This Is How War Thunder's Economy Needs To Change
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- Опубліковано 25 тра 2023
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Thanks for all the support. It means more than you know :) - Ігри
I'd like to modify my suggestion based on feedback from the comments.
-Scrap the "increased repair cost" idea and replace it with a 1:1 KD break even system (apparently Tim's Variety's idea) where to cover the repair cost you must get 1 kill.
-Increase rewards for awards like nukes, supporting fire, last man standing, particularly those rewards which either encourages good play or makes little difference if you do not get lots of kills
-Reintroduction of double reward (double XP) weekends for the game
Thanks for the feedback. I said at the beginning I don't have all the answers nor the best answers and I'm continuing to look at more comments :)
Thank you for taking the time to respond and take feedback. We all want to see our loved game come out for the better.
WT had double XP weekends??? I've never seen this. I started playing in 2018, so must have been prior to that.
ya... reward failure with failure... this is dumb to punish bad player's. its good to punish toxics and leavers.
@@user-ix6ri9vl1p well that’s why I’m open to suggestions mate
@@Spitflyer here is my take:
A. I don't think you need to pay a repair at all! Show me one pay-to-play game! This is one big nonsense! You want to give your players the opportunity to play whenever possible!
B. They should focus more on the cosmetic side and Battle Pass. All great games benefit from this alone! How can it even be called Battle Pass if the person present can't finish it! And who's even talking about reaching level 125 so you can buy the next Battle Pass! In every other game (including Gaijin's Enlisted...) you do it at the most at 80... let's not talk about the fact that even if you played 1000 hours, if you didn't do the Battle Pass missions you didn't get anything!! This is absurd!!!
increasing the repair cost for flying your planes "incorrectly" will only incentivize people to play more passively, until they can guarantee a kill. That will mean killstealing as a matter of economic necessity for avoiding repair cost and earning maximum profit.
Agreed but they could do things like lowering the repair cost for every useful action made in a match and increasing rewards for victory and acheaving objectives.
Also they could punish one death leavers whitch are defenetly a problem.
@@tommasogubiani3768 Definitely, I love the idea of "breaking even" in K:D (going 1 kill for 1 death) refunding your repair cost, so that you can also break even economically.
Also, if the worse planes for their BR (eg. lower 20% of play rates or win/loss ratio) got boosted rewards for doing well, it would make non-premium SL grind actually viable while diversifying game lobbies.
"last minute head ons, full commit headons, shouldnt be rewarded even if you get a kill"" (basically word for word from clip around 16min) just a stupid idea. Often you need to risk a head on as the enemy plane has nearly every advantage over you, or multiple enemies stopping you taking a safer option. But ah well, credit for that kill shouldnt count... Honestly at times its as if he strayed from his topics list.
@@paraphiliac I don't play air too much (mostly beacuse my aim with an aircraft sucks) so I don't know about stupid manouvers and stuff like that but, your right on the point players should be incentiviced at doing better not punished for being bad otherwise they will just end up quitting almost instantly.
Yea nah, how about we dont raise repair costs when they shouldent even exist
*_If your feedback or ideas don’t involve them making more money, they aren’t going to entertain any of them. You know this, I know this Spit!_*
true. A company does have to profit, though. It needs to be a balance of free to play being a legitimate option, but that paying is still a way to get a few benefits.
@@braedynhoward3644 not just few benefits. When you pay for a product you should receive said product. Not just some nice little things
What? Re-phrase that sentence in a way that makes sense.
@Thespacemanfil it does make sense. Comprehension isn't for everyone.
Well we, the community, must force them to compromise
They need to make the grind from 1.0 to 12.0 reasonable for an employed adult. To complete a single tech tree currently takes WAYYYY too long, even for people with a lot of free time.
And there is tanks, planes, helis and ships plus 10 nations. If just one is a lot, imagine having multiple nations grinded...
I personally have USA/GER/USSR cause I've been playing since a long time, yet I haven't touched rank 3+ in any other.
Even with too much free time, premium and premium vehicles, this shit sucks. Have not completed a single tree with something like 8k hours
@@cheekibreeki4638 8k hours and not a single one? That seems like lack of focus on a few or skill issue mate.
I don't want to defend the grind, but I call out lacklustre when I see it.
As an employed adult, their plan is to make the grind impossible and encourage you to spend money instead, thats the business model
@@LostCauseRT i had complete usa after 1k hours
The problem with repair cost is that sometimes the reason you died is out of your hand. This is extremely frustrating.
The warbond shop was amazing before the change you could get one rank II or rank III premium every two weeks and now that they tied it to the battle pass not only is a looot harder to advance but you can only get one every season. I dont understand why the comunity didnt fought this change.
I never got far in the warbond shop, but I could always at least get a booster or 2 from it. Now I can never even get that
@@primisto7530 And even if yo could get one bow that they removed non expiring boosters if you didnt used it you will just loose it.
They really dont care about how much time and effort we put on the game.
Now you can get three warbond premiums only if you buy the battlepass and grind all the way to level 150
@@ashman8891 And is even worse because the battle pass lasts 13 weeks and you get 3 vehicles of a branch each meanwhile in the old sistemnt in that time if you did only ground you could get 6 rank III tanks while playing less time since the tasks had less restrictions and there weren't any challenge requirments
Because rank I and II (no rank IIIs to be had) premium vehicles are irrelevant, really. The grind gets tedious after rank III.
I think by far, the first thing they need to do is lower repair costs. When you do decent in a game but you literally make no silver lions because you don't have premium time, you feel like war thunder is punishing you for being average, and playing their game. I'm fine with grinding a long time as long as it's possible to grind.
100% agreed. 1.5 years of grinding is fine, planes for 1m is fine as long as I can actually fly them! Repair costs make it impossible to play high/top tier even if you are average
Oh absolutely, although I feel like RP is an even bigger issue (at least for me). I've got 1600 hours of play time, playing just four nations and I'm not even close to top tier in either one of them. I even have some premiums I often use to grind with and researching still takes forever. Getting only 4000 vehicle research RP after getting and ace and winning in a plane with a 400% multiplier is just absurdly low.
@@brunobegic3841 the plane multipliers seem fine to me, using the f5c gets me like 10k rp for a meh match. Ground rb, on the other hand, is abysmal. Without premium, you can barely get 2k rp for 5 kills.
To your comment regarding unskilled players. I can personally say that when I spend hours upon hours just grinding for silver lions. I slowly start to get into a a mode where I care less and less before eventually getting tired and walking away. The game gets so boring when you have to grind and grind. As a premium account owner, and premium vehicle buyer, It’s been feeling like I’m just spending money on a second job.
Honestly the most fun I have is flipping back to low tier with friends because I’m not having to worry about affording repairs for my tanks or maximizing booster and all that crap. I can just play and have fun.
The problem with gaijin is that even now they dont think taht they did anything wrong and see players as the bad ones. No real change cant happen until they recognize that they did something wrong.
I almost agreed to what you said, except the high repair cost part. Repair costs should be slashed across the board. It only encourages 1-death quitting and to grind many games just to recover from that one game you got stomped. This, in turn, pushes high level players into low tier. And low level players will get crushed and will be more likely to uninstall. Repair costs should be lowered. Not only to avoid what i just said, but to also lower the toxicity in the game. If you die and have to lose a big amount of SL because a stupid teammate pushes you out of cover will piss you off, but if the repair costs are lowered, the SL loss will be minimal and the annoyance from this incident will be lowered.
Also, convertible RP is a dead mechanic. Almost nobody buys it with GE. (people mainly buy premium time and/or vehicles) Therefore, it could be put to good use by allowing players to use it kinda like in wargaming titles (for free for modifications and vehicle research). This will solve the stock vehicle problem and would encourage players to explore other tech trees as well.
100% agreed, spit has forgotten how it's like to be average and try to pay for repairs at high tiers. With jets you just loose money if you don't make at least 2 kills
@@mrsjatits Exactly
I think one step would be to make the baseline income higher. That way, even if you performed badly through no fault of your own you're incentivized to remain playing
17:10 ^ this, 100%. I've been saying for years that it would be so much nicer if assists were equal in value to kills. I feel like that would completely eliminate any animosity towards players who "kill steal" while also encouraging better teamwork. There's been so many times where all I really could do to a tank is track and barrel torture them while someone else flanks or whatever, and that's fine, but assists are worth so little that it ends up being frustrating when someone that I'm trying to whittle down gets snatched up leaving me with just a net loss in SL due to the ammo costs. And in the Air RB side of things, after the Real Shitter™cannon nerf it sometimes is an actual chore to get kills or even meaningful critical damage. So when I set someone on fire and end up with a shitty assist, it just makes me angry. Some of the most important things they need to improve is: remove the soft cap on RP gains in ground, lower SL costs across the board, make assists worth more, and for the love of god revert back to the old cannon HE damage.
I flew a 2.3BR plane yesterday in Air RB. Got 3 kills & didn't die.... I earned like 3,000SL. HTF is a new player supposed to grind like this? WT actual F.
I like the idea of -% repair costs for every extra machine spawned in the game. First machine 100% repair cost, 2nd -25% of cost, 3rd -50% of cost, 4th -75% cost 5th+ vehicle spawned -90% reduced repair cost.
Incentivize players to stay in the game and expand their line ups.
BUT
can we really trust them? will they really make some good changes? i have bad feeling they are just making it look like it and then they will just say nope we won t do anything you know what i mean?
We can't trust them, but we can see what they do next. The game is literally on a breaking point and I hope it doesn't destroy the game due to pity and dumb choices.
Been playing since 2013. Your answer is no. From my experience, Gaijin is or almost is as bad as EA
Increasing repair cost to reward good play and "punish" bad play really only works in Air RB, where you only have one life. In GRB for example, you're just going to die at some point, unless your team is completely steamrolling, to things out of your control: revenge bombing, helicopters, whatever.
And in general, high repair costs are one of the things that the playerbase really despises I think, because it makes you hemorrhage money constantly even if you do generally finish in the top end of the team.
Additionally, I don't think adding premium to the Warbond shop is much better than premium vehicles. The problem is that the players time isn't valued more, it's just something else to blow your Warbonds on which is basically more grind.
Something that I think could be interesting, while maybe not really helping the economy as much, would be to provide extra RP and SL for vehicles or even entire BR brackets dynamically depending on how many players are currently playing there. A few MMORPGs do something like this, in WoW for example players playing as Tanks or Healers will receive extra rewards because those roles are usually underfilled. While this probably wouldn't help new players too much, I think it could entice people to just try out new things and maybe help with the Matchmaker being basically "Your BR is 6.3, but there's a lot of 7.3 players so your Pershing/IS2 will be fighting Leopard I's and Cents now, good luck".
Honestly the reason I stopped playing WT is because of the BR Compression and very often being only 3 people on a 10 player team because the rest left after one death (mainly a GRB issue). And even if they "fix" the economy, it won't bring me back (or at least not my wallet).
'More than 80% of players don't pay'
more like don't play
I knew it was less of a free to play game when I was a casual who played maybe 2 or 3 times a week for an hour or two (I was into World of Tanks at the time, judge me XD). I then started playing more like 5 times a week for an hour or two, and began getting decent at the game. I did this for around a year and a half, and then it hit me, I had only managed to grind to the Tiger 2s, and the later BF 109s. And I had ONLY played Germany until that point. I also badly wanted Russian and American vehicles too. It struck me that I was going to be grinding for eternity. SO, like most players, I decided to get a few mid tier premium planes and tanks, and for a good year I was happy with that, because I felt free seeing the SL I was making and the RP I was grinding out. But then I realized I had to do that again for top tier. so, I reluctantly got a top tier premium, and ground for the new F 14. And a top tier tank. And viola, thats how you go from a free to play player, one of those who hasn't spent a dime, to a player who's spent maybe 100 USD total, to a paying "subscriber". And still I haven't reached top tier ground yet (because I get bored playing the same nation eternally). For reference though, I never bought German premiums. I am at the Leo 2k. In the US tech tree, where I got a premium, I got past that BR easily in a year, what had taken me several without premium for Germany. Needless to say, I am boycotting.
Edit: OH! And I forgot to mention the crew skills. I STILL HAVEN'T MAXED THOSE OUT! And then I saw the 1 million SL I had to spend to max each aircraft, and GE to actually max. That Made me FURIOUS! They need to fix that.
That 80% not paying contains all the deserted accounts as well.
People, that just registered, installed, took a good look into the game, then left it indefinitely.
This is one evidence, that statistics are lies.
It's also a function of the Prato distribution phenomenon. Meaning 20% of the population do the majority of the work(pay). Trying to get more than that is trying to defy a weird law of nature.
I like the idea from Tim's Variety that, whatever the repair cost happens to be, 1 kill covers the repair cost of that vehicle. A decent compromise for that idea is that 1 kill could cover 80% of the full repair cost, and maybe an assist on top can cover the other 20%.
I highly recommend Tim's video "10 steps to fix the economy in War Thunder." He has some great ideas, and they're very well reasoned on top of it.
As far as rewarding players for skilled play, just remove all the soft caps on rewards so there's no diminishing returns for multiple kills, caps, etc.
Tim's video on this matter pretty much destroys all others. Sadly few people will watch it because it's long-form.
I don't think increasing the repair costs is good because, I find that, especially in top tier ground RB, performance in a match isn't necessarily depended on personal skill. I find that it's very difficult to average more than 5 kills with top tier Germany but top tier Russia isn't as much of challenge. The main reason is the skill of teammates and I don't feel that it's fair for a player to pay in excess of 10, 000 SL per vehicle if losing because of team skill inadequacies. Also, if the enemy team is significantly better at working together than your team, winning and more importantly preserving your own vehicle to avoid repair costs becomes much more difficult. I don't mind repair costs but I don't believe they should be more than the base reward a vehicle will earn for getting 1-3 kills/zone caps (depending on tier).
1. Increase battle partisipitation lions. (It is my understanding the battle activity silver lion gain was nurfed a while ago.)
2. Daily doubles for lions with different vehicles in your tech trees. This would let people play different vehicles and game modes, making grinding more interesting.
3.. Foldered vehicles should also have decreased repair cost and increased rp/lion gain. Fouldered vehicles should let players play their fav vehicles whithout fear of going bankrupt.
These are just some ideas to brainstorm. Glad to see the comunity getting up in arms over this. This game has become significantly more preditory and abuse sense I started playing, I'm hoping for a change.
As someone that has 80% of the nations air, heli's and ground tree grinded to top tier - I had a lot of free time during Covid. I can totally agree that things take too long. I do remember a time they would add cool vehicles and I would think " awesome! But I will never get them :') "
And I am sure there are a lot that still feel that way.
I'm glad to hear another creator suggesting constructive solution such as Turny and Odd. P.S. I haven't visited your channel in a year or so and forgot how amazing your are at Air RB lol.
thanks mate :)
Being honest, I've always consumed WT content, and I always hop on for the test drives, but I don't really play the actual game too much, one of the main reasons is the insane grind. I work, and I don't always have time to play games. And it's really off-putting know how much you need to put into this game to get anywhere. If it does change in future I'd welcome it.
To build on your attainable premium idea it might be an idea to add rank 3/4 squadron vehicles with premium bonusses. This would be an upside of choosing those above the high ranking ones with regular bonusses so it could also help prevent people jumping to toptier while not ready yet
WT definitely doesn't need any more punishment for dying. Even with the aforementioned "average player's skill issue" you'd die every now and then: you might be playing an unfamiliar / stock vehicle, at an unfavorable BR, or meet an actually skilled(!) opponent. And let me tell you being set back 5 matches' worth of SL through what feels like no fault of your own feels not at all unlike a kick to the crotch.
They should reward good play, instead. Nobody opposes that, and it would serve just as well of an incentive to learn how to play.
Dont ever ask to raise repair costs, most players always die every game. A survivor bonus and assist bonus are a great idea
For me, they need to split Rank 6+ into a new Tree for most nations (Israel for Exanple excluded), like they did back in the day with Naval.
Nah, rank 5 plus? Would give a buffer zone to learn jets with the early ones.
The game has definitely grown to the point where there needs to be a split in eras. A new player looking at a tech tree has hundreds upon hundreds of hours to grind before even sniffing a top tier vehicle, and they might have wanted to play the game strictly because they’re interested in playing a Leo 2 or something. There needs to be a split in eras, where a new player can start playing mid-way up a tech tree (without buying a premium). They won’t have access/research points go towards the top end of the WWII era vehicles, but it will allow them to get to the more modern vehicles faster. Combine the idea of what Gaijin did the Israel tech tree, and for the coastal boats for the naval tech tree.
“The customer is always right” where the customer is the entire player base. Not one person.
For me, the fact that even when I play with a premium account and a part of the time with premium tanks I do not earn enough credits to unlock new vehicles + expert their crews while not even near top tier yet is just ridiculous. And without any premium benefits the credit income is almost nothing, I can't even begin to imagine how bad it is around top tier.
I would also like to get certain premiums like the Lorraine and the AMX 50 premium, but the only way to get them (well you can get the AMX 50 through the marketplace too but €2000 is nowhere near reasonable for any vehicle) is by buying lootboxes with undisclosed drop rates, but that are rumoured to be 1 in 50.000 or even 1 in 250.000 depending on the specific vehicle drop, which'd cost the price of a new car or thousands of hours of grinding just to have a reasonable (but of course not guaranteed) chance to get even one premium from the pool, let alone one of the ones you want.
I'm also tired of all the types of air vehicles in the "ground" RB mode, from the lowest tiers on you get bombed all the time, then around the higher middle tiers you start getting harassed by completely broken helicopters, and then at the high tiers you get nuked from orbit by drones which are essentially exclusively usable for revenge killing.
Lastly the map design often allowing for spawn camping from the middle of the map in combination with the completely useless spawn protection makes it so that often when you're on the losing side of a match or an enemy just snuck around the map, you get shot pretty much immediately after spawning, which is ridiculous.
My biggest gripe is i never ever get to try out the new stuff in the updates im just now barely getting to the top of the us tech tree and now im in a slump not having fun. I want to try other planes and countries but its so daunting to start them cause it feels like it'll take months and months of doing the same thing over and over again just to get a couple planes i want to try out.
Suicidal CAS should be discouraged with a end of match for the player and a crew lock until that match is over.
One of the most frustrating thing for the economy was capping sim rewards, the other was loosing the battle activity time.
i did not agree with most of your talking points, but i agreed with a few others, yes reward players for good play, but no one should be punished for playing the game
That's a cool hoodie design.
17:18 that's is a great point because kill steals happen all the time, you could've spent 5 minutes in a dogfight, finally having the advantage but some other idiot who did nothing just swoops in and steals the kill. I do really think that assists should reward a lot more.
I just need research rewards sped up for ground and honestly I’m happy. I don’t struggle for sl and I enjoy multiple brs in the game, I just need to be able to progress at a reasonable rate with premium time. I should realistically be able to make it through a ground tier in a major nation in about 3 days, just like in air.
I can say that the moment i noticed how lazy gaijin is with problems that dont impact their revenue is with the traction nerf for tanks. They couldnt be bothered to fix their bad maps so they just removed the abilty to climb any hill.
Would suggest adding timestamps for relevant points made.
Almost thought you werent gonna cash in on the drama views
But yeah the economy for F2P players is abhorent and needs to be improved
Even with premium is beyond shit, but i dont know why you would be rewarded for not paying anything.
reason I'm partaking in the boycott
@@cheekibreeki4638 because the game is f2p, if not paying means you cant play just make wt a paid game then
It is, its just in disguise. Not saying its right, but thats seems to be how F2P goes
7:58 he’s not wrong I have over 1000 matches in my r3 yes I bullied alot at 4.0 but my crew is like around levels 110ish
I honestly haven't seen the specifics of the economy changes myself, but plenty of people I have heard from have complained and I'll take their word for it.
I've been doing pretty well on Silver Lions lately, but that's obviously because I have fed the snail some. Premium P-47M and premium account, I make enough SL by shooting down the Ju-288 spam.
This wasn't always the case, though. I was really struggling with SL while I was unlocking the earlier jets in the USA tree. A 20,000 SL repair cost for an F-86F-2? While getting shot down by 9.7BR Su-25Ks with R-60M missiles? Oof.
Being able to sell unused vehicles for SL (similar to Wargaming's model) will speed up the grind and add value to grinding in the first place
The 80% that don't pay a dime includes a huge percentage of lost opportunity for Gaijin. Most who enjoy a game will at some time pay a little towards something, and until that point, they help to populate the servers. Also, even a premium player will find it hard to get passed the 9.0 to 10.7 wall of premium planes using tech tree planes without significant loss of SL.
I think the compensation for playing matches is my biggest issue ESPECIALLY in ground RB. For an excellent game (5+ kills w/ 2+ caps) with premium time, youll probably break 60k SL. For every other match your losing money, breaking even or, if it was good game(2+ kills and a cap) maybe walking away with 20k SL. This horrible grind is compounded in top tier ground were ALOT of your deaths will be of no fault of your own AKA MIG 27 at 10km or MI28 slinging Vikrs 7km away or maybe your team just gets steamrolled that match. So as im typing this i think i noticed the economy has just never been adjusted for top tier (>rank 5) honestly from rank 1-5 in any nation, especially in Air RB ,the grind isnt bad.
Yep and i did it today. I got 10 kills and a cap and got 72k SL… SMH
A spit flyer upload 👀
When I first got into top tier, went from arcade mode to realistic. I was waiting 10 even 15 min to get into around that lasted maybe 5 min at the most. I can't think of any game that does that like wtf
make premium time earn like 5x over normal time and increase normal time rewards by like 60% for both RP and SL, then check the player base feedback after a month. A simple rewards bump may fix the problem for like 70% of the player base
Someone had the idea yeeeears ago of a weekly 50-100GE allowance for all accounts. Still seems like a good idea
My opinions focused on air RB:
1- If someone gets a kill and then dies the SL valance should be net zero on a loss or a small profit in a win(to avoid suicide head on grinders which were a problem back in the 2016/2020 era more or less)
2-If a bomber or strike aircraft gets a base/10 ground targets the SL valance should be zero on a loss or a small profit on a win (like 2k on higher tiers, 1.5k medium and 1 on low tiers maybe? should be the same as a kill really)
3-If you do more than that in the match like hits, crits, kills, bases or ground targets the SL rewards should be higher than they are now and net you a decent profit with a win and at least not a loss on a defeat
4-Almost identical aircraft should be foldered (the f-104s, some sabres, Bf-109s, spitfires, F-80s, B-17s, etc)
5-Research points for higher aircraft should be lowered, not that much, but noticeably. 3 straight planes of 380.000+ RP is outrageous
6-Bring back base bombing effects on a win in high tiers.
Im certain the snail wont do anything we want them to do and just give us the F-15 next patch to shut us up (if thats the route they take please give us the Vark too)
I would greatly appreciate a decrease in crew training cost cuz I've had the F16 for months now and still haven't used it because the crew isn't experted
so what about bombers if you give them a survivor bonus and all their ally's die. Won't they will continue flying into the stratosphere even more?
1 idea i have is give a small ge reward for doing really really good in games think of getting a nuke and not dying once or something like that
I would quite like if the warbond shop didn't require me to do those idiotic medal tasks for actually worthwhile rewards to be purchasable. Sure, they mean you can't just go and dump your warbonds on shop refresh, except you already can't because you need to progress the shop by doing dailies and battlepass tasks.
All they do is sap your warbonds and waste your time.
The game has definitely grown to the point where there needs to be a split in eras. A new player looking at a tech tree has hundreds upon hundreds of hours to grind before even sniffing a top tier vehicle, and they might have wanted to play the game strictly because they’re interested in playing a Leo 2 or something. There needs to be a split in eras, where a new player can start playing mid-way up a tech tree (without buying a premium). They won’t have access/research points go towards the top end of the WWII era vehicles, but it will allow them to get to the more modern vehicles faster. Combine the idea of what Gaijin did the Israel tech tree, and for the coastal boats for the naval tech tree.
divide research by 3
Can u review the thunderbolt mk 1?
The queue time is just a bad excuse for decompression, i bet my 2 balls that if queue times were longer nobody would care, also they can make so you can still do stuff while loading a battle, so you could organize your lineups and stuff
Gaijin just needs to stop being so greedy as to force players into paying by sheer frustration and inspire them to want to support the game instead. They've gone about it the wrong way entirely.
The minutes of wait time has nothing to do with the amount of people playing… I’ve had to wait 2-3 minutes for matches dozens of times with 100+ people in my bracket waiting for a match. It tells you how many people in your BR range are waiting for a match right under the timer..
I dont mind grinding a week for a new vehicle, what keeps me from playing is the potential of loosing sl just for playing without premium acc
what if all the cc make 1 video together and upload it to phly channel or something
One important thing I would like to see is increased rewards for when you're uptiered. Let's say you're flying a 5.0 plane and you're fully uptiered. It would make sense if you'd earn more SL and RP by eliminating a 6.0 player than eliminating a 5.0 player. I feel like every match nowadays is basically a roll of the dice when it comes to the battle ratings of your opponents and teammates, to the point where you're just praying not to get a full uptier because the match will be painfully unfair, especially in ground RB. Going up against an IS-3 in your 76 Jumbo is extremely painful. You literally cannot reliably pen him anywhere and the BR difference is just 0.7.
So why not reward players for winning fights they had no business winning?
Increased repair costs across the board would be a silly idea, however maybe increasing repair costs for some of the top tier premiums so that they are in line with other vehicles in the tier would make more sense, since usually the ones that tend to throw away their lives in matches are them, like rushing bases and dying or trading kills. I think premiums shouldn't be a free pass to get money no matter what you do, rather they should reward you more for playing like you would in a normal vehicle and that implies doing your best not to die. This would also help with newer players who take these vehicles out with no previous knowledge of the game, eventually they will run out of free repairs and won't be able to afford to play top tier until they go back to low tier and learn the game where it's cheaper.
I like your argument for the repair cost BUT you have to remember, repair cost is what prevents players from playing the new planes they just unlocked, you cannot expect new players to just learn a plane and its suroundings in a few games, and this is even more relevent when you take into account the lack of modifications. The difference between a spaded and stock plane is still enormous, add to that the fact that you have to learn a new playstyle... well you're going to die and do reckless mooves... is it your fault? no! everyone learns and its only natural to fail when you learn. If I'm in my brand new spitfire MkXVI and climb like I always do in spitfires, encounter a Ta152 at high alt caus full uptier and I start turnfighting him, my spitfire's gonna get oblitareted by that ta, but how could I have known it, spitfires have always been about climbing and turning, finding a good 1v1 and trapping the opponent by outmaneuvering them. So even has an experienced spitfire player I got caught offgards by the difference in performance. And you can only learn those interactions through playing! so what? I'm getting punished because I turned with a spitfire in a 1v1 in a neutral altitude situation! and adding insult to injury I now have to pay a ton of sl?
What I would suggest is rather than making you pay more when you fail, gain more when you win, you talked about server population but making players pay that much for their mistakes will turn them off said battle rating. So I would fix it in a 3 point method:
1) increase gains when you do assists or kill and allies are in a 5km range for props, 10 for jets and lower the gains when you gets kills and there are more than 2 ennemies in that range and no allies(generally being outnumbered is a sign of bad play, even more so if there are no allies nearby, sure you have exceptions like pro player getting in a 1v3 and winning by sheer skill but at that point the 2 last kills will have normal multipliers and win a ton of sl and rp)
2) lower repair cost for every minute you've had an equivalent (or close to) number of allies and ennemies close to you to encourage teamplay (it encourages teamplay and even if you miss the kills and the assists, it happens even if you play well, you'll get rewards for helping your teammates)
3) Victories will give you exponentially bigger rewards linked to the activity you had ingame so that the more you play and you survive actively to the ennemies the more you are rewarded, no need to punish defeat, they're already missing on the rewards.
I might be idealist but I feel like encouraging teamplay and good plays is way more enducing to player than punishing missplays especially for newer players and older players that try new things, diversity is a good thing and I think that with the things I proposed it encourages it. I don't want our beloved game to be only profitable for the elite of the elite, give the noobies a chance to git goot :P
(and finally sorry for my bad english, it's not my main language, and sorry if I sounded a little to critical, I writted this only as a constructive comment, or I hope so, I love these vids and hope my small contribution will help ^^')
something that hasnt really to do with the economy but I really miss historical matchmaking
Ironically “giving (selling) everyone an abrams” is actually one of the problems we’re complaining about.
Anyway, I think it's going to be hard to base rewards on player performance. If you incentivize by giving a heft reward for 'winning,' it will only ever reward players who shitstomp the enemy team, which already happens with regularity in War Thunder.
What we need is more dynamic and varied 'objectives' to be met within the game. In some air RB missions, if the game timer starts running low, some new vehicles will spawn for each enemy team to strafe to help run the enemy out of tickets. This should happen earlier in the match, with different groups of enemy targets spawning in different places with some regularity. Not a whole lot all at once, just pairs of objectives spawning in every 4-5 minutes. And these objectives don't need to be all about shooting up unarmored trucks, you can vary it up. Sometimes it will be armored targets. Another objective can start up 6-7 minutes into the game, after people have climbed to altitude, a group of AI bombers will spawn. If a certain percentage of them survive to make it to their drop point, the team completes the objective. If the enemy team shoots enough of them down, they complete the objective. And nobody will know in a given match if their team will be getting attacker or defender for these objectives. This will make players adapt to new situations, and reward a diverse team composition.
And importantly, these objectives could reward a flat "SL Bonus" for the entire team if completed. So even if you lose, a team that was able to complete *some of* these objectives will have their repair costs partially offset. Reward teamwork instead of making people fight over kills.
im so close to leave war thunder after playing it since 2014. grinding is really hard now, new players getting high tier premiums and killing the matchmaker, low rewards (got 8 kills and 1.24ton bombing in a round that i clutched 1v3 and just got 6k RP and 60K SL. It’s just struggling now.
I have 3.2k hours in this game, almost all of the last thousand were spent screaming at the game and only being able to play two games or so before rage quitting because of terrible rewards or because of Gaijin’s bugginess/volumetric
we need voice chat for matches... i would like to communicate with my team and strategise
I agree on rewarding skill, but unfortunately Gaijin made clear by the removal of the proximity rewards that they don't want to reward skillful plays. Proximity rewards aren't perfect, but it was still a good way to reward players that contributed to a positive match outcome by baiting, or pressuring, an enemy in a way that required setting the kill up for a friendly and not themselves as otherwise they would've had to give away that advantageous position.
I stopped paying for premium because I couldn't tell the difference in my SL problems either way.
The premium benefit was so small, the costs are so high, that I just grind
Sometimes, I feel like all Im doing is grinding unpleasant, stock, bad vehicles to get to the few vehicles I like
Why respawn and cost myself more SL in repair costs on maps where my team is spawn pinned, or where I have to drive kilometers of open fields to get into cover?
The game has become the South Park episode about free games
Crew in GRB? Let’s see, i have a slot with 123 level and from my accounting (spawns with those tanks) something like 4000 battles over 4 or so years. Yup that is insane grinding.
Just put advertisements in the hangar and loading screens, instant revenue, wont have to rely on premiums as much
I think what needs to happen is that Gaijin needs to just… go away. Another company has to take its place, but I’m not sure who’d be better. They’ve repeatedly proven themselves to be eternally money hungry out of touch people, and enough is enough.
The problem with that is almost every company that has the money to buy it off them is the exact same way, I couldn't imagine what would happen, say, EA got their hands on warthunder.
@@themanhimself6696 "Purchase more energy to enter a match, energy regenerates every two hours!"
Ive always thought overkill would be a good choice
@@LostCauseRT Just wait until the F22 raptor DLC comes out for $300 and it's the only gen 5 in the game
@@themanhimself6696 💀
I found it insanely funny that one of my main complaints was the SPAA in Sim battles one shot pilot sniping before you can even do anything. After I quit for a week I came back to play some custom battles by myself and the last patch was “reduced accuracy for SPAA in Sim Battles” lmfao.. sorry that’s not enough to get me to come back. The reason that was such a huge problem for me is because of repair costs. Paying 20,000+ SL just to spawn in and getting AI sniped before being able to do anything. Making me pay 25,000 SL to spawn in a Vatour jet bomber with no CCIP/RP is fucking absurd. You literally have to get close enough to drop somewhat accurately but the ground AI having aimbot has been a problem as long as I’ve been playing and made it so you basically threw away 20,000+ SL anytime you wanted to play Sim. Even in RB ground AA AI has been a huge problem, through all the ranks. Causing instant oil leaks at lower tiers, to destroying your engine in one hit at higher tiers.
i want this game to be a better place i want people to be nice i would love to see people helping one and other on both teams we are all here to have fun and progress but i find it really hard to do so at 11.0 and up bc its so toxic most times i dont even want to kill other players bc i know how much it sucks to go into a game just to die and not do anything i like to go for AI and tanks and stuff like that im a chill guy i just want to be left alone to grind the way i want and id love to see people understanding that and being more nice about it im sick of being told stuff like cope cry harder skill issue nood get good stuff like that its just toxic and makes me not want to play i love the game but some people make it hard to play
400 hours, best vehicle is t34-85
Well and Chapaev on 6.0
Only got into naval because of being tired of having 200k after days of grinding at a time :/
I feel like if you disconnect due to server issues/ internet issues or get kicked you shouldnt pay repair cost or at least ful price and shouldnt get penalized
I feed like adding what type of playstily a plane has to the statcard whould alos help.Becuse even though im into planes and has early jets in Sweden and Germany. I dont have the mood all the time to watch or read on WT wiki or a video just to know what the playstily a newly bout plane has. So i think from my view that a simple line or discriptoin of the playstily on the statcard whould shorten the time to master a new plane.
Ps, im swedish so my english is'nt the best!
As someone who has spent a good chunk of change on the game this change makes me so upset. I don’t have a premium account anymore but I always assumed oh I can just grind all my premium vehicles and still progress decently quickly. Now even that is gonna be a horribly long grind. Love Gaijin
Most important thing that needs to change is separation of WWII tanks/planes from Cold War ones ,same with divide between Cold War and Modern era.This can be done by either bringing back old br's or placing empty br between 6.0 and 7.0 and next one between 8.0-9.0. For new players it is impossible to advance when every single match is uptier against players that can lolpen you at any angle.Players shouldn't have 6 + kills every single game just to break even.
this is the third reason why I stopped playing the game, it became absurd how every match I was using WWII tanks to fight cold era one
We do have a free abrams. It is the aim
The thing for me is, I would love to spend more time in the game, work on different tech trees, try out different aircraft tanks or ships but I don’t have enough time, I enjoy the game enough that even if it was a base price game I’d buy it! But I don’t want to spend the next 10 years of my life trying to finish the US tech tree.
Also side note, people may play up to top tier and decide that they prefer prop planes or early jets and go back and fill up those servers because that’s what they prefer, eliminate the crew training costs so people can freely bounce around from vehicle to vehicle after they bought it! Make x2 SL events with P26’s for a weekend as an example…that will fill up servers
I haven't played the game in a hot minute, but I used to play this game a lot and here are the issues that caused me to stop playing the game. Airfield camping has been atrocious and never fixed, there are probably easy ways to get a fix for it, like a limited timer you have before your friendly aa stops giving you cover because you are just doing circles around the airfield. All of the OG jets like the F2, Hunter, Mig 17, and CL13 all get shit on by missiles and supersonic jets. It is possible to play them but it is not fun anymore. I stopped playing high tier and went to low tier due to friends not having jets and it was a lot of fun, but we got tired of the airfield camping and when they eventually grinded their way to tier 5 jets it was terrible and that's what caused them to quit. There shouldn't be a skill based matchmaker but there should be a system in place where you don't have an entire team full of bots that just die in the first 5 minutes of the match either. Also whatever BR rating the JU288c was at made matches in that BR miserable because the matches always consisted of 6 bombers on a team and like 2 fighters.
10k in dept. I hit the wrong buttion and shot 😭
Gaijin thinks that they need to do this monetization methodology, which is wrong. The progression could be ten, one hundred times as fast atp and they could still make bank. Look at Warframe, which has similar amounts of unlockable content, but fairly quick unlocks. They make a ton of their money on cosmetics. Simply having user created and company created cosmetics, and allowing people to get into the vehicles they want instantly, fairly cheaply (say max $20) would make them more than they make now.
Can you fly the fw 190 F8?
Only apology ill accept is everyone in management being sacked.
They want to play with fire, we'll play scorched earth
Absolutely! F them!
I think since War thunder should include a ranked system that includes boosters with increasing ranks so people are incentivized to play well but people are also not demotivated from playing if they cant play well because the on average really high or really low skill drives people away especially in top tier. but otherwise i agree with you
i find it kind of fucked up that i buy the olifant mk1a for 590k then the crew training is the same price
makes no sense
I'm not sure if I buy the whole "only 20% of you spend money"
But if it is true then maybe they should reevaluate the physical cost of items and/or make them more enticing especially if they plan on continuing to ask for $70. Like look at the $70 planes they added...they just aren't worth the money
I think you’re right with both ideas. I do think they used the total number of accounts as that 20% metric, including players that made an account and never played
Mmmm 20 minute spit video, yea
Not only the economy has to change, they have to decompress the BR system, why a Sabre or mig 15 bis have to try to evade R60s? it's like putting bi planes against superprops!, also, they have to remove the new damage models because the HEFI shells don't work as intended, or maybe fix them.
I love this game and I'm also kind of a average war thunder player. I don't really play war thunder but I would love to play it. all these changes that need to happen but for the average player and the high low rewards and I think maybe the repair costs should go in that way to. But I don't know I'm not the ones developing war thunder.
There needs to be an equal commitment from both sides.
As someone who’s spent upwards of $18,000 on War Thunder over the course of 10 years, it is not worth it
I really love aviation and tanks from the WW2 era to now, and I see it more as paying for collectibles instead of wasting literal months to get them (which after over 5,000 hours, you still have to regardless of money spent)
But the fact that you can spend more than a new car’s worth of money on this game, and still be nowhere close to having the majority of vehicles available to play, speaks volumes about the monetization tactics this game has in place