WARCRAFT: Why Did the Forsaken Join the Horde? (WoW Classic Lore)
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- Опубліковано 1 лип 2020
- The Warcraft universe is one based upon conflict - it's in the name. A common source of confrontation is the tense relationship between the two main factions of Azeroth in the World of Warcraft - the Alliance and the Horde. But for all of the Classic fantasy imagery that WoW borrows, Undead marching into battle alongside Orcs and Trolls does seem odd, and given the Lore of the franchise, they do make for some strange bedfellows. So, Why Did the Forsaken Join the Horde?
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This topic always reminds me of an old joke: Some orc says "the only good human is a dead human." A member of the Forsaken replies "hey, we're dead humans." The orc responds "OK, you can join."
Orcs and humans became allies against the Burning Legion. So by the time the Forsaken joined the Horde, this joke would be obsolete. Good example is how Broxigar Saurfang treated Rhonin.
Humans hate orcs so much that they continue their genocide long after the demon blood diluted.
And the orcs hate humans so much that they let the dead version join them xD
I mean the Alliance and Horde have been allies on and off since long before WoW even released and weirdly it's usually the humans that start the hostilities. Though most often it's splinter groups of Humans like Daelin Proudmoore as an example. I'm obviously talking post second war.
@@Noobie2k7 i mean its obviously since past that the only group of orcs is the one under thrall who vouches for peace. grommash dies,and the rest of the horde leaders perish as well. all the rest like saurfang and the group,go along with thrall. if it was blackhand or the other orcs though,im pretty sure theyd cause some hostilities as well. it isnt until garrosh that orcs start causing big problems again
Yeah this definitely a old 2004 topic , just had too understand wtf why would the Orcs , let the undead join the Horde ? isn't them being undead from a Plague .. the Orc , Trolls and Tauren better watch out the undead females might give em some kinda undead std ..lol i remember when this game was announced in the late 90s , seen a screen shot of human , orcs and night Elves, undead, me and friends/fam thought their was going to be 4 factions like the rts game ..
You gotta love the Tauren man. True Peacekeepers. They didn't hesitate to help undead. in lore that really speaks a lot for their character.
@Philip K how ironic
@Philip K 🤣🐄
Even though taurens are a part of the horde they are also a part of the alliance, taurens are still a neutral race.
cenarion circle etc. theres both alliance and horde.
@@olfan92 True its more of "We'll fight when the horde has need of us" type deal.
Until you meet the grimtotem and you get over it.
I've always thought of the Forsaken as just being what remains of Lordaeron, they start with friendly rep towards Silvermoon because the belves are the last of their old allies, and neutral with the rest of the Orc-led Horde because of old enemies becoming new friends
Wasnt specifically Lordaeron leadership that was racist towards belves?
@@haxel8929 leadership, not the people.
@@CCgivemeawedgy Still, I doubt having the former undead subjects of the guy who destroyed their nation as allies is the reason they joined.Blizzard just wanted to give the horde a pretty race because the player count was relatively low.I read somewhere that the belves were even planned as an Alliance race but then switched for this very reason
@@haxel8929 the literal leader of the forsaken is the former ranger general of Quelthalas…it’s not hard to imagine. The forsaken isn’t only make of humans either
@@victorzhu Yeah their leader... that went well, didn t it?
This channel is criminally underrated, as a warcraft veteran myself.
Thank you!!
Hey man! You gotta keep making these videos
Totally agress with you! This dude have been soo much in my headset the latest days when I've been working alot 😁 makes the time go fast in a cool way 👍😁
The tabletop gaming book stated Thrall allowed the Undead to join because he wanted assurances in case things between him and the Alliance went south. The undead themselves needed help against the combined forces of the Scourge, Scarlet crusade and Alliance.
I think part of what drew me to the Horde so much as a kid is that the dynamic between the races was so much more interesting than the Alliance. I tend to prefer Ally nowadays just because I like the zones and vibe more, but I still love the story of the Horde as this rag tag team of misfits. The Troll/Tauren/Orc clique feels like best bros taking on the whole world together, and then the Undead are precariously added to the mix where it's obvious to everyone that this is an extremely shaky alliance of convenience between two sides that have nothing in common. It's very dynamic and interesting.
especially with the forsaken into pointing out that it is only an alliance of convenience , and several forsaken questions that actually go against the horde and show the forsakens treacherous plans. ( Beggars haunt quests ) The alliance spy straight up says the forsaken are conspiring against the horde. And quests invovling the creation of the Blight or "New Plague" mention goals of turning the whole world into a plague lands like hellscape.
the good thing retail has done (except the whole sylvannas arc,yikes) is show how the forsaken eventually grow to like the horde,and find themselves as part of the horde instead of using them. its fun.
I remember when WoW originally came out they were classed as "Undead" for spell purposes too, so an Alliance Paladin could cast exorcise on them in PvP.
That would be bad in general, but the advantages could obliterate a lot of raid encounters
Yeah but then one day someone at Blizzard said "you know what, paladins need to be even shitter than they already are and do even less damage than they already do, let's take away their ability to hit undeads with exorcism. We want paladins to be the absolute shittest class in the game, like we want them to be really, really shit. We want ret paladins to do even less damage than healers. We want prot paladins unable to hold aggro and have no taunt. We want holy paladins to be basically unplayable outside of dungeons, and even though holy paladins are supposed to wear plate armour we want them to never be able to find an actual full set of plate armour, we want them to look like clowns wearing a mixture of cloth, leather and the occasional piece of plate we decided to put in the game. We know paladins are important as fuck in the lore, with some of the most beloved characters of all time being paladins who are always at the forefront of the battle crushing skulls and healing allies, but in WoW we want them to be absolutely dogshit bro."
Then the class designer did another bump of coke, laughed and said "Ok sure, uh, I know! Let's make ret paladins - the spec that's designed to actually be dps - rely on auto-attacks and Seal of Command procs, so that even with a full set of literally the best melee dps gear in the whole game they still only do less damage than a fresh level 60 warrior wearing questing greens"
Then everybody did another 4 bumps of coke and washed those down with some crack and a gin and tonic and said "AHAHAHAHA yeah mate that's fucking hilarious, do it do it!"
Forsaken also used to speak orcish and common, they could evesdrop on the enemy as an extra bonus racial
@@Aethelhald you definitely have repressed anger to blizzard
@@mrwhippy3756 You'd have it too if your otp class was paladin and you tried vanilla. Honestly, understandable.
I like the fact that throughout the years you've managed to keep me coming back for more and following you wherever it is you went whether it was with the game theorists normal boots to now the rebirth of your own personal channel.
Thanks for sticking with me, my dude!
@@FullMotionVideos I can already tell its gonna be quite the ride
@@FullMotionVideos Maybe its a mistake in the lore, but I thought it was weird when you said that the dark spear trolls thought the forsaken to be against thier shamanistic beliefs. Trolls have a long history with undead, this is specifically brought up by the Troll/Forsken forces at the base of Jintha'Alor in the cataclysm hinterlands. Also both the Sandfury, and Amani tribes in chostlands and eversong woods use and have undead trolls in thier ranks. Plus the bllod trolls. And the patron Loa of the Dark Spear is Bwonsamdi the loa of death who has raised the dead infront of the dark spear. It seems like the trolls would be OK or neutral about the forsaken joining the horde.
This was a really great and informative video!
Really helped me with the lore
this channel got me back into wow. thank you sir.
The Forsaken are probably the coolest race in any MMORPG ever
Awesome video :D would like to see other videos as well
I love the undead for their lore, all the positive and negative aspects of the race makes them to be very deep characters.
your videos are soo good ^^ i dont play it anymore but the lore is great
The old gods would be a huge can of worms for a lore video. Conversly, since you brought up the night elves here, an overview of their tumultuous history would also be a good idea. From the war of the ancients to the war of the shifting sands (I can't remember which came first) and everything else in between.
I DEFINITELY have plans to tackle the Old Gods at some point, and there's already a similar video about the Night Elves in the works, but being real, I will probably have to make multiple videos about them. They're such an excellent addition to Warcraft's lore!
@@FullMotionVideos I really loved your old content. But that appreciation comes more from your style of writing and presentation. I jumped when I saw your community post. I'll watch whatever you make because you're a creator that I've watched and respected for I don't know how long. On that note, the old god stuff would mesh well with titan lore as well as overarching cosmic stuff. A series on the broader aspects of Warcraft lore encompassing those parts would be great to watch.
Love the video man, can’t wait to see more. Personally I think the Forsaken should have been the first neutral race in the game, with players deciding whether to join the Horde or the Alliance, rather than the Pandaren. It would have been a lot more work, but I feel it would have more sense. Yeah some of the Forsaken might have still went on to join the Horde but I’m sure there were those who still had strong ties and family within the alliance.
Thank you so much!
From a gameplay balance standpoint, I totally understand why they went with having the Forsaken as part of the Horde, as explained in the video. But I do see where you're coming from. They definitely had to make some big leaps in logic to get the Undead on the side of the Horde when, given where they ended in Warcraft III, they probably should've been neutral!
THIS IS OLD COMMENT BY NOW SO APOLOGIES,but you gotta remember,the alliance and the humans there were one of the most hurt by the scourge. seeing undead come to your city after having them murdered and raised as monsters of the scourge,none of the humans would want that. i mean imagine your family got murdered by scourge,you grieve for them,you fight the scourge and then these (to your eyes) monsters just shamble up to your city and ask to be let in. you wouldnt let them in even if they looked like your family.
Your each video deserves million views
I need that picture at 3.03. This looks awesome!
I admire your work! Awesome!
Fantastic video, I love it!!
Thank you! :)
liked and subbed. great lore coverage
Hey, thanks so much! Glad you enjoy :)
Great video, i would like to hear a about interesting characters from undead lore, payson, deathstalkers, Barov family, and if you can a video like this telling the reason the blood elves joined the horde.
Honestly when WoW first came out the idea of a zombie playable race is what hooked me in. I just thought it was so bizarre.
Hey man nice video, I like the format and your voice. You've earned a subscriber with me
Thank you so much!! :) I hope you enjoy what I have coming down the line!
I think a lore catch up video is a solid idea. Just a video to help us returning players understand what's going on, what is the shadowlands, why the Banshee Queen opened the portal, things that will be important to know going forward etc. Love your content by the way been binging all of your videos all day!
I haven't played wow since the end of mist. A recap from when sylvannas took over the horde till now would really help
Who cares about that sad convoluted excuse for a storyline
Amazing videos! :) just started playing wow for the first time and cant get enough of it! Keep the good videos 👍🏾
Thank you so much! Glad you're enjoying WoW, it's a wonderful game with a lot of story packed in to it. Can't wait to do more :)
Wow amazing i love your channel
You should do videos on the ebon blade and illidari. What they think of the forsaken and other races as well as what other races think of them.
Great video really hope they bring wow to console with game pad/ keyboard and mouse options
Your awesome and awesome video be safe out there big fan of world of warcaf
Good video, I've always wondered why there were undead trainers in Thunderbluff or why there were Tauren NPCs in some of the undead zones. I've read a majority of the quest text in classic and it was never explained.
Tauren NPCs in Undead zones? Could you point out in which zones?
@@pogolas There's one in the Apothacarium, and in Hillsbrad
My guy I liked the video but I did laugh out loud when in the intro you called the goblins honerable
They can be honorable, if you pay them enough to do so... I mean, the closest thing to "honor" is they will honor any contract they make to the letter. Usually. When they're bought, they usually stay bought.
And here is my contribution for the YT algorithm!
I wonder...where are undead orcs, taurens, blood elfs, trolls? Why undead are only humans?
Because death knight class
Alliance goes, "Ew, monsters... not in front of my conjured salad." and the Horde replies, "What a bunch of dicks. We don't need'm ... we can take care of ourselves."
Why did the Forsaken join the Horde? Because, Blizzard needed another faction for the "bad guys" in _World of Warcraft._ That's literally it.
*See you next video!*
Sylvanas had tried to establish connections with the Alliance but it was a failure since...you know....the Scourge that has completely ravaged the Eastern Kingdoms was still pretty fresh in the memory.
So she tried the same thing with the Horde. And Thrall has shown compassion and allowed the Forsaken to be a part of his faction. But yeah considering what happened later at the Wrathgate - he kinda screwed up. Now yes - Sylvanas wasn't the one who betrayed the Horde and it was Varimathras's scheme but still - that one stinged.
You can make a video about why the blood elves joined the Horde, and not the Alliance ;)
That's on the list, along with Why the Night Elves Joined the Alliance! ;)
@@FullMotionVideos any update on this?
While after this video I feel like the forsaken being part of the horde makes sense, I still feel like having their own unique faction would have been better. They have proven time and time again that they are willing to go to any lenght to achieve their goals and I'm pretty sure the shamanistic orcs and tauren would have realized sooner or later that recruiting an army that spreads the plague on purpose wherever they go might not have been such a good idea.
Either way Blizzard will most likely never add another playable faction which is such a missed oppurtunity.
Should have been 4 factions, like warcraft 3. Horde of tauren, orcs, and trolls. Alliance of human, dwarf, and gnome, (place holder name) The Pact of forsaken blood elves and leper gnomes, and (place holder name) The Protectorates of night elf, dranei, and (third race place holder) furbolgs. With a sort of allyship between the Alliance and Protectorates, and between the Horde and the Pact.
I don't think the Forsaken being on the Eastern Kingdoms mattered too much tbh. It was probably more like "Let's make the 4 playable races from WC3 playable in WoW" and Forsaken best fit with the Orcs and the Night Elves and Humans paired well.
2:48 what is in the picture?
This reminds me of some gamer trolls answering the rage and protest after sylvanas action in teldrassil.
"She is the good guy from the start, why they make her villain?"
"Casual, you never played vanilla or dont pay attention to old quest"
I love these stories. But my question is: why have we not had Night Elf Paladins? There are two prominent ones in the faction hall.
cause Elune doesn't like pallys and so forbids it.
Arthas in typical entitled feudalist fashion created a class sytem of undead- the serfs and proles became mindless zombies while the knights and aristocrats retained their intelligence and powers.
Anyone remember when Taurens didn't have mounts they would just run fast lol
Where do you find this WoW art
I love the warcraft universe too.
3:11 from where u find that wallpaper?
Heroes of the Storm.
Where i find this epic wallpapers?
I first started playing WoW during WotLK and I always found undead out of place, thank you for this video.
Christian Finnish Frostiis I really liked playing Forsaken Female Warrior on classic back in the day, i just sometimes wished really to make a "proper living character" i quess i kinda was into to RP of the Forsaken with the self-hatered of being a undead
I guess they forgot about Silvermoon when they were thinking of footholds in the eastern kingdoms
I'm surprised with the release of the Kul Tiran race, they didn't add chunky(thicc) undead models. CMON, IT WOULD LITERALLY BE LIKE PLAYING AN ABOMINATION!!
Before i even watch this and as a player of warcraft 2 and 3 - They should of had there own faction and so should the night elves!
"They made the reasons up" bro its a fantasy story thats how everything works
I think the Forsaken now are my favorite classic race. They’re the black sheep and they’re cut off from everyone in the Eastern Kingdoms
Im pretty sure this was due to the jailers master plan.
reasons:
1) they are big deal enough to be playable
2) definitely not alliance
3) there are only 2 factions
imagine having the worst enemy of the alliance..in the alliance
TBH They joined the horde because they needed to force a 4th race there for balance.. same reason as why Kaelthas became an evil raid boss (forced again with a poor excuse) or why some races have to be both horde and alliance... they could have just gone with goblins from the get go
I no longer play WOW, mainly because of the subsciption, but when i did the forsaken where my favorite race.
"Honorable" Horde. Now that's funny
I would say they joined the horde because of Sylvanas hatred for Arthas since he cursed her to live as a banshee.
You can't sate unrelenting hunger. That's oxymoronic.
Indeed! That's partially what makes the algorithm so tragic
Sylvanas
for the dark lady
If you are undead (not living), how do you die?
If you go to the afterlife in shadowlands, how do you die?
This game is retconned beyond beleif.
Porque por la jubalididad no podía haber tres facciones.
The zombies put me off the horde , love all the other horde races tho!
Great, just great, now I ask myself, why the Nightelfs joins the Alliance...
Same! I'm sure it's an interesting story. Might have to go explore that...
While the alliance discriminated against them out of their usual habits the Horde welcomely embraced the Forsaken. This is why I will always main Horde, the true good guys.
Why did the Forsaken join the Horde? It's in the name, they were literally forsaken by their own kin and most other races. The humans of the Alliance were simply disgusted and terrified at the fact that these once normal people (farmers, teachers, merchants, etc) are now "undead" and residing in the once great kingdom of Lordaeron. The Forsaken are and always have been my favorite race, they deserve Lordaeron & Tirisfal, it was their home when they were alive and it was their home in undeath.
Forsaken and night elves are in the wrong faction
Is there any MMO that u can main an undead?? XD dont think so.
2:46 damn that art is almost as bad as the comic panel of Sylvanas disemboweling a ghost!!
Yes all good. But fuck undercity still.
for the spreading things
The entire Horde needs to be purged anyway so it fits.
Fresh wow vanilla 1.12 dropping june 29th everlook starfall
me like video
💀
Tldr: cuz it was either that or alliance
No brainer really
WoW=The Forsaken
oh yes.. the story that made me hate alliance
Because they're mutilated monsters and would not blend in with the alliance races from the writers and developers perspective. This is why many would agree that the blood elves should have been merged with the alliance.
That's a reason for them not to be in the Alliance, not a reason for them to be in the Horde. The Horde shouldn't be the side that gets the misfits and rejects by default; all the members have a specific reason to be there other than just because the other side rejected them (well, except for the Nightborne at least where that actually is the reason they joined...)
why ? Cause horde ugly, undead ugly, so we go hand in hand like bros
Well, by culture thing, Undeath is something heavily something hated with reasons for all as much for the Alliance. As they at the time was Heavy Religious on the Light and its believes. Most was I suppose the pun Forsaken by the Family's Friends Society. So yeah, the Horde or by them selfs was easier for them to live what lives they got now vs. in the Alliance were only Death and persecution awaited them all.
The thing is, undeath is not much less hated in the Horde, who fought against the Scourge as well. A lot of Horde NPCs still show at least some wariness around Sylvanas and the Forsaken. Garrosh Hellscream didn't even bother to try to hide it.
Back before Cataclysm it was very noticeable that there were almost no non-Forsaken NPCs in Undercity and very few Forsaken NPCs in the other cities. They were usually quite hidden even when you could find them. You get the impression that a significant amount of the Horde was less than welcoming to them in general.
Answer: Racism
It should have been 4 factions from the beginning
Because Blizzard wanted an equal amount of races for each faction. Thats why.
Same goes for blood elves. There isnt any real logic behind it. Its made up reasoning and vibe, nothing else.
Yup, exactly! The lore reasons were made up to justify what they thought was just a fun, cool addition to the game. :)
There is a bit of logic. Undead and humans on same team is thematic trash. Doesn't work well. Alliance are the "noble" races. Horde are the outcasts.
Off rip: You said the Alliance were "rIgHeOuS" but um. Did you forget that the Alliance are the ones who originally started the conflict? Thor was friends with Jaina and Jaina's dad was the reason the whole issue began. He was the one who originally acted hostile, not the Horde, so the fact that you describe them as "righeous" is, objectively, incorrect.
Orcs attacked humans first.
Too lazy for 3 factions. but wanted skellington toons.
Just shamelessly using AI for content lol
When the foresaken joined the horde, that was mostly the end of WoW.
What are you even talking about? They did so before the BEGINNING of WoW...
@@troodon1096 Exactly
Garithos did nothing wrong
It‘s „QUEL‘Thalas“ ,not „KAEL‘Thalas“ lol
I still like the video though,good work.
Because Blizzard was too lazy to implement a 3 way faction like Age of Camelot
Undead got the most poor costumize ever bob earings
UD Don't need much...
* Green shaggy hair:Check
*Face looks like skull option:Check
*Black X strap across eyes:Check
Asking for likes before you provide value is stupid.
Hate the game, not the player
@@FullMotionVideos Many, many creators ask for likes at the end, after they have provided value to the viewer. Many youtubers talk about how rude it is to do before. So it's not the game, it's just your socially unaware self.