Thanks so much! I'm really thrilled to be working with and learning from Kelsey. Trust me when I say there are some very exciting things in the work at The Arcane Library!
I lifted this from some Free League games like Forbidden Lands. It’s easy, works well, and averages around 4-5 XP per session. I think putting oaths and blessings on the list would make sense too. Awarding Experience Points If the PC can answer ‘yes’ to any of the items below, its worth 1 XP each. Did you? Show up for the session. Explore a new dangerous/wonderous location. Gain and enemy who still lives. Gain a friend you can trust. Fulfill a contract or complete a mission. Have a clever idea or action. Endanger yourself to help others. Avoid unnecessary violence. Find treasure. Defeat monsters.
Great video! One note: when we talk about oaths I believe there is a difference between Oaths the players swear to their gods in Midnight Sun and the type discussed in acquiring XP. Oaths to gods are oaths the PLAYERS make to do a service to others the XP earning oaths are oaths that the players RECEIVE FROM NPCS promising service, fealty or friendship. I believe this would be similar to a blessing from a god. Instead of killing the bandits you defeat or negotiate them to the point they swear an oath to let you pass unmolested - 1XP earned! I believe this is to show the ways soft power can be leveraged to have material gains in the world that aren’t solid gold
I kinda did this in my most recent campaign without noticing. Both for a blessing and for clever thinking. In the first instance, one of my players solved a riddle related to a god of knowledge. They did it in a great fashion, including some of the lore within the dungeon, so I was impressed. My plan was to award them with a Luck token, but I was so amazed I wanted to give them more, so I gave them all a point of XP. In the second one, we were about to start a session and one of my players said: "We should look in this room for secret doors." I was puzzled but tried to hide my surprise, since there was an actual secret door in that room. After one round, they found the secret door and I asked my player why did he know there was a secret door. He answered: "Well, I have been keeping track of the layout and all of the other floors have a circle shape, but this one does not, so there must be a way to connect them." I was so amazed by his clever thinking I wanted to reward it, so, again, I gave them all 1 XP. I think the best thing to take away from this is you can use your gut for awarding XP. If your players do something that you want to encourage or that made your day, just award them XP.
As a young DnD player, the group I was in used a method we called, "Begging for Experience." I've been critisized intensely online when I mention it. None of the negatives folks like to bring up were experienced, at least not by me. Yes it was arbitray , a bit. At some "pause point" in an adventure we would all receive a base amount of XP. Then we went around the group and described our actions and contributions in terms of our characters. Actions demonstrating use of character abilities and feats of daring would draw more XP. And, the opposite was true. If a Cavalier or Paladin failed to engage or uphold what the party might expect of them (in terms of honor or piety), then we might all chime in about it. It was more a fun way to review what we had all done, relive it a bit, and learn how to better roleplay our characters. We were all friends, not day-to-day friends, and malice was not something tolerated - we were al there to have fun. Trash talk was always pretty fun, never personal, and we all progressed in playing our characters no matter how different they might be from adventure to adventure. This ties into SD nicely, very nicely. Players recount, first that they survived so far, and their deeds and acommplishments. All of which fits nicely into the XP system for SD. In all fairness, as was true in my youth, leveling up tends to come after one ha stretched their character abilities about as far as possible and should expect to better or broader in their abilities next session. Thank you for your ongoing content!
For ideas of the types of Oaths someone could make, take a look at WotC’s Mythic Odysseys of Theros. In Chapter 2 under each of the gods’ descriptions there’s a section called “Earning and Losing Piety” which includes examples of the things you could do to please that god. So for example Iroas god of victory it says you gain favour after “Overcoming long odds honorably Defeating a skilled foe in single combat Winning a great feat of strength or skill” etc. If you happen to already have this book, a great source of prompts to players. So a character who worshipped a Lawful martial god in Shadowdark might have that list in mind and say “By my honour I swear to Saint Terragnis I will hold this doorway closed long enough for my friends to escape” etc.
Reward the play you want to see. I have my settings history tied to XP. The PCs happen upon a ruined library, they look through the tomes and find one of interest. Once back to town they can study (instead of carouse) and get XP and learn about the location of a wonderous object or the weakness of a powerful enemy. Like a shadowdark description. I distill lore into bite sized nuggets. They are always on the hunt for more.
I really like Shadowdark. My XP system instead of being based on gold is based on all ability check rolls: crits grant 2 xp, fumbles grants 3 xp. To me it just makes more since to reward XP based on Ability score rolls.
I think the two oaths you are describing are quite different, the oaths in cursed scroll #3 are Oaths you swear, while an Oath in the core rules that you get XP for are oath sworn to you, basically quest rewards such as being promised a title or something
Thanks for this! My players rescued a weaver's apprentice from a giant spider cocoon, so I will give them 1 XP for that! Loving ShadowDark RPG so much better than D&D 5e!
My understanding was that the main way to get a significant reward of XP was through Carousing (it being the main gameplay loop)?? And that the XP scale of Oaths in CS3 corresponded to the XP quality chart in the base game. Ie Worthy 1XP, Mighty 3 XP, and Legendary being 10 XP.
Oath Bids. When you make an oath, you lose an XP and note what your goal is. At the end of a session, check your oaths. If an oath hasn't been completed, you may erase that oath, or lose another XP to keep it. If any oaths are completed, gain XP equal one and a half XP spent on that oath.
Yup, the first half of the memo is this ain't Final Fantasy. You don't get XP just for stacking corpses. But you do get XP for treasure, for really getting into the game, and for doing clever/fun stuff. Reward your players for playing well!
I may have commented on here before, but I didn't prefere battle or treasure XP. I like the XP system from Dungeon World and D100 Dungeon so I combined them both with 2 XP for fumbled rolls and 1 for Crit rolls with Shadowdarks XP Level up system thos works real good.
At the end of the day, what matters is that you and your players are having fun! If you want to use your own XP systems or a combo of Shadowdark and something else, I think that's great!
Treasure should be a reward in itself. I never understood the idea behind giving Exp for treasure. That is so.... "capitalist" (for a lack of a better word). It really feels as far away from my understanding of fantasy as I can possibly think.
The way I understand it (and the way I usually play gold for XP) is actually SPENDING that gold for XP. I'm just now looking intk Shadowdark, but for my table completing a dungeon delve was likely under someone's request. You return to that person and fulfill their request (an oath more or less) and get XP. It's the experiences gained through spending your loot in town that increases your lived experiences. My two cents at least.
Everyone welcome our new Assistant Librarian!
Congrats Michael on becoming part of The Arcane Library crew!
Thanks so much! I'm really thrilled to be working with and learning from Kelsey. Trust me when I say there are some very exciting things in the work at The Arcane Library!
I’m so glad you’re shining light on the many ways to get XP! 😃
Did we mention "Boons" on pg. 280 of the core rulebook yet? It has more guidelines about oaths, secrets and blessings, including some examples.
Assistant Librarian! That is so freaking cool. Congrats, you couldn’t ask for a better person to fill that role.
I lifted this from some Free League games like Forbidden Lands. It’s easy, works well, and averages around 4-5 XP per session. I think putting oaths and blessings on the list would make sense too.
Awarding Experience Points
If the PC can answer ‘yes’ to any of the items below, its worth 1 XP each.
Did you?
Show up for the session.
Explore a new dangerous/wonderous location.
Gain and enemy who still lives.
Gain a friend you can trust.
Fulfill a contract or complete a mission.
Have a clever idea or action.
Endanger yourself to help others.
Avoid unnecessary violence.
Find treasure.
Defeat monsters.
Great video!
One note: when we talk about oaths I believe there is a difference between Oaths the players swear to their gods in Midnight Sun and the type discussed in acquiring XP. Oaths to gods are oaths the PLAYERS make to do a service to others the XP earning oaths are oaths that the players RECEIVE FROM NPCS promising service, fealty or friendship. I believe this would be similar to a blessing from a god. Instead of killing the bandits you defeat or negotiate them to the point they swear an oath to let you pass unmolested - 1XP earned! I believe this is to show the ways soft power can be leveraged to have material gains in the world that aren’t solid gold
I kinda did this in my most recent campaign without noticing. Both for a blessing and for clever thinking.
In the first instance, one of my players solved a riddle related to a god of knowledge. They did it in a great fashion, including some of the lore within the dungeon, so I was impressed. My plan was to award them with a Luck token, but I was so amazed I wanted to give them more, so I gave them all a point of XP.
In the second one, we were about to start a session and one of my players said: "We should look in this room for secret doors." I was puzzled but tried to hide my surprise, since there was an actual secret door in that room. After one round, they found the secret door and I asked my player why did he know there was a secret door. He answered: "Well, I have been keeping track of the layout and all of the other floors have a circle shape, but this one does not, so there must be a way to connect them." I was so amazed by his clever thinking I wanted to reward it, so, again, I gave them all 1 XP.
I think the best thing to take away from this is you can use your gut for awarding XP. If your players do something that you want to encourage or that made your day, just award them XP.
As a young DnD player, the group I was in used a method we called, "Begging for Experience." I've been critisized intensely online when I mention it. None of the negatives folks like to bring up were experienced, at least not by me. Yes it was arbitray , a bit. At some "pause point" in an adventure we would all receive a base amount of XP. Then we went around the group and described our actions and contributions in terms of our characters. Actions demonstrating use of character abilities and feats of daring would draw more XP. And, the opposite was true. If a Cavalier or Paladin failed to engage or uphold what the party might expect of them (in terms of honor or piety), then we might all chime in about it. It was more a fun way to review what we had all done, relive it a bit, and learn how to better roleplay our characters. We were all friends, not day-to-day friends, and malice was not something tolerated - we were al there to have fun. Trash talk was always pretty fun, never personal, and we all progressed in playing our characters no matter how different they might be from adventure to adventure.
This ties into SD nicely, very nicely. Players recount, first that they survived so far, and their deeds and acommplishments. All of which fits nicely into the XP system for SD. In all fairness, as was true in my youth, leveling up tends to come after one ha stretched their character abilities about as far as possible and should expect to better or broader in their abilities next session.
Thank you for your ongoing content!
Loved this video. Oaths and Secrets are easy to overlook. Also Boons and Blessings.
For ideas of the types of Oaths someone could make, take a look at WotC’s Mythic Odysseys of Theros. In Chapter 2 under each of the gods’ descriptions there’s a section called “Earning and Losing Piety” which includes examples of the things you could do to please that god.
So for example Iroas god of victory it says you gain favour after “Overcoming long odds honorably
Defeating a skilled foe in single combat
Winning a great feat of strength or skill” etc.
If you happen to already have this book, a great source of prompts to players. So a character who worshipped a Lawful martial god in Shadowdark might have that list in mind and say “By my honour I swear to Saint Terragnis I will hold this doorway closed long enough for my friends to escape” etc.
On nice! I'll have to check that out!!!
Reward the play you want to see. I have my settings history tied to XP. The PCs happen upon a ruined library, they look through the tomes and find one of interest. Once back to town they can study (instead of carouse) and get XP and learn about the location of a wonderous object or the weakness of a powerful enemy. Like a shadowdark description. I distill lore into bite sized nuggets. They are always on the hunt for more.
Ok milestones…thanks! I was thinking this was to subjective a rumor they find (+1xp!) a new location unlocked (+1xp!) cool
I really like Shadowdark.
My XP system instead of being based on gold is based on all ability check rolls:
crits grant 2 xp,
fumbles grants 3 xp.
To me it just makes more since to reward XP based on
Ability score rolls.
I think the two oaths you are describing are quite different, the oaths in cursed scroll #3 are Oaths you swear, while an Oath in the core rules that you get XP for are oath sworn to you, basically quest rewards such as being promised a title or something
Thanks for exposing me to this. I might add it to my game of Knave. As someone who already likes Ironsworn, yeah oaths are cool :P
Thanks for this! My players rescued a weaver's apprentice from a giant spider cocoon, so I will give them 1 XP for that! Loving ShadowDark RPG so much better than D&D 5e!
@@MarkCherkowski hell yeah! I'm glad you found it useful and are loving Shadowdark!
My understanding was that the main way to get a significant reward of XP was through Carousing (it being the main gameplay loop)??
And that the XP scale of Oaths in CS3 corresponded to the XP quality chart in the base game. Ie Worthy 1XP, Mighty 3 XP, and Legendary being 10 XP.
Oath Bids. When you make an oath, you lose an XP and note what your goal is. At the end of a session, check your oaths. If an oath hasn't been completed, you may erase that oath, or lose another XP to keep it. If any oaths are completed, gain XP equal one and a half XP spent on that oath.
Yup, the first half of the memo is this ain't Final Fantasy. You don't get XP just for stacking corpses. But you do get XP for treasure, for really getting into the game, and for doing clever/fun stuff. Reward your players for playing well!
What level “Assistant Librarian” tho?? 😂 Congrats Michael. BTW @JPCoovert sent me here. 👍🏼
I may have commented on here before, but I didn't prefere battle or treasure XP.
I like the XP system from Dungeon World and
D100 Dungeon so I combined them both with 2 XP for fumbled rolls and
1 for Crit rolls with Shadowdarks XP Level up system thos works real good.
At the end of the day, what matters is that you and your players are having fun! If you want to use your own XP systems or a combo of Shadowdark and something else, I think that's great!
That’s a useful note. Thanks!
Thank you for the great advice! 😊
Happy to help!
thank you for this. love your video.
Thanks so much for watching! 😁
Enjoying all the Shadowdark content
Thank you so much! I'm having a blast making it!
It's all about that liberal XP showering! Love it!
Hopefully I can say hi at Gary Con.
Hell yeah! I shouldn't be hard to find 🤙
@@NightNoonGames We actually played together in the Saturday night Shadowdome Thunderdark game.
@@dnddaddy oh snap! Were you on my team or the other team?
@@NightNoonGames The other team. I was the ranger sitting opposite of you on the end.
I'm sorry... but offickle?? Official doesn't rhyme with pickle!
Pobody's nerfect!
Noice
Treasure should be a reward in itself. I never understood the idea behind giving Exp for treasure. That is so.... "capitalist" (for a lack of a better word). It really feels as far away from my understanding of fantasy as I can possibly think.
The way I understand it (and the way I usually play gold for XP) is actually SPENDING that gold for XP. I'm just now looking intk Shadowdark, but for my table completing a dungeon delve was likely under someone's request. You return to that person and fulfill their request (an oath more or less) and get XP. It's the experiences gained through spending your loot in town that increases your lived experiences. My two cents at least.
This assumes your players are trying to find secrets and take oaths. Lol.
Oh yeah. It's part of the game!
@zwoq6779 they will if you start rewarding it!