To give a scale to cost, I was a senior electronics technician in Salisbury, Rhodesia, until mid-1975. My salary was Rh$ 400/month. Rh$1.4 = Rand(SA)1.4 = £1 Sterling. This was a better than average salary. As a conscript in the RRhAF (Sgt) I was issued with a FN FAL, which was the subject of another of your excellent presentations. We also had Browning Hi-Power and Star BM pistols. My sincere thanks for all the research and time you commit to the compilation of the content; this brought back many memories.
While they may have been officially retired from service the British army still use a fair number of hi-powers to this day which just goes to show how good those things are
I was in Rhodesia in 1977 and 1978, I do remember these and another gun that looked similar, it was called the LDP? or nicknamed the RHUZI as it was a local manufactured gun but used UZI magazines, I know on one occasion a farmer had one and it fired by mistake I think was supposed to be semi auto but went full auto and a burst of rounds hit his right leg, and was in plaster for months and months. I used a few on the ranges but stuck to the UZI and FN-FAL, and Colt Python I had.
The wire buttstock almost looks interchangeable. And the barrel if it cam in 45.acp would match as well. Though the body was closer to Ingram Mac-10. Makes me wonder if anyone produces a wooden stock to fit the M-3 grease gun.
Well. One of my colleagues told me that if he was twice his age, he would still be a lot younger than me. He was my apprentice five years ago. I hired my own poison.😉😉😉
Geez Ian, amazing that you even know what gunshop they were sold in! Amazingly, Harrisons gunshop is still going strong, went there a couple of months ago to look for some .470 ammo, alas none in stock though. Greetings from Zimbabwe 🇿🇼🇿🇼🇿🇼
I saw one of the R76 models in the local gun shop to my boarding school here in the UK back in the early 80s, it was (back then) considered a pistol (even with a stock), I never knew what it was till now, but it had one major difference, it was chambered in 45ACP, used 1911 magazines and had a much shorter barrel. I have no idea if the modifications from 9mm to 45ACP was from the factory or done over here in the UK.
Arms produced under embargo are my favorite topic in all of firearms history, I really hope you do more! As they say necessity is the mother of invention, so the nations under embargo seem to experiment quite radically for solutions to that problem. As for the price being unwarranted, consider that the production capacity of the manufacturer of those guns was probably not very high, so the price was elevated not because all the guns were worth that much based on quality of machining or design but rather because even at the elevated price they would all be sold because firearms are artificially less available in nations under embargo, elevating the equilibrium interception of supply amd demand curves. I suspect that if the production capacity of the manufacturer was greater, the price would have been lower due to increasing supply corresponding to a less acute demand.
It literally was. This is Rhodesia, where what little modernization that exists was in a handful of small cities spread over an area much bigger than Texas. A lot of stuff was locally sourced or simply didn't exist.
not too long ago Mec-Gar offered 30 ~ 32 round mags for the High Power. in addition they offered 15 round mags that were a flush fit, and 20 round mags that were slightly extended.
@@3eightiesopinion524 .....they still make 30 shot Browning Hi-Power mags in Newcastle Natal South Africa....high quality finish R1000 or $60.... Plus postage..
Speaking of guns made in isolation. Would Iran fit that description or it would not, since it already had some weapon industry? Anyway, it still would be interesting to see that Iranian made bullpup version of AR15 named Khaybar KH 2002
I believe he would have to be in another country who has legal trade with Iran to review it. He couldn’t bring or own Iranian arms in the US. Please correct me if I misunderstand the trade barriers.
I remember reading an article about some of Rhodesia's "home built' security devices in SOF back in the late 70s. The car mounted frag projector was a YGTBSM of epic proportions. Any chance you could do a episode on the D-MAX? It looked like the front half of a Lancaster with a Mark V Sten grip/stock. 9mm/10mm/.45ACP www.ar15.com/forums/armory/Does_anyone_know_this_gun__DMAX_45ACP_Carbine/2-268314/
Been watching you for a few years don't know why I hadn't subbed before now. Midieveil weapons is more my thing but your presentation and explanations of the guns both historical and practical are simply fascinating
In order to bore and rifle the barrel, and turn the threads, it has to be turned on a lathe. One chucked up in a lathe, it's no big deal to make the barrel round. If you had a bandsaw, a small lathe and a milling machine, you could build this gun in your garage. ^_*
That is a neat looking pair of guns. I've always thought they needed more folding stocks. Or Removable ones like those. Cool how they are interchangeable.
Very interesting to see what a small country under pressure could develop and produce. You have to remember the country was under an embargo at the time. It reminds me of the things you saw being developed from WW2 Europe in a way.
Well the RPD didnt have much going about it but some simple-ish field modifications. Sadly not much to go for any longer video. They really just used whatever they could get their hands on and tried to mass produce as few items as possible (but in as large quantity as possible). Theres even pictures where ZANLA forces in the early bush war look more standardised than some Rhodesian companies, for the simple reason that they couldnt get ahold of weapons wherever.
I really don't know why but guns like this, crude garage looking guns that look like something Jeff refined in his garage, grease guns, stens, Uru's and the like.
Was anyone else waiting for the holy matrimony of that 30 round magazine written the Hi Power used for scale? Now find me one in full auto and now we're talking about an answer to the G18C that might not be totally unusable due to increased weight dampening recoil.
I like them, they have character! Also, while the guns are certainly heavy for a 9mm, the weight actually helps with control, meaning that while the 9mm cartridge may not be the most powerful one, making the follow up shot is very easy with these guns^^
It looks like it comes straight out of the Fallout series. "Hey Ian, I've got some box tube. Let's use this for the reciever." "Okay, let's make everything as square as possible."
I know for a fact that some of these made it to Ireland during the “Troubles”. No idea how or how many though, but they were definitely in circulation.
The general idea for a modular system is not bad, just it's production. First thing I thought when looking at these guns "That's a grease gun barrel, right? It looks like one. Did they copy it, or borrowed some genuine M3 barrels?"
My family bought one in 1977. I used to carry it when hitchhiking between Bulawayo and Salisbury. It was bloody useless and I am glad I never had to use it for self defense.
Having served in the Rhodesian army, like most I was issued the FN however given I was in and out of the Alouetta' small helicopter I would swap it out for an UZI. when in flight. Later the G3 was the rifle of issue. I remember thinking they were just a cheaper version of the FN, but never really fired one. So cannot remember their reliability. Rhodesia military mimicked and in part were trained by the Israeli (who better to learn from about terrorist warfare) and the history reminds me of how this small country (Israel), defied the odds and did things out of the ordinary. Rhodesia's big downfall was we had no port and once Mozambique fell it really became a war on all fronts. Amazing country, pity it is mishandled now. There was a lot of potential.
FYI - it was a really dumb rule that civvies were not allowed to own full auto weapons at that time because anyone who had served in the armed forces as a Regular and/or was a Territorial Force member - which meant most of us males - was usually entitled to keep their FAL, Uzi, G3, etc. at home in between call ups(six weeks in/six weeks out). This was allowed due to the fact that Rhodesia was a pretty rural country(Zim still is) and the war zones started almost as soon as you left the suburbs of any town.
This thing basically looks like a Madsen M50 with an MP40 pistol grip, M3A1 Grease Gun stock that takes Browning Hi-Power mags... One of the first official "Frankenguns" ever made?
Mildly surprised the wire stock didn’t have multiple notches for different stock lengths, so both wife and husband with different arm lengths could have their own
To give a scale to cost, I was a senior electronics technician in Salisbury, Rhodesia, until mid-1975. My salary was Rh$ 400/month. Rh$1.4 = Rand(SA)1.4 = £1 Sterling. This was a better than average salary. As a conscript in the RRhAF (Sgt) I was issued with a FN FAL, which was the subject of another of your excellent presentations. We also had Browning Hi-Power and Star BM pistols. My sincere thanks for all the research and time you commit to the compilation of the content; this brought back many memories.
While they may have been officially retired from service the British army still use a fair number of hi-powers to this day which just goes to show how good those things are
For Rhodesian and yourself. Fucking hero's.
did you leave the country after 75'?
@@MegaZeta does ratzi = Rhodesian nazi?
The Rhodesians used portuguese g3s didn't they
I was in Rhodesia in 1977 and 1978, I do remember these and another gun that looked similar, it was called the LDP? or nicknamed the RHUZI as it was a local manufactured gun but used UZI magazines, I know on one occasion a farmer had one and it fired by mistake I think was supposed to be semi auto but went full auto and a burst of rounds hit his right leg, and was in plaster for months and months.
I used a few on the ranges but stuck to the UZI and FN-FAL, and Colt Python I had.
The LDP became the Kommando, and I do have a video on one of those filmed. Don't have a publication date for it yet though.
That looks like an M3 grease gun from an 8 bit video game.
The wire buttstock almost looks interchangeable. And the barrel if it cam in 45.acp would match as well. Though the body was closer to Ingram Mac-10. Makes me wonder if anyone produces a wooden stock to fit the M-3 grease gun.
William Sager I’m sure you could find one, though I’m sure it’d kinda throw off the weight and be unnecessarily expensive
Or a 3D game from '97 or so.
It's like the model of a gun being held by an AI character in an N64 shooter. A box with a barrel on the front.
Looks like a child the grease gun and the uzi lol.
Ian, make a 20 second video where you stuff one of those 30 round magazines into a High Power.
There's something about these simple, ugly and obsolete SMG style of gun that I absolutely love. Probably because they remind me of myself.
I can relate, I can fold and collapse easily as well.
DEEP
me_irl
Well. One of my colleagues told me that if he was twice his age, he would still be a lot younger than me. He was my apprentice five years ago. I hired my own poison.😉😉😉
You are rugged, cost effective, simple but crude, and you just work? haha I love those smg designs too
Looks like the Grease Gun and MAC10 had a baby.
My thoughts exactly! I'm surprised Ian didn't mention this obvious fact in his video.
Looks like a CBJ MS to me
qqq Yes unfortunately not a pretty one.
A few hints of the Luty guns as well?
And dropped it on it's head...
I just want some sweet Rhodesian Bush shorts
James from TFBTV can sort you out there bro.
Fireforce Ventures has them in stock every now and again
i think we all want rhodesian shorty shorts
Who wears short shorts? Rhodesians wear short shorts
Ian Cornell It’s what gives them their immortality
Geez Ian, amazing that you even know what gunshop they were sold in! Amazingly, Harrisons gunshop is still going strong, went there a couple of months ago to look for some .470 ammo, alas none in stock though. Greetings from Zimbabwe 🇿🇼🇿🇼🇿🇼
I saw one of the R76 models in the local gun shop to my boarding school here in the UK back in the early 80s, it was (back then) considered a pistol (even with a stock), I never knew what it was till now, but it had one major difference, it was chambered in 45ACP, used 1911 magazines and had a much shorter barrel. I have no idea if the modifications from 9mm to 45ACP was from the factory or done over here in the UK.
Oh look, it's that assault rifle we drew in primary school...
Ian, youre the Mr Rodgers of the firearm community.
This makes a Hi Point look like an elegant piece of engineering. I love it
I think that the full length version with the FAL stock looks much more hideous.
Looks like something Royal Nonesuch would make
Marantz underrated comment.
Ahhhh! You beat me to it!!
Arms produced under embargo are my favorite topic in all of firearms history, I really hope you do more!
As they say necessity is the mother of invention, so the nations under embargo seem to experiment quite radically for solutions to that problem.
As for the price being unwarranted, consider that the production capacity of the manufacturer of those guns was probably not very high, so the price was elevated not because all the guns were worth that much based on quality of machining or design but rather because even at the elevated price they would all be sold because firearms are artificially less available in nations under embargo, elevating the equilibrium interception of supply amd demand curves. I suspect that if the production capacity of the manufacturer was greater, the price would have been lower due to increasing supply corresponding to a less acute demand.
Ever heard of Boganville? They had to build their own weapons to fight against the Australian backed Papua New Guineans.
But he said the guy who made it was a scam artist, and I can't find the video where he elaborates on that...
This looks remarkably like it was made in a garage workshop by a competent machinist. Even more so than most blowback subguns.
It literally was. This is Rhodesia, where what little modernization that exists was in a handful of small cities spread over an area much bigger than Texas. A lot of stuff was locally sourced or simply didn't exist.
I don't know why I watch these videos, but I'm not gonna stop.
These are the types of videos i love! Ram-shackled sub-machine guns. Keep up the great work Ian!
semi-auto was also favoured due to the scarcity of ammunition during the bush war, especially as the situation deteriorated in the late 70s
So would the 30-round magazine theoretically fit and/or work in a standard Hi-Power?
Yes.
not too long ago Mec-Gar offered 30 ~ 32 round mags for the High Power.
in addition they offered 15 round mags that were a flush fit, and 20 round mags that were slightly extended.
I got excited because I though you said hipoint, and I was just thinking about somehow buying a 30 round mag for a hipoint
@@3eightiesopinion524 .....they still make 30 shot Browning Hi-Power mags in Newcastle Natal South Africa....high quality finish R1000 or $60....
Plus postage..
IIRC some of the Northwood 30 rounders were trialled with Hi Power equipped INTAF mounted troopers (Latham’s Light Horse?).
And thank you very much for continuing to make quality informational content
This looks like PA Luty's submachine gun with some improvement, would love to own one.
Speaking of guns made in isolation. Would Iran fit that description or it would not, since it already had some weapon industry? Anyway, it still would be interesting to see that Iranian made bullpup version of AR15 named Khaybar KH 2002
If he can get his hands on them i bet we'd have videos for them, or at least planned. Lets hope he gets a chance!
@@markmcelroy1872 I don't get it...
I highly doubt that anyone would be importing civilian semiauto versions of it.
I believe he would have to be in another country who has legal trade with Iran to review it. He couldn’t bring or own Iranian arms in the US. Please correct me if I misunderstand the trade barriers.
I love how you even pause to show the catches on the wire stock when you pull it out. Your work is so effective in its ability to educate.
I remember reading an article about some of Rhodesia's "home built' security devices in SOF back in the late 70s. The car mounted frag projector was a YGTBSM of epic proportions.
Any chance you could do a episode on the D-MAX? It looked like the front half of a Lancaster with a Mark V Sten grip/stock. 9mm/10mm/.45ACP
www.ar15.com/forums/armory/Does_anyone_know_this_gun__DMAX_45ACP_Carbine/2-268314/
Excellent review as always. The pistol is very cool.
Been watching you for a few years don't know why I hadn't subbed before now. Midieveil weapons is more my thing but your presentation and explanations of the guns both historical and practical are simply fascinating
I'm surprised that the barrel isn't square to.
In order to bore and rifle the barrel, and turn the threads, it has to be turned on a lathe. One chucked up in a lathe, it's no big deal to make the barrel round. If you had a bandsaw, a small lathe and a milling machine, you could build this gun in your garage. ^_*
I'm pretty sure there were no Turks in ZANU.
Something a family Guy animator would draw for Stewie
That is a neat looking pair of guns. I've always thought they needed more folding stocks. Or Removable ones like those. Cool how they are interchangeable.
Very interesting to see what a small country under pressure could develop and produce. You have to remember the country was under an embargo at the time. It reminds me of the things you saw being developed from WW2 Europe in a way.
I just hear AvE saying "Reverse Rhodesian Reach-Around"
diamondflaw I can't un hear that now
Faaaakkk
How do u do that
AvE and forgotten Weapons crossover when lol
more rhodesian guns please
Only a couple guns, he’s already covered the FAL which was the primary weapon of Rhodesia
where dem chopped rpd's tho
Eddie Lee Well it’s only if an auction company has em in stock
this video wasnt from an auction. i presume it was from his trip to south africa.
Well the RPD didnt have much going about it but some simple-ish field modifications.
Sadly not much to go for any longer video.
They really just used whatever they could get their hands on and tried to mass produce as few items as possible (but in as large quantity as possible). Theres even pictures where ZANLA forces in the early bush war look more standardised than some Rhodesian companies, for the simple reason that they couldnt get ahold of weapons wherever.
At first you got me interested with the Rhodesian FAL
But now with these Rhodesian smg's you have caught my attention
Thank you Mr Mccollum
I really don't know why but guns like this, crude garage looking guns that look like something Jeff refined in his garage, grease guns, stens, Uru's and the like.
I love these guns - both for the idea of modularity with interchangable parts, and the general look they have
They look like these homemade submachine guns you find in South America.
Random Guy Well they both are sorta crude just barely functioning gun like PA luty’s guns
A genious,simple construction..Thank's for the video 👍
Thanks for the great video. Also thanks for all your videos in general, you made some of my family from anti-gun to fine with guns.
Buy a R76, get a pair of short shorts. Buy a M77, get two pair!
Little Jenny You’ll look like African Master chief
Good lord, that makes a TEC-9 look like a Weatherby rifle!-John in Texas
I love the bolt handle. It works as a dustcover!
Was anyone else waiting for the holy matrimony of that 30 round magazine written the Hi Power used for scale? Now find me one in full auto and now we're talking about an answer to the G18C that might not be totally unusable due to increased weight dampening recoil.
As a Zimbabwean, this video means a lot to me! I didn't know of this SMG platform before :)
The guns didn’t last long considering their crude nature
As a rhodesian* you mean
As a communist?
YAY Zimbabwe!
vncube1 How are things in Zimbabwe right now as Mugabe isn't president anymore? How have people reacted to the current situation?
Those guys had a style all there own. Distinct and cool...
When Ian says "a quirk in our laws", he really means to say creeping authoritarianism
looks like the receiver is off the shelf square tubing so cheap and easy to manufacture like a luty or "sten if cylindrical"
Thanks for bringing this to us :)
I like them, they have character!
Also, while the guns are certainly heavy for a 9mm, the weight actually helps with control, meaning that while the 9mm cartridge may not be the most powerful one, making the follow up shot is very easy with these guns^^
What an... 'interesting' design...
Michael Berthelsen it looks like it could've been the lovechild of a M3 Greasegun and a MAC-11
reminds me of the French/Vietnamese Mat 49s
More like a prototype than a finished design.
Another amazing and fascinating video as always 👍
It looks like it comes straight out of the Fallout series. "Hey Ian, I've got some box tube. Let's use this for the reciever." "Okay, let's make everything as square as possible."
Man, I bet those things have a truly bizarre recoil impulse.
That thing looks so cool
I like the integrated feed ramp
A ruler must have been the main tool on drawing phase. It essentially seems to be a box where everything else has been attached on or in.
These firearms look like they were design & made by,"I know a guy who knows a guy at Hank's Underground Basement"
That carbine looks like something you'd see henchmen in Johnny Quest carrying.
I love seeing these kinds of guns. But I can't believe that this was a production gun. It looks like something thrown together in a garage.
I know for a fact that some of these made it to Ireland during the “Troubles”.
No idea how or how many though, but they were definitely in circulation.
The general idea for a modular system is not bad, just it's production. First thing I thought when looking at these guns "That's a grease gun barrel, right? It looks like one. Did they copy it, or borrowed some genuine M3 barrels?"
Reminds me of the Swedish CBJ-MS, hope ya can take a look at one of those sometime!
I LOVE THIS CHANNEL!
have to say man love the vids keep it up
I remember weapons called the GM15 and GM16. Roughly uzzi sized things. And the sten and the patchet
That looks like the Madsen M50 and the MAT 49 had a baby and it was raised by a Vietcong copy of a Sten gun.
These make a Hi-point look good.
Can someone explain to me why many extended pistol mags keep that metal "lip" on the backplate?
to avoid over insertion of the magacine into the gun since that will cause a malfuntion for the gun and damage to the magacine.
But that's not the case with extended mags, the magwell doesn't go that far.
Commonality of tooling is the most likely reason. The lip has no effect on the function, so why bother retooling to make a "lipless" version.
Nunca había visto esa arma. Buen tema
Honestly if a gun could be called "Cheap and Cheerful" I believe these would be it.
My family bought one in 1977. I used to carry it when hitchhiking between Bulawayo and Salisbury. It was bloody useless and I am glad I never had to use it for self defense.
The shape of the body, wire stock and sights kind of remind me of the CBJ-MS. Btw, please do a video on the CBJ-MS.
The square casing reminds me of a rustic Mac 10
Love how this gun is built! Rear sight needs help.
At first sight I was reminded of the French M.A.T 49 we had in the 70's.
@11:38 Soooo you're telling me that's NOT a permanently attached stock...
It may look ugly. But to the people who made it, and used it it was the most beautiful thing. Because it represented a free Rhodesia.
4.5% free
Looks like something someone made in a reasonably well equipped garage.
Would really love to see a FN2000 and a HK P7
It's weirdly put together but it looks pretty nice to be honest.
Oh no... I wanted to see the Hi-Power with the 30 round mag, just for giggles ^^
I wonder is there a some sort of not bush method firearms industry in Zimbabwe today? Or did it largely end in Rhodesia?
It reminds me of the Grease gun and sten gun
when you positively need to make a sten gun looks like the best thing ever.
Having served in the Rhodesian army, like most I was issued the FN however given I was in and out of the Alouetta' small helicopter I would swap it out for an UZI. when in flight. Later the G3 was the rifle of issue. I remember thinking they were just a cheaper version of the FN, but never really fired one. So cannot remember their reliability.
Rhodesia military mimicked and in part were trained by the Israeli (who better to learn from about terrorist warfare) and the history reminds me of how this small country (Israel), defied the odds and did things out of the ordinary. Rhodesia's big downfall was we had no port and once Mozambique fell it really became a war on all fronts.
Amazing country, pity it is mishandled now. There was a lot of potential.
FYI - it was a really dumb rule that civvies were not allowed to own full auto weapons at that time because anyone who had served in the armed forces as a Regular and/or was a Territorial Force member - which meant most of us males - was usually entitled to keep their FAL, Uzi, G3, etc. at home in between call ups(six weeks in/six weeks out). This was allowed due to the fact that Rhodesia was a pretty rural country(Zim still is) and the war zones started almost as soon as you left the suburbs of any town.
Who used fully auto.
This thing basically looks like a Madsen M50 with an MP40 pistol grip, M3A1 Grease Gun stock that takes Browning Hi-Power mags... One of the first official "Frankenguns" ever made?
It would be great if they tested these carbines on the range with some Clem Tholet songs playing in the background.
Kinda looks like the love child between an M3 Grease Gun and a Mac 10
Every Rhodesian gun starts out as a piece of metal tubing from the local hardware store
Looks very futuristic! Can you still buy them?
Yes in SA, secondhand, but a rare find
Did they use a standard box section to make the gun?
EDIT: Oh they did. I had to replay it because I knew I missed something.
The full length version with the wooden stock looks like the rebels beginner weapon that shoots "pistol ammo"
Looks like it might do well in the mud test.
Primitive design, yet I definitely do not want to be on the receiving end of that barrel. Therefore I'd say: mission accomplished.
Geez. that ejector... a marvel of engineering... lols
Are you going to be able to take either one to the range?
Mildly surprised the wire stock didn’t have multiple notches for different stock lengths, so both wife and husband with different arm lengths could have their own
Looks like something you would find at an arcade.
I’m a simple man. I see Rhodesia, I click
like
Ukraine must have interesting callendars if there's still 1980s there.
Radar Radarovič what a wise quote from such a wise little robot
Ian, where were you when this video was made?