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When to Use Pipe dope, Teflon Tape, Neither or Both for Threaded Connection
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- Опубліковано 24 січ 2018
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When making a threaded connection, when should you use teflon tape, pipe dope, something else, or nothing at all.
Adding pipe dope to black iron pipe
What is a tapered thread connection
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One of the best educational videos out there. The best I've seen. Clear, detailed, yet simple and short. No time waisted. Thank you very much for that. *saved to my plumbing videos.
I use tape for plastic on plastic threads. Dope for mixing metal and plastic threads. Dope for metal on metal threads. Often the metal threads will cut into the tape and cause it to bunch up or causes too much to be between the threads so you cant tighten it enough. Once I learned this I saved myself many many hours. Never had a leak using pipe dope since then, only downside is it can be messy even with the most careful applications. This is for sprinklers so not indoor plumbing but similar idea. Our lines never really exceed 80PSI for the vast majority so really high pressure applications may be a different story.
The other thing to know about teflon tape is that it does not seal the threads. Its only purpose is to lubricate the threads so you can tighten it to a point that the threads seal themselves. As mentioned in the video the threads taper to create a seal as you tighten them. Often times friction prevents you from being able to tighten the threads to that point without tape or dope. Plastic fittings can even fuse together from the heat/friction before you reach that point without any tape or dope. I did not know this when I first started but once it was explained to me it made much more sense.
Before you apply tape OR dope, check your fittings for poor threads, crushed threads, missing or interrupted threads, galled threads that pulled out etc. At the very least --on the exposed male threads should be carefully inspected. Cheap black pipe nipples can be threaded using old dies that needed to be serviced or replaced as they don't cut to spec anymore. Also dropped or crushed threads are very common on the pipe you buy at big block retailers as careless consumers may dent the threads when handlin longer sticks. Use a stiff steel wire brush to clean up the threads and investing in chasing dies to reform damaged male threads is not very expensive insurance, especially if you are re-using old threaded couplers and fittings in the smaller sizes up to 1-1/4". The female taps can be worth it in the smaller residential sizes as well.
There are zero makers of Dope who tell a pipe fitter to use dope AND tape on a single fitting. It is a bad idea as the two are not compatible. Tape does not stick to anything and the dope will squeeze into the interior of the pipe when the fitting is tightened, causing clogs and destroying metering valves and gas regulators and thermostats. Really bad idea as the dope does not stick to the teflon tape. Get a thicker tape if your fittings require that much filler. Also do not apply dope or tape all the way to the end of the fitting as the squeeze out of either can become loose and create clogs in the gas appliance you are installing. The drip leg is designed to catch rust, scale and particulates but when was he last time you cleaned one of those out?
Always use tape and dope,and dope and or never seize my union faces/gasket faces with some flanges,and I’ve been noticing a lot of younger guys on jobs putting tape over dope,that’s not right..tape,then dope,,save yourself time and money…licensed pipe fitter,gas fitter,sprinkler fitter ,30 years working in power plants,chemical plants,steam,gas,air,etc.. let’s teach these kids right and keep our trades alive and well,thanks for your video
You applied the Teflon tape in the correct direction but you put the wicking on backwards. I'm not kidding, it really does make a difference.
Probably because he watched the video that This Old House put out and passed it off as his own content without knowing what he was doing. ua-cam.com/video/jHeCP21ik7w/v-deo.html
@JD Spears that's a negative
@@dubz5149 Can you explain? I'm not a plumber, but it looks like the teflon was put on backward as well. He installed it counter-clockwise. Wouldn't it possibly unravel when threaded into the female end?
@@fourdragonv2 just think about it going into a pipe as he put the Teflon riding on the threads
I use teflon tape on npt fittings that go up to 2000 psi to have a no leak seal with only hydrogen in the line. Hydrogen will find a leak, it is the smallest molecule. I've never used pipe dope.
I'm state licensed as a plumber, but really I'm a state licenced HVAC guy. On a FB group named, "Plumbers, handymen need not apply" I asked, "Dope, Teflon tape or both?."I had 95 rsponses, at least 80% said "both", many adamant. I've asked another 12 or so in my locale since then. Here too about 75% say "both." Me? Both
I work on ships in the engineroom. I generally use tape with some dope added. Generally, there are times when you have to take pipe connections apart to fix something else or just one thing gets changed out. So using just dope almost always makes the pipe harder to seperate as well as requires cleaning and additional prep. If its a permanent fixture then just dope is perfect. Otherwise using just tape may cause leaks so by using the tape and then dope on top it makes it easier to clean the male threads. Usually you can jist clean the threads by removing the tape with fingers, a knife, or a wire brush.. So generally tape and then dope to make things easier and quicker.
You put the wicking on backward, when you turn the fitting on (righty tighty) the wicking will unravel, same as if you put teflon tape on backward.
Attention to detail at its best
Exactly…
He may have got putting the wicking on wrong, but the info in the video was quite helpful.
I’m a heating and air guy so I install hot water heaters, boilers, and steamers regularly. For hot water applications I like to use both to be safe. Tape then dope. For cold water one or the other is fine with the exception of big diameter pipe (1 1/4”+) I use both. For natural gas/propane I use just dope.
Why do you need a heater for hot water?
@@michaelcutchin3692 he meant hot water tank or tankless use your brain
@@michaelcutchin3692 The heater makes hot water so it is a hot water heater.
I worked in the chemical industry for 20 years. We ran hot oil systems. Most were welded connections. Where ever there was a ntp connection. We used a product called x-pando. Crazy stuff! This product is amazing. I had a chance to buy this company years ago when a little old lady owned it. And there product was really unknown. Its a black powder you mix with water. You make it into a pancake consistency. Clean the pipe with a solvent, and dry. Add this paste to the in side threads and out side threads. Tighten as you normally would. And let it dry. Better then a welded pipe. I never had a leak in all the years i used it. And i was using it on 600 degrees hot oil systems.
I use both yellow gas line tape just a little pro/dope 💯 no gas leaks n never call backs. Never hurts to use both gives me a piece of mind especially when I just worked on a Custermer s home. I sleep better at night .
Well I just finished a gas line and some brass fittings for water. Now then when you talk about tape versus pipe dope one must consider the following: The manufacture and quality of each product. The Monster Blue tape is awesome. When I put a lot of dope the blue one on the pipe it just was not visible rubs off. I found that a tight layer first of pipe thread and a little pipe dope is the best as the pipe dome lubricates the teflon tape a adds a better end seal when it hardens. Stay away from the white cheap thread seal tape.
I'm from Ireland so we have different terms for everything you have mentioned.
But anyway,
If you put the dope on first and then the wicking, the dope acts as a lubricant preventing the wicking from going deep into the joint (it slides up the threads as you tighten) . Wicking and then dope means the wicking stays in place but is lubricated into the joint.
Oh and you wound it the wrong way!
I didnt know about wicking. I was wondering about the direction but assumed he was doing it right. Thanx
Yeah that part bothered me...
you mean the starting point or the direction?
The wicking was the wrong direction. The tape was the right direction.
Tape is ok for some applications, but if attaching threaded pipe where the liquid deteriorates Teflon tape, like connecting heating oil lines, tape will disintegrate and potentially foul the oil. Dope is the only material to use in such applications. It's not about what is easy to use or minimizing a mess, it's about the right material for the correct application.
Not a plumber so I live off of tutorials on UA-cam. That was clear, concise, and well done !
And wrong !!! They put the wicking on backwards !
@@barryestell6324 u noticed that and the pipe dope way to low
@@pipers255 pipe dope just lubricates the pipe, you don’t need it on the first 3 threads. And plumbers live off UA-cam as well lol
If you are running natural gas (or propane or butane) piping you should use gas rated tape. It is tape made specially for gas. It’s yellow and thicker.
Gas rated dope exists too.
Not exactly a pro plumber, but I have done quite a bit of it, in my experience tape is often the easiest and most convenient, but there are a few cases that tape just doesn't seem to cut it, mostly old fittings, large fittings, and pipe that was threaded by say the hardware store instead of the factory. Sometimes it seems to just get shredded by the very act of screwing the peices together. If something gives me trouble then I get out the goop and/or wicking. I also use teflon tape sometimes to make sure I can take something apart in say 5 years from now. For these various reasons sometimes I use both but it's not usually necessary.
Nice video that references opinions from the "pros", I wish more vidz would do this. Its nice to know what the experienced guys are doing....
Professional Plumber for over 40 years.. both have there place.. “Pipe dope” started out as a linseed oil based product to act as a lubricant to help seat the threads correctly. The addition of sealants came about because the manufacturing tolerances on pipe threads got out of hand! NPT, tapered pipe threads... When made correctly have what’s known as “the depth of perfect thread” ideally a thread that’s made that you can screw the fitting on 2 1/2 threads by hand.... then finish with a wrench.
On stainless pipe threads, I will use tape and pipe dope. Again, the dope is a lubricant, the tape is the sealant ( stainless threads will gall and weld themselves together)
As far as “Yellow” tape for natural gas.. that’s a joke. If you take the time to review a chemical resistance chart on “Teflon” (PTFE) you will find the only thing that remotely affects PTFE is Tomato Paste.
To sum this up, think about the connection your working with, the condition of the threads your working with and make a decision on which you think will work best. Tape and dope together will never hurt in most situations, plastic threads are different (Just Tape), it’s too easy to cross the threads with pipe dope! As far as the “wicking”. It’s called “Lamp Wick”. Yes as in a kerosene lamp wick! Thanks for sharing and Best Regards!
Thanks for your input, this is all very valuable information!
Yellow tape is thicker. That is why it's recommended for gas lines. It has nothing to do with reacting to different metals. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thread_seal_tape
Now I am wondering what they use in the Tomato Paste Factory? or do they just let it leak? lol
@@pbc1951 haha! That’s a post from 2 years ago! 🤣🤣. Be Blessed Brother!
Tape is less resistant to vibration than dope so equipment like my air compressors get dope. Official locking sealants exist (it pays to visit manufacturer websites because offerings change all the time). I use Loctite red gel on personal tapered pipe fittings on my motorcycle and auto engines because all anaerobic locking compounds also act as anti-seize. (Locking and seizing are very different, seizing normally due to corrosion is destructive failure). That maintains the clock position of my fittings without relying on high torque. Tapered pipe fittings are NOT designed for high vibration use, they just get used anyway (except in aircraft where straight threaded sealed fittings are the norm, I'm also a jet mech).
Totally subscribing. I'm building my own house and doing all the plumbing. I just got to connecting my tub tailpiece to the trap using a plastic adapter and wondered if I needed Teflon tape.
Awesome, thank you! That's really great that you're building your own home, if you run into plumbing or H-Vac questions that you can't figure out then send us a message!
In the fire sprinkler trade we pretty much all use tape and dope. Only time I don’t use both is on the side I pullling the fitting on using the machine. I use just dope. The side I’m making in I always dope then tape. We’re usually dealing with a lot higher presser. Typically ranging from 75-175psi and it can also get upwards of 300+psi.
We stick to Pipe Dope and Teflon, we like your flow ! Yes Sir! Yes Yes
DUDE> You're holding the teflon tape roll backwards. That's why it wasn't going on easily for you. Roll the tape onto the threads from the top of the roll, rather than trying to unwind the tape from the bottom of the roll.
That's dope!
Sa, thank you!
I've always taken the extra time and used tape first and followed it up with the dope and never had a leak or a call back.
The purpose of pipe dope or Teflon tape is to lubricate the threads so they can be tightend enough to make a liquid tight connection. Neither is actually a sealant. If I wanted a SEALANT ,I would use a silicone sealant or an epoxy.
You always apply wicking in a clockwise direction- like tape. I still use raw hemp. Cheap and effective. I’m a plumber. Only use tape on plastic fittings. Hemp doesn’t draw in properly 😜
Naval vessels use only rector seal pipe dope. It has a special ASTME number for the type rector seal that meets the Navy's specification. I figure if its good enough for them, it's good enough for me....they do not use teflon tape. Neither do I.
For my RV’s main propane line, I have black iron pipe, with an adapter for a flare hose connection to my RV appliance. Wouldn’t I just use the yellow gas tape?
Back in the 80's teflon tape was the thing and we never ever used pipe dope. I personally never had a leak with teflon tape using it on my rental properties, personal home, and flip houses. Was surprised when I discovered pipe dope still in being used in 2023. They say its safe for potable water but I seriously question that.
I use both. I've made good seals using just one of the other but I had an old plumber tell me that he's NEVER had a leak because he uses both so I figure since he'd been doing it for 40 years why not do what he does. It's only takes 5 seconds longer and it's certainly worth it if you never have to do it again. Tape and then dope
My rule of thumb. When in doubt, throw some tape on it.. it’s cheap easy and clean. I know which applications to use it but I just say to people. To be safe rather than risk a leak. Iv never used pipe dope. Iv heard people love it
I use alot of black iron on my hydronic heating systems. Been doing it for quite some time now. Leaks are your nemesis. Extremely frustrating. Never in a convenient location. I now use tape first then pipe dope on every fitting. Especially your unions. Tape and dope the threads on your unions on heating systems. The up and down in temperature of the water, they will start leaking guaranteed. If there's a thread, tape and dope.
As a gas pipe installer I use dope and then tape, and if it’s 2” or larger diameter I apply a second layer of dope to the inside of the fitting. Some would say it’s overkill but I rarely encounter leaks.
Check out the specs on PipeFit Anaerobic pipe dope.
Here in Greece where I am located,all plumbers use hemp combined with pro dope or hemp with PTFE tape on top...Tried to explain to some the lunacy of this, but no luck.They also wind it backwars which is also wrong since we're dealing with tapered threads and sealant has to be conical.Many times found myself correcting joints made by local plumbers.
Stopped using pipe dope in 2016, only use Teflon (on potable, heating and nat. gas)
If done correctly (proper orientation, do NOT over-apply), you will be 100% leak-free
This guy is awesome
A good reason is an old plumber told you to do it that way? That's a terrible reason! Second, the survey only asked 30 plumbers. The sample size is way too small. Third, asking plumbers may not be the best source. They may just respond in a way that everyone else will. The best source is an independent researcher that actually tested the efficacy of different methods.
At 1:15, he is winding the wicking WITH the direction of rotation, whereas at 1:40, he is winding the teflon tape AGAINST the direction of rotation. Shouldn't both be AGAINST, so that tightening the pipe tends to tighten the wicking or tape?
I use both. Tape the threads then dope, more of a lubricant than anything else allows for a tighter joint with less effort.
Both. For the one time it would have been needed, and does save a return call, then its worth it to us.
I found tape does not work well on threaded brass adapter. Hand tight will leak a lot, wrench tight will slow drip. The metal thread seems to cut the tape to pieces.
I have a plastic 1" barb fitting, going into a PVC coupler. I used Teflon tape on it, and it leaks. I didn't put a lot of torque on it, though. I wonder if the plastic fitting's seams tore the tape up. They're all two halves apparently. In the Natural Gas industry, on threaded connections, we used Swak.
Pipe dope with PTFE in it I’ve also used Blue Teflon tape with pipe dope as a double seal and I’ve had no leaks or call backs …. Call backs are bad for business
Great video! Straight to the point and thanks for not trying to sell me anything.lol
Put your finger thru the hole in the teflon easier to apply and get it tight when we do boilers we use both. use to use just dope tell one time it leaked and an 1-1/2" B.I.header with 4 zones its a pain in the ass to strip it back and that one time I had to remove the whole header in plumbing u learn from your one time mistakes.
thanks 4 the video... still unclear though... ....ive got teflon tape... its a copper pipe to a iron compression fitting to another iron fitting then hose bib.....maybe double teflon wrapping on threads cause they are real nice sharp shiny and tight for forty tears old in ground and see if it stays dry..... and i will see if that holds... great video concise to the point but lots of goop or not... what a decision...
If you have pipe dope available its less difficult than Teflon for non-professionals. Just get the dope in the valley of the threads. But few non professional have pipe dope laying around and many home connections in my experience need several wraps to fill the threads properly or are very tight from the get go. Good luck.
On oil and gas wells, they tape and dope everything from what I saw.
I asked my gas-fitter brother-in-law if he uses one or both
He asked if I wear suspender with a belt
I said no...
He said...."I do"
If you're messing around with natural gas line, always tape and dope. I know it's only 15psi but I don't recommend anyone taking any chances. I don't care how messy it might gets.
Very bad wrong ignore and why. Other comments agree dangerous posting. Here's just two problems / errors: black iron pipe is only for gas mostly natural gas which requires the more expensive special purpose for gas applications YELLOW Teflon tape, second any plumber who takes pride in their work would never NOT thoroughly clean out ALL old sealant or tape from a pipe fittings s/he planned to reuse. Trick this can be difficult even with a steel wire brush don't use brass or plastic brush but if you torch the thread area first then the steel brush will take all the old stuff off easily. If your not a journeyman and willing to SHOW your credibility please don't post as the expert you AREN'T!!!!
If you're so knowledgeable why are you watching this video? 🤔
@@fern9234 Maybe his hobby is policing posers.
What about pipe thread sealant stick?
But how do you get the pipe to screw on to the place you want the thread to be directed. If they not water tight and facing wrong direction do you just add a heap of tape until it goes tight to the right direction??? If the elbow is facing the wrong way once tight is what i meant.
Clean n Clear instruction. Thank you for sharing!
Sick video, my students liked the video!
Glad to hear that!
Man this sounds a lot like 'this old house'!
Hi. Just wondering what is best to use for the connections to a tankless water heater.
Damn I did a bunch of black iron today and I always use dope and tape.
Well done.
This guy jacked this information from a this old house episode almost identical.
Thanks. Good information.
I’ve always used both but make sure you use the right Teflon for what you’re doing white Teflon and gas line is a big no-no
I'm having a terrible time getting a threaded plastic fitting to seal into a threaded brass fitting. Tried small amounts of Teflon tape - still dripped. Tried a TON of teflon tape - still dripped. Tried tightening the snot out of it until the plastic fitting was going to break - still dripped. Am now back to only white plumbers dope but I have my doubts as my last attempt with it - still dripped. I think the brand of dope is not good but it came from a large strictly plumbing outfit so you'd think......BTW, it's fittings on a hot water tank and I'm seeing the leak change with the temperature of the water...
Could be the threads. Careful with plastic, easy to over tighten hand tight and only one turn after. Dope and/or tape can make it feel like you should keep going. Don't. Could use tape then dope (both) if you have both.
If using dope on a gas line, is it better to let it dry before turning on the gas, or does the pressure help force the dope into any leak points? Also, how important is gas rated dope vs. a random tube of ptfe stuff?
I was always under the impression that pipe dope and tape didn't actually seal anything but helped lubricate the threads and allow you to drive the connection tighter than without them and that's what created the seal not the tape or dope.
Wrong impression...
I normally use Teflon tape and get good results on liquid and air fittings but thread paste? or pipe sealant seems to lubricate better? and allow some movement - 1/2 turn or so to loosen without leaking that make me wonder if there are some advantages to pipe sealant / dope over tape in some situations.
Greetings, Paul! There are advantages to both of them, the right option depends on the application you're using it for.
Thanks that clears that question up
I've plumbed tons of galvanized on a boat, if it's just a small leak, it'll rust itself shut. Presuming it's water running through it.
Great video. Very helpful.
Great job!
I was installing sprinklers the other day, and noticed it says "DO-NOT-USE-PIPE-DOPE" on the bottom of the sprinkler head. I didn't know what to make of it. Were they calling me a dope and I shouldn't use a pipe or was I not supposed to smoke dope in my pipe!!? LOL JK
I am just installing a new water heate rin my RV, I have to insert a threaded brass fitting in there. I tried teflon tape first but has seepage, so I geuss its pipe dope for me.
what is the condition of the male / female threads? Might leak with either method or require some RTV or glue like sealant. Expoxy could be use but it can only be removed with heat (but there must be room for a torch and the pipe must be metal).
And a trick an old plumber taught me was to take your hacksaw and drag it lightly sideways across the teeth a couple of times first. Gives it a tooth the stops it spinning off, especially on plastic . Fine sawzall blades do the trick too.
I've re-read your comment 3 times and I still can't make sense of it
@@peterhamborg9576 When you t-tape a joint, the tape often tends to spin around the pipe unless you start it with your left thumb on it, then pull it tight a couple of times to bite into the thread- each time holding it with your thumb. If you drag a saw blade sideways across the threads it makes little teeth that catch the tape and stop it sliding. Makes it much faster to tape a bunch of joints.
Thank you!!
I have a pool heater that at the joint that is plastic it says no plumber's dope just tape. Why is this?
Amazing video thumps up 👍
Thanks!
So with plastic, you dont use pipe dope usually, right?
Correct, not typically seen but most dope are made for PVC, CPVC, ABS, and even nylon plastic pipe systems.
you are showing wicking anticlockwise 🙂
Use both
Great video.
dude - your cool
I just use hemp fibres and a bit of grease. never had any issues with leaks.
I use pipe dope but it sometimes I still get leaks
Good stuff mate
Thanks!
Good info. Watch This Old House video. Same information.
Not just same info, but this guy plagiarized quite a bit, except for the. ua-cam.com/video/jHeCP21ik7w/v-deo.html
Only thing different was the poll and opinions from poll.
Thank you for the information. It will help with my new project. Also, this is a good video. You have a good camera presence, and I think (me, not being anyone important) that with some more confidence and practice, you could become a much bigger channel. Again, my only "expertise" is watching alot of UA-cam videos, so probably take this with a grain of salt. Anyway, good video and a good info.
Blue leak lock for critical applications never had it leak
Not all dopes are created equal, If its super critical for no leaks, FPPI anaerobic pipe dope, its good to 10,000 psi liquid.
Lasco Fittings, Inc. does not recommend PTFE tapes on PVC fittings instead use a non-hardening, PVC compatible sealant. PTFE tapes cause deformations of the female PVC fittings compromising structural integrity and lowering the rated PSI for the fitting.
why would you ever need to use both? The pipe dope always acts in the exact same manner.
No mention of anaerobics??? Loctite?? 567?
Thanks. I have a brass pipe that has a slow leak at the threads. Tried tape, tried pipe-dope and neither worked. I'll try both and see how that works.
That's strange, let me know if using both works. Is it cold in your area? If it is then maybe the pipe is contracting.
I'm happy to report back.. Using both definitely worked!! Thanks a lot!
...and another typical no report back
@@SR-jz9wn - the guy replied m.imgur.com/a/VzF4uNK
Don't use Teflon tape, Teflon paste or pipe dope. ... Teflon paste and pipe dope, just like Teflon tape, make threaded joints slippery. Their use on PVC fittings can be an invitation to over-torque. When working with threaded plastic fittings do use a proper sealant.
This reminds me of the time I calledy supplier and said "I need some help to pack a joint...."
Can I use silicone on the threads?
Don't, it may seal at first but it won't last nearly as long as pipe dope.
Teflon, then dope. Fittings screw in so much easier.
I need to know if teflon tape should be used when connecting a PEX adapter to galvanized pipe.
As a natural gas pipe installer, I use tape and dope on anything connecting to galvanized or black iron if it’s 1” or larger. On smaller sizes it won’t hurt to use both, but I usually just use dope. Tape is too error prone to be used alone in gas applications, so I personally wouldn’t use it alone for water either.
Tape and dope aren't for sealing they're so you can take the thing apart 30 years later. If you have a leak there's something wrong with the threads or you didn't tighten it enough.
When I use cruddy plastic swamp cooler overflows, they seem to leak no matter what without tape...
FYI. Teflon tape is not manufactured any longer. What you have is PTFE tape.
Ptfe is the acronym for the generic chemical. Teflon is just a trade name.
"Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) is a synthetic fluoropolymer of tetrafluoroethylene that has numerous applications. The well-known brand name of PTFE-based formulas is Teflon by Chemours''. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene