Differences in Ford 460 engines
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- Опубліковано 26 сер 2024
- I wanted to show what the differences was in a 1979 and on Ford 460 and a 1978 and earlier 460 Ford engine. Stuff to keep in mind while rebuilding one or swapping one in out of the junkyard.
Several years ago, I converted a 1970 460 from A/T flywheel to manual transmission flywheel. Ford parts manager said that could not be done. I ordered a 460 manual transmission truck flywheel anyway and bought a '79 truck 460 bell housing. I removed the counterweight from the flywheel so that it had neutral balance. 573k miles later and it still runs perfectly fine. Mild rebuild at 428k miles.
@@sergeantmasson3669 I have a z5s42 manual transmission my truck had a o4od auto transmission can I make the manual transmission work I know the 2 pes fly wheel won't work
@@user-ud6dd6mf1t WTH is a "2 pes" flywheel? What engine in your truck? I need to know that in order to assist you.
@@sergeantmasson3669 460 gas
Omfg THANK YOU. Was looking EVERYWHERE for a concise outline of the differences btwn 1978 and 79 engines. Just picked up my first pre-2000’s car (‘78 f350 super camper special) and want to do a ZF5 swap in it. Needed this info.
You're welcome! There is more 460 stuff coming including a 460 swap in my 1978 F150 and a fuel injected 460 swap into my 1974 F350.
Thanks for this important info. It is nice to know !! Cheers from Motown.
thanks so much i new about the drive shaft to mark it and keep it with the same on the rear end
You can put the early crank in the later block just takes a little time and patience and internally balanced as much better than externally balance you're much tougher crankshaft I've done it many times you get the best of both worlds
You have to cut the counter weights down to get them to clear the bottom of the cylinders on the later model block.
Good info , thanks for the clarification .
You're welcome!
I have a 1975 model block and I converted from an automatic C6 to a 5-speed out of a 96 f350 everything worked just fine
I've never seen a 1975 block casting. All I have ever seen is the D1VE casting until the D9TE casting came out in 1979.
Thanks I'm new to the 460
I built a 514 from a 71 Lincoln 460 block number D1VE and it externally balanced with a harmonical balancer with a cobra crank and heads it produces around 700hp. And never had a problem and hole bunch of other goodies.
From what I have read the aftermarket cranks like Scat and others are made to fit either block and can indeed be balanced either way.
good video but the 3ya cranks i have one with a oil slinger on the rear of the crank and one crank without best i can tell the oil slinger was just on the 79 -83 460
My 1986 model 460 has the oil slinger on it. I have a core 1989-1990 460 that has the pan off of it. I need to look and see if it has the oil slinger or not?
Thank you so much for sharing! Definitely important haha
You’re welcome! Just trying to save some people some frustrations when trying to interchange 460 Ford engines.
Thanks for the BBF content.
You're welcome
You are awesome I have an 86...I'm getting ready to build ...or should I say I was getting ready to make a mess...thankyou sir..
You're welcome!
How does the flex plate with weight need to be oriented in relation to the hatchet weight?
The flex plate will only bolt up one way. Two holes are closer together than the other holes. You can only get all the bolts in, in that one position
I'm going to come see you
For what?
Thank you. Very informative but now I have a mystery with my engine. It is in a 1980 E350 but I was told it was from a '71 Lincoln. I verified that the block number is "D1VE..." so it is a '71 block but I have the external balancer. The reason I know it has the external balancer sleeve is because I'm tearing into it to fix a water and oil leak. You said you can't put the earlier crank in the older block but I'm guessing they might have put the newer crank into the old block when they did the rebuild. It runs very smoothly so I doubt it has an external balancer on an early crank.
You might try looking at the flexplate. The early models will have no weight on the flexplate but the later model 460 does have a weight on the flexplate. Although since its installed you can't see the back side where the weight is, you should be able to see the spots where the weight was welded to the flexplate. If there is no weight on the flexplate then there is definitely a miss match on that engine.
@@BlackLabGarage What about the ford motor company 514 short block? Anything I need to know. I was thinking about doing a build with this for the torque for a 2003 Excursion.
@@brandonrobertson6327 If you are talking about the one offered as a crate engine from Ford, the early ones had connecting rod problems which is why they switched to Eagle rods later. Also it comes with a solid roller cam which isn't good for street driving. If it was mine and I was going to drive it on the street I would swap the cam to a hydraulic roller if I wanted to stay with a roller setup.
@@BlackLabGarage Thanks.
I was kicking the idea around and wondering about this short block, what cam would be good off idle to about 5k rpms for a strong torque curve for towing. A 460 and a 514 or even a 557 may act differently due to different airflow needs. I know that I don't need a radical cam and head combination, but would like your thoughts on what you think will fit my stated needs. Any suggestions on head and cams? Some might say go diesel, but I rather keep it cheaper on operating cost ease of doing my own service on repairs and maintenance.
If my factory gas engine ever blows up, I'm will be considering this swap with an transmission adapter.
@@brandonrobertson6327 Are you good at porting heads? There are 460 engines out there with the later D3VE lower compression heads making 450hp and 530lb feet of torque all in by 5500 rpms. The key is in the heads and good exhaust flow. It doesn't take a lot of camshaft to achieve it. Something around 210 duration @.050 on the intake and 220 duration @ .050 on the exhaust should get you what you are looking for. While its always better to get a custom cam, if i had to pick an off the shelf hydraulic roller I would probably pick this one.
www.lunatipower.com/voodoo-hydraulic-roller-cam-ford-429-460-262-270.html
Great info thank you .
You're welcome!
I'm looking for a 1980 up 460 to replace my 351m Bronco thanks for the tips.
You're welcome!
Thanks for the Info.
You're welcome!
I have a 83 460 which is externally balanced I’ve read several articles bout what the flexplate plate to use some say they were 50 ounces and some say they were all 24.2 ounces do you know what the proper weight balance would be on a 83 460?
There is only one flywheel or flexplate used on an external balance 460. As long as you have a 460 flexplate with the weight on it then it's right. If it has no weight on it then it's for a 1978 and earlier internal balanced 429/460 engine.
very informative video.
I have a question: does it matter what direction the weight is facing,
rather, what clock position should the weight be facing ?
please let us know, thank you much
The flexplate will only bolt up in one position. The counterweight on the front is keyed to the crank so they can only go on one way.
@@BlackLabGarage wrong, the flexplate can go on in all 6 positions.
I'm trying to find out which is the correct one
Thanks for putting this out I've got a 69 429 that I want to make into a 460 and use the same block.
Your welcome! You have a good set of heads. Finding gas for it to run on might be tough though unless you drop the compression down some. I think in 1969 the 460 was rated at 11:1 compression but also 360 hp stock.
So if the later model blocks are better for stroking where do you find the aftermarket crank to fit and are they externally balanced as well
Scat makes stroker cranks for the 460 in both internal and external balance.
The 60s and early 70s cars use a flywheel (flex plate) with open triangular holes stamped in it so it has spoke like appearance. They are prone to cracking. Can I replace one with the solid non weighted pre 78 flywheel shown on this video.
Yeah. As long as the diameter and tooth count is the same then any internal balance 429/460 flex plate should work on a 1978 and back engine.
What block would be optimal for a balanced stroker kit, internal or external balance? reason being, I have a 1970 429 block and a 1979 460 block
Internal balance is always better. The stroker cranks are supposed to be made to fit either block. The increased cylinder length of the 1979 and up 460 block offers more support for the piston at the bottom of the cylinder over the earlier blocks which is more important when stroking a 460. Just use the regular crank spacer on the front instead of the hatchet weight spacer used on 1979 and up, and use the earlier model flywheel which is neutral balance that way way you can have the whole assembly internally balanced to use in the later model block. Best of both worlds.
@@BlackLabGarage Thanks for the reply. I’ll go with the newer block
You're welcome!@@HeyDude93gt
I am rebuilding my '77 460 and doing a tranny swap to a 6R80. Since I am internally balanced can I use the new flex plate that the speed gems sent me with the adapter?
I'd have to see the flex plate that they sent, but as long as it's an internal balance flex plate it should be ok to use.
But can you put a later model crank in an early model block? Or what flywheel can I use to swap a 77 460 into my 79 f150 4 speed
I'm wanting to say that the oil slinger location on the crank moved slightly from the internal balance to the external balance but I would have to measure to be sure. If your engine is a 1977 model then it should be internal balance and most of the time people use a Ford 390 flywheel and a 11" diaphragm clutch to put the earlier 460's in. The 390 flywheel is a few teeth short of being exact but it will work. If you want the exact flywheel then you would have to get one from L&L Products.
Hi buddy, that was a good bit of info on a lot of the differences. You ommitted to mention the crankshaft is also different. Apart from different casting numbers , It has different counterweighting. Unless you have them side by side, its hard to differentiate between the two.
I did say that the cranks were different and will not interchange. It's around the 2:20 mark. Because I also said you can not put an early model crank in the later model block because the counterweights hit the bottom of the cylinders. The external balance 460 crank has smaller counterweights.
ford 460, should the flexplate weight be facing the 12 o'clock position ?
or be facing 180 degs the other way in the 6 o'clock position?
in relation to the hatchet weight in the front.
please help me, thanks
They can only go on one way. Ford drills their cranks so the flywheels and flexplates will only go on in one position. The weight on the front on the crank is keyed to it so it can only go on one way also.
@@BlackLabGarage
not on a big block ford 429-460, it can fit in six different positions.
I found out that flexplate weight goes in 180° from the front crank counter weight, to balance correctly.
thank you for responding.
Something ain't right with your flexplate. I have never seen a flexplate or flywheel on a Ford that would mount in all six positions.@@EarthsMysterieswithKenKay
I have an extra crank and flexplate laying around. Do you want me to make a video showing that it can only fit one way?
@@BlackLabGarage yes,
that would be amazing,
because it's impossible.
an externally balanced ford 460 crank with six bolt holes.
there's no difference in the bolt holes.
you can spin it to all six holes, except for it wouldn't be balanced.
Can you put a late model crank in a early block ?
I will measure when I get a chance but I am almost 100% positive that the oil slinger on the crankshaft next to the rear main seal is in different locations between the old internal balance 2y crankshafts and the later external balance 3Y crankshafts. It seems I ran into that once years ago and had to have the oil slinger machined off the crank.
I have a 1986 460bbf. What manual 5 speed will go good for a street car build?
If you are building a healthy 460 you would need a minimum of a TKO transmission. A T-5 or something along those lines won’t live long behind a 460. I have seen the input shaft twisted on a top loader 4 speed from the power of a big block Ford!
@@BlackLabGarage I have some more questions I didn’t realize you had responded the same day, do you have instagram or a social media platform where I can give you my number and maybe you can help me out?
@@DavyJonesSN95 I have not started a social media for this channel yet, although I probably should.
You can email me if you want. My email is on my about page.
So my 76 tbird 460 has the external sleeve balancer?
If the engine is original to the car it should have the smooth round spacer not the counter weighted spacer. They didn't make that change until 1979.
At the approximate time in this video you said starting in 79 because it wasn't externally balanced. So 79 and after are internally balanced? Earlier in the video you said 78 and Earlier are internally balanced.
79 and later are externally balanced. They will have that counterweight behind the balancer.
@@BlackLabGarage thank you man. This helps me to be sure as I look to junk yard identify one ect. I am subscribed to you after this.
@@jackwilley9847 You're welcome! Thank you for subscribing.
Hey man I've got a running f250 with a 460. My father and I plan on pulling it to build. He's a retired certified ford mechanic so disassembly and assembly is understood.
I'm curious if you've got an email so we could correspond? I'm working on a general parts list for the rebuild and just wanted to show and share my ideas, and hear your feedback!
It's hard to find too many people who know in depth 460 information on UA-cam, at least that I could find anyway.
Thanks for your time and knowledge!
sure... blacklabgarage@gmail.com
@@BlackLabGarage thanks a ton! My names Ryan and I'll send you an email this weekend! Appreciate your time my friend 🙋♂️
@@highvibegardens You're Welcome!
Year model 1979 vehicles are all internally balanced. Year model 1980 is first year external.
No. They started building the external balance 460 in September of 1978 for the 1979 model year. The D9TE block and the 3Y crankshaft.
Flex plate part # D1SZ_6375-A is for 73 to 79 429 and 460.
Until 1978. D9TZ6375A is the flex plate starting in 1979.
@@BlackLabGarage Ya you are right . I went to the manual and it shows the fly weight on crank snout spacer . Dennis Carpenter catalog has a typo showing till 1979 . Thanks for the info. Us Ford guys need to stick together . PEACE !
1997ford I am going to put manual transmission in the place of a auto market
This is great information, I have 2 460.
1975 Lincoln, and 1980 truck..
I have a 1980 club wagon van.
Currently the original 351 Windsor with 160 k original miles.
It has a 9 inch locker in the rear end.
C6 transmission.
I'm sick and tired of the punk's tailgating me.
😂. The Windsor has a whole 168 ponies two barrel.
I'm looking for 475 and about 550 torque
I want to yank the front off the ground and fuk em bad!!!!!
Bye bye of course I will punch it as they try to pass,, 😂
My dad had one of the E-350 4x4's with a 460. It would get with the program so to speak..lol. The main things to do to a 460 is raise the compression up, get rid of the factory retarded timing set that retarded the cam 8 degrees, and open the exhaust up on them. Those three things make a world of difference in a 460. Recurving the distributor helps also.