PART 3 - California Smog/BAR Referee In-Person Appointment - 1985 Toyota Corolla GT-S - AE86 w/F20C
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- Опубліковано 20 січ 2023
- This is an overview of the in-person process through the California Smog/BAR Referee program with my 1985 Toyota Corolla GT-S (AE86) with a Honda S2000 F20C swap that I had put together over 10 years ago. I go over everything that the state ref looked at during my inspection to get my car BAR'd.
Great video, very informative and well done! Congrats on being legal. That would be nerve racking and anxious for me.
Very informative and really appreciate that you taking the time to help us out!
I had a lot of help and just want to pass on what information that I gathered. It's a great feeling to have your car finally be legal.
After countless research and emails back and forth with the state referee, I finally got a response that I was cleared to move on to the in-person inspection! I am one step closer to legally driving my car back on the road. It wouldn't have been possible if you didn't list the people who helped you because I actually reached out to Andrew on Instagram and he has been a tremendous help! I just wanted to let you know that I appreciate your video and you sure made a difference in my father and son build so thank you again!
Going to be attempting an LS1 T56 swap in a 93 Toyota pickup 2WD. I am bookmarking all of your videos are reference guides. Crucial information! Located near the bay! I may be stopping by for more information and or questions.
It's a fun process. Before you start, just make sure that the model year engine/ECU are from the same model year or newer, and engine classification of the donor car has the same gross vehicle weight classification (you'll have to do a little more digging as where your truck falls vs. the donor engine/ECU) going into your 1993 Toyota pickup (e.g. light-duty truck to light-duty truck... you can't use a heavy-duty truck engine in a light-duty truck). It's a fun process, but do the homework first to see that those are allowed. You can download the BAR's Smog Check Reference Guide and pay special attention to Appendix D which is the engine change section.
@@agraygoatthank you for such a quick response. I will definitely be referencing that guide religiously over the next few months/year lol. I intend to get a donor vehicle so I have access to all smog equipment and wiring /harnesses etc. instead of piecing it together. One of my concerns was regarding the gas tank, and having to swap it over but I have seen some information regarding OBD1 to OBD2 swaps and being able to retain stock fueling system components obviously with additional systems like evap canister etc.
Actually the one that I’ve read the most conflicting information about is what transmissions are allowed. I’ve read that if the donor vehicle comes with an auto it must stay auto in the swap vehicle, something about the PCM’s throwing a code because it’s wanting a signal from the auto that a manual won’t give, “oh just tune that fault code out” no that won’t work either I thought especially based on your videos regarding PCM’s being completely stock and not modified at all. Others say that’s not an emissions related code you’re ok, buy an auto and swap a manual trans later, but before you take it to the ref. Since the BAR sticker does state what type of trans is in there at the time of testing. Any insight? This relates to “just buy the cheaper” 4.8/5.3 Iron LS that only came with autos (4L60E’s or 80e’s) and the trash NV4500 truck manuals VS the more expensive LS1/T56 combos. That’s going to determine what I buy as a donor.
@@Burnin209 - A car going from non-OBD2 to OBD2 can retain its stock fuel tank. However, any required emissions components attached to the fuel tank need to added on/modified to fit the existing tank. This was a 1985 Toyota Corolla GT-S which was pre-OBD... I am using a Corolla fuel tank, but it had to be modified to fit all of the S2000 components onto the fuel tank (there was brazing involved). Because of the bulky emissions components, I ended up cutting part of the trunk floor out to fit the tank in its stock location. If the car is going from OBD2 to OBD2, I believe you need to use the donor fuel tank though. The PCMs cannot be modified from what I was able to gather... If that particular engine came with a manual transmission at that time, use the ECU meant for a manual. They took my PCM# and verified that it was indeed for the make/model/year of my engine. They verified that my block was for this PCMs as well. The manual PCMs are going to have a different part# from the automatics. In regards to the PCMs, they made me take mine to the Honda dealership to have it verified to make sure that it was the most updated version and unmodified. I had a lot of trouble finding a Honda dealership to look at a "Toyota" to plug into the PCM. I had to call in a few favors to get the car in. Keep me up-to-date with your build and swap. It sounds exciting.
A fun process haha, are you for real dude? You sound like you're an employee for CARB @@agraygoat
@@dmv494- Haha. I might as well be. I learned enough of the process and met enough people to be able to at least apply.
Screw ca smog! I should be able to do whatever I want to my car!
Getting a swap legal in CA is a project in itself. Oh you swapped a cool engine into your car? Now do it while making it California compliant... I totally feel you.
Ref was running the OIS test that model year 2000+ vehicles are subject to during registration renewal.
Good to know... Does that mean I have to do OIS AND rollers every time going forward?....
@@agraygoat nah, you will test as usual based on year of vehicle, so you still get dyno/sniffer every two years. There won’t be another obd2 functional check either. Check engine light still has to function properly though.
@@sfbmx88 - The Old dyno tester computers do an OBDII check but it's not as extensive as the Newer OIS test. In fact i bet you could get away with a tune with them using the older Dyno smog computer to test. I think only the OIS SMOG computers check for the tunes. Might be a nice little loophole there
Hell yeah!!
Thanks Mike. It's a relief. We need to meet up one of these days...
OBD2 port on a 1985 car! In my case 2 refs took 2 full hours to validate my swap. It is very rewarding when you play by the rules. Hope that rear end is doing well with the F20C. Synthetic oil might help.
I totally agree. There's something nice about being legal. Rearend seems to be ok for now. We'll see though. My car doesn't really go to the track anymore, so the wear shouldn't be as bad.
What car did you swap? I love seeing other peoples' swaps.
You must be in south bay. I am in Los Angeles. The car is an 80 Volvo station wagon. Good choice on the F20C. Some people here use the SR20DET but I dont understand how they can make that engine legal because it is a JDM.
@@Juancheros - I'm actually on the Peninsula closer to San Francisco. Wagons are super-cool. What did you put in it? So, here's a little bit of interesting information... I saw that a JDM 1996 ITR with an OBD1 port was passed by BAR recently. The ITR wasn't offered here until after that here. I'm wondering if they allowed that because the engine came here eventually but that it was just early enough to still allow OBD1?
I am familiar with a JDM 1996 ITR swap done by 2Kgs in the bay area. What he did was nothing new. Years ago I did a similar JDM swap into a Subaru. I used the JDM engine as a replacement block and did not even have to go to a referee. Everything else under the hood remained USDM and it worked normally at the smog station. In this manner, the engine swap was classified under BAR rules as an engine replacement rather than an engine change. In my Volvo, the engine swap was towards a V8 hence it was classified under BAR rules as an engine change therefore a visit to the Referee. BAR rules are very clear about no JDM’s. This is why I can not see how an SR20DET is allowed in CA because nothing like it was sold in USDM. It would have otherwise been a good engine for a lot of CA swaps. Whatever you folks out there do, keep it legal and you will enjoy it more in the long run.
Congratulations!!!
Thanks, Wes. It's seriously been a long time coming.
Did the referee make you install the bcm or anything to satisfy the security system for some of the computers
@@justinvaughn801- It depends on the ECU. Technically anything that's not emissions-related can go, but with Hondas you have an immobilizer that will kick the CEL on if it's forcibly removed. I had the original key for the ECU so I was able to easily incorporate that into the wiring. I removed everything else that didn't kick on the CEL though (power windows, mirrors, convertible top, etc.). Keep the OBD port functional and plug in the reader to see what codes are popping up. What swap are you doing?
@agraygoat I'm in final stages of a smog legal ls swap. 89 silverado with 2004 6.0 4l80 and he said since the immobilizer has wiring to the gm style immobilizer that I have to integrate it vs just turning that off I the ecm tune.
@@justinvaughn801- Nice. They have a reg about truck engines going into truck engines and not cars. I can't remember what the exact language was off the top of my head. Is your swap from a Trailblazer? Have you already been talking with the BAR?
Very informative I’m thinking on a k series swap in my ek sedan
That should be a pretty easy one. The EKs were OB2, weren't they? You might want to double-check on this one, but you might need to use the fuel tank from whichever k-series that you're taking your swap from.
good video
Thanks. I hope it helps you in whatever projects you get yourself into.
Good video. Im almost ready to take my Suzuki Samurai to the ref after I do the proper break in. I have been sitting on the engine swap for the pass ten years. It was a Craigslist purchase back in the days. My concern is the proof of purchase.
Also does the gas cap have to match the the newer engine swap or the stock original one?
You do not need to show proof of purchase, although I did have the paperwork. They really just verified that my engine block was for the engine that I was trying to swap in. I can't remember the specifics with the fuel tank, but if it's an OBD2 car to a pre-OBD2 car, you don't need to swap the tank over. The gas cap should match the tank. Good luck on the process. The ref will tell you if something fails and you can correct it and make another appointment. I lined everything up that I could (as described in the videos) and passed on the first try. If you stay on it, you'll get it. Let me know how it goes.
Informative video! If I buy my parts piecemeal instead of buying a donar car, do I use the ecu as the car I'm testing against? Does the engine vin still have to match the ecu?
Correct. You want to have the ECU that you will be testing for. For example, I used a 2002 Honda S2000 ECU (I pieced mine together as well) and tested as such with the BAR. You just need to make sure that all of the emissions-related components from a 2002 Honda S2000 are present on the swap. The engine VIN# didn't have to match the ECU for my swap, but they did verify to see that I was using the appropriate F20C block for my swap. Each ref might be different in this regards. The most difficult thing for me was finding a dealership that would even look at my car to verify that the ECU wasn't modified. Some ECUs you can program (they'll verify at the dealership that it's not flashed and if it is, they can have it flashed with the most recent updates) and some you can't (ROM - read-only memory). Mine was ROM and I just made sure that the dealership paperwork stated that the ECU could not be flashed with updates as it was ROM. Otherwise, you'll want them to update the ECU and write in the paperwork that it has the most recent updates. What swap are you working on?
@@agraygoat I'm working on a 2gr-fe swap into my 86 MR2. Most difficult thing is trying to get it set up w/ a manual transmission. Turns out one specific year Toyota sienna came with an external transmission control which can be used with a manual. I was hoping that I could piece together the build instead of having to find one specific donor car. You video is one of two I've seen where the owners were bar-ing a former track only car, so it didn't make sense to me that the REFs would match VIN's with ECU.
This make it a lot easier since I wanted to just find an engine to rebuild and build my own harness, and I could pick up emissions stuff and ecu separately.
What about receipts for parts? Did they ask to see that stuff?
Toyonda toyonda
It's actually a Honyota.
Did they give you the bar and emissions paperwork there? Or they mailed them to you?
The dealership gave me the invoice and paperwork that I needed right then and there to show to the BAR (once your appointment has been made). When you go in for the BAR, they'll look over your car, smog it, and take care of everything right there. They'll put the BAR label on your car right there.
Did thwy verify the vin on the engine? And did they ask for proof of purchase?
I heard that they did and I had all of the paperwork printed and lined up, but they didn't ask for it. They did look to see that it was the right engine that I was BAR'ing for though. What are you looking to swap?
This exactly what I would like to know as well
dog i swapped a 3.4L V6 into my 2.8L V6 fiero and i put a 2.8L cat and did nothing else and it passed all be it dose look factory but still is a bigger engine with more power so idk lol
Nice.
U got any clue lok plus it was running like trash and it back fired hella @@agraygoat
@SirNerfDude1986 - Backfiring could be a number of things, but I would just be guessing without seeing the car in person. The popping is unburned fuel igniting in your exhaust if that is what's actually happening. I'm not sure if the 2.8L cat is going to be smaller or more restrictive than a 3.4L one either.
Where is the referee at in california
They're all over California. Where are you located?
whatabout in riverside county@@agraygoat
Seems like alot of work
It definitely is a lot of work, but there's something nice about not having to worry about getting pulled over for out-of-state plates or refereed knowing that you won't pass.