You said what I came to say. Knives are no longer tools, they fashion statements. It’s a competition of which makers can come up with the latest super steel, which most average user can’t tell the difference between a good solid steel, yet those good steels are declared obsolete for marketing purposes! The result is knives are out reach of the masses combined with a slumping economy and there you go!
@@palerider7171 I could not agree with you more. It is interesting how so many things in our lives have become fashion statements (I call it grown up Barbie Doll time). I have been a huge fan on D2 since the 1990s when Bob Dozier was making some amazing fixed blades. The best thing that ever happened for me was when overseas companies starting bringing in D2 for the budget knives they were making for themselves and for others brands.
So true. I appreciate a beautiful knife but most people buy stuff to post on their instagram and UA-cam channels. I think the companies are figuring that out and making 💰
No doubt, priorities first "the way out is forward" laughable, sounds like at democrat talking points, build back better. How old is this dude, " never seen anything like this before" what did you expect when you have a demented old fool ruining the country
I personally think that the industry pivoting to expensive pocket jewelry and away from knives meant to be used for things has been a huge contributor.
Good point! I get the impression knife design has become so specialised, the designers don't have any time to use knives. They're on the computer all day.
Yes. Too expensive for USA knives, too many that look the same and too many designs trying to be different so they end up looking like gas-station or carnival knives.
When I first started buying knives, the average price of a Benchmade was about £100. A Griptilian was about £70, a Freek or an Osborne about £120 or £130. A Manix was £70, a Paramilitary in G10 and S35VN was a little over £100. Average Benchmade today -- well, I guess the Bugout would be the Griptilian's equivalent. About £180. Osborne is over £200. Paramilitary about the same. Prices have more than doubled. Wages are the same.
I remember when i paid my knifeworks exclusive benchmade 710 in m390 170 dollars. Now seeing newly released Benchmade 710 for 400 dollars makes laugh. We can argue but chinese knives getting better and better and they are priced just right.
@aurelianobuendia5360 prices increase as materials and price of labor increases. The unfortunate thing about Chinese knives is they can afford to keep their knives cheap because they have an endless supply of dirt cheap labor who doesn't need competitive pay, benefits, health insurance, ect. And it benefits china to hurt the American economy
@@jonathanscott5932as slump in the market can be caused by many different things, everybody being ooor because Biden and Democrats have destroyed our economy is something different
@@echosierra9990 Not my problem people scream for premium materials to feel fancy. As if 440C is a bad steel or something, or aluminium not worthy simply because there is more expensive titanium. People are always weird like that, but thank goodness not everyone is like that. I personally don't like brands that only do fancy stuff, because for one many do it only to generate more profit, and for another they don't really care about "the little man" who doesn't spend over 100 or 200 bucks just for a knife. But then again, they don't really affect me personally, other than not making a design with normally great materials just to not "devalue" their sales of the same designs with premium materials. Anyone saying 440C or even 440A is not good, or even bad, those people I don't listen to, also not on other matters, when they are like that on a simple thing like knife steel. In my opinion the knife world would be much better if designers and makers wouldn't focus so much on premium materials as it comes across. You can make the same knife designs with less expensive but still great materials. But then where would be the profit in that. Maybe we need more knife nerds to make knives, and not just those profit oriented fancy feeling expensive materials wannahavers. Okay, sorry for going off on a tangent, but you see I am also thinking about these things sometimes.
@@Leftyotism I usually go for budget tier knives, but I DO have a couple of mid range knives (between $100-$200). A couple of Benchmade knives bought 5-6 years ago, and a couple of Kansept straight up left handed knives recently, as well as a lefty button lock Pyrite from CJRB. Any more, I just scour the sale/discontinued section on websites. I basically have all the knives I’ll ever need, as I have work friendly ones, and then my regular carry ones. The one factor that separates a $50 knife vs a $150 knife is quality of knife steel and build materials.
Constructive suggestion. Please don't do the click bait. The thumbnail suggest I'm gonna watch content about the knife industry and it's just a small comment at the beginning followed by a product showing.
Ive got more knives than i could ever use. I realized its dumb and I am now selling most. The surge driven by social media is starting to die. At the end of the day a knife is a knife and the small market is over saturated
Except that Ben does some nice designs. Much nicer designs than the in-house designers at the brands that do the work for him. I think the cross-bar lock addition was huge - I'm not a fan of liner locks (despite flipping really nicely). I'm waiting for the original TriAd lock patent to expire so Ben can add some beauty to the inherent ruggedness of a generic, cloned TriAd (don't feel sorry for Cold Steel, Demko briefly mentioned some upcoming tweaks to the original TriAd design which clone makers won't be able to implement until THAT new patent expires). Still, setting aside the "fun factor" - JoeX had some nice things to say about the utility oriented Dozier Kabar - it's hard to catch a share of marketplace without some fans.
@@mdubb4855 The problem is that there is always another designer with some "nice designs". I think that was the OP's point. It is certainly how I see it as well. I think a lot of folks are waking up to the fact that very few "new" knife designs actually improve on the basic knife and even fewer of them are justified in their pricing. I think that is the reality that the knife industry is now struggling with as people are waking up.
@@mdubb4855 I like Ben as much as the next guy, but his designs are derivative, the banter doesn't even have a choil, and the proportions are way off. There are plenty of models that are cheaper and better designed than those of Ben. I still like his models, and I like that he is improving, but a knife for most of us is a once in 20 years expense, not 20 knives in a year. People in the knives industry are delusional.
Technically you could a different one every day, and end up using all your knives. Or maybe you meant something like "using them until they are beyond repair". 🤔
I believe the knife industry has lost it's way. Things are ridiculously overpriced. Yet quality has gotten worse. With the high prices what do you get. In many cases just marketing. When it comes to food gas or a knife. Guess who wins. It's a shame no American companies make budget knives anymore.
I think the knife industry is oversaturated and there's a glut of excellent designs for little money. It's a victim of its own success. Knife collecting is a niche hobby and many of us have more than we can use. For everyone else, a $30 Pyrite Light is about all they would need, full stop.
Also, I hate to be the one to say it, as far as the knife market being soft, you haven't seen anything yet. It will be interesting to see which brands/companies are left when its over and the dust settles. Hope I'm wrong but from an economic standpoint there are some HUGE shoes (plural) yet to drop
You're not wrong. This depression has been on the way for a long time. We've had two years of recession. We just hit the Sahm rule for unemployment rate to recession, which has a 100% accurate prediction rate. Look up the Sahm rule and go look at unemployment. Knives are a luxury that will go quickly by the wayside. I know the big boys will find a way to survive and the only one I'd feel bad for if they couldn't would be Spyderco. I will laugh if Benchmade falls in the coming depression. All these midtech guys are going away and only the most desirable custom guys will have a wait list for the truly ultra wealthy who won't be hurting in the coming recession. The average man who's income, overtime, and work demand is highly dependent on the overall market won't be buying even Chinese OEM knives much less integrated handles with timascus.
@@Silence-and-Violence Glad I'm not alone, and get ready with the BOJ (Bank of Japan) think Japan Fed, totally and completely backing off raising rates and now publicly saying they will NOT raise rates. The choice has been made, as it was either deflation or HYPER inflation, and Hyper inflation it is. Buckle up kids this is gonna get real, and when it happens its gonna be really quick. Like an all at once type deal and nothing will ever be the same or it will takes years for a return to anything remotely close of what we deem as "normal" now. Good luck everyone.
The knife market is definitely ready for some change. The American manufacturers (Benchmade and Spyderco in particular) have kind of been resting in their laurels the last few while dramatically increasing their prices. Many Chinese manufacturers aren't as competitive as they once were - Reate, WE, Bestech, etc. are pumping out cool collaborations with American designers...but their prices are now nearly in the same range as smaller American-made brands like Mcnees. There is some innovation going on at the edges, but it's gotten a little stale and a little pricey lately I love what Knafs is doing with user-serviceable, customizable, budget-friendly designs. Now I just need Ben to let go of the finger rule and release some knives with 3.5"+ blades! 😀
Recently retired trucker, cant tell you how many knive i have lost, throughout the years-never paid more than 40 dollars for a knive (tool). Could not imagine paying the prices they are asking today!
I gave up on buying name brand Knives about 10 years ago. The explanation is simple. We are seeing custom maker price points on production made knives. Just my opinion. when a company collaborates with a reputable maker, should we be forced to pay maker price points? The problem I’ve seen is the content creators have tried to force feed us that the price point is what is normal.
@BLdontM Not really, its a difference between a high dollar collector, which is fine, and the common middle class or lower blue collar bushcrafter, which is fine. The knife industry decided to gear their outdoor blades towards collectors but the common man will buy more knives in the long run given that they are affordable. Thats why they are failing. The 'ol tryna get rich off one knife vendor.
Yea, I mean I only started buying decently priced knives ($100-$200) recently, when honestly, the majority of my edc and knives are $40-$65, folders from Kizer, QSP, SRM, SOG, Vosteed, Civivi, etc….and when times are at a low, people have less to spend on wants and just scrap by for needs…😢
The whole pocket jewelry trend with people taking pics for their instagram has messed the industry up for us, who use our knives. I can understand a steeper price for a hand made knife, that performs it's function and looks nice, but first and foremost, knives are tools that get dropped, dirty, and beat up a bit. A $500 folder with a blade that chips if it hits a staple cutting a box, lock slippages, and tips that break off from a drop is unacceptable.
Very fun show! Most knife purchases are luxury buys, even sub-$100 ones, and there’s less extra money available for those these days. The only segment of the market that has really adapted is the budget category.
I have been collecting knives for over 30 years. I have lots and lots of knives I carry a knife every day. I stay in the 20 -50 dollar price range if I lose it I can replace it. It's said when knifes are called budget knifes when they cost les the a 100 dollars. Company's like benchmade is ridiculous with their prices. I can sharpening a knife like a razor so what if I have to sharpen my 30 dollar knife sooner then I would you 200 dollar knife I will stick with brands like civivi,sentcut,kershaw, kizer, miguron, petrified fish, qsp,cjrb. They make great products ,
Only a couple knife companies like Kizer has gotten realistic with the profit margin ratio to be ahead of the downward curve coming. Hopefully others follow because I am no longer buying stuff that’s 200% marked up because of the stamped company name.
Brands like Civivi are knocking it out of the park with quality, affordability and good designs. It’s become difficult for western makers to compete especially with the cost of living increasing so rapidly.
As a knife collector that tries very hard to responsibly budget out monthly and make sure I save and always have money for all my purchases I have noticed almost all my excess spending or investing money each month has been re-diverted to grocery, gasoline costs and the increase in all the miscellaneous expenses over time this year since last year. I know what im about to say is basing my opinion off the conspiracy of planned obsolescence but since I think It does not run rampant in the knife market unless you are appealing to the collectors market which has the capacity to remain evergreen with buyers then eventually the standard users will have enough knives and the people selling knives will hit a slump and have to wait until a new generation of users pops up. Budget knives tend to appeal to the user crowd so I imagine companies that don't offer products for users, collectors and everyone in between will hit sale deadzones when this occurs. But yeah inflation, wages stay the same and despite that people are now starting to get laid off due to corporate greed. Even as a knofe lover its hard to justify even one new purchase right now.
I think there is a much in the market for makers who make simple knives from high carbon steel with simple handles with basic wood scales I think they would take off like a rocket
There have always been, and continue to be, custom makers who aren't famous and who regularly produce HIGH quality knives for good prices. There's a group of guys who have been chasing every ounce of performance out of 52100 steel and have done amazing things with it. The famous one is Ed Fowler and his knives are very expensive but he's a cool guy who has shared his knowledge with many other guys and there's a whole network of dudes loosely connected to Ed around 52100 steel and many of them produce affordable custom knives with ELITE heat treatment. I have a 52100 custom trout and fish knife with perfect stag scales, Westinghouse micarte liners, and an insane differential heat treat on the 52100 that leaves a beautiful hamon line like a legitimate samurai sword. I got it for under $225. The leather sheath was handmade as well by the maker and his wife. There's still a bunch of guys like this in almost every hobby, you just gotta find them. Once you learn about what makes something good, you can find makers who do those things who aren't charging for their name brand yet. This is how I have acquired very nice knives, fountain pens, and even mechanical watches for very good prices. Once you get over brand hype and xenophobia and only care about the best materials implemented in the best ways, you can find makers all over the place who can do that for you without exploiting you. No one knows the guy who made my trout and fish knife, but I also promise very few dudes would be able to track down a true 64 HRC carbon steel custom fixed blade with sambar and old stock micarta because most casuals in these hobbies care more about branding and hype than real quality.
00:50 I speculate the softness of the knife industry is due to a lack of really good knife content. You guys are getting into it, so it may help. Most of those we followed, aren't doing much content as they use too. Maybe it's burnout, maybe it is life changes. The majority of us knife nerds were and still are Ben, Zac, and Taylor fans. With Zac stepping away, that is nearly 1/3 of the industry leading market salesmen to excite products. This does not discredit other knife influencers, but what he brought to the table, was backed by you- Ben and Taylor. Love em' or hate em' it was true. The zac influence, I believe helped because he has a degree that relates to PR if I remember correctly. That being said, any man who has the capacity to invite himself to a hangout and skateboard home with a whole pizza, and then bring that energy to the knife world says something. Unfortunately, it makes it readily difficult to do what Zac and Jamie had as a team. That being said, I am really REALLY excited about this content, b/c the level of knife related videos has plummeted, which I can see as a corelation to sales. Y.t. is the Hotspot for knife marketing. Thank you Knafs and especially you Ben for providing what we long for. It may not be WOW or Banter which i know you created, but your videos are still really good. I have fond memories in those few years of looking forward to be home from work, or from bible study to sit and watch WEEK ONE WEDNESDAYS. Thank you for those times. I am grateful that you are still bringing the same energy you did back then.
I remember when an ontario rat 5 was 65$ and a spyderco paramiltary 2 digicam/black blade was 140 new. Im looking to pick up a second one now, ten years later, and its 220$. Its the reason Ive been giving these companies like vosteed a chance, and they knock it out of the park for 55$. If anyone has a used pm2 lmk 😅
I paid $500 for a Benchmade a few years back. It was straight junk. Never buy another. And they want $650 for The Narrows?😆 I wouldn't buy that gimmick if it was a quarter of that.😐
In the 70s and 80s I had one or two small pocket knives that I made last for years. I've seen the knife hobby rise and fall a few times. Add to it being a luxury item in a historically bad world economy, and huge oversaturation, there is the fact that besides legality most "normal" people and all law enforcement still don't like pocket knives in the hands of the public.
Prices have gotten out of control....stupid Mall-ninja droolers, hoarders and speculators paying and asking ridiculous $$ for fashion over function junk that serves nothing but to provide an ego boost ....hey folks its just a knife..it doesnt make you taller,smarter more attactive, impart marshall skills or improve your prospects for the future. Grow up.
You guys are way too old for all the “cringe worthy” lingo. Talk like adults… unless you are aiming for the post-hip millennial market that isn’t buying expensive knives.
I believe part of the problem from sales is that nowadays companies like you guys make the best product you can achieve so it ends up been a last longing (if not eternal with proper care) product that doesn't need to be changed by obsolesce every couple of years, I know there is people that like to buy a new knife every week but its not as prevalent for the everyday joe out there in my opinion.
Market oversaturation. And a lot of stuff looks the same, or a brand has a design ethos that reflects through most of their lines. Boring. How many companies have a premium brand, a more affordable sub brand and in some instances a sub sub brand? Most of the designs are shared across their verticals. And that’s not even considering the other “edc” items that have saturated the market and are competing for dollars.
With my gear, I'm only buying new knives and flashlights with money I make on ebay selling stuff from the collection and it's slow af right now. I have a Fenix LD30R, brand new but the box got messed up during shipping so I removed it. It's a 70 dollar light I have up on ebay for 50 bucks. I also have a Fenix E28R V2 up for like 43 bucks that was carried for 3 days and has one small mark. Can't sell either of them. They're the lowest price for those lights on Ebay and I can't get them sold. This inflation is killing the market majorly
I have no use for an expensive knife that is too pretty to use. Whether I'm at work, hunting, camping, SAR, my knives get used. They must be durable, usable, and affordable.
NGL I hope B-made is feeling it HARD. I hate that the industry as a whole is feeling it, especially such a consumer forward company as Knafs. But I am comforted by the fact that some companies will be forced to reevaluate their values being offered. Everyone else is trying to balance their profit with value for the customer while B-made is doing the equivalent of spitting in our faces by trying to convince us that G10 and S30v is worth $280. Which just isn't true on this planet at this time.
i find their narrows even more offensive tbh, 500 bucks for less than decent milled ti scales, a cheap steel spring clip and m390, add 100 more if you want it with a dlc-coating😂
I actually skipped Blade this year due to the fact I just didn't see myself being able to afford it. It's not far for me (so the drive cost isn't expensive...literally a tank for the entire trip), but it's the fact everything is so expensive now. With that, and the fact work for me has slowed down quite a bit over the summer...I felt it was smarter to skip. Kinda sucks since the only time I've missed between this year and when I started going about a decade ago was COVID when Blade wasn't even happening. On another, brighter note...it's so cool the 3D printing files that y'all offer up for someone like me with a printer available. Even more reason I've always loved what y'all do...except being sold out of the five-panel hats right now...kinda sad about that one...
Ok, I stopped by knives because they are expensive. I have picked up two of your knives recently because of the quality and the price. I love supporting you because you are a small business and from your videos I feel you care about your friends and employees. Last point. I loved Benchmade and have purchased several in the past. Now, will not do it. The price for one of their knives is just ridiculous now. Especially for the materials they are using and steel. I truly enjoy my banter for my edc.
The only new knives I have been buying in the last year are Cold Steel because of the great deals at Midway and on Amazon. Everything else is so expensive. I used to absolutely love collecting Spyderco Exclusives and Sprint runs but that doesn't interest me whatsoever anymore. I still have quite a few in the collection but don't plan on adding more, prices are crazy.
Just be wary as they sold to GSM and have switched more of their production to China. Joe X and other EDC people have covered this. That is not saying knives made in China are necessarily bad as there are some excellent ones, but this may be a cheapo move on their part. If you are going to get them you may want to see if you can get pre-GSM ones. I do love my Coldsteels, and nobody makes a good pocket sword like they do! My favorite one is my Rajah II and then either my Scorpion from Off-Grid knives or my Drift in Vanax from Quiet Carry. Only issue with the last 2 is I do not have CBN or diamond stones to get the maximum benefit and edge retention from them which makes me sad as they are great knives. If I could go back, would get one of Off-Grids knives made in D2, a Civvivi, or a good Vosteed and more particularly the Nightshade. Standard carry is Rajah II for bigger cutting tasks, chopping, and self defense, Leatherman Sidekick as multi tool, and then one of my other smaller ones with a good point for doing detail work and breaking boxes down faster. I work as a handyman part time for a school and process a lot of cardboard and putting together a bunch of furniture where that setup has helped a bunch in saving time and being more efficient. Just some thoughts. Hope you have a great night! Sincerely, JS
Knife companies have totally lost their minds with their pricing. Yet I have seen people still spend the money on high end knives. As long as people are stupid enough to pay the ridicules prices the knife prices will not go down.
I stopped buying knives after buying a Microtech 6 years ago. The knife and GPU/CPU market are very similar. Charging too much for gimmicky materials and loveeee to justify it by saying "the CNC takes sooooo long" Ok buddy, I can buy a killer innovations threaded match grade pistol barrel with 120 individual cuts for under $300. That and we keep using super steels with shit heat treatments and quality control. I shouldn't have to go to some random knife designer and pay 500+ for a proper heat treat on a basic style custom knife. The knife market is off the chain, basic knives for the cost of a canik tp9 or Glock is just not...no, just no. "But they use good spacers and washers, oh you mean the shit that costs a few cents? You can be an idiot, I'm not. Titanium, G10 and Micarta are not rare expensive bougie materials, their pretty basic and common materials that don't cost all that much raw. The marketing and useful idiots do not help matters.
China makes high quality knives with great materials and steels for 1/6th the price of American made brands… (Civivi, Kizer, to name a few)…. Then here comes Benchmade with $400 fixed blades with 154CM. No one is paying $300-400 for sub par knives anymore.
I use to be a Spyderco whore but the prices, especially here in Canada, is crazy. There's no way I can keep up with a collection and still put food on the table. I still love my collection but it's been a while since I've bought one and I don't see any new ones in the near future. When a regular, plain Jane VG-10 Delica cost $129 Cnd, you know prices are a bit too much. That's just a bit under what I paid for my Navaja or my Chokwe.
The “knife community” aka consumers are destroying their own community. Keep buying artificially priced Chinese knives, and bitching about UsA made. You’ll love the “community” you end up with in 10-15 years.
FACTS: needed a new hunting knife. ( left my old one somewhere in the woods. Not going to spend 300 on a knife. Recorded my subscription to buckmasters and they sent me a fixed blade. That's what I'm using for the forceable future. Lol
I was actually surprised that a well known knife maker has his own show. I like your knives. Today knives are like TV sets,new ones every week with just a little added touch,like a pocket clip and it makes it me want to wait on buying. Also some of the steels which brings the prices higher and how many people actually need this steel for everyday. I won't buy a knife over $100 dollar from experience because they're all hype,screws start coming off and I haven't even used them and they're from a well known brand. Also I've learned that the tougher steels (154 ) are harder to sharpen if one doesn't have the right sharpening tools because a stone will take forever,and some sharpening equipment are b s. I always give a little swipe every time I use a knife. I'm happy with D2 steel. Another thing is finding the proper knife for your use and that's not always explained. I believe that you will be more successful with your show and build the right edc
I already have a huge knife collection, I’m focusing on paring it down to what I actually use. Like if 90% of the time, I cycle between my Baby Banter, my Kwaiken Air, and my Delica do I really need all these others?
I buy Chinese counterfeit knives. $40 and I have a damn nice “Microtech” Ultratech knife and I love it! I had a “real” real one and this fake one comes 99% of the real thing. $40 vs $300+ is an easy decision, the economy is down right now and people are pinching their money a lot harder these days.
The knife industry is flooding the market with new knives, looking what sells and trashing the other novelties. "New designs" are often slightly different than 4 other recent "new designs" by other brands. As a customer, you are totally overwhelmed in the meantime. Then there are brands that are struggling to justify their high prices given the quality of today's budget knives they are competing with. "Made in USA" doesn't mean anything anymore, the quality is no better than good Chinese, Taiwanese or Italian knives and often have dated steels to raise the profit margin. Since you mentioned Boker - they have the same problems. If you take a step back and look at what you need and use, plus a few cool models that you just enjoy, you don't need a new knife every month. I sold off many of my knives and now have 5 folding knives that cover everything I need or want.
Yes. They absolutely are. The only knives that have overall gotten better over the last few years are professional grade culinary knives. Gerbers quality is down. Cold steel is down, schrade, kershaw, leatherman. They've all gotten slightly worse over the last few years.
When peoples homes are growing in value they are much more likely to frivolously spend money. This is a fact that blankets all consumption including knives. Plain and simple. There I solved it for you
I’m still a fan of victorinox. They are durable, and they warranty them for life. Even the us military is starting to go to victorinox. The new one hand trekker is based on the Swiss Soldier 08.
The knives are all under 3.5", they're expensive, and generic as possible. So yes they've been failing and it's gotten way worse the last year or two since I checked out.
When people ask me about knives or express interest in knives it hard to talk about. I cant justify recommend starting point knives that are now double to triple the price from when I origonal bought them.
I haven't bought any new knives cause I already have like 20 of em. And if I did buy a knife, I wouldn't want to spend more than a hundred bucks on it.
Getting flooded with cheap Chinese knives might have something to do with western knife brands tanking. They are not playing by the rules of the free world.
Dear Mr Peterson I Really enjoy your Tool burrito design is there a chance in the future that you will do it in a plethora of other colors. Ok how about Red and Blue
Yes, it is failing, and one of the biggest reasons in my opinion is an introduction of super steel, which have put the cost of knives out of the reach of most blue-collar, hard-working men and women until we get the thought out of peoples heads that they have to have a knife that is hard as a diamondfor it to be a good knife we’re gonna have this problem
Yes,big time. Who in their right mind asks so much money for a not even so special knive. Knive makers are big time failing the normal guy or woman. I rather buy a good but much cheaper victorinox ,or even a opinel for a few bucks. They slice and dice just as good, and lets be honost, maybe better then the expensive brands. A good knive doesnt need all those magic steels,that will be old news next year. A good knive doesnt need a mild pocketclip. A good knive doesnt need all the fancy handles. A good knive has to cut for the purpose you need it. I rather get me a new victorinox and have a good meal for my family.
IM HOPING the fact that custom knife makers are ALSO people who can’t afford much can resonate with people. The one thing we can do that large company’s can’t is scale our materials down to match budgets.
reasons: money doesn't stretch nearly as far as it did, even last year, for hobby collectors, "name" knives are, as always, comically overpriced, for defense, the population is moving to firearms (a market that's booming among first-time buyers)
The knife industry is failing becouse knives are costing way too much and people can’t afford them. The cost needs to come down. Guys like the hobby of collecting knives but it’s way too expensive to buy knives. I believe if the cost of knives came down a lot it would do better
You can also use the Monty Python, "Knights that say Knafs!" or the Knights at Knafs, so you can post at anytime! I've really enjoyed watching the two episodes so far. The "Banter" (pun intended) between you two is great, and the industry news and insights is really valuable. It's great to have that inside look at what's happening across the industry! Thanks for being amazing as always.
Back in the day, a person would have one knife that did the job and you wouldn't get another unless you lost, broke or wore out your knife. After the 2000's we bought and changed knives for no practical reason, however, in today's economy that is unsustainable. We might go back and think about a knife being a tool and not a luxury item. How many hammers do you typically need in the house? Just one.
I think this is a little short-sighted. I grew up on a farm and was a carpenter. We had sledgehammers, framing hammers, tack hammers, dry wall hammers, farriers hammer, and even nail guns. I wouldn't use a farriers hammer to-do my dry wall. There are tools for every job buy what you need and vote with your wallet. Let the market sort the rest. For every fancy knive, there are 50 hard use practicals.
I'm only a suburban, white collar dude but I still need at least 2 or 3 different hammers for the odd jobs, construction, building and repairs I do around my house. You really only use one? What about when you need to drive something without marring the surface of either the nail or the surface? What about when you need to nail a tiny pin instead of driving a framing nail? I think everyone could benefit from at least both a basic, do it all hammer, and then a smaller nylon head or rubber head hammer.
Ill just tell you, its not just the outdoor industry. Its the everything industry. Everything is way expensive and just keeps getting moreso, so people aren't able to spend money on everyday things, let alone luxuries. I work at a battery factory, and we are going through company changes as well.
To me knives are luxury items unless it is a budget or work beater brand. I personally believe why brands like Condor, CRKT, Case, Moirakniv, and Buck (would put Ontario here too but it is no longer with us) have had such a long successful and storied history is because they keep their pricing and materials in the range of the working man.
The cost of knives, especially American made is ridiculous. Many of the Spyderco knives are $100+ than when they launched. Gerber and Kershaw knives have doubled, even their crappy ones. Look at Tops, I mean, really now?? Forget it.
The knife industry for the most part has been off their rockers with how much they are charging for knives. It's time they got a reality check.
You said what I came to say. Knives are no longer tools, they fashion statements. It’s a competition of which makers can come up with the latest super steel, which most average user can’t tell the difference between a good solid steel, yet those good steels are declared obsolete for marketing purposes! The result is knives are out reach of the masses combined with a slumping economy and there you go!
@@palerider7171 I could not agree with you more. It is interesting how so many things in our lives have become fashion statements (I call it grown up Barbie Doll time). I have been a huge fan on D2 since the 1990s when Bob Dozier was making some amazing fixed blades. The best thing that ever happened for me was when overseas companies starting bringing in D2 for the budget knives they were making for themselves and for others brands.
So true. I appreciate a beautiful knife but most people buy stuff to post on their instagram and UA-cam channels. I think the companies are figuring that out and making 💰
@@palerider7171they can't tell the difference because the heat treats are all soft.
@@lynnjr457big difference in performance between doizer USA d2 and China d2 due to heat treat differences.
People can't afford food on their tables. I can't afford a new knife past what I need right now.
No doubt, priorities first "the way out is forward" laughable, sounds like at democrat talking points, build back better. How old is this dude, " never seen anything like this before" what did you expect when you have a demented old fool ruining the country
enough said well put
Bidenomics baabbbyyyyyy!
lol. $5.39 for In n Out in late 2019, $9.35 now.
@@tjpighinit’s actually a result of trumps tax code but incorrectly pop off!
I personally think that the industry pivoting to expensive pocket jewelry and away from knives meant to be used for things has been a huge contributor.
Good point!
I get the impression knife design has become so specialised, the designers don't have any time to use knives. They're on the computer all day.
No users and soft heat treats at huge costs.
Couldnt agree more. The grinds are super thick and heat treatment below average at best.
@@tacticalcenter8658 and thick grinds too
Yeah and every knife channel is trying to push this crap, like that dork from neeves knives
Yes. Too expensive for USA knives, too many that look the same and too many designs trying to be different so they end up looking like gas-station or carnival knives.
Completely agreed
When I first started buying knives, the average price of a Benchmade was about £100. A Griptilian was about £70, a Freek or an Osborne about £120 or £130. A Manix was £70, a Paramilitary in G10 and S35VN was a little over £100.
Average Benchmade today -- well, I guess the Bugout would be the Griptilian's equivalent. About £180. Osborne is over £200. Paramilitary about the same. Prices have more than doubled. Wages are the same.
I remember when i paid my knifeworks exclusive benchmade 710 in m390 170 dollars. Now seeing newly released Benchmade 710 for 400 dollars makes laugh. We can argue but chinese knives getting better and better and they are priced just right.
That's what you get for wanting expensive materials, sadly.
I got a condor knife for $65 in 2015 … same knife is $100 now and it did not improve by any means.
It’s called inflation. Get used to it. It’s barely started.
@aurelianobuendia5360 prices increase as materials and price of labor increases. The unfortunate thing about Chinese knives is they can afford to keep their knives cheap because they have an endless supply of dirt cheap labor who doesn't need competitive pay, benefits, health insurance, ect. And it benefits china to hurt the American economy
Everything is to expensive. I have enough knifes so unless I see something super cool for a great price im not buying anymore.
$95 for a Spyderco Delica in VG-10 steel and FRN scales feels ridiculous.
It’s my favorite all time edc, but I have to agree .
It isn't a slump. We are just literally not able to buy stuff because everything is so expensive. It will pick back up
what you just described is a slump in the market, You okay bro?
@@jonathanscott5932as slump in the market can be caused by many different things, everybody being ooor because Biden and Democrats have destroyed our economy is something different
Love y’all are discussing this. The knife market is saturated with inflated pricing. That combo along with what you all discussed is a huge factor.
Knife collecting has become A LOT more expensive over the last few years, so most of us cut WAY back on what we buy.
@@echosierra9990 Not my problem people scream for premium materials to feel fancy. As if 440C is a bad steel or something, or aluminium not worthy simply because there is more expensive titanium. People are always weird like that, but thank goodness not everyone is like that.
I personally don't like brands that only do fancy stuff, because for one many do it only to generate more profit, and for another they don't really care about "the little man" who doesn't spend over 100 or 200 bucks just for a knife. But then again, they don't really affect me personally, other than not making a design with normally great materials just to not "devalue" their sales of the same designs with premium materials.
Anyone saying 440C or even 440A is not good, or even bad, those people I don't listen to, also not on other matters, when they are like that on a simple thing like knife steel.
In my opinion the knife world would be much better if designers and makers wouldn't focus so much on premium materials as it comes across. You can make the same knife designs with less expensive but still great materials. But then where would be the profit in that.
Maybe we need more knife nerds to make knives, and not just those profit oriented fancy feeling expensive materials wannahavers.
Okay, sorry for going off on a tangent, but you see I am also thinking about these things sometimes.
@@Leftyotism I usually go for budget tier knives, but I DO have a couple of mid range knives (between $100-$200). A couple of Benchmade knives bought 5-6 years ago, and a couple of Kansept straight up left handed knives recently, as well as a lefty button lock Pyrite from CJRB. Any more, I just scour the sale/discontinued section on websites. I basically have all the knives I’ll ever need, as I have work friendly ones, and then my regular carry ones. The one factor that separates a $50 knife vs a $150 knife is quality of knife steel and build materials.
Constructive suggestion. Please don't do the click bait. The thumbnail suggest I'm gonna watch content about the knife industry and it's just a small comment at the beginning followed by a product showing.
Ive got more knives than i could ever use. I realized its dumb and I am now selling most. The surge driven by social media is starting to die. At the end of the day a knife is a knife and the small market is over saturated
Except that Ben does some nice designs. Much nicer designs than the in-house designers at the brands that do the work for him. I think the cross-bar lock addition was huge - I'm not a fan of liner locks (despite flipping really nicely). I'm waiting for the original TriAd lock patent to expire so Ben can add some beauty to the inherent ruggedness of a generic, cloned TriAd (don't feel sorry for Cold Steel, Demko briefly mentioned some upcoming tweaks to the original TriAd design which clone makers won't be able to implement until THAT new patent expires). Still, setting aside the "fun factor" - JoeX had some nice things to say about the utility oriented Dozier Kabar - it's hard to catch a share of marketplace without some fans.
@@mdubb4855 The problem is that there is always another designer with some "nice designs". I think that was the OP's point. It is certainly how I see it as well. I think a lot of folks are waking up to the fact that very few "new" knife designs actually improve on the basic knife and even fewer of them are justified in their pricing. I think that is the reality that the knife industry is now struggling with as people are waking up.
@@mdubb4855 I like Ben as much as the next guy, but his designs are derivative, the banter doesn't even have a choil, and the proportions are way off. There are plenty of models that are cheaper and better designed than those of Ben. I still like his models, and I like that he is improving, but a knife for most of us is a once in 20 years expense, not 20 knives in a year. People in the knives industry are delusional.
Technically you could a different one every day, and end up using all your knives.
Or maybe you meant something like "using them until they are beyond repair". 🤔
@@Leftyotism definitely 😁
I believe the knife industry has lost it's way. Things are ridiculously overpriced.
Yet quality has gotten worse.
With the high prices what do you get. In many cases just marketing.
When it comes to food gas or a knife. Guess who wins.
It's a shame no American companies make budget knives anymore.
Everything is failing, we can’t afford anything much less fancy pocket knives
I think the knife industry is oversaturated and there's a glut of excellent designs for little money. It's a victim of its own success. Knife collecting is a niche hobby and many of us have more than we can use. For everyone else, a $30 Pyrite Light is about all they would need, full stop.
Also, I hate to be the one to say it, as far as the knife market being soft, you haven't seen anything yet. It will be interesting to see which brands/companies are left when its over and the dust settles. Hope I'm wrong but from an economic standpoint there are some HUGE shoes (plural) yet to drop
You're not wrong.
This depression has been on the way for a long time. We've had two years of recession.
We just hit the Sahm rule for unemployment rate to recession, which has a 100% accurate prediction rate. Look up the Sahm rule and go look at unemployment.
Knives are a luxury that will go quickly by the wayside.
I know the big boys will find a way to survive and the only one I'd feel bad for if they couldn't would be Spyderco.
I will laugh if Benchmade falls in the coming depression.
All these midtech guys are going away and only the most desirable custom guys will have a wait list for the truly ultra wealthy who won't be hurting in the coming recession.
The average man who's income, overtime, and work demand is highly dependent on the overall market won't be buying even Chinese OEM knives much less integrated handles with timascus.
@@Silence-and-Violence Glad I'm not alone, and get ready with the BOJ (Bank of Japan) think Japan Fed, totally and completely backing off raising rates and now publicly saying they will NOT raise rates. The choice has been made, as it was either deflation or HYPER inflation, and Hyper inflation it is. Buckle up kids this is gonna get real, and when it happens its gonna be really quick. Like an all at once type deal and nothing will ever be the same or it will takes years for a return to anything remotely close of what we deem as "normal" now. Good luck everyone.
The knife market is definitely ready for some change. The American manufacturers (Benchmade and Spyderco in particular) have kind of been resting in their laurels the last few while dramatically increasing their prices. Many Chinese manufacturers aren't as competitive as they once were - Reate, WE, Bestech, etc. are pumping out cool collaborations with American designers...but their prices are now nearly in the same range as smaller American-made brands like Mcnees. There is some innovation going on at the edges, but it's gotten a little stale and a little pricey lately
I love what Knafs is doing with user-serviceable, customizable, budget-friendly designs. Now I just need Ben to let go of the finger rule and release some knives with 3.5"+ blades! 😀
And other than Spyderco most of them are soft heat treats for the steels they use. Meaning low value.
Recently retired trucker, cant tell you how many knive i have lost, throughout the years-never paid more than 40 dollars for a knive (tool). Could not imagine paying the prices they are asking today!
Some of them are worth it
I gave up on buying name brand Knives about 10 years ago. The explanation is simple. We are seeing custom maker price points on production made knives. Just my opinion. when a company collaborates with a reputable maker, should we be forced to pay maker price points? The problem I’ve seen is the content creators have tried to force feed us that the price point is what is normal.
Yes. $240+ knives at REI. Yikes. Expensive knives are over priced for use as a tools. Mostly status objects IMHO.
EXACTLY
80% of designs and materials being used are all almost identical and that gets boring
These expensive knife companies are the knife version of pavement princess trucks. The same kind of people buy both for the same reasons.
Oh brother. A "soft hands" post I see
@BLdontM Not really, its a difference between a high dollar collector, which is fine, and the common middle class or lower blue collar bushcrafter, which is fine. The knife industry decided to gear their outdoor blades towards collectors but the common man will buy more knives in the long run given that they are affordable. Thats why they are failing. The 'ol tryna get rich off one knife vendor.
That ash handled mora was a good example of why the knife industry is failing. They're ridiculous.
Inflation is definitely a limiting factor, on the other hand I bought 4 used knives today ($350 ish value) for $100…so there’s deals to be had
Yea, I mean I only started buying decently priced knives ($100-$200) recently, when honestly, the majority of my edc and knives are $40-$65, folders from Kizer, QSP, SRM, SOG, Vosteed, Civivi, etc….and when times are at a low, people have less to spend on wants and just scrap by for needs…😢
The whole pocket jewelry trend with people taking pics for their instagram has messed the industry up for us, who use our knives. I can understand a steeper price for a hand made knife, that performs it's function and looks nice, but first and foremost, knives are tools that get dropped, dirty, and beat up a bit. A $500 folder with a blade that chips if it hits a staple cutting a box, lock slippages, and tips that break off from a drop is unacceptable.
Very fun show! Most knife purchases are luxury buys, even sub-$100 ones, and there’s less extra money available for those these days. The only segment of the market that has really adapted is the budget category.
Yup the Chinese knife brands. Because American budget knives use 8cr13mov which most people don’t want. It’s rough out here. lol
Thank Bidenomics and the Dementiacrats.
My absolute favorite thing about you guys is this philosophy of sharing and fostering the knife hobbyist community.
I have been collecting knives for over 30 years. I have lots and lots of knives I carry a knife every day. I stay in the 20 -50 dollar price range if I lose it I can replace it. It's said when knifes are called budget knifes when they cost les the a 100 dollars. Company's like benchmade is ridiculous with their prices. I can sharpening a knife like a razor so what if I have to sharpen my 30 dollar knife sooner then I would you 200 dollar knife I will stick with brands like civivi,sentcut,kershaw, kizer, miguron, petrified fish, qsp,cjrb. They make great products ,
Only a couple knife companies like Kizer has gotten realistic with the profit margin ratio to be ahead of the downward curve coming. Hopefully others follow because I am no longer buying stuff that’s 200% marked up because of the stamped company name.
Brands like Civivi are knocking it out of the park with quality, affordability and good designs. It’s become difficult for western makers to compete especially with the cost of living increasing so rapidly.
As a knife collector that tries very hard to responsibly budget out monthly and make sure I save and always have money for all my purchases I have noticed almost all my excess spending or investing money each month has been re-diverted to grocery, gasoline costs and the increase in all the miscellaneous expenses over time this year since last year.
I know what im about to say is basing my opinion off the conspiracy of planned obsolescence but since I think It does not run rampant in the knife market unless you are appealing to the collectors market which has the capacity to remain evergreen with buyers then eventually the standard users will have enough knives and the people selling knives will hit a slump and have to wait until a new generation of users pops up. Budget knives tend to appeal to the user crowd so I imagine companies that don't offer products for users, collectors and everyone in between will hit sale deadzones when this occurs.
But yeah inflation, wages stay the same and despite that people are now starting to get laid off due to corporate greed. Even as a knofe lover its hard to justify even one new purchase right now.
I know stuff is getting so expensive I can't afford it anymore
Civivi and sencut have been doing amazing budget knives
I think there is a much in the market for makers who make simple knives from high carbon steel with simple handles with basic wood scales I think they would take off like a rocket
I hope so
Yes please! Thank you
There have always been, and continue to be, custom makers who aren't famous and who regularly produce HIGH quality knives for good prices.
There's a group of guys who have been chasing every ounce of performance out of 52100 steel and have done amazing things with it. The famous one is Ed Fowler and his knives are very expensive but he's a cool guy who has shared his knowledge with many other guys and there's a whole network of dudes loosely connected to Ed around 52100 steel and many of them produce affordable custom knives with ELITE heat treatment.
I have a 52100 custom trout and fish knife with perfect stag scales, Westinghouse micarte liners, and an insane differential heat treat on the 52100 that leaves a beautiful hamon line like a legitimate samurai sword.
I got it for under $225.
The leather sheath was handmade as well by the maker and his wife.
There's still a bunch of guys like this in almost every hobby, you just gotta find them.
Once you learn about what makes something good, you can find makers who do those things who aren't charging for their name brand yet.
This is how I have acquired very nice knives, fountain pens, and even mechanical watches for very good prices.
Once you get over brand hype and xenophobia and only care about the best materials implemented in the best ways, you can find makers all over the place who can do that for you without exploiting you.
No one knows the guy who made my trout and fish knife, but I also promise very few dudes would be able to track down a true 64 HRC carbon steel custom fixed blade with sambar and old stock micarta because most casuals in these hobbies care more about branding and hype than real quality.
Man, it’s like I’m watching the og knife banter and I LOVE IT!
00:50 I speculate the softness of the knife industry is due to a lack of really good knife content. You guys are getting into it, so it may help.
Most of those we followed, aren't doing much content as they use too. Maybe it's burnout, maybe it is life changes.
The majority of us knife nerds were and still are Ben, Zac, and Taylor fans.
With Zac stepping away, that is nearly 1/3 of the industry leading market salesmen to excite products.
This does not discredit other knife influencers, but what he brought to the table, was backed by you- Ben and Taylor. Love em' or hate em' it was true.
The zac influence, I believe helped because he has a degree that relates to PR if I remember correctly.
That being said, any man who has the capacity to invite himself to a hangout and skateboard home with a whole pizza, and then bring that energy to the knife world says something.
Unfortunately, it makes it readily difficult to do what Zac and Jamie had as a team.
That being said, I am really REALLY excited about this content, b/c the level of knife related videos has plummeted, which I can see as a corelation to sales.
Y.t. is the Hotspot for knife marketing.
Thank you Knafs and especially you Ben for providing what we long for. It may not be WOW or Banter which i know you created, but your videos are still really good.
I have fond memories in those few years of looking forward to be home from work, or from bible study to sit and watch WEEK ONE WEDNESDAYS. Thank you for those times.
I am grateful that you are still bringing the same energy you did back then.
I remember when an ontario rat 5 was 65$ and a spyderco paramiltary 2 digicam/black blade was 140 new. Im looking to pick up a second one now, ten years later, and its 220$. Its the reason Ive been giving these companies like vosteed a chance, and they knock it out of the park for 55$. If anyone has a used pm2 lmk 😅
I paid $500 for a Benchmade a few years back.
It was straight junk.
Never buy another.
And they want $650 for The Narrows?😆
I wouldn't buy that gimmick if it was a quarter of that.😐
In the 70s and 80s I had one or two small pocket knives that I made last for years. I've seen the knife hobby rise and fall a few times. Add to it being a luxury item in a historically bad world economy, and huge oversaturation, there is the fact that besides legality most "normal" people and all law enforcement still don't like pocket knives in the hands of the public.
I stopped collecting knives probably 5 years ago now, my edc is now a Milwaukee fastback, way more useful and cheaper than a spyderco, benchmade etc.
Prices have gotten out of control....stupid Mall-ninja droolers, hoarders and speculators paying and asking ridiculous $$ for fashion over function junk that serves nothing but to provide an ego boost ....hey folks its just a knife..it doesnt make you taller,smarter more attactive, impart marshall skills or improve your prospects for the future. Grow up.
You guys are way too old for all the “cringe worthy” lingo. Talk like adults… unless you are aiming for the post-hip millennial market that isn’t buying expensive knives.
100% Agree!
I believe part of the problem from sales is that nowadays companies like you guys make the best product you can achieve so it ends up been a last longing (if not eternal with proper care) product that doesn't need to be changed by obsolesce every couple of years, I know there is people that like to buy a new knife every week but its not as prevalent for the everyday joe out there in my opinion.
Market oversaturation. And a lot of stuff looks the same, or a brand has a design ethos that reflects through most of their lines. Boring.
How many companies have a premium brand, a more affordable sub brand and in some instances a sub sub brand? Most of the designs are shared across their verticals.
And that’s not even considering the other “edc” items that have saturated the market and are competing for dollars.
With my gear, I'm only buying new knives and flashlights with money I make on ebay selling stuff from the collection and it's slow af right now. I have a Fenix LD30R, brand new but the box got messed up during shipping so I removed it. It's a 70 dollar light I have up on ebay for 50 bucks. I also have a Fenix E28R V2 up for like 43 bucks that was carried for 3 days and has one small mark. Can't sell either of them. They're the lowest price for those lights on Ebay and I can't get them sold. This inflation is killing the market majorly
I was not expecting to see my knife handle project featured in one of your videos. That popped up and I haven't quit smiling yet.
Glad we could put a smile on your face!
I have no use for an expensive knife that is too pretty to use. Whether I'm at work, hunting, camping, SAR, my knives get used. They must be durable, usable, and affordable.
NGL I hope B-made is feeling it HARD. I hate that the industry as a whole is feeling it, especially such a consumer forward company as Knafs. But I am comforted by the fact that some companies will be forced to reevaluate their values being offered.
Everyone else is trying to balance their profit with value for the customer while B-made is doing the equivalent of spitting in our faces by trying to convince us that G10 and S30v is worth $280. Which just isn't true on this planet at this time.
A 2.5 inch $307 dollar knife........bm is nuts.
i find their narrows even more offensive tbh, 500 bucks for less than decent milled ti scales, a cheap steel spring clip and m390, add 100 more if you want it with a dlc-coating😂
Everyone complains about Benchmade, but everyone LOVES Spyderco price gouging every year. Love hypocrisy.
@@DenyTheZeitgeist nobody ever said that, spyderco is pretty darn bad too.
Part of it is that they are charging way too much for some of these knives.
I actually skipped Blade this year due to the fact I just didn't see myself being able to afford it. It's not far for me (so the drive cost isn't expensive...literally a tank for the entire trip), but it's the fact everything is so expensive now. With that, and the fact work for me has slowed down quite a bit over the summer...I felt it was smarter to skip. Kinda sucks since the only time I've missed between this year and when I started going about a decade ago was COVID when Blade wasn't even happening.
On another, brighter note...it's so cool the 3D printing files that y'all offer up for someone like me with a printer available. Even more reason I've always loved what y'all do...except being sold out of the five-panel hats right now...kinda sad about that one...
I was #1000 like 👍 BTW Ben is the absolute best. He has helped me numerous times with knafsale and every time he meets and exceeds customer service.
Worst seller of the week could be the “best underachiever of the week!” - keep it positive for Athena!
This 🙂👆🏻🙂
I would call it no man left behind
Budget options are the wave rn. No way I’m paying 2-500 for a knife
Ok, I stopped by knives because they are expensive. I have picked up two of your knives recently because of the quality and the price. I love supporting you because you are a small business and from your videos I feel you care about your friends and employees. Last point. I loved Benchmade and have purchased several in the past. Now, will not do it. The price for one of their knives is just ridiculous now. Especially for the materials they are using and steel. I truly enjoy my banter for my edc.
The only new knives I have been buying in the last year are Cold Steel because of the great deals at Midway and on Amazon. Everything else is so expensive. I used to absolutely love collecting Spyderco Exclusives and Sprint runs but that doesn't interest me whatsoever anymore. I still have quite a few in the collection but don't plan on adding more, prices are crazy.
Just be wary as they sold to GSM and have switched more of their production to China. Joe X and other EDC people have covered this. That is not saying knives made in China are necessarily bad as there are some excellent ones, but this may be a cheapo move on their part. If you are going to get them you may want to see if you can get pre-GSM ones. I do love my Coldsteels, and nobody makes a good pocket sword like they do! My favorite one is my Rajah II and then either my Scorpion from Off-Grid knives or my Drift in Vanax from Quiet Carry. Only issue with the last 2 is I do not have CBN or diamond stones to get the maximum benefit and edge retention from them which makes me sad as they are great knives. If I could go back, would get one of Off-Grids knives made in D2, a Civvivi, or a good Vosteed and more particularly the Nightshade. Standard carry is Rajah II for bigger cutting tasks, chopping, and self defense, Leatherman Sidekick as multi tool, and then one of my other smaller ones with a good point for doing detail work and breaking boxes down faster. I work as a handyman part time for a school and process a lot of cardboard and putting together a bunch of furniture where that setup has helped a bunch in saving time and being more efficient.
Just some thoughts. Hope you have a great night!
Sincerely,
JS
Knife companies have totally lost their minds with their pricing. Yet I have seen people still spend the money on high end knives. As long as people are stupid enough to pay the ridicules prices the knife prices will not go down.
Call it Underdog of the Week instead of worst seller
It’s money
Straight up
I stopped buying knives after buying a Microtech 6 years ago. The knife and GPU/CPU market are very similar. Charging too much for gimmicky materials and loveeee to justify it by saying "the CNC takes sooooo long" Ok buddy, I can buy a killer innovations threaded match grade pistol barrel with 120 individual cuts for under $300. That and we keep using super steels with shit heat treatments and quality control. I shouldn't have to go to some random knife designer and pay 500+ for a proper heat treat on a basic style custom knife. The knife market is off the chain, basic knives for the cost of a canik tp9 or Glock is just not...no, just no. "But they use good spacers and washers, oh you mean the shit that costs a few cents? You can be an idiot, I'm not. Titanium, G10 and Micarta are not rare expensive bougie materials, their pretty basic and common materials that don't cost all that much raw. The marketing and useful idiots do not help matters.
China makes high quality knives with great materials and steels for 1/6th the price of American made brands… (Civivi, Kizer, to name a few)…. Then here comes Benchmade with $400 fixed blades with 154CM. No one is paying $300-400 for sub par knives anymore.
I use to be a Spyderco whore but the prices, especially here in Canada, is crazy. There's no way I can keep up with a collection and still put food on the table. I still love my collection but it's been a while since I've bought one and I don't see any new ones in the near future.
When a regular, plain Jane VG-10 Delica cost $129 Cnd, you know prices are a bit too much. That's just a bit under what I paid for my Navaja or my Chokwe.
The “knife community” aka consumers are destroying their own community.
Keep buying artificially priced Chinese knives, and bitching about UsA made. You’ll love the “community” you end up with in 10-15 years.
FACTS: needed a new hunting knife. ( left my old one somewhere in the woods. Not going to spend 300 on a knife. Recorded my subscription to buckmasters and they sent me a fixed blade. That's what I'm using for the forceable future. Lol
I was actually surprised that a well known knife maker has his own show. I like your knives. Today knives are like TV sets,new ones every week with just a little added touch,like a pocket clip and it makes it me want to wait on buying. Also some of the steels which brings the prices higher and how many people actually need this steel for everyday. I won't buy a knife over $100 dollar from experience because they're all hype,screws start coming off and I haven't even used them and they're from a well known brand. Also I've learned that the tougher steels (154 ) are harder to sharpen if one doesn't have the right sharpening tools because a stone will take forever,and some sharpening equipment are b s. I always give a little swipe every time I use a knife. I'm happy with D2 steel. Another thing is finding the proper knife for your use and that's not always explained. I believe that you will be more successful with your show and build the right edc
I already have a huge knife collection, I’m focusing on paring it down to what I actually use. Like if 90% of the time, I cycle between my Baby Banter, my Kwaiken Air, and my Delica do I really need all these others?
Their shop is literally just outside my neighborhood.. lots of overpriced chineseium.
Tony burger, burly burger, and Atlantis are all way better.
I buy Chinese counterfeit knives. $40 and I have a damn nice “Microtech” Ultratech knife and I love it! I had a “real” real one and this fake one comes 99% of the real thing. $40 vs $300+ is an easy decision, the economy is down right now and people are pinching their money a lot harder these days.
The knife industry is flooding the market with new knives, looking what sells and trashing the other novelties. "New designs" are often slightly different than 4 other recent "new designs" by other brands. As a customer, you are totally overwhelmed in the meantime. Then there are brands that are struggling to justify their high prices given the quality of today's budget knives they are competing with. "Made in USA" doesn't mean anything anymore, the quality is no better than good Chinese, Taiwanese or Italian knives and often have dated steels to raise the profit margin. Since you mentioned Boker - they have the same problems.
If you take a step back and look at what you need and use, plus a few cool models that you just enjoy, you don't need a new knife every month. I sold off many of my knives and now have 5 folding knives that cover everything I need or want.
Yes. They absolutely are. The only knives that have overall gotten better over the last few years are professional grade culinary knives. Gerbers quality is down. Cold steel is down, schrade, kershaw, leatherman. They've all gotten slightly worse over the last few years.
When peoples homes are growing in value they are much more likely to frivolously spend money. This is a fact that blankets all consumption including knives. Plain and simple. There I solved it for you
I’m still a fan of victorinox. They are durable, and they warranty them for life. Even the us military is starting to go to victorinox. The new one hand trekker is based on the Swiss Soldier 08.
The knives are all under 3.5", they're expensive, and generic as possible. So yes they've been failing and it's gotten way worse the last year or two since I checked out.
When people ask me about knives or express interest in knives it hard to talk about. I cant justify recommend starting point knives that are now double to triple the price from when I origonal bought them.
I haven't bought any new knives cause I already have like 20 of em. And if I did buy a knife, I wouldn't want to spend more than a hundred bucks on it.
Getting flooded with cheap Chinese knives might have something to do with western knife brands tanking. They are not playing by the rules of the free world.
I just don’t collect them. Everything I buy is with the intent of my great grandchildren using. Buy once cry once
I've been seeing this coming a few years ago. The price hikes are getting ridiculous and the designs themselves are just getting too cheesy.
Dear Mr Peterson I Really enjoy your Tool burrito design is there a chance in the future that you will do it in a plethora of other colors. Ok how about Red and Blue
Yes, it is failing, and one of the biggest reasons in my opinion is an introduction of super steel, which have put the cost of knives out of the reach of most blue-collar, hard-working men and women until we get the thought out of peoples heads that they have to have a knife that is hard as a diamondfor it to be a good knife we’re gonna have this problem
All products look the same and they are all too fuggn expensive. For the first time in my life I’m looking for chinese steel
There are waaaaaaayyyyy too many people making knives. Far too flooded for a non consumable product.
Yes,big time. Who in their right mind asks so much money for a not even so special knive. Knive makers are big time failing the normal guy or woman. I rather buy a good but much cheaper victorinox ,or even a opinel for a few bucks. They slice and dice just as good, and lets be honost, maybe better then the expensive brands. A good knive doesnt need all those magic steels,that will be old news next year. A good knive doesnt need a mild pocketclip. A good knive doesnt need all the fancy handles. A good knive has to cut for the purpose you need it. I rather get me a new victorinox and have a good meal for my family.
IM HOPING the fact that custom knife makers are ALSO people who can’t afford much can resonate with people. The one thing we can do that large company’s can’t is scale our materials down to match budgets.
First Sergeant.
He's the lead Non Commissioned Officer for a Company sized Army unit.
reasons:
money doesn't stretch nearly as far as it did, even last year,
for hobby collectors, "name" knives are, as always, comically overpriced,
for defense, the population is moving to firearms (a market that's booming among first-time buyers)
The knife industry is failing becouse knives are costing way too much and people can’t afford them. The cost needs to come down. Guys like the hobby of collecting knives but it’s way too expensive to buy knives. I believe if the cost of knives came down a lot it would do better
I think it's overpriced for what you get and often the quality is going down as well.
Yes very boring. It's like collecting spoons. How many knives can you pile up in your drawer. Nothing new anymore.
You can also use the Monty Python, "Knights that say Knafs!" or the Knights at Knafs, so you can post at anytime! I've really enjoyed watching the two episodes so far. The "Banter" (pun intended) between you two is great, and the industry news and insights is really valuable. It's great to have that inside look at what's happening across the industry! Thanks for being amazing as always.
Back in the day, a person would have one knife that did the job and you wouldn't get another unless you lost, broke or wore out your knife. After the 2000's we bought and changed knives for no practical reason, however, in today's economy that is unsustainable. We might go back and think about a knife being a tool and not a luxury item. How many hammers do you typically need in the house? Just one.
I think this is a little short-sighted. I grew up on a farm and was a carpenter. We had sledgehammers, framing hammers, tack hammers, dry wall hammers, farriers hammer, and even nail guns. I wouldn't use a farriers hammer to-do my dry wall. There are tools for every job buy what you need and vote with your wallet. Let the market sort the rest. For every fancy knive, there are 50 hard use practicals.
I'm only a suburban, white collar dude but I still need at least 2 or 3 different hammers for the odd jobs, construction, building and repairs I do around my house.
You really only use one?
What about when you need to drive something without marring the surface of either the nail or the surface?
What about when you need to nail a tiny pin instead of driving a framing nail?
I think everyone could benefit from at least both a basic, do it all hammer, and then a smaller nylon head or rubber head hammer.
I cant justify buying a new Spyderco over groceries.
Clickbait title with a bunch of unrelated stuff. Shame.
Jose is now a first sergeant by the way! E-8 pay grade and now the NCO in charge of a conpany sized unit (roughly 120 people)
I’d buy a carrokatana, that thing has some great giggle factor.
Enjoy this show and your knives. Looking forward to celebrating your 100th show. 🤞🏻
There isn't a knife made that's worth over a $100.00.
Influencers like you and other's are selling soft Garbo at high prices.
Shop pocket dumps for sure! Or at least at the BBQ sidewalk sale at least haha
Ill just tell you, its not just the outdoor industry. Its the everything industry. Everything is way expensive and just keeps getting moreso, so people aren't able to spend money on everyday things, let alone luxuries. I work at a battery factory, and we are going through company changes as well.
To me knives are luxury items unless it is a budget or work beater brand. I personally believe why brands like Condor, CRKT, Case, Moirakniv, and Buck (would put Ontario here too but it is no longer with us) have had such a long successful and storied history is because they keep their pricing and materials in the range of the working man.
The cost of knives, especially American made is ridiculous. Many of the Spyderco knives are $100+ than when they launched. Gerber and Kershaw knives have doubled, even their crappy ones. Look at Tops, I mean, really now??
Forget it.
100% Agree!