How to Accurately Diagnose the Codependent and Narcissist In Any Relationship. Expert Instruction.
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- Опубліковано 12 тра 2020
- In this video I explain how, I completely gutted the explanation and diagnostic criteria for codependency and pathological narcissism. With this new and improved diagnostic criteria (explanation), I demonstrate how to distinguish the codependent from narcissist in any Human Magnet Syndrome compelled relationship - one that comes together via romantic "chemistry".
I also explain how to determine such dysfunctional roles when one partner is a Covert Narcissist (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) or Sociopath (Antisocial Personality Disorder). In addition, I demonstrate this diagnostic protocol with codependents / people with Self-Love Deficit Disorder who have been gaslit and/or pathologically manipulated to behave and/or believe like they are the narcissist.
ABOUT ROSS
Ross Rosenberg M.Ed., CADC, is Self-Love Recovery Institute’s CEO and primary contributor. His internationally recognized expertise includes pathological narcissism, narcissistic abuse, and attachment trauma. Ross’s “Codependency Cure™ Treatment Program provides innovative and results-oriented treatment. His expert educational and inspirational seminars have earned him international acclaim, including his 23 million UA-cam video views and 240K subscribers. In addition to being featured on national TV and radio, his “Human Magnet Syndrome” books sold over 150K copies and are in 12 languages. Ross provides expert testimony/witness services.
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The only way to heal is to walk away. The narcissist will let you down and hurt you time and time again. They have no empathy. My ex enjoyed hurting me. He was more alive when I was hurt. He was never wrong. Never. Never sorry for the lies and betrayal. I have left him. After years of depression and wrecked sense of self, I am so proud to go on.
You got this.
You did the right thing … in the end there is simply no other option
After 40 years I'm finally seeing this and realizing I can no longer stay.
Our culture teaches us to “never quit”.
But walking away is the best skill EVER to develop.
Co dependants can’t walk away . They have mental problems too .
After the 3rd LTR w/a malignant narcissist left me homeless & so psychologically broken I could barely function, I found a simple sol'n to being a narc magnet: I no longer have relationships w/people. No lovers, no friends, no acquaintances. It's easier to sleep at night when I can close BOTH eyes...
mee too, im fine richt now. like to stay there (smile)
I have been saying I am just fine by myself, it is in the (narc) relationship that scares me and makes me run. (Yet they always come after me).
This is where I find myself now, & it's hard..
bc I really don't want to live that way, but I don't know what else to do
Thats not a cure, just a band aid on the wound.
That's how I'm feeling these days, only people I want close are those I've known for years who I know 100% aren't narcs 🤷♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️
Self-love is the cure and the prevention.
It really is
Oh yes indeed !!!! Trauma has affected me in many ways !!!! Alack of self love is the root cause of all suffering in this universe!!!! The antidote for codependency is self love baby !!!! We're more than enough Miss!!!! Take care and be well ...
@@queensigal would you put an oxygen mask straight away on the person sitting next to you before you put on yourself, if the aeroplane hit turbulence?
So true
I love myself tremendously I don’t think this is it. Our programming and karma keep us in same loop!
This explains so much for me. I just knew I was a narcissistic and was devastated about it. I thought because I was controlling I was a narcissistic. But understand codependency so much better now. I wasn’t controlling to hurt anymore or get supply it was to get love, respect and save my ex from himself and also to stop the pain.
Thank you. Because every single time I realize I’m a codependent I see things about narcissism that align with me and then I get super sad again. But this comment helped me. I never did anything to hurt or have a supply, I just wanted validation, love and to simply get back from people what I didn’t have. Also I attached myself to people who I thought felt the same as me (lacking love,validation,respect) and I’d give until my hearts content. Then I would explode and have cycles of behavior that was super unlike my usual nice self and it was because I was constantly getting and never getting. After that - I’d apologize, cry and try to win people back again. Like please love me don’t leave me, let me prove that I’m worth staying with/being a friend to
Thank you for your comment! This fits me exactly!
I don’t feel I’m self love deficient. I think there are people who can fall into narcissistic relationships and still have love for self. One of the things I found was that I ignored the red flags from the covert narcissist. I ignored them because I was desirous of a relationship at that time.
It can be easy to miss the signs can't it
I you loved yourself why would you ignore red flags. Typically the relationship with a narcissist works only when the other partner is codependent.
Well...I know for myself, when young!, I was cocky. Now, however; I was tricked into helping someone who was in a self dug hole, financially, physically and maybe emotionally...but maybe not! I knew better but invested myself to help. ..my bad..
@@larrywhittemore9362 cocky is not self love. It is a defensive system designed to over compensate for the fact that you don't love yourself.
@@larrywhittemore9362o you played your role 😂? Watch the one on why codependents always fall for narcs (you'd be the narcissistic person in my humble opinion...) hear me out bc if you have a falsely inflated sense of self and used "cockiness" to mask that your identity was not built on solid ground.....and you were the "provider" to a incompetent person as you have essentially described them...
Then 1) as a child you confused your own inner psyche and likely due to a controlling overbearing mother that never truly gave quality time and was highly doting but highly critical... which is confusing to a child ... they don't understand when the cold nature comes through from the mother that also seems to care so much ... (or a father that beat you down constantly but approved of all of your achievements and gave you praise when you succeeded again, confusion) confusion is the secret ingredient when combined with over abuse or neglect that creates a more narcissistic personality...
now I'm not saying that you have NPD... like DSM certifiably but by all accord your statement was very arrogant and not from the heart that is probably unable to voice itself and integrate fully w your ego.
Because
2) you are likely used to making declarations and conclusions ab very confusing things in childhood bc you are an assertive male ....so you have boldly concluded that you "were tricked" by this person ... but again confusion is real when you are a child of a toxic family system... so what if you tricked yourself by allowing your assumptions to be green flags off the bat and then having too much ( pride ? Need to feel like a hero? ) to shift the cognitive dissonance as it played out to be a very different situation...because to believe you were essentially the only one to help this person would be false assuming they tricked you they have tricked others or you just assumed that role and they willingly obliged ... hut taking on that responsibility as your "job" as a man... is a grandiose admission especially when the reality appears that no matter the efforts you gave they were not what the person Actually was in need of (I e resources therapy to help them gain self respect responsibility and independence....or emotional support that was unwavering and not based on them "digging themselves out" or ...or... being rescued ... by you. Ti compound that self motivated help is the resentment you have for your misguided efforts and the resentment they feel for letting you lead . They were probably pouring into you emotionally and admiring you upon the beginning of your efforts but ended up bitter and resentful when you confirmed their issues w trust and abandonment by coming in as the white knight only to give them solutions that put your need to be the hero in your way under your conditions or to ....devastatingly for the codependent....ultimately leave .....w no success in actually helping that individual thrive (plus clearly also some added resentment from subjective blame on your end and shame on theirs -surrounding it being their "fault" for their "self dug hole") this further perpetuates both individuals lacking self worth in very different looking ways .... you are leaving them with only more opportunities to mistrust genuine altruistic unconditional love from others and a higher need to covertly manipulate to get their "needs" met by others without speaking them in clear cut self defined and empowered ways leaving so much room to make excuses and even more need to manipulate and/or play the victim... and they are leaving you to feel like you gave all you had and failed them because Theyyy are self dug and ... which is unnecessary self loathing... and that you are in fact the "victim" but the truth is neither of you are probably all the way in the weeds on these personality types ...you probably both exhibit some cluster B like toxic traits one of them and the most toxic of all feeling the need to find blame in loving relationships for the failures of both individuals... I would really search deep and also look into CPTSD bc it manifests very overwhelmingly close to NPD in one variation mostly seen in males ... however it is not a cluster B and is hope for requiring yourself there .... and if you love that person truly i would consider telling them that after seeing a therapist who can help you find the right boundaries and ways to give to them without tapping into your own childhood triggers to the point where it flares up any narc traits you have.....blame is the root of it all bc it creates shame and entitlement...shame and power are the life essence of fear... which is the matter of the "dark energy" in this world spirituality...."he who blames others has a long way to go. He who blames himself is halfway there... he who blames no one has arrived."
The Best Book I've ever read in my life... @ 55 yrs old and a Grandmother of 4 it is an understatement to say it was the tipping point of my healing and recovery. This might not make sense but while reading it I had never felt that kind of pain in my life yet so relieved. My life FINALLY made sense to me. That was 10 months ago. I've never been this happy, this aware & this clear of who I am, who others are and best of all I know exactly where others belong in OR out of My Life 💞 Thank you with all My Heart..Your Lifes Journey is helping save so many of us.
Thank you Arlene. I'm so glad you liked my book
Arlene, it certainly makes sense!
If your trying to "make sense of it all" like I was in my life then this is the must have book. Let's just saying I'm divorcing a greater narcissist...if you've read the Human Magnet Syndrome you'll know exactly how HUGE this step was in my life💗
@@RossRosenberg Thank you very much for your Book.
From 7'to 9'40 is my life.
From 12' to 13' is the story.
Psychotherapist where I live are not enough informed I 'm afraid.
Lucky that you help so much.
Many thanks.
@@RossRosenberg What is the name of the book Arlene Dora read to help her, that you wrote?
Of all the narcissist/codependent gurus on UA-cam you are the absolute best. Believe me because I am obsessed with listening to each and everyone. What you have to say truly hits home and makes sense. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I finally have some closure. I finally know who I am. I finally know who my ex was and the ex before that, a bit too late. Better late than never. What a tragic circus life is. The good news is for the first time in my life I’ve been waking up in the morning all alone and I feel great.
Thank you so much for sharing and for your support. Keep up the good work!
My ex told me he couldn't be a narcissist because he'd discussed it with a private psychologist.
This doesn't convince me. Narcissists come across initially as charming, grounded, caring individuals. With no disrespect to psychologists, I'm sure many have been hoodwinked before - if ever - reaching a diagnosis of some significantly narcissistic clients.
My recent ex has just told me the same thing!!! She says that it was me that convinced her that she was a narcissist
I don’t know you might be the narcissist , narcissists rarely seek therapy
😳 the beautiful ones . I use call them soul crushers think bout it !
You perfectly explained the dynamic between myself (the SLDD) and the ex-wife covert narcissist. Her persona is kind and caring, she has fooled everyone. At the end, she portrayed herself as the victim of me and everybody believed her despite people knowing me for 20 years.
I have been researching narcissism and codependency for 20 months but you just combined the two and it was amazing and provided so much validation.
I will have to buy your book. I haven't been able to read and digest for years (brain fog) but now I must force myself. Thank you so much Sir.
Isn’t it crazy Adam how they fool everyone but have the audacity to call us the actors (projection) the good news is we are better (wisdom) leaving the relationship, they never grow and eventually others will see just like you did 🙏
You just explained the culmination of the last 20 years of my life. Only 6 months out from my discovery of her cheating with a married man that I found out she had been keeping in touch with him for 15 years I divorced her with great pain in my soul. I remember a couple years ago realizing she was different inside. Once I saw her, I couldn't not see her. She realized I could see her now so she nuked the whole family. Then claimed victimization and that I was secretly always psychologically abusive. Have sons 14 & 5 ,& Raised her daughter all those years.
@@virtualmoralityRealize it has nothing to do with you. Harder said than done. But realize this. Or remind yourself of this fact until you intuitively KNIW it. It is not a reflection of your worth, ability, or competency. Research or think through to understand that it is never you. It’s is another person’s insecurities. Need for additional attention and VALIDATION. Who places so much emphasis and need on validation? What kinds of people do you think? …. Exactly. This is not YOU or an issue you caused or could have impacted. Emphasis on “additional” too. Or else she could have realized this connection with another person and left and ended the relationship with you. But she didn’t. This is why it has nothing to do with you. But more of a result of a negative, fear based energy that’s cultivated inside of a human. That energy, of course can wreak havoc all around it, IF WE’RE NOT AWARE. That’s how trauma, evil, negativity, depravity, violence, hate, etc. cultivates. Realize it is not you. Not this. Staying where you were disregarded and unloved is where you should work to take accountability. Get there eventually. But not this. Immoral, betraying, corrupt, selfish, deceitful, dangerous, illegitimacy, shameful, act. The act is horrendous, out of alignment, and of a very low vibration. That’s why it hurts us so badly. But know that energy, unless coming from yourself- should not be owned or accounted for. Have some empathy towards her if u need to, (or get angry, or disgusted) to truly see that it is all her doing. This negative. Not you. Use this to build compassion for yourself and build towards self love and acceptance.
@sperez3275 Thank you very, very much. Still hurts like hell every day. Many nights and days even, I slept to have my brain not think. Until all my dreams were as if awake. Then I had to get up. Her family apologized more than she ever had considering she hasn't. I worked side by side with her father and both brothers for over a decade doing Ironwork. The whole family, both sides were blindsided. Our children , we homeschooled use to tell me she wasn't the same when I was at work. Found myself feeling like their defense attorney many a days. She knew I came from a terrible divorced family whereby my mother cheated on all 3 husband's she had. Then to do to me was traumatic. She'd asked 5 different times to work things out and the first 3 I was elated, like all the pain was gone. Then watched as she gleefully skipped away only to change her mind a few days later, crushing me again. I asked her "who the hell are you?" She said, "I don't know". Never knew what trauma bonding was till my divorce. Looking for answers as if I may have been a narcissist and not even knew it. That maybe I did abuse her and I was a monster somehow, too get myself some help for hurting someone I loved and somehow catch myself still living the idea of. She doesn't appear to have that problem. I've barely seen a tear from her. When i did it was followed with pity for herself. Not the babies. I almost had to be hospitalized , thought I was having a heart attack. My oldest son found me basically dying and called 911. Her? Acting like she's 19, getting tattoos, hanging out with little girls half her age partying down with zero remorse. All while posting religious quotes about God and his transformation plan for her on Facebook, where she has all her supporters cheering her on as a victim. I have most of custody of my boys at least. Can't figure out why I can't hate her more often than I do. Still catch myself having a good day then realizing again my current circumstances. Like my brain still thinks I'm married so I'm happy at different points of the day, but then I remember again. My oldest boy is beside himself. Trying to focus on him and his brother so their character isn't mentally fractured. Again, THANK YOU. I appreciate it greatly. Take care.
I’m 67 and have learnt something today. Thanks
Glad to help Bruce
So a selfish person needs an unselfish person.
So true. My parents!
Somehow I think he's saying much, much more than that🤕
Well condensed Miss🙂👌🏻
Wow. I have gone through all the five stages of an SLD with my depressed narcissist husband. First actively, trying to change him, to passive, to finally ending up accepting who he is and becoming an anorexic SLD, where I’ve learned, in addition to making him happy, I make myself happy as well. I don’t seek it from him anymore. It satisfies me to see him happy. I love him from the depths of my soul and just accept that this is how it is. Opposites truly attract and the pull is tremendous.
This is why I reject a relationship with a normal woman, her normal, natural ways scare the hell out of me because I have been surrounded with dysfunction over half a century. From my earliest memories.
I loved my worst enemy to a fault four decades never giving her permission to hurt me. My love and trust shattered now she hoovers. I eat her food, enjoy the sex denied in a sexless marriage so long which she uses effectively presently to keep me from moving on. I take her good, dress and go. I will never love her again and attracted to her yes, angry at myself for going to her afterward I seek to somehow break the cycle as not doing the same things over is the only possible way to achieve a different result.
Is healing even a possibility, serious doubts fill my thoughts.
You deserve to be loved and I wish you the best, and the peace I enjoy when not around her even for a few days.
So it is extremely dangerous to start an intimate relationship before knowing someone’s environment. Or to say it shortly: Dating is overestimated. 🤷🏽♀️
An SOB will always be an SOB
It's painful to realize all of the covert narcissists who have been in my life masquerading as genuinely caring people, but it's equally painful to realize how self-love deficient I was and how that lack of self-empowerment and confidence attracted these people in the first place....also very empowering, though. At least most people who are SLD WANT to heal..real narcissists have no real incentive to heal or change because they know there will always be an endless line of unsuspecting victims. I actually have an narc ex-girlfriend who has been drunk calling/texting me for 2.5 years in the hopes that she can suck more of my blood. I have ignored each and every one of her many attempts. She does not know I am now greatly healed and aware. She does not know I see her true colors. Thanks for your videos and further clarifying better ways to detect these relationship dynamics.
Thank you for listening and for sharing. 🙏
Thank you so much for shedding light on this. I have such a hard time believing I am NOT the narcissist...very much needed insight
You are so welcome.
My husband was usually great about doing whatever I asked. There were a few times when I asked him to do something around the house that needed to be done, and he would act like he was fine with doing it, but I could tell he was bitter about it. After watching this video, the big realization that I had was that he was always operating to serve himself, but if I asked him to go somewhere or do something he normally would say yes. Otherwise he was just in his own boat or he was in our boat but I was rowing. I always found it quite odd that he would never offer something that I liked or needed.
So he came across as a attentive giving person, but it was only when someone approached him to ask, otherwise he was the center of his world. I also found it quite strange how he could barely remember things that I talked about previously. I believe that he is an expert at acting like he's listening and caring.
Thank you for this video, I have purchased your online course and look forward to going through it.
After being gaslit for nearly 17 years by my stbxh, I was wondering what was wrong with me. My stbxh is an alcoholic and untreated bipolar. He also has patterns of covert narcissism. After listening to your videos, I realize now that I'm an active/cerebral codependent. I was constantly giving, constantly trying to figure out how to fix our r/s, reading self help books, running myself ragged to make my H happy only to end up completely exhausted with 2 autoimmune diseases.
hope jou are doing fine!
Soulsister, same with me
Same with me
So relatable
Prayers of healing to you & the world in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, Amen. God bless ❤
Love this! Look for the LRC so true. Also note there is no M for Money 🤑. Narcs say they're good because they give money.
So true
My mother has/had the whole world fooled about who she really is, esp. pertaining to my father. I know see how she alienated us from him & his family. It’s so sad. He passed in 2017 before I’d become aware fully at what a true beast my mother really is.
It makes me so sad.
Your theory coheres very well, in my opinion. The maldistribution of love, respect, and caring is a reliable diagnostic indicator.
After being 20 years together, I begged him to start a parent/ couple’s therapy with me. It took 3 years of horrible therapy, until the therapist diagnosed himas a covert narcissist. Although I told the therapist from the start, that Iam an overly emotional co-dependent, I knew because I had years of therapy experience, it took 3 fatiguing years. Now, after so many years of living with a covert, I know them inside out. It is hell and back and all over again. I am well educated and very reflected, yet I can´t overcome the "gas lighting, projection, passive-aggressive, victim playing trauma" I have from him. This is a wound, that will never heal, because I know, I am the sick compatible part and it can happen again anytime. ALL therapists should get your training - non-negotiable.
This is clarifying so much for me. This is for sure why so many codependents believe they may be the narcissist. I will have to check out your book. This video is my introduction to you. Thank you.
So the fact that I am trying to problem solve, understand why and how they are they way they are and am the one who is the only one wanting and giving and knowing i am not coming from a vindictive place- but a place of what I believe goodness, a place where I want this live reciprocated - makes me the codependent? I have been working on my codependency for three years- but I get worried that I may be covert- but I also understand the cross overs…. I think i need to take a step back from over analysing myself 😣 I also know that I do better when I am not in relationships- with my goals, health etc- as I end up making another my focus- which is such a sad reality x
I have been working on Self-Love and Self -Compassion. These videos continue to help me during years of healing. The healing is slow but I'm building a new, foundation. Once the foundation begins to appear, the growth appears like a seedling rises from the ground. It takes time. It's amazing. Buds of Joy. Thank you!
This is really good to hear.
LRC Distribution is such a valuable framework. Thank you.
I wish every therapist, in every situation, used this as part of an initial assessment and revisited it regularly to reassess and track progress. The world would be a much happier and more productive place if they did. As it stands the majority of "talk therapy" is worthless or counterproductive to the "customer." (ask me how I know...)
so true, I was retraumatized by my therapist. She had no idea about co-dependency/narcissism and told me that I was a frustrated housewife and that I am the problem. As a person with severe self love disorder I nearly was disturbed not only by my psychopathic husband but also by the therapist. I nearly tipped over. Videos like this saved my life, so that I was able to manage to quit the "relationship" to my husband. I gave all LRS and never got anything in reverse. This is so eye-opening, and another missing part of the puzzle.
@@spring-089 It's crazy how little diagnosis is done in therapy. I guess that's because they really don't have adequate training. It's like going to a chiropractor complaining of a neck strain and all they do is work on your foot! Glad you are on the mend and realizing how little help most of the world is in the narcissist dynamics. It takes huge progress just to trust yourself after years of gaslighting.
I like this approach. Narcissist and SLD are in opposite direction but the are on the flip side of the same vile coin.
I am weary of the thousands of people and videos that speak about those terrible evil narcissists. It's almost like they are not blaming themselves.
I was the victim of a series three bad relationships. I was also one of the conductors of my own bad behavior.
Just had to say that.
Or those 99% of us in the non-psychologist world, “Givers” and “Takers”.
The manipulators and the manipulatable. Takes two active participants to dance.
Yeah children are responsible for being gaslit by their narcissistic parents and it's the kids fault they develops disorders from it - that's your logic.
@@13jorino sure, how you decide to regulate those emotions are your response. However,
People are also responsible for how they treat you even if they don't take accountability for it.
@@13jorino it was sarcastic impression of you.
Its not fun if you have you explain it though.
I had no idea what I was experiencing. I am out now but it took years for me to figure it out.
This is an excellent video! Thanks. It was your covert narcissist video that first enlightened me about my marital situation. As you spoke of the covert narc a bell rang with every description. Lack of empathy, silent treatment etc... This video gives it more clarity. Wow. I’m getting a whole new life!
Holy smokes. I will have to listen to this another few times, just to get all the golden nuggets of info out! Thank you so very much, Ross! I just have to say, too often do I see SLD's that are confused and wondering if they infact, are the narcissist in the relationship. THIS answers so much! Please keep going with your amazing work and research! Thanks and blessings to you!
Glad it was helpful!
Wow well spoken sir!!! Biblically speaking sir trauma has affected me in many ways in my life ..... Iam more than enough !!!!
I was told I was imagining things..That I didn't know what I was talking about..That I was crazy etc..I was the person who was responsible for everyone's bad choices in their eyes. I am on my healing journey to self Love. Thank you for your videos and your book, which I am now reading..
O...k...this clears a lot up for me! I gave been researching whether I am a narcissist based on being gaslight by a true narcissist and this REALLY concretes reality. My goodness it's so clear!! Thank you Doctor. I am SO glad you mentioned that exact scenario
Thanks for sharing! This other video may be helpful as well: ua-cam.com/video/QUreWOILAvk/v-deo.html
thank you so much dear Ross....
wonderfully articulated & so much help ...
Excellent explanations regarding reverse diagnosis. Much appreciated
6:20 This was going through my head... when you mentioned that Love Respect Care should be mutual in a healthy relationship... I realized that narcissist are like opportunist.. the ends justify the means ALL THE TIME. So they obligate you... So I was thinking how funny would it be if I was just straight forward with him : 1. I don't feel comfortable in a new relationship to give Love Care Respect without really knowing you... this guy is like a care taker... so of course I believe he will be passive aggressive with me... start being meticulous on my "extra benefits" oh and best of all we are in a poor situation... so he will get to use that excuse... such as ANYTHING just because I don't know what kind of person he is... he is a preacher I think.. he keeps saying I should join his church... it dawned on me recently... I shouldn't trust him... he came from prison.. I started to realize when I was talking with myself that he would be very angry....and think less of me... not that he doesn't already lol.. and is just trying to set me up in a wrestling ring(his church yes he owns a church) what is funny is he looks like a luchadora (mexican wrestler). He is so obtuse.
Ahhh! You said the word “invisible”. Wow. Major revelation.
Brilliant. Thank you Mr. Rosenberg for sharing your useful wisdom.
This should be worth watching !
So simple once you understand it. Your videos are so helpful!
Super interesting and the LRC distribution totally makes sense ! 👍💕
Why would you want to live that life? You get way more out of life with honey than you do with vinegar! I don't know it just seems to me that life is to short to be mean and lie your way through this life. All it does it build to more lies, more sleeping around, more pain, more anger, the list goes on. Why would you want to keep doing that to yourself?
Like to my x wife and I could have had it all as far as a happy life. However she couldn't stop lying, cheating, manipulating, screaming, hitting ect.. finally I just tapped out and started ignoring it all. I couldn't take one more second of it.
You are literally saving my life by revealing it and making me a chance to heal my broken pieces. Thank you!
Pretty smart. Operational method of diagnosis. Pretty easy to apply. Smart
Excellent work 😎. Thank you 😊
The champion of all codependents is this man. Empowering us and validating us, in ways we would never gain from the emotional manipulator. A thousand thanks.
Thank you Susanna for the support!
It’s absolutely clear now 🙏 thank you so much
Thank you for an excellent explanation.
Thank you Ross. Your videos are really helpful to me in navigating these waters that seem to well up around us as we unwind our own image of ourselves. Appreciate your viewpoint.
Thank you. I just found your videos recently and have been finding them very helpful. This video is great and leads me to believe I fall under the "gaslit SLDD" category. I want to convince myself that I am a narcissist but when I think about how the LRC is distributed in my relationships- it is always imbalanced; where Im giving and giving and giving. I get burnt out and then disappear once I realize my efforts are not reciprocated.
I'm in the process of healing from trauma and abuse. I'm finding it very difficult to understand how to love myself. I cannot even conceptualize it. I will be looking more into your site and resources you have available.
Thanks for the informative video.
I appreciate this so much. I ordered your book and I look forward to reading it. I’m a psychology student who wants to specialize in this area. Oddly enough, I’m also a narc magnet as I divorced a malignant narc and am actively trying to move past my current covert narc. I’m also the cerebral codependent (I almost died when that was mentioned lol). You were recommended to me through a FB group specifically for healing narc magnets. Glad they did!!!
This is EXCELLENT!!! Thankyou so much. I’ve been really struggling how to figure out the persona, so many narcissists are so convincing.. the speech scattered with reference to emotion, care. The teary eyes to perform sensitivity.. but all the while it jars with very contrasting ambitions and life philosophy.
I think this is going to help me alot
This video was gold. After 1 yr of research this consisely put it all together. I feel courageous, prepared, and free. God bless you.
Brilliant.
Thank you.......this really helps
Ross I appreciate your sharing this. It raises more questions (!) but I am grateful. Thank you.
So glad it was helpful.
Thank you for not allowing yourself to be manipulated by the parner or family
Mine manipulated every therapist we had.
I got to witness my therapist process her own feelings in seconds as my ex had no choice but to admit he had been lying the whole time.. it was a sight to be seen. I wish I could process my feelings that fast.
It was the moment I had been waiting for..
thank you Ross, need to take your book out again and put the work in .Brilliant video as usual.
You are welcome, glad you liked it!
Thank you for this brilliant advice on how to determine who is who by looking at the dostribution of Love Respect and Caring in a relationship. Who is giving and who is taking and to what extent. Invaluable. Thank you.
Thank you for explaining
Very insightful. Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
I'm watching this video and I just want to cry, I'm grateful for all the knowledge you have, no one explains it better than u, he really made me the bad person to the point I accepted it as well just because I get angry and scream . So if I really was angry I must be abusive towards him . I can't believe this, I stay away from your videos because it's hard to listen to but I had to click this one..... Is there a way to contact you online? I live in another continent from you.
Thank you very much !!
Damn, I used to watch these videos and get so confused and there it was in 3 words the answer I knew but as explained further I kept attaching the wrong traits to it thinking it wasn't possible to still be on that side w/ the " negative traits "... which coincidentally led to me being told shortly after I noticed the overlaps that maybe everything I was studying and trying to understand was being perceived wrong ... removed any sense of grounding i had
Great vid..great diagnostic tool..agree with all except I have witnessed the narcissist to narcissist magnet so don’t fully agree with the opposite magnet attraction in totality but in general yes.
I have also seen this. But I have never seen a relationship of that sort last as a long term ( > 2 years) relationship.
I’m getting this book right now!
This helps. Examples would make it even better. Thanks 😀
Glad it was helpful Robert!
Grate explanation bro!
Glad it was helpful Daniel.
My mom tried to do that to me where she flipped the script, and played the victim, and acted like I was a narc. I always fought back. Which made her try to prove it more. Which made me fight back more. And that's how I handle manipulative people. If they're going after me, I go after them more. Even if I don't "win", the win is that they associate me now with personal discomfort and I've done something to ruin their foundation. They are never completely the controlling one or the uncontrolled one. I don't have to see the results to know I made an impact. Them being untouchable geniuses is a big dumb lie. They cry about being humbled and like the rest of us have to be, and it greatly disturbs them to not always win. They're always thinking about the fights they didn't win. Some people say "if you make them mad, they may 'retaliate.'" Yeah duh. The thing is I would retaliate more and nobody seems to worry or understand that. I'm not going to change the laws of fairness because it doesn't register for someone that they're unfair. I'll try to help them and make it more obvious, but if they want to go down with their ship, even better. I don't make special exceptions for pompous assholes.
The LRC method is very liberating. It seems so logical and cuts through the facade of of the manipulator and the manipulated. I have spent the last five years of my life with a woman who I thought was The perfect love of my life. After the last 3 1/2 years of unimaginable hell, I am convinced she is a very high spectrum covert narcissist. I have only recently come to consider the possibility that I have been codependent. (I understand you don’t necessarily agree with that term, and I think I agree with you). When I look back at these last 3 1/2 years through your spectrum of LRC, the fog seems to be lifting to reveal what appears to be very clear pattern that you describe. Well I tried so very hard to control the situation, it is very clear that I was the giver of LRC not the receiver. Thank you for your work, I am going to read your books and absorb this more thoroughly. But I wanted to let you know that this helps. Thank you
Thanks so much for sharing Robert. If interested in more of Ross's resources, please visit www.selfloverecovery.com/ and humanmagnetsyndrome.com/hmsblog/. Keep up the good work!
I love the way Ross reframes things. For all the content I've been reading, watching, listening to, this is something that helps it all click in a different way. That being said, what was the name of your book again? I can't for the life of me remember. . . .
Glad it was helpful! You can find Ross's book in different versions here: www.selfloverecovery.com/collections/human-magnet-syndrome-books
I've been all of these types of Self Love Deficit Disorder. Predominantly Passive, Cerebral, and Anorexic.
I have BPD. I am not a liar. I manage my BPD as best as possible. It has had a profound impact on my life trajectory. But I’m right where God has planned me to be.
Thank you now I know why I'm fat being abused as a young child I thought that gaining weight would make the grown men stop looking at me and stop trying to touch me by nine both of my parents were dead and my weight got worse being raised by my co dependent sister and her narcissist husband made life horrible I walked out on my narcissist I had enough there was no helping him
I had never heard of anyone else doing that. I did that recently for the first time in my life at 46 started over eating and gaining weight because I stopped caring and hoped my narcissist would find me unattractive. Didn't work at ALL 😔
It's very important as far as I'm concerned for you to be true to yourself even if it makes other people upset and it's taking me over 60 years to see this but finally I seen it better late than never right
Nobody wants to lose their own identity when they start finding it later in life..
You don't want anyone to take that away from you. You suffered enough to get this far to discover the real you. And honesty is the only way to find the real you. Anything else is a distortion to make somebody else happy. It's amazing when you start standing up for yourself in a kind loving way not getting angry and just being firm and saying to the person who's upset with you I'm sorry I don't agree with you.. and I don't want to argue with you. I've heard your opinion and I have my opinion I value your opinion but right now I choose to do it my way. If they're anything of a friend they will respect you for who you are and what you stand up for. I'd rather have five good friends than a thousand lousy ones.
Ya, i am drowning in grief all the time. I know my wife is a covert and it makes me so sad. I used to just go crazy, because she was literally making me crazy. Now that i know alot more about this subject and what it is that i am actually going threw, its like a veil has been lifted. But now I've gone from horrified and bewildered to just sorrow. We've been threw so much and i love her more than life itself. And shes killing me, i dare say literally. My health is soo poor anymore. I just feel dizzy lightheaded like im on a ride at the carnival.
Watch DrRamani's youtube on how narcissists are like magicians. It should help with that 'love' piece.
threw= past tense of throw. We go "through" stuff.
@@thetroopoftruth4820 I am sorry, on top of being abused by my wife who is doing horrible things to me, while at the same time morning the death of our 3yr old grandson that happend suddenly and devastated what was left of our fragile family dynamics, I must have actually gotten even stupider then i already was before it all started. Hmm thanks for pointing that out.
@@BLUDOTUBEZ you're welcome. Stop calling yourself names. It'll only make you feel worse, and make it harder to deal with everything. Take some deep breaths each night before sleep, and say very caring, kind words to yourself. Encourage and exaggerate all the tiny good qualities you find about yourself. It'll help you get your sanity back.
Informative video
Thanks. Glad you think so.
It's nice to make up your own labeling and sell book about it. I hope you have your intentions in the right place.
Yippee great video 📹 👏 👍 👌 🙌 😀
What if the codependent has given up on themselves to the point that they now need the narcissist and they temporarily have to coexist in the same space??
How does the codependent get on their feet when the narcissit keeps interjecting themselves into their path of healing? For example, taking care of a parent who is perfectly capable of taking care of themselves but having to prioritize their needs over yours to coexist peacefully...even when youre battling your own health conditions. Things dont get done around the house, having to run errands for them etc. & not being able to focus on growth, bettering skills, or building a life of independence & freedom. 😔 cant figure out how to set boundaries to develop a routine for healing and growth, when unable to go no contact at the moment. I cant even get on my feet and focus on keeping a job because I cant get my health in order to maintain stability. 😭
Same here. And I’ll be 32 in august. Fun times, isn’t it?!
Silent Treatment, Grey Rock, Mirror What they Say and repeat medods until they give up and leave you alone!!
Nothing makes sense about narcissism and those who stay with the narcissist for decades.
I'm not an angel, not a victim possess traits from all three of the dark triad coupled with an abundance of empathy.
I honestly am trying to figure out what I am by looking inside and a meaningful relationship is impossible to maintain until I get myself figured out.
I know I manipulate others, I do it to try to protect myself from harm.
Sadly everyone I have cared about or trusted, in over half a century has betrayed me.
Breaking that cycle drives me to learn, grow and become a man others love and respect.
Why would logic apply to my life from the little scapegoat inside me to a life that could never be normal.
These videos help understand why looking inside hurts so terribly as my childhood hurt terribly
I know I have SLDD. I was with a covert narcissist for almost 6 years. For an entire year, I was love bombed, but there were clues. Clues I chose to ignore. I swear for the most part, I was blind sided. The clues were essentially financial. By the time I was financially bound in the relationship where it would cost more legally to get out, his whole personality flipped. Then I still didn't understand what was going on, I was convinced it was depression. I feel stupid, but he fooled my children and friends and continued to manipulate them behind my back. They would tell me, "he loves you so much", I really believed for years I was so damaged , it was me. Everyone that knows him will tell you how great a person he is. Can I ever trust my judgement?
You know years ago Ross in my thirties and twenties... after my parents died I was trying to please everyone. It's almost like it was pathetically overboard. And if I didn't do something for somebody I was the bad one I was the selfish one and I felt so downhearted in fact when I started reading years ago but narcissistic and codependency I thought I was a narcissist because I wanted to be happy and I wanted to have nice things and somebody says oh you're just narcissistic and so I felt really guilty I didn't really know the meaning behind that word but I thought well if I want to have nice things for myself and if I want to make myself happy I must be really narcissistic lol but it turned out I was the opposite. And when somebody tries to give you a guilt trip because you want to be happy or because you want to say no to somebody because it's against your conscience or something about it doesn't agree with you then do it. Don't let people go against your conscience because your conscience is a gift it's like a beacon in the open ocean. It's when you're not too sure about your direction and you're not too sure about anything your conscience acts like a beacon in the light. So listen to your conscience or you could be shipwreck mentally and emotionally and even spiritually. Don't gravitate to people who put you down because you want to be happy there's nothing wrong with being happy. The wrong thing is when you are selfish and mean and do things to others to be happy do cruel things to others to be happy that is not real happiness now is it
Thank you for this. I found it very helpful. To try to uncover a covert narcissist do you just look at the balance of LRC btw married people, or can you reveal if they are a covert narcissist by also observing the balance shown in other closer relationships they have? ie father and daughter, close friend to close friend?
I’ve known a Narc that goes to Codependent (thinking she is one of course) support groups and always manages to gather them as “friends”.
This can happen in platonic relationships of any kind though? It is so often referred to in romantic relationships. I’m coming out of suffering from this. I can see I have a lot of wounds to heal .... wounds I never knew I had until now..it’s all very fascinating yet painful. Thanks for your work. 🙏
Looking back all my favorite lovers were narcissist I felt most seen work a narcissist while knowing they were trash
This is what I explained to you and you said I wasn’t a codependent.Joe A
I can see it. As a hopeless codependent I'm 2 for 2 linking up long term with abusive manipulative lying narcs, although I think I've fine tuned them to borderline (wife #1) and histrionic (wife #2), both with narcissistic traits. Together they pretty much FUBARed me.
My FUBAR was systematic from diapers to adulthood.
I wish you could be my therapist and help me x x
He could be, he has a set of online courses
This is good stuff but I was wondering, do you have a book? I feel like you might have mentioned it once or twice but can’t be sure.
15:30 What do you mean by giver of "primary" LRC ?
Hi, could there be any other reason why the lrc is out of balance than to be in a relationship with a narcissist? I was married to a (diagnosed) narcissist and after that I had an HSP boyfriend with attachment issues, he said. I saw a number of things that I recognized about my ex, but there was also a lot else. I don't know if what I saw was my own wound that had yet to heal, or did I fall back into the same "trap"? I just ended the relationship with my boyfriend because now I know I earn some lrc too, but I don't think he's a narcissist ... hope you can help me. Of course I'm the codependent in this story, so I ordered your book
Also, I don't like this dynamic from psychologists:
-says codependent and narc are equally bad
- codependent is the only one willing to change out of the two
-codependent is already guilted by the narc constantly anyway
-narc is bad, but that's just how they aaaaaare
It's like subtly reinforcing the narc
Your theory is SO CLOSE to reality but it is not yet comprehensive until you incorporate power and control in decision-making. Distribution of power/decision-making is central to codependent+narcissistic relationships. Lack of actual control in decisionmaking is cental to being codependent. Relinquishment of power/ Vs Centrralzation of power in the other.
I feel like you can be either or depending on the person your with. I've feel I've behaved polar oppositely in different relationships that seems odd to me
I’m the same, I’ve asked about this on another video. I feel like I’ve been the narc in some relationships and the SLD in others.. I was the ‘golden child’ til I hit puberty, then I became the scapegoat that was “always letting the family down and causing all the stress in the family”. I think that means I’m sort of a half-blood. I think of myself as a “failed narcissist” because I was also completely rejected by my peers so my grandiose delusions didn’t “take”. I’m actually grateful in a way because if anyone had taken me seriously I would have grown into a full fledged narc and been incapable of healing
I feel the same. Is there any resources that talks about being narc and codependent with different partners?
@@selcenita you probably are disorganized attachment
What if my husband is SLDD, I’m a recovering SLDD.
He has covert narc parents..They don’t care for us..but he does care for them.
He does love, respect and care for me, but for some reason I feel he is not honest with me. He comes from highly narcissistic family. He doesn’t talk negative about his parents at all..it’s me who keeps on asking and telling him what they are..
I feel like I'm going through this now
You can't convince about narcissism to others. It is nearly impossible to convince people about narcissism. Even the narcissist herself is unaware of it.
Is the pairing always SLD+Narcissist or can it also be SLD+Dismissive Avoidant Attachment style?
Dr. Rosenberg, I love your book but I have a question for you: If people are attracted to their opposites, how do you explain the Kanye West-Kim Kardashian marriage? If they are both on the self-oriented spectrum, wouldn't they be repulsed by each other?
You know what I do now yes I questioned people and they don't like it I don't do it in a aggressive way I do it in a calm way and before I wouldn't even question anybody and I would always trust everybody's word like a fool. Because people would say why don't you believe me when I tell you? Or they would say you don't have to question me you know I'm right.
Now when somebody says something and I will say oh that's nice where'd you get that information from I like to see that information. And then out comes the stories while I didn't get that information from such-and-such I got it from over here. And I say Oh I thought you just finished saying you got that information over here and then they say I think you got that mixed up I don't think you got that straight because your memory is poor and I reply that's where you are wrong cuz I know exactly what you said and I made notes just to be sure my memory does not deceive me. :) and here comes out my notes LOL..
And now when I put people on spot in a nice way I am loosing narcissistic Neighbors. And I love it because I am starting to love myself and don't put up with any line cuz that's the way I was brought up. Why would I all of a sudden change my principles about lying just to make somebody else happy? Thought doesn't work in my books.
I knew this neighbour who lives in the same complex as me and the landlord has cameras inside the hallways in the entrance and outside for security reasons. My girlfriend is a janitor and she cleans the hallways and she does the entrance bathroom. When she's working the landlord can see everything that she does. She put her sunglasses on a table in the entrance and my neighbour went downstairs saw the sunglasses by her Cleaning Supplies on the table and took the sunglasses. When she came back she didn't find her sunglasses and she was Disturbed so she talked to the landlord the next day and you looked at the cameras and said to her I know who the thief is. Here it was that woman and he approached her and she lied blue face. And then my friend approached her and again she lied blue face and started accusing some neighbour..
So when I spoke to her I said to her I guess the landlord saw you on camera taking my girlfriends sunglasses and she says to me oh no the camera was lying and I said well apparently the landlord said he saw you and now she doesn't want to talk to me because now she's telling my girlfriend that I was accusing her of lying and stealing. My girlfriend fell for her crying and saying... I didn't take them I didn't take them .
And I was saying to myself just because somebody is old and puts on this "I can't remember story" and they are crying profusly and swearing up and down, denying it... my friend who is codependent hugged her and said Toro it's okay don't cry...
I thought to myself why would my friend be so soft-hearted when I told her that this woman has lied to me and my other neighbour and got caught in the lie about doing something and yet my friend who is codependent chose to believe her and being her own sunglasses. Now this woman is really mad at me and won't talk to me as if I care if she does..
If you're codependent you would be a sucker like that. You would always feel sorry for somebody and make excuses for them..
After two years of reading and listening to your videos and Lisa..
I have decided that it's not important to me if people don't like me for being honest. If you are honest and people start seeing a change because you stand up for yourself I say good for you ..
We have to stand up for what is right or will fall for anything