Don't trust everything you see... it's Time to find out what really happened to Mighty and Ray and if they're even real! What do you guys think? SMASH That Like Button if You Loved this Theory, and Share It! :) EDIT: Also, I'm Aware that Dragon Ball Super: Broly movie is said to be CANON to the main Dragon Ball Series. I just put it along with the previous movies as an EXAMPLE lol.
why would eggman create illusions to HELP sonic?1? that seems pretty stupid and it's not like the phantom ruby just created them it favors Eggman and the Heavies
It kinda does. Does this mean that Timeline 2 is permanently stuck in a Mania Loop? Or will there be a sequel that resolves the problem of the Phantom Ruby? Who knows? Probably Iizuka, but he wouldn't ever actually tell anyone. He's too stingy.
I WON'T believe everything i see, and that's why I'm contradicting this theory. Izuka meant that they won't be in any MODERN games, only future classic instalments. Sonic games don't do things like that unless they come out and tell you. It's fun to think about, but cannonicly mighty and ray were there, and only ONE of the ones you find in Angel island was an illusion, while the real one appears later.
Ooh, good point! Especially since the one you pick seems so surprised at the reveal. However, there's no specific scene in the game to meet the other new character and resolve this plot hole. That puts a damper on your idea.
People forgot that the Phantom Ruby in Sonic Forces. Eggman use the real Ruby in the final boss, Classic Sonic, Sonic, and the Avatar destroyed the Ruby. All of the illusion and Infinite was eraesed forever. Classic Sonic was sent back to his timeline in the same pose in Sonic Mania Adventures part 1.
All I can say is...damn... I walked into this highly skeptical but as it went on, Sonic Mania Plus got creepier and creepier. And I was finishing up encore mode listening to this. Good job dudes!
The quality in this video seems higher, also this theory makes alot of sense if you think about it. Like if you rescue one ally and the other turns into a hard boiled heavy.
I personally think that we actually never actually see the original Phantom Ruby in Sonic Force's. It's stated multiple times that the Ruby Infinite has is the perfected Phantom Ruby. While all the other Rubys in the game are called prototypes. As for the one Eggman used to power the Death Egg it seems to be implying that it's the perfected Ruby that Infinite was using. He even states that he can still fight before Eggman pulls him from the battle. I believe that Eggman who has clearly learned from his past mistakes in this game knew that he could not control the original Phantom Ruby. And decided to create less powerful copies which only create illusions (that can still kill you I might add). While the original seems to actually affect reality itself given that classic Sonic was genuinely transported to an alternate reality and wasn't affected by an illusion.
Thank you, I've been saying this exactly for quite some time now, and no one else has believed me. I think it's POSSIBLE that Eggman was using the original Phantom Ruby at the end of Forces, but extremely unlikely given the rest of the game, and yet even the Sonic Wikia will tell you as if it's fact that it was the original.
That's because the Wikia is an amalgamation of both facts and theories about Sonic lore. Since it's freely re-writable, anyone could post anything there.
What happened to Infinite after he got beamed off is a key part of the Phantom Ruby mystery. I think there's evidence to show that Eggman uses Infinite's ruby at the end of the game. It might be wrong but that's what I think. Eggman beams off Infinite and leaves shortly after. Then Sonic goes through Final Judgement. I think that it's during this time that Eggman goes to wherever he sent Infinite, and separates the ruby from him. He then uses it to power his Death Egg Robot, and confronts Sonic. Infinite pleads to Eggman to give him more time, and that he can still fight. Implying that if Eggman beams him off, he will be rendered incapable of fighting. And this would probably be achieved by taking the ruby from him
Funny enough I figured they were illusions given how, when choosing Ray or Mighty, the one you didn't choose reveals himself to be Heavy Magician. However, I would argue that pointing out that the capsule in which Ray and mighty are imprisoned in (which looks like the same capsules used to free characters from the combi catcher in Knuckles' Chaotix) being out in the middle of nowhere isn't a good argument for one minor reason: In Knuckles' Chaotix, Knuckles finds Espio in a capsule in the middle of nowhere with Eggman working on said capsule before the good doctor is carried off by Metal Sonic.
I genuinely think that Infinite is still out there and now controlling the Phantom Ruby (ill shorten it to PR). The PR had more of a sentient presence in Mania Plus/Encore than in Mania Mode. Why would it randomly flee from Sonic in the beginning of Angel Island? Why did it randomly open a portal and chase the gang at the end of Encore? What happened to Infinite in Forces? I'm telling you, that PR isn't the original, which is destroyed. It is Infinite's ruby. He is now part of the ruby itself. He IS the ruby. And he's probably going to throw another tantrum after being defeated. And knowing how Sonic Team made the plot darker... Tails = dead confirmed? :thonk:
Oh, boy. Another edge fest? Seriously?! Infinite's theme tune is one of the edgiest songs I've ever heard, and Infinite himself is obsessed with I AM NOT WEAK!!! So much so, he turned himself into a VR being, and became one of the edgiest Sonic villains ever. That guy messing with the Classic Timeline would be beyond aggravating.
NyanDoge The Phantom Ruby in Mania was transported to Forces. This was the original Phantom Ruby that Eggman took and experimented with to create the Phantom Ruby Prototypes. The final prototype, which was the most complete one was given to Infinite. The original Phantom Ruby was destroyed at the end of Forces. That leads to the ruby in Encore mode being Infinite's ruby as that is the only Phantom Ruby that exists. All the decoys, prototypes were also destroyed.
Non-Ugandan Knuckles Infinite's ruby was specifically designed to fit on his chest. Again, all prototypes were destroyed (the last one was with the Avatar, and was destroyed). All decoys were destroyed in Final Judgement. Also, if you mean that it can't be Infinite's ruby in Encore because it looks like Mania's ruby, they're reusing assets. They've done this countless times in the DLC, such as the AIZ > GHZ transition.
Wait but if mighty and ray are just phantom ruby illusions then I don’t get why they would help sonic through out the entire game it’s the same thing as Shadow in forces despite shadow being on Sonics side the ruby illusions still attacked him
The thing is, that Mighty and Ray are Classic-exclusive characters. They only exist in the Classic Timeline. So it's possible that only one of the two in the capsule was an illusion, and the other (the one you pick) was real. Finding the other one during the journey, means clearing the Blue Sphere stages. Maybe the Phantom Ruby created fakes, to try to trick Sonic away from the real ones. Sound plausible to you?
i might just have believed this, but two things hold me back. 1. This contradicts my own theory about the Phantom Ruby 2. Why would eggman be running away in the end if it was the exit?
that it actually a link between the two timelines and contains some of the time eaters power. it explains how it can transport itself to the modern timeline and back, and shows what the "virtual reality" really is. instead of creating illusions, it causes the affected to exist in two dimensions or timelines at once.
Johnathon Turner I thought of something similar to that. I don't know how I feel about the separate timeline stuff as Sonic has never dealt with that stuff before when they could have. (Especially in Sonic 06) I do agree with the PR being a part of the Time Eater, though.
Dang... This theory is so freaking surreal yet so evidently true. Your mad man GamerGuyd! I wonder what a Mania sequel would be like, fracturing in if this is true? That'd be insane.
And something which may prove your theory...in mania plus at the menu screen is a scene of sonic and tails walking normally in green hill. But there is an unused file which has sonic and tails running trough green hill trough a loop,again,again and again. Never stopping. Hopefully i helped :) (good theory btw keep up the good work,and these collabs i love them!)
One thing I still wonder about the good ending is what happens to Classic Eggman after he get's knocked into the portal. Is this another setup for a modern game with classic, as when Sonic, Classic, and the Avatar beat Modern Eggman in forces, he doesn't leave Null Space (at least on screen he doesn't). Did Classic Eggman also end up in Null Space with his modern self? Are we about to get Forces 2? If we do, it better also have Mania 2 coming after.
@Non-Ugandan Knuckles Tails:"Dr.Eggman!?...but how!?" Dr.Robotnik:"He had a little help." Classic Tails:"DR.ROBOTNIK!" Dr.Robotnik:"Nobody calls me that anymore." One question that's plagued everyone in Generations is that if Eggman needed his past self to use Time Eater how did he get him in the first place to help him? But the thing is...that isn't Dr.Eggman's past self! Exactly like how Mania!Sonic was warped to the canon universe, Mania!Eggman was warped to the canon universe at the end of Plus but instead of coming out the other end to whatever Modern Sonic game will come after Forces he was sent to Generations instead and passed off as "Dr.Robotnik" a name he hasn't used since before he met (and tried to crush with an orange wrecking ball) his universe's Sonic. Mania universe timeline: ¤Sonic The Hedgehog ¤SegaSonic ¤Sonic CD ¤Sonic 2 ¤Sonic 3 & Knux ¤Chaotix ¤Sonic Mania+ Canon universe timeline: ¤Sonic The Hedgehog ¤SegaSonic ¤Sonic CD ¤Sonic 2 ¤Sonic 3 & Knux ¤Chaotix ¤Sonic Adventure ¤Sonic Adventure 2 ¤Sonic Heroes ¤Shadow The Hedgehog ¤The One We Must Never Speak Of From 2006 ¤Sonic Unleashed ¤Sonic Storybook Duo(Secret Rings and Black Knight) ¤Sonic Colors ¤Sonic Generations ¤Sonic Lost World ¤Sonic Forces
I'm surprised you didn't mention the bad ending in addition to the good ending. In the bad ending, instead of the Phantom Ruby opening a portal, you see the Heavy King come and collect it by inserting it into the scepter. The ending also shows the Heavy King, not Eggman, juggling the chaos emeralds. It's interesting how the whole thing circles around the Heavy King, doesn't it? Actually, keeping on the topic of the Heavy King, did you also notice you don't fight the Phantom King in Encore mode? What if this is because the Phantom King doesn't "need" to seize the Phantom Ruby from Eggman because he already has it, regardless of whether or not you collect the chaos emeralds (since one could argue, especially given the final boss battle, that the Heavy King is his chosen puppet). In fact, on that topic... You're theory is that Ray and Mighty are illusions, but what if Eggman's presence in Encore is also an illusion? It would actually make sense since the entire encore story seems to circle around the Ruby/Heavy King and not Eggman. Minus the illusions, this is very similar to Sonic 3 & Knuckles, where a character goes through the same levels again with minor differences after the main story is finished (I.E. Knuckles goes through all the levels Sonic & Tails did (minus Death Egg) and fights all the same bosses. The reason I say "again" with Knuckles is because he follows sonic throughout the game to set traps for him). The ironic thing is the enemy to replace Eggman in this story is, of all things, an Eggrobo who even manages to steal the Master Emerald (just like how the Heavy King tried to do). It's almost uncanny how that worked out. And on the subject of the Master Emerald, it's discolored and is purple instead of green in Encore mode, once again showing us that something isn't right. ( steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1480015666 )
MSOGameShow everything you said is interesting except one thing for Sonic 3 & Knuckles. If I understood well what you said buddy, Knuckles story in Sonic 3&K is after Sonic’s story, just to put traps for him? Knuckles didn’t go through all the same levels to put traps for Sonic. Knuckles’ story is right after Sonic’s story, because one egg robot survived and took Robotnik’s place in the story. If you noticed, in Lava Reef Zone with Knuckles, there are some broken monitors. They are from the last time that Sonic and Tails got through the stage. Also if you see in the ending cutscenes, when you defeat the Death Egg Robot in Dooms Day Zone, Sonic and Tails gave the Master Emerald back to Knuckles and the Angel Island started to raising up from the sea again, but the island reaches only the half way up to the sky. Then, when you defeat the game with Knuckles, the island continues raising more higher from the first point. So we have 2 different stories the one right after the other. Your theory for the encore Mode is great and burned my brain, in the good way 😜 It was a nice observation that the Encore Mode is cycling over Heavy King 👏👏 I don’t know if the purple Master Emerald is colored like that because it’s an illusion or if just took the color pallet from the entire stage, but that’s a think too.
Maybe Mighty didn't go missing until after Knuckles' Chaotix so he could try to find the real Ray but went missing in the process. Maybe that's why team Chaotix became Detectives: to look for Ray & Mighty
Battle of Gods, Resurrection F, and the new Broly movie are all considered canon to the Super Timeline, but the previous DBZ movies were not. That's what he was actually referring to.
The Super movies are semi-canon, due to the fact that they were also turned into arcs in the Manga and Anime. However, the new Broly movie is confirmed to be fully canon, in comparison. The only DBZ movie canon to the Anime Timeline was the Dead Zone movie, which was backstory for the Garlic Jr. Filler Arc between the Frieza Saga and the Android Saga. And it was crap.
I think Mania Plus (and the Encore Mode) isn't canon like it is 3&K, after all both games are just "bonus games" and Iizuka ever repeated that 3&K isn't canon for this reason; Plus, the Encore Mode have a ton of inconsistencies, 1. Phantom Ruby randomly appear in the past/dimension/whatever place, 2. Heavy King and the others HBH working again for Eggman after the last battle in Mania Mode for no reasons, 3. Knuckles and Tails randomly appears for helping Sonic... etc Mania Adventures have a fluid plot where don't clash with those things and basically more canon than the Encore Mode; The Boom games are canon to Boom TV series that was confirmed since the announcement (and completely confirmed with the presence of D-Fekt in the Season 2) This isn't the first time where the Sonic games use other media to complete a story arc, thinking about the comics prequel of Forces, the prequel comic will be released soon for Team Sonic Racing, the others prequel comics of Sonic 4, Lost World, Chronicles, etc... Even the short movie "Night of Werehog" clearly canon since the two ghosts appears in the game Unleashed In the end for those reasons, for me Mania Adventures is more canon than the Encore Mode (Mania Plus) Edit: Is confirmed that Sonic CD take place after S&K
People are still arguing over where Sonic CD goes to this day. I highly doubt anyone from SEGA or Sonic Team confirmed anything about when CD happened. Except that it was before Sonic 4...
Gaming Sensei Well, in this article sonicretro.org/2011/08/sega-staffer-speaks-sonic-cd-details-revised-as-sonic-4-prequel/ , Sega basically say CD set after 3&K and before S4 and still happened when it happened but doesn't mean directly set after or before in those games
the hooligans werent copies, it was just heavy magician being a chaotic lil bean and showing off her ability to mimic/ shapeshift into things just like the other friend u didn't choose
Sorry for commenting so much, but I had an idea regarding the ending to Encore mode with the Heavy King showing up with the plate of ice cream. What if, with Eggman, and possibly the Phantom Ruby, gone, the Heavy King overwrote his own programming and became friendly, since he had no reason to fight Sonic anymore? I know it sounds crazy, but we've seen Eggman's robots do this before like E-102 Gamma and E-123 Omega. Of course, this idea, I realize, can easily be dismissed given how the Heavy King is just an Eggrobo illusion and thus not real and the Phantom Ruby is still at large. Of course, we know it must still exist in the classic universe if the Heavy King is still around since, as shown in Sonic forces, when the Phantom Ruby leaves a dimension, all the illusions it created in that dimension are dispelled. Since the Heavy King, an illusion of the Phantom Ruby, shows up at the end, we can assume the Phantom Ruby is still around in this dimension at least.
I also find the good ending of Encore Mode a little interesting. It appears that he's a "good guy" now. because otherwise why would he be approaching them with ice cream? If he wanted to attack them, he would have lunged at them with his scepter in hand, or something else. So either he really is friendly, or perhaps he's being spiteful? Spiteful in the way that he knows this is all just a looping scenario and he's just having fun to himself before the whole situation repeats again in due time
As of late June 2018, I officially got back into the Sonic The Hedgehog series after over a decade. So I started looking up the series lore and even bought a brand new copy of Sonic Forces (Bonus Edition) to celebrate the reunion of my love of the series. Anyhow, I encountered your channels around that time and your interesting theory video really kept my intrest whenever I was sleeping or visiting my doctor due to Physical injury which had me physically handicapped for over a year. I love your content and I'm sorry I forgot to subscribe all that time ago. (I just did now) I hope you continue doing what you do and have a nice day!
Meta Ridley, aka The Cunning God Of Death okay, but if it takes place on Angel Island, is Lava Reef an illusion? Why would the original zones nit be illusions but Hydro City and Lava Reef? Why?
That would kinda explain why Angel Island isn't floating... I guess. But Forces kinda made the whole saga a cluster. Robotnic created the Phantom Ruby in that story, right? I can't remember.
Rivers1129 I thought angel island had a body of water around it. In the background angel island, you can see ice cap, and ice cap is just a giant glacier meaning water has to be surrounding it. You can also see a body of water in mania adventures.
Modern Eggman created his own Phantom Ruby, using the data of the original. He wasn't about to risk losing the real one. So the real Ruby returned to the Classic Timeline after Forces.
Modern Eggman created his own Phantom Ruby, using the data of the original. He wasn't about to risk losing the real one. So the real Ruby returned to the Classic Timeline after Forces.
While I don't (want to) agree with this illusion theory, Mighty and Ray are, in fact, still missing. _In timeline 1._ They exist in Classic's world, but Modern Sonic never met them ever again, until that eventually happens in a future game.
yeah because timeline 1 is basically timeline 2 without mania but with a lot more games it's literally sonic's past but when generations happens sonic from timeline 1 meet's his past self and that created timeline 2 and now classic sonic doesn't go to sonic adventure but instead to mania and all of that shit happens and then he goes to forces and then comes back and finds mighty and ray and rescues them, so now after that some weird things happen in timeline 2 but now back to timeline 1 so I think in timeline 1 mighty went to find ray that's why he didn't stay with the chaotix and he got lost in the process of finding him so they both could be somewhere but ofc sega probably won't create a plot that revolves around finding them.
But wait a minute. The Phantom ruby clones are made to be evil. But mighty and ray weren't. . . But then again. Why didn't might or ray attack the other in the capsule. Because Everything isn't as it seems. . . But then they legit change form. But no matter what everytime you play it, it could be mighty, or it could be ray.
Maybe the clones can just be what the ruby, or the ruby's user wants them to be? If the ruby is feeling like it wants to be entertained, maybe it will choose to make the clones "good". If it's feeling malicious, the clones are evil
I've got a theory that sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles are part of time line 1, but sonic 3 & Knuckles is considered another game and is placed on time line 2 because of the Super Emeralds being in 3 & Knuckles. Might make a video to explain it further.
When after finishing Sonic CD tails said: "See you next game", I thought that "next game'" is Sonic CD, but with tails. (I was playing christian whitehead's remaster of Sonic CD)
I think this is wrong cause they defeat heavy magition and why would Mighty and Ray be still there and the phantom ruby in the good end gets sucked up with robotnick and mighty and Ray are still their
Triple Trouple IS canon. Besides Sonic Fighters it is only other appearance Fang the sniper has made. Plus saying the handhelds are not canon contridicts your earlier theory about Sonic Colors full story being split between its Wii and 3Ds interations.. Plus The Sonic Rivals Games are considered canon intriduction of Silver post 06 retcon from the timeline.
Fun fact: as confirmed by series creator,Akira Toriyama, Dragon Ball Super: Broly is cannon to the DBS manga and anime. For it was written by Akira Toriyama
Aaron Webber is a social media manager. He isnt the head of sega, sonic team nor created Sonic. What he said wasn't even a fact he wasn't even sure cause he never created the game. Sonic Mania Adventures takes place after Forces as you see the same pose Classic Sonic had at the end of forces in the first episode of mania adventures even the the description of the first episode proves it as well meaning it takes place within the main timeline. Encore Mode takes place in another timeline due to the fact the PHR is alive while the one in the main dimension is dead not only that the Encore Mode didn't have Sonic doing the pose he did at the end of Forces proving it takes place in alternate timeline. Encore Mode is another timeline. Mania Adventures takes place in the main one.
I don't know I mean mighty is a pascifist and Ray loves adventuring so if anything I think Ray and mighty are just hanging around adventuring after this game and stuff
here's a joke that goesqlong with this theory Mighty and Ray walk into a bar except they dont because they would only be of drinking age in the modern games
my theory is a bit different, but it's somewhat similar. in Sonic Forces, Eggman used the Phantom Ruby to create evil clones of characters like Zavok and Shadow. However, my theory suggests that he used the Phantom Ruby to create clones of mighty and ray (like you said in the video) and make a mirage so once again they have to live the main story but set at night with mighty and ray, but in the end the heroes defeated the Phantom Robos again. At the end of the game, the Heavy King was just reprogrammed by Tails to work at an ice-cream parlor. As a result, everything returned to normal, and it's worth noting that Sonic Superstars is releasing this year and everything is back to normal, no sign of the phantom ruby. i think parts of your theory did make sense because mighty and ray hasnt appeared in superstars, i feel like the theory is correct they are not in superstars as they are still missing
I have a theory for mighty and ray! What if after sonic ran away, egg man somehow managed to catch the duo again, after some years of trying to turn them into something He made them into cubot and orbot (notice their colors) Also it would make sense because mighty and rat would have been a trio with metal sonic (orbot cubot and metal is the current evil trio( what do you think?
I have a better theory: GamerGuyd7Aces:So, that's exactly my theory! And re- ???:Aaaces... Aces:W-w-hat? ???:Dooon't you reaaaliiise?... Aces:REALISE WWH--H-H-AT? ???:That we never even thought about anythiing, we never made it so deep... Aces:No, it can't b-b-b-be... Takashi Iizuka:We made it to just make people BUY MERCHANDISE AND GAMES MOREEEE. WE MADE ALL THE HYPE WITH RAY AND MIGHTY WITHOUT AN EXPLAINATION, JUST FOR MOOONEEEY Aces:No, it can't be, NO, NO, NO! NOOOOOO! *signal problems* Iizuka:Buy... merchandise... BUY... MERCHANDISE... MONEY IS INFINITE WITH SEGA ENTERPRISESSSSS *signal lost*
I know you worked hard on this but sometimes, you shouldn’t overthink things. These theories actually anger me because you are only trying to make the story sad
btw, after you hit the future sign in stardust speedway, you never hit a past sign later, meaning all zones after stardust speedway are in the future. ;)
The phantom ruby is probably the most scariest and powerful jewels in the sonic series. Imagine if it feel into the hands of someone more evil and smart than Eggman! That would be s crazy sonic plot.
Edited: I was an idiot when it came to Sonic lore 2 years ago, but I'm smart enough to know there are seven Chaos Emeralds, and Sonic the Fighters has 8 Emeralds. So if that game is canon, does that mean that there are more than 7, or heck, 8 Emeralds? It's certainly interesting now that I think about it.
Aaron Webber is a Social Media director. I wouldn't take him as a reliable source since he isnt the creator of the series and has no authority over the main canon continuity.
Yes but, if they were phantom copys they would be attacking Sonic. If it was controlled by eggman anyway. Which it was because heavy magician uses it. And it's safe to assume that Ray was merely taken away from them and retrieved from a moniter. And you might say," but when they die they reappear back into ring boxes. Spooky right?" But so do Tails and Knuckles and even Sonic. So here's the 4 1 1. Encore mode is a time look but when a character dies they get transported into moniters so they can continue the loop later. But at the end, they are in the normal mirage saloon. The non encore mode mirage saloon. So I kinda sorta think they escaped it. And Mighty and Ray are the real ones not weird illusions because if they were they would be attacking Sonic. And whoever you didn't pick at the start of encore mode was stolen away and places in a ring box or special stage. So there is what I think.
The Phantom Ruby is a very scary artifact when you theorize it in this way, this is by far the darkest theory thus far, I feel bad for the Classic world now.
6:55 Gamerguyd, your friend said that every place that Sonic visited in Sonic Mania that he has been to before (like Green Hill and the Chemical Plant) is an illusion, he said places that are not an illusion are only the places where Sonic never been before (like Studiopolis and Press Garden), does that mean Flying Battery that appears at the end of Studiopolis (in that TV) is an illusion inside of a reality? (I await replies 😏)
Sega Sonic the Hedgehog, and Sonic the Fighters can be canon, but not the 8-bit games!? Making them non-canon because "handheld games" is a mute point considering some were original Master System games, a home console. Nack/Fang debuted in Triple Trouble, and making that game non-canon basically gets rid of his entire character. Not to mention the 8-bit games don't even cause any serious timeline flaws. I guess Sonic CD should also be non-canon since it "interrupts the flow of the classic trilogy". Why would Robotnik build Metal Sonic *before* Silver Sonic? If the 8-bit games were canon, you could just say the Silver Sonic prototype was built first in Sonic 2 8-bit which could then take place before Sonic CD. Sega themselves want Sonic CD to take place in-between Sonic 2 and Sonic 3, which doesn't work cause Sonic 3 is a direct sequel to Sonic (taking place days apart). You can easily fit it all together with ease; most Classic Sonic games even don't conflict with each other. Sonic 1 - Master System and Genesis happen at the same time Sega Sonic the Hedgehog - Likely before Tails meets Sonic, placement unknown Sonic Labyrinth - Game has 6 emeralds thus taking place before Sonic 2. Tails absent. Tails Adventures - Taking place sometime before Tails meets Sonic. Tails Skypatrol - Taking place sometime before Tails meets Sonic. Sonic 2 Master/GG - Silver sonic prototype is built (Assuming it is one) This prototype has the ability to spindash; this is how sonic learns the move! Sonic CD - Super Peel-out and "unstable" spindash. Original Metal Sonic is created. Sonic Drift - This can happen anywhere after Sonic CD since Amy is here. (It takes place on South Island) Sonic Chaos (Tails starts helping Sonic) Sonic has perfected the spindash. Sonic 2 16-bit (Start of the 7 emeralds and death egg saga) Final version of Silver Sonic. Sonic 3 (Follows Sonic 2 directly) Sonic & Knuckles (Follows Sonic 3) Sonic Triple Trouble - Knuckles has been tricked again, Nack/Fang is introduced. Knuckles' Chaotix - Takes place after S3&K; Metal sonic is rebuilt from Sonic CD into "Metal Sonic Kai" (He now has red eyes) Sonic 3D Blast - Sonic goes on a solo adventure by himself Sonic Drift 2 - Metal sonic has red eyes so it takes place after chaotix. Nack is also present which means this occured after Triple Trouble. Sonic the Fighters - Death Egg from Sonic Drift is constructed into the Death Egg II. Sonic Mania - After S3&K and Chaotix.
![Sonic Mania Plus LOST BITS | MORE Unused Content and Debug Mode Secrets [TetraBitGaming]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/F30_44zolHY/mqdefault.jpg)
![Sonic Mania Plus LOST BITS | MORE Unused Content and Debug Mode Secrets [TetraBitGaming]](/img/tr.png)
Don't trust everything you see... it's Time to find out what really happened to Mighty and Ray and if they're even real!
What do you guys think? SMASH That Like Button if You Loved this Theory, and Share It! :)
EDIT: Also, I'm Aware that Dragon Ball Super: Broly movie is said to be CANON to the main Dragon Ball Series. I just put it along with the previous movies as an EXAMPLE lol.
GamerGuyd7Aces it is a very high possibility.
Cool theory and all, but my bois worked hard to leave the bar and get a spot in Mania. They will still be the real Mighty and Ray to me.
Gamerguyd7Aces, are you real? O_O
why would eggman create illusions to HELP sonic?1? that seems pretty stupid and it's not like the phantom ruby just created them it favors Eggman and the Heavies
also it (the phatom ruby) wouldn't know who mighty and ray are
Somewhere... somewhere out there...
Might and Ray are still in that bar.
Darkky Why are you everywhere??
Mighty be like "F*ck Sega". ^_^'
Bean: You think you had it bad...
Eastrise hey
Is no one going to mention that mighty is spelled wrong?
At least Sonic and the gang can hear that awesome soundtrack FOREVER
UH...Video game characters don't hear game soundtrack.
R/woooosh
That ending's got some real _Infinity War_ vibes, man.
It kinda does. Does this mean that Timeline 2 is permanently stuck in a Mania Loop? Or will there be a sequel that resolves the problem of the Phantom Ruby? Who knows? Probably Iizuka, but he wouldn't ever actually tell anyone. He's too stingy.
I WON'T believe everything i see, and that's why I'm contradicting this theory. Izuka meant that they won't be in any MODERN games, only future classic instalments. Sonic games don't do things like that unless they come out and tell you. It's fun to think about, but cannonicly mighty and ray were there, and only ONE of the ones you find in Angel island was an illusion, while the real one appears later.
Ooh, good point! Especially since the one you pick seems so surprised at the reveal. However, there's no specific scene in the game to meet the other new character and resolve this plot hole. That puts a damper on your idea.
There's a modern mighty and ray
@@ShadowTheHedgehog_30 Archie owns their modern asses.
I know :/
Since the Archie Timeline is dead, and Ken Penders owns its characters, the "Modern" versions there don't count.
People forgot that the Phantom Ruby in Sonic Forces.
Eggman use the real Ruby in the final boss, Classic Sonic, Sonic, and the Avatar destroyed the Ruby.
All of the illusion and Infinite was eraesed forever. Classic Sonic was sent back to his timeline in the same pose in Sonic Mania Adventures part 1.
That ending reminded me of something....I don't really feel so good.
Bomber Blurr LOL
......
I call dips on Captain America, they all die so it's doesn't matter who you pick
But I'm still Cap
@@robertjoe9396 Fine then i am iron man so I am surviving
MLGAllan65
*cough* endgame *cough*
@@mlgallan6591 iron Man dies in the end, he suicides
The reason why Ray is an illusion is because he got hired for a show called: Everyone loves Ray Romando The Flying Squirrel
All I can say is...damn... I walked into this highly skeptical but as it went on, Sonic Mania Plus got creepier and creepier. And I was finishing up encore mode listening to this. Good job dudes!
The quality in this video seems higher, also this theory makes alot of sense if you think about it. Like if you rescue one ally and the other turns into a hard boiled heavy.
Specifically heavy magician
I personally think that we actually never actually see the original Phantom Ruby in Sonic Force's. It's stated multiple times that the Ruby Infinite has is the perfected Phantom Ruby. While all the other Rubys in the game are called prototypes. As for the one Eggman used to power the Death Egg it seems to be implying that it's the perfected Ruby that Infinite was using. He even states that he can still fight before Eggman pulls him from the battle. I believe that Eggman who has clearly learned from his past mistakes in this game knew that he could not control the original Phantom Ruby. And decided to create less powerful copies which only create illusions (that can still kill you I might add). While the original seems to actually affect reality itself given that classic Sonic was genuinely transported to an alternate reality and wasn't affected by an illusion.
Thank you, I've been saying this exactly for quite some time now, and no one else has believed me. I think it's POSSIBLE that Eggman was using the original Phantom Ruby at the end of Forces, but extremely unlikely given the rest of the game, and yet even the Sonic Wikia will tell you as if it's fact that it was the original.
That's because the Wikia is an amalgamation of both facts and theories about Sonic lore. Since it's freely re-writable, anyone could post anything there.
What happened to Infinite after he got beamed off is a key part of the Phantom Ruby mystery. I think there's evidence to show that Eggman uses Infinite's ruby at the end of the game. It might be wrong but that's what I think.
Eggman beams off Infinite and leaves shortly after. Then Sonic goes through Final Judgement. I think that it's during this time that Eggman goes to wherever he sent Infinite, and separates the ruby from him. He then uses it to power his Death Egg Robot, and confronts Sonic.
Infinite pleads to Eggman to give him more time, and that he can still fight. Implying that if Eggman beams him off, he will be rendered incapable of fighting. And this would probably be achieved by taking the ruby from him
Funny enough I figured they were illusions given how, when choosing Ray or Mighty, the one you didn't choose reveals himself to be Heavy Magician. However, I would argue that pointing out that the capsule in which Ray and mighty are imprisoned in (which looks like the same capsules used to free characters from the combi catcher in Knuckles' Chaotix) being out in the middle of nowhere isn't a good argument for one minor reason: In Knuckles' Chaotix, Knuckles finds Espio in a capsule in the middle of nowhere with Eggman working on said capsule before the good doctor is carried off by Metal Sonic.
I genuinely think that Infinite is still out there and now controlling the Phantom Ruby (ill shorten it to PR). The PR had more of a sentient presence in Mania Plus/Encore than in Mania Mode. Why would it randomly flee from Sonic in the beginning of Angel Island? Why did it randomly open a portal and chase the gang at the end of Encore? What happened to Infinite in Forces?
I'm telling you, that PR isn't the original, which is destroyed. It is Infinite's ruby. He is now part of the ruby itself. He IS the ruby. And he's probably going to throw another tantrum after being defeated. And knowing how Sonic Team made the plot darker...
Tails = dead confirmed? :thonk:
Xenova That sounds really cool.
Oh, boy. Another edge fest? Seriously?! Infinite's theme tune is one of the edgiest songs I've ever heard, and Infinite himself is obsessed with I AM NOT WEAK!!! So much so, he turned himself into a VR being, and became one of the edgiest Sonic villains ever. That guy messing with the Classic Timeline would be beyond aggravating.
Wow, Good Observation!
NyanDoge
The Phantom Ruby in Mania was transported to Forces. This was the original Phantom Ruby that Eggman took and experimented with to create the Phantom Ruby Prototypes.
The final prototype, which was the most complete one was given to Infinite. The original Phantom Ruby was destroyed at the end of Forces.
That leads to the ruby in Encore mode being Infinite's ruby as that is the only Phantom Ruby that exists. All the decoys, prototypes were also destroyed.
Non-Ugandan Knuckles
Infinite's ruby was specifically designed to fit on his chest. Again, all prototypes were destroyed (the last one was with the Avatar, and was destroyed). All decoys were destroyed in Final Judgement.
Also, if you mean that it can't be Infinite's ruby in Encore because it looks like Mania's ruby, they're reusing assets. They've done this countless times in the DLC, such as the AIZ > GHZ transition.
Wait but if mighty and ray are just phantom ruby illusions then I don’t get why they would help sonic through out the entire game it’s the same thing as Shadow in forces despite shadow being on Sonics side the ruby illusions still attacked him
Oh good point
The thing is, that Mighty and Ray are Classic-exclusive characters. They only exist in the Classic Timeline. So it's possible that only one of the two in the capsule was an illusion, and the other (the one you pick) was real. Finding the other one during the journey, means clearing the Blue Sphere stages. Maybe the Phantom Ruby created fakes, to try to trick Sonic away from the real ones. Sound plausible to you?
@@SomaCruztheDemigodofBalance Wow
They did lead sonic and his friends to that bar that had a egg robo hiding in it...
i might just have believed this, but two things hold me back.
1. This contradicts my own theory about the Phantom Ruby
2. Why would eggman be running away in the end if it was the exit?
Johnathon Turner Although he did imply that it was exit, he didn't confirm to be a way out of illusional reality. So yeah
What is your theory on the PR?
that it actually a link between the two timelines and contains some of the time eaters power. it explains how it can transport itself to the modern timeline and back, and shows what the "virtual reality" really is. instead of creating illusions, it causes the affected to exist in two dimensions or timelines at once.
Johnathon Turner
I thought of something similar to that. I don't know how I feel about the separate timeline stuff as Sonic has never dealt with that stuff before when they could have. (Especially in Sonic 06)
I do agree with the PR being a part of the Time Eater, though.
it's pretty simple. the alternate timeline was made by generations, and that has mania sonic on it. a lot simpler than the shit 06 did.
Someone needs to show this amazing yet dark theroy to Arin Webber
Hmm....
Underfell Sans The edgy skeleton yeah u should show this to him! 👍
GamerGuyd7Aces
And now to make a Twitter acount right the hell now & show him this amazingness
GamerGuyd7Aces
I know this’s a quick replay yet I did send the video to the Official Sonic twitter
Now we play the waiting game
Dang... This theory is so freaking surreal yet so evidently true. Your mad man GamerGuyd! I wonder what a Mania sequel would be like, fracturing in if this is true? That'd be insane.
In aw way, your saying Mighty and Ray are dead / killed by Eggman and Sonic never saved them and only see illusion of his dead friends.
Sounds Dark
And something which may prove your theory...in mania plus at the menu screen is a scene of sonic and tails walking normally in green hill. But there is an unused file which has sonic and tails running trough green hill trough a loop,again,again and again. Never stopping. Hopefully i helped :) (good theory btw keep up the good work,and these collabs i love them!)
One thing I still wonder about the good ending is what happens to Classic Eggman after he get's knocked into the portal. Is this another setup for a modern game with classic, as when Sonic, Classic, and the Avatar beat Modern Eggman in forces, he doesn't leave Null Space (at least on screen he doesn't). Did Classic Eggman also end up in Null Space with his modern self? Are we about to get Forces 2? If we do, it better also have Mania 2 coming after.
@Non-Ugandan Knuckles Tails:"Dr.Eggman!?...but how!?"
Dr.Robotnik:"He had a little help."
Classic Tails:"DR.ROBOTNIK!"
Dr.Robotnik:"Nobody calls me that anymore."
One question that's plagued everyone in Generations is that if Eggman needed his past self to use Time Eater how did he get him in the first place to help him? But the thing is...that isn't Dr.Eggman's past self!
Exactly like how Mania!Sonic was warped to the canon universe, Mania!Eggman was warped to the canon universe at the end of Plus but instead of coming out the other end to whatever Modern Sonic game will come after Forces he was sent to Generations instead and passed off as "Dr.Robotnik" a name he hasn't used since before he met (and tried to crush with an orange wrecking ball) his universe's Sonic.
Mania universe timeline:
¤Sonic The Hedgehog
¤SegaSonic
¤Sonic CD
¤Sonic 2
¤Sonic 3 & Knux
¤Chaotix
¤Sonic Mania+
Canon universe timeline:
¤Sonic The Hedgehog
¤SegaSonic
¤Sonic CD
¤Sonic 2
¤Sonic 3 & Knux
¤Chaotix
¤Sonic Adventure
¤Sonic Adventure 2
¤Sonic Heroes
¤Shadow The Hedgehog
¤The One We Must Never Speak Of From 2006
¤Sonic Unleashed
¤Sonic Storybook Duo(Secret Rings and Black Knight)
¤Sonic Colors
¤Sonic Generations
¤Sonic Lost World
¤Sonic Forces
I'm surprised you didn't mention the bad ending in addition to the good ending. In the bad ending, instead of the Phantom Ruby opening a portal, you see the Heavy King come and collect it by inserting it into the scepter. The ending also shows the Heavy King, not Eggman, juggling the chaos emeralds. It's interesting how the whole thing circles around the Heavy King, doesn't it? Actually, keeping on the topic of the Heavy King, did you also notice you don't fight the Phantom King in Encore mode? What if this is because the Phantom King doesn't "need" to seize the Phantom Ruby from Eggman because he already has it, regardless of whether or not you collect the chaos emeralds (since one could argue, especially given the final boss battle, that the Heavy King is his chosen puppet).
In fact, on that topic... You're theory is that Ray and Mighty are illusions, but what if Eggman's presence in Encore is also an illusion? It would actually make sense since the entire encore story seems to circle around the Ruby/Heavy King and not Eggman. Minus the illusions, this is very similar to Sonic 3 & Knuckles, where a character goes through the same levels again with minor differences after the main story is finished (I.E. Knuckles goes through all the levels Sonic & Tails did (minus Death Egg) and fights all the same bosses. The reason I say "again" with Knuckles is because he follows sonic throughout the game to set traps for him). The ironic thing is the enemy to replace Eggman in this story is, of all things, an Eggrobo who even manages to steal the Master Emerald (just like how the Heavy King tried to do). It's almost uncanny how that worked out.
And on the subject of the Master Emerald, it's discolored and is purple instead of green in Encore mode, once again showing us that something isn't right. ( steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1480015666 )
Wow I totally didn't realize the Master Emerald is Purple in Encore Mode! :o Thanks for pointing that out dude!
Paragraph Alert
Yeah, sorry. Kind of nerded out. XD
MSOGameShow everything you said is interesting except one thing for Sonic 3 & Knuckles. If I understood well what you said buddy, Knuckles story in Sonic 3&K is after Sonic’s story, just to put traps for him?
Knuckles didn’t go through all the same levels to put traps for Sonic. Knuckles’ story is right after Sonic’s story, because one egg robot survived and took Robotnik’s place in the story.
If you noticed, in Lava Reef Zone with Knuckles, there are some broken monitors. They are from the last time that Sonic and Tails got through the stage.
Also if you see in the ending cutscenes, when you defeat the Death Egg Robot in Dooms Day Zone, Sonic and Tails gave the Master Emerald back to Knuckles and the Angel Island started to raising up from the sea again, but the island reaches only the half way up to the sky.
Then, when you defeat the game with Knuckles, the island continues raising more higher from the first point. So we have 2 different stories the one right after the other.
Your theory for the encore Mode is great and burned my brain, in the good way 😜
It was a nice observation that the Encore Mode is cycling over Heavy King 👏👏
I don’t know if the purple Master Emerald is colored like that because it’s an illusion or if just took the color pallet from the entire stage, but that’s a think too.
Maybe Mighty didn't go missing until after Knuckles' Chaotix so he could try to find the real Ray but went missing in the process. Maybe that's why team Chaotix became Detectives: to look for Ray & Mighty
Some where in a different reality of our own, this whole series is mighty the armadillo. Sonic and tails have been the ones missing for years
This is the darkest theory I've ever heard about in years. >~<
I love the ending too.
You just made me appreciate Mania, and see it more in it than merely a celebration of the past, bravo, great theory!
"And Remember don't trust anything you see.."
Me: I won't trust you anymore
This would make a good storyline for a Mighty and Ray spin off game. To see where Mighty and Ray were after Sega Sonic the Hedgehog.
Actually the super movie is most likely gonna be canon and resurrection f I think was canon but not anymore I think
Anime and Games Fan
Ikr
Battle of Gods, Resurrection F, and the new Broly movie are all considered canon to the Super Timeline, but the previous DBZ movies were not. That's what he was actually referring to.
Anime and Games Fan Those movies weren't canon from the beginning even when the series was first announced. Broly movie however is (confirmed) canon.
The Super movies are semi-canon, due to the fact that they were also turned into arcs in the Manga and Anime. However, the new Broly movie is confirmed to be fully canon, in comparison. The only DBZ movie canon to the Anime Timeline was the Dead Zone movie, which was backstory for the Garlic Jr. Filler Arc between the Frieza Saga and the Android Saga. And it was crap.
I think Mania Plus (and the Encore Mode) isn't canon like it is 3&K, after all both games are just "bonus games" and Iizuka ever repeated that 3&K isn't canon for this reason;
Plus, the Encore Mode have a ton of inconsistencies,
1. Phantom Ruby randomly appear in the past/dimension/whatever place,
2. Heavy King and the others HBH working again for Eggman after the last battle in Mania Mode for no reasons,
3. Knuckles and Tails randomly appears for helping Sonic... etc
Mania Adventures have a fluid plot where don't clash with those things and basically more canon than the Encore Mode;
The Boom games are canon to Boom TV series that was confirmed since the announcement (and completely confirmed with the presence of D-Fekt in the Season 2)
This isn't the first time where the Sonic games use other media to complete a story arc, thinking about the comics prequel of Forces, the prequel comic will be released soon for Team Sonic Racing, the others prequel comics of Sonic 4, Lost World, Chronicles, etc...
Even the short movie "Night of Werehog" clearly canon since the two ghosts appears in the game Unleashed
In the end for those reasons, for me Mania Adventures is more canon than the Encore Mode (Mania Plus)
Edit: Is confirmed that Sonic CD take place after S&K
People are still arguing over where Sonic CD goes to this day. I highly doubt anyone from SEGA or Sonic Team confirmed anything about when CD happened. Except that it was before Sonic 4...
Gaming Sensei Well, in this article sonicretro.org/2011/08/sega-staffer-speaks-sonic-cd-details-revised-as-sonic-4-prequel/ , Sega basically say CD set after 3&K and before S4 and still happened when it happened but doesn't mean directly set after or before in those games
the hooligans werent copies, it was just heavy magician being a chaotic lil bean and showing off her ability to mimic/ shapeshift into things just like the other friend u didn't choose
"Future games" Sonic mania takes place in the Past
Sonic mighty and ray Are the original team sonic!!!!! Think about it it makes sense
Nightmare 0907 not really team sonic formed with tails then knuckles
Poor mighty and ray
Well. Not really while SegaSonic IS canon they've been missing That's team Sonic 2 (I think)
Sorry for commenting so much, but I had an idea regarding the ending to Encore mode with the Heavy King showing up with the plate of ice cream. What if, with Eggman, and possibly the Phantom Ruby, gone, the Heavy King overwrote his own programming and became friendly, since he had no reason to fight Sonic anymore? I know it sounds crazy, but we've seen Eggman's robots do this before like E-102 Gamma and E-123 Omega. Of course, this idea, I realize, can easily be dismissed given how the Heavy King is just an Eggrobo illusion and thus not real and the Phantom Ruby is still at large. Of course, we know it must still exist in the classic universe if the Heavy King is still around since, as shown in Sonic forces, when the Phantom Ruby leaves a dimension, all the illusions it created in that dimension are dispelled. Since the Heavy King, an illusion of the Phantom Ruby, shows up at the end, we can assume the Phantom Ruby is still around in this dimension at least.
I also find the good ending of Encore Mode a little interesting. It appears that he's a "good guy" now. because otherwise why would he be approaching them with ice cream? If he wanted to attack them, he would have lunged at them with his scepter in hand, or something else.
So either he really is friendly, or perhaps he's being spiteful? Spiteful in the way that he knows this is all just a looping scenario and he's just having fun to himself before the whole situation repeats again in due time
Wouldn't Mirage Saloon be a virtual reality too given its a mirage ?
16:17 GamerGuyd did you just reference "We Can" from Sonic Heroes. You know, the lyrics "This time, not alone. We got some friends along."
I don't know why Sega doesn't just admit that sonic has no overall continuity and be done with it.
As of late June 2018, I officially got back into the Sonic The Hedgehog series after over a decade. So I started looking up the series lore and even bought a brand new copy of Sonic Forces (Bonus Edition) to celebrate the reunion of my love of the series. Anyhow, I encountered your channels around that time and your interesting theory video really kept my intrest whenever I was sleeping or visiting my doctor due to Physical injury which had me physically handicapped for over a year. I love your content and I'm sorry I forgot to subscribe all that time ago. (I just did now) I hope you continue doing what you do and have a nice day!
I'm glad people know one of my favourite games of all time Epic Mickey
Damn the editing is amazing. Nice work guyd
oh hell no... after mania plus I better see more of mighty and Ray
ikr
WE NEED THEM!
If all the zones are illusions except the new ones, explain how the stage transitions work
+Mr. Sheep *ThEy'rE jUsT iLuSsIoNs*
Meta Ridley, aka The Cunning God Of Death
okay, but if it takes place on Angel Island, is Lava Reef an illusion? Why would the original zones nit be illusions but Hydro City and Lava Reef? Why?
Flying battery wouldnt be one either.
+Jared Burk Lol don't take my obvious sarcastic comment serious.
Meta Ridley, aka The Cunning God Of Death
Can never be too sure. You could have been serious, and just a 10 year old. :P
That would kinda explain why Angel Island isn't floating... I guess. But Forces kinda made the whole saga a cluster. Robotnic created the Phantom Ruby in that story, right? I can't remember.
Rivers1129 I thought angel island had a body of water around it. In the background angel island, you can see ice cap, and ice cap is just a giant glacier meaning water has to be surrounding it. You can also see a body of water in mania adventures.
Modern Eggman created his own Phantom Ruby, using the data of the original. He wasn't about to risk losing the real one. So the real Ruby returned to the Classic Timeline after Forces.
Modern Eggman created his own Phantom Ruby, using the data of the original. He wasn't about to risk losing the real one. So the real Ruby returned to the Classic Timeline after Forces.
After hearing this it shocked me that we have 4 Sonics (Sonic, Shadow, Silver, and now Mighty (proto-Sonic))
.....husky .......sounds adorable and has an adorable character .
While I don't (want to) agree with this illusion theory, Mighty and Ray are, in fact, still missing. _In timeline 1._ They exist in Classic's world, but Modern Sonic never met them ever again, until that eventually happens in a future game.
yeah because timeline 1 is basically timeline 2 without mania but with a lot more games it's literally sonic's past but when generations happens sonic from timeline 1 meet's his past self and that created timeline 2 and now classic sonic doesn't go to sonic adventure but instead to mania and all of that shit happens and then he goes to forces and then comes back and finds mighty and ray and rescues them, so now after that some weird things happen in timeline 2 but now back to timeline 1 so I think in timeline 1 mighty went to find ray that's why he didn't stay with the chaotix and he got lost in the process of finding him so they both could be somewhere but ofc sega probably won't create a plot that revolves around finding them.
21:39 This theory was never real
OOOH SIT-
Mr gamerguy I don’t feel so good...
Wow this has got to be your best theory yet. I cant think of anything to debunk it at all. Good job!
But wait a minute. The Phantom ruby clones are made to be evil. But mighty and ray weren't. . . But then again. Why didn't might or ray attack the other in the capsule. Because Everything isn't as it seems. . . But then they legit change form. But no matter what everytime you play it, it could be mighty, or it could be ray.
Maybe the clones can just be what the ruby, or the ruby's user wants them to be? If the ruby is feeling like it wants to be entertained, maybe it will choose to make the clones "good". If it's feeling malicious, the clones are evil
I've got a theory that sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles are part of time line 1, but sonic 3 & Knuckles is considered another game and is placed on time line 2 because of the Super Emeralds being in 3 & Knuckles. Might make a video to explain it further.
When after finishing Sonic CD tails said: "See you next game", I thought that "next game'" is Sonic CD, but with tails. (I was playing christian whitehead's remaster of Sonic CD)
I think this is wrong cause they defeat heavy magition and why would Mighty and Ray be still there and the phantom ruby in the good end gets sucked up with robotnick and mighty and Ray are still their
Mighty, I don't feel so good. -Ray
Mighty to Knuckles: “it was the only way” *dies*
Wait... they were *MEANT* to be forgotten?
Yup
At least the modern Mighty and Ray exist
Triple Trouple IS canon. Besides Sonic Fighters it is only other appearance Fang the sniper has made. Plus saying the handhelds are not canon contridicts your earlier theory about Sonic Colors full story being split between its Wii and 3Ds interations.. Plus The Sonic Rivals Games are considered canon intriduction of Silver post 06 retcon from the timeline.
Fun fact: as confirmed by series creator,Akira Toriyama, Dragon Ball Super: Broly is cannon to the DBS manga and anime. For it was written by Akira Toriyama
How can we play as them? hmmmm...
am I an illusion?
Max Hamilton everything is a illusion. You're a illusion, sonic is a illusion.
Bruh
Freom the ultimate reploid god . OH OK
I really need to know how you do these theroies! Awesome video!
Maybe Red Sonic and Tail the Squirrel never existed at all which would explain why they are original the recolours.
Nice video! Amazing video as always
Thanks!
Dude this theory gave me the chills 😰
Nuben Mendarr That all sounds like a possibility
IT'S DARK AND VAUGE! OF COURSE IT'S BONE CHILLING!
Mania is connected to Forces and after the events of that game, mania plus comes
That was also my Theory
In the Comics SegaSonic happens before Sonic the Hedgehog 1 . . . Doesn't change anything just saying.
but why would mighty and ray help the trio, if they were phantom copies.
...What?
But, Sega doesnt exist in the Sonic world, they just create the games.
I wonder where Classic Amy and Honey the Cat are at. Any ideas?
This gives a whole new meaning to the usage of "FUN IS INFINITE".
As I was watching the beginning and GammerGuyd7Aces said that alot of strange things happen in Angel Island, I was thinking;
Angel Island is fake!
As always, wonderful video!
Aaron Webber is a social media manager. He isnt the head of sega, sonic team nor created Sonic. What he said wasn't even a fact he wasn't even sure cause he never created the game.
Sonic Mania Adventures takes place after Forces as you see the same pose Classic Sonic had at the end of forces in the first episode of mania adventures even the the description of the first episode proves it as well meaning it takes place within the main timeline. Encore Mode takes place in another timeline due to the fact the PHR is alive while the one in the main dimension is dead not only that the Encore Mode didn't have Sonic doing the pose he did at the end of Forces proving it takes place in alternate timeline.
Encore Mode is another timeline. Mania Adventures takes place in the main one.
I don't know I mean mighty is a pascifist and Ray loves adventuring so if anything I think Ray and mighty are just hanging around adventuring after this game and stuff
here's a joke that goesqlong with this theory
Mighty and Ray walk into a bar
except they dont because they would only be of drinking age in the modern games
my theory is a bit different, but it's somewhat similar. in Sonic Forces, Eggman used the Phantom Ruby to create evil clones of characters like Zavok and Shadow. However, my theory suggests that he used the Phantom Ruby to create clones of mighty and ray (like you said in the video) and make a mirage so once again they have to live the main story but set at night with mighty and ray, but in the end the heroes defeated the Phantom Robos again. At the end of the game, the Heavy King was just reprogrammed by Tails to work at an ice-cream parlor. As a result, everything returned to normal, and it's worth noting that Sonic Superstars is releasing this year and everything is back to normal, no sign of the phantom ruby.
i think parts of your theory did make sense
because mighty and ray hasnt appeared in superstars, i feel like the theory is correct they are not in superstars as they are still missing
I have a theory for mighty and ray!
What if after sonic ran away, egg man somehow managed to catch the duo again, after some years of trying to turn them into something
He made them into cubot and orbot (notice their colors)
Also it would make sense because mighty and rat would have been a trio with metal sonic (orbot cubot and metal is the current evil trio( what do you think?
Your editing is really really good!
I have a better theory:
GamerGuyd7Aces:So, that's exactly my theory! And re-
???:Aaaces...
Aces:W-w-hat?
???:Dooon't you reaaaliiise?...
Aces:REALISE WWH--H-H-AT?
???:That we never even thought about anythiing, we never made it so deep...
Aces:No, it can't b-b-b-be...
Takashi Iizuka:We made it to just make people BUY MERCHANDISE AND GAMES MOREEEE. WE MADE ALL THE HYPE WITH RAY AND MIGHTY WITHOUT AN EXPLAINATION, JUST FOR MOOONEEEY
Aces:No, it can't be, NO, NO, NO!
NOOOOOO!
*signal problems*
Iizuka:Buy... merchandise... BUY... MERCHANDISE... MONEY IS INFINITE WITH SEGA ENTERPRISESSSSS
*signal lost*
Yesssssss new video!
I know you worked hard on this but sometimes, you shouldn’t overthink things. These theories actually anger me because you are only trying to make the story sad
Maybe it's because my life is sad too
There’s too much filler in this video.
How? lol
1. You should’be put the sponsor in the beginning of the video.
2. You could’ve explained everything faster.
Mighty and Ray maybe still missing but still i wish mighty and ray will appear in modern games if mighty was in forces my soul would leave my body
Mighty and Ray are not dead I think thank you for the video guys.
they aren't dead but they are missing somewhere it's kind of fishy and creepy.
Not really a big fan of your theories but this is probably your best one yet.
btw, after you hit the future sign in stardust speedway, you never hit a past sign later, meaning all zones after stardust speedway are in the future. ;)
The phantom ruby is probably the most scariest and powerful jewels in the sonic series. Imagine if it feel into the hands of someone more evil and smart than Eggman! That would be s crazy sonic plot.
Edited: I was an idiot when it came to Sonic lore 2 years ago, but I'm smart enough to know there are seven Chaos Emeralds, and Sonic the Fighters has 8 Emeralds. So if that game is canon, does that mean that there are more than 7, or heck, 8 Emeralds? It's certainly interesting now that I think about it.
Maybe Heavy Magician can make two Illusions now? Or maybe the Heavy and the Ruby..
Aaron Webber is a Social Media director. I wouldn't take him as a reliable source since he isnt the creator of the series and has no authority over the main canon continuity.
Non-Ugandan Knuckles He isn't he is social media director he has no authority over games. Everyone knows thatm
Non-Ugandan Knuckles proof of the Arch Angel UK? cause I'm pretty sure he has no.authority over the canonicity of the games as well.
Yes but, if they were phantom copys they would be attacking Sonic. If it was controlled by eggman anyway. Which it was because heavy magician uses it. And it's safe to assume that Ray was merely taken away from them and retrieved from a moniter. And you might say," but when they die they reappear back into ring boxes. Spooky right?" But so do Tails and Knuckles and even Sonic. So here's the 4 1 1. Encore mode is a time look but when a character dies they get transported into moniters so they can continue the loop later. But at the end, they are in the normal mirage saloon. The non encore mode mirage saloon. So I kinda sorta think they escaped it. And Mighty and Ray are the real ones not weird illusions because if they were they would be attacking Sonic. And whoever you didn't pick at the start of encore mode was stolen away and places in a ring box or special stage. So there is what I think.
This would make sense if it weren’t for the fact that the Phantom Ruby doesn’t activate until after Sonic finds them.
The Phantom Ruby is a very scary artifact when you theorize it in this way, this is by far the darkest theory thus far, I feel bad for the Classic world now.
Say...Did the thumbnail change? Or was it like this all along? Or was it....THE RUBY!?
6:55 Gamerguyd, your friend said that every place that Sonic visited in Sonic Mania that he has been to before (like Green Hill and the Chemical Plant) is an illusion, he said places that are not an illusion are only the places where Sonic never been before (like Studiopolis and Press Garden), does that mean Flying Battery that appears at the end of Studiopolis (in that TV) is an illusion inside of a reality?
(I await replies 😏)
BTW Battle of Gods, Reseraction F and Dragon Ball Super movie of the new Broly are the onlt movies that are canon to the main Dragon Ball timeline.
This was insane. One of your best theories
Remember when Mania Plus was just a harmless sonic game? Same here.
This video gives off silent hill zone vibes especially that ending just hearing the phantom ruby and it's illusion noises
Man just appreciate them being here...
Sega Sonic the Hedgehog, and Sonic the Fighters can be canon, but not the 8-bit games!? Making them non-canon because "handheld games" is a mute point considering some were original Master System games, a home console.
Nack/Fang debuted in Triple Trouble, and making that game non-canon basically gets rid of his entire character.
Not to mention the 8-bit games don't even cause any serious timeline flaws. I guess Sonic CD should also be non-canon since it "interrupts the flow of the classic trilogy". Why would Robotnik build Metal Sonic *before* Silver Sonic? If the 8-bit games were canon, you could just say the Silver Sonic prototype was built first in Sonic 2 8-bit which could then take place before Sonic CD. Sega themselves want Sonic CD to take place in-between Sonic 2 and Sonic 3, which doesn't work cause Sonic 3 is a direct sequel to Sonic (taking place days apart).
You can easily fit it all together with ease; most Classic Sonic games even don't conflict with each other.
Sonic 1 - Master System and Genesis happen at the same time
Sega Sonic the Hedgehog - Likely before Tails meets Sonic, placement unknown
Sonic Labyrinth - Game has 6 emeralds thus taking place before Sonic 2. Tails absent.
Tails Adventures - Taking place sometime before Tails meets Sonic.
Tails Skypatrol - Taking place sometime before Tails meets Sonic.
Sonic 2 Master/GG - Silver sonic prototype is built (Assuming it is one) This prototype has the ability to spindash; this is how sonic learns the move!
Sonic CD - Super Peel-out and "unstable" spindash. Original Metal Sonic is created.
Sonic Drift - This can happen anywhere after Sonic CD since Amy is here. (It takes place on South Island)
Sonic Chaos (Tails starts helping Sonic) Sonic has perfected the spindash.
Sonic 2 16-bit (Start of the 7 emeralds and death egg saga) Final version of Silver Sonic.
Sonic 3 (Follows Sonic 2 directly)
Sonic & Knuckles (Follows Sonic 3)
Sonic Triple Trouble - Knuckles has been tricked again, Nack/Fang is introduced.
Knuckles' Chaotix - Takes place after S3&K; Metal sonic is rebuilt from Sonic CD into "Metal Sonic Kai" (He now has red eyes)
Sonic 3D Blast - Sonic goes on a solo adventure by himself
Sonic Drift 2 - Metal sonic has red eyes so it takes place after chaotix. Nack is also present which means this occured after Triple Trouble.
Sonic the Fighters - Death Egg from Sonic Drift is constructed into the Death Egg II.
Sonic Mania - After S3&K and Chaotix.
Theory: The entire game (Aside from Angel Island) Just an illusion and the whole game takes place on The Death Egg.
Remember your cannibal theroy,what if that dimension of the theroy does exist but sonic doesn’t remember it...
Goddamn my brain froze by watching this video, I think superstars retcons this whole phantom ruby thing