op for AC4 shows nobless oige devastate the beginner AC from the Gen 3 universe (more specifically from Nexus)
I think the reason why they omitted gen 3 ACs in AC4/ACFA is the huge variety of parts will take much longer to program than using a uniform model that we see in Normals.
Reminds me of a Mission in Mechwarrior 2 Mercenaries, where you hijack a bottom-tier Harasser hovercraft, after breaking out of a prison camp. Two light mechs and a few guys in power armor become a major threat.
Hey there, back here after 2 years and still enjoying your content. I have a little suggestion... could you make a video akin to this one but with the MTs of Nexus and Last Raven? I really love those design and I would like to see a video explaining them. As a personal digression, since Bandai Is now making 30 minute missions ACs kits It would be awesome of they would make also Muscle Tracers and Normals, but unfortunately It Is very unlikely. Still, best wishes follow Raven!
I hope when the new Armored Core comes out there will be a resurgence of the older games and bring in people to this channel. You're videos are fun to listen to.
Normals are just regular ACs, albeit lacking and possibly not capable of customization. Since lore has established that companies dont use Kojima particles anymore due to environmental damage (with the exception of the next J piloted at the end of Verdict Day), having "Normals" be a regular enemy against ACs would probably end up being an overwhelming force. The only difference between a Normal and a Next are utilization of Kojima particles for Primal Armor and most importantly the AMS system that makes them so fast and reactive. Thats why theyre called normals, because theyre "normal" ACs compared to "next" gen ACs.
Honestly? Id love to see a game where you start with an MT as your "tutorial" missions, doing a handfull of jobs in them before passing your examination and getting your AC proper
Now that is the dream there, earning you way up to becoming an ac pilot. Maybe having to living through a battle against one as well as I'm sure the relationship between MT pilots and AC ravens/lynx could be explored as well.
@@armoredcorelore Theres alot of cool shit you can do with such a concept. Itd be like all of Act 1 youre an MT pilot, and your repair bills/ammo costs are low, taking on other MT's and infantry/jumptroopers, building up to a company reaching out and offering you an AC license if you do a job for them, acting as the final challenge of act 1, moving into act 2 with your AC Proper, like how you dont have the Elden Ring fragments untill "act 1" where you finally fell one of the three lords. A fun idea, but one likely to never happen
Japanese war fiction seems to have little of this climb-up concept. There's usually an ocean of fodder stuck beneath a class of unreachable heroes. Part of it is indulgent power fantasy of course, but I bet it also draws from the cultural memory of the separation between Samurai and peasant levy Ashigaru.
This is an amazing video, the only thing I could possibly nitpick is the origin of MTs. We don’t know when MTs we’re created in the universe of Armored Core 1-2 Another Age and Armored Core 4-VD, and yes they ARE separate timelines. We do know that in 3-LR they were made by Crest and Mirage. That said you covered the timeline separation, which I love. Best video yet, take my like.
Thank you and feel free to nitpick, i admit i was struggling to get a real grip on origins as they is speculation that MTS where already a thing before the great destruction in the original universe. But there is no evidence of this in game so that theory is on the back burner. The idea of an MT in v and Verdict day seem to have shifted to drones and more normal style machines of war bringing up more questions. Also the first mt in ac3 XMT-01, i need to look into that more. Still I'm going off on one, thanks again for the feedback.
@@armoredcorelore I'd venture a guess that the drones and standard warmachines being called MT's is a case of linguistic drift. As MT's became nothing but cannon fodder (even more than Normals) during the 4-4FA period and after, including the leadup to 5, the term's original meaning 'Muscle Tracer' was forgotten and only the 'cannon fodder military unit' meaning remained relevant and stuck around.
MT = pilots, Normals (AC1-3) = Ravens, Nexts (AC4) = Lynx I wish they will release a tiered progression where your pilot starts off as an actual MT pilot then into a Normal Raven into a Next Lynk.
Great vid and commentary. Always wondered if the "Scimitar/Super Scimitar" helped push the parts that we now called the Vixen set. These series of MTs were in the Master of Arena era. A rather elusive and fully capable unit.
Thank you and well if we take what the wiki reads and some quick translations, they can tell us the vixen idea itself came from chrome AC Venom design. But we're talking about a corporation who did not really like ravens so there is nothing to say either Venom happened first then the Scitmitar or the other way around.
Team blood bringer believes in ACv and verdict day the reason you can’t free fly was not just a meta game decision but after technology was reset all the normals were actually new more powerful MTs, and the last boss is an AC from 4 or 4 answers, explaining the back weapons and exploding core
I always assumed the point of the "Armored Core" designation as distinct from just a heavy MT, is that it referred to an armored *Fusion Core* which is why the player's machine can fly around and recharge so freely.
Wow this is really cool channel! I'm curious how you record your footage, and it seems like when you were showing off the various normals they were WAY bigger then they normally are, so I'm curious what's going on there XD I really appreciate actually showing gameplay footage as well as concept art for them, so much care and attention given to even the lowliest of grunt type mecha in this series.
Well I will try to answer the best I can. For older ac games I use the 'pc version' which may account for why some older mts are larger, while for the newer generations I just use an elgato capture card and got as close as I could to normals. I mean to the point where I was bouncing off them and even trying different nexts to see if their height would give me a better view. Hope this answers your question and thank you again for your kind words.
@@armoredcorelore I think it is a horrible thing that so few games let you see their models up close without them moving everywhere. The Metroid Prime series' Logbook is not perfect, but it's the best that I know of. Warframe has a codex, but it is lacking the ability to control your camera in it. It's on a set track, the models go through a selection of animations and can't be frozen. Worse though is that they seem to use the same camera settings for each model, so all of the bigger ones only have part of them visible. I know they eventually added in a special camera booth mode or something, which you can move around in and freeze time, but Idk how complete their roster of spawn-able things is. Maybe they've improved the codex since I quit in 2018 or 2019. Modelers and artists put hard work into making these models (even if AC4's non-ACs or Arms Forts are all barely textured). Developers, PLEASE let us see the models, by themselves, with a free moving camera (including not being orbit locked, especially to the "center").
Can’t wait for the eventual 1-2 3 and 5 vids on mts (and maybe vids on special enemies encountered like pulverizers or disorder units?) enemies in ac are so detailed and mostly believable that it almost feels bad to just go through a mission hacking and blasting up everything(maybe even ac6 once it comes out but that’s almost a gimmie since lts almost garunteed we will have a lot of content for ac6
Oh so much to cover ha ha. You'll have to give me a chance to look over the guide books and such to gather small bits of data and note them down but I'll cover them.
They are seen as the first generation of ac in this universe however there is some debate as they are more like general armored cores then the armored cores we pilot in ac1. As normals are built one way, they don't swap parts like older acs. They swap weapons, but not parts like we never see a solarwind with Dulake arms. There not as customisable so they fall more into being more general purpose armored cores rather then the more advanced ac's we the player pilot even back in ac1.
Good seeing our predecessor mechs getting some attention. They were the basis for creation of my beloved AC/NEXT. Without them I wouldn't have the beautiful machine I pilot today.
Is the GOPPERT-G3 (and even other Normals) supposed to be taller than a 10-meter NEXT, or were the developers not concerned with properly scaling enemies and player models?
No i am afraid it comes does come down to scaling issue. Its the same with the armsfort to be honest as these behemoths of the battlefield are meant to be even larger. Taking a look at the book a new order for nexts gives us some measurements to go off. armoredcore.fandom.com/wiki/NEXT?file=A_New_Order_of_NEXT_Page_91_Size_comparison.png
I mean i can see why. Inside a mts is a person sometimes so it would follow the idea that it is a manned target as some missions do request the destruction of mts.
Good question, i will be honest i think they might do better then they did when fighting Nexts. Like the PCA cavalry Normals equipment would be effective against ac6 AC's as we're not dealing with primal armour anymore so there is not this extra layer of protection that made normal weapon useless. They also offer more then the MTS can in ac6 so they would be a much better fighting force. Really i would say there are between Subject guard mt and cavalry. But that said its always open for debate and people will have different ideas to myself. But overall i would say normal would do a lot better in this world then thier own.
@@armoredcorelore I just think that his fight was the only time in the game that MTs were a threat in any way, because of how well G1 positions them and pressures you
The other day I was playing AC4 and in one mission, there was a group of small enemies as a security detail armed with rocket launchers, and I mean really small do you know if these infantry/power suits/really small MTs? Couldnt find anything about them on the wiki and i didnt get a good look at them in game
There are enemies like this in AC2 and AC3, as well. In those games, they were referred to as "Special Forces Teams." In AC2 & AC3 they hover indefinitely and wield light weaponry on tier with yours. So, I'd guess they're powered armor like a Clan Elemental or Inner Sphere Battlesuit, from Battletech.
I wonder what are the controls of a NORMAL? Since a lot of speculations theorizes that MT are operated through following body movements or 'tracing muscles/body movement'. It can explain why we see their 'cores' much bigger than an AC for more movement in the cockpit A NEXT is operated by AMS, a direct nerve connection to the AC with psychic powers. Would normals be operated using buttons, switches, joysticks seen in gundam since they are mass produced? Cheaper to produce than a discount non psychic AMS or direct nerve connection systems
Well you ask an interesting question as we know what the inside of fifth gen ac looks like and i would like to think normals would be close too it. The use of control joystick, buttons anything that you could just load a person into and go use this without the training needed for nexts.
@@armoredcorelore Yeah, I thought of it. In several Gundam discussions, majority agrees that there was learning computer for executing REALLY complex movements if done in a simple sequence of buttons, switches, and sticks. Just like how Modern Jet Planes have a computer that auto corrects any deviations in controls or dangerous movements by either lessening to outright cutting the control of the pilot. I think, this was being applied here for NORMALS.
Good question. You are not piloting a normal in the first ac game as your ac is able to swap parts a feature normals can not do as they are mass produced. In fact a closer comparison to a normal from the first games would be the general purpose cores like the one sumika uses in project phantasma. However do remember the games happen in different time lines so the armored cores we piloted in the first game actually never existed in the 4 and for answer universe. Basically in the ac4 universe the technology went from general purpose cores to NEXTS thanks to kojima particles and skipped the armored cores we play as in the first games. Hope this helps.
If memory serves me right, Normals are actually supposed to be standard Armored Cores that aren't NEXTs, not MTs. This is reinforced by the fact that they're mostly all biped (with a couple of exceptions), they're capable of boosting, they have interchangeable weapons and they all share the same form factor of a Core with a head, arms and legs attached to it. Since the Gen 4 and Gen 5 games take place in the same timeline (N-WGIX/V being huge proof of this, since it's a NEXT), it's safe to assume that the ACs we pilot in Gen 5, despite basically being retrofit from scraps, are essentially Normals.
Right and since they are not MTS nor NEXTS they have to be AC's however we know these units are mass produced during this timeline due to the sheer number of them and the factories. This would make them more like general purpose cores like the one seen being used by sumika since these were cheaper to make then armored cores. And sure i have nothing to prove otherwise that the ac's of five are not dug up normals which crudely have been modified with was laying about and adding function like all the boost types and scan mode. I'm still making my way through some ac V books so i can come up with an answer i am happy to back up.
@@armoredcorelore Aye, that is a safe reasoning. That said, standard ACs and Normals are generally much cheaper to produce than NEXTs anyway due to them not using Kojima energy, and due to their parts just overall being inferior to those of a NEXT. It's like comparing an Audi to a Lamborghini. While I know that the 4th and 5th gen games are in a different timeline to the 1st and 2nd gens, there is still a parallel between them with 4/5's Normals and 1/2's ACs. Look at the AC2 intro, for example, we see three standard issue Zio Matrix ACs facing off against three Emeraude ones, which makes it safe to assume that said ACs are also mass produced like the Normals in AC4 and ACFA. Normals, like the aforementioned ACs, are also specifically made by the many corporations, as you mentioned in the video, such as GA's GA03-Solarwind, or Rosenthal's TYPE-DULAKE. Granted, I'm trying as hard as possible not to fall into the "it's an AC since it's not an MT nor an AC NEXT" fallacy, but one cannot deny the very visually clear parallels that reinforce Normals actually being ACs.
Hello there! I kind of get the feeling you find a lot of the weapons in AC very.....uncivilised. Except the Lazer blade, of course. Very handy when you have the high ground, no?
It won't be for a while as i would like to finish off the stories of acv and Verdict day, cover some of thier well known characters and then go back and cover all the subject i missed.
So, ACs are just better, cooler MT's? After playing AC 6 (my first AC game) i assumed that MT's principal difference from AC are control method: MT's trace muscles, and AC's plugged directly in to the pilots nervous system.
Ah well see the nerve control system (the ams) is only for nexts in ac4 and for answer. The armored cores of other games are more like fighter jet controls. Mts we still have not idea how they work. But what really make armored cores and mt different is the core theory (Basically able to change parts and add more armour) However nexts like we see in ac4 and for answer basically skipped this thanks to kojima tech. Instead in those games normals are more like general purpose armored cores seen in ac1. Not very customable with other parts from other general purpose acs. The best they can do is swap weapons so you won't see a solarwind ga normal with the hover body of the interior union normal. But it can be given a range of weapons. Sorry nerded out there. Happy to answer any questions you may have and let me say welcome fellow raven.
@@armoredcorelore it feels like the normals are still worse than the ac's from the previous games. maybe its because all the qualified pilots are using the NEXT's so only grunts use the normals.
@@OgBadlaws Normals in the AC4 universe are mass produced like MTs, unlike 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gen. where the mercenary Ravens who used ACs individually customized them.
@@OgBadlaws They do because really Normals are more like general purpose cores like sumika uses rather then the armroed core we pilot as players. As Nate has pointed out Normals are mass project and are not able to be customized like ac.
Pretty sure Normals are just the ACs from AC1-3. With the disparity between Normals and NEXTs, however, customization of Normals was deemed to be significantly less important, especially because the return on investment would be significantly lesser than a similar focus on NEXTs.
I would say they are more like the general purpose cores then the customizable armored cores we the players get. But i understand the idea after all the very first trailer we got for AC4 was noblesse downing two armored cores that look like from the pervious games which then they scrapped. Still i agree on the investment part as why make grunt units that can be customised when a next could take down in one shot. Better to make standard models, mass produce them and be able to quickly train pilots for them with thier simple loadouts.
While they are easy cannon fodder in small numbers That doesnt mean their numbers would not damage you while fighting a tough AC like G1 Michigan at the wrong time for example. A heavily armed MT is a threat when they are on support roles for their elite comrades. But i like this. Though i would imagine how hard would it be to pilot these machines against bigger and better models in future titles if we temporarily lost our AC.
Ah yes the last boss and that is a fair opinion. I know ac fans have thier likes and dislikes over the different universe armored cores. All i hope is we can civil about the matter, listen to one another and welcome newcomers with open minds and kind words.
ye the tech bridge between normals and nexts is pretty insane, but it makes sense as a boss fight. I just Really dont like how much they slowed down AC5s combat, and grounded it.
About the two Lynx coming from the Bharat Squadron? It is mentioned in both their bios. armoredcore.fandom.com/wiki/Irbis_Ornstein?file=Collared_profile_Irbis_Ornstein.png Anil Hassan bio: An Elite Lynx selected from Eqbal's Bharat Squadron. A born soldier with considerable battlefield experience and the skill to see his mission through.
@@spacewargamer4181 It or they? Also since the squad is made up of normals then any pilot that was promoted from that squad to a lynx would have had to be a normal pilot.
Sadly no, normals in AC4 and FA where manned by a pilot as were mts. It was about controllable might and having humans in them made them this way. As a ai could be hacked.
And i can see why after all mt in our own world has a variety of things. However in ac lore mt has always been referred to muscle tracers while all other vehicles kept thier full names.
Honestly i have little knowledge on Mechwarriors, but after a quick google search pretty much. But this is on limited knowledge and if they can change arms and legs that would make them more like a normal then an mt.
Nope the MT/Normal varieties is very wide from transformable flighter jet/ mech, Pacific Rim (Jaeger size) mobile fortress that can rain down 5 city worth of ammunition ( from AC gen 1, 2and 3), some are assassins type that can cloak and Stan you(AC6), some MT are just tank but bigger and faster as you see in the AC6 cataphract boss, some MT is just straight up exo suit/ power armor (like in AC4 missions). Because MT ( Muscle tracer= similar to Jaeger control system) started as a Construction machine like exo suit but the longer the time the tech kept evolving and they got bigger like avatar (power armor). They got bigger, faster, more advanced, some have jet boosters. Until they start repurposed/reused these machines as a weapons. Similar to how invention of the engine technology (started in 1807 I think)and they used it for farming around 1817. And this engine tech opens up a lot of doors for humanity that we never thought we needed like farming machines, airplanes, tanks, Warship, transport ship, cars, generator to generate electricity etc. They all using the advanced version of engine technology. The MT technology started as just a construction tool but it evolved over time it used to not just construction but also started using in construction in space, under water construction, creating deep underground mining cities, agriculture, Due to having MT(civil used) you don't need a road to travel from one place to another( like a car) if you see a hill you can just climb or jet boost over it, and if you see forest filled with three and uneven surfaces you can just walk through it. And last of all these Corporations started producing military MT/ reverse engineer the construction MT to see if there are any chances to fight with the government even though it will not be practical. And you can see the results in game yeah it is impractical but compare to a tank, helicopter and Fighter. It is easy to use like you can just pilot a MT in 20 minutes because they are based on muscle memories. So MT pilots will have more experience in fighting wars and less time wasting on training compare to tank, helicopter and fighter jet pilot because Due to you need a longer time to learn how to control the tank and have a great team work with your crew mates to make these machines work. MT don't need that you give an infantry soldier and three big ass guns and they can go and fight without any training. What I mean by three MT weapons is (First and secondary + AA weapons/artillery that mounted in their back since MT gun rounds are already very huge you can pretty much kill the tank with it by shooting 3 times just by the sheer weights of the rounds) The only training they need is infantry training( which these soldiers already have) and some tips and tricks like examples How to not hit by a tank or how to dodge it, keep a look out for infantry soldiers they will sneak attack you with a RPG and how to fight aerial base weapons with third options weapons(maybe machine gun or AA missiles etc that is mounted in their back) etc that the engineer and sergeants will give them these tips to not get kill. Again these are tips you don't need 1 year training to master you can master it by just paying attention. That is why MT is overly used compare to tank and other military weapons but don't get me wrong they still used these conventional military weapons like SAM or artillery tank.
When you think about it, one decent MTS can wreck havoc in Mech Warrior universe :D:D:D MW meches are just so slow and bulky. MTS can just circle around it and unleash hell at the MW mech legs and that's it. MW mech could not hit one straight bullet as they have inferior maneuverability and lame ass aiming assist.
Must be very demoralising when you work your ass off in a corporation only to end up in a machine called a Normal
It must and to know your fighting nexts who's weapons are bigger, got more punch to them and they have a shield no wonder most just stood there firing all they could.
Not gonna lie I really love the detail on all these cannon fodder units
Me too, there is a lot to know about the poor grunts we as players cut down without a second thought.
@@armoredcorelore care do a video on generic weapons? i.e. helicopters, tanks, and the like?
If you ever feel useless, just remember that there are still MBTs in the Armored Core universe
Yes there is. How cruel would that be? Well you get the mts that might be able to run away from these new armored cores, but you rookie you get the tank. Have fun.
Even worse, the helicopters.
Thanks to ACVI, I had a moment of excitement when I heard the name "Pilebunker".
Ah yes ac6 certainly has brought a lot of joy to the pilebunker.
Piledriver Bunker Buster, I imagine.
I've seen other Japanese mech media refer to spike-type weapons as "pile driver" as well. And the Japanese have a convention when making contractions / abbreviations, wherein they take the first half of each component term, and squish them together. The devs applied this to English and got "PileBunker."
Ah, you actuallly did it! Finding info about these little popcorn suits must have been nearly impossible. But it’s always important to remember however destructible they are, real love still goes into even the smallest design. Great video as always!
Thank you for your kind praise.
00:42 The test "MT" in AC1 is officially AC type in JP version and share line with AC Vixen and Venom. The NA AC1 for some reason refer it as MT.
Thank you for sharing this. It is information like this i miss not knowing the language.
Years later, their warm welcome of grenade right at my face a milliseconds after the door open still left a mark in me
What an exploding entrance!
Ahhh I'm glad you covered this topic, good to see the grunts get some love, that being said, it would of been nices to see some ACs from the Gen 3 universe be fielded in Gen 4 as the normals as more standardise models, like in the original trailer/op for AC4 shows nobless oige devastate the beginner AC from the Gen 3 universe (more specifically from Nexus)
Ah yes project force, it was a neat trailer.
I think the reason why they omitted gen 3 ACs in AC4/ACFA is the huge variety of parts will take much longer to program than using a uniform model that we see in Normals.
It would be interesting if you were able to play as an MT in missions, as a kind of challenge run.
There is a fan game out there that focus on MTs, i believe hellhound 13th has some videos of it on thier channel.
Fromsoft made Chromehounds. While not connected to AC in lore it's effectively an MT simulator.
Reminds me of a Mission in Mechwarrior 2 Mercenaries, where you hijack a bottom-tier Harasser hovercraft, after breaking out of a prison camp. Two light mechs and a few guys in power armor become a major threat.
I'm glad someone is giving some deserved love to the grunts of the Armored Core universe! Keep up the work pal, your videos are great!
Thank you for the kind words.
Hey there, back here after 2 years and still enjoying your content. I have a little suggestion... could you make a video akin to this one but with the MTs of Nexus and Last Raven? I really love those design and I would like to see a video explaining them. As a personal digression, since Bandai Is now making 30 minute missions ACs kits It would be awesome of they would make also Muscle Tracers and Normals, but unfortunately It Is very unlikely.
Still, best wishes follow Raven!
I hope when the new Armored Core comes out there will be a resurgence of the older games and bring in people to this channel. You're videos are fun to listen to.
Thank you for kind words and me too.
THE SKY IS OUR'S, RAVENS!
Yeah seems you were right friend we did see a resurge in interest
Really hope we see a bigger emphasis on Normals in AC6. I always feels like many MTs offer no real opposition in missions.
I would like to see in AC6 for the player go from a mt, to a normal than an ac.
Normals are just regular ACs, albeit lacking and possibly not capable of customization. Since lore has established that companies dont use Kojima particles anymore due to environmental damage (with the exception of the next J piloted at the end of Verdict Day), having "Normals" be a regular enemy against ACs would probably end up being an overwhelming force.
The only difference between a Normal and a Next are utilization of Kojima particles for Primal Armor and most importantly the AMS system that makes them so fast and reactive.
Thats why theyre called normals, because theyre "normal" ACs compared to "next" gen ACs.
There are some boss normals in game
@@Crotchcuzzler AC6 has some great MT representation. Even made a whole ass set of ones classifications for non AC mechs.
@@Raso719The LCs are a great addition. Feels similar to fighting an AC.
The cannon fodder brigades
The joys of not being an ac pilot.
This is a important primer guide for new fans, so they know the different types of mechs and their roles.
Honestly? Id love to see a game where you start with an MT as your "tutorial" missions, doing a handfull of jobs in them before passing your examination and getting your AC proper
There’s a fan game where you can play as MTs from the first AC game (1997).
ua-cam.com/play/PLOGpMeV2BHCUKuz2gK2wdtDJEZQ6buLws.html
Now that is the dream there, earning you way up to becoming an ac pilot. Maybe having to living through a battle against one as well as I'm sure the relationship between MT pilots and AC ravens/lynx could be explored as well.
@@armoredcorelore Theres alot of cool shit you can do with such a concept. Itd be like all of Act 1 youre an MT pilot, and your repair bills/ammo costs are low, taking on other MT's and infantry/jumptroopers, building up to a company reaching out and offering you an AC license if you do a job for them, acting as the final challenge of act 1, moving into act 2 with your AC Proper, like how you dont have the Elden Ring fragments untill "act 1" where you finally fell one of the three lords. A fun idea, but one likely to never happen
Japanese war fiction seems to have little of this climb-up concept. There's usually an ocean of fodder stuck beneath a class of unreachable heroes. Part of it is indulgent power fantasy of course, but I bet it also draws from the cultural memory of the separation between Samurai and peasant levy Ashigaru.
@@MrCantStopTheRobot yeah this, alsp the mecha genre is very differrent to Mech genre
This is an amazing video, the only thing I could possibly nitpick is the origin of MTs.
We don’t know when MTs we’re created in the universe of Armored Core 1-2 Another Age and Armored Core 4-VD, and yes they ARE separate timelines.
We do know that in 3-LR they were made by Crest and Mirage. That said you covered the timeline separation, which I love.
Best video yet, take my like.
Thank you and feel free to nitpick, i admit i was struggling to get a real grip on origins as they is speculation that MTS where already a thing before the great destruction in the original universe. But there is no evidence of this in game so that theory is on the back burner.
The idea of an MT in v and Verdict day seem to have shifted to drones and more normal style machines of war bringing up more questions. Also the first mt in ac3 XMT-01, i need to look into that more. Still I'm going off on one, thanks again for the feedback.
@@armoredcorelore That’s really your only mistake, if you can calm it that, everything else you nailed. Beautiful, beautiful work.
@@armoredcorelore I'd venture a guess that the drones and standard warmachines being called MT's is a case of linguistic drift. As MT's became nothing but cannon fodder (even more than Normals) during the 4-4FA period and after, including the leadup to 5, the term's original meaning 'Muscle Tracer' was forgotten and only the 'cannon fodder military unit' meaning remained relevant and stuck around.
ah, controller has finally decided to bring the armored core channels out of the wood work. nice. subbed
Thank you. I mean I am grateful for the controllers support in our efforts to help guide humanity in thier future.
MT = pilots, Normals (AC1-3) = Ravens, Nexts (AC4) = Lynx
I wish they will release a tiered progression where your pilot starts off as an actual MT pilot then into a Normal Raven into a Next Lynk.
Would be a neat journey.
You're definitely not the only guy to think this!
Great vid and commentary. Always wondered if the "Scimitar/Super Scimitar" helped push the parts that we now called the Vixen set. These series of MTs were in the Master of Arena era. A rather elusive and fully capable unit.
Thank you and well if we take what the wiki reads and some quick translations, they can tell us the vixen idea itself came from chrome AC Venom design. But we're talking about a corporation who did not really like ravens so there is nothing to say either Venom happened first then the Scitmitar or the other way around.
Subbed my guy! Keep it up and here’s to hoping we get a new AC soon!
I hope so too!
@@armoredcorelore went back to this vid and forgot I commented haha, so glad at where we are now!
Thank you so much for another great video!
Team blood bringer believes in ACv and verdict day the reason you can’t free fly was not just a meta game decision but after technology was reset all the normals were actually new more powerful MTs, and the last boss is an AC from 4 or 4 answers, explaining the back weapons and exploding core
Wait, hol up! MT units were made in the CHROME millennium? Bruh, it just hit me those things are friggin Chromehounds!
Another classic game that is still inside my xbox 360.
I always assumed the point of the "Armored Core" designation as distinct from just a heavy MT, is that it referred to an armored *Fusion Core* which is why the player's machine can fly around and recharge so freely.
The amount of digging this had to take is insane! Thank you for sharing this wealth of information. You saved many, much head scratching
It was all fun to dig around and see what could be found. Thank you for the kind words.
@@armoredcorelore I offer you a new challenge then. Construct the first ever complete timeline of Armored core.
Wow this is really cool channel! I'm curious how you record your footage, and it seems like when you were showing off the various normals they were WAY bigger then they normally are, so I'm curious what's going on there XD
I really appreciate actually showing gameplay footage as well as concept art for them, so much care and attention given to even the lowliest of grunt type mecha in this series.
Well I will try to answer the best I can. For older ac games I use the 'pc version' which may account for why some older mts are larger, while for the newer generations I just use an elgato capture card and got as close as I could to normals.
I mean to the point where I was bouncing off them and even trying different nexts to see if their height would give me a better view. Hope this answers your question and thank you again for your kind words.
@@armoredcorelore I think it is a horrible thing that so few games let you see their models up close without them moving everywhere.
The Metroid Prime series' Logbook is not perfect, but it's the best that I know of.
Warframe has a codex, but it is lacking the ability to control your camera in it. It's on a set track, the models go through a selection of animations and can't be frozen. Worse though is that they seem to use the same camera settings for each model, so all of the bigger ones only have part of them visible.
I know they eventually added in a special camera booth mode or something, which you can move around in and freeze time, but Idk how complete their roster of spawn-able things is. Maybe they've improved the codex since I quit in 2018 or 2019.
Modelers and artists put hard work into making these models (even if AC4's non-ACs or Arms Forts are all barely textured). Developers, PLEASE let us see the models, by themselves, with a free moving camera (including not being orbit locked, especially to the "center").
Can’t wait for the eventual 1-2 3 and 5 vids on mts (and maybe vids on special enemies encountered like pulverizers or disorder units?) enemies in ac are so detailed and mostly believable that it almost feels bad to just go through a mission hacking and blasting up everything(maybe even ac6 once it comes out but that’s almost a gimmie since lts almost garunteed we will have a lot of content for ac6
Oh so much to cover ha ha. You'll have to give me a chance to look over the guide books and such to gather small bits of data and note them down but I'll cover them.
@@armoredcorelore yeah lol had a feeling it would take a hot minute
I mean I can’t wait but I actually can
Take as long as ya need to 👍
I fear no man, but those SELJQ Normals with pile bunkers , they terrify me
They do pack a punch and with them always in packs too its always one jumps and then one attacks.
Aren't Normals explicitly just ACs, they're just not NEXTs because they don't use the NEXT generation of kojima reactors and the ACS control system.
They are seen as the first generation of ac in this universe however there is some debate as they are more like general armored cores then the armored cores we pilot in ac1. As normals are built one way, they don't swap parts like older acs. They swap weapons, but not parts like we never see a solarwind with Dulake arms. There not as customisable so they fall more into being more general purpose armored cores rather then the more advanced ac's we the player pilot even back in ac1.
04:36 The I-C003-IC is officially AC type called "Special AC".
Thank you for sharing this.
Thanks dude.
Thank you.
Good seeing our predecessor mechs getting some attention. They were the basis for creation of my beloved AC/NEXT. Without them I wouldn't have the beautiful machine I pilot today.
Is the GOPPERT-G3 (and even other Normals) supposed to be taller than a 10-meter NEXT, or were the developers not concerned with properly scaling enemies and player models?
No i am afraid it comes does come down to scaling issue. Its the same with the armsfort to be honest as these behemoths of the battlefield are meant to be even larger. Taking a look at the book a new order for nexts gives us some measurements to go off.
armoredcore.fandom.com/wiki/NEXT?file=A_New_Order_of_NEXT_Page_91_Size_comparison.png
For decades I always thought that MT stood for Manned Target. I have thought that since AC on the PS1.
I mean i can see why. Inside a mts is a person sometimes so it would follow the idea that it is a manned target as some missions do request the destruction of mts.
How would these normals fare aginst the ACs from AC 6?
Good question, i will be honest i think they might do better then they did when fighting Nexts. Like the PCA cavalry Normals equipment would be effective against ac6 AC's as we're not dealing with primal armour anymore so there is not this extra layer of protection that made normal weapon useless. They also offer more then the MTS can in ac6 so they would be a much better fighting force. Really i would say there are between Subject guard mt and cavalry. But that said its always open for debate and people will have different ideas to myself. But overall i would say normal would do a lot better in this world then thier own.
I feel like if the animations of this guys are better in AC4 than in FA
I need more vehicles on enemies from the games, from the weird walkers to the giant massive MT’s
I hope he dose a video on the Torus Armored Core.
The ARGYROS, it is already on the list after a few more items.
Best fight in AC 6 is G1 Michigan, and it’s all because of his LADS!
He is quite the character and yes you gotta love the men and women he fights with doing the maths while they battle.
@@armoredcorelore I just think that his fight was the only time in the game that MTs were a threat in any way, because of how well G1 positions them and pressures you
I love that fight, the chatter between them bring a lot of life into those Little cannon fodder.
The other day I was playing AC4 and in one mission, there was a group of small enemies as a security detail armed with rocket launchers, and I mean really small
do you know if these infantry/power suits/really small MTs? Couldnt find anything about them on the wiki and i didnt get a good look at them in game
Not off the top of my head. However what was the mission? I'll drag out the old ac4 book and take a look myself.
There are enemies like this in AC2 and AC3, as well. In those games, they were referred to as "Special Forces Teams." In AC2 & AC3 they hover indefinitely and wield light weaponry on tier with yours. So, I'd guess they're powered armor like a Clan Elemental or Inner Sphere Battlesuit, from Battletech.
I wonder what are the controls of a NORMAL?
Since a lot of speculations theorizes that MT are operated through following body movements or 'tracing muscles/body movement'. It can explain why we see their 'cores' much bigger than an AC for more movement in the cockpit
A NEXT is operated by AMS, a direct nerve connection to the AC with psychic powers.
Would normals be operated using buttons, switches, joysticks seen in gundam since they are mass produced? Cheaper to produce than a discount non psychic AMS or direct nerve connection systems
Well you ask an interesting question as we know what the inside of fifth gen ac looks like and i would like to think normals would be close too it.
The use of control joystick, buttons anything that you could just load a person into and go use this without the training needed for nexts.
@@armoredcorelore Yeah, I thought of it.
In several Gundam discussions, majority agrees that there was learning computer for executing REALLY complex movements if done in a simple sequence of buttons, switches, and sticks.
Just like how Modern Jet Planes have a computer that auto corrects any deviations in controls or dangerous movements by either lessening to outright cutting the control of the pilot.
I think, this was being applied here for NORMALS.
So, is a normal what I'm piloting in the first games? Then later a NEXT? or is it a separate item from a Ac?
Good question. You are not piloting a normal in the first ac game as your ac is able to swap parts a feature normals can not do as they are mass produced. In fact a closer comparison to a normal from the first games would be the general purpose cores like the one sumika uses in project phantasma. However do remember the games happen in different time lines so the armored cores we piloted in the first game actually never existed in the 4 and for answer universe.
Basically in the ac4 universe the technology went from general purpose cores to NEXTS thanks to kojima particles and skipped the armored cores we play as in the first games. Hope this helps.
Wow, how the heck did you find all of this. I've always wanted to know more about MTs in AC4, or any AC really.
Some information comes from the games and from the artbooks. The armored core wiki is also a treasure trove of information.
@@armoredcorelore there are art books?!
@@adamofblastworks1517 Yes there is. A google search will bring them up if your interested.
@@adamofblastworks1517 they are published by enterbrain interactive a sub of kadokawa, you can still probably import them from japan I think
Buen video
Thank you or Gracias as the one of the few Spanish words i can remember from my education.
If memory serves me right, Normals are actually supposed to be standard Armored Cores that aren't NEXTs, not MTs.
This is reinforced by the fact that they're mostly all biped (with a couple of exceptions), they're capable of boosting, they have interchangeable weapons and they all share the same form factor of a Core with a head, arms and legs attached to it.
Since the Gen 4 and Gen 5 games take place in the same timeline (N-WGIX/V being huge proof of this, since it's a NEXT), it's safe to assume that the ACs we pilot in Gen 5, despite basically being retrofit from scraps, are essentially Normals.
Right and since they are not MTS nor NEXTS they have to be AC's however we know these units are mass produced during this timeline due to the sheer number of them and the factories.
This would make them more like general purpose cores like the one seen being used by sumika since these were cheaper to make then armored cores.
And sure i have nothing to prove otherwise that the ac's of five are not dug up normals which crudely have been modified with was laying about and adding function like all the boost types and scan mode. I'm still making my way through some ac V books so i can come up with an answer i am happy to back up.
@@armoredcorelore Aye, that is a safe reasoning. That said, standard ACs and Normals are generally much cheaper to produce than NEXTs anyway due to them not using Kojima energy, and due to their parts just overall being inferior to those of a NEXT. It's like comparing an Audi to a Lamborghini.
While I know that the 4th and 5th gen games are in a different timeline to the 1st and 2nd gens, there is still a parallel between them with 4/5's Normals and 1/2's ACs.
Look at the AC2 intro, for example, we see three standard issue Zio Matrix ACs facing off against three Emeraude ones, which makes it safe to assume that said ACs are also mass produced like the Normals in AC4 and ACFA.
Normals, like the aforementioned ACs, are also specifically made by the many corporations, as you mentioned in the video, such as GA's GA03-Solarwind, or Rosenthal's TYPE-DULAKE.
Granted, I'm trying as hard as possible not to fall into the "it's an AC since it's not an MT nor an AC NEXT" fallacy, but one cannot deny the very visually clear parallels that reinforce Normals actually being ACs.
Hello there!
I kind of get the feeling you find a lot of the weapons in AC very.....uncivilised. Except the Lazer blade, of course. Very handy when you have the high ground, no?
Back in your box obi one kenobi.
@@armoredcorelore 😆
I can't be the first person to compare your voice to Ewan McGregor, am I?
I mean it as a compliment!
@@greyswandir2807 Ha ha funny enough you are =) I promise my comment was all in fun as I grew up on these movies so it makes me smile.
The normals in For Answer are a lot better than the MTs in AC6. Better variety here.
Fair enough.
when will you do a video about General Purpose Armored Core?
It won't be for a while as i would like to finish off the stories of acv and Verdict day, cover some of thier well known characters and then go back and cover all the subject i missed.
So, ACs are just better, cooler MT's? After playing AC 6 (my first AC game) i assumed that MT's principal difference from AC are control method: MT's trace muscles, and AC's plugged directly in to the pilots nervous system.
Ah well see the nerve control system (the ams) is only for nexts in ac4 and for answer. The armored cores of other games are more like fighter jet controls. Mts we still have not idea how they work.
But what really make armored cores and mt different is the core theory (Basically able to change parts and add more armour) However nexts like we see in ac4 and for answer basically skipped this thanks to kojima tech.
Instead in those games normals are more like general purpose armored cores seen in ac1. Not very customable with other parts from other general purpose acs.
The best they can do is swap weapons so you won't see a solarwind ga normal with the hover body of the interior union normal. But it can be given a range of weapons.
Sorry nerded out there. Happy to answer any questions you may have and let me say welcome fellow raven.
Gotta say the GA-01 Solarwind and Sunshine look exactly like what an american built mecha would look like. 😂
I would have to agree with a lot of GA builds being seen as American by fans.
How can I make a zaku build AC 🥵
I mean i have some free time now.
I'm not super deep in ac4 lore, are the 'normals' equal to AC's in ac1 for example?
That is correct. Simple mechs which anyone can pilot unlike the next which require a level of AMS capability to move.
@@armoredcorelore it feels like the normals are still worse than the ac's from the previous games. maybe its because all the qualified pilots are using the NEXT's so only grunts use the normals.
@@OgBadlaws
Normals in the AC4 universe are mass produced like MTs, unlike 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gen. where the mercenary Ravens who used ACs individually customized them.
@@OgBadlaws They do because really Normals are more like general purpose cores like sumika uses rather then the armroed core we pilot as players. As Nate has pointed out Normals are mass project and are not able to be customized like ac.
Pretty sure Normals are just the ACs from AC1-3. With the disparity between Normals and NEXTs, however, customization of Normals was deemed to be significantly less important, especially because the return on investment would be significantly lesser than a similar focus on NEXTs.
I would say they are more like the general purpose cores then the customizable armored cores we the players get. But i understand the idea after all the very first trailer we got for AC4 was noblesse downing two armored cores that look like from the pervious games which then they scrapped.
Still i agree on the investment part as why make grunt units that can be customised when a next could take down in one shot. Better to make standard models, mass produce them and be able to quickly train pilots for them with thier simple loadouts.
I'm hope that AC6 will be playable as MT first then you will facing an AC with Human+ ability as tutorial boss just like elden ring did
I mean it be would a cool intro.
While they are easy cannon fodder in small numbers
That doesnt mean their numbers would not damage you while fighting a tough AC like G1 Michigan at the wrong time for example.
A heavily armed MT is a threat when they are on support roles for their elite comrades.
But i like this. Though i would imagine how hard would it be to pilot these machines against bigger and better models in future titles if we temporarily lost our AC.
I thought normals were just regular ACs that we see in every other version of the series besides AC4 and 4A. Only nexts are so powerful.
That’s pretty much what @Armoredcorelore said.
I hate that AC5 mechs were basically just normals, and the final boss was an AC4 Next
Ah yes the last boss and that is a fair opinion. I know ac fans have thier likes and dislikes over the different universe armored cores. All i hope is we can civil about the matter, listen to one another and welcome newcomers with open minds and kind words.
ironic that the "normal" smashed a next, aye? overconfidence much
ye the tech bridge between normals and nexts is pretty insane, but it makes sense as a boss fight. I just Really dont like how much they slowed down AC5s combat, and grounded it.
Hm, I think Eqbals SELJQ means 'Seljuk', which is, just like 'Mamluk', something from the medieval middle-east
Interesting, i never did look further into the name after the video.
Darling i got a job piloting an mt. Now we can finally fund that childrens hospital. 😂
Should have been a pilot in formula front.
7:06 Where they say that? I don't remember it
About the two Lynx coming from the Bharat Squadron? It is mentioned in both their bios.
armoredcore.fandom.com/wiki/Irbis_Ornstein?file=Collared_profile_Irbis_Ornstein.png
Anil Hassan bio: An Elite Lynx selected from Eqbal's Bharat Squadron. A born soldier with considerable battlefield experience and the skill to see his mission through.
@@armoredcorelore It doesn't say that it was a normal pilot
@@spacewargamer4181 It or they? Also since the squad is made up of normals then any pilot that was promoted from that squad to a lynx would have had to be a normal pilot.
@@armoredcorelore Is he, my bad.
And that just an assumption, there is no need for him to have been a normal pilot.
@@armoredcorelore The bio says that he is the commander, not that he promoted *from* that squad.
I’m sad there is a mission in AC6 that would have been perfect to put us into a MT as it’s point is not to fight and evade.
Spoiler warning from me. Just in case anyone is reading and not got that far.
You mean the prisoner break. Yeah that would have been neat.
ARMORED *LORE*
Might have been my channel name if it wasn't ACL.
yeah maybe@@armoredcorelore
I'm excited to see what you do.
So normals don't carry individual pilots? Just AI?
Sadly no, normals in AC4 and FA where manned by a pilot as were mts. It was about controllable might and having humans in them made them this way. As a ai could be hacked.
I always thought that MTs stood for Mobile Tanks or Mobile Troops
And i can see why after all mt in our own world has a variety of things. However in ac lore mt has always been referred to muscle tracers while all other vehicles kept thier full names.
@@armoredcorelore I am unsure if it is mentioned in AC4, 5, or 6. I my have missed it if they did
海外だと「シュトルヒ」のことを「ストーチ」って言うんだ。初めて知った。
i thought MT stands for mobile turret
It does and others like Mechanical Transport, but in AC lore these crafts are called muscle tracers so they get shorted to MTS.
4:30 "spinny" is so cute if youre german
You got me curious.
I love normals than MTs lolz
Well the normals are very cool in design. I admit thought i do like the bishop series of mts with thier chicken legs.
I want an Armored Core game where you pilot anything but an Armored Core but the opposition has them.
Ah see there is a fan game where you pilot mts, oh the name escapes me. But its very cool, i think its called muscle tracer.
Yeah, after fifteen or so games playing as Boss tier, it'd be nice to switch things up.
Bro. Listen to your own videos. The opening audio is waaaaaaay louder than your own voice over.
So theyre pretty much mechwarriors
Honestly i have little knowledge on Mechwarriors, but after a quick google search pretty much. But this is on limited knowledge and if they can change arms and legs that would make them more like a normal then an mt.
Nope the MT/Normal varieties is very wide from transformable flighter jet/ mech, Pacific Rim (Jaeger size) mobile fortress that can rain down 5 city worth of ammunition ( from AC gen 1, 2and 3), some are assassins type that can cloak and Stan you(AC6), some MT are just tank but bigger and faster as you see in the AC6 cataphract boss, some MT is just straight up exo suit/ power armor (like in AC4 missions).
Because MT ( Muscle tracer= similar to Jaeger control system) started as a Construction machine like exo suit but the longer the time the tech kept evolving and they got bigger like avatar (power armor).
They got bigger, faster, more advanced, some have jet boosters. Until they start repurposed/reused these machines as a weapons.
Similar to how invention of the engine technology (started in 1807 I think)and they used it for farming around 1817.
And this engine tech opens up a lot of doors for humanity that we never thought we needed like farming machines, airplanes, tanks, Warship, transport ship, cars, generator to generate electricity etc. They all using the advanced version of engine technology.
The MT technology started as just a construction tool but it evolved over time it used to not just construction but also started using in construction in space, under water construction, creating deep underground mining cities, agriculture,
Due to having MT(civil used) you don't need a road to travel from one place to another( like a car)
if you see a hill you can just climb or jet boost over it, and if you see forest filled with three and uneven surfaces you can just walk through it.
And last of all these Corporations started producing military MT/ reverse engineer the construction MT to see if there are any chances to fight with the government even though it will not be practical.
And you can see the results in game yeah it is impractical but compare to a tank, helicopter and Fighter. It is easy to use like you can just pilot a MT in 20 minutes because they are based on muscle memories.
So MT pilots will have more experience in fighting wars and less time wasting on training compare to tank, helicopter and fighter jet pilot because
Due to you need a longer time to learn how to control the tank and have a great team work with your crew mates to make these machines work.
MT don't need that you give an infantry soldier and three big ass guns and they can go and fight without any training.
What I mean by three MT weapons is (First and secondary + AA weapons/artillery that mounted in their back since MT gun rounds are already very huge you can pretty much kill the tank with it by shooting 3 times just by the sheer weights of the rounds)
The only training they need is infantry training( which these soldiers already have) and some tips and tricks like examples
How to not hit by a tank or how to dodge it, keep a look out for infantry soldiers they will sneak attack you with a RPG and how to fight aerial base weapons with third options weapons(maybe machine gun or AA missiles etc that is mounted in their back) etc that the engineer and sergeants will give them these tips to not get kill.
Again these are tips you don't need 1 year training to master you can master it by just paying attention.
That is why MT is overly used compare to tank and other military weapons but don't get me wrong they still used these conventional military weapons like SAM or artillery tank.
When you think about it, one decent MTS can wreck havoc in Mech Warrior universe :D:D:D
MW meches are just so slow and bulky. MTS can just circle around it and unleash hell at the MW mech legs and that's it. MW mech could not hit one straight bullet as they have inferior maneuverability and lame ass aiming assist.