Dr. Jordan Peterson, I'm addressing this comment to you as a beloved follower of your work. Please consider allowing your guests to finish their full thoughts without interrupting them. I found the variety of topics discussed to be incredibly stimulating in thought, especially when Robert Greene was walking down a path of thoughtfulness only be to interrupted by your interjections. I know you may be excited to share your thoughts and perspectives but found that this podcast in particular left me wanting to hear the guests full thoughts in situ. With love and admiration.
@@kaivogel253I hope one day you get help to work through your anger. I'd suggest understanding your shadow self and then work on integrating it. You may find it useful rather than spend your time slandering others online. But you do you.
I do wish Jordan let Robert speak a little more, but it seemed entirely based on Jordan’s genuine interest in understanding the mind of Robert. He wanted to analyze him. You can tell he’s truly enjoying their commonalities and wanting to share and toss ideas back and forth. Robert isn’t aggressive or assertive by nature, and he speaks more slowly, whereas Jordan’s pace is much quicker. I’d LOVE to see them work on a project together
Exactly I wish Jordan would have let Robert speak a little more. Jordan was like constantly interrupting Robert and barely even let him finish the sentence
@@kaivogel253 It sounds like you don't like to see people seeking information/guidance? LOL, If this isn't for you personally then just go away, nobody is forcing you. You shouldn't waste your time with this attention seeking behaviour anyway, especially if you already know everything about everything. Others here are busy trying to look for various ideas to be an even better version of themselves. You are just annoying them with these clearly made up, temporary notions of yours. It's nothing useful, nor is it effective.
@@kaivogel253 Says the widdle baby that's been crying all over the comment section... You're not a real serious individual, it could've done you good to actually listen to the two talk, but that's still pearls before swine I guess. Chao.
@@kaivogel253 You can only say that if you watched the whole thing and if so, you just gave those 2 the money ;). If you didn't, you gained nothing and lost time writing a comment. Nice
It's simple. Though life is very complex. If you can consider these ideas, think them through. Hard to find error here. Try it out, a little bit at a time. Truth takes time for ALL humans, all the time.
I really appreciate Jordan Peterson, but I find that he has a consistent habit of interrupting people in the middle of insightful thoughts. Again, I truly appreciate his insights. I hope that this sentiment finds him, and is received well. Beyond that, I loved the interview!
Agreed. There's a lot of interrupting. I think it's particularly bad here because Peterson has expertise in subjects that Greene is talking about so he feels compelled to show it. But as a consequence we don't to hear what Greene was going to say. It's poor conversation technique.
that really sad that JP cant live up to your expectation.... its not like this is free to watch. i will write a letter to him. becuse im also very disapointed that you are disapointed in JP...
I can't believe I'm only seeing this now, a year after it went up. I just want to throw this out there... Years ago, i worked in a very political environment and made an enemy of one of my managers. This manager, a supervisor and a small clique of employees made a coordinated effort to either get me fired or force me to quit. I came across the 33 strategies of war at this time, and that book became my bible. After about a year of conflict, a year of defending myself to HR and finally getting a toxic workplace investigation launched.... after about a year, the manager actually lost his job, as did the supervisor in this situation. I got promoted to that supervisors position and later that management position. Robert Greene didn't teach me to win by treachery. His book taught me to recognize the games they were playing and helped me to hang in there and counter them.
Here are together two of the most influential authors in my life: "The Art of Seduction" got me a girlfriend and "Mastery" helped me find my professional calling. Thanks to Greene I decided to be a writer and started to look over the most influential stories in human history, so then I found in Jordan a mentor and in "Maps of Meaning" a key to understand stories, art and myself. I would not be myself today without these two monsters of teachers. THANK YOU GUYS FOR EXISTING , THANK YOU!!!
Professor J Peterson is no only an academic but a truly down to earth guy who speaks in layman’s terms but perhaps more importantly his honesty and directness are key to his success. Sadly in today’s modern world where many parents forget what their role is and choose to be “friends “ with their offspring (this is more common with mother and daughter relationships), and teachers and other figures of authority sugar coating everything rather than being honest. Young people thrive on honesty, direction and structure and in some cases discipline not gimmicks and not promoting girls at the expense of boys.
@@kaivogel253 Your mama Merkel and your daddy Schröder are two monsters. They paved the way for Putin! So "set your house in order before you criticize the world"!
I cannot believe the two top influential people in my life are in one video. Recently I had an interview in which I was asked who were my role models…and immediately no doubt Peterson and Greene. You both changed my life in so many ways I can’t thank you enough. Please take care of yourselves and continue passing on your wisdoms to the younger generations. We are all learning and looking up to you 😭❤️
Don't get me wrong its an amazing conversation but only leaves me starving for more. And I think that is intended to bring in a greater audience and let others hook into discussion. I need to watch more and do some reading.
It really was a high quality conversation. I think the part about hearing the darkness in the most joyous classical music hit me hard in particular, because it's so, SO true to classical music in particular, to be expressing integrated emotions. That's really what I think defines classical output, in a way. It expresses deeply integrated experience, which is why the early works of composers tend to often be the trite "crowd pleasers," and the later works tend to be less accessible, but they grow on you as you keep hearing them, and the music starts to make more sense as you grow as a person. Beethoven's 9th symphony is one of those. Bach's unfinished fugue is one of the most powerful, moving pieces. For God's sake, I can't think of a piece that feels like I'm listening to the mind of God like that piece: This really was an absolutely fantastic conversation, and I think that Jordan Peterson and Robert Greene should do more than just podcast. They should collaborate, just as 50 cent and Robert Greene collaborated. He's SO, so right about the fact that we live in these silos.
@@DudeSoWin agree, I love JP, but it's obvious he knows little of Robert Greene, he needs to read a few of his books, then have him back on for a real deep discussion.
As a young girl being raised in a house with a very violent father, I can honestly say "don't outshine your master" and "pretend to be an imbecile to not threaten another's ego" were literally the first lessons I learned in life. I am 38 and still say very little to him, tho he lives across the street. Nor has he ever asked me how I feel. Just let him talk, act interested even if he's wrong, and get away when you can... this is how we all operate with him. It took me quite a while to stop choosing men who acted like him, but I am now finally in an "equal" relationship of 6 years (✨️just married✨️), where I am able to practice speaking up at my own speed, having constructive discussions, and having a voice in relationship. Tho i am almost always in leadership roles in community and in work environments, I still see all the time that I have work to do speaking up surrounding my needs, and sharing constructive criticism with my man. He's a gem tho, and is a great partner to be working thru this mess with. I'm getting better at finding my voice in intimate relationship every day 🤜🤛
That’s amazing, I’m proud of you! That shit is hard, I still struggle to communicate my needs and sometimes in a healthy way. My close friends have helped me a lot
To the degree you went to describe your own situation, i felt that connection, i'm not gonna assume anything but just lay out my own because these words feel like have been with me all along. A shadow almost. i'm 21 now, a guy, even now i struggle to describe my own father. I feel weird for struggling to describe it because i can do it and just jump straight to it and yet i feel the need to make it clear where the stake is exactly piercing. How do you describe Aggressiveness, Violence without inserting that you were threatened or beaten or getting any sort of physical. In fact i feel that lack of physical violence is extremely important to describe a person such as MY father. Living in this household, family, i often have to remind myself of what isn't normal. One time i was 16ish i remember hearing my mom and dad have a sharp vocal issue with one and other in the middle of the night and i'm just sitting next room on my computer, pull out my earphones and think to myself, why am i not nervous, on edge hearing my father threaten my mother. Murderous language was something that was heard on the daily. This must not be normal, i wonder how will this pan out for me if i'm in a relationship, i thought that to myself.. Spoilers, never gotten into one Under 40 year of marriage, My father never hit my mother, never hit my older brother and sister, he have only hit me twice, because i told him the fuck off, for that he only uses his brutish force on objects, on the house, on the house that wasn't ours, burning the money that could've got us mansions over the years, i was sickeningly worried about these things because my mom was sickeningly worried it about it, imagine my 15y old ass unable to do anything really, be consumed by these worries. My mother was actually shocked that happened, because hes a imbecile, a coward who's all mouth, a child who needs the most attention and is always right or else throws a tantrum, how come he has actually come to physicality. I kinda make fun of that event when i tell it saying; my drunk father came up to me, spinned like 3 times with his arm out, of course for balance he did it slowly to make sure he doesn't fall, on the third spin he put his hands on my face, i bet he learned it from old jackie chan action movies because watching crap on a tablet / TV is what he spends his time on instead of actually learning martial arts. So that tickles some the dark humor part of my brain. Hes not bad, if a younger self of his would see himself he would probably do better or possibly sink into it even further.. Sad reality is that hes a 62y old alcoholic chain smoker who's been at it since 18, looking at him now, talking to him is sad, his consciousness is not a 100% even sober, people die smoking after 5-10y this bastard lived over 40y smoking 40-80g of tobacco a day with many bottles of wine and strong spirits to go with it, he probably himself carries it from his own father. Hes not that bad really, hes sweet to my sister, sweet to each of us his kids really but we can only be babies around him with no serious thoughts, no opposing tastes. Mom got the worst side of him, a liar, deflecting, accusatory, he would blame the stars on mom, he have this unique sets of words that is only used when mom is in the context, if there were a hole to hell in the ground he would look at it, and say "That's your moms habbit to put it here". People, friends that get to know the story assume the two are separated, and be utterly shocked when i tell how it actually is. Marriage +40y strong, add that to one other strangely abnormal things that seemed normal to me. That this is the family, the one and only.. Mom about 3-4 months ago said something to me i didn't realize i wanted to hear "I'm sorry for not leaving him, for you to have to live like this" She says.. She pitied him.. That reminded me of a story where i was still a baby and they did separate, where i fell in a depressive state for weeks and asked about dad, where's dad. Wich motivated her to try again.. Well if people were to ask what would you do with a time machine ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@gamerdude4465 hes very complicated. He means well, Im sure. But he has much anger in him. but his words do ring true. Brilliant and troubled. A modern day Alan Watts I see in him.
Extremely stoked to live in a world where these two phenomenal minds exist. The 48 laws of power is an exploration of the deep dark recesses of the collective human unconscious which allows and provides us the opportunity to integrate our shadow, to become a more competent, charismatic and wholesome human being (as explained in my ‘Power Intro’ video). Looking forward to having both of these gentlemen (the only two alive on my background painting) on my channel in the near future 🔥 Enormous thank you to both of you.
Robert Greene helped me so much with being more assertive in my teens with his book The 50th Law. I suppressed so much of myself to please others which led to people walking all over me. It led me down a very lonely and suicidal path. I contribute exercise and his books to helping me build up my self esteem and crawl out of that "hell". Grateful for his books, and I was super excited for this talk. Thank you Jordan and Robert, you two have written some incredible works that have changed lives.
Yeah that path. I'm def on it now. Starting to wonder at what point one loses the control, the perspective to stop at the last minute and decide to live. Feel like I get a little farther down it every day towards that place of no longer having perspective.
@@jonathanbecker8935 Yeah, I'm more or less there myself, and really the only thing you can do is think about how much your family will miss you. If someone made your mother cry, would you be pissed? Or if you have a kid, think about how much they unconditionally love you. I'm basically a homeless comic (day job but meh it sucks my soul) with a child, couch surfing. Had my ex basically leave me because God told her to, when she said earlier it wouldn't affect us, and thus we got engaged and had our kid (right at the beginning of the lockdown). Three months later, she took little pieces of the relationship away until there was nothing, and I had nowhere to live. I've been back and forth multiple times, and she won't even try or lift a finger to fix "us", but anytime she needs something (apartment, van, etc.), she wants to "work on it." DUDE. I had a house bought and paid for, and turned the loan down because she wanted to work on it. Look at the housing market now. My parents live 500 miles away, and I have no family here. It would be easier to end it, and goddamn I want to. But I can't leave my child here alone. If you don't have anything or anyone to stop you from feeling this way, and in turn, who you have makes you feel worse, find something to get out of your comfort zone and feel alive. I chose comedy, because you gotta laugh at this shit man, no one knows what they're doing or how they're doing it. They just do. Purpose. You can't change shit, but you can laugh at it all day. Hope this helps dude, Melvis
@@melvinburchett I understand what you're saying because my kids are the love anchors that keep me here , if not for them I'd have no desire or reason to stay on this bubble full of malfunctioning meat puppets! I've always been an outsider, a loner, was an only child then spent 12 years alone after I left the kids dad. I like being alone, then I met the man I've been with for the past 3 years, I wasnt looking and wasnt trying to team up with anyone, then when I met him, randomly in a parking lot, he was like the man of my dreams and vise versa he felt the same about me! So I have everything I could want, I'm not a high maintence or flashy person, but my suicidal nature wont leave! I can feel fine for weeks then as soon as I have a bad day its like I've been living in that bad day indefinitely.. and I would off myself in a minute if it werent for the kids, and cats and loved ones .. sometimes I even resent having these loved ones forcing me to stay, but I cant just abandon ship and leave my kids to the wolves! If everything is for a mysterious purpose, then there is some reason we persist
So good to read this and all the comments of people who read in their teens. I was mortified at Jordan’s piece on how he taught his son No and the struggle I’ve had with that with my boys as a single mum. I’m going to get my boys the 50th law, especially my eldest. We’ve had a tough life. My relationship with my boys are honest and close but they can struggle.
Wish Greene had more time to share his thoughts. I've listened to a few of his other interviews and podcast appearances, and the man has some very deep insight into history and human nature.
Same, my two favorite intellectuals finally unite. I've always wondered how JP viewed Robert's books and beliefs. Both men's wisdoms has helped me so much to learn and grow as a person.
Absolutely fascinating! Thank you so much professor. One of your quotes that i always keep in mind is, a virtuous man is he who knows he's capable of doing great evil BUT he chooses not to. Love from Egypt~ 💙
I agree, I think that's one of his best quotes. "He who knows how to use a sword but keeps it sheathed will inherit the earth." That's the version I heard I heard it in one of his compilation videos
Wow. It's a sort of a relief to hear you gentlemen talking about your multiple jobs. So far I've been: a waiter, a casino floorman, a gas station attendant, interior designer, warehouse worker, laundry worker, bathroom utensils salesman, kitchen furniture salesman and designer, power tools salesman and again am a kithen stuff salesman and designer. I was always told by everyone, including family, that I'm a failure who can't settle at a job. You guys made me feel ok with that messy resume. Thanks :)
I feel the same!! I’ve done anything from gas station clerk, liquor store clerk, to plumbing, building tractors, in-home caretaker for elderly people, a cleaning job, building doors, mental health peer support… I’ve also sold some of my art and got my poetry published, I’m even working on a poetry book and plan to get into welding sculptures! I plan to join the Marines in about a year to be a combat photographer, plus I’m in college for fine art & writing now. A lot of people seem to frown on having lots of jobs or changing you career goals frequently, but I’ve found I get bored once I have something down plus I love learning new things. It’s helped me to figure out which environments I fit into or find intolerable. Having lots of jobs and finding what you do/don’t like is better than letting yourself be stuck at a job you hate if you ask me!
Well idk if it's just me, but I see you as one of those superman kinda people who can do anything. That is valuable experience for someone with an entrepreneurial mindset, so there is that 😊
36 and have had just about as many myself. Very inspiring to know Robert's true passion didn't take flight until 38/39. Perhaps more of us are late bloomers than we'd like to think 😊
Dr. Peterson, it is because of people like yourself, Carl Jung, and Robert here that inspired this brand and it’s message. We’ve all got wolves in the shadows of our souls. Thank you for everything you do
Love the work Jp has been doing - so inspirational; but I wish we could have heard more from Robert who rarely had the chance to embellish his points before getting interrupted..
If you’re gonna go up against Jordan Peterson you gotta make him shut up. That’s why he’s such a formidable conversationalist. I like it even though I know everyone thinks he should just chill out and let people talk.
@@ghosthusler Peterson is arrogant. He admits it. Why do you think he talks about malevolence so much? He’s not perfect. Sometimes he over talks. But at least he has something to say. And the other guy did get something to say as well. Nothing is ever black or white. It’s all gray.
@@MichaelCBryan He also talks about being a monster but then learning to control it. Maybe he should learn to control his talking, again, what's the point of having a podcast if you're not going to let your guest talk?
I'm surprised I can sit down at my computer for 1 hr 43mins watching this kind of stuff without getting bored. I love Jordan Peterson and his work. Very educative.
I can't deny that I also noticed how JP kept interrupting RG, but I think it's really from excitement and pure interest. He felt like he had a friend and had a lot he was relating with from his own experience. He was also genuinely intrigued by RG's mind. Both nerdy and curious about human behavior. Hear how he kept saying "I got something cool to share with you." and using "man" in that very friendly way. RG is more intro whereas JP is a little more extro.
Most people with temperance will exercise a soft spoken manner with Jordan. I don't neccessarily believe he is that soft spoken, he even alluded to that multiple times in this interview. I was too surprised by how assertive he was rather than aggressive.
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One of the best things that happened to me during the Pandemic was to come across Jordan, this discussion really helps me to understand my inner anger and not be afraid of it. Every time I listen to an episode by JP and with guests, I feel is the best use of my time. I love the example of cleaning the room or having some order in one’s life, could sound banal, but is soo true. Great discussion gentleman, May God keep you going in good health!
@@kaivogel253 are you Perfect? Perhaps don’t comment on my comment if you will hide it with your negativity. If he is not helpful to you, stop following him.
OMG !!!! That's like a dream came to reality, i am really deeply happy to see you both together... You are both heros to me, and you can't imagine how much it means to me.
I first read the 48 laws of power a decade ago at 16. And I contribute his books to my perspective of the world today. It SAVED me from heartbreak and confusion. You do not read his books, you STUDY them. I’ve read certain pages over a dozen times. Not to say the books are a “Bible.” But honestly, his books are very close to INTENSE REALITY.
I thought I was the only one who was introduced to this book as an adolescent! 15/16 as well and I've revisited it throughout my adult life now 33. I've read all his books finishing up the Laws of Human Nature. You and I are fortunate to be introduced to these concepts so early in life 🙏🏾
Listening to Jordan Peterson alone is life changing. These two together is just mind blowing! Awesome conversation. Thank you both for helping us navigate through life.
I remember buying the 48 Laws of Power wanting to feel/become powerful (feeling very powerless) I couldn’t get half way through the book because it seemed at the time so brutal and heartless…. I eventually worked for a psychopath and his company was full of family and I so quickly learned the truth the book was right and I was extremely naïve and ill prepared. Needless to say it didn’t end well for me when I tried to finally break free and stand up for myself and the trauma were unreal I still struggle with the abuse and have nightmares…. Listening to this was sooooo reaffirming it’s insane! No one around me could believe what was happening to me and faulted me surely I did something…. I did I woke up and tried to get free from the abuse. This book is sadly a reality in a lot of environments I wish I wasn’t offended by the idea I would have run so fast from the company if I took heed still dealing with court cases because of it
I have tried to read the book as well, but could not finish it. I think it is important to confront the "dark side" of human nature, but sometimes my mind needs something uplifting- like this conversation!
@Sym Cardnel thank you! He tried to destroy my life for walking away but I am still standing and stronger for it. I wish I could help others but it’s such a silent struggle
Great sharing - Jordan Peterson and Robert Greene. I was really curious as to how an accomplished psychologist would interview Robert Greene. I had to replay this video more times than any other. These two men complement each other. More please.
Love your work JP and what a privilege to live in an age that I can stream this level of intellectual conversation for free, but man sometimes you just gotta let a guy speak, your insights are amazing and it’s not like when you cut Robert off you don’t provide an amazing detail to the pod, but it would have been nice to hear the end of what he was saying on a number of occasions!
I love listening to you Jordan, but sometimes you interrupt people before they get a chance to finish what they were saying. Sometimes just listen. No offence. I do love your videos and share them and find them absolutely helpful.
I feel the same, i mostly enjoy these interviews, but sometimes they are frustrating to me. Dr Peterson chimes in way too fast and too often sometimes. So much room for improvement there .
I think he will read that and appreciate that honesty. But if you look at all of his talks with ppl you will see the pattern that the more he agrees with someone and feels that someone is hitting the nail on the head he cuts in more not trying to be rude but Because he is enjoying the conversation, but when he doesnt like the person or the person is attacking him then he cuts in less simply to let them bury themselves. And if its a neutral conversation as in him talking to someone whom he feels a neutral feeling about (not bad or good) he tends to really teach that person instead of talking to them. So in this convo he doesn't need to teach mr.greene they both understand each other lol and so jordan is just showing excitement more or less
@@A11N4TURAL I agree with all your observations and i felt the same. Nevertheless, to some viewers including me, the constant stopping of the flow of the conversation becomes annoying !
it’s as though he wants to almost be proving someone wrong or wants to always be the most clever… especially with his ‘perfect’ vocabulary this guy literally reads a dictionary, I’ve often thought he may have a dark personality
I agree. There were lots of times Robert was on to make a great point or example and Jordan chimed in too early. Overall a great conversation, i still enjoyed it. I just wish we can see to the end of each person’s point before a response comes.
The 48 laws of Power is one of the most dangerous Books of the 21'st century. It's the equivalent of a modern Pandora's box on a individual level. It is Well written, well researched well thought out .. and in my opinion every thing it clams to be ...
It’s the first time I’ve ever wanted to hear more from the interviewee instead of JP lol! I didn’t know this guy before the interview, so I thank JP for the discovery.
They need a round 2 interview, I'd like JP to go deeper into the views of Robert Greene, but for that he needs to probably read some of his books, especially the 48 laws of power, and the art of seduction.
Very frustrating how Jordan never let Robert finish. That said, both brilliant, wonderful souls. I always feel richer after listening to either one, thank you for the wonderful insights.
When we are with the right person, we can easily open to talk about things we wouldn't talk about with anyone else. I love their calmness, respect for each other's thoughts and honest conversations. Conversations like this can last a lifetime. Incredible!!
Looking forward where we can hear more of Robert as well!! Robert was so gentle he left it until the last minute of the video to praise Dr. Peterson in expressing that he read Maps of Meaning, even though Dr. Peterson did not even read or know much of Robert Greene's books and writings!! Hope Dr. Peterson can let his guest speak more next time!
Yes, please! Part two - with Mr. Greene getting no less than 80%..no, well: %75 airtime. Do you read that, Herr @Jordan B Peterson? 😁😘 still - love yer work, very much.
@@Cagalhuni Yea, JP is use to being the expert in the situation and ALWAYS having the floor. It's kool when he's being interviewed but not when he's interviewing... it's a little irritating 🤏🏿
I did 14 years on probation, and after reading the "48 Laws of Power" I analyzed my past behaviors, and behaviors from the authority figures. I can see why people would think this book is evil, and teaching people how to manipulate, but once you read it you'll see that all it is labeling the natural behaviors people display when interacting with each other. I bet most people are acting out some of the laws in their everyday life without even knowing it because it's natural responses to the experience of socializing.
But I wonder why does he use language like choosing your victim/target? You can explain something without that kind of loaded language as if he expects the reader to engage in that behaviour. The Art of Seduction is also full of these kind of phrases too. Don't get me wrong i learned A LOT! But I'm not surprised it's got a bad rep for being manipulative since in some parts it literally does guide people to be manipulative and take advantage either for power or seduction.
@@kaivogel253You may have an opinion about the authors and that is fine. However, you should refrain from making quick assumptions on people you know nothing about. In fact I do read quite an amount, somewhere between 25-40 books per year on average.
Sad to see that Jordan (who I admire greatly) clearly didn't understand what a heavyweight and intellectual giant he was interviewing, often interrupting. We will need a 2nd interview with more of Jordan's brilliant questions, but where Robert gets to speak without interruptions.
1:00:19 Robert greene deals with people cutting him off all the time, Ive noticed this with a lot of interviews. He seems so calm and accommodating ,allowing others to relax and speak up that interviewers forget they’re interviewing him and not them. Robert greene is an extremely patient man.
Excellent discussion. Many thanks for this. Greene makes a great point when he states that no one teaches us the truth about the world. We really do have to find that out for ourselves. Often we find out the hard way.
Such a high quality conversation, it’s almost as if they are reading my mind. I love that this is free for us to watch on our phones, truly what a time to be alive… Sending love from London to those of you that are on your healing journeys
@@igbanam Same for me. I would love from Jordan to do more of a deep dive into Roberts books and work. Michaela allso did a pretty bad job in her own podcast about seduction with Robert - not reading the books, too bad - he is such a fascinating author and person. I do believe however this is just first of Jordans and Roberts conversations, so I hope for more.
Me too. And what a disappointment it was, right? Jordan made Robert look like an idiot. What a pity. What should've been a great collab turned into Jordan psycho analysing his guest and making him look like a fool
Maybe it's just me but seems in the last few interviews Jordan isn't letting the other person speak much. I was looking forward to this too but Greene can hardly get an word in edgewise. It's almost like Jordan is just using the guest as an audience. Don't get me wrong, I loved what Jordan was saying, but I wanted Greene to discuss his work too.
My favorite author!! His books helped me so much after breaking up with a narcissist, it helped me understand the whole playbook and helped me heal. LOVE all of his books!
i mean it’s possible that he’s a narcissist too. doesn’t seem like it but hey if a shark wrote a book about how to not get eaten by sharks you would probably do well to read it 🤷♀️
@@youtubemom497 most narcissists aren't overt. about 20% of the world population are narcissists. their narcissistic tendencies are often hidden or suppressed by societal hierarchies.
I remember when I first read 48 LOP it put me into a dark place leaving me trust issues. After maturing and learning more in the world I came back to try it again. After that it brought me more awareness and ways to delicately work with evil/corrupt/egotistical people in a smoother manor. Certain tools for certain jobs. Same way we can’t use a hammer to fix everything. Awesome interview with two great minds.
@@franciscogerardohernandezr4788 I believe I was about 20y/o when I first read it. The reason why I can come back now and see it differently is because learned more about ego. Ego chases power and will use deceptive practices in order to obtain and protect it. Not everyone however operates from that area. It's good to read with someone and provide them with further understanding that not everyone in the world is like that but to be aware of it. That's my opinion with it
Yah i agree. I feel that you have to be in the right state of mind to dwelve into the book, knowing that it should probably not be used as a tool to manipulate, but rather as a shield, understanding how people in the world operate and being able to navigate those situations
@@joshuadasilva3995 Actually the argument of that book is based on Machiavelli's school of thought, which basically states that you should use whatever means necessary to gain power, as the one who does so has the RIGHT to do so. Its the same ethic that got Tupac killed at 25 years old. Careful, men.
@@joshuadasilva3995 100%. But if a person is overcome with a thirst for power along with a high ego then it instructs how to tactfully work with them. I've found two things that unfortunately can corrupt is $ and power.
Finally! They got together! This is an amazing meeting of the minds. I can feel the synergy between the highly cerebral intellect of Peterson and the earthy intuitive wisdom of Greene. Thank you for this.
"The worst people torture the people who are competent." That sums it up! As funny as it sounds, I LOVED the honesty of this book on power and deception.
I love the fact of Jordan's interruptions. He's so honest on the way how he start his interview about the skepticism or confusion about what's that Robert writes about, he recognizes it might be projection of shadow (seeing some irritating facts of himself reflected on Robert's work), he starts questioning some of Robert's ideas, even dares to analyze his personality, and ultimately he ends up immersed in a great conversation where he is totally engaged! He is so engaged that in his excitement, he just can't help to enthusiastically share with Robert notes of how he identifies with some of Robert's ideas. Great conversation!
This is where you see the brilliance of Robert Greene. He subtly plays on Jordan Peterson's intellectual insecurity. I enjoyed the talk, but felt like JP was like an appeaser to Robert. Without attempting to fully understand Robert, he kept throwing theories and stories at him to see which would stick. You can fully appreciate Robert's calmness at the matter. He's there for the ride, and he's also promoting his own material throughout the talk. Honestly this brought out the worst of JP's mental rigidity, and showcased Robert as a practicing theoretian.. without needing to directly control the conversation at all, he established his own credibility.
What a time to be alive. Two of the greatest behavioral psychologists of our time having a conversation from the comfort of their homes, and we can watch it from the comfort of ours. What a time.
@@kaivogel253 Does Jordan not seeing Patients in years make him an illigitimate psychologist or it discredits his work outside of the clinic sphere ? What draws me into Jordan mostly is that he acts according to what he says at least that's the idea i'm getting. Also when when you discribe him as a hack would you please elaborate on that. Thank you.
It’s a blessing this content is free. I feel honored to even be able to get to listen to these conversations. Also, [mostly] everyone commenting on these- it’s great to know we aren’t all going mad as far as the example of the “authoritarian empath”. Unapologetically willing to say what’s on your mind is more respectable than hiding in the dark as to not offend someone. Good grief I can’t imagine being a parent to a college student in this day and age. You can’t protect everyone and if you try then you’re the one who’s going to get stepped all over losing yourself in the process because you’ll have no sense of identity. People pleasing can tarnish into a self deprecating catastrophe if you don’t stand up for yourself and are too worried about what others think. My super agreeable mother has made me proud over the years because seeing her stand up for herself in the workplace is not a character trait I thought I would ever get to hear of as pathetic as that sounds. She often lets people walk all over her because she can be too nice and I see what will happen a mile away. People take advantage of her kindness. What a world.
I am the too agreeable mother too. Standing up for myself is so foreign, so difficult, it is actually painful. I tremble, and have a hard time speaking, even when I know I need to speak up, and stand my ground. If your mother has in any way figured out how to stand up for herself, you are right to be proud of her. Also, be proud of her that she is such a nice person. Respect her no matter what, she is an individual, she may continue to grow or she may remain who you have always known her to be. Respecting her encourages, helps build confidence, supports who she is. Enjoy who she is, don't wish and try to chnage her. Just accept, love and respect her.
I am a very agreeable person but I also have an infamous “last nerve”. I always say “never mistake my kindness for weakness”. Psychopaths love to invade boundaries as it’s almost a sport for them. Like pulling wings off flies. But I have lived long enough to recognise when I am allowing someone to think they are overpowering me to sit back, observe and bide my time for the offensive. ;-)
Thrilled to have the opportunity to listen to two of the biggest minds willing to guide my generation. I really wish Jordan would have let Robert finish his thoughts more, I can tell Jordan was very excited to be speaking to Robert. But other than that, this was super interesting, I'd like to see more.
I think the more time they would have talked together that differential would even out. Although Jordan did talk a lot, I do think Robert really wanted to listen to what he had to say. As if a negative outcome in the short-term but good in the long-term. I want to see more as well!
:3 Fellow Jewish brother! :3 My dad was born-and-raised in New York, where many Jewish people are at. I was born-and-raised in Miami, FL, with many Jewish people in the beach area.
What hit home for me was JP stating that we assume that other people are reasonable which is why conscious people dont speak up at times. People can also be manipulative which needs to be met with force. Great content!
Ohh i could sit at the feet of these intellectual giants and listen forever... ABSOLUTELY precious 💖🥺 I really hope they'll grace us with one of these again. Their chemistry and connection is off the charts! A joy to see ❤ Thank you for this!
I turned my husband onto Jordan Peterson years ago and now he's begging me watch these videos with him. This is the best discussion yet, and I have loved most of them. Greene's observations in the workplace are spot on -- concepts I've never really heard articulated so well before. And he's right that these experiences can traumatize a naive person. I am an early retiree -- part of "the Great Quit" aka "the Great Retire" precisely because I could not participate in that environment anymore. I was in Marketing for 25 years and now believe that the constant cognitive dissonance American marketing perpetuates in American peoples' minds is contributing to a very mentally unwell society.
The end of your comment reminds me of that bill Hicks bit about marketing. "If there's anyone in marketing here tonight, KYS, no seriously do. There's no rationalization for what you do and you are Satan's little helpers."
Really? Do you believe it creates and perpetuates cognitive dissonance? I would love to hear even a basic exploration of that it sounds genuinely fascinating.
Having a channel like this at hand is just terrific. I am amazed at how much I learn, not only about others, but also about myself - and it's a great replacement for my country's "woke" good-for-nothing psychologists. I wish to express my gratitude and admiration to and for you, Dr. Peterson. Cheers.
@@damienmulder909 well what is the spiritual side to life then? the kind of spirituality that i see all over the internet is so vague that you can basically fit anything within the definition of spirituality. Like everyone is going about their own version of spirituality, so how do you even begin to tackle the question of something like spirituality which is way too subjective.
I just added 48 Laws of Power to my Audible library. I was recently diagnosed with autism, which diagnosis I sought after I suffered a terrible failure. As an adult, I am really terrible at endearing anyone to me despite my supposed intelligence and talent. This book sounds like it is going to frame social interaction in a practical way that I can understand. Thanks for bringing this to my attention; I'm going to need it.
@@dibbi3237 The rules that I've heard so far are interesting. If you like history, you would enjoy all of the historical examples he gives for obeying each law and transgressing each law. It turned out to be a little too much history for me (math person here), and I keep falling asleep while listening, lol. That being said, I'm sure that keeping some of these in mind is going to be handy in the future. The book will not really teach a person to form loving, trusting relationships with peers; rather it's extremely pragmatic, which would seem to preserve the emotional distance between people. I would not use a lot of these rules on people I actually cared about.
@Alien at Large I feel the same way for the most part. Some laws felt too unfeeling for me to see any value in, apart from theoretical application. Thinking on it, though, I realized that these are incredibly important for those in situations less blessed than my own. After realizing this and thinking more about my less positive interactions I actually came to find I was utilizing some of the colder laws in more toxic relationships with people in my past. It's definitely a fascinating concept of a book, to say the least. Thanks for your response.
I would advise you get it in a readable form! Audiobooks are great, but this is one of those which is more useful I believe in print form!!! Good luck and all the best ❤
I wish I saw this video earlier, it would save me from many mistakes in my previous job. I completely agree that being surrounded by toxic people is better to quit immediately, otherwise they destroy all your strength and you become one of them. Thank you very much for 48 laws of power. It helped me to realize how mean and disguised people can be
I didn't know I needed to see this, but I'm glad I did. I've been dealing with PTSD from a previous employer, and this podcast really helped me feel validated. Thank you Jordan Peterson and Robert Greene. You guys are amazing.
This is truly a remarkable conversation. There’s an adrenaline rush in me when I saw this video. I immediatly watch it, and I can’t turn away my attention to the screen until the very end. Thumbs up to these two influencial heroes of mine.👍
I love how Mr. Greene is such a good listener ❤ I mean he makes the person feel like what they’re saying is the most important thing that is being said at the moment. Also he has a very calming nature… I wanna be that❤
Please let the guest finish his thoughts. The conversation is always incredibly interesting, but for the most part we already know your views. The guest thoughts and what they are working on is what I want to discover. I would like to have learned more about him, his book and filosofie in combination with your opinion of course.
@@1911free he does this a lot with other people too though. I also watched a video after writing this where he actually says something like "people have criticized me in the past for cutting other people off, and it's because of my high extraversion that I do this." I think it was his daughter's interview with he and his wife where they talk about the big five results for the two of them and how it affects their relationship.
My depression after a traumatic experience was partly healed by finally allowing myself to feel anger and let it out as well. Thanks to amazing therapists I could get to the point where I cried and yelled and threw pillows in a therapy session. It felt like a big knot in my chest came apart and as if the suppressed energy, positive and negative, of over two years that had gotten stuck in it rushed through my body. I felt almost high right after, I couldn't sit still, I was crying and laughing and jumping, it felt crazy. Everything in myself changed to the better after that. Now I try to allow myself to feel all those negative emotions when they come up.
Dear Doctor Peterson, Thank you for this discussion. I have been listening to your lectures and discussions for a few years now. I get emotional when I think about the possibility of one day getting to meet you, shake your hand and thank you in person for all that you have done for us. There seems to be no end to the things I have to learn from you and the wonderful people you speak with.
@@patmanpatmanson I just learned about the book from this video. I plan to get it. I think it would help even though I have already figured things out (out of necessity) that they talked about.
Robert Greene you have GREAT patience, the interruptions were the most annoying from this interviewer. Love your work & enjoyed your book on The Art of Seduction.✨️
@@kaivogel253 I peeped this big time with his interview. At moments I thought Jordan was actually trying to insult Green. It was quite cringe bc he insisted this man was bullied although Greene reiterated that it wasn’t the case.
The two most influential writers on me having a discussion with each other, this is great and I’ve been waiting for it for a long time for these two to interact. I am slightly surprised at Jordan’s lack of knowledge of Robert though considering he’s such a giant in his field. I’d love for Jordan to read at least the 48 Laws of Power though and give his thoughts, that would be fascinating. It’s a wonderful book.
@@kaivogel253 The art of seduction does not just relate to a "cheat-sheet" for pathetic insecure boys to have conversations with a human being. Personally, I haven't read it. But I've read reviews and apparently it is more than this "cheat-sheet" you talk about. It talks about seduction in general, and this does not have to be zoomed into the "sexual intimacy" seduction I think you are referring to.
This is the type of content I’m looking for. Two highly intellectual men applying their skillsets to real world events that impact individuals in different ways. Robert E Greene’s books has literally been life savers whether it be in romantic relationship or dealing with work place politics. For me, he is the best author whose books I’ve ever read.
This is one of the most epic conversation and I am blessed to be able to come across this video. Two influential people who've overcome horrific health and death, coming out the other stronger and more persistent than ever. Thank you J Peterson and R Greene!!
Dr. Peterson I love the talk but please let your guests finish their sentences first 😅. As always, great learning and had me thinking about my previous self too and evaluated myself from the "now" perspective.
Beautiful person with beautiful personality and presenting the top 1% of the content that an individual should see on the daily basis rather then wasting time on instagram reels and shorts and whatever the nonsense. We all love you sir ❤❤
Jordan is smart and curious. But he's also extraverted, and I think he is more interested in sharing his reaction to his guests' ideas (and, maybe at developing his guests ideas further) than in sharing their ideas as they already exist, without challenge or interpretation. I don't think I could do any better than Jordan, but I think Russell Brand might be better at allowing a guest to speak freely about what they already think, vs challenging and expanding their ideas. At least, that's what I saw when RB interviewed Ben Shapiro. Sometimes, I agree with Jordan's approach, and sometimes I wish he'd allow me to engage with his guests' ideas without pre-chewing them too much.
Thank you Robert Greene! Never have I heard someone say with such clarity what I’ve been dealing with for the past 10 years in the working world. I’ve been at 4 different companies during that time and realized that many corporations function as vampires. Can’t be in direct sunlight (I still don’t understand why most Corp buildings don’t have windows that can open, unless they’re scared we’re going to jump out), and need to suck the life force out of their victims until they’re gone or become like them. You’re not making us paranoid Greene, you’re making us aware
It’s actually a unwritten rule in Manhattan to not have openable windows past the first floor due to exactly that……in China they have literal nets to stop people from jumping
I was a super creative kid, but I can't access any of that because of my deep resentment for my dad. I've had a life of dreams where i'm bashing him to death because he's always ridiculed me and laughed at whatever I've said and never let me express power. Resentment is the most toxic energy robbing emotion of all.
it's very strange that I've learned more about human psychology from one of his books than all of the lecture and books I've consumed on the subject and his books are obviously anecdotal and have examples from both factual historical accounts and works of classical fiction
I’ve heard Peterson talk about people who get punished for being virtuous, but that’s about as far as he goes. Where as this new guy he is talking to resonates with me deeper than I ever thought anyone would. It bothers me beyond belief how we were lied to about working hard (results) and they’d get you anywhere etc. when in reality you are more likely to be punished for such behaviors. If you show up to work with a smile, they’ll be more likely to try and put you down behind your back. Because why can he be happy when you’re not? I never liked to play the game of politics, yet without it you can’t get anywhere…. Anyways rambling aside, he’s one of the first I’ve seen acknowledging this oddity that most won’t admit exists. Would love to learn more and hopefully put it to use in my work life. Thanks for the recommendation👍
I felt as if Peterson was trying to intimidate Robert by his psychological knack. But, Robert actually used the mirroring technique to its maximum. It was awesome to watch 2 x highly educated minds of the world.
@@CryBaby2211 He wasn't allowed to talk. Peterson probably felt threatened by Greene's worldview, but Greene handled it like a champ and got more exposure for his books. At the end of the day, that's what matters.
I'm shocked to hear these things from Jordan's guest... I've never heard his name before or seen his books, but he is perfectly describing the way that I analyze the actions of people around me. I've always felt that people saw me as quick to distrust, or perhaps standoffish, or maybe even suspicious of others. But after just a short while of listening to this discussion, I realize I am actually far more well prepared to stand as a powerful beacon for my family than I thought. I am immediately feeling a wash of confidence. Thank you for creating this discussion for us.
Notice how Jordan in the first 6 minutes uses the exact law he is talking about and Robert reciprocates not to manipulate one another but to have a conversation demonstrating the power we have to come together to have meaningful dialog. Neither one is trying to out shine the other but shine together as individual powers towards a common goal of understanding and growth both personally and for the benefit of everyone willing to listen.
Watching two intelligent people speak is amazing, as they connect concepts and help each other learn more, it’s like an evolution of when children connect the dots of reality through conversing with one another, coming to both profound and relatively insignificant realizations because of merely talking
Two incredible thought thinkers who have both overcome many obstacles, Robert with his stroke and near death and Jordan with his health issues! Both sharp and on their game here in this interview! We have so much to learn from each of them!
I was very unsure of Robert Greene just as Dr Peterson was before this interview, this was astounding to watch Dr Peterson analyse his personality and I feel it helped me understand the point of Mr Greene’s work a lot more. Beyond interesting, thank you yet again Dr Peterson.
That's what internet is made for I swear I've grown years watching this conversation Thanks to the both of you I'm gonna give Robert's books a go as well that's now became a must 🙏
Dr. Jordan Peterson, I'm addressing this comment to you as a beloved follower of your work. Please consider allowing your guests to finish their full thoughts without interrupting them. I found the variety of topics discussed to be incredibly stimulating in thought, especially when Robert Greene was walking down a path of thoughtfulness only be to interrupted by your interjections. I know you may be excited to share your thoughts and perspectives but found that this podcast in particular left me wanting to hear the guests full thoughts in situ. With love and admiration.
@@kaivogel253I hope one day you get help to work through your anger. I'd suggest understanding your shadow self and then work on integrating it. You may find it useful rather than spend your time slandering others online. But you do you.
@@kaivogel253 what are you even doing here, be on your merry way and do something you like
Well said, I was also an excited interrupter with good intentions and needed someone to bring it to my attention.
I agree with this feedback and believe it to be very constructive criticism.
@@kaivogel253 you must be a sad sorry individual.
Robert is a good listener and so calm. I love his nature.
Zen.
Strategist
Law 4 and law 35
As do I.
Probably smokes a ton of weed.
I literally screamed when I saw this was posted! We are living in the best reality when the greatest minds find one another. Bless all of you!
Me too!!!
I did the same! 🖤
Lmaooo I literally screamed too!!
Haven’t watched yet but this has got to be one of the best collaborations of all time!
Yes
I do wish Jordan let Robert speak a little more, but it seemed entirely based on Jordan’s genuine interest in understanding the mind of Robert. He wanted to analyze him. You can tell he’s truly enjoying their commonalities and wanting to share and toss ideas back and forth. Robert isn’t aggressive or assertive by nature, and he speaks more slowly, whereas Jordan’s pace is much quicker. I’d LOVE to see them work on a project together
I felt the same about Jordan’s interest of Robert’s mindset and ideas in a way that he cannot wait to show his agreement with what he is saying
The man had a conversation based on his accomplishments and shared it for free with us. He is not an entertainer or talk show host
That's how he really shows he is an extravert. It's always much mor eof a conversation instead of an interview.
Factz I think he wants to be the center of attention I think he is just insecure n hasn’t learn to play the host role yet
Exactly I wish Jordan would have let Robert speak a little more. Jordan was like constantly interrupting Robert and barely even let him finish the sentence
2 men that give you the Tools to change your life for the Better 🙏🏻🙏🏻
@@kaivogel253
It sounds like you don't like to see people seeking information/guidance?
LOL, If this isn't for you personally then just go away, nobody is forcing you.
You shouldn't waste your time with this attention seeking behaviour anyway, especially if you already know everything about everything.
Others here are busy trying to look for various ideas to be an even better version of themselves. You are just annoying them with these clearly made up, temporary notions of yours. It's nothing useful, nor is it effective.
@@kaivogel253 Says the widdle baby that's been crying all over the comment section...
You're not a real serious individual, it could've done you good to actually listen to the two talk, but that's still pearls before swine I guess.
Chao.
@@kaivogel253 You can only say that if you watched the whole thing and if so, you just gave those 2 the money ;). If you didn't, you gained nothing and lost time writing a comment. Nice
It's simple. Though life is very complex. If you can consider these ideas, think them through. Hard to find error here. Try it out, a little bit at a time. Truth takes time for ALL humans, all the time.
There is a dark side to everyone. It's common sense. Devil or dark side, same thing.
I've been wishing for this discussion for ages! Robert Greene is one of my favorite modern authors.
Ditto, heavyweights for sure.
I am going to look him up!
One of my favorite authors for sure, too!
@@tammys8711 you should definitely look him up.
😀😀😀😀
I really appreciate Jordan Peterson, but I find that he has a consistent habit of interrupting people in the middle of insightful thoughts. Again, I truly appreciate his insights. I hope that this sentiment finds him, and is received well.
Beyond that, I loved the interview!
Agreed. There's a lot of interrupting. I think it's particularly bad here because Peterson has expertise in subjects that Greene is talking about so he feels compelled to show it. But as a consequence we don't to hear what Greene was going to say. It's poor conversation technique.
that really sad that JP cant live up to your expectation.... its not like this is free to watch. i will write a letter to him. becuse im also very disapointed that you are disapointed in JP...
@@Torsdagskvallsmys So do you think JP has a habit of interrupting or not?
@@shamusenright5387 definatly not... only nervousnes
@@Torsdagskvallsmys Cool. I appreciate the letter. It would be surprising if there weren't alternative views.
I can't believe I'm only seeing this now, a year after it went up.
I just want to throw this out there... Years ago, i worked in a very political environment and made an enemy of one of my managers.
This manager, a supervisor and a small clique of employees made a coordinated effort to either get me fired or force me to quit.
I came across the 33 strategies of war at this time, and that book became my bible. After about a year of conflict, a year of defending myself to HR and finally getting a toxic workplace investigation launched.... after about a year, the manager actually lost his job, as did the supervisor in this situation. I got promoted to that supervisors position and later that management position.
Robert Greene didn't teach me to win by treachery. His book taught me to recognize the games they were playing and helped me to hang in there and counter them.
I'm in that same position now. I'd love to collaborate with you on a way through this.
Here are together two of the most influential authors in my life: "The Art of Seduction" got me a girlfriend and "Mastery" helped me find my professional calling.
Thanks to Greene I decided to be a writer and started to look over the most influential stories in human history, so then I found in Jordan a mentor and in "Maps of Meaning" a key to understand stories, art and myself. I would not be myself today without these two monsters of teachers. THANK YOU GUYS FOR EXISTING , THANK YOU!!!
@@kaivogel253 Monsters? haha. deadly trolling.
Professor J Peterson is no only an academic but a truly down to earth guy who speaks in layman’s terms but perhaps more importantly his honesty and directness are key to his success. Sadly in today’s modern world where many parents forget what their role is and choose to be “friends “ with their offspring (this is more common with mother and daughter relationships), and teachers and other figures of authority sugar coating everything rather than being honest. Young people thrive on honesty, direction and structure and in some cases discipline not gimmicks and not promoting girls at the expense of boys.
@@kaivogel253 Your mama Merkel and your daddy Schröder are two monsters. They paved the way for Putin! So "set your house in order before you criticize the world"!
@@kaivogel253 I've seen you spreading these type of comments everywhere. Why do you think they're monsters? Why are you bothered?
@@thiagomuniz8607 He is just a troll desperate for attention, which is why he trolls.
I cannot believe the two top influential people in my life are in one video. Recently I had an interview in which I was asked who were my role models…and immediately no doubt Peterson and Greene. You both changed my life in so many ways I can’t thank you enough. Please take care of yourselves and continue passing on your wisdoms to the younger generations. We are all learning and looking up to you 😭❤️
Don't get me wrong its an amazing conversation but only leaves me starving for more. And I think that is intended to bring in a greater audience and let others hook into discussion. I need to watch more and do some reading.
It really was a high quality conversation.
I think the part about hearing the darkness in the most joyous classical music hit me hard in particular, because it's so, SO true to classical music in particular, to be expressing integrated emotions.
That's really what I think defines classical output, in a way. It expresses deeply integrated experience, which is why the early works of composers tend to often be the trite "crowd pleasers," and the later works tend to be less accessible, but they grow on you as you keep hearing them, and the music starts to make more sense as you grow as a person.
Beethoven's 9th symphony is one of those. Bach's unfinished fugue is one of the most powerful, moving pieces. For God's sake, I can't think of a piece that feels like I'm listening to the mind of God like that piece:
This really was an absolutely fantastic conversation, and I think that Jordan Peterson and Robert Greene should do more than just podcast.
They should collaborate, just as 50 cent and Robert Greene collaborated. He's SO, so right about the fact that we live in these silos.
This girl is so attractive to me. Just based on a thumbnail. But I also love both Robert and Jordan.
I am thinking 100% the same
@@DudeSoWin agree, I love JP, but it's obvious he knows little of Robert Greene, he needs to read a few of his books, then have him back on for a real deep discussion.
As a young girl being raised in a house with a very violent father, I can honestly say "don't outshine your master" and "pretend to be an imbecile to not threaten another's ego" were literally the first lessons I learned in life. I am 38 and still say very little to him, tho he lives across the street. Nor has he ever asked me how I feel. Just let him talk, act interested even if he's wrong, and get away when you can... this is how we all operate with him.
It took me quite a while to stop choosing men who acted like him, but I am now finally in an "equal" relationship of 6 years (✨️just married✨️), where I am able to practice speaking up at my own speed, having constructive discussions, and having a voice in relationship. Tho i am almost always in leadership roles in community and in work environments, I still see all the time that I have work to do speaking up surrounding my needs, and sharing constructive criticism with my man. He's a gem tho, and is a great partner to be working thru this mess with. I'm getting better at finding my voice in intimate relationship every day 🤜🤛
That’s amazing, I’m proud of you! That shit is hard, I still struggle to communicate my needs and sometimes in a healthy way. My close friends have helped me a lot
To the degree you went to describe your own situation, i felt that connection, i'm not gonna assume anything but just lay out my own because these words feel like have been with me all along. A shadow almost.
i'm 21 now, a guy, even now i struggle to describe my own father. I feel weird for struggling to describe it because i can do it and just jump straight to it and yet i feel the need to make it clear where the stake is exactly piercing. How do you describe Aggressiveness, Violence without inserting that you were threatened or beaten or getting any sort of physical. In fact i feel that lack of physical violence is extremely important to describe a person such as MY father. Living in this household, family, i often have to remind myself of what isn't normal.
One time i was 16ish i remember hearing my mom and dad have a sharp vocal issue with one and other in the middle of the night and i'm just sitting next room on my computer, pull out my earphones and think to myself, why am i not nervous, on edge hearing my father threaten my mother. Murderous language was something that was heard on the daily. This must not be normal, i wonder how will this pan out for me if i'm in a relationship, i thought that to myself.. Spoilers, never gotten into one
Under 40 year of marriage, My father never hit my mother, never hit my older brother and sister, he have only hit me twice, because i told him the fuck off, for that he only uses his brutish force on objects, on the house, on the house that wasn't ours, burning the money that could've got us mansions over the years, i was sickeningly worried about these things because my mom was sickeningly worried it about it, imagine my 15y old ass unable to do anything really, be consumed by these worries. My mother was actually shocked that happened, because hes a imbecile, a coward who's all mouth, a child who needs the most attention and is always right or else throws a tantrum, how come he has actually come to physicality. I kinda make fun of that event when i tell it saying; my drunk father came up to me, spinned like 3 times with his arm out, of course for balance he did it slowly to make sure he doesn't fall, on the third spin he put his hands on my face, i bet he learned it from old jackie chan action movies because watching crap on a tablet / TV is what he spends his time on instead of actually learning martial arts. So that tickles some the dark humor part of my brain.
Hes not bad, if a younger self of his would see himself he would probably do better or possibly sink into it even further.. Sad reality is that hes a 62y old alcoholic chain smoker who's been at it since 18, looking at him now, talking to him is sad, his consciousness is not a 100% even sober, people die smoking after 5-10y this bastard lived over 40y smoking 40-80g of tobacco a day with many bottles of wine and strong spirits to go with it, he probably himself carries it from his own father. Hes not that bad really, hes sweet to my sister, sweet to each of us his kids really but we can only be babies around him with no serious thoughts, no opposing tastes. Mom got the worst side of him, a liar, deflecting, accusatory, he would blame the stars on mom, he have this unique sets of words that is only used when mom is in the context, if there were a hole to hell in the ground he would look at it, and say "That's your moms habbit to put it here".
People, friends that get to know the story assume the two are separated, and be utterly shocked when i tell how it actually is. Marriage +40y strong, add that to one other strangely abnormal things that seemed normal to me. That this is the family, the one and only.. Mom about 3-4 months ago said something to me i didn't realize i wanted to hear "I'm sorry for not leaving him, for you to have to live like this" She says.. She pitied him.. That reminded me of a story where i was still a baby and they did separate, where i fell in a depressive state for weeks and asked about dad, where's dad. Wich motivated her to try again.. Well if people were to ask what would you do with a time machine ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Woah I did the same in childhood but thought it was just me because my siblings went other routes
Congratulations to both of you with the marriage.
Fantastic comment ❤
Two of the most iconic people I've ever been blessed to walk the earth alongside... thank you for sharing your incredible minds and this encounter.
I would love Peterson break Down my mindset online or offline!!
They should collab on a book lol
Nah Jordon Peterson is pretentious and is a pseudo intellectual. Here, he barely let Greene finish his topics. He just wanted to drag his own thing
@@gamerdude4465 hes very complicated. He means well, Im sure. But he has much anger in him. but his words do ring true. Brilliant and troubled. A modern day Alan Watts I see in him.
Extremely stoked to live in a world where these two phenomenal minds exist. The 48 laws of power is an exploration of the deep dark recesses of the collective human unconscious which allows and provides us the opportunity to integrate our shadow, to become a more competent, charismatic and wholesome human being (as explained in my ‘Power Intro’ video).
Looking forward to having both of these gentlemen (the only two alive on my background painting) on my channel in the near future 🔥
Enormous thank you to both of you.
@Shayan Wahedi True💯
Hey shayan love your work and I’m also wishing they’d be in your channel soon
@@bernardmatias2758 🙏🏽🔥
It'd be great if they will be being interviewed by you Shayan, love your videos!
Local police assaulting me un-waranted meanwhile rich people sit behind their keyboard.
Robert Greene helped me so much with being more assertive in my teens with his book The 50th Law. I suppressed so much of myself to please others which led to people walking all over me. It led me down a very lonely and suicidal path.
I contribute exercise and his books to helping me build up my self esteem and crawl out of that "hell".
Grateful for his books, and I was super excited for this talk. Thank you Jordan and Robert, you two have written some incredible works that have changed lives.
Yeah that path. I'm def on it now.
Starting to wonder at what point one loses the control, the perspective to stop at the last minute and decide to live. Feel like I get a little farther down it every day towards that place of no longer having perspective.
@@jonathanbecker8935 Yeah, I'm more or less there myself, and really the only thing you can do is think about how much your family will miss you. If someone made your mother cry, would you be pissed? Or if you have a kid, think about how much they unconditionally love you. I'm basically a homeless comic (day job but meh it sucks my soul) with a child, couch surfing. Had my ex basically leave me because God told her to, when she said earlier it wouldn't affect us, and thus we got engaged and had our kid (right at the beginning of the lockdown). Three months later, she took little pieces of the relationship away until there was nothing, and I had nowhere to live. I've been back and forth multiple times, and she won't even try or lift a finger to fix "us", but anytime she needs something (apartment, van, etc.), she wants to "work on it." DUDE. I had a house bought and paid for, and turned the loan down because she wanted to work on it. Look at the housing market now. My parents live 500 miles away, and I have no family here. It would be easier to end it, and goddamn I want to. But I can't leave my child here alone. If you don't have anything or anyone to stop you from feeling this way, and in turn, who you have makes you feel worse, find something to get out of your comfort zone and feel alive. I chose comedy, because you gotta laugh at this shit man, no one knows what they're doing or how they're doing it. They just do. Purpose. You can't change shit, but you can laugh at it all day.
Hope this helps dude,
Melvis
@@melvinburchett I understand what you're saying because my kids are the love anchors that keep me here , if not for them I'd have no desire or reason to stay on this bubble full of malfunctioning meat puppets! I've always been an outsider, a loner, was an only child then spent 12 years alone after I left the kids dad. I like being alone, then I met the man I've been with for the past 3 years, I wasnt looking and wasnt trying to team up with anyone, then when I met him, randomly in a parking lot, he was like the man of my dreams and vise versa he felt the same about me! So I have everything I could want, I'm not a high maintence or flashy person, but my suicidal nature wont leave! I can feel fine for weeks then as soon as I have a bad day its like I've been living in that bad day indefinitely.. and I would off myself in a minute if it werent for the kids, and cats and loved ones .. sometimes I even resent having these loved ones forcing me to stay, but I cant just abandon ship and leave my kids to the wolves! If everything is for a mysterious purpose, then there is some reason we persist
So good to read this and all the comments of people who read in their teens. I was mortified at Jordan’s piece on how he taught his son No and the struggle I’ve had with that with my boys as a single mum. I’m going to get my boys the 50th law, especially my eldest. We’ve had a tough life. My relationship with my boys are honest and close but they can struggle.
"48 Laws of Power" helped me out so much in my career! So grateful for Robert Greene. Thank you JP for having him as a guest 💯🙌
Wish Greene had more time to share his thoughts. I've listened to a few of his other interviews and podcast appearances, and the man has some very deep insight into history and human nature.
Agreed
@@Paid2Win端は差はさすしサシは【試作ササははされたらスさは【さ笹佐橋は刺さパサパサささす久しさは長谷さん佐々木はさびサバサバ笹鯖を組みあわせてますしサフは素子蓮はサスは房は左派さそ嗣子はは秘せそさぞさハスハソサハソフフシソササハハ！す芝生は阻止はし左派そそ氏は二十二日からさびさはさふふさ走日はそうヒサは始まったハサヒシルシハフサハサシラサラサソラルラハラサラハシハシルヒサハサハサラシラサハルルルサルラサハはさひふはしらさらすりりるりるさひさふふるるりらるるひはるる
if peterson didn't cut him off every two minutes
OMG. I was waiting for this for a long time. And I was thinking about when you'll get Robert on the podcast and here it is. Thank you! :)
Yeeeesssss!!!!!
Exactly
You and me both! Lol This is gonna be good! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Same, my two favorite intellectuals finally unite. I've always wondered how JP viewed Robert's books and beliefs. Both men's wisdoms has helped me so much to learn and grow as a person.
Same!!!
Absolutely fascinating! Thank you so much professor. One of your quotes that i always keep in mind is, a virtuous man is he who knows he's capable of doing great evil BUT he chooses not to. Love from Egypt~ 💙
You don't look like a man to care about male virtuosity
@@kaledon6 so what? 🙄
@kaledon6 what a dumb comment. So grade school of you! What are you like 8 years old?
@@kaledon6 go watch feminist videos
I agree, I think that's one of his best quotes. "He who knows how to use a sword but keeps it sheathed will inherit the earth." That's the version I heard
I heard it in one of his compilation videos
Wow. It's a sort of a relief to hear you gentlemen talking about your multiple jobs.
So far I've been: a waiter, a casino floorman, a gas station attendant, interior designer, warehouse worker, laundry worker, bathroom utensils salesman, kitchen furniture salesman and designer, power tools salesman and again am a kithen stuff salesman and designer.
I was always told by everyone, including family, that I'm a failure who can't settle at a job.
You guys made me feel ok with that messy resume. Thanks :)
I feel the same!! I’ve done anything from gas station clerk, liquor store clerk, to plumbing, building tractors, in-home caretaker for elderly people, a cleaning job, building doors, mental health peer support… I’ve also sold some of my art and got my poetry published, I’m even working on a poetry book and plan to get into welding sculptures! I plan to join the Marines in about a year to be a combat photographer, plus I’m in college for fine art & writing now. A lot of people seem to frown on having lots of jobs or changing you career goals frequently, but I’ve found I get bored once I have something down plus I love learning new things. It’s helped me to figure out which environments I fit into or find intolerable. Having lots of jobs and finding what you do/don’t like is better than letting yourself be stuck at a job you hate if you ask me!
I'm a 58 year-old recovering addict female I have a similar resume except I became a carnie at 17 years old
Well idk if it's just me, but I see you as one of those superman kinda people who can do anything. That is valuable experience for someone with an entrepreneurial mindset, so there is that 😊
That's so cool tbh, it tells me that you've had such an extensive set of diverse experiences, especially with people
36 and have had just about as many myself. Very inspiring to know Robert's true passion didn't take flight until 38/39. Perhaps more of us are late bloomers than we'd like to think 😊
Dr. Peterson, it is because of people like yourself, Carl Jung, and Robert here that inspired this brand and it’s message. We’ve all got wolves in the shadows of our souls. Thank you for everything you do
This man jordan is lost! When you have a child you are suppose to relearn life! So yea everyone is an ignorant moronic human being! With being said…..
With that being said!
Wow - thanks for all the love everyone! Check us out on IG!
Don't forget Nietzsche. He had similar ideas long before Jung.
@@BBunnythaPhilosiopher can you elaborate?
Love the work Jp has been doing - so inspirational; but I wish we could have heard more from Robert who rarely had the chance to embellish his points before getting interrupted..
I was thinking the same...he did interrupt way too much
If you’re gonna go up against Jordan Peterson you gotta make him shut up. That’s why he’s such a formidable conversationalist. I like it even though I know everyone thinks he should just chill out and let people talk.
@@MichaelCBryan What is the point of having a podcast of you're not gonna let your guests talk?
@@ghosthusler Peterson is arrogant. He admits it. Why do you think he talks about malevolence so much? He’s not perfect. Sometimes he over talks. But at least he has something to say. And the other guy did get something to say as well. Nothing is ever black or white. It’s all gray.
@@MichaelCBryan He also talks about being a monster but then learning to control it. Maybe he should learn to control his talking, again, what's the point of having a podcast if you're not going to let your guest talk?
I'm surprised I can sit down at my computer for 1 hr 43mins watching this kind of stuff without getting bored. I love Jordan Peterson and his work. Very educative.
Yep! I finish watching these lectures during my lunch, breaks and while going to sleep.
@@ladyusa6647 for me, while I do the washing. Nothing like psychology and philosophy in the sunshine to feel optimistic.
Literally one of 4 youtubers I watch, Bret Weinstein, Russell Brand, Joe rogan and Peterson himself
@@carolynbrightfield8911 heck yes
I can't deny that I also noticed how JP kept interrupting RG, but I think it's really from excitement and pure interest. He felt like he had a friend and had a lot he was relating with from his own experience. He was also genuinely intrigued by RG's mind. Both nerdy and curious about human behavior. Hear how he kept saying "I got something cool to share with you." and using "man" in that very friendly way. RG is more intro whereas JP is a little more extro.
I have the read most of the ‘48’ book, I had no idea it was written by such a nice, soft spoken man. Thanks for this insightful interview
Read it
Most people with temperance will exercise a soft spoken manner with Jordan. I don't neccessarily believe he is that soft spoken, he even alluded to that multiple times in this interview. I was too surprised by how assertive he was rather than aggressive.
That soft spoken man has a viciousness underneath that is so familiar. Hell if you read the book you know who I am.
@@segundojoel10 if you watch any interview of his you will see he is just as soft spoken talking to anyone.
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One of the best things that happened to me during the Pandemic was to come across Jordan, this discussion really helps me to understand my inner anger and not be afraid of it. Every time I listen to an episode by JP and with guests, I feel is the best use of my time. I love the example of cleaning the room or having some order in one’s life, could sound banal, but is soo true. Great discussion gentleman, May God keep you going in good health!
I survived the last 2 years because Jordan Taught me the history I was never taught to then be prepared and see it all coming. I owe this man my life!
@@kaivogel253 are you Perfect? Perhaps don’t comment on my comment if you will hide it with your negativity. If he is not helpful to you, stop following him.
@@kaivogel253 Why are you here watching them ?
OMG !!!! That's like a dream came to reality, i am really deeply happy to see you both together... You are both heros to me, and you can't imagine how much it means to me.
I am glad we share the same emotion! People get excited for Marvel movies, but we exist too.
or people that like both like me😁
@@shivdeepsingharora9045 me too my heroes
Same here guys 😊😄
I first read the 48 laws of power a decade ago at 16. And I contribute his books to my perspective of the world today. It SAVED me from heartbreak and confusion. You do not read his books, you STUDY them. I’ve read certain pages over a dozen times. Not to say the books are a “Bible.” But honestly, his books are very close to INTENSE REALITY.
I thought I was the only one who was introduced to this book as an adolescent! 15/16 as well and I've revisited it throughout my adult life now 33. I've read all his books finishing up the Laws of Human Nature.
You and I are fortunate to be introduced to these concepts so early in life 🙏🏾
Listening to Jordan Peterson alone is life changing. These two together is just mind blowing! Awesome conversation. Thank you both for helping us navigate through life.
I read Greene years ago and it really was an eye opening to see the world as it is, amazing seeing them together
I remember buying the 48 Laws of Power wanting to feel/become powerful (feeling very powerless) I couldn’t get half way through the book because it seemed at the time so brutal and heartless…. I eventually worked for a psychopath and his company was full of family and I so quickly learned the truth the book was right and I was extremely naïve and ill prepared. Needless to say it didn’t end well for me when I tried to finally break free and stand up for myself and the trauma were unreal I still struggle with the abuse and have nightmares…. Listening to this was sooooo reaffirming it’s insane! No one around me could believe what was happening to me and faulted me surely I did something…. I did I woke up and tried to get free from the abuse. This book is sadly a reality in a lot of environments I wish I wasn’t offended by the idea I would have run so fast from the company if I took heed still dealing with court cases because of it
Glad you got out. Most don't.
Same
Sorry about your experience. ❤️
I have tried to read the book as well, but could not finish it. I think it is important to confront the "dark side" of human nature, but sometimes my mind needs something uplifting- like this conversation!
@Sym Cardnel thank you! He tried to destroy my life for walking away but I am still standing and stronger for it. I wish I could help others but it’s such a silent struggle
Robert is a fascinating individual and I could listen to him talk about anything for hours. He’s a warm soul.
Great sharing - Jordan Peterson and Robert Greene. I was really curious as to how an accomplished psychologist would interview Robert Greene. I had to replay this video more times than any other. These two men complement each other. More please.
Love your work JP and what a privilege to live in an age that I can stream this level of intellectual conversation for free, but man sometimes you just gotta let a guy speak, your insights are amazing and it’s not like when you cut Robert off you don’t provide an amazing detail to the pod, but it would have been nice to hear the end of what he was saying on a number of occasions!
Ok I thought it was just me lol
100% agreed
agree
Agreed. I love JP, but he can talk over people that he is excited to speak with.
Extremely frustrating. I'm 40min in and he hasn't let Robert finish a single thought
I love listening to you Jordan, but sometimes you interrupt people before they get a chance to finish what they were saying. Sometimes just listen. No offence. I do love your videos and share them and find them absolutely helpful.
I feel the same, i mostly enjoy these interviews, but sometimes they are frustrating to me.
Dr Peterson chimes in way too fast and too often sometimes. So much room for improvement there .
I think he will read that and appreciate that honesty. But if you look at all of his talks with ppl you will see the pattern that the more he agrees with someone and feels that someone is hitting the nail on the head he cuts in more not trying to be rude but Because he is enjoying the conversation, but when he doesnt like the person or the person is attacking him then he cuts in less simply to let them bury themselves. And if its a neutral conversation as in him talking to someone whom he feels a neutral feeling about (not bad or good) he tends to really teach that person instead of talking to them. So in this convo he doesn't need to teach mr.greene they both understand each other lol and so jordan is just showing excitement more or less
@@A11N4TURAL I agree with all your observations and i felt the same. Nevertheless, to some viewers including me, the constant stopping of the flow of the conversation becomes annoying !
it’s as though he wants to almost be proving someone wrong or wants to always be the most clever… especially with his ‘perfect’ vocabulary this guy literally reads a dictionary, I’ve often thought he may have a dark personality
I agree. There were lots of times Robert was on to make a great point or example and Jordan chimed in too early. Overall a great conversation, i still enjoyed it. I just wish we can see to the end of each person’s point before a response comes.
These two are my favorite authors. Seeing them together is like a dream coming true.
Amazing interview. I think these two understood each other very well. Two intellectual titans without egos, how rare.
The 48 laws of Power is one of the most dangerous Books of the 21'st century. It's the equivalent of a modern Pandora's box on a individual level. It is Well written, well researched well thought out .. and in my opinion every thing it clams to be ...
I also clam it's pretty good.
Yes. Extremely dangerous book. Extremely well researched and written. That’s what makes it dangerous. I got through 8 chapters and had to close it.
This is undoubtedly the best interview of Robert Greene I've seen. Thank you Jordan and Robert for coming together to make magic!
It’s the first time I’ve ever wanted to hear more from the interviewee instead of JP lol!
I didn’t know this guy before the interview, so I thank JP for the discovery.
@@carsonhunt4642 I wish Jordan would shut up for 5 minutes
@@mikeohernia5498 agreed. I love hearing Dr Peterson, but here he just shows he needs to improve his interviewing skills.
They need a round 2 interview, I'd like JP to go deeper into the views of Robert Greene, but for that he needs to probably read some of his books, especially the 48 laws of power, and the art of seduction.
disagree, there are a lot of better interviews out there, where there's less interruption
Very frustrating how Jordan never let Robert finish. That said, both brilliant, wonderful souls. I always feel richer after listening to either one, thank you for the wonderful insights.
lol yes, I think Jordon met his male soulmate and got way too excited, he's almost confessing to Robert. They are two of my favorite intellectuals.
@@bunnylopez1808 I think you're right!
When we are with the right person, we can easily open to talk about things we wouldn't talk about with anyone else. I love their calmness, respect for each other's thoughts and honest conversations. Conversations like this can last a lifetime. Incredible!!
We need a part 2 of this interview, looking forward for when Robert's book comes out!
Yes, part two please!!
Looking forward where we can hear more of Robert as well!! Robert was so gentle he left it until the last minute of the video to praise Dr. Peterson in expressing that he read Maps of Meaning, even though Dr. Peterson did not even read or know much of Robert Greene's books and writings!! Hope Dr. Peterson can let his guest speak more next time!
Yes, please! Part two - with Mr. Greene getting no less than 80%..no, well: %75 airtime.
Do you read that, Herr @Jordan B Peterson? 😁😘 still - love yer work, very much.
@@Cagalhuni Yea, JP is use to being the expert in the situation and ALWAYS having the floor. It's kool when he's being interviewed but not when he's interviewing... it's a little irritating 🤏🏿
I did 14 years on probation, and after reading the "48 Laws of Power" I analyzed my past behaviors, and behaviors from the authority figures. I can see why people would think this book is evil, and teaching people how to manipulate, but once you read it you'll see that all it is labeling the natural behaviors people display when interacting with each other. I bet most people are acting out some of the laws in their everyday life without even knowing it because it's natural responses to the experience of socializing.
Yeah I agree if we aren’t aware of these tactics, we and others can easily fall into being a prey or a predator.
But I wonder why does he use language like choosing your victim/target? You can explain something without that kind of loaded language as if he expects the reader to engage in that behaviour. The Art of Seduction is also full of these kind of phrases too. Don't get me wrong i learned A LOT! But I'm not surprised it's got a bad rep for being manipulative since in some parts it literally does guide people to be manipulative and take advantage either for power or seduction.
Possibly my two favorite living authors having a conversation in search of truth. Very happy to listen to it!
@@kaivogel253You may have an opinion about the authors and that is fine.
However, you should refrain from making quick assumptions on people you know nothing about. In fact I do read quite an amount, somewhere between 25-40 books per year on average.
Mastery by Robert Green is one of the most powerful books produced by mankind.
Sad to see that Jordan (who I admire greatly) clearly didn't understand what a heavyweight and intellectual giant he was interviewing, often interrupting. We will need a 2nd interview with more of Jordan's brilliant questions, but where Robert gets to speak without interruptions.
Yess!!!!
Law 4 always say less than necessary
agree.
Green is constantly interrupted. Irritating.
1:00:19
Robert greene deals with people cutting him off all the time,
Ive noticed this with a lot of interviews.
He seems so calm and accommodating ,allowing others to relax and speak up
that interviewers forget
they’re interviewing him and not them.
Robert greene is an extremely patient man.
When it's not based on results, then it's about ego. Brilliant.
Excellent discussion. Many thanks for this. Greene makes a great point when he states that no one teaches us the truth about the world. We really do have to find that out for ourselves. Often we find out the hard way.
Such a high quality conversation, it’s almost as if they are reading my mind. I love that this is free for us to watch on our phones, truly what a time to be alive…
Sending love from London to those of you that are on your healing journeys
I was looking forward to this conversation for so long.
Did it live up to your expectation? I felt like it was so much potential, but it ended up being a more water cooler conversation.
@@igbanam po of o
@@igbanam Same for me. I would love from Jordan to do more of a deep dive into Roberts books and work. Michaela allso did a pretty bad job in her own podcast about seduction with Robert - not reading the books, too bad - he is such a fascinating author and person. I do believe however this is just first of Jordans and Roberts conversations, so I hope for more.
Me too. And what a disappointment it was, right? Jordan made Robert look like an idiot. What a pity. What should've been a great collab turned into Jordan psycho analysing his guest and making him look like a fool
Maybe it's just me but seems in the last few interviews Jordan isn't letting the other person speak much. I was looking forward to this too but Greene can hardly get an word in edgewise. It's almost like Jordan is just using the guest as an audience. Don't get me wrong, I loved what Jordan was saying, but I wanted Greene to discuss his work too.
My favorite author!! His books helped me so much after breaking up with a narcissist, it helped me understand the whole playbook and helped me heal. LOVE all of his books!
i mean it’s possible that he’s a narcissist too. doesn’t seem like it but hey if a shark wrote a book about how to not get eaten by sharks you would probably do well to read it 🤷♀️
@@youtubemom497 most narcissists aren't overt. about 20% of the world population are narcissists. their narcissistic tendencies are often hidden or suppressed by societal hierarchies.
@@youtubemom497 yep. you don't ask a fish how to catch fish, you ask the fishermen
Mastering the dark parts of one's personality is the hardest, but the most useful thing someone can do. Thank you for sharing this.
For president.
Really useful knowledge, we kinda feel it but only as an abstraction
Robert Greene is the best. Always making the most sense, clear and cogent.
I remember when I first read 48 LOP it put me into a dark place leaving me trust issues. After maturing and learning more in the world I came back to try it again. After that it brought me more awareness and ways to delicately work with evil/corrupt/egotistical people in a smoother manor. Certain tools for certain jobs. Same way we can’t use a hammer to fix everything. Awesome interview with two great minds.
How old were you at that time? I intend to read it and discuss each law with my son, but I am not sure about the appropriate age for it.
@@franciscogerardohernandezr4788 I believe I was about 20y/o when I first read it. The reason why I can come back now and see it differently is because learned more about ego. Ego chases power and will use deceptive practices in order to obtain and protect it. Not everyone however operates from that area. It's good to read with someone and provide them with further understanding that not everyone in the world is like that but to be aware of it. That's my opinion with it
Yah i agree. I feel that you have to be in the right state of mind to dwelve into the book, knowing that it should probably not be used as a tool to manipulate, but rather as a shield, understanding how people in the world operate and being able to navigate those situations
@@joshuadasilva3995 Actually the argument of that book is based on Machiavelli's school of thought, which basically states that you should use whatever means necessary to gain power, as the one who does so has the RIGHT to do so.
Its the same ethic that got Tupac killed at 25 years old. Careful, men.
@@joshuadasilva3995 100%. But if a person is overcome with a thirst for power along with a high ego then it instructs how to tactfully work with them. I've found two things that unfortunately can corrupt is $ and power.
Finally! They got together! This is an amazing meeting of the minds. I can feel the synergy between the highly cerebral intellect of Peterson and the earthy intuitive wisdom of Greene. Thank you for this.
"The worst people torture the people who are competent." That sums it up! As funny as it sounds, I LOVED the honesty of this book on power and deception.
I love the fact of Jordan's interruptions. He's so honest on the way how he start his interview about the skepticism or confusion about what's that Robert writes about, he recognizes it might be projection of shadow (seeing some irritating facts of himself reflected on Robert's work), he starts questioning some of Robert's ideas, even dares to analyze his personality, and ultimately he ends up immersed in a great conversation where he is totally engaged! He is so engaged that in his excitement, he just can't help to enthusiastically share with Robert notes of how he identifies with some of Robert's ideas. Great conversation!
This is where you see the brilliance of Robert Greene. He subtly plays on Jordan Peterson's intellectual insecurity. I enjoyed the talk, but felt like JP was like an appeaser to Robert. Without attempting to fully understand Robert, he kept throwing theories and stories at him to see which would stick. You can fully appreciate Robert's calmness at the matter. He's there for the ride, and he's also promoting his own material throughout the talk. Honestly this brought out the worst of JP's mental rigidity, and showcased Robert as a practicing theoretian.. without needing to directly control the conversation at all, he established his own credibility.
Jordan Peterson is smart and he's pretty captivating throughout the talk, but you can also sense that he's being a bit of a fool here.
What a time to be alive. Two of the greatest behavioral psychologists of our time having a conversation from the comfort of their homes, and we can watch it from the comfort of ours. What a time.
@@kaivogel253 Does Jordan not seeing Patients in years make him an illigitimate psychologist or it discredits his work outside of the clinic sphere ? What draws me into Jordan mostly is that he acts according to what he says at least that's the idea i'm getting. Also when when you discribe him as a hack would you please elaborate on that.
Thank you.
These two men are incredible and are helping me through life
"You don't have to follow stupid rules, but you have to put up with consequences if you get caught." This is the way I try to live my life every day.
It’s a blessing this content is free. I feel honored to even be able to get to listen to these conversations. Also, [mostly] everyone commenting on these- it’s great to know we aren’t all going mad as far as the example of the “authoritarian empath”. Unapologetically willing to say what’s on your mind is more respectable than hiding in the dark as to not offend someone. Good grief I can’t imagine being a parent to a college student in this day and age. You can’t protect everyone and if you try then you’re the one who’s going to get stepped all over losing yourself in the process because you’ll have no sense of identity. People pleasing can tarnish into a self deprecating catastrophe if you don’t stand up for yourself and are too worried about what others think.
My super agreeable mother has made me proud over the years because seeing her stand up for herself in the workplace is not a character trait I thought I would ever get to hear of as pathetic as that sounds. She often lets people walk all over her because she can be too nice and I see what will happen a mile away. People take advantage of her kindness. What a world.
Bro.. just relax and speak with simple words
I am the too agreeable mother too. Standing up for myself is so foreign, so difficult, it is actually painful. I tremble, and have a hard time speaking, even when I know I need to speak up, and stand my ground. If your mother has in any way figured out how to stand up for herself, you are right to be proud of her. Also, be proud of her that she is such a nice person. Respect her no matter what, she is an individual, she may continue to grow or she may remain who you have always known her to be. Respecting her encourages, helps build confidence, supports who she is. Enjoy who she is, don't wish and try to chnage her. Just accept, love and respect her.
I am a very agreeable person but I also have an infamous “last nerve”. I always say “never mistake my kindness for weakness”. Psychopaths love to invade boundaries as it’s almost a sport for them. Like pulling wings off flies. But I have lived long enough to recognise when I am allowing someone to think they are overpowering me to sit back, observe and bide my time for the offensive. ;-)
Thrilled to have the opportunity to listen to two of the biggest minds willing to guide my generation. I really wish Jordan would have let Robert finish his thoughts more, I can tell Jordan was very excited to be speaking to Robert. But other than that, this was super interesting, I'd like to see more.
I think the more time they would have talked together that differential would even out. Although Jordan did talk a lot, I do think Robert really wanted to listen to what he had to say. As if a negative outcome in the short-term but good in the long-term. I want to see more as well!
Definitelly, the interview shows how Robert is better listener than Jordan. I really wanted to stop jordan some times.
who cares ... let the man have his conversation
AHAHAHAHAHAH u r sick!
:3 Fellow Jewish brother! :3
My dad was born-and-raised in New York, where many Jewish people are at. I was born-and-raised in Miami, FL, with many Jewish people in the beach area.
What hit home for me was JP stating that we assume that other people are reasonable which is why conscious people dont speak up at times. People can also be manipulative which needs to be met with force. Great content!
Ohh i could sit at the feet of these intellectual giants and listen forever...
ABSOLUTELY precious 💖🥺
I really hope they'll grace us with one of these again. Their chemistry and connection is off the charts!
A joy to see ❤ Thank you for this!
Finally I’ve wanted these two to speak. 12 Rules for Life and 48 Laws of Power are two of the best books I’ve read
I turned my husband onto Jordan Peterson years ago and now he's begging me watch these videos with him. This is the best discussion yet, and I have loved most of them. Greene's observations in the workplace are spot on -- concepts I've never really heard articulated so well before. And he's right that these experiences can traumatize a naive person. I am an early retiree -- part of "the Great Quit" aka "the Great Retire" precisely because I could not participate in that environment anymore. I was in Marketing for 25 years and now believe that the constant cognitive dissonance American marketing perpetuates in American peoples' minds is contributing to a very mentally unwell society.
JBP ftw
The end of your comment reminds me of that bill Hicks bit about marketing. "If there's anyone in marketing here tonight, KYS, no seriously do. There's no rationalization for what you do and you are Satan's little helpers."
Could you elaborate on your views on marketing please?
@@BPBrutalPenguin Would love to hear it to! There's alot to be said
Really? Do you believe it creates and perpetuates cognitive dissonance? I would love to hear even a basic exploration of that it sounds genuinely fascinating.
Having a channel like this at hand is just terrific. I am amazed at how much I learn, not only about others, but also about myself - and it's a great replacement for my country's "woke" good-for-nothing psychologists. I wish to express my gratitude and admiration to and for you, Dr. Peterson. Cheers.
@@damienmulder909 It's still more than most spiritualists.
@@damienmulder909 well what is the spiritual side to life then? the kind of spirituality that i see all over the internet is so vague that you can basically fit anything within the definition of spirituality. Like everyone is going about their own version of spirituality, so how do you even begin to tackle the question of something like spirituality which is way too subjective.
I just added 48 Laws of Power to my Audible library. I was recently diagnosed with autism, which diagnosis I sought after I suffered a terrible failure. As an adult, I am really terrible at endearing anyone to me despite my supposed intelligence and talent. This book sounds like it is going to frame social interaction in a practical way that I can understand. Thanks for bringing this to my attention; I'm going to need it.
Any opinions on it so far?
@@dibbi3237 The rules that I've heard so far are interesting. If you like history, you would enjoy all of the historical examples he gives for obeying each law and transgressing each law. It turned out to be a little too much history for me (math person here), and I keep falling asleep while listening, lol. That being said, I'm sure that keeping some of these in mind is going to be handy in the future. The book will not really teach a person to form loving, trusting relationships with peers; rather it's extremely pragmatic, which would seem to preserve the emotional distance between people. I would not use a lot of these rules on people I actually cared about.
@Alien at Large I feel the same way for the most part. Some laws felt too unfeeling for me to see any value in, apart from theoretical application. Thinking on it, though, I realized that these are incredibly important for those in situations less blessed than my own. After realizing this and thinking more about my less positive interactions I actually came to find I was utilizing some of the colder laws in more toxic relationships with people in my past. It's definitely a fascinating concept of a book, to say the least. Thanks for your response.
Thanks for posting this. I am like you but I love history and math bores me
I would advise you get it in a readable form! Audiobooks are great, but this is one of those which is more useful I believe in print form!!! Good luck and all the best ❤
I wish I saw this video earlier, it would save me from many mistakes in my previous job. I completely agree that being surrounded by toxic people is better to quit immediately, otherwise they destroy all your strength and you become one of them.
Thank you very much for 48 laws of power. It helped me to realize how mean and disguised people can be
I didn't know I needed to see this, but I'm glad I did. I've been dealing with PTSD from a previous employer, and this podcast really helped me feel validated. Thank you Jordan Peterson and Robert Greene. You guys are amazing.
This is truly a remarkable conversation. There’s an adrenaline rush in me when I saw this video. I immediatly watch it, and I can’t turn away my attention to the screen until the very end. Thumbs up to these two influencial heroes of mine.👍
I love how Mr. Greene is such a good listener ❤ I mean he makes the person feel like what they’re saying is the most important thing that is being said at the moment. Also he has a very calming nature… I wanna be that❤
Years ago I started following Greene's work and it really led me to Jordan...
It's great to see them together
For me it's vice versa 🫡
@@patmanpatmanson congrats
@@patmanpatmanson ditto
Please let the guest finish his thoughts. The conversation is always incredibly interesting, but for the most part we already know your views. The guest thoughts and what they are working on is what I want to discover. I would like to have learned more about him, his book and filosofie in combination with your opinion of course.
@soapfanaddict bruh what?? u good ??
@soapfanaddict ok edgy 15 year old
@soapfanaddict you're funny man
JP, your ideas and stories are awesome, I'm a huge fan. But you gotta let other people talk without cutting them off.
100%
Came to comment this
@@ivthecause for me it feels more like JP is such a big RG fan that just poors himself out. It's like he is trying to earn his validation.
Kindred spirits and Jordan couldn’t wait to chime in. I completely understand the urge though.
@@1911free he does this a lot with other people too though. I also watched a video after writing this where he actually says something like "people have criticized me in the past for cutting other people off, and it's because of my high extraversion that I do this." I think it was his daughter's interview with he and his wife where they talk about the big five results for the two of them and how it affects their relationship.
One hour in and I’m not sure there’s much need for Robert Greene to be here.
My depression after a traumatic experience was partly healed by finally allowing myself to feel anger and let it out as well. Thanks to amazing therapists I could get to the point where I cried and yelled and threw pillows in a therapy session. It felt like a big knot in my chest came apart and as if the suppressed energy, positive and negative, of over two years that had gotten stuck in it rushed through my body. I felt almost high right after, I couldn't sit still, I was crying and laughing and jumping, it felt crazy. Everything in myself changed to the better after that. Now I try to allow myself to feel all those negative emotions when they come up.
Dear Doctor Peterson,
Thank you for this discussion. I have been listening to your lectures and discussions for a few years now. I get emotional when I think about the possibility of one day getting to meet you, shake your hand and thank you in person for all that you have done for us. There seems to be no end to the things I have to learn from you and the wonderful people you speak with.
48 laws of power is a good book to cope with narcissists.
I had a narc supervisor who almost killed me.
@@amandaa3713 did Greene's books help?
@@patmanpatmanson I just learned about the book from this video. I plan to get it. I think it would help even though I have already figured things out (out of necessity) that they talked about.
yea narcs are dangerous people
@@patmanpatmanson yes great book
Robert Greene you have GREAT patience, the interruptions were the most annoying from this interviewer.
Love your work & enjoyed your book on The Art of Seduction.✨️
You could tell Jordan was really enjoying this. He went from not really knowing who Greene was to loving his company.
@@kaivogel253 I peeped this big time with his interview. At moments I thought Jordan was actually trying to insult Green. It was quite cringe bc he insisted this man was bullied although Greene reiterated that it wasn’t the case.
The two most influential writers on me having a discussion with each other, this is great and I’ve been waiting for it for a long time for these two to interact. I am slightly surprised at Jordan’s lack of knowledge of Robert though considering he’s such a giant in his field.
I’d love for Jordan to read at least the 48 Laws of Power though and give his thoughts, that would be fascinating. It’s a wonderful book.
@@kaivogel253 The art of seduction does not just relate to a "cheat-sheet" for pathetic insecure boys to have conversations with a human being. Personally, I haven't read it. But I've read reviews and apparently it is more than this "cheat-sheet" you talk about. It talks about seduction in general, and this does not have to be zoomed into the "sexual intimacy" seduction I think you are referring to.
@@kaivogel253 how many books have you written? What kind of books do you read?
@@kaivogel253 🤔
Robert Greene still on of the most underrated author of our time , he deserves more
The guy wrote like two best-sellers, that's hardly underrated.
Robert Greene was EXTREMELY famous when he wrote the 48 laws of power.
Not underrated at all
This is the type of content I’m looking for. Two highly intellectual men applying their skillsets to real world events that impact individuals in different ways. Robert E Greene’s books has literally been life savers whether it be in romantic relationship or dealing with work place politics. For me, he is the best author whose books I’ve ever read.
This is one of the most epic conversation and I am blessed to be able to come across this video. Two influential people who've overcome horrific health and death, coming out the other stronger and more persistent than ever. Thank you J Peterson and R Greene!!
Dr. Peterson I love the talk but please let your guests finish their sentences first 😅. As always, great learning and had me thinking about my previous self too and evaluated myself from the "now" perspective.
I thought the same, even though I like listening to Dr. Peterson, he did cut Robert Greene off quite a few times.
Listening to these two is pure joy. Such genuine intelligence, curiosity and wisdom.
Beautiful person with beautiful personality and presenting the top 1% of the content that an individual should see on the daily basis rather then wasting time on instagram reels and shorts and whatever the nonsense. We all love you sir ❤❤
I expected it to be a good conversation but it turned out to be a fascinating monologue by Jordan Peterson.
😆
Sorry, Robert, another time :/
Jordan is smart and curious. But he's also extraverted, and I think he is more interested in sharing his reaction to his guests' ideas (and, maybe at developing his guests ideas further) than in sharing their ideas as they already exist, without challenge or interpretation.
I don't think I could do any better than Jordan, but I think Russell Brand might be better at allowing a guest to speak freely about what they already think, vs challenging and expanding their ideas. At least, that's what I saw when RB interviewed Ben Shapiro.
Sometimes, I agree with Jordan's approach, and sometimes I wish he'd allow me to engage with his guests' ideas without pre-chewing them too much.
I liked the part where he gave off three examples in a row that I just yesterday read on his book
😂
Thank you Robert Greene! Never have I heard someone say with such clarity what I’ve been dealing with for the past 10 years in the working world. I’ve been at 4 different companies during that time and realized that many corporations function as vampires. Can’t be in direct sunlight (I still don’t understand why most Corp buildings don’t have windows that can open, unless they’re scared we’re going to jump out), and need to suck the life force out of their victims until they’re gone or become like them. You’re not making us paranoid Greene, you’re making us aware
It’s actually a unwritten rule in Manhattan to not have openable windows past the first floor due to exactly that……in China they have literal nets to stop people from jumping
@@ZeRockOfficial I was thinking the same thing.
I work in China, on the 4th floors, windows only open a few inches. @@ZeRockOfficial
I was a super creative kid, but I can't access any of that because of my deep resentment for my dad. I've had a life of dreams where i'm bashing him to death because he's always ridiculed me and laughed at whatever I've said and never let me express power. Resentment is the most toxic energy robbing emotion of all.
2 legends talking about … life!
Usefully perfect
it's very strange that I've learned more about human psychology from one of his books than all of the lecture and books I've consumed on the subject and his books are obviously anecdotal and have examples from both factual historical accounts and works of classical fiction
Interesting...which book?
@@JohnDoe-iu5xi thanks for the recommendation
@@SI-rv9te Absolutely read the 48 Laws of Power, it’s just brilliant
I’ve heard Peterson talk about people who get punished for being virtuous, but that’s about as far as he goes. Where as this new guy he is talking to resonates with me deeper than I ever thought anyone would.
It bothers me beyond belief how we were lied to about working hard (results) and they’d get you anywhere etc. when in reality you are more likely to be punished for such behaviors. If you show up to work with a smile, they’ll be more likely to try and put you down behind your back. Because why can he be happy when you’re not?
I never liked to play the game of politics, yet without it you can’t get anywhere….
Anyways rambling aside, he’s one of the first I’ve seen acknowledging this oddity that most won’t admit exists. Would love to learn more and hopefully put it to use in my work life. Thanks for the recommendation👍
@@JohnDoe-iu5xi What have I done to you?
I felt as if Peterson was trying to intimidate Robert by his psychological knack. But, Robert actually used the mirroring technique to its maximum. It was awesome to watch 2 x highly educated minds of the world.
Passion not intimidation. 😆
Intimidate? 😂 this is not a competition
Robert’s facial expression kinda stagnates everytime jordan peterson cuts his stories
@@CryBaby2211 yes I saw this
@@CryBaby2211 He wasn't allowed to talk. Peterson probably felt threatened by Greene's worldview, but Greene handled it like a champ and got more exposure for his books. At the end of the day, that's what matters.
I'm shocked to hear these things from Jordan's guest... I've never heard his name before or seen his books, but he is perfectly describing the way that I analyze the actions of people around me. I've always felt that people saw me as quick to distrust, or perhaps standoffish, or maybe even suspicious of others. But after just a short while of listening to this discussion, I realize I am actually far more well prepared to stand as a powerful beacon for my family than I thought. I am immediately feeling a wash of confidence. Thank you for creating this discussion for us.
Notice how Jordan in the first 6 minutes uses the exact law he is talking about and Robert reciprocates not to manipulate one another but to have a conversation demonstrating the power we have to come together to have meaningful dialog. Neither one is trying to out shine the other but shine together as individual powers towards a common goal of understanding and growth both personally and for the benefit of everyone willing to listen.
Absolutely disagree. It was irritating how often Jordan was interrupting Robert, Robert was unable to finish most of his thoughts and sentences.
Watching two intelligent people speak is amazing, as they connect concepts and help each other learn more, it’s like an evolution of when children connect the dots of reality through conversing with one another, coming to both profound and relatively insignificant realizations because of merely talking
Two incredible thought thinkers who have both overcome many obstacles, Robert with his stroke and near death and Jordan with his health issues! Both sharp and on their game here in this interview! We have so much to learn from each of them!
I was very unsure of Robert Greene just as Dr Peterson was before this interview, this was astounding to watch Dr Peterson analyse his personality and I feel it helped me understand the point of Mr Greene’s work a lot more. Beyond interesting, thank you yet again Dr Peterson.
That's what internet is made for
I swear I've grown years watching this conversation
Thanks to the both of you
I'm gonna give Robert's books a go as well that's now became a must 🙏