I switched about a year ago or so. I found my nocking point had to be lifted.Its almost 3/4 inch now. You are right about arrow speed. Have a great day!
Great information and having shot a stick some 40 plus yrs. I have to agree with you 100%, Some folks are not susceptible to change, that's bow hunting is all about, Keep it coming.
I've heard of spray lacquers, powders, etc being ways of really waterproofing feathers. AAE tradvanes are something I haven't played with yet but they sure do look neat and reliable. I've been considering going from 3 to 2 fletch and shooting three under. With a single bevel broadhead they'd have more than enough rotation and stability and even with field points it would probably hold true. Would be super neat to play with. Also, I think 3" feathers are such a game changer compared to having to shoot 4-5". I've had no problems with the shorter feathers they fly a tad faster and are quieter than the longer ones.
Feathers should be quiet, but I bet how they are treated these days might remove the microscopic properties that would make them more silent. Maybe we should be hunting with owl feathers?
@@EthanPageHunter did you test the noise with feathers cut to the same size as your vanes? As for visibility, fathers and vanes can be colored the same colors... Some traditions shoot unfletched arrows and some have very small feathers for better speed over longer distances... But even in the English longbow traditions, the fletching should not be as big as most sell them these days.. Techniques to send arrows straight from your bow without so much stabilization needed can be learned in a minute or two... We have instincts for archery, kind of like walking or running... we just have to work on those muscle groups, the nervous system pathways get stronger with regular use and intent... Pick up a basic bow with no arrow rest, do something like what Armin Hirmer calls "simple khatra", or what many longbow people call "pushing" on the bow when arrow is on inside... You will get the hang of natural archery in a shot or three... As long as the bow is easy to pull, easy to control, you can make even unfletched arrows fly so straight with a little practice or maybe super quick, it is like you get the hang of it all of a sudden... Thank the ancestors! ...At least from a scientific viewpoint...
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 I've actually wondered this too. The way they are grown is unlike any other feather it is fascinating. It's just illegal to use them unfortunately (in America)
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 I have done audible testing on feathers and they are definitely louder. I agree to an extent but there are generally still a lot more factors that go into a bare shaft flying straight. too stiff or too weak and it will ultimately fly sideways down range. This is where tune becomes critical. Yes arrows should require little fletching to steer them but in realty, not many are going to take the time to tune. thus the need for larger fletchings. not to mention the advantage of getting full pass through on animals with less than 40# with a good tune because that arrow is efficient.. most also dont need to shoot 60+ pound bows. its not necessary. But archery is ultimately what you make of it. I just like to do more with less and tinker to get there.
They are best option out there if you are shooting an elevated shelf. I’ve never been super pleased with off the shelf flight. Only on a couple bows have I got good results off the shelf.
I have enough feathers to make about 35 dozen arrows but on a whim I've tried Trad Vanes and I like them. They are noticeably quieter, faster, and the price is less than half that of feathers. I shoot 3 fletch that I put on with a straight clamp. I don't know if I will switch completely to them, but I have one in the quiver for wet days.
Arrow flight is way more about properly tuning your arrow (shaft) to your bow and the biggest key to that is spine than the type of fletching you use. Proper spine is best found by bare shaft tuning by adjusting nock height and trimming the arrow very slightly over and over along with adjusting head weight. Feathers will not be damaged or worn with a properly tuned arrow because they won't even touch the riser. Feathers can easily be treated to withstand water, but even an untreated water soaked feather can fly very well. Even a dramatically damaged feather will fly well. A damaged feather will fly much better than a damaged vane. BUT, you do you and enjoy the flight of the arrow. That's all that matters.
Been trying trad vanes in 4 fletch. Arrow is tuned perfectly bare shaft but I out these on and I’m getting a ton of strike plate contact. Like it’s peeling my strike plate on the edge in 2 spots. Any advise?
Have you ever had vanes cause the arrow to move up and down? I normally shoot feathers but tried a few arrows that have a little bit higher spine with vanes and it causes the arrow to wiggle up and down when shot.
I had durability issues with the tradvanes. Switched to just low profile Vanetec V Max vanes shooting off a Hoyt stick on . I 4 fletch 3 inch vanes. Im a bit slower with the heavier vanes. I struggled with feathers because broadhead stabilization was off when they were wet. I got wobble in my arrow flight and I did not like that. Im not "trad" anymore apparently but I dont really care lol... I shoot a single sight pin too on a bow that my grandpa shot in the 60s with the same sight pin ...
@@EthanPageHunter exactly. I'm not competing so I don't really care. If I was competing I'd make changes but I don't think deer are that concerned about how my bow looks lol.
In my own experience, I have seen plastic vanes destroy wooden arrow rests over time. I started with plastic vanes. They were cutting a groove into the wood of my bow and even the decorative leather with all the shooting I was doing. Then I went with feathers and I never looked back. This was 16+ years ago, so I don't know if there are new plastics with are more forgiving on wood. If I were to start using plastic vanes again I would use it with a bow with a handle made from modern material or at least have the arrow rest be reinforced with a modern material to protect the wood of the bow.
Feathers should extend from the arrow as far as the arrow is wide. Most arrows with feathers have feathers that are way too big for the arrow... So more effect from the air for sure...
Hey I have to ask, but do you live on the tippicanoe river in indiana? Your yard looks identical to my grandparents yard they use to have. I know it’s a weird question but I couldn’t help but ask.
fWIW, rear weight stiffens not weakens spines. You may have lighter fletches but you are running four not three so weight is a bit acedemic as is claiming less surface area for water to sit on. Not trying to persuade you either way. I use both. Both are great. Hunting I'd use trad vanes. Target I use feathers. I don't shoot targets in the rain....
You do have to tune based off of the number, size and material for sure cause it will effect it (I do prefer a touch on the stiff end). Another added beny to the vanes, those four way less than three feathers. For target I absolutely agree. Some Vegas shooters even use feathers.
Fletch feathers are very forgiving wet, dirt clogged or partially ripped off they fly. I’ve tried soaking an arrow over night and shot it it the morning. Without shaking it out it flew just fine. I’m saying water doesn’t effect a feather fletch.
I think all the things that you're saying are true. Accept the part about it, knocking it. Because your arrow is on the bow before the deer comes the right way. You hardly ever get a second shot, and if you do, you have an index on the Knox so you don't have to look so that part is somewhat erroneous. But thanks for a great presentation on those. They are great. Lefty
@BackwardsHatNation Maybe you can show how your rest and side plate is setup. I am shooting straight off a leather rest and side plate on my recurve and calf hair on my longbow. Maybe just take some pics and throw them up on your community posts. Heck you might even have a video on it.
I have the Easton legacy arrows, 400 spine 31", they are made in China and I don't like the wrap/fake wrap, I think it affects the performance of the arrow. And those arrows, seem like they have crappy feathers. I just built some Easton 6.5 match arrow shafts, True flight 4" feathers, they seem like nicer quality feathers.
If you are talking arrow tuning then you are talking modern archery... IMO... Archery existed since the stone age, but the modern style of target archery came about in Victorian Britain in the late 1800s and that style is the common style taught today with its focus on set distances and equipment tuning and a set way of shooting..
Even Native American understand arrow flight characteristics. Some many Eastern and Western tribes used cane or mule fat for the back 2/3 of the arrow and hard wood for the front 1/3. The extent it’s taken to may perhaps be modern but the principle of arrow tune is ancient. Thanks for the comment 🤙🏼
Those turkeys you were hunting can stand out in the rain all day and when they need to fly they do so perfectly ! So do my 5 inch feathers. Go ahead and buy you self a compound bow !!
If your gear isn't tuned very well, then a larger feather will help compensate for the poor flight you may be getting. If you "suck" then you're probably better off doing some bareshaft tuning along with shooting with shorter fletching so as not to hide your mistakes, and just practice a lot more...then you'll get better over time.
The present thinking is that the bow came to North American form Asia around 3000 bc. I don’t know if I believe that either. Scientist for some reason aren’t able to believe that native people from north or South American where able to invent or develop for themself. They most likely developed it themself.
I switched about a year ago or so. I found my nocking point had to be lifted.Its almost 3/4 inch now. You are right about arrow speed. Have a great day!
Great information and having shot a stick some 40 plus yrs. I have to agree with you 100%, Some folks are not susceptible to change, that's bow hunting is all about, Keep it coming.
I've heard of spray lacquers, powders, etc being ways of really waterproofing feathers. AAE tradvanes are something I haven't played with yet but they sure do look neat and reliable. I've been considering going from 3 to 2 fletch and shooting three under. With a single bevel broadhead they'd have more than enough rotation and stability and even with field points it would probably hold true. Would be super neat to play with. Also, I think 3" feathers are such a game changer compared to having to shoot 4-5". I've had no problems with the shorter feathers they fly a tad faster and are quieter than the longer ones.
Absolutely
Feathers should be quiet, but I bet how they are treated these days might remove the microscopic properties that would make them more silent. Maybe we should be hunting with owl feathers?
@@EthanPageHunter did you test the noise with feathers cut to the same size as your vanes? As for visibility, fathers and vanes can be colored the same colors... Some traditions shoot unfletched arrows and some have very small feathers for better speed over longer distances... But even in the English longbow traditions, the fletching should not be as big as most sell them these days.. Techniques to send arrows straight from your bow without so much stabilization needed can be learned in a minute or two... We have instincts for archery, kind of like walking or running... we just have to work on those muscle groups, the nervous system pathways get stronger with regular use and intent... Pick up a basic bow with no arrow rest, do something like what Armin Hirmer calls "simple khatra", or what many longbow people call "pushing" on the bow when arrow is on inside... You will get the hang of natural archery in a shot or three... As long as the bow is easy to pull, easy to control, you can make even unfletched arrows fly so straight with a little practice or maybe super quick, it is like you get the hang of it all of a sudden... Thank the ancestors! ...At least from a scientific viewpoint...
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 I've actually wondered this too. The way they are grown is unlike any other feather it is fascinating. It's just illegal to use them unfortunately (in America)
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 I have done audible testing on feathers and they are definitely louder. I agree to an extent but there are generally still a lot more factors that go into a bare shaft flying straight. too stiff or too weak and it will ultimately fly sideways down range. This is where tune becomes critical. Yes arrows should require little fletching to steer them but in realty, not many are going to take the time to tune. thus the need for larger fletchings. not to mention the advantage of getting full pass through on animals with less than 40# with a good tune because that arrow is efficient.. most also dont need to shoot 60+ pound bows. its not necessary. But archery is ultimately what you make of it. I just like to do more with less and tinker to get there.
I have been looking at these for about a year now and you helped me to decide to switch, thank you.
They are best option out there if you are shooting an elevated shelf. I’ve never been super pleased with off the shelf flight. Only on a couple bows have I got good results off the shelf.
LET IT BE KNOWN I am not knocking anyone that uses feathers! In many ways, they cant be beat. And again....they look darn cool!
I have enough feathers to make about 35 dozen arrows but on a whim I've tried Trad Vanes and I like them. They are noticeably quieter, faster, and the price is less than half that of feathers. I shoot 3 fletch that I put on with a straight clamp. I don't know if I will switch completely to them, but I have one in the quiver for wet days.
The price is a point I didn’t even consider. The cost of gateways is insane..
Thank you for the information! You helped me decide on my setup this year.
Glad to help! Good luck!
Arrow flight is way more about properly tuning your arrow (shaft) to your bow and the biggest key to that is spine than the type of fletching you use. Proper spine is best found by bare shaft tuning by adjusting nock height and trimming the arrow very slightly over and over along with adjusting head weight. Feathers will not be damaged or worn with a properly tuned arrow because they won't even touch the riser. Feathers can easily be treated to withstand water, but even an untreated water soaked feather can fly very well. Even a dramatically damaged feather will fly well. A damaged feather will fly much better than a damaged vane. BUT, you do you and enjoy the flight of the arrow. That's all that matters.
@@ejesoriginal the information in this video was given that you have a properly tuned arrow. Thanks for the input though 🤙🏼
Been trying trad vanes in 4 fletch. Arrow is tuned perfectly bare shaft but I out these on and I’m getting a ton of strike plate contact. Like it’s peeling my strike plate on the edge in 2 spots. Any advise?
Spine. Only thing it can be.
Have you ever had vanes cause the arrow to move up and down? I normally shoot feathers but tried a few arrows that have a little bit higher spine with vanes and it causes the arrow to wiggle up and down when shot.
Trad vanes collapse just like feathers and won’t alter the flight of your arrow even off the shelf.
Good tune is a little more important for making these shine IMO
It’s the spine that’s affecting the flight. Try tuning bareshaft at 10-20m once you get them flying straight the fletching won’t be a problem
I had durability issues with the tradvanes.
Switched to just low profile Vanetec V Max vanes shooting off a Hoyt stick on .
I 4 fletch 3 inch vanes. Im a bit slower with the heavier vanes.
I struggled with feathers because broadhead stabilization was off when they were wet. I got wobble in my arrow flight and I did not like that.
Im not "trad" anymore apparently but I dont really care lol... I shoot a single sight pin too on a bow that my grandpa shot in the 60s with the same sight pin ...
If it works do it. “Trad” is an over rated thing that people get worked up over. Do you my friend.
@@EthanPageHunter exactly. I'm not competing so I don't really care. If I was competing I'd make changes but I don't think deer are that concerned about how my bow looks lol.
Thanks for all the info
Thanks for the view and support!
In my own experience, I have seen plastic vanes destroy wooden arrow rests over time.
I started with plastic vanes. They were cutting a groove into the wood of my bow and even the decorative leather with all the shooting I was doing.
Then I went with feathers and I never looked back.
This was 16+ years ago, so I don't know if there are new plastics with are more forgiving on wood.
If I were to start using plastic vanes again I would use it with a bow with a handle made from modern material or at least have the arrow rest be reinforced with a modern material to protect the wood of the bow.
I can see that. I only shoot them in elevated
Feathers should extend from the arrow as far as the arrow is wide. Most arrows with feathers have feathers that are way too big for the arrow... So more effect from the air for sure...
Hey I have to ask, but do you live on the tippicanoe river in indiana? Your yard looks identical to my grandparents yard they use to have. I know it’s a weird question but I couldn’t help but ask.
No worries. I live in Missouri.
fWIW, rear weight stiffens not weakens spines. You may have lighter fletches but you are running four not three so weight is a bit acedemic as is claiming less surface area for water to sit on. Not trying to persuade you either way. I use both. Both are great. Hunting I'd use trad vanes. Target I use feathers. I don't shoot targets in the rain....
You do have to tune based off of the number, size and material for sure cause it will effect it (I do prefer a touch on the stiff end). Another added beny to the vanes, those four way less than three feathers. For target I absolutely agree. Some Vegas shooters even use feathers.
How do you shoot them off the shelf ?
They shoot of the shelf with no issue. They are a collapsing vane not ridged like a normal plastic fletching.
dude..gamechanger! not to mention theyre cheaper!
Agreed 👍🏼
Fletch feathers are very forgiving wet, dirt clogged or partially ripped off they fly. I’ve tried soaking an arrow over night and shot it it the morning. Without shaking it out it flew just fine. I’m saying water doesn’t effect a feather fletch.
It does with a broadhead.
What's hair blowers
Hair dryer
I think all the things that you're saying are true. Accept the part about it, knocking it. Because your arrow is on the bow before the deer comes the right way. You hardly ever get a second shot, and if you do, you have an index on the Knox so you don't have to look so that part is somewhat erroneous. But thanks for a great presentation on those. They are great. Lefty
To each there own both will get the job done
For sure. I’ll be hunting with feathers this year.
Parabolic cut is more quiet and possible speed increase.
Could have been the sound of the release that made the turkey duck... You have no way of knowing...
Never tried the vanes.
Worth a try
@BackwardsHatNation Maybe you can show how your rest and side plate is setup. I am shooting straight off a leather rest and side plate on my recurve and calf hair on my longbow. Maybe just take some pics and throw them up on your community posts. Heck you might even have a video on it.
@@UncleDanBand64 they work with anything you got. I’m shooting off the shelf with Velcro rest now.
@BackwardsHatNation thanks, I will give it a try
I have the Easton legacy arrows, 400 spine 31", they are made in China and I don't like the wrap/fake wrap, I think it affects the performance of the arrow. And those arrows, seem like they have crappy feathers. I just built some Easton 6.5 match arrow shafts, True flight 4" feathers, they seem like nicer quality feathers.
Feathers are cooler 😎
If you are talking arrow tuning then you are talking modern archery... IMO... Archery existed since the stone age, but the modern style of target archery came about in Victorian Britain in the late 1800s and that style is the common style taught today with its focus on set distances and equipment tuning and a set way of shooting..
Even Native American understand arrow flight characteristics. Some many Eastern and Western tribes used cane or mule fat for the back 2/3 of the arrow and hard wood for the front 1/3. The extent it’s taken to may perhaps be modern but the principle of arrow tune is ancient. Thanks for the comment 🤙🏼
Spray silicone on feathers 👍
Those turkeys you were hunting can stand out in the rain all day and when they need to fly they do so perfectly ! So do my 5 inch feathers. Go ahead and buy you self a compound bow !!
It's not all about being up to date some of us want to be like the good old times
👍🏻🇨🇦
Deer squat at the sound of the bow being shot and not the arrow in flight.
@@allangilbert7011 I would have to disagree to great extent but thanks for watching and commenting.
They are pretty expensive
I could do without the rap music on your vids otherwise good content.
So, if you suck you should shoot feathers?
5” feathers will always provide greatest stability.
If your gear isn't tuned very well, then a larger feather will help compensate for the poor flight you may be getting. If you "suck" then you're probably better off doing some bareshaft tuning along with shooting with shorter fletching so as not to hide your mistakes, and just practice a lot more...then you'll get better over time.
Trad vanes are considerably heavier than feather fletching, NOT lighter.
I beg to differ there. Maybe comparing 3” feathers to 3” TVs. MAYBE. Depends on feather perhaps but that’s not the data I’ve gathered.
People associate bows with Native Americans. However it was Europeans that introduced the bow to the Native Americans.
The present thinking is that the bow came to North American form Asia around 3000 bc. I don’t know if I believe that either. Scientist for some reason aren’t able to believe that native people from north or South American where able to invent or develop for themself. They most likely developed it themself.