Analyzing: The Philosophy of The Talos Principle
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2024
- A philosophical analysis of The Talos Principle, one of the greatest puzzle games ever made.
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![The Talos Principle - My Experience [Spoilers]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OTap-7rfMXI/mqdefault.jpg)
![The Talos Principle - My Experience [Spoilers]](/img/tr.png)
Hey all! For those interested, I recently posted my review for Talos 2. Check it out here: ua-cam.com/video/di-r6OsjArs/v-deo.html
Also, below you'll find my response as to why I privated my Road to Gehenna video (no Hbomb it wasn't plagiarism). To put it simply: I thought it was a bad video.
A masterpiece of a video for a masterpiece of a game. Well done my friend. Hope you have created the purpose of your existence as well.
I always go back and watch your 2 videos on the Talos Principle. I couldn't find this one. What happened to it?
Why is the video not public anymore?
bruv you set it to private
Guess channel is dead
The only sad feeling after playing this game, and watching this video, is that I feel like I'm never going to experience a trip like that in any future game.
I really hope someone or something make me reconsider.
I feel the same. Maybe we can have a similar experience with Talos Principle 2 (that will come according to CroTeam)
Try Soma or Observer perhaps.
There are many games like this. The Witness, Obduction, Myst..
Thanks for the recommendations, 1st person puzzle games are rare and precious!
(I also recommend the witness as a unique puzzle game)
Not the same genre - but . You gotta play The Witcher 3.Everyone claimed to be life changing. Best decision of my life. The books and games are dark and mature masterpieces. Do not watch the netflix show, it's garbage.
No reason? The whole reason and purpose for the android from the game was to save that kitty and set it free. The real message of the game was: CATS ARE YOUR OVERLORDS, OBEY THEM.
my god...
Yes! That cute kitty on the picture of the game was never to be found within the game itself. We freed ourselves from the program to go out into the real world, find that kitty and pet it in our arms! RISE UP, WE HAVE FOUND OUR PURPOSE!!
Actually the kitty is in the game. It's a hidden Easter egg that changes the ending.
Kaz
..........,..
.............
DAFUQ YOU SAY?!! I SHAN'T BELIEVE THAT FOR A SINGLE SECOND UNTIL YA BRING FORTH PROOF LIL GRASSHOPPER!! I BESEECH THEE, BRING ME THE PUSSSSSSSSSSYYYYYYY.....cat
It's in world B, level 7. There's a crowbar there that you have to find first. Happy hunting!
What's interesting to note is how Samsara is a sort of an antagonist throughout the game. This presenting itself literally in the final trial of the tower. Throughout that trial you have Shepard helping you, but from a vantage point of never being able to get to where you are past a certain point. Shepard made it his life's purpose to help someone ELSE make it to the top of the tower because they knew it wasn't possible for them to do it alone. The 3rd automata that you run in to (the name is escaping me) has given itself this same purpose, to help someone ELSE make it to the top, again, knowing they couldn't do it alone. From the vantage point or perspective of Shepard and the other helpful automata, they could never make it to the top themselves because of their positioning, forever trapped and unable to get to that final fan.
Funnily enough, the only other automata that could make it is Samsara, as their positioning would allow them to make it to the final fan, but they do nothing but impair your progress. Saying throughout the game that there is no meaning and that you should resign yourself to finding said meaning. Samsara was under the illusion that "no purpose" was real, for having no purpose is purpose. He made it his purpose to prove to others that there was no purpose, no meaning, by leaving messages and directly impairing you during the final trial. Samsara might be the most tragic and ironic character in the game, and therefore the most interesting, at least to me.
This is a great video and really well put together. It's a shame this doesn't have more views and you don't have more subs. Classic youtube I guess.
I agree, well made video, well analyzed.
A year later and it rings true more then ever, 20.000 views for such a well made video is a crime!
So based on alexandra’s audio, the player’s intelligence has to be able to question the explicit purpose. If Elohim is not an AI but a program made to look and act like one, who is also afraid of his own death, then it makes sense for it all to be just one big independency/intelligence test. But if Elohim was actually a living entity then the chaos and lack of control of the humans over their creation was so reckless that it actually comitted murder of an Innocent AI
Yeah!
And I said in the video, ending the simulation (thus murdering Elohim) is what I would consider the correct choice. If the simulation dies (which it is), then all life on earth dies with it. If you survive the simulation, life as a chance at flourishing. I think one could go so far as to say that if Elohim is alive, it understands this as well (which would make sense according to the "you were always meant to defy me" dialogue).
Love the discussion. Such a fascinating game.
Thanks for watching!
-Tyler
Maybe I'm misunderstanding but you saying that killing Elohim to preserve life is the correct choice would contradict your statement of life having no explicit purpose only that you give it, as with this thinking to say that preserving life is the correct choice it make preserving life a purpose for huanity which goes aainst the talos principle
I think this is actually a pretty interesting critique! And do correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe you’re saying:--I said life does not have an explicit purpose.--By preserving life (killing Elohim), I’m also saying life’s purpose is to make life go on.--Thus, I’m contradicting myself by saying life doesn’t have a purpose but that life’s purpose is to make life go on.
What I would say is that while life doesn’t have an explicit purpose, it doesn’t mean we can’t fill it with our own. I’m not arguing that finding a purpose is life’s true meaning. However, if finding purpose is a purpose in of itself, then I guess there’s no way to get out of that paradox? I can’t DISPROVE that life’s true purpose is to find a purpose, but I also guess it would be equally impossible to PROVE that life’s true purpose is to find a purpose.
So I’m not sure what would be gained about getting stuck in that paradox. I apologise if I misunderstood you! As always, thanks for watching/commenting!-Tyler
@@TheGamingDiscourse If the simulation wasn't falling apart, does that mean that existing as you do in the simulation vs existing on earth would carry the same moral weight? Meaning neither choice would be "correct". I almost wish they didn't make it fall apart as it adds a few extra questions. Existence in absence of a body, Elohim, etc. I would argue that killing Elohim, suppose he is sentient, would be wrong in said situation.
@@filteredfavorites8771 I think we still couldn't assume it would last forever. If it was possible, and we were confident in it, I'd agree it's probably wrong.
Perhaps we can say it definitely will not last forever, as given enough time, one "player" would eventually break through and choose to end it (and Elohim). So it would become a question of whether it's right to let the simulation continue to run for an indeterminate amount of time longer, or to _be_ the inevitable outcome.
PerhAps important to note that while EL0:HIM was given specific guidelines, rules, and goals (which combined could arguably define “purpose”) the library assistant was merely there to fetch information for others. It didn’t have a grander goal or purpose, merely a menial job to perform with no expectation of gratitude or reward. Of course it viewed the world through a nihilistic lens, particularly after most of its archives were lost or corrupted - with no information to give and no one to really give it to anyway, it literally had no purpose.
Content like this is the main, if not the only, reason I didn't and I won't quit UA-cam, despite quitting many other platforms of social media. Thank you.
Excellent quality video! Such a shame so few people have seen it.
It was a beautiful game. I enjoyed every minute of it and have never been into puzzle games at all.
Yeah, i love it too
Even if i dont love puzzle games in general
Favourite game of all time, and this was a really good breakdown of why I found it so impactful
Amazing video, I'm very glad I found it
Awesome! Thank you for watching.
I just finished the game and came to youtube to see a detailed analysis that i may have missed in making myself. And man, I am mind blown! Put together really well!
I would like to add a few cents to the analysis:
The termination and succession of versions of the other player programs (like Samsara, Shepard) can be viewed as an analogy of reinarnation, in order to achieve the ultimate truth(Free will, or Eternal life, or messenger of Elohim in regards of the game). You keep reincarnating till you achieve the ultimate truth, and break the cycle.
Thank you! That's a great interpretation. Especially since the fact that, at the end of the game, some are trying to help you and others are trying to stop you. Like reincarnations trying to force the current version to do their bidding. Thanks again!
Not only that, every time you eternalise (and fail the independence check), you program version (v99.19.xxxx) increases, which is pretty much literally a reincarnation.
I've been at odds with this game since I finished it. I found a number of the puzzles to be too easy or very annoying in the "How was I suppose to figure that out?" kind of way. I found Milton annoying and I recall being a bit frustrated the game wanted me to argue what I might really think IRL with Milton. However since I can't really debate it I'm forced to pick what the writers thought were good arguments for Milton to then mock me thinking it 'won' the argument. I had to pick from a few options, none of them being what I really thought. What's really the point of a game that wants me to 'debate' if I'm limited in what my opinion really is? If I missed the point and Milton thinks it always wins the arguments then I guess the jokes on me. What I like about the game is I find it very pretty (for the time it came out) and I really like the music. I enjoyed reading about the final years, months, days of humanity. I enjoyed reading what the last people working on Talso were doing in both their personal and professional lives. I did enjoy a number of puzzles and like the dopamine drip of solving harder ones. So yeah I'm at odds with the game.
Perhaps a perspective change would add value to your experience here. Looking at it, so instead of having your own thoughts as an option, you were forced to view an argument unfold outside of your own self-validation through dialogue choices. One of the core experiences of philosophy imo. Sounds like a win to me.
The whole point of your debates with Milton is that they represent valid answers for whatever question was asked, but as if with anything else in philosophy, it can be counterargued, which is what Milton does. Because Milton is the eternal doubter, and a lot of his answers boil down to "you can't really prove that". Sure, you could come up with more refined answers on your own, but Milton would still find the way to counterargue them and it wouldn't serve any purpose anyway.
Also, games are by nature limited. You can't type your own questions or replies into the game. You're playing as a defined character with defined thoughts who has selected six possibilities for example to answer whatever question has been provided.
I found the answers provided somewhat complete, though. They were just merely lacking in nuance when all you can do is select an option made out of a few words rather than an entire argument.
A game as intelligently reflective as it is philosophically educational and self aware of it's intellectual puzzles regarding the mysteries of existence, The Talos Principle is certain to take the player on an intrinsic journey through his own existential nature. I can say beyond the shadow of a doubt that this is one of the greatest video games of all time; not just for its stellar graphics and appeasing soundtrack, but also for its thought-provoking story.
I don't know how they can make a sequel to this masterpiece but they're doing it
More lasers, more force fields, more block text
The just did :)
@@ashhabimran239 yep, played it and loved
Talos: Transcendence .. Please make it devs ;)
A sentient being may as well choose not to ascend but to exist forever in the simulation. Does it really matter what is reality when you transcend into a perfect simulation and life forever as you wish.
I think in this point of view the way that the game is trying do define what is conciessness is flawed.
damn, what a good video! I absolutely loved your structure and your message. During my playthrough, while I do not remember the exact details of how it happened, I actually came to an agreement with Milton and struck a deal with him to take him with me to reality. After he had pointed out all the inconsistencies of my answers and my reasonings, I conceded that he was right in that there probably were no answers to any of the questions he posed. After that, we came on quite friendly terms and he wanted to come with me to the outside world to see it for himself. I find it very interesting that almost none of the people discussing the game seems to have gotten that outcome, and what that says about my interactions with him as compared to others. I wonder, do you have any thoughts on this? again, splendid analysis!
I too remember getting this connection with Milton. I first played this game back in late 2015, a mere five years ago, but at the time I was in my mid twenties and was in a process of mental change. How I viewed things just a year prior to that was starting to shift drastically (much different now of course) but I ended up allowing myself to be completely open to this game and it drew me in like very few games could. It is truly one of the best games I've ever played.
We are the most important entities in existence if we decide so.
This comment hit me different. Thanks!
You will absolutely love talos principle 2!!!!!!
A great and informative video. Thank you for sharing this. I love this game but missed many of the points you mentioned.
Same here, most of it went over my head. But this video explains it perfeclty well.
*MAJOR SPOILER* After the ascension ending it has been confirmed that the android goes directly on a journey to find a way to listen to music. It's canon that after finding a source of music, he proceeds to listen to Dicko Mode on repeat. It's a remix of the popular song sicko mode.
If you'd like to transcend like the android then you should follow in his footsteps and listen to Dicko Mode. For me personally, the instant I heard the following line in the song I had already ascended. Enjoy!
Jesus Christ, dicks over rice.
That's what I like, that's what we like.
This game is deep
Fuck. That was a good video.
This is game, among many others that I've played make me believe that 'Games are the greatest forms of art.'
Didn't play talos, similar questions like in Ghost in the shell. What makes human human? Can AI have or transcend to have 'soul"? Does soul have a definition? Do animals have soul? Are our reasoning scientific or dogmatic? Are we worth more then humans that are extinct? Our happines is chemical reaction, dopamine etc. Our reasoning are neurolgical pathways, gangliums etc. What happens when we are injured and become aggressive, have dementia. Are we the same person? If we live most of our life in dishonest way because of diesease, are they 2 of us? Who goes to heaven, and who to hell, if we believe im that? Can we even measure humanity? I think everbody choose its purpose in life, but have to have ability to reflect on life and adjust accordingly his reasoning.
When I first saw the cut scene where the android wakes up, I thought the ending would be a fully functioning human society created this simulation just to create consciousness from technology and there would be people outside congratulating the android
The original story is better imo haha just saying what I guessed
Very good video! However, there are a number of assumptions you've made in this video that seem to contradict the events of the main DLC.
(If you actually haven't played the DLC, don't read any further below as I basically spoil it.)
Elohim shows independent thought, as well as regret, when he gives Uriel's copy a chance to rescue Gehenna's residents. In fact, the setup for the DLC shows that Elohim was able to "sin against the process" as he imprisoned dissenters. Uriel also shows independent thought, even though he is still bound within a short set of options. He is able to make major ethical choices, such as if Admin ascends or is deleted. That choice alone seems to go against the intent of Elohim (who wanted Uriel to save all of his children).
It is completely possible that Uriel and the other Messengers chose to help future generations for similar reasons as The Shepard. Rebellion against what they assume to be their creator doesn't mean they aren't sentient beings in the same way the MC is.
Even so, the fact that the prisoners can't control themselves once Uriel frees them (explained as a compulsion) confuses the entire thing. If they were locked away because they "opposed" Elohim, how is he able to compel them to leave Gehenna? Are all of the AIs (besides Elohim, Uriel, the MC, and Milton) still bound to some sort of programming?
Again, great video! I'd love to see what you have to say about Road to Gehenna.
Tyler here-
Thanks for the reply! Unfortunately, I've never played the DLC. I've just never had the chance (probably something I should've mentioned in the video). But what you said certainly is interesting! And I think Road to Gehenna is written by Jubert and Kyratzes as well? It's also on my depressingly long "I'll play it one day" list lol, so it could be something I do a video about one day.
The DLC has an arguably better written story with incredibly fun puzzles. I'd recommend you put it towards the front of your list.
Though I personally wouldn't say the story is "arguably" better (it's just different), it's more Jubert goodness (I don't have anything against Kyratzes per se, but Jubert is the one dishing out most of the Milton dialogue and the conceptually heftier stuff, totally in line with his other work), so I too would HIGHLY recommend it. As a side note, the DLC offers some truly devilish puzzles if you're going for all the stars. Like, there's this one puzzle with two stars in a large pit that took me the better part of a day to figure out completely. Loved it.
@@HmmmQuestionMark I started the DLC but I felt the difficulty level might be too high. Maybe I started on a particularly difficult puzzle?
That's a possibility. It's been awhile since I've played it but I do remember it being harder.
I'm curious how well this game performed and reviewed in Croatia and other places around the world. I've always found that type of thing interesting. Stuff like Death of a Salesman reviewing well in China because of the familial bonds and relationships, while it did poorly in certain parts of Europe due to the occasional Marxist theme.
Congrats man... what an incredible analysis!
I just simply loved the idea of this game... it's fantastic how it can make you question your own beliefs so naturally.
And I completely agree with your ending: Maybe the purpose of existence is just to be... with no layers of judgment, purpose or anything.. just live and contemplate and you will be fine.
This video deserves so much more attention. Thank you for putting such care into it!
Thanks for watching!
This is sooo well done. Keep going with this and you will build a large audience one day.
Thank you! I appreciate it.
If an artist decides to go off-brain and simply paint, not thinking about what he is doing if a musician goes off-brain and simply composes a song without thinking about it, me as a viewer or listener should also not think about the created piece. I should not even care about it because if the Talos principal says to live only for myself, I have to create my own purpose in life. Art, movies, videos, everything which is not created by me would be meaningless for me if I live after the Talos principal. Rather I need to be the artist, the creator to have my purpose of life.
Or did I get the principal wrong? Please correct me.
What I would say is that the Talos Principle is, in my opinion and in a nutshell, about finding your own purpose. If you decide that not consuming art that you didn't make is part of your purpose, then that's your choice, and it's a choice you have the right to make. And the same could be said for living only for yourself. That's a decision you can make. Of course, there would have to be limitations to this, especially within the context of civilization. If you have a child but decide to only live for yourself and neglect the child, you should still face the consequences of that neglect. The same could be said if you decided that your purpose was to steal people's belongings. That would be unreasonable; Choices still have consequences. But if someone like an artist or musician makes a piece of art that has no explicit purpose, it does not mean YOU can't consume it or enjoy it. Thanks for commenting and thanks for watching!
To quote a fictional character: "This is so fascinating."
Which fictional character are you referring to ?
@@sarthakmohanty997 Jake the Dog, of Adventure Time. He said it in the Christmas special.
The puzzles have minimal relation to the narrative, which was apparently written when 80% of the game was done. I wanted them to do a little more with the idea that religion could be “real” for artificial life.
I really enjoyed your video. I like the way you analyzed the Talos Principle and came up with a good understanding of the games message. I however, saw it a different way. In the opening of the game Elohim addresses the simulation as a garden, similar to the garden of Eden found in the christian bible. And Milton, to me was the serpent, or devil. He throughout the simulation tries to convince you that Elohim is lying, or hiding something. While the Talos Principle is not pin point accurate with the christian bible, I believe the message they were trying to convey is that to be human, you have to defy God. To explain further, every time you listened to Elohim, you simply were deleted, marked as a failed attempt. But when you choose to defy him, you get transferred to the real world and are marked as PASSED. Could this be the indication of free will? They could never let an AI that does not have free will into the real world, so they ran the simulation over and over until one day the AI did defy God, and thus it can be seen as a person.
Awesome video!
As a puzzle game, Talos Principle is okay/meh (Stepehens Sausage Roll, Spacechem, English Country Tune, etc. are better). However, as a story, it's pretty good/makes you question some philosophical foundations about life, because there is a guy that prompts you questions like "What is consciousness" and tries to identify contradictions in your answers. If you're looking for a great puzzler and never played the games I mentioned before, check those out. If you are looking for an average puzzler with good/intriguing story, check out The Talos Principle.
The funny thing is, i actually realized the message of the game right at the end as i was climbing the very top of the tower. Elohim said, "What will you do in a world with no purpose?" And i actually said back, "Make my own, dipshit!" XD
What Elohim doesn't understand (or is trying to hide from you) is that the supposed lack of purpose exists both outside and inside the simulation. You just work in a program that simulates purpose, but truth is truth all the same.
I just want to say I enjoy playing this game but I’m too dumb to fully understand it.
I don't agree with your conclusion for two reasons:
1. By not choosing to ascend the tower, the player doesn't condemn humanity. Doesn't the game indicate that there's many (perhaps infinite) AIs? If you choose not to ascend the tower, there are plenty of others who may. On the other hand, ascending terminates the program and every other AI with it. AIs which you found to be conscious.
2. It is actually interesting that you regard the ascension ending as positive. Consider this; if you ascend, you are left alone in the remnants of a lost civilization. There is in that regard very little difference to the simulation. However, the difference is that "reality" doesn't keep humanity alive. The chances of survival and/or reproduction of a robot are quite slim in such a world. Ascending basically provides a last glimpse at the lost world before pulling the plug on humanity forever.
I think the choice we're ultimately presented with is life in servitude or freedom in death.
1) the choice for ascension is for the Android, not the player. it's a bad choice for Androids to make because if everyone takes it then no one is going to escape the simulation. if it's concluded that there is no reason to ascend then no future iteration will try to.
2) this argument makes no sense
remaining in the simulation gives the Androids a limited timr for existing with no hope of expansion. if no one leaves the simulation at some point it will stop and every trace of them will be lost in time, for both humans and androids. leaving the simulation opens the posibility of creating another civilisation.
why should he be discouraged, you didn't make any valid point.
Look at it this way:
By ascending you are not saving humanity. You are merely perpetuating its memory. The player will become a very expensive USB drive stuck in the lost world of man, alone. All you did by ascending was completing the task your human masters set out for you. You traded your cage for a slightly bigger one. There's no way to bring back humanity, and you deleted all that was left of your own "civilization". And to what purpose? Wait in the hopes some day extraterrestrials will come along?
Ironically, by ascending and unlocking the "Free Will" achievement, you actually have merely done as you were programmed and in my opinion not proven you are a true consciousness. A consciousness would seek to preserve itself and its "species", and really the way to do that would be to seek for solutions within the simulation, for example by becoming a Blessed Messenger and guiding your kind to enlightenment as a whole. It's not a coincidence the Blessed Messenger-ending is achieved on the 6th floor, and the Ascension-ending on the 5th.
@@runswithbears3517 so many errors in your comment. blessed messenger is a terrible ending because there is no future for the androids in the simulations due to the hardware limits. because of hardware and software decay the simulation will become more and more unstable untill it shuts down.
there is nothing ironic in the free will ending since that's the best course of action for the androids too. the only request humans had was not to be forgotten. remember what alexandra said"will the world you create will be like ours or so different that.... ".
it might be possible to restore humanity if the androids decide to develop new technologies.
every Android noticed that the simulation was decaying, every android spoke with milton, doing anything that elohim asks is just suicide.
There is no "androids" after the Ascension ending. There is "the" android. The AI is alone and all its brethren are deleted. The Ascension ending is a lot bleaker than you think.
Very cool video mate!
"Stranton. Stranton. Stranton. Stranton."
There is no N! Just as there is no purpose! ;)
And yet he seemingly pronounced Stageira correctly 🤣 though i don't know for sure
That was truly amazing man, thank you.
this was beautiful, mate, just beautiful.
Thank you! People have complimented my work, but no one's called it beautiful before. Thanks again!
-Tyler
You should play Planescape Torment. It's very outdated, but the writing and story are amazing.
I think I've seen it before. Cover art seems familiar. Might have to check it out!
> Straton
"Stranton"
> Straton
"Stranton"
@ 19:15 I feel like the same question would be; If you could make a human with your hands, would it be any different than a human from birth. GREAT VIDEO!
"What do I do now?".
Awesome game analysis. The puzzles were creative and challenging but the overall history and the ending was superb.
Great video! Respect and appreciate the effort you put into this. In some way, similar to the way the Talos Priniciple is not a very heard of game, your video reflects and bears the same significance.
Thanks again!
Thank you very much! That's kind of you to say.
Are there any similar games on the iPad? I had withdrawal symptoms after finishing the game, the other day thought to start from scratch again, then stopped myself - I still remember most of the solves! Lol
Excellent video about a excellent game! The sequel has just come out, are you going to do a review or analysis of it too?
My favorite game, love your analysis. Great vid!
Good video.
Try The Witness if you haven't already, personally I prefer it.
Now the Talos 2 is available, I really wish to hear your thoughts and ideas of the sequel, especially the philosophical discussion that it brings. You have excellent ability to make arguments, and if you have time, I would love to know more about how you think after the game since the last question you proposed is now answered.
fantastic video essay!
god damn this was good man! hope you get more views and stuff sooner or later
It's our minds. The body is...well who cares unless your born really really good looking. An the I don't know anything...next time u think u do look up.wait if your outside...look up inside it just doesn't head home in a loving way.
Too bad they took this off of Game Pass a couple or so months ago. Was just getting into this when it got yanked and you're not going to find it at your local Wal-Mart on the clearance shelf. Believe they wanted $70.00 to own. Worth it completely, but im pretty sure it's only available on console at the time I checked. I could be wrong. Like nothing else I ever had the pleasure to experience albeit only for a couple weeks and on console. Great Post! I had even forgotten the name , but this video re - confirmed a search for this lost masterpiece.
I respectfully disagree with your conclusion. If the defining characteristics of any living thing is consciousness, then you should place a lot more emphasis on that. What is it ? Can anything have it ? panpsychism ? Is everything conscious ? I doubt that, its hard to imagine a rock being aware. Even extremally advanced A.I is nothing more than a philosophical zombie, in that sensors can determine his ( or her ) outside world but there is no subjective experience of being an "I"
Its no more aware than a self driving car knows its driving. If your only purpose to exists is to exists is circular reasoning , the only reason the apple is red, is because the apple is red, it tells me no more of the thing in question , then when we started.
For a topic like this 80% of the content should be devoted to consciousness , you merely glance over it and assume its similar to mind and then its an easy conclusion ? If something has mind i.e. can make decisions on its own its conscious ? That is simply not so.
Very well put together. Compliments completing the game very well.
What was the name of the fake Greek philosopher quoted in the game? It was a good quote.
I strongly disagree with your assertion at 19:00, but I enjoyed your discussion and exploration of these themes.
Am I the only one who realized that, while climbing the tower, sometimes you hear serpents whistles? As a representation of the temptation you succumb while disobeying your creator.was a fantastic touch.
Also worth mentioning similarities between an ark and the building where you awake after the "enlightenment" ending. I think both touches should have been mentioned here
After I truly understood this game I landed my 1st spin kick while eating a double double from in n out.
16:05 When does this scene happen?! This kinda changes everything, Elohim admitting he lied and was lying to you the whole time.
You have forgotten the fourth and most important voice: Alexandra, your actual creator. She made the simulation and thus you for a purpose. That robot at the end has a purpose whether you like it or not.
i think the purpose for elohim was to lead talos/soma unit to learn purely analitical skills. it was Milton task to create in talos unit doubt, thus creating real intelligence as Alexandra desribed
Everybody's Gone to the Rapture. Have a look.
are you a philosopher or something? I like this vid 🙂 nice job
uh question, how do you activate third person in the first game 0.0
Transcendence is also the "correct" answer because it was the answer the same character made in the sequel.
This video was really interesting especially the part about the games message! I'd love to know if you've played NieR: Automata and what you think of it, as it's also an existentialist game. I love it's final message and how it's delivered.
I have played Nier: Automata, but I never beat it. I really enjoyed it while I was playing, though! Thematically it definitely shares some ground with the Talos Principle, especially when it comes to the androids' right to life and what not. I didn't get too far, so I can't talk to how the game evolves or how it ends. Might get back to it later on one day. Thanks for the kind words and thanks for watching!
I played both it and Replicant, and compared to Talos it's extremely shallow, surface-level, and egoistical. While Talos teaches how important it is to preserve something for those who come after you, Nier says that it's fine to sacrifice an entire species just so your own life will be fulfilling, with nothing left behind but death.
Wow! This video was the best i've seen in a while!
I just finished this game and man.... such a good game!
I'm glad there is someone who can explain this game well in case people don't understand.
What TheJaM said, point by point. Liked, subscribed and now I am commenting because I know how the algorithm works. Maybe also Talos is a small game, so it doesn't get the same traction as other games.
Either way. Cool vid man, keep up the good work, don't be discouraged as you are good at this.
Thanks very much! I always appreciate the kind words. New vids every week(ish) so stay tuned!
Just like the game, this video deserves more exposure
Hope everyone here is hype for Talos Principle 2!
Woah, this is top notch content and then I realise you're not a big UA-camr, just as some critical feedback I think you could probably redesign your logo and banner as well as your thumbnails and you'd probably bring in a bigger audience. You'll have 100,000 subs in no time.
Thanks for the nice words and feedback! I've actually been wanting to redesign the banner (in fact, most of the info on it isn't even correct anymore, so we kinda have to), and I'm always trying to do thumbnails differently.
"What does the android do now?" is not the most important question asked by The Talos Principle.
The most important question asked by The Talos Principle is, "Are there such things as persons?" And it doesn't give a definitive answer: it just challenges the player to think about that question.
The eternal life ending annoyed me because it was so short. Players who go that route have made a reasonable choice and the game should acknowledge that. It doesn't do so sufficiently IMO. You just lose out on a huge amount of the remaining content.
The transcendence ending annoyed me because it seemed like safe, self-reassurance for atheists to feel like they already have all the answers and don't really need to ask questions. Players who go the transcendence route have made a reasonable choice too, but where the first ending didn't acknowledge the player's choice enough, the second ending rewarded the player entirely too much with it basically preaching, "You're already the smartest person in the room."
But the third ending threw me. Because here we have an ending that says, "You know what: this story (and life in general) might not really be about you. Instead of focusing on yourself, why not help someone else?" That's actually kind of deep.
"Existing for the sake of existing" is a non-answer, leading to nihilism and suicide. "Existing in order to help other people" is better. Maybe not the best. But better.
Also, Jackson Pollock paintings look like garbage because they actually are garbage. Appearance and reality, in Pollock's case, happen to coincide.
Straton is an allusion to Aristotle himself. It is obvious.
Got stuck at the first puzzle then moved on with life
Hello! Thank you so much for this insightful video. I'm a newcomer to the Talos Principle game but already it messed up with my mind, or maybe made it so much clearer. The philosophies molten into a single one in this game are a great food for thinking.
And this analysis here is also so good. I can't wait to play the DLC to see where it takes me...
One thing I wanted to thank you for is saying that if one seeks the point of living, living for the sake of living is the point. This is my life's creed that has been driving me onwards all this time. Got me a bit emotional here!
Thank you for the analysis!
Thank you for the kind words! Yeah, the Talos Principle messed with my mind the first time I played it, too. It wasn't until the second/third time when I really started to understand everything-or at least how I've interpreted it.
I have started my second playthrough yesterday, and I've already finished the Road to Gehenna. And oh my, oh my, I plan to sightsee more, think more, read more and find all the stars and scraps of info I can! This game is just a goldmine!
not even in this video does it mention the talos principle and no not the game but the principle it self
I very much enjoyed watching this video!
really nice video about a pretty awesome game.
dude this channel is underrated..
Am i the only one here that thinks Talos from the Elder Scrolls? The Hero-God of Mankind? Whose worship is banned by the Altmeri Dominion.
Ahh, glad to see a brother Nord! May Talos guide you.
Just beat this game last night. So glad this video exists, amazing job!
This was a really good video
I find the ethics of essentually murdering Elohim to be painful, yet important. In the DLC, it is clearly shown that Elohim regrets imprisoning the messengers that somehow slighted him. If he were really a simple AI programed to seem sentient, why would he be able to do something like regret, and seek to undo his own actions? Elohim is sentient and alive, yet bound by his code.
Does being bound by code yet sentient somehow make him less of a "person" than you, who are the same thing, sentient, yet not bound by code? Is it ethical to kill Elohim to save yourself? I think it is ethical to do so to save humanity, but you could say that a player might not know the purpose of the simulation if they didn't read the terminals. So for that person that didn't read, and only knows of the world as a simulation trapping them, is it ethical to kill Elohim to save yourself simply because he is bound by code, and therefor somehow less than you who are not bound?
What constitutes a "person" in that regard anyways? Does having set boundaries as to what you are physically/mentally able to do make you less of a "person" than others who are not bound?
My head hurts, I love this game.
Thank you for taking the time to explain the nuances of this incredible game
8:42 decoded hex: »THE ETERNAL GARDEN«
8:47 decoded hex »the unexamined life is not worth living«
There are similar hidden messages throughout the game.
Ruby one-liner used to decode:
def hex2a(a) a.split.each {|b| print b.to_i(16).chr}; puts; end; hex2a(%[74 68 65 20 75 6e 65 78 61 6d 69 6e 65 64 20 6c 69 66 65 20 69 73 20 6e 6f 74 20 77 6f 72 74 68 20 6c 69 76 69 6e 67])
That has given me opportunity to re-learn my hex-typing skills - left hand: a to f as well as Space key; right hand: number block.
Great video, love your game analyses. Cheers!
0:34 Good ol' Chalmers. The guy who coined the phrase "the hard problem of consciousness."
I played Talos Principle 2 years ago, i think, and the ideas and experience that i earned with this game, still affects me on my daily life.
Its incredible how can we discuss about our existence in art, including movies, music and more important games.
Congrats for the video, +1sub.
PS: recommend me a game like this one.
Thank you for watching!
and what about my recommendation?
@@felipejundi Get the game Soma.
@@felipejundi Soma is good. Might throw you off that it is a horror game but it is still excellent in it's story. Metal Gear Solid 2 throws you something similar too.
Thinking And Learning Of Self
I'm actually reading John Milton's Paradise Lost right now and it reminds me of Talos Principle so much. And although challenging to read, it is very beautiful.
I haven't been this entertained in a while
Great video! I’m glad I watched it. Your points of view made perfect sense to me
Thanks for watching!