Molasses 2 part Recipe 1 Parts Black Molasses (Not de-sulfured) 9 Parts Water 3 to 4 weeks. Check periodically. Scrub parts and leave if needed. Get at feed store. $8 bucks per gal. as Deer bait Food grade workes fine too ($8 per 8oz.) I've used a (much) weaker solution with great results. Once ready: Rust/silt, is easily wiped or rinsed off. Pressure washer is best applied. Scrub using steel wool, a scouring pad, or a wire brush, and dry thoroughly. Spray with breack cleaner, thinner, or primer, or use any oil. Immediately. You could use a Linseed oil wipe for permanent coating. (Oxygen exposure creats "Rust-flash" Very quick) Notes: Gloves, but not necessary. Hands may smell like iron or syrup, but otherwise Non-Toxic. Curious: When you open container, you will see a silhouette of the object lying on surface as foam. The metal alloy varietie may be effected differently, that is, after months of saturation, some may deform/desolve. Containers: Small jars, Plastic bins, kiddy pools, swimming pool~for cars, (4in. PVC) for long rods, Trailer axles, etc. ----------------------------- Chelating effects: Chelating derives from the Latin word chele, meaning claw. The pincer shaped molecules at work here are shaped somewhat like a Dungeness crab claw. The molecules can form several bonds to a single metal ion which contains cyclic hydroxamic acids, which, in turn, bind with rust, making it water-soluble. Larger amounts of these cyclic hydroxamic acids are found in molasses derived from sugar beet rather than cane. Plants and microbes appear to use the same chelation bacteria/chemicals to remove rust, robbing oxygen from the iron oxide. Medically: (Molasses itself has many uses as a medical/food supplement specifically for Iron. Black Molassis can rectify iron deficiency very quickly, too much to mention here). Agriculturally, Chelating agents bind to minerals and make them available to plants. Related chelating agents are, administered for metal poisoning for the release of lead and mercury toxins, the body is then able to excrete contaminant as it becomes soluble. 😊
@moonolyth Thank you for stating one of the medical uses of Molasses. I’m always interested in a more natural or holistic treatment. Would love to tell Big Pharma to take a long walk down a short pier.
After a good de-rusting be sure to rinse and quickly oil up the parts to prevent flash rust. WD-40 works fine unless the part is to be painted. For that just get primer on, but be aware that primers are porous and just slow oxidation until actually painted over and sealed from the atmosphere. Yes, warm/hot water and ultrasonic will speed the chelating process considerably. BTDT 10/10 on the video.
Have been using this recipe many times (found it on another channel) and it works really well and lasts much longer than Evaporust. The only thing to be aware of is that it dissolves zink. Brass, copper and aluminium seems unaffected.
I know it's dumbed down for people who couldn't care less, but does water to citric acid ratio actually matter? Does spreading the mollecules far enough apart before adding any of the sodas make a big difference in quality of solution? That is, will I get same results if I add thrice as much of citric acid and soda to 0.5l of water, or will it be worse? Likewise if I add a third of citric acid and soda to 1l of water... I know that chemistry is fickle sometimes, that's why some chemicals are very expensive and of course, sometimes outright illegal unless you're educated enough with proof to handle them. And sure, you can say I should try and see, and I am waiting for one thing to derust right now in like 800ml of water with 30g citric acid, which started as like 100ml of water turned into 30% citric acid solution with more water being added to wash out remaining citric acid (which doesn't really matter) and then I was adding water together with soda very slowly for same reason, to remove all of it from a cup. For completeness sake, I used baking soda, of which you need 63g per 100g citric acid, in other words, 18.9g in my case. And I'm asking because I know that trisodium citrate is basically worthless and what we're going for is mostly monosodium citrate, hence lower amount of soda that doesn't completely kill the acid, leading to ~4pH
Nice end results. But if you look closely, the muffler has a lot of metal gone (holes) from the rust around the treaded part. So it may not be long before it is gone... Thumbs Up!
If you watch original Beyond Ballistics video (Better than Evaporust), he gives 3 recipes, you don't need sodium carbonate, you can use baking soda or caustic soda instead, just use different quantities.
Substituting 63g baking soda for the 40g sodium carbonate (washing soda ?) gives the same result without having to go to the trouble of heating the baking soda...
So you dissolve citric acid in water to have an acidic solution, you partially neutralize it with sodium carbonate, you are left with water, smaller concentration of citric acid and sodium citrate. You could have just used less citric acid since sodium citrate is having less weight in the rust removal process.
I also use citric acid for rust removal and for things internet says "vinegar" instead, because I hate the smell. I've found that adding heat makes rust removal significantly faster, you don't have to wait overnight if you're in a hurry. Best commercial rust remover I've used is Bilt Hamber Deox-C, it's also in powder form, and gets faster when the solution is heated.
Arrhenius rule says that reaction rate doubles every +10C. It is a rule of thumb but often correct for similar reactions like this. +30C would be 8 times faster.
Interesting! Great results. Only issue I have is that it gets spent. Evaporust lasts a very long time. Adding an air stone will accelerate the process.
You can find citric acid at most hardware stores (or Amazon) and sodium carbonate is washing soda, which can usually be found in the grocery with washing detergents. I live in the USA, so take that into account.
Citrus is massively too expensive to waste on rust removal. That would take approximately 20 lemons - $30 Canadian where I live. The citric acid is $2.
No it does not for iron. It makes everything in its vicinity rust even from the vapors and is notoriously difficult to remove as it creates corrosive chlorides. It will dissolve rust as well as many metals. I frequently etch metals with HCl + H2O2, that is never done in the shop. The sodiumcitrate process is very good and inexpensive, it helps to add a little alcohol as well.
Perhaps the Chemical equation is: H3C6H5O7 (citric acid) + 3Na2CO3 (sodium carbonate) → 2Na3C6H5O7 (sodium citrate) + 3H2O (water) + 3CO2 (carbon dioxide) But molar mass and actual mass added to the water probably leaves it with a pH
Nope, you want monosodium and disodium citrates, trisodium citrate is about as useful as using citric acid for derusting purposes (it is useless), this is why you add less soda than you do citric acid.
@@anasalwash it's not completely neutralized since he is using 0.52mol of citric acid vs 0.38mol of sodium carbonate. So there are still free H+ ions, but less than before. Is it useful? Probably not.
It is a Chelation solution not and acidic rust removal based rust removal system. Best to watch the video that Beyond Ballistics did as he actually explains it.
@milanfanas It is a Chelation solution solution not and acidic rust removal based rust removal method. It works extremely well and is non toxic. Best to watch the video from Beyond Ballistics, the guy who devised this mix, as he actually explains it instead of just demonstrating it. The demo in this video is not overly well done as a larger quantity of solution would have removed all the rust in one dipping, without needing to replace the spent solution.
I would think Evaporust and electrolysis would be a better solution than having to wait so long with that process. But it looks interesting regardless of the situation.
One problem. The mixture got neutral with both ingredients. I've done it with the acid first and then the baking soda. Reverse PH knocks the rust of big time!
your just using a weak vinegar to remove rust the baking soda kills the acid in the vinegar soap does let it stick yes you want to remove rust evapo rust is your only option.
That is not correct, this method uses Chelation, rather than an acid rust removal system method. Best to look at the original video by Beyond Ballistics, it is far better than this video as it actually explains the process and provides multiple tests directly compared to Evaporust.
Nice progress Jeff. Happy new year to you guys as well.
Molasses 2 part Recipe
1 Parts Black Molasses
(Not de-sulfured)
9 Parts Water
3 to 4 weeks. Check periodically.
Scrub parts and leave if needed.
Get at feed store.
$8 bucks per gal. as Deer bait
Food grade workes fine too ($8 per 8oz.)
I've used a (much) weaker solution with great results.
Once ready:
Rust/silt, is easily wiped or rinsed off.
Pressure washer is best applied.
Scrub using steel wool, a scouring pad, or a wire brush, and dry thoroughly.
Spray with breack cleaner, thinner, or primer, or use any oil. Immediately.
You could use a Linseed oil wipe for permanent coating.
(Oxygen exposure creats "Rust-flash" Very quick)
Notes:
Gloves, but not necessary. Hands may smell like iron or syrup, but otherwise Non-Toxic.
Curious: When you open container, you will see a silhouette of the object lying on surface as foam.
The metal alloy varietie may be effected differently, that is, after months of saturation, some may deform/desolve.
Containers:
Small jars, Plastic bins, kiddy pools, swimming pool~for cars,
(4in. PVC) for long rods, Trailer axles, etc.
-----------------------------
Chelating effects:
Chelating derives from the Latin word chele, meaning claw.
The pincer shaped molecules at work here are shaped somewhat like a Dungeness crab claw. The molecules can form several bonds to a single metal ion which contains cyclic hydroxamic acids, which, in turn, bind with rust, making it water-soluble.
Larger amounts of these cyclic hydroxamic acids are found in molasses derived from sugar beet rather than cane.
Plants and microbes appear to use the same chelation bacteria/chemicals to remove rust, robbing oxygen from the iron oxide.
Medically:
(Molasses itself has many uses as a medical/food supplement specifically for Iron.
Black Molassis can rectify iron deficiency very quickly, too much to mention here).
Agriculturally, Chelating agents bind to minerals and make them available to plants.
Related chelating agents are, administered for metal poisoning for the release of lead and mercury toxins, the body is then able to excrete contaminant as it becomes soluble. 😊
@moonolyth Thank you for stating one of the medical uses of Molasses. I’m always interested in a more natural or holistic treatment. Would love to tell Big Pharma to take a long walk down a short pier.
After a good de-rusting be sure to rinse and quickly oil up the parts to prevent flash rust. WD-40 works fine unless the part is to be painted. For that just get primer on, but be aware that primers are porous and just slow oxidation until actually painted over and sealed from the atmosphere. Yes, warm/hot water and ultrasonic will speed the chelating process considerably. BTDT 10/10 on the video.
I've used this solution, my experience is it it way cheaper and removes rust over many more uses than evapo rust or any other thing I've ever tried.
Thank you AJ!
Thank you Beyond Ballistics!
That’s amazing AJ, I’ll have to give it a try! Thanks for sharing!
Have been using this recipe many times (found it on another channel) and it works really well and lasts much longer than Evaporust. The only thing to be aware of is that it dissolves zink. Brass, copper and aluminium seems unaffected.
Yes, it removed the zinc plating from pieces I tested, too.
Good to know.
Phosphoric acid works very well.
I know it's dumbed down for people who couldn't care less, but does water to citric acid ratio actually matter? Does spreading the mollecules far enough apart before adding any of the sodas make a big difference in quality of solution? That is, will I get same results if I add thrice as much of citric acid and soda to 0.5l of water, or will it be worse?
Likewise if I add a third of citric acid and soda to 1l of water... I know that chemistry is fickle sometimes, that's why some chemicals are very expensive and of course, sometimes outright illegal unless you're educated enough with proof to handle them.
And sure, you can say I should try and see, and I am waiting for one thing to derust right now in like 800ml of water with 30g citric acid, which started as like 100ml of water turned into 30% citric acid solution with more water being added to wash out remaining citric acid (which doesn't really matter) and then I was adding water together with soda very slowly for same reason, to remove all of it from a cup.
For completeness sake, I used baking soda, of which you need 63g per 100g citric acid, in other words, 18.9g in my case. And I'm asking because I know that trisodium citrate is basically worthless and what we're going for is mostly monosodium citrate, hence lower amount of soda that doesn't completely kill the acid, leading to ~4pH
Nice end results. But if you look closely, the muffler has a lot of metal gone (holes) from the rust around the treaded part. So it may not be long before it is gone... Thumbs Up!
the whole point is that unrusted metal is mostly undamaged, at extremely low price
This is beyond ballistics formulation
Correct, its where I found it. I had to try it for myself.
Indeed. That's why the video description started with "I found this recipe from a video made by Beyond Ballistics..."
Thanks, it is a very helpfull as we all have some rust removing to do.🐞
I want to try one of the Lazer rust removers too!!!
Attach magnesium after cleaning to stop corrosion. bake baking soda on glass and it turns to sodium carbonate needed here.
Please explain bake baking soda on glass... Do you mean pour it into a glass container on a stove or inside over at what temp, 450F?
If you watch original Beyond Ballistics video (Better than Evaporust), he gives 3 recipes, you don't need sodium carbonate, you can use baking soda or caustic soda instead, just use different quantities.
Substituting 63g baking soda for the 40g sodium carbonate (washing soda ?) gives the same result without having to go to the trouble of heating the baking soda...
Looks like it will even remove the carbon from the inside of the muffler
So you dissolve citric acid in water to have an acidic solution, you partially neutralize it with sodium carbonate, you are left with water, smaller concentration of citric acid and sodium citrate. You could have just used less citric acid since sodium citrate is having less weight in the rust removal process.
I was thinking the exact same thing.
@@dreimer2 me too, it makes little sense unless you like to watch the reaction... lots of bubbles
You should probably stick with Evapo-Rust
Isn’t it an acidic buffer solution ?
ua-cam.com/video/fVYZmeReKKY/v-deo.html
Salt and vinegar gives a similar result in the same time.
I also use citric acid for rust removal and for things internet says "vinegar" instead, because I hate the smell.
I've found that adding heat makes rust removal significantly faster, you don't have to wait overnight if you're in a hurry.
Best commercial rust remover I've used is Bilt Hamber Deox-C, it's also in powder form, and gets faster when the solution is heated.
Thats some good advice! Ill give it a shot. Heating it up makes sense.
@@AJRestoration Heat and an ultrasonic cleaner speed it up by about eight times.
Arrhenius rule says that reaction rate doubles every +10C. It is a rule of thumb but often correct for similar reactions like this. +30C would be 8 times faster.
I want to try one of the las
Good morning from Southeast South Dakota AJ
Interesting! Great results. Only issue I have is that it gets spent. Evaporust lasts a very long time. Adding an air stone will accelerate the process.
With hevily rusted parts Evaporust also gets spent quickly. My Evaporust sollution got spent with the 3rd use. Its not worth the money.
Beyond Ballistics made comparison with Evaporust and his product was applicable more times than Evaporust.
Very nice A.J.. Where can I purchase the ingredients to make up a batch of that?
You can find citric acid at most hardware stores (or Amazon) and sodium carbonate is washing soda, which can usually be found in the grocery with washing detergents. I live in the USA, so take that into account.
@pfadiva is correct, its easy to come by for most.
@@pfadiva thx for the info... I'm in the states also... Should be easy to find it...
Circa 1% Fe2SO4 may activate/ catalyze the process, has anyone tried it?
Ah. You made Enos 😂
I will try this mix.
Good info!
hydrochloric acid works much better and fast.
and vinegar or citrus acid pure works also ok..
cheers
ben
hcl immediately ruins gas tanks
Citrus is massively too expensive to waste on rust removal. That would take approximately 20 lemons - $30 Canadian where I live. The citric acid is $2.
2.2 pounds of Citric Acid cost me $5.66 and it will make 10 liters of solution. Its really damn cheap comparing to evaporust
@@AJRestoration vinigar is a little bit cheaper and give the same result.
but for quick result hydrochloric acid is very good.
No it does not for iron. It makes everything in its vicinity rust even from the vapors and is notoriously difficult to remove as it creates corrosive chlorides. It will dissolve rust as well as many metals. I frequently etch metals with HCl + H2O2, that is never done in the shop. The sodiumcitrate process is very good and inexpensive, it helps to add a little alcohol as well.
Perhaps the Chemical equation is:
H3C6H5O7 (citric acid) + 3Na2CO3 (sodium carbonate) → 2Na3C6H5O7 (sodium citrate) + 3H2O (water) + 3CO2 (carbon dioxide)
But molar mass and actual mass added to the water probably leaves it with a pH
Nope, you want monosodium and disodium citrates, trisodium citrate is about as useful as using citric acid for derusting purposes (it is useless), this is why you add less soda than you do citric acid.
so, the only active ingredient is the soap since the acid and base neutralized each other
nope
ua-cam.com/video/fVYZmeReKKY/v-deo.html
@@anasalwash it's not completely neutralized since he is using 0.52mol of citric acid vs 0.38mol of sodium carbonate. So there are still free H+ ions, but less than before. Is it useful? Probably not.
It is a Chelation solution not and acidic rust removal based rust removal system. Best to watch the video that Beyond Ballistics did as he actually explains it.
@milanfanas It is a Chelation solution solution not and acidic rust removal based rust removal method. It works extremely well and is non toxic. Best to watch the video from Beyond Ballistics, the guy who devised this mix, as he actually explains it instead of just demonstrating it. The demo in this video is not overly well done as a larger quantity of solution would have removed all the rust in one dipping, without needing to replace the spent solution.
Have you tested just Distilled White Vinegar? I use it for fuel tanks and it can do that in about 1 hour.
ua-cam.com/video/fVYZmeReKKY/v-deo.html
Beyond Ballistics vid: ua-cam.com/video/fVYZmeReKKY/v-deo.htmlsi=S4uj4uF0-Ub-z2bX
Correct, that is the video linked in the video description.
I would think Evaporust and electrolysis would be a better solution than having to wait so long with that process. But it looks interesting regardless of the situation.
ElementalMaker had the exact same recipe but explained the process as he went .
One problem. The mixture got neutral with both ingredients. I've done it with the acid first and then the baking soda. Reverse PH knocks the rust of big time!
Elemental Maker used EDTA. Not the same.
oh dear. oh dear. oh dear.
Oh No
Tonto reacion ácido base😅😅😅
your just using a weak vinegar to remove rust the baking soda kills the acid in the vinegar soap does let it stick yes you want to remove rust evapo rust is your only option.
There is a better and cheaper solution than Evapo-Rust for removing the rust, and it is called: Deox C
It is made in U.K. and it works amazingly well.
incorrect
ua-cam.com/video/fVYZmeReKKY/v-deo.html
That is not correct, this method uses Chelation, rather than an acid rust removal system method.
Best to look at the original video by Beyond Ballistics, it is far better than this video as it actually explains the process and provides multiple tests directly compared to Evaporust.