2 wheelsets is this ticket here. 1 setup with 1500g wheels and XC tires. The other setup with some beefier aluminum wheels and DHFs. I'm running them on my Giant Trance 29. 4 piston brakes and 200mm dropper feels at home for both wheelset setups.
I love my EE, It is an XC bike or "downcountry" bike foremost though some uprate the suspension and tires to make it more trail. It won't necessarily replace a trail or enduro bike but might be enough depending on your needs.
Yes, it is less of a compromise than other "downcountry bikes". It's lighter and faster on the flats with minimal rise on the handlebar. I think the stem is 60 mm too. Or maybe you weren't asking me? 😜
A lot of this comes down to rider. I just took my epic evo on a local black shuttle trail with rock gardens and berms at the top, flow/jump line at the bottom. It did fine. Couldn't go full send through the rocks on it like my big enduro/park bike (Evil Insurgent) but it was surprisingly capable. Would I take it to N* and do double blacks? Nah, but blues and blacks absolutely!
You're absolutely right. A more experienced rider than me would probably tackle these trails better than I did. This day was wet and muddy though. Didn't show on camera, but there was zero grip.
That would have made a HUGE difference for me. I need all the grip I can get to be comfortable on red and black trails. I still struggle here with the A-lines on a proper enduro bike though, but I could probably go twice as fast with those tyres you suggested.
Would really love some help with a compairson between a the Blur tr vs Epic Evo? I have had a Epic Evo before loved the bike but would like to try something different on my next bike. Thank you very much!
I ride & race enduro on a 130/125mm DC bike as well, I'd say proper tires + inserts is a must if you want to go fast and be comfy. Got some clips on my channel doing these exact trails in race-pace. :>
@MTBs that's cool! I was planning on upgrading my frame from the trek fuel ex 7 2022 to the s works epic evo frame with the sid select ultimate forks. I am trying to create an all rounder bike that can excel at everything. My current build is so slow that it won't do expert jump lines, so wasn't sure what you'd recommend. I saw you mention stumpjumper, but that seems similar to the trek fuel ex 7.
I don't know what you mean by expert jump lines, the epic evo is no bike park bike. But if you see some top level XCO racing you know what I mean. Those races can be pretty rough. Downcountry bikes, like the epic evo, trek top fuel or the scott spark are great at many things. They go like XC bikes on the flats and ups, and have the geometry to ride decsents too. The amount of travel and tyres is what limits the bike imo.
@MTBs yeah, I can see where that'd make sense. I already have the whiskey carbon handlebars and 29 inch Roval carbon wheels along with maxxis tire on front and xr4 racing tire on the rear. I am basically wanting to put an s works epic evo frame on it with the sid select ultimate forks because when I asked why my bike was going so slow, it had to do with the amount of suspension travel and apparently, the less suspension travel, the faster you go. My trail bike was going so slow, it rolled back down from a jump.
@@kevinburke1325 Sounds like a tyre issue if you ask me. An Epic Evo will not roll much faster in a jump line with the same tyres. When I'm in a bike park I usually ride around 1.8 bars both front and rear on my bikes. A bit much, bit it rolls fast... 😆
Hello! I think the video would have been much more informative had you swapped out the tires. If you would have put those tires on an Enduro bike you would have likely felt that bike was insufficient for those conditions as well. I ride and race a Epic Evo in Western NC (Pisgah) and the bike is surprisingly capable in rough terrain, with the proper tires. Take care!
Hi Charles! You are absolutely right, a proper set of tyres would have changed the bike completely. But I didn't have the opportunity to change tyres for this test unfortunately. The bike is probably very capable in the hands of the right rider, but for me the lower front end was scary in the descents. Rode the Stumpjumper this weekend and that is a bike that could do a little bit of everything, including enduro trails. If I should have only one bike, I think the Stumpy would do the trick for me.
Yea you need a second set of tires to get more out of it. I put the ground control from the front onto the back and then put an eliminator on the front. I also immediately put some handlebars with some rise. Big difference. Not as fast but much more grippy but still faster and not as cumbersome as my stumpy that I sold. I’ll probably eventually get a status for the bike park.
I am pretty sure the changes you made a huge difference in challenging terrain! What model year was your Stumpy? I just tested the new one the other weekend (video out on Friday). I thought it was pretty fast on the flats too for being a trail bike.
@@MTBs 2019 expert. Great bike but too burly for what I do regularly. Probably should’ve tried more mellow tires before I sold lol. But I’m happy with the epic.
Main reason for the handlebar rise for me was because of the shifters possibly hitting the frame. I didn’t think about the position for better confidence but it’s a great trade off
@@kentao4 Yes, I mentioned that in my video review of the bike. The frame could be damaged by the dropper or shifter in case of an accident. Great bike apart from that design flaw!
Hi Hugo! Yes, lovely bike! I am 185 cm tall and I am in between sizes. I fit on a L, but I know from experience that I probably would want a XL in this example. Did try the Stumpjumper the other weekend. Very nice bike that too! Video review out on Friday. Cheers!
I buy a M size because the fitting test say is right to me, and I feel amazing in my bike is super fast and comfortable, I am 1,77 cm my question is because when you say wrong size and you feel so trust when attack the trail and jumped 😅
Nice video - Ivr considered selling my xc hardtail and my enduro rig and just have one down country bike! Would have been interesting how you would have performed if you had fitted appropriate tires - or just some normal quality trail tires in the class of dhf/dhr or even dissector or rekon class…
Thx! I think the tyres make a huge difference, especially in muddy conditions as it was here. The Epic Evo is the most "XC" oriented bike of all downcountry bikes and maybe I wouldn't have any issues with a Trek Top Fuel. But in the end, if you lived with an Epic Evo for a while you would probably learn how to ride it properly as well, even in challenging conditions.
Cool vid! I've seen your vids on the Stumpy Comp and this Epic Evo and not sure which one to get. I have a feeling the stumpy is better for the steep and rocky trails I ride. A lightweight bike like the Evo would be awesome though.
Thank you! Yes, the Stumpy is more suitable for enduro trails like these. But I kind of wished that I pushed a little harder, I think I could have made it. At the same time I don't want to crash on a 7000 € loaner bike... It would be perfect to have 2 sets of wheels for the Epic Evo to tackle the rougher parts. Cheers!
@@MTBs That's a good idea to have 2 sets of wheels for the Epic. I personally like the looks of the stumpy more and the swat feature is really cool. Hopefully I can test ride both bikes. Cheers, brother!
Yes, that's about the takeaway here. A different set of tyres would have made a world of difference. Just tested the new Stumpjumper this weekend and I think if I should only have one bike, the Stumpy would be a better choice.
this bike is an xc bike not a downcountry bike. Downcountry is a xc bike with trail bike components like wider bars or wider-riser bars and 4 pot brakes. These kind of stuff. Secondly there isn't a six bar design, it is the same horst link that we all know and lastly, this bike you are testing, is a single pivot, not ''something else''. It is not a shame to say that it is a single pivot. The single pivot design has been proven to be one of the best designs out there, and their comeback is a proof to that end.
Hi there! I sense you feel strongly about the downcountry concept and suspension design - all good! 😀 To me, this is the very definition of a downcountry bike. An Epic (XC) with more travel, better brakes and a slightly changed rear triangle. Nothing wrong with the single pivot either, but I just know how good the Spesh Enduro is. Cheers!
@@MTBs well, to tell you the truth this concept is so fluid that anybody can give the downcountry definition. For me the very definition of downcountry was the mongoose teocali salvo. 120 rear travel with 120 front but with 780 bars and 465 chainstays. Geometry a little slacker than xc but steeper than trail. It was trully something in between xc and trail.
You were braking too hard and too often. Think dimmer switch not on and off to prevent locking up the wheels and don't brake on slick rocks or off camber trail sections unless you want to get dirty. I know you said you were just an average rider so trying to be gentle. You were correct, mud tires and more suspension would give you more confidence. That trail although steep and muddy can easily be ridden fast and fun on the regular epic. You can ride ST bikes on any trail, just takes more skill and will usually be slower unless there is some climbing in the stage. It's just physics really. The bigger squishier bikes can absorb the hits better and not slow down. A more skilled rider learns to carry speed and pop up over the hits...simply put one adapts.
Thank you for your input, Jonny! Yes, you are absolutely right. The main problem here (besides my skills) was that I did not trust the tyres at all. It didn't show in the video, but the rear wheel was all over the place in the mud. Front ok-ish. I didn't want to damage a 7000€ loaner bike. With a bigger and more suitable bike I would just have plowed through, no skills needed. I am still on a learning curve and one of my missions this year is to get better at skipping over obstacles and maintain a higher average speed. Now I am going in between rocks and roots, where better/faster riders just ride on top of them.
@@MTBs Totally get it. I beat the he'll out of my Epic S-Works in the chunk. Then feel sick to my stomach after thinking of all the wear and tear, crashes and scratches. Enough to get an after ride hangover. Although I've thought of doing some Enduro stages on a ST bike, I am not sure I could handle the stress of cracking a frame, blowing a shock or even just slicing a thin XC tire and throwing away an expensive race entry. 😅
First of all it's not just a tire problem, you basically have no technique whatsoever. Said that, it makes absolutely NO SENSE comparing an XC bike with an XXL Enduro bike. Totally pointless video
Poor technique? Sure, I can take that. I am an average biker. Point is, an average biker can easily ride these trails with an enduro bike. Mud makes that epic slide like on ice. Both bikes size L.
2 wheelsets is this ticket here. 1 setup with 1500g wheels and XC tires. The other setup with some beefier aluminum wheels and DHFs. I'm running them on my Giant Trance 29. 4 piston brakes and 200mm dropper feels at home for both wheelset setups.
Yes, that's my biggest takeaway from this embarrassing experience.
Trying this course when it wasn't wet would be nice.
Agree. Or with different tyres.
I love my EE, It is an XC bike or "downcountry" bike foremost though some uprate the suspension and tires to make it more trail. It won't necessarily replace a trail or enduro bike but might be enough depending on your needs.
Agree, having a second wheelset with grippy tyres would probably make a XC-bike much more versatile but it can never replace a dedicated enduro.
do you recommend an xc rider buying it? thx
Yes, it is less of a compromise than other "downcountry bikes". It's lighter and faster on the flats with minimal rise on the handlebar. I think the stem is 60 mm too.
Or maybe you weren't asking me? 😜
@@MTBs Lugnt, tack :)
A lot of this comes down to rider. I just took my epic evo on a local black shuttle trail with rock gardens and berms at the top, flow/jump line at the bottom. It did fine. Couldn't go full send through the rocks on it like my big enduro/park bike (Evil Insurgent) but it was surprisingly capable. Would I take it to N* and do double blacks? Nah, but blues and blacks absolutely!
You're absolutely right. A more experienced rider than me would probably tackle these trails better than I did. This day was wet and muddy though. Didn't show on camera, but there was zero grip.
Wish you could have run 2 dhr2 2.4 front and rear and see how it goes.
Thanks for the great videos
That would have made a HUGE difference for me. I need all the grip I can get to be comfortable on red and black trails. I still struggle here with the A-lines on a proper enduro bike though, but I could probably go twice as fast with those tyres you suggested.
The epic evo is the spiritual successor to the camber in my opinion.
You have a point and I guess there really isn't anything new under the sun.
Very interesting~
Well, I'm a coward and I really need good mud tyres to get down red and blacks. A better rider than me would have had fewer problems. 😜
Would really love some help with a compairson between a the Blur tr vs Epic Evo? I have had a Epic Evo before loved the bike but would like to try something different on my next bike. Thank you very much!
Hi!
Yes, it would have been a great comparison but unfortunately I don't have access to Santa Cruz bikes.
I ride & race enduro on a 130/125mm DC bike as well, I'd say proper tires + inserts is a must if you want to go fast and be comfy.
Got some clips on my channel doing these exact trails in race-pace. :>
Yes, just tested the new Stumpjumper with about the same type of travel as yours. At least twice as fast!
Does the epic evo also handle jumps?
To an extent, sure! It's not a bike park bike, but a drop or a small jump here and there is no problem.
@MTBs that's cool! I was planning on upgrading my frame from the trek fuel ex 7 2022 to the s works epic evo frame with the sid select ultimate forks. I am trying to create an all rounder bike that can excel at everything. My current build is so slow that it won't do expert jump lines, so wasn't sure what you'd recommend. I saw you mention stumpjumper, but that seems similar to the trek fuel ex 7.
I don't know what you mean by expert jump lines, the epic evo is no bike park bike. But if you see some top level XCO racing you know what I mean. Those races can be pretty rough.
Downcountry bikes, like the epic evo, trek top fuel or the scott spark are great at many things. They go like XC bikes on the flats and ups, and have the geometry to ride decsents too. The amount of travel and tyres is what limits the bike imo.
@MTBs yeah, I can see where that'd make sense. I already have the whiskey carbon handlebars and 29 inch Roval carbon wheels along with maxxis tire on front and xr4 racing tire on the rear. I am basically wanting to put an s works epic evo frame on it with the sid select ultimate forks because when I asked why my bike was going so slow, it had to do with the amount of suspension travel and apparently, the less suspension travel, the faster you go. My trail bike was going so slow, it rolled back down from a jump.
@@kevinburke1325 Sounds like a tyre issue if you ask me. An Epic Evo will not roll much faster in a jump line with the same tyres.
When I'm in a bike park I usually ride around 1.8 bars both front and rear on my bikes. A bit much, bit it rolls fast... 😆
Hello! I think the video would have been much more informative had you swapped out the tires. If you would have put those tires on an Enduro bike you would have likely felt that bike was insufficient for those conditions as well. I ride and race a Epic Evo in Western NC (Pisgah) and the bike is surprisingly capable in rough terrain, with the proper tires. Take care!
Hi Charles!
You are absolutely right, a proper set of tyres would have changed the bike completely. But I didn't have the opportunity to change tyres for this test unfortunately.
The bike is probably very capable in the hands of the right rider, but for me the lower front end was scary in the descents. Rode the Stumpjumper this weekend and that is a bike that could do a little bit of everything, including enduro trails. If I should have only one bike, I think the Stumpy would do the trick for me.
What ties on your epic evo?
Yea you need a second set of tires to get more out of it. I put the ground control from the front onto the back and then put an eliminator on the front. I also immediately put some handlebars with some rise. Big difference. Not as fast but much more grippy but still faster and not as cumbersome as my stumpy that I sold. I’ll probably eventually get a status for the bike park.
I am pretty sure the changes you made a huge difference in challenging terrain!
What model year was your Stumpy? I just tested the new one the other weekend (video out on Friday). I thought it was pretty fast on the flats too for being a trail bike.
@@MTBs 2019 expert. Great bike but too burly for what I do regularly. Probably should’ve tried more mellow tires before I sold lol. But I’m happy with the epic.
Main reason for the handlebar rise for me was because of the shifters possibly hitting the frame. I didn’t think about the position for better confidence but it’s a great trade off
@@kentao4 Yes, I mentioned that in my video review of the bike. The frame could be damaged by the dropper or shifter in case of an accident. Great bike apart from that design flaw!
I love the bike, is so beautiful!!! What is your body size? Why you buy a small size, L and no XL?
Hi Hugo!
Yes, lovely bike! I am 185 cm tall and I am in between sizes. I fit on a L, but I know from experience that I probably would want a XL in this example.
Did try the Stumpjumper the other weekend. Very nice bike that too! Video review out on Friday.
Cheers!
I buy a M size because the fitting test say is right to me, and I feel amazing in my bike is super fast and comfortable, I am 1,77 cm my question is because when you say wrong size and you feel so trust when attack the trail and jumped 😅
Nice video - Ivr considered selling my xc hardtail and my enduro rig and just have one down country bike! Would have been interesting how you would have performed if you had fitted appropriate tires - or just some normal quality trail tires in the class of dhf/dhr or even dissector or rekon class…
Thx!
I think the tyres make a huge difference, especially in muddy conditions as it was here. The Epic Evo is the most "XC" oriented bike of all downcountry bikes and maybe I wouldn't have any issues with a Trek Top Fuel. But in the end, if you lived with an Epic Evo for a while you would probably learn how to ride it properly as well, even in challenging conditions.
Cool vid! I've seen your vids on the Stumpy Comp and this Epic Evo and not sure which one to get. I have a feeling the stumpy is better for the steep and rocky trails I ride. A lightweight bike like the Evo would be awesome though.
Thank you!
Yes, the Stumpy is more suitable for enduro trails like these. But I kind of wished that I pushed a little harder, I think I could have made it. At the same time I don't want to crash on a 7000 € loaner bike... It would be perfect to have 2 sets of wheels for the Epic Evo to tackle the rougher parts.
Cheers!
@@MTBs That's a good idea to have 2 sets of wheels for the Epic. I personally like the looks of the stumpy more and the swat feature is really cool. Hopefully I can test ride both bikes. Cheers, brother!
What about if you change the tires that's gonna be a big difference and now you can compare
Yes, that's about the takeaway here. A different set of tyres would have made a world of difference.
Just tested the new Stumpjumper this weekend and I think if I should only have one bike, the Stumpy would be a better choice.
@@MTBs Awesome cuz i can't decide between stumpjumper evo and epic evo but i want like all around bike
Find a demo bike and test yourself, is my advice. Some random dude on UA-cam can only provide so much information. 😜
@@MTBs Lol i will try
its Baltic white or Cream white?
I think it is called Gloss Clay!
this bike is an xc bike not a downcountry bike. Downcountry is a xc bike with trail bike components like wider bars or wider-riser bars and 4 pot brakes. These kind of stuff. Secondly there isn't a six bar design, it is the same horst link that we all know and lastly, this bike you are testing, is a single pivot, not ''something else''. It is not a shame to say that it is a single pivot. The single pivot design has been proven to be one of the best designs out there, and their comeback is a proof to that end.
Hi there!
I sense you feel strongly about the downcountry concept and suspension design - all good! 😀
To me, this is the very definition of a downcountry bike. An Epic (XC) with more travel, better brakes and a slightly changed rear triangle. Nothing wrong with the single pivot either, but I just know how good the Spesh Enduro is.
Cheers!
@@MTBs well, to tell you the truth this concept is so fluid that anybody can give the downcountry definition. For me the very definition of downcountry was the mongoose teocali salvo. 120 rear travel with 120 front but with 780 bars and 465 chainstays. Geometry a little slacker than xc but steeper than trail. It was trully something in between xc and trail.
😲Great mtb video! Keep improving!
I’ve subscribed to your channel a while ago,
Thanks a bunch! 😀
😅🤣, i bought it a evo, i´m still waiting. Was a funny... horror film? ,😁Thanks
Slippery as hell that day! :)
You were braking too hard and too often. Think dimmer switch not on and off to prevent locking up the wheels and don't brake on slick rocks or off camber trail sections unless you want to get dirty. I know you said you were just an average rider so trying to be gentle. You were correct, mud tires and more suspension would give you more confidence. That trail although steep and muddy can easily be ridden fast and fun on the regular epic. You can ride ST bikes on any trail, just takes more skill and will usually be slower unless there is some climbing in the stage. It's just physics really. The bigger squishier bikes can absorb the hits better and not slow down. A more skilled rider learns to carry speed and pop up over the hits...simply put one adapts.
Thank you for your input, Jonny!
Yes, you are absolutely right. The main problem here (besides my skills) was that I did not trust the tyres at all. It didn't show in the video, but the rear wheel was all over the place in the mud. Front ok-ish. I didn't want to damage a 7000€ loaner bike.
With a bigger and more suitable bike I would just have plowed through, no skills needed.
I am still on a learning curve and one of my missions this year is to get better at skipping over obstacles and maintain a higher average speed. Now I am going in between rocks and roots, where better/faster riders just ride on top of them.
@@MTBs Totally get it. I beat the he'll out of my Epic S-Works in the chunk. Then feel sick to my stomach after thinking of all the wear and tear, crashes and scratches. Enough to get an after ride hangover. Although I've thought of doing some Enduro stages on a ST bike, I am not sure I could handle the stress of cracking a frame, blowing a shock or even just slicing a thin XC tire and throwing away an expensive race entry. 😅
First of all it's not just a tire problem, you basically have no technique whatsoever. Said that, it makes absolutely NO SENSE comparing an XC bike with an XXL Enduro bike. Totally pointless video
Poor technique? Sure, I can take that. I am an average biker. Point is, an average biker can easily ride these trails with an enduro bike. Mud makes that epic slide like on ice. Both bikes size L.