Regarding the parents' reaction, Nietzsche said if a person''s whole raison d'etre is to fight a particular enemy, then it is not in that person's interests to let the enemy die. Because once the enemy dies, that person loses his whole raison d'etre (reason for existence). So it will never be in the interests for example of an SJW to downplay homophobia or racism or say that those issues are going away. Marion Le Pen actually used this quote in a speech in the French parliament about feminists.
9:20 Wait, is that Kitty Pryde? Jesus, I thought that was Bobby's boyfriend. Why the hell does every female character over at Marvel have to look like a teenage boy?
Welp.....Ive expected this ever since them Awful Captain Marvel Comics came out(Ive been Hateing Captain Marvel). Looks like Captain Marvel is spreading her Man looks disease around to all these Marvel females
I'm just confused as to how Bobbies parents some how were able to love their son as a mutant but are shocked by him being Gay. I mean political pandering aside - You'd think after being revealed to be a Mutant where people fear and misunderstand you that being Gay would just be.. Well something a family that strong could overcome easily. Their should have been no tie ups.
Thank you! I myself am not a homosexual. However I have a fair few friends that are. They are just people - being a mutant is so much more of a difference than a sexual preference. One of those has the potential to harm yourself and others you care about if you can't control it or be used for evil to threaten government institutions. The other one is a Man being sexually attracted to other Men or vice versa for a Women. SJW marvel is so out of touch with so much of their narrative it comes off as immoral and insensitive to the people who are what they are trying to represent. Once again just another example of poor story telling. You know what would have been progressive is if Bobby knew in his heart he was gay and wasn't sure how to deal with it and by coming out to his parents they show him love and support. Bobby isn't exactly "Dude for Dude" just yet but coming to terms with and being supported by his family. (Even tho the Jean Grey thing makes it complete bullshit) Or better yet make a new homosexual mutant character who at the same time of coming out is also just now developing their mutant gene. (Sounds like a page turner doesn't it?)
NotTheWheel well one means you have god-like superpowers and the other one involves sleeping with the same sex and getting involved in all the other things associated with gay culture.
Well I don't think you gotta dress up like the Village People anymore to be Gay. Least of all I don't believe you have to adopt absolutely everything that is considered Gay Culture perse. I'd say an over indulgence to that level is a bit to steep for a person just figuring out how they feel about it. I'm not sure I'd have to ask one of my Gay friends about it. It's a decent point regardless. You sure got a lot of homework to take on for being Gay then. I just figured it could be as simple as liking the same sex. Shows how much I know lmao XD
You could argue there was nuance - like how liberals accept homophobic Islam but not homophobic Christianity, or how most christians are for interracial marriage but not gay marriage - you could argue they had something like that, but the books fail to bring them up, so with what we know it is ridiculous.
The real Iceman was mind-displaced by Jean Grey and is stuck in weird limbo dimensions. Now he has to fight his way across different forms of reality whilst trying to hold on to his real self.
it'll never happen...this is the iceman we get forever...once they turn a character gay he can't be turned back without too much backlash....this is it.
It's the Marvel Universe, and people get up in arms over random things. Captain Marvel once mentioned "I'm half kree and have super star powers but being a mutant is the big Scare? " The X-Men have always been a series about intolerance and discrimination that includes all minority groups. Bobby parent are clearly the "We love you son, but we wish you were NORMAL, can you just be normal and not like THEM" WE as readers know they're heroes but the great Universe sees MUTANT ≈ MONSTER
I just don't even know why he's doing the coming out thing when he's yet to have any gay action. Shouldn't he try some sausage before coming out to his parents in his 30's.
wayne de olival_yea man that's my biggest question...the timeline was one conversation with the younger version of himself where he's like "well if you're gay then i must be gay because of course i am" then we get to here...he's never dated a guy or kissed a guy...the closest things that's happened to him that could be considered gay are one dance with daken and the fact his costume is a romper. that's it...like...what if he goes all in and finds out he reeeeeeaaally doesn't like anything up his butt....does he just mulligan this whole series? does he call up mom and dad and say "hey i'm just gonna take back all that gay talk...turns out dick up the butt hurts so....vagina all the way"
Or maybe he'll realize that he feels similarly dissatisfied by gay sex as straight sex and he realizes that his problem isn't that he's gay or straight or asexual or whatever just that he's chronically depressed from all the life and death, saving the world bullshit he engages in on the regular. Whether he likes dick or not is the least of Iceman's problems, he's a 30 something year old dude that hangs around with child soldiers fighting for human rights.
Also wasn't it floated that the younger versions may be from a different reality entirely ? Hence why their continued presence hasn't destroyed their existence. Or was that dropped ? I can't even be bothered trying to keep track of Marvel nonsense.
as a gay guy, i'm insulted but i can't fucking stop laughing. This is the most ridiculous bullshit i've ever heard. what happend to good gay characters like wiccan during childrens crusade
@ind0ctr1n3 - "To me personally, I don't like gay people that act like extremely feminent men. Not because of their sexual orientation, just the way they are bugs the fuck out of me." Well, not liking a whole group of people because of their mannerisms is pretty bigoted, man. Also, it's effeminate. Not 'feminent.'
I bet this is the reaction the gay writer for the comic WISHED he got. There's this sketch on College Humor where a character comes out and everyone is so accepting that he's disappointed. I feel that this guy is going through the same thing.
So basjcally, what youre telling me is that a guy just self inserted himself into a character more than twice his age in legacy and history, made all characters shitty horrible people and brought in Jugger as some weird manchild. Yeah, you can't expect this to sell to normal people.
As an openly gay 35yo fan of comics this trend to make heroes LGBT and not have realistic stories is so painful, they need to just make new LGBT characters
Wow! When you said "Kitty" I didn't realize that the person with Bobby WAS KITTY! I literally thought it was some guy that came along for support with a bowl cut! Also Bobby sort of hangs a lantern on how crazy this situation is "You've seen me risk my life time and time again." would've been interesting if Bobby's dad was like "wait...what? We thought we sent you to a school for gifted people so you could learn to live some kind of approximation of a normal life, not be a paramilitary children's militia for mutant rights!"
Making Iceman gay seems so unnecessary. For decades he was established as a ladies type guy or at least aspired to be one. Why not just make a new character to address this particular topic? It just seems creatively dishonest to basically retcon an already well established character.
Cough Syrup The Loyal There's already a good number of established gay X-characters, though. These people don't even care to learn who they are. They just want a well known character to be their mouthpiece. (And that mandate is sad if true, but I don't doubt it.)
Xmen has had several characters that were gay. Their sexualities flipped and flopped throughout the different universes. One time colossus and northstar dated.
@@mikeclifford8360 well he had only showed sexual attraction to women and since we are in a position where we can read his thoughts and feelings, it never showed any inclination that he might have other sexuality, not even a hint I think, so to me doesn't make sense this change A good comparative would be Dc Character Jericho, that had shown hints that he wasn't heterosexual, bit due to the age of publication (back in the 80s) they couldn't really make him come out
It sucks that Bobby is written flamboyantly gay. Like, his character, up until the point it was changed, was straight. Even if we were all fine with him magically changing sexuality (which I'm not, it's pathetic pandering, make new characters to ruin) why would he magically change his level of masculinity. You'd think, for the sake of continuity (to some degree) they'd want to maintain that level of masculinity. His personality should not have changed. I'm ignorant and sheltered, but are all gay men ridiculously flamboyant? (Apart from Dave Rubin, who is the most normal seeming gay man on the internet) Because that's what these comics are telling me.
A more realistic coming out story would have been him coming home in that awful shorty shorts costume and his mom jokingly asking if he was gay, then him just being silent until it sinks in. Then his mom in a sympathetic way saying "oh honey, just because you are doesn't mean you have to dress like that, lets go get you some pants." And his dad in the background mumbling about how he kind of figured since his ex looked like a man, but was hoping he'd at least knock her up so they would have grandchildren.
I remember hearing that apparently Northstar used to be attracted to Iceman and Iceman refused because he's straight. Also Northstar is married so no North Pole for this book unless Northstar and his husband(who's name I can't remember) are polyamorous. Also I'll say that to me, Iceman being gay is nonsensical. He's dated numerous women and has turned down men. I doubt he was scared of the other Xmen because they're literally some of the most accepting people ever. And they said that the past Xmen are from an alternate universe so if that's the case then Iceman shouldn't even be gay because that's not him from the past technically.
that's right!! i remember that...northstar made a pass at iceman and iceman freaked out and was offended as all hell about it...holy shit....well this is awkward....
@@JuggyBohab - Most men who repress their sexuality to a big enough extent react by freaking out and being overly offended. Just ask the Republican/Christian Right who rail over and over again about the "scourge" of homosexuality then are busted for soliciting sex from men in the public mensroom.
I was married to a woman and turned down men. And I knew my family was very accepting of all kinds of people. But, I actually met a men and fell in love with him. All of a sudden, I had a choice to make. Continue living a lie ONLY FOR THE COMFORT OF OTHER PEOPLE or be honest with them and myself and live an authentic life. I chose the latter. See, the first person a gay man has to come out to is himself. If he can't accept himself as gay, he'll do anything in his power to dissuade others from finding out about it.
This writer (and the editor) don´t even know these characters. Maddie Drake was a caring open minded mom, the dad thougt Bobby should hide his mutant powers and was agains him dating a japaneese woman, but later he get beat up for calling Graydon Creed a Racist on TV, and that was in he 90's. They only watched X2 for sure.
This is right up Disneys street. They would never say that. This is what they want. If they could they'd shove it int he star wars films and the new Han Solo film would have him suddenly being gay
The funny thing is Jean told young Bobby that he was gay so current Bobby who already had years to build up his identity suddenly decides he's gay too. Not that being gay is bad, but pulling a 180 on an established character's personality of course people are going to be upset about it.
No one "suddenly decides" that they are gay. It may be the first time YOU know about it. But, believe me, gay people know they are "different" from a very young age.
Nobody at work believes this stuff is actually going on in Marvel. My mom won't even let me talk about it any more it makes her so upset. "Are you serious?!" The one thing I hear from EVERY person I talk to about this. It's ridiculous. AvX for me is where comics end for Marvel.
one more day did it for me...i haven't felt that anything went right for marvel at that point. it was just mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake....well wait the whole dark reign thing was pretty cool...so after that but i think one more day was the start.
Weston Wickman I didn't even make it through AvX. It's that issue after Bendis took over the X-Men with the original 5 time travel kids. After Quesada had Peter Parker sell his marriage to the devil, that was it. That was the last issue of any comic I've read. I have a whole box of books I picked up from the shop the same day that came out, that I've never touched.
Holy shit that's Kitty! I didn't know until you commented on her/him saying "annnd I'm out", up until that point I thought it was the younger version of Bobby who's already a used and abused teenaged twink also talking to who presumably would also be his parents, just aged more. Holy shit, when is she going to come out to her parents as a trans man? You nailed it D&C!
Space Woof even then it was a disrespect to his original parents who actual loved their son enough and didn’t shame him or abandoned him for being a mutant and sent him to Xavier’s school to have a normal life. What’s horrible about this is that coming out thing was supposed to represent gays coming out to their parents or relatives. The mutants are supposed to represent LGBT people but we can do subtle things like this nowadays.
Of course they're having that kind of "wait, WHAT?!" reaction. For 50 years, Bobby Drake has been straight. Now he's suddenly gay because the SJW crowd wanted to turn him gay, apparently just for the hell of it. So yeah, they're having a completely baffled reaction because there son has never been gay before. He's had numerous girlfriends, he's crushed on girls, etc. This whole "lolz yeah he's totes gay now!" thing is basically just a giant middle finger to the Marvel fans of Bobby Drake. Proving once again that the writers of these horrible "comics" don't have the first clue about the characters or how to write a decent story.
Did SJW Marvel forget we already have a gay mutant anyway to fit their "quota". He's called Northstar and he was actually a well written character but 1. I don't know if he's still around 2. He probably will be ruined or is ruined now and I just don't know
Hey Marvel fans, wanna see the daring adventures of the Uncanny X-Men!? Want to see them battle Apocalypse in an alternate future, or Mr. Sinister in the Savage Lands, or maybe fighting Magneto and The Brotherhood ?? Yeah!? Well fuck you, here's a coming out story about Ice Man! He'll talk and talk and talk with his parents about bullshit you couldn't care less about. Excelsior!!!
LobsterPuncher the worst part is that he is gay not by choice or by understanding himself but because jean brainwashed him, if he stay gay forever, the fans will always remember that is was jean fault
I heard in the next one Mike Pence finds out what Jean did to Iceman and brokers a deal with Wakanda to have Storm zap him with lightning to make him straight again.
YA GONNA *POUND* THE VILLAINS, ICE MAN?! Haha hahahaha A_A [Tears stream down my face as I watch Marvel slowly kill itself and all it's beautiful characters.]
I miss these types of videos. These are moments in Comicsgate history and need to be preserved. You and EVS's Star Wars videos are the primordial soup from which Comicsgate was born, I remember well the videos in the car and Zacs hand gestures lmao and the Luna the dog videos, such amazing times❣
Wow man, I just found out about what they, really, what they replaced Iceman with last week or so. You're right, it's not the same character at all. But did you say they have Kitty Pryde or Jean Grey 'transitioning' now? That's every bit as bad; there's zero legitimate basis for any of that. They don't care one iota about these characters or their stories. There's no integrity in any of this. It's just another propaganda opportunity to them. I haven't read them in six or seven years, and it still upsets me. Just more reinforcement that I left comics at the right time, I guess. I really miss *good* X-Verse comics. I used to buy the whole line, got nearly every issue for a good 25 year span, plus back issues and reprints. I loved these characters; they were one of the few things that would come with, every time I moved to a new city. I remember ordering about ten years of books, across all titles, in chronological story order when I was a teenager. It was all one grand opera to me from childhood through my college years, my working years. Probably why I've been watching videos about Marvel stuff lately. Just honestly breaks my heart, just that much, even though I'm out of the market now. They're not in it for the right reasons. They apparently just don't care, beyond how they can use the megaphone dropped in their laps to advance their own personal goals. There's nothing noble about destroying something with real value just to throw mud around your own sandbox. It's a prison of the mind, like they can't see beyond their own skin, their own prism. I feel basically like it all died not long after I left off, and there's just nothing much to go back to, even if they weren't pricing people out. Makes me that much more appreciative of the fims, as long as they don't go down the same road, and glad that the X-Men film franchise is not under Disney/Marvel's control, as much as I see people around the internet keep demanding it.
the problem here is writers think we gay people are only that... *GAYS* like there's nothing else that define us... they should know by now that having Bobby gay doesn't have to affect him AT ALL... he may be happier, yeah, but because he might feel free...nothing else...
This Juggernaut is boss. It was in X-men Blue #1 or #2 so it's not original to this. Not sure where it came from though. I also really don't like the Jean Grey thing personally. I get that it's a joke but that belittles what really happened. It was writers with agendas that want to virtue signal.
well yea it was the writers but they used jean grey to do it. there was literally no build up then one day jean was like "bobby you're gay" and that was it. it wasn't even hinted at before then.
JuggyBohab Even while entertaining the meta-theory of Jean and Bobby, there is no proof of it. Comic books can be subtexual but for important events like a character death or becoming gay suddenly, if it isn't explicitly shown it didn't happen. This leaves one conclusion to which creating a meta-theory becomes moot: the writer did it because, "Why not?".
1) i will never watch another video about "gayice" make sure title them appropriately so there is no confusion 2) the real iceman is in the past , in all the comics i read as a kid.
My girlfriend's father is in his sixties, and has just had two knees replaced, and he's in better shape than Bobby's parents. You'd think the artist could have put a bit more effort into them.
So, I don´t get it. Jean Grey gets to fundamentally alter people and everyone is ok with that? I can´t imagine its not something that would be caught by higher ups in one of the many groups that run around Marvel Earth.
I was all too willing to make the brainwashing little head cannon, but if Bobby hasn't even slept with a guy yet and has continuously slept with multiple women in the past, that's the only conclusion available cannon wise. Someone help poor Iceman.
So his parents can accept that Bobby is a Omega Level mutant that can turn his body and surroundings into ice but can't stand that he likes to date dudes?
NOHERO 1 Considering the fact that their son was legitimately heterosexual until Jean Grey decided to mindrape him into being gay, it's not too much of a stretch to believe that they'd be shocked by that revelation.
It's just so crazy how no one finds this suspicious. He hasn't even been with another dude or lusted for a guy before or has been a situation that idk felt right to him he just one day woke up and was like guys I'm gay in 2017 but let's act like it's 1992 and act like I'm being brave or a victim of my situation
NOHERO 1 Since this train looks to keep on rolling, can we at least see him date a real man? A Ross Kemp, Chuck Norris type. A manly man who is not effeminate, who just needs 5 minutes, bish bash, job done and puts on the football with a can of bear, doesn't need to be held... No of course not. I forgot, this is Marvel and men are actually women in this universe.
NOHERO 1 to be honest, from the point of view of his parents, he has been a mutant since he was a teenager, he was dating a girl like a 1 or 2 months ago, and now he is gay
They missed a golden opportunity to examine the subject of Conversion Therapy from a generally unexplored angle here, possibly even comparing Jean Grey to any number of mind manipulating villains that they X-Men has faced in the past such as Master Mind.
guy at bar- I'll have a cosmopolitan please, and an umbrella. Bobby Drake appears- you want ice with that? chuckles. -sure, nice ice breaker btw. chuckles. leaked from Ice Man movie script.
The point of Bobby Drake was an Omega level mutant who was a normal person with loving parents. He was oftentimes not used correctly as a juxtaposition between some of the more screwed up backgrounds of the xmen. His charm was that he was normal.
What blows me away is that the 'Grey Makes Gay' theory makes for a better comic book story than what we have so far with Iceman, and it also keeps gaining traction as the story progresses. He's coming out as gay at 30 and his parents are shocked when the story with most people coming out is that their parents knew beforehand. He himself didn't seem to know he was gay. Also he's never had a single encounter with a man well into his 30's which is also far fetched and doesn't add up. Gay people may hide it sometimes but behind closed doors they have their relationships. His dating of woman after woman over the years, and his intense romance with Kitty, and not even a flirtation with a fella? It just doesn't add up. The way he comes out to them, "I"m gay. Dude for dude. I want to go on dates with men", was most likely meant to be written as snarky hipster speak, but read in the right monotone voice it sounds like pure brainwash scripted lines as it's so unnatural and robotic. At this point I almost expect SJW Marvel to catch wind of this theory by now and put something into the story to dispel it.
when and if we ever get a clean sweep of the company not only do we need writers who actually know what they are doing but we need writers who are actively trying to undo all the damage SJW Marvel has done they need to just put all these characters back to the way they were.
The FlameCon podcast of XplainTheXmen is a pretty good look at Sina Grace's insight into Iceman. Agree or disagree, but he definitely explains (sorry, no pun) his perspective. There was another "Xplain" podcast with Grace that helps complete the picture.
I believe the new Juggernaut was first introduced in Astonishing X-Men #18-19 where Cyttorak makes Cain Marko an even more powerful Juggernaut than ever before. I don't know who designed it though.
The Juggernaut costume is from marvel now 2.0, but I think I saw it in the Extinction X Men story ark where he tried to get revenge on cyclops for kill of Charles Xavier.
RIP Bobby Drake. Rage. Pure rage. This book makes me so mad I could die. Think I've ranted about it enough, though. The book ripping at the end is usually just funny--this time? It was cathartic.
I feel really sorry for Bobby, his mind was warped by Jean to be gay. Everyone knows it too and is too afraid to stop it or help. Unless they succumb to the same fate, or worse.
I think the only way I can like any thing that Marvel is doing right now is to tell myself that it is an Alternate Universe story. None of it matters to the real continuity so it can be enjoyed as a separate thing... or not, but it isn't doing violence to the original just by existing at that point. I had to do the same thing with Firefly and Serenity and now I can watch Serenity without foaming at the mouth (though I don't because it's an AU so who cares. :D). Maybe the same idea will work for current Marvel stuff. It's all just a big What If...
There are quite a few things but in general it is that the movie doesn't follow the established story of the series. Simon is a Doctor, he isn't a commando or spy. In the series, he pays people to get River out, it isn't exciting but it helps define his character. In the movie he does it himself which in my opinion actually makes his character less distinct. Remember when he tried to pass himself off as a guy who wanted to buy mud in Jaynestown? How did that character sneak into a top secret alliance base? Why would River be confused to see him after he lets her out of the cryo box if he was the one that put her inside. For that matter, why would he even put her in the box when his face would be every bit as known as hers. Mr. Universe came out of nowhere and felt very much to me like a plot device that was scratching at the door of Deus ex machina. The explanation for the Reavers didn't jive well with what we had seen of them in my opinion. Why were they able to operate without core containment? Was it killing them and they just didn't care or was it not killing them for some reason. If the explanation for their behavior is that the rage center of their brain is running at full all the time, why would they care about going into space to hunt people? How would they operate as any kind of society? How does them being really angry get us to complicated traps, weird body pinatas, psychological torture, tactical decision making or the ability to not die in space with any kind of regularity. Plus when Joss Whedon killed Wash all I could see was every other time that he has tried to recapture the impact of the death of Jenny Calendar and it annoyed me rather than making me fear for the rest of the crew. There are a few other little things but those are the big ones. Not faulting anyone that likes Serenity, if I separate the two in my mind it's a pretty good movie. If I watch it as a sequel I don't care for it though.
I went to the Comic Shop and asked "When is Iceman coming out?" The answer of course is Every Issue .
He already came out in 2003. If Iceman is gay, blame Brian Singer.
The Sentinel I think that was an Iceman from another universe
I blame Jean Grey. We should just blame Jean Grey for everything at this point.
^^^ AGREED ^^^^
But she's a woman. You can't blame her. Blame the patriarchy!
Regarding the parents' reaction, Nietzsche said if a person''s whole raison d'etre is to fight a particular enemy, then it is not in that person's interests to let the enemy die. Because once the enemy dies, that person loses his whole raison d'etre (reason for existence). So it will never be in the interests for example of an SJW to downplay homophobia or racism or say that those issues are going away. Marion Le Pen actually used this quote in a speech in the French parliament about feminists.
That's a good (and depressing) point. No wonder they see racism and homophobia in places where it hasn't existed since the previous century.
Cassius- Thank you, very wise.
Cassius True. Well said.
9:20 Wait, is that Kitty Pryde? Jesus, I thought that was Bobby's boyfriend. Why the hell does every female character over at Marvel have to look like a teenage boy?
Because woman and girls are boys now. Adult women dont exist only girls and grannies.
I was going to say this exact thing. Honestly thought it was a boyfriend.
Naw, that's just his boyfriend, you're seeing things.
Because real women and real men terrify SJWs. Along with real PoC when we refuse to be their purse puppies. And apparently real gay people too.
Welp.....Ive expected this ever since them Awful Captain Marvel Comics came out(Ive been Hateing Captain Marvel). Looks like Captain Marvel is spreading her Man looks disease around to all these Marvel females
"John Goodman and his husband are shocked by the gay in 2017"
"Don't talk to me or my wife, son. Ever again."
The husband shouts "No Respect" then the wife replies "Shut the fuck up, Donnie!"
I'm just confused as to how Bobbies parents some how were able to love their son as a mutant but are shocked by him being Gay. I mean political pandering aside - You'd think after being revealed to be a Mutant where people fear and misunderstand you that being Gay would just be.. Well something a family that strong could overcome easily. Their should have been no tie ups.
Thank you! I myself am not a homosexual. However I have a fair few friends that are. They are just people - being a mutant is so much more of a difference than a sexual preference. One of those has the potential to harm yourself and others you care about if you can't control it or be used for evil to threaten government institutions. The other one is a Man being sexually attracted to other Men or vice versa for a Women.
SJW marvel is so out of touch with so much of their narrative it comes off as immoral and insensitive to the people who are what they are trying to represent. Once again just another example of poor story telling. You know what would have been progressive is if Bobby knew in his heart he was gay and wasn't sure how to deal with it and by coming out to his parents they show him love and support. Bobby isn't exactly "Dude for Dude" just yet but coming to terms with and being supported by his family. (Even tho the Jean Grey thing makes it complete bullshit)
Or better yet make a new homosexual mutant character who at the same time of coming out is also just now developing their mutant gene. (Sounds like a page turner doesn't it?)
NotTheWheel well one means you have god-like superpowers and the other one involves sleeping with the same sex and getting involved in all the other things associated with gay culture.
Well I don't think you gotta dress up like the Village People anymore to be Gay. Least of all I don't believe you have to adopt absolutely everything that is considered Gay Culture perse. I'd say an over indulgence to that level is a bit to steep for a person just figuring out how they feel about it. I'm not sure I'd have to ask one of my Gay friends about it. It's a decent point regardless. You sure got a lot of homework to take on for being Gay then. I just figured it could be as simple as liking the same sex. Shows how much I know lmao XD
You could argue there was nuance - like how liberals accept homophobic Islam but not homophobic Christianity, or how most christians are for interracial marriage but not gay marriage - you could argue they had something like that, but the books fail to bring them up, so with what we know it is ridiculous.
If you're looking for logic, you're in the wrong place
What killed the dinosaurs? The Ice Age!!!
What killed marvel? Cold sales
There is now such thing as a gay Iceman.Because he lost all his cool he will now be known as LUKEWARMMAN.
"Ice Gay
The Ice Gayge!
Fluoride in the water turned the dinosaurs gay.
The real Iceman was mind-displaced by Jean Grey and is stuck in weird limbo dimensions. Now he has to fight his way across different forms of reality whilst trying to hold on to his real self.
TheSouloftheDragon that would be a great story
it'll never happen...this is the iceman we get forever...once they turn a character gay he can't be turned back without too much backlash....this is it.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! THIS CANT BE HIS FINAL STAGE!!!!! It just CANT!!!😭. They ruined my favorite X-man(Besides Quicksilver and Havok)
MARVELFan 101 havok?havok? Is one over your favorite X-Men are you serious?
Franklin Lyons , whats wrong with him?
So Iceman is now Lukewarmman.
Gehrt Dichgarnixan 👍
If Iceman hits someone is it called a
Fruit punch
After you've found out that your son is a mutant, how does him coming out as gay elicit more than a shrug?
It's the Marvel Universe, and people get up in arms over random things.
Captain Marvel once mentioned "I'm half kree and have super star powers but being a mutant is the big Scare? "
The X-Men have always been a series about intolerance and discrimination that includes all minority groups.
Bobby parent are clearly the "We love you son, but we wish you were NORMAL, can you just be normal and not like THEM"
WE as readers know they're heroes but the great Universe sees MUTANT ≈ MONSTER
So then the Juggernaut walks up and is like"Im the juggernaut, bitch!"
As a gay man who has loved Iceman since childhood I find this ridiculous and somewhat offensive. I'm thinking about burning a copy...
I just don't even know why he's doing the coming out thing when he's yet to have any gay action. Shouldn't he try some sausage before coming out to his parents in his 30's.
wayne de olival_yea man that's my biggest question...the timeline was one conversation with the younger version of himself where he's like "well if you're gay then i must be gay because of course i am" then we get to here...he's never dated a guy or kissed a guy...the closest things that's happened to him that could be considered gay are one dance with daken and the fact his costume is a romper. that's it...like...what if he goes all in and finds out he reeeeeeaaally doesn't like anything up his butt....does he just mulligan this whole series? does he call up mom and dad and say "hey i'm just gonna take back all that gay talk...turns out dick up the butt hurts so....vagina all the way"
Or maybe he'll realize that he feels similarly dissatisfied by gay sex as straight sex and he realizes that his problem isn't that he's gay or straight or asexual or whatever just that he's chronically depressed from all the life and death, saving the world bullshit he engages in on the regular.
Whether he likes dick or not is the least of Iceman's problems, he's a 30 something year old dude that hangs around with child soldiers fighting for human rights.
Also wasn't it floated that the younger versions may be from a different reality entirely ? Hence why their continued presence hasn't destroyed their existence. Or was that dropped ? I can't even be bothered trying to keep track of Marvel nonsense.
wayne de olival yep the young x-men are not THE young x-men from our timeline
This is literally a Family Guy joke that didn't stop.
Just Some Guy with a Mustache damn it family guy, see what you've done?
as a gay guy, i'm insulted but i can't fucking stop laughing. This is the most ridiculous bullshit i've ever heard. what happend to good gay characters like wiccan during childrens crusade
see there are millions of gay characters out there and they are a lot better then him
@ind0ctr1n3 - "To me personally, I don't like gay people that act like extremely feminent men. Not because of their sexual orientation, just the way they are bugs the fuck out of me." Well, not liking a whole group of people because of their mannerisms is pretty bigoted, man.
Also, it's effeminate. Not 'feminent.'
Gotta love how instead of making "new and diverse characters" they maul beloved characters until they are unrecognizable.
I bet this is the reaction the gay writer for the comic WISHED he got. There's this sketch on College Humor where a character comes out and everyone is so accepting that he's disappointed. I feel that this guy is going through the same thing.
weird in X-factor Bobby has kids and was engaged?
I wonder whats happen to them
Paul Calvin they killed our bobby man...
Paul Calvin Marvel killed them.
This book makes me cringe so hard I'm straight again
I cringed so hard I hurt myself.
As a straight girl, I cringed so hard my spine has started curving.
So basjcally, what youre telling me is that a guy just self inserted himself into a character more than twice his age in legacy and history, made all characters shitty horrible people and brought in Jugger as some weird manchild.
Yeah, you can't expect this to sell to normal people.
As an openly gay 35yo fan of comics this trend to make heroes LGBT and not have realistic stories is so painful, they need to just make new LGBT characters
Wow! When you said "Kitty" I didn't realize that the person with Bobby WAS KITTY! I literally thought it was some guy that came along for support with a bowl cut! Also Bobby sort of hangs a lantern on how crazy this situation is "You've seen me risk my life time and time again." would've been interesting if Bobby's dad was like "wait...what? We thought we sent you to a school for gifted people so you could learn to live some kind of approximation of a normal life, not be a paramilitary children's militia for mutant rights!"
Making Iceman gay seems so unnecessary. For decades he was established as a ladies type guy or at least aspired to be one. Why not just make a new character to address this particular topic? It just seems creatively dishonest to basically retcon an already well established character.
Cough Syrup The Loyal There's already a good number of established gay X-characters, though. These people don't even care to learn who they are. They just want a well known character to be their mouthpiece. (And that mandate is sad if true, but I don't doubt it.)
Xmen has had several characters that were gay. Their sexualities flipped and flopped throughout the different universes. One time colossus and northstar dated.
Seriously this is stupid. Its trying to pander to the lgbt community but its more offensive than anything.
Depends on how you define "well established." I was married to a woman when I came out of the closet.
@@mikeclifford8360 well he had only showed sexual attraction to women and since we are in a position where we can read his thoughts and feelings, it never showed any inclination that he might have other sexuality, not even a hint I think, so to me doesn't make sense this change
A good comparative would be Dc Character Jericho, that had shown hints that he wasn't heterosexual, bit due to the age of publication (back in the 80s) they couldn't really make him come out
It sucks that Bobby is written flamboyantly gay. Like, his character, up until the point it was changed, was straight. Even if we were all fine with him magically changing sexuality (which I'm not, it's pathetic pandering, make new characters to ruin) why would he magically change his level of masculinity. You'd think, for the sake of continuity (to some degree) they'd want to maintain that level of masculinity. His personality should not have changed. I'm ignorant and sheltered, but are all gay men ridiculously flamboyant? (Apart from Dave Rubin, who is the most normal seeming gay man on the internet) Because that's what these comics are telling me.
Northstar is an actual character who just happens to be gay, so of course he can't get any focus.
A more realistic coming out story would have been him coming home in that awful shorty shorts costume and his mom jokingly asking if he was gay, then him just being silent until it sinks in. Then his mom in a sympathetic way saying "oh honey, just because you are doesn't mean you have to dress like that, lets go get you some pants." And his dad in the background mumbling about how he kind of figured since his ex looked like a man, but was hoping he'd at least knock her up so they would have grandchildren.
Casca52 that is actually pretty good! Hahahaha
What???? This is realistic to you????
I remember hearing that apparently Northstar used to be attracted to Iceman and Iceman refused because he's straight. Also Northstar is married so no North Pole for this book unless Northstar and his husband(who's name I can't remember) are polyamorous. Also I'll say that to me, Iceman being gay is nonsensical. He's dated numerous women and has turned down men. I doubt he was scared of the other Xmen because they're literally some of the most accepting people ever. And they said that the past Xmen are from an alternate universe so if that's the case then Iceman shouldn't even be gay because that's not him from the past technically.
that's right!! i remember that...northstar made a pass at iceman and iceman freaked out and was offended as all hell about it...holy shit....well this is awkward....
JuggyBohab fuck this bullshit man, when they FORCED bobby gay they killed him on that day imo.
@@JuggyBohab - Most men who repress their sexuality to a big enough extent react by freaking out and being overly offended. Just ask the Republican/Christian Right who rail over and over again about the "scourge" of homosexuality then are busted for soliciting sex from men in the public mensroom.
I was married to a woman and turned down men. And I knew my family was very accepting of all kinds of people. But, I actually met a men and fell in love with him. All of a sudden, I had a choice to make. Continue living a lie ONLY FOR THE COMFORT OF OTHER PEOPLE or be honest with them and myself and live an authentic life. I chose the latter.
See, the first person a gay man has to come out to is himself. If he can't accept himself as gay, he'll do anything in his power to dissuade others from finding out about it.
Idk where the real Iceman is. Maybe Bobby's dad was right. Maybe the actual Bobby is really dead. Which is really sad, because I miss that Bobby
MrPonytron same man
Instead of ripping you should've put it in some ice water. Y'know because of Iceman.
Frozen, then shattered.
This writer (and the editor) don´t even know these characters. Maddie Drake was a caring open minded mom, the dad thougt Bobby should hide his mutant powers and was agains him dating a japaneese woman, but later he get beat up for calling Graydon Creed a Racist on TV, and that was in he 90's. They only watched X2 for sure.
lacrarte zorok sad
lacrarte zorok Yep. All they care about is the propaganda soapbox.
"We didn't realize our son was this big of an idiot". What Disney says about Marvel now... whew. Iceman.
This is right up Disneys street.
They would never say that. This is what they want.
If they could they'd shove it int he star wars films and the new Han Solo film would have him suddenly being gay
So The Juggernaut, who can effortlessly shrug out of a 40ft cocoon of steel, is beaten by a bit of ice and a few frosty the snowmen?
and was ripped asunder by a normal man.
The funny thing is Jean told young Bobby that he was gay so current Bobby who already had years to build up his identity suddenly decides he's gay too. Not that being gay is bad, but pulling a 180 on an established character's personality of course people are going to be upset about it.
It is bad, which is why they constantly feel they have to justify themselves.
No one "suddenly decides" that they are gay. It may be the first time YOU know about it. But, believe me, gay people know they are "different" from a very young age.
Nobody at work believes this stuff is actually going on in Marvel. My mom won't even let me talk about it any more it makes her so upset. "Are you serious?!" The one thing I hear from EVERY person I talk to about this. It's ridiculous. AvX for me is where comics end for Marvel.
Weston Wickman Buy a comic then show it to them no wait use Kisscomics then show it to them
one more day did it for me...i haven't felt that anything went right for marvel at that point. it was just mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake....well wait the whole dark reign thing was pretty cool...so after that but i think one more day was the start.
Weston Wickman I didn't even make it through AvX. It's that issue after Bendis took over the X-Men with the original 5 time travel kids. After Quesada had Peter Parker sell his marriage to the devil, that was it. That was the last issue of any comic I've read. I have a whole box of books I picked up from the shop the same day that came out, that I've never touched.
Holy shit that's Kitty! I didn't know until you commented on her/him saying "annnd I'm out", up until that point I thought it was the younger version of Bobby who's already a used and abused teenaged twink also talking to who presumably would also be his parents, just aged more. Holy shit, when is she going to come out to her parents as a trans man? You nailed it D&C!
Iceman sums up everything that is wrong with marvel comics. It needs to be cancelled as soon as possible.
They weren't even creative, this "coming out" scene is ripped straight from the X-Men 2 movie when they his parents found out Bobby was a mutant.
Space Woof even then it was a disrespect to his original parents who actual loved their son enough and didn’t shame him or abandoned him for being a mutant and sent him to Xavier’s school to have a normal life.
What’s horrible about this is that coming out thing was supposed to represent gays coming out to their parents or relatives.
The mutants are supposed to represent LGBT people but we can do subtle things like this nowadays.
Of course they're having that kind of "wait, WHAT?!" reaction. For 50 years, Bobby Drake has been straight. Now he's suddenly gay because the SJW crowd wanted to turn him gay, apparently just for the hell of it. So yeah, they're having a completely baffled reaction because there son has never been gay before. He's had numerous girlfriends, he's crushed on girls, etc. This whole "lolz yeah he's totes gay now!" thing is basically just a giant middle finger to the Marvel fans of Bobby Drake. Proving once again that the writers of these horrible "comics" don't have the first clue about the characters or how to write a decent story.
The 5 dislikes are the people that worked on this comic.
Did SJW Marvel forget we already have a gay mutant anyway to fit their "quota". He's called Northstar and he was actually a well written character but
1. I don't know if he's still around
2. He probably will be ruined or is ruined now and I just don't know
Sad times at Marvel.
Marvel needs those pats on the back tho
"They look like testicles. I don't mean to be blue...."
- Diversity and Comics 2017
Why does Iceman look exactly like Gordon Ramsay in your thumbnail
With how much Marvel has told us how Iceman is gay I actually didn't even think his parents might not know. Like of course he's gay.
Watching you rip that cover of the Juggernaut- awww- my innerchild
The Adventures of Icegay
Hey Marvel fans, wanna see the daring adventures of the Uncanny X-Men!? Want to see them battle Apocalypse in an alternate future, or Mr. Sinister in the Savage Lands, or maybe fighting Magneto and The Brotherhood ?? Yeah!? Well fuck you, here's a coming out story about Ice Man! He'll talk and talk and talk with his parents about bullshit you couldn't care less about. Excelsior!!!
LobsterPuncher 👍
LobsterPuncher the worst part is that he is gay not by choice or by understanding himself but because jean brainwashed him, if he stay gay forever, the fans will always remember that is was jean fault
edgardo caballero they killed our iceman that day man...shame.
@@r.c.8268 - Not even close to what happened. And gay people are not gay by choice. Just as straight people aren't straight by choice.
I heard in the next one Mike Pence finds out what Jean did to Iceman and brokers a deal with Wakanda to have Storm zap him with lightning to make him straight again.
What's with the "Star Wars" references in the titles lately? Yeah I'm a fan so I picked up on it.
The Sentinel same
What are you, gay?
Jack Blackthorn FREEZIE POP!
I like it.
@Patriot Cat, I think you've misunderstood. It's D&C who's been making Star Wars references in his titles, not SJW Marvel.
"Because you're actually dead."
I'm dead 😂
I can't believe these are actual characters and this is an official comic? Sounds like a fanfiction.
I guess you could say the fans are giving this new series a....cold shoulder.
YA GONNA *POUND* THE VILLAINS, ICE MAN?! Haha hahahaha A_A
[Tears stream down my face as I watch Marvel slowly kill itself and all it's beautiful characters.]
Bobby Drake's mom looks like Bobby Drake's dad wearing a wig....
COUGH SQUAD ASSEMBLE
Whooping Cough reporting to duty!
Seargant Bronchitis reporting for duty sir!
Your videos have more views than Marvel Comics subscription numbers
I miss these types of videos. These are moments in Comicsgate history and need to be preserved. You and EVS's Star Wars videos are the primordial soup from which Comicsgate was born, I remember well the videos in the car and Zacs hand gestures lmao and the Luna the dog videos, such amazing times❣
Wow man, I just found out about what they, really, what they replaced Iceman with last week or so. You're right, it's not the same character at all. But did you say they have Kitty Pryde or Jean Grey 'transitioning' now? That's every bit as bad; there's zero legitimate basis for any of that. They don't care one iota about these characters or their stories. There's no integrity in any of this. It's just another propaganda opportunity to them. I haven't read them in six or seven years, and it still upsets me. Just more reinforcement that I left comics at the right time, I guess.
I really miss *good* X-Verse comics. I used to buy the whole line, got nearly every issue for a good 25 year span, plus back issues and reprints. I loved these characters; they were one of the few things that would come with, every time I moved to a new city. I remember ordering about ten years of books, across all titles, in chronological story order when I was a teenager. It was all one grand opera to me from childhood through my college years, my working years. Probably why I've been watching videos about Marvel stuff lately. Just honestly breaks my heart, just that much, even though I'm out of the market now. They're not in it for the right reasons. They apparently just don't care, beyond how they can use the megaphone dropped in their laps to advance their own personal goals. There's nothing noble about destroying something with real value just to throw mud around your own sandbox. It's a prison of the mind, like they can't see beyond their own skin, their own prism. I feel basically like it all died not long after I left off, and there's just nothing much to go back to, even if they weren't pricing people out. Makes me that much more appreciative of the fims, as long as they don't go down the same road, and glad that the X-Men film franchise is not under Disney/Marvel's control, as much as I see people around the internet keep demanding it.
THAT was Kitty? I thought it was the little boy Bobby was supposed to be bangin.
the problem here is writers think we gay people are only that... *GAYS* like there's nothing else that define us... they should know by now that having Bobby gay doesn't have to affect him AT ALL... he may be happier, yeah, but because he might feel free...nothing else...
^exactly!!
I'm so excited for this roast.
This Juggernaut is boss. It was in X-men Blue #1 or #2 so it's not original to this. Not sure where it came from though.
I also really don't like the Jean Grey thing personally. I get that it's a joke but that belittles what really happened. It was writers with agendas that want to virtue signal.
well yea it was the writers but they used jean grey to do it. there was literally no build up then one day jean was like "bobby you're gay" and that was it. it wasn't even hinted at before then.
JuggyBohab Even while entertaining the meta-theory of Jean and Bobby, there is no proof of it. Comic books can be subtexual but for important events like a character death or becoming gay suddenly, if it isn't explicitly shown it didn't happen. This leaves one conclusion to which creating a meta-theory becomes moot: the writer did it because, "Why not?".
1) i will never watch another video about "gayice" make sure title them appropriately so there is no confusion
2) the real iceman is in the past , in all the comics i read as a kid.
Maybe they're going to make Northstar straight? And a woman? Oh wait...that's Aurora.
If you were to make a Super Hero/Villain character themed around being an SJW, what powers would they have?
Watching these backwards so he gets less insane with each video.
What's up with all these super powers that have to do with shit coming out of people's mouths?
My girlfriend's father is in his sixties, and has just had two knees replaced, and he's in better shape than Bobby's parents. You'd think the artist could have put a bit more effort into them.
tbh I thought that kitty was the teenage bobby
Poor Bobby, what have they done to you?
Troy Vader They mind fucked him man.
So, I don´t get it. Jean Grey gets to fundamentally alter people and everyone is ok with that? I can´t imagine its not something that would be caught by higher ups in one of the many groups that run around Marvel Earth.
They took a metaphor way too seriously and now it's pointless.
Next issue, soak the comic book in water, put it in the freezer, and then smash it. Might not be effective, but it would look cool.
I was all too willing to make the brainwashing little head cannon, but if Bobby hasn't even slept with a guy yet and has continuously slept with multiple women in the past, that's the only conclusion available cannon wise.
Someone help poor Iceman.
Marvel it's time to stop.
So his parents can accept that Bobby is a Omega Level mutant that can turn his body and surroundings into ice but can't stand that he likes to date dudes?
NOHERO 1 Considering the fact that their son was legitimately heterosexual until Jean Grey decided to mindrape him into being gay, it's not too much of a stretch to believe that they'd be shocked by that revelation.
It's just so crazy how no one finds this suspicious. He hasn't even been with another dude or lusted for a guy before or has been a situation that idk felt right to him he just one day woke up and was like guys I'm gay in 2017 but let's act like it's 1992 and act like I'm being brave or a victim of my situation
NOHERO 1 Since this train looks to keep on rolling, can we at least see him date a real man? A Ross Kemp, Chuck Norris type. A manly man who is not effeminate, who just needs 5 minutes, bish bash, job done and puts on the football with a can of bear, doesn't need to be held... No of course not. I forgot, this is Marvel and men are actually women in this universe.
Kids on Tumblr pretty much do that every day. "It's cool now, so I'm gay. And queer. And trans. You bigot"
NOHERO 1 to be honest, from the point of view of his parents, he has been a mutant since he was a teenager, he was dating a girl like a 1 or 2 months ago, and now he is gay
They missed a golden opportunity to examine the subject of Conversion Therapy from a generally unexplored angle here, possibly even comparing Jean Grey to any number of mind manipulating villains that they X-Men has faced in the past such as Master Mind.
The cables behind Juggernaut's head make him look kinda like Bane. The black and red looks good though.
Also Iceman has faced Magneto, Apocalypse and Onslaught... and he cares about what his old bigot parents think of him?
He can't beat them up.
One of the Juggernaut pictures made me think of a cross between classic Juggernaut and Bane, the way those hoses come off his back.
At least the cover art is badass.
guy at bar- I'll have a cosmopolitan please, and an umbrella.
Bobby Drake appears- you want ice with that?
chuckles.
-sure, nice ice breaker btw.
chuckles.
leaked from Ice Man movie script.
Wait Jeanne grey is transgender now? Or was that a joke about her being portrayed as manly?
6:25 Maybe that's why they are having a problem, they are in their hundreds, give 'em marvel.
wait, what? Jean Grey is trans now?
The horse part came out of nowhere ajjaajjajajaja
What a fun, action packed comic.
hahahaha you roasted Bobby's parents so bad, I can't stop lolloling .
The real Bobby Drake is cryogenicly frozen under Charles Xavier's school for gifted youngsters.
family guy literally predicts the future.
The point of Bobby Drake was an Omega level mutant who was a normal person with loving parents. He was oftentimes not used correctly as a juxtaposition between some of the more screwed up backgrounds of the xmen. His charm was that he was normal.
Another good call out. People in real life don't act like this. Keep up the great content.
What blows me away is that the 'Grey Makes Gay' theory makes for a better comic book story than what we have so far with Iceman, and it also keeps gaining traction as the story progresses.
He's coming out as gay at 30 and his parents are shocked when the story with most people coming out is that their parents knew beforehand. He himself didn't seem to know he was gay. Also he's never had a single encounter with a man well into his 30's which is also far fetched and doesn't add up. Gay people may hide it sometimes but behind closed doors they have their relationships. His dating of woman after woman over the years, and his intense romance with Kitty, and not even a flirtation with a fella? It just doesn't add up.
The way he comes out to them, "I"m gay. Dude for dude. I want to go on dates with men", was most likely meant to be written as snarky hipster speak, but read in the right monotone voice it sounds like pure brainwash scripted lines as it's so unnatural and robotic. At this point I almost expect SJW Marvel to catch wind of this theory by now and put something into the story to dispel it.
when and if we ever get a clean sweep of the company not only do we need writers who actually know what they are doing but we need writers who are actively trying to undo all the damage SJW Marvel has done they need to just put all these characters back to the way they were.
Dude, your channels growing massively- when did it hit 36 K?
The FlameCon podcast of XplainTheXmen is a pretty good look at Sina Grace's insight into Iceman. Agree or disagree, but he definitely explains (sorry, no pun) his perspective. There was another "Xplain" podcast with Grace that helps complete the picture.
Juggernaut: "I'm unstoppabbl-llaaaaaaahhhhh!"
The whole Jean Grey turning him gay thing sounds just like the attempts at "curing" gayness.
I believe the new Juggernaut was first introduced in Astonishing X-Men #18-19 where Cyttorak makes Cain Marko an even more powerful Juggernaut than ever before. I don't know who designed it though.
The Juggernaut costume is from marvel now 2.0, but I think I saw it in the Extinction X Men story ark where he tried to get revenge on cyclops for kill of Charles Xavier.
RIP Bobby Drake.
Rage. Pure rage. This book makes me so mad I could die. Think I've ranted about it enough, though. The book ripping at the end is usually just funny--this time? It was cathartic.
I feel really sorry for Bobby, his mind was warped by Jean to be gay. Everyone knows it too and is too afraid to stop it or help. Unless they succumb to the same fate, or worse.
I think the only way I can like any thing that Marvel is doing right now is to tell myself that it is an Alternate Universe story. None of it matters to the real continuity so it can be enjoyed as a separate thing... or not, but it isn't doing violence to the original just by existing at that point. I had to do the same thing with Firefly and Serenity and now I can watch Serenity without foaming at the mouth (though I don't because it's an AU so who cares. :D). Maybe the same idea will work for current Marvel stuff. It's all just a big What If...
What bugs you about Serenity ?
There are quite a few things but in general it is that the movie doesn't follow the established story of the series.
Simon is a Doctor, he isn't a commando or spy. In the series, he pays people to get River out, it isn't exciting but it helps define his character. In the movie he does it himself which in my opinion actually makes his character less distinct. Remember when he tried to pass himself off as a guy who wanted to buy mud in Jaynestown? How did that character sneak into a top secret alliance base? Why would River be confused to see him after he lets her out of the cryo box if he was the one that put her inside. For that matter, why would he even put her in the box when his face would be every bit as known as hers.
Mr. Universe came out of nowhere and felt very much to me like a plot device that was scratching at the door of Deus ex machina.
The explanation for the Reavers didn't jive well with what we had seen of them in my opinion. Why were they able to operate without core containment? Was it killing them and they just didn't care or was it not killing them for some reason. If the explanation for their behavior is that the rage center of their brain is running at full all the time, why would they care about going into space to hunt people? How would they operate as any kind of society? How does them being really angry get us to complicated traps, weird body pinatas, psychological torture, tactical decision making or the ability to not die in space with any kind of regularity.
Plus when Joss Whedon killed Wash all I could see was every other time that he has tried to recapture the impact of the death of Jenny Calendar and it annoyed me rather than making me fear for the rest of the crew.
There are a few other little things but those are the big ones. Not faulting anyone that likes Serenity, if I separate the two in my mind it's a pretty good movie. If I watch it as a sequel I don't care for it though.