do you really need to ''subdue'' the river?... can't you just let it be and use a simple paddle wheel? [make one by yourself! ] that will last for decades?...
@@user-McGiver Yes, it seems like they (Jeff is to blame ;-) you can take it big boy) are getting to playing like "government employees"*. Perhaps it is the money being made available - or fame for the client..... Drilling holes in rocks that have been there for 60,000 years or more, from what I see, is noting short of graffitti. Or vandalism!! Why not a long bar from side to side of the valley secured in a mobile concrete base (wheels can be inserted so that it can be rolled out of position)with a wheel on it, and the whole rig secured from a high tree above? It won't last a heavy storm as it is. I've just had 3 ton trees sweep past my window this last week, and another 7m oak stuck right now needing to be cut up and removed - perhaps only 2 tons, but if you get that sort of stuff comind down, you'll be properly tested - I know the catchment area in question is much smaller than my area, I'm not half way up a mountain, and those levels of water flow are not likely to arise, but none the less, construct something that can be protected or removed in seriously bad times, because they are coming, or didn't you get the message? * unproductive
The gravel and sand will still cause problems in wearing the turbine runner and nozzles quickly, if you don't improve the intake. Ideally, a coanda effect screen intake designed with an accelerator plate leading onto the screen, making sure the water is doing at least 1m/s across the screen, keeps any solids suspended higher in the flow and only clean water is sliced through the screen. When designed well, with enough bypass flow, coanda screens should be self-cleaning. While the wedge-wire in the screen is not cheap, the overall cost can be reduced by making the screen housing yourself. Never hear anyone complaining about the cost after they are installed, as they are so low maintenance.
Build a flow over dam and take the water into the penstock at the half way point between the surface and the bottom... the gravels all fall to the bottom of the pond... the sticks and leaves all float over the top of the dam.
I removed my coanda screen intake, after 18 years of use, as it was a always a bit of a hassle to keep it "happy" with precisely the right amount of flow, as I don't have the luxury of a proper coffer dam or accelerator (?) plate, it's just positioned directly under a culvert! It also had moss or some kind of fungus that had to be sandblasted off every few weeks during the summer, if not the delivered flow would drop off. I replaced it with a simple steel trough, 4' long x 12" wide, with stainless 1/4" mesh on top, it's on a slight downhill incline. It's worked great for 2 months now, full delivery 24/7, total cost about $100.00. 147' of head, 3" line, 33 amps @ 26 VDC, grid tied, via an Outback 3500 watt inverter, with an additional 1500 watts of solar to the same inverter. I was off grid for 28 years, due to no powerlines to my old place, now, on my new 70 acres, I am grid tied, with a simple net metering system, so I don't waste a single watt with fully charged batteries! I get every watt back I produce, no matter how long ago. Being off grid is great, if you HAVE TO BE.
40 years ago, we dug a trench from the middle of the stream behind my dad's place in White Pass, WA two feet deep in the bottom of an existing hole above bedrock and paralleling the flow to a penstock with a 50 foot elevation difference, inlaying a 3" PVC pipe to run a turbine. It's worked flawlessly year round ever since. Turbine was an under-shot Pelton wheel. Inlet was an inverted stainless steel drum with 1/16" holes punched in its cylindrical sides to let in maximum flow and minimum debris.
@Gridlessness Ya, what's crazy though is, the penstock is under a concrete and wood deck behind the house. My dad is long gone (heck, I'm 75!), the house has been sold and resold and I doubt anyone else now even knows it's there !!!
@116thcrazy Hey, that's a terrific idea. I'm 75, live about 7 states away and like I said somewhere else, the property has likely been sold and resold over the past nearly 60 years. If you would be so kind as to provide me the current Owner's name and mailing address, I'll fire off that letter. Great idea!
Pebbles and rocks in the crossflow turbine is not the fault of the turbine manufacture it is because you guys did not use or make an appropriate intake with a coanda screen or sediment/pebbles settling tank before entering the penstock. If you do not screen your intake water with the new turbine the sand and pebbles are going to wet sandblast the plastic nozzles and the stainless steel Turgo wheel.
Lookin good , never underestimate a few watts thats consistent. Time flies and battery's are easily over charged . 5 6 7 hundred watts consistent is way better than 2 to 3 k of solar in a day plus draining batteries every night , I would like to point out that keeping the 3 phase run up to the house is more efficient. Easily rectified before the charge controller. Not knocking what you got , Iv done the same . It works , you know the numbers you adjust . Theres living and living well Awesome setup, and cool video.
The difference between the 560W calculated and 460W displayed might be due to two effects: 1) If the DC is noisy, then the bandwidth of the measuring device or if the device is measuring average or true RMS (Even of the DC amount) 2) you might have some phase difference between the current and voltage devices, even thoug it's DC the ripple might be causing this. You'd need a proper true RMS power meter to calibrate the MPPT converter's display. If the MPPT likes to O/C the input thinking it's a solar, then you'd need to dump power for a hydro input to keep the turbine loaded, you have the power dumping relays, so you could setup the MPPT to target a voltage above the load shedding devices. All pretty interesting :)
If I ever win the lottery, this is exactly what I'd do with some of the money. I'd buy property with an ample year round water source that originates on the property. That way nobody upstream could divert your water source. Then I'd sink millions upon millions into solar and hydroelectric infrastructure. As well as installing a huge sand battery for heating and power storage. I wouldn't care what it cost me. When it was done, It wouldn't matter what time of day, month, or climate pattern. I'd still produce enough power to supply half the county that I was living in. The outside world would be so insignificant that not even Thanos could snap his fingers and affect me.
Why would anyone buy land without water? If you want to go offgrid then go where you have land and water and space to do what you want. And no idiots coming along to tell you what is right and wrong like me.
@@kennethkeen1234 My land has plenty of water, so much that I would never have to worry about drinking water. I just don't have a nice fast-running stream like this person has.
Yep absolutely is valuable. In fact I'm looking for land I'm looking for something that has a stream and a elevation difference in order to utilize it for micro hydro project. In addition to my solar I've already built up. 👍
I have been thinking about sand batteries lately. For systems like hydro, wind and solar, when they have maxed out their battery charge, they need to expel their power somewhere, which is often in big resistors, that turns power into heat. That is perfect for a sand battery, which is a very large mass of sand, that uses a resistive heater, it turn power into heat, that a sand battery is very good at taking in and hold over long periods of time. Seems like if you dig out a really big hole, dropped a large diameter culver pipe to the bottom, maybe 5, 8 or even 10 foot in diameter, then filled up around it with the dirt from the hole and fill it with whatever special sand is required, (obviously including whatever electronics are required, which I understand are pretty simple), you got yourself a good long term store of extra power or heat. Whatever is most valuable to you in the moment.
Homesteading has been a lifetime dream. I ave worked in the Bush for over 20 years, so the work constructing it would be a natural jobs skill. You folks are Great in all aspects of the process. Your entire family is on a beacon (at least at this pase) is on board with the program. It's Cool.
We are off-grid in N Idaho. No river on my land so we use solar. I get tons of sun during summer but the neighbors trees keep getting taller. Eventually I wont have much sun during winter. We run a honda3k inverter gen in winter to charge my home made tesla power wall. I used 16 280ah EVE V3 cells to get a 48v pack. The pack runs my house for 3-4 days. I am using all Victron equipment as it just works out of the box and no fussing with knobs and buttons. I am going to watch all of your videos and learn what I can. Honda makes a mini-co-gen plant that produces hot air, hot water and electricity. We do have natural gas at our property line if I can ever get the Honda co-gen I will send you a note.
I would think sizing the nozzles all the same then use the valves to tune for peak power would be the way to go. This way you could compensate for the hose connection header and different hose lengths / bends, putting the same flow pressure at each nozzle. Then you could eliminate any cavitation, which would increase the turbine RPM giving more power. I must warn you that I'm a retired engineer, so as an engineer, I'm sure we could improve on the design and make it where no one could afford one. I Like your videos; they make realize how much of life I missed out on living a corporate life.
Awesome ! I loved seeing other peoples hydro setup.everyone’s is different. Mine makes around 1.5 peak in the winter. 8” pvc penstock with two turbines. GPM varies but winter it’s roughly 500+. With 55 ft of head. Works great.
Great machines! Don’t get hung up on free-wheeling with those specs. At 15psi, the nozzle velocity is simply not fast enough to cause high voltage damage. You don’t want constant free-wheeling because of the extra duty on the bearings, but nothing is going to burn up. My system is nearly identical (31’ head, 4x 7/8” nozzles over winter. 600+ watts.)
From the uk here. Great bunch of guys. Some engineers Reverse engineering Some electricians Plumbers And woodwork skills Blacksmith Knife sword axe hammer smiths And natural farming skills would be a great idea build a community teach the young ones sounds like a plan
Can't wait to do Hydro eventually at our new place! Already planning a giant conduit run in our foundation for it too. Also can't wait to see the GasifierGaserator Part 3!
Love it been a electrician for a long time and this is truly amazing 😊 could a small debrse neet help also 😊 appropriate y'all sharing such a wonderful story 🙏
I would call the tech support for that MPPT. I have a feeling that it is just not configured properly. Give their support line a call and see if they can get it working correctly.
All those adjustments with the nozzles and magnet levels - I was wishing that you had shown the residual water pressure at each step, because that’s a good representation of how much energy there is left in the water.
A smooth manifold would be nice, but just some wyes would help. When measuring resistance, with a good meter you can short the leads and tell it to zero out. So then it just shows the extra resistance. Surprised you're using DC over a long distance though.
Very cool. I'd be constantly worried about a spring thaw, an especially fast one, turning that water, which is very fast moving now, into a raging river which ends up trashing the hydro system. I'd probably invest the time to build up a rock wall around the turbine, so basically build a little harbor for it.
with your turbine and generator being so close to the water level it’s likely to be submerged when the river is in flood. Is that equipment rated for or durable enough to survive such an event?
hydropower is perfect if you can use it the problem is that you need a decent drop on your property to create the necessary head pressure to operate any turbine, and even more if you are using a high-head low-flow design(which is often the more compact and powerful, though harder to keep clean, wonder if the first video that brought me to your channel should have included a centrifugal separator partway down instead of that screen in the intake sump...) it might be possible if you can set up a ram pump to get the required head with minimal flow, though the number of them required would be problematic and given mountianous water you could even easily collect some for use in your own domestic water(just make sure to have an adequate filter system(probably an intake UVC then sediment filter(oversize the filter to ~5x what domestic sediment ones would be for longevity, and maybe add in a spin down just before to help) then a carbon(might be part of your sediment if you get dual-mode carbon block filters) then RO then DI(you might bypass the DI or even the RO for non-consumption flow(like showers and toilets)(or just use the waste flow for that)) the fact that you have a clear stream with large flow and drops will be perfect for most water and power needs(plus you can take all that biomass into a bioreactor and use spare electricity to purify and crack the gasses into sellable pure butane/propane to get extra cash
Just can't imagine how much money I'm looking at in galvanized pipe.... wow. I'm playing around with damming up my creek to put in a few turbines and water wheels to experiment with. Fun to watch thank you. @18:44 Yeah that is exactly why I wouldn't fully rely on this stuff and just going to use it for supplemental even if I ever get my system big enough to deal with the whole house I'd still keep my reg elec utilities just in case or if I was using something like a welder/plasma cutter. I work from home for a company and I can't miss work over junk inverters, I've heard so many people talk about them dying and I believe that at this point with the tech that most to all will crap out over full 24/7 duty.
If you need a welder...use a modern inverter one running off a portable 7kw generator. Battery banks do not need to be high tech or high cost...you can use old second hand truck batteries in a bank.... if you have 24/7 replenishment from hydro... any drain through the inverter is quickly replenished.. Modern name brand inverters like Vectron are reliable...if you keep in mind their limits. You can't get V8 performance from a 2 cylinder engine...horses for courses...and galloping horses cost more than little ponies. Want to see an 18 year old off grid system built and run on a shoestring? See Marty T channel.....
@@JohnSmith-pl2bk I'll just use the grid for the high drain stuff. Yeah I do have a modern welder, not mag core, but inverter style. I don't own a 7kw genny lol, not going to bother with that.
I’m curious why Paul didn’t wire the machine for high voltage 3-phase given the existing wire run and the distance. We run 12ga wire ~650’ with about 1% - 2% line loss at 600w.
If solids got into your old turbine, then they will get into your new turbine. With the new Turgo wheel you have, the solids should not cause blockages, but there will be significant turbine cup and jet erosion. I suggest you add a solids removal system up at the water intake.
I don’t disagree, but I wonder how long will the turgo last? If it lasts a couple years, it may be far cheaper and easier than building an intake structure. What do think?
Would have been the perfect Titanic seen 💕 rose I can't feel my legs but looks at the power 🤧 lol 🤣 really appreciate y'all sharing such a wonderful story 🙏
15 psi in a 4" pip = 60 pond's per inch . nozzle perisher. good presser = 600 wats . tow turbines = Plus 400-wats Times tow 800 wats between them Less wear.
Great project! But shoudn't you have a another controller for hydro power than a MppT controller. Isnt MPPT only for solar? There is another controller for hydro and it get AC and can turn into DC (ore other way)
I wonder if that MPPT charge controller is not actually meant for water turbines, tracking solar and tracking wind and water is a little bit different of an algorithm. I was reading about this as I had somebody who wanted to reuse one of his Solar MPPT units for a wind turbine but it was an older model and I don't think it's gonna share very well but he likes to replace things so that's not a big deal. Why do it once when you can pay for it to be done three times.
I did a little calculation and it appears that that controller is reading AC Watts when you're feeding it DC power... perhaps the settings in the controller power monitoring circuit is the reason for this. DC current delivers √2 more power than RMS AC current over the same period of time.
If the controller is using the peak ac voltage as its bases for calculating power and using 7071 * the peak voltage as as is using AC RMS power calculations then that would explain the discrepancy and the output power readings
Hello everyone. Very interesting and humorous video. You are all very competent. It would have been an honor to visit you but because of my disability this is unthinkable but you manage to feel very close to you. I live in France but although there are beautiful regions, life and mentality and especially politics there make you gloomy. All the best Henry
Come and visit me with your disability - I'm a grumpy old fart who needs help. Get to 24800 and then scream out loud and I can come and collect you in my car. TVA is the place. In front of the station.
Quick tip, if you want to zero out, your test leads put them together and push the “REL”button on your meter. I use it all the time it works great. Also, something else you might want to be aware of. Is that your DC amp clamp on might not be accurate. I don’t know about the brand that you have, but I have a fluke DC clamp on at work and our Calibration Tech can never get it to calibrate correctly. He says DC clamp ons in general are only good for quantitative measurements not qualitative which is just another way of saying they are inaccurate.
Thanks a Stack ... I actually just 'Stumbled Upom' this Great vidclip ... An 'Observation' .... Shouldn't your 'Clean-Out' by at the Bottom of that 'Manifold' ... ????? One would want to be able to drop any 'Pebbles / Dirt' out from the lowest Point .... Also maybe have a bit of 'Dirt Chambers' .... An Large Extention to the 'Manifold' where the 'Debris' can collect without going into the 'Nossle Lines' .... Best to ALL from ChCh, NZ
my solar controller was doing odd regulating.. i finally figured out it was a battery temp sensor over riding the settings. so simple me unplugged it. its fine now
I would make every effort to reduce/eliminate any intake of sand, pebbles, debris this kind of stuff in the system will act as a sand blaster eroding the nozzles, and the turbine blades and reduce the efficiency of the system. My theory is every nozzle should have the same output . If you run a lessor volume into a system that one side is greater than the other it will inhibit or make no difference than the largest input nozzle. 😁
Yea You are a cavitating With four nozzles, really 2 should be enough you would think, I love the idea I have a Brooke 30 feet from my house and about 60 below micella I wish I could get that flow I will try it at my house I even put a pond up by the house and thought about pumping it up and using the drop 12 inches one in sick1 foot drop equals 1 hp but anyway I love it
I was just thinking to myself about covering that system up somehow, to protect it from falling debris and such. Great system though, continuous flow no matter the wattage. Love ya'll ❤️
Love the design of your jets! You said that adding the 4th jet reduced your output… may the nozzle jets need to change the angle of delivery? Instead of 90 degree angle try some 30 degree angles? Just a suggestion, I don’t know anything but GREAT VIDEO and thank you!😊 “you can flow or crash like water” ~Bruce lee
You will discover that by experimenting with many different size diameters of drilled out nozzles you will learn which diameter will increase your power output the best. Every situation is different.
is there not fear of "storming water flow" over running the whole install @ motor..? as it appears to be close to water level in creek now, let alone during annual high water- great presentation- the stream engine seems to be the gold standard
Also bei der Strömung, würde ich wirklich ein Wasserrad aus Holz, (Eiche), bauen. Damit dann eine Welle antreiben, die wiederum den Generator antreibt. Der Generator allerdings, steht an Land, wo ihm nichts passieren kann. So, wie bei einer Wassermühle. Wäre dass, nicht besser? Das Rad, hält gefühlt, eine Ewigkeit. Also mindestens 100 jahre.
These guys live in dumb dumb land - everything should be made to last a season and then start again. They are no longer living in tents - sorry, they have started that again. Cauliflower people in SanSFransicko are mostly in tents - but that is just temporary. Sprichts du richtig deutsch oder muss man ein uebersetzer haben um dich zu verstehen? Ich haben menschen aus Bayern hal gehoert - gel. Ist katastrophal. Is nur ein schertz. Willst du was richitiges sehen mit viel potential - dann melde dich. Habe alle dingen um einige kW zu produzieren aber es fehlen menschen - weil ich so ein arsch bin und spriche die wahrheit - was die meisten gar nicht leiden koennen.
2425 when measurements are made at the alternator, a Loaded condition must be simulated somehow. if it is not, the output amps will measure falsely higher.
A lot of rocks and boulders on that hill , in heavy rain or with heavy snow and ice these can get lose and destroy the pipe and turbine . Maybe building some sort of heavy duty retaining wall that reflect the incoming .
And using wood for a base.....that won't last long. Jeff knows this and it is all provisional just to test the system. To do it properly a few bags of concrete would be smart - but then people in America don't know whta concrete is - bricks is another item which is missing and wooden huts are fine if you don't mind building a new hut every ten years, or season if you are in the windy creek. I laugh when I see the factories blown to smithereens in USA - how can anyone be so dumb to build something to put valuables in and protect it with cardboard and plywood?
Join us at the Off Grid Homestead Campout! www.gridlessness.com/offgridcampout
do you really need to ''subdue'' the river?... can't you just let it be and use a simple paddle wheel? [make one by yourself! ] that will last for decades?...
It seams to me a paddle wheel with sprockets and pollies and generators. Would be easier.
@@user-McGiver Yes, it seems like they (Jeff is to blame ;-) you can take it big boy) are getting to playing like "government employees"*. Perhaps it is the money being made available - or fame for the client.....
Drilling holes in rocks that have been there for 60,000 years or more, from what I see, is noting short of graffitti.
Or vandalism!!
Why not a long bar from side to side of the valley secured in a mobile concrete base (wheels can be inserted so that it can be rolled out of position)with a wheel on it, and the whole rig secured from a high tree above? It won't last a heavy storm as it is.
I've just had 3 ton trees sweep past my window this last week, and another 7m oak stuck right now needing to be cut up and removed - perhaps only 2 tons, but if you get that sort of stuff comind down, you'll be properly tested - I know the catchment area in question is much smaller than my area, I'm not half way up a mountain, and those levels of water flow are not likely to arise, but none the less, construct something that can be protected or removed in seriously bad times, because they are coming, or didn't you get the message?
* unproductive
The gravel and sand will still cause problems in wearing the turbine runner and nozzles quickly, if you don't improve the intake. Ideally, a coanda effect screen intake designed with an accelerator plate leading onto the screen, making sure the water is doing at least 1m/s across the screen, keeps any solids suspended higher in the flow and only clean water is sliced through the screen. When designed well, with enough bypass flow, coanda screens should be self-cleaning. While the wedge-wire in the screen is not cheap, the overall cost can be reduced by making the screen housing yourself. Never hear anyone complaining about the cost after they are installed, as they are so low maintenance.
Build a flow over dam and take the water into the penstock at the half way point between the surface and the bottom...
the gravels all fall to the bottom of the pond...
the sticks and leaves all float over the top of the dam.
I removed my coanda screen intake, after 18 years of use, as it was a always a bit of a hassle to keep it "happy" with precisely the right amount of flow, as I don't have the luxury of a proper coffer dam or accelerator (?) plate, it's just positioned directly under a culvert! It also had moss or some kind of fungus that had to be sandblasted off every few weeks during the summer, if not the delivered flow would drop off. I replaced it with a simple steel trough, 4' long x 12" wide, with stainless 1/4" mesh on top, it's on a slight downhill incline. It's worked great for 2 months now, full delivery 24/7, total cost about $100.00. 147' of head, 3" line, 33 amps @ 26 VDC, grid tied, via an Outback 3500 watt inverter, with an additional 1500 watts of solar to the same inverter. I was off grid for 28 years, due to no powerlines to my old place, now, on my new 70 acres, I am grid tied, with a simple net metering system, so I don't waste a single watt with fully charged batteries! I get every watt back I produce, no matter how long ago. Being off grid is great, if you HAVE TO BE.
40 years ago, we dug a trench from the middle of the stream behind my dad's place in White Pass, WA two feet deep in the bottom of an existing hole above bedrock and paralleling the flow to a penstock with a 50 foot elevation difference, inlaying a 3" PVC pipe to run a turbine. It's worked flawlessly year round ever since.
Turbine was an under-shot Pelton wheel. Inlet was an inverted stainless steel drum with 1/16" holes punched in its cylindrical sides to let in maximum flow and minimum debris.
That sounds like a great system, and obviously a really good investment 40 years ago.
@Gridlessness
Ya, what's crazy though is, the penstock is under a concrete and wood deck behind the house. My dad is long gone (heck, I'm 75!), the house has been sold and resold and I doubt anyone else now even knows it's there !!!
🤯
@@WhatDadIsUpTo Write them a letter?
@116thcrazy
Hey, that's a terrific idea. I'm 75, live about 7 states away and like I said somewhere else, the property has likely been sold and resold over the past nearly 60 years.
If you would be so kind as to provide me the current Owner's name and mailing address, I'll fire off that letter. Great idea!
Pebbles and rocks in the crossflow turbine is not the fault of the turbine manufacture it is because you guys did not use or make an appropriate intake with a coanda screen or sediment/pebbles settling tank before entering the penstock. If you do not screen your intake water with the new turbine the sand and pebbles are going to wet sandblast the plastic nozzles and the stainless steel Turgo wheel.
Lookin good , never underestimate a few watts thats consistent. Time flies and battery's are easily over charged . 5 6 7 hundred watts consistent is way better than 2 to 3 k of solar in a day plus draining batteries every night , I would like to point out that keeping the 3 phase run up to the house is more efficient. Easily rectified before the charge controller.
Not knocking what you got , Iv done the same . It works , you know the numbers you adjust .
Theres living and living well
Awesome setup, and cool video.
The difference between the 560W calculated and 460W displayed might be due to two effects:
1) If the DC is noisy, then the bandwidth of the measuring device or if the device is measuring average or true RMS (Even of the DC amount)
2) you might have some phase difference between the current and voltage devices, even thoug it's DC the ripple might be causing this.
You'd need a proper true RMS power meter to calibrate the MPPT converter's display.
If the MPPT likes to O/C the input thinking it's a solar, then you'd need to dump power for a hydro input to keep the turbine loaded, you have the power dumping relays, so you could setup the MPPT to target a voltage above the load shedding devices. All pretty interesting :)
I don't understand all that mechanical and electrical engineering stuff but i watched the whole video with great interest.
Wish I had a nice stream like that near my land. That's really valuable, in more ways than one.
If I ever win the lottery, this is exactly what I'd do with some of the money. I'd buy property with an ample year round water source that originates on the property. That way nobody upstream could divert your water source. Then I'd sink millions upon millions into solar and hydroelectric infrastructure. As well as installing a huge sand battery for heating and power storage. I wouldn't care what it cost me. When it was done, It wouldn't matter what time of day, month, or climate pattern. I'd still produce enough power to supply half the county that I was living in. The outside world would be so insignificant that not even Thanos could snap his fingers and affect me.
Why would anyone buy land without water? If you want to go offgrid then go where you have land and water and space to do what you want. And no idiots coming along to tell you what is right and wrong like me.
@@kennethkeen1234 My land has plenty of water, so much that I would never have to worry about drinking water. I just don't have a nice fast-running stream like this person has.
Yep absolutely is valuable. In fact I'm looking for land I'm looking for something that has a stream and a elevation difference in order to utilize it for micro hydro project. In addition to my solar I've already built up. 👍
@DumpsterElite u can create your own stream if you have source
I have been thinking about sand batteries lately. For systems like hydro, wind and solar, when they have maxed out their battery charge, they need to expel their power somewhere, which is often in big resistors, that turns power into heat. That is perfect for a sand battery, which is a very large mass of sand, that uses a resistive heater, it turn power into heat, that a sand battery is very good at taking in and hold over long periods of time. Seems like if you dig out a really big hole, dropped a large diameter culver pipe to the bottom, maybe 5, 8 or even 10 foot in diameter, then filled up around it with the dirt from the hole and fill it with whatever special sand is required, (obviously including whatever electronics are required, which I understand are pretty simple), you got yourself a good long term store of extra power or heat. Whatever is most valuable to you in the moment.
issue is retrevin the energy
Unless u use it for heat its not goo
Homesteading has been a lifetime dream. I ave worked in the Bush for over 20 years, so the work constructing it would be a natural jobs skill. You folks are Great in all aspects of the process. Your entire family is on a beacon (at least at this pase) is on board with the program. It's Cool.
Great neighbours makes life easier and happier.
Isn't that his brother? And niece?
We are off-grid in N Idaho. No river on my land so we use solar. I get tons of sun during summer but the neighbors trees keep getting taller. Eventually I wont have much sun during winter. We run a honda3k inverter gen in winter to charge my home made tesla power wall. I used 16 280ah EVE V3 cells to get a 48v pack. The pack runs my house for 3-4 days. I am using all Victron equipment as it just works out of the box and no fussing with knobs and buttons.
I am going to watch all of your videos and learn what I can. Honda makes a mini-co-gen plant that produces hot air, hot water and electricity. We do have natural gas at our property line if I can ever get the Honda co-gen I will send you a note.
I would think sizing the nozzles all the same then use the valves to tune for peak power would be the way to go. This way you could compensate for the hose connection header and different hose lengths / bends, putting the same flow pressure at each nozzle. Then you could eliminate any cavitation, which would increase the turbine RPM giving more power. I must warn you that I'm a retired engineer, so as an engineer, I'm sure we could improve on the design and make it where no one could afford one. I Like your videos; they make realize how much of life I missed out on living a corporate life.
Awesome ! I loved seeing other peoples hydro setup.everyone’s is different. Mine makes around 1.5 peak in the winter. 8” pvc penstock with two turbines. GPM varies but winter it’s roughly 500+. With 55 ft of head. Works great.
Watching your video on television I'm impressed thank you guys
Remember that every sag in the penstock will hold some gravel ready to jam a nozzle or obstruct the turbine whenever the gravel is disturbed.
Amazing for these folks to get that much power from you and your family Jeff, Rose and family!! Love it!!
Très bon travail l'eau a porté de main c'est agréable de voir un couple comme ça ! ta femme est toujours gracieuse ❤
Great machines! Don’t get hung up on free-wheeling with those specs. At 15psi, the nozzle velocity is simply not fast enough to cause high voltage damage. You don’t want constant free-wheeling because of the extra duty on the bearings, but nothing is going to burn up. My system is nearly identical (31’ head, 4x 7/8” nozzles over winter. 600+ watts.)
From the uk here.
Great bunch of guys.
Some engineers
Reverse engineering
Some electricians
Plumbers
And woodwork skills
Blacksmith
Knife sword axe hammer smiths
And natural farming skills would be a great idea build a community teach the young ones sounds like a plan
It would be an honor! Definitely on the bucket list to visit
Your Hydro Power project looks like the villian in the Spiderman Movie...😁😁😁
Another nice additional power added to your off-grid.
Doc OC!
Brilliant to be off-grid what a dream. And now your daughters are pipefitters, what can't your family do.😊
It's SO beautiful there
I would like to say thank you for posting my comments, I’m very sorry that I was so emotional
Man up stop being so emotional
thats some crazy water pressure there awasome
Can't wait to do Hydro eventually at our new place! Already planning a giant conduit run in our foundation for it too. Also can't wait to see the GasifierGaserator Part 3!
Bei dem Druck, könnt ihr es ja gleich als Feuerwehrschlauch nutzen. Wow!
Das sind yanky Penner - kann man nichts besseres erwarten.
Love it been a electrician for a long time and this is truly amazing 😊 could a small debrse neet help also 😊 appropriate y'all sharing such a wonderful story 🙏
yall be rite na.
me nos wha ye cee bat is al beta wen ya spek in a lango wat is nown. or is ya a dumo?
@@kennethkeen1234Quit being a 🍆
I would call the tech support for that MPPT. I have a feeling that it is just not configured properly. Give their support line a call and see if they can get it working correctly.
Perfect upgrade! 👍that high power stream is good to drive the generator. Julia is also good on mechanic tools😊👍
All those adjustments with the nozzles and magnet levels - I was wishing that you had shown the residual water pressure at each step, because that’s a good representation of how much energy there is left in the water.
A smooth manifold would be nice, but just some wyes would help.
When measuring resistance, with a good meter you can short the leads and tell it to zero out. So then it just shows the extra resistance. Surprised you're using DC over a long distance though.
Very cool. I'd be constantly worried about a spring thaw, an especially fast one, turning that water, which is very fast moving now, into a raging river which ends up trashing the hydro system. I'd probably invest the time to build up a rock wall around the turbine, so basically build a little harbor for it.
Take it all up the bank by at least 5 metres......or above whatever "high tide mark" any previous flood has left as a marker?
Float pier on driven rods if needed.
That way you always get max head, eh...
with your turbine and generator being so close to the water level it’s likely to be submerged when the river is in flood. Is that equipment rated for or durable enough to survive such an event?
I'm learning so much from these :)
That extreme close up face was really extreme Jeff!
I'M BACK !!!! BEEN WATCHING THE WHOLE TIME !!! KEEP DIGGING BRO AND FAMILY !!!!
hydropower is perfect if you can use it
the problem is that you need a decent drop on your property to create the necessary head pressure to operate any turbine, and even more if you are using a high-head low-flow design(which is often the more compact and powerful, though harder to keep clean, wonder if the first video that brought me to your channel should have included a centrifugal separator partway down instead of that screen in the intake sump...)
it might be possible if you can set up a ram pump to get the required head with minimal flow, though the number of them required would be problematic
and given mountianous water you could even easily collect some for use in your own domestic water(just make sure to have an adequate filter system(probably an intake UVC then sediment filter(oversize the filter to ~5x what domestic sediment ones would be for longevity, and maybe add in a spin down just before to help) then a carbon(might be part of your sediment if you get dual-mode carbon block filters) then RO then DI(you might bypass the DI or even the RO for non-consumption flow(like showers and toilets)(or just use the waste flow for that))
the fact that you have a clear stream with large flow and drops will be perfect for most water and power needs(plus you can take all that biomass into a bioreactor and use spare electricity to purify and crack the gasses into sellable pure butane/propane to get extra cash
I SAW A REALLY NEAT RIVER GENERATOR THAT IS BUILT ON LIKE A LITTLE PONTOON BOAT WITH THE GEAR IN BETWEEN THE PONTOONS
Just can't imagine how much money I'm looking at in galvanized pipe.... wow.
I'm playing around with damming up my creek to put in a few turbines and water wheels to experiment with.
Fun to watch thank you.
@18:44 Yeah that is exactly why I wouldn't fully rely on this stuff and just going to use it for supplemental even if I ever get my system big enough to deal with the whole house I'd still keep my reg elec utilities just in case or if I was using something like a welder/plasma cutter. I work from home for a company and I can't miss work over junk inverters, I've heard so many people talk about them dying and I believe that at this point with the tech that most to all will crap out over full 24/7 duty.
If you need a welder...use a modern inverter one running off a portable 7kw generator.
Battery banks do not need to be high tech or high cost...you can use old second hand truck batteries in a bank.... if you have 24/7 replenishment from hydro...
any drain through the inverter is quickly replenished..
Modern name brand inverters like Vectron are reliable...if you keep in mind their limits.
You can't get V8 performance from a 2 cylinder engine...horses for courses...and galloping horses cost more than little ponies.
Want to see an 18 year old off grid system built and run on a shoestring?
See Marty T channel.....
@@JohnSmith-pl2bk I'll just use the grid for the high drain stuff. Yeah I do have a modern welder, not mag core, but inverter style. I don't own a 7kw genny lol, not going to bother with that.
Can you remove the rectifier from the turbine and put that nearest your home so you can run three-phase alternating current the majority of the way?
Fantastic! And beautiful spot too.
Dr Otto Octavias? 😊
We love watching your videos , you are brilliant , your daughters likewise !!
It looks so natural in that nature. Like an octopus on desert. Nature friendly. Imagine if every house in the valley have one.....
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
I’m curious why Paul didn’t wire the machine for high voltage 3-phase given the existing wire run and the distance. We run 12ga wire ~650’ with about 1% - 2% line loss at 600w.
With that nozzle setup you could sluice the banks.
If solids got into your old turbine, then they will get into your new turbine. With the new Turgo wheel you have, the solids should not cause blockages, but there will be significant turbine cup and jet erosion. I suggest you add a solids removal system up at the water intake.
I don’t disagree, but I wonder how long will the turgo last? If it lasts a couple years, it may be far cheaper and easier than building an intake structure. What do think?
"I am like in like the eye of the storm", everyone knows Jeff IS the storm...
Wow… where did you guys steal the creek from?? I dont remember there being a stream round yer place with that much flow?
Would have been the perfect Titanic seen 💕 rose I can't feel my legs but looks at the power 🤧 lol 🤣 really appreciate y'all sharing such a wonderful story 🙏
"Y'all" is substandard and not needed here. "You" is easier - but you want to be different and screw the language up for new learners of English.
@@kennethkeen1234Grammar police! 🙄
15 psi in a 4" pip = 60 pond's per inch . nozzle perisher. good presser = 600 wats . tow turbines = Plus 400-wats Times tow 800 wats between them Less wear.
Great project! But shoudn't you have a another controller for hydro power than a MppT controller. Isnt MPPT only for solar? There is another controller for hydro and it get AC and can turn into DC (ore other way)
08:15 That's also how the first manmade fountains workes, pure pressure through height difference.
at 8:22 . its really cool to see how high the water shoots up. I bet its pretty close to the head height. Can you confirm?
I wonder if that MPPT charge controller is not actually meant for water turbines, tracking solar and tracking wind and water is a little bit different of an algorithm.
I was reading about this as I had somebody who wanted to reuse one of his Solar MPPT units for a wind turbine but it was an older model and I don't think it's gonna share very well but he likes to replace things so that's not a big deal. Why do it once when you can pay for it to be done three times.
I did a little calculation and it appears that that controller is reading AC Watts when you're feeding it DC power... perhaps the settings in the controller power monitoring circuit is the reason for this. DC current delivers √2 more power than RMS AC current over the same period of time.
If the controller is using the peak ac voltage as its bases for calculating power and using 7071 * the peak voltage as as is using AC RMS power calculations then that would explain the discrepancy and the output power readings
So is the water on your land or can anyone use the water that way? What will keep it from freezing the water flow force? U guys...are so smart!!!❤
B4 the new assembly install a y screen that will trap large pebbles and sediment and you can install a dump valve
Hello everyone.
Very interesting and humorous video.
You are all very competent.
It would have been an honor to visit you but because of my disability this is unthinkable but you manage to feel very close to you.
I live in France but although there are beautiful regions, life and mentality and especially politics there make you gloomy.
All the best
Henry
Come and visit me with your disability - I'm a grumpy old fart who needs help. Get to 24800 and then scream out loud and I can come and collect you in my car. TVA is the place. In front of the station.
Quick tip, if you want to zero out, your test leads put them together and push the “REL”button on your meter. I use it all the time it works great. Also, something else you might want to be aware of. Is that your DC amp clamp on might not be accurate. I don’t know about the brand that you have, but I have a fluke DC clamp on at work and our Calibration Tech can never get it to calibrate correctly. He says DC clamp ons in general are only good for quantitative measurements not qualitative which is just another way of saying they are inaccurate.
Awesome video but can you tell use about that house. It look awesome build. Can u do a video on the house
LEE AND COOPER CEMETERY ! OLD TOWN FLORIDA !!!!
Thanks a Stack ... I actually just 'Stumbled Upom' this Great vidclip ... An 'Observation' .... Shouldn't your 'Clean-Out' by at the Bottom of that 'Manifold' ... ????? One would want to be able to drop any 'Pebbles / Dirt' out from the lowest Point .... Also maybe have a bit of 'Dirt Chambers' .... An Large Extention to the 'Manifold' where the 'Debris' can collect without going into the 'Nossle Lines' .... Best to ALL from ChCh, NZ
Are you installing a dump bin for future gravel and mud?
my solar controller was doing odd regulating.. i finally figured out it was a battery temp sensor over riding the settings. so simple me unplugged it. its fine now
Thanks for sharing!! ❣❤❣
what do you call those metal pipes what made the water go up?
I would make every effort to reduce/eliminate any intake of sand, pebbles, debris this kind of stuff in the system will act as a sand blaster eroding the nozzles, and the turbine blades and reduce the efficiency of the system. My theory is every nozzle should have the same output . If you run a lessor volume into a system that one side is greater than the other it will inhibit or make no difference than the largest input nozzle. 😁
Yea You are a cavitating With four nozzles, really 2 should be enough you would think, I love the idea I have a Brooke 30 feet from my house and about 60 below micella I wish I could get that flow I will try it at my house I even put a pond up by the house and thought about pumping it up and using the drop 12 inches one in sick1 foot drop equals 1 hp but anyway I love it
i really enjoy your videos mr. offgrid jack black :D
I was just thinking to myself about covering that system up somehow, to protect it from falling debris and such. Great system though, continuous flow no matter the wattage. Love ya'll ❤️
Did you check for gold in the material that came out of the pipe?.....
Love the design of your jets! You said that adding the 4th jet reduced your output… may the nozzle jets need to change the angle of delivery? Instead of 90 degree angle try some 30 degree angles? Just a suggestion, I don’t know anything but GREAT VIDEO and thank you!😊 “you can flow or crash like water” ~Bruce lee
Nice! Cool video!
Amazing answer - helps the whole world improve. Jesus we just love yank comments.
@@kennethkeen1234Geez. Don't you ever have anything nice to say? I bet you're a blast at parties. 😅
You will discover that by experimenting with many different size diameters of drilled out nozzles you will learn which diameter will increase your power output the best. Every situation is different.
That looks amazing but I want to know if you’ve ever looked for gold in that creek/stream? It looks beautiful 🤗
Texas
Alaska is where the gold is. And I have a heap in my river too.
2 × I WATCHED THIS VIDEO !!! KEEP DIGGING BRO AND FAMILY !!!
Loved this one
27:14 Ha!! Where can I find that video?
You need a “de-sander” to drop out your sand and gravel just like the large hydro plants do in turbid water bodies.
First sensible comment on the page. The rest are just micky mouse home steaders.
@@kennethkeen1234 Thanks Kenneth
The resistance in the wire changes under load as it heats up.
is there not fear of "storming water flow" over running the whole install @ motor..? as it appears to be close to water level in creek now, let alone during annual high water- great presentation- the stream engine seems to be the gold standard
Powerful.
@19:19 we have enough micro plastic in our rivers and oceans already😮💨
Iam looking for more information on this post there. Looking all get.
"Damn it feels good to be a gangster!" Hey Jeff, could two of the new turbines be wired together?
It would be better just to get a bigger turbine 😉
Come visit the Philippines ❤
You need something like the BlueSolar MPPT 150/35 for Hydro Power, A solar charge MPPT will not work.
Great video and good end results 🇳🇿❤️
Also bei der Strömung, würde ich wirklich ein Wasserrad aus Holz, (Eiche), bauen. Damit dann eine Welle antreiben, die wiederum den Generator antreibt. Der Generator allerdings, steht an Land, wo ihm nichts passieren kann. So, wie bei einer Wassermühle.
Wäre dass, nicht besser?
Das Rad, hält gefühlt, eine Ewigkeit. Also mindestens 100 jahre.
These guys live in dumb dumb land - everything should be made to last a season and then start again. They are no longer living in tents - sorry, they have started that again. Cauliflower people in SanSFransicko are mostly in tents - but that is just temporary.
Sprichts du richtig deutsch oder muss man ein uebersetzer haben um dich zu verstehen? Ich haben menschen aus Bayern hal gehoert - gel. Ist katastrophal.
Is nur ein schertz.
Willst du was richitiges sehen mit viel potential - dann melde dich. Habe alle dingen um einige kW zu produzieren aber es fehlen menschen - weil ich so ein arsch bin und spriche die wahrheit - was die meisten gar nicht leiden koennen.
Laminar flow is probably important to prevent cavatation.
2425 when measurements are made at the alternator, a Loaded condition must be simulated somehow. if it is not, the output amps will measure falsely higher.
i think i saw gold with thoses pebbles ! You should go take another look ;)
That creek just screams “I’m full of Gold!!”
@@Gridlessness Jeff. if you want gold then write to me. I'll educate you and you can take home the gold. My name alone is gold.
Ask any Japanese person. Dozo yoroshko.
Dont you need a "trap" to catch the sand, so it dont destroy the turbine?
Quadruple turbines 🤯
HI what is the output power come out of the system ????
I think you'd be better off with an inverter at the generator.
It sounds like you also need a load which is easy enough just throw Barn heater on it
A lot of rocks and boulders on that hill , in heavy rain or with heavy snow and ice these can get lose and destroy the pipe and turbine . Maybe building some sort of heavy duty retaining wall that reflect the incoming .
And using wood for a base.....that won't last long. Jeff knows this and it is all provisional just to test the system. To do it properly a few bags of concrete would be smart - but then people in America don't know whta concrete is - bricks is another item which is missing and wooden huts are fine if you don't mind building a new hut every ten years, or season if you are in the windy creek.
I laugh when I see the factories blown to smithereens in USA - how can anyone be so dumb to build something to put valuables in and protect it with cardboard and plywood?
@@kennethkeen1234What's with the typo, Mr. Perfect? 😯 You misspelled the word 'what.' Oh my stars! The world is going to end now. 😂
Hello, just wondering if this was in the area of strike of Hurricane Helene and got affected?