Carriers have the most offensive power in 1 unit (5 if you put both the Carrier and the Fighter squadron into surface attack) and is the only unit in the game that can influence neighbouring areas without needing an order. They are a bit stronger than the Battleships and a bit more expensive, in game terms I think they are very well balanced, though yeah, a bit unrealisticaly so.
Great review, of a game our groups loves. It's worth mentioning, the 2nd Kickstarter has optional rules to chop some aspects of the game to significantly speed up play. Can't wait to try them.
While watching I'd like to point out that the carrier plane regenerated if destroyed. So the battleship has these benefits: red vs green, so 2 red/black vs 3 green/black (sometimes +1 white), with advantage 1 vs 2... -1 oil +1 iron, oil being costlier The carrier has these: attack 3/0+2/1 anti air or 0/3+1/2 anti naval, total 5/1 or 1/5 vs 2/3 or 1/4, so way better. the fighter respawns when destroyed it can help defend or attack the land next to it when doing nothing So when you have one, always get the other, then collect at least one cruiser and sub. It a matter of taste what you like best, but as green will be destroyed more easily, I'd build backup of those as well as blue and some yellow to keep advantage after battles. Like in A&A planes are generally nicer value for money as they keep value after you won at sea, but ships are cooler and more tempting to build.
The solution to the table was two 30" x 72" foldable resin tables, put side by side with the playmat in the middle. A few bucks for the table and a few angry looks from wife who wonders why you moved all the furniture in the living room / dining room lol. With 6 players, which player do you recommend also does China?
Well if I'm not mistaken the boat was offloading the games in Savannah port, GA. It finally was unloaded around the 31st where it is waiting to be sent to QML in Florida. Hopefully there are no delays in customs check and delivering. Can't wait!
Really interesting review fellas! While I have no intentions of buying another massive monster wargame, you’ve given me a lot of ideas that I’d like repurpose my 2d edition A World at War and make something playable and homebrewed out of that! Again, thanks for the review!
As I watch the video and think on it, Grant hits a big issue (for developers and players) on the head: should the game be an accurate “simulation” that follows the historical event or should players be able to do the unthinkable to create a different viable strategy? Personally, outside of simulations that I solo, I’d prefer games with multiple routes to victory instead of a formulaic path. Grant mentioned players abandoning France being ahistorical. While that might be true, I think it goes to the deeper struggle for the developer in how much should they hamstring players to the historical event and how much leeway should they have for atypical strategies? I’m a fan of the options but can see how it would turn people off.
@@yukidaruma6988 My vote is for the latter. I have no interest in following the path laid out by historical events. If I did, then I would play the Allies every time knowing that I would win the game more often than not.
Good video. Frame at 20:15 on a mug? The videos on solitaire play were helpful. A video on finishing or ending a game well, solitaire & group, would be great. There are tons of how to start, but few "how does this madness end!" tips!
The problem with the combat system for this game is that it only takes the attacker's offensive strength (i.e. # of dice available to use) into account. The defender's defensive strength has no impact at all. This system is basically a "more dice rolls" version of the Axis & Allies combat system (both games share the same designer).
The map isn’t really that much bigger than A&A Global. It’s 42” diameter and fits on most dinningroom tables. Won’t fit on a single foldout church table, but would easily on two.
Thanks so much for this. It's taken this game from, "Maybe I'll try and talk my convention group into it," to "I might have to insist." I'm _a little_ disappointed to find out the command sticks seemed more like a gimmick than something practical. I wonder if just using them and getting some practice at it would make them more useful?
I also agree that aircraft carriers are underpowered. If you want to use house rules you can easily fix it by giving aircraft carriers an additional fighter or a bomber.
Three, moving from the island to I4 takes one move. So you'd have to write your order to a zone within two steps from B7 (Horn of Afrika). So either B8 or seazone I3, I4 or I6. And afterwards you can indeed move to B7 or change your mind and move up to two zones elsewhere. You might find yourself in battle if others move there.
Has anyone created a 1939 or 1940 starting scenario like people did in A&A games? I'd be very interested in that. I haven't played yet but I get your point in the carriers only having one aircraft. But as mentioned they don't need an order and you get a free one every round. You don't have to invest in planes like you do in A&A. They probably aren't worth investing to much in but as long as they stay alive thats free value every round. Of course it can cause you stress points though unfortunately if it is killed. I have a question about combat. The rules say to take turns rolling batches of 10. I get that it makes a difference rolling 10 and assigning hits before rolling another 10 rather than rolling 20 and having perfect information on what you can assign hits to. But do you really need to alternate? Is it just because the rules say to have each side roll 10, and then remove the hotspot marker that indicated 10 dice? Or is there another reason I am missing? EDIT: Rereading the rules subs will dive after sets of 10 are rolled and they are damaged. Is that the only other thing that would really matter?
Awsome game. Sold my first KS edition on ebay (what was a fault) but thinking about getting 2nd edition next year. Unfortunate my gaming "group" consists of only me and a friend of mine...
Also black and white results work when NONE of the sides have force advantage, the only way black and white results are misses if one side HAS the advantage and the other doesn't.
@@ThePlayersAid One caveat to the Walmart shelves, they are slightly smaller which can be a problem for things designed for Kallax dimensions, like the Too Many Bones Trove Chest for instance.
If Super-Bombers existed that is how you bring Washington to heel. Germany needs the Red Skull and Hydra. We need the War Room: Hydra expansion, or call it Man in the High Castle: War Room expansion.
When talking about China you mentioned "I would never play 7 players" but is this game not 1-6 players ref. BGG and the Kickstarter? I do how ever see that there are 7 countries tho, if so what country is meant not to be played?
China technically can be played by a 7th player, and there are groups that have done it, but I would not recommend it. I think officially it's a 1-6 person game, but people have tried it.
Battle ship if you added another color, so Red + One additional color, so how about Red + White or Red + Blue? Correct, Carriers should have at least 2 respawnable Fighters so if you kill one it respawns for free or Cheap, so if a normal plane cost X, then reduce the cost. Axis and Allies that cost was 12, so I'd say cost 3 to regenerate a new Fighter on Carrier. Something like that. But if the RAW for war room game is 1 fighter you can always respawn free that is nice but it should be 2 Fighters.
Of the ones that you can see in this video 11 are unplayed, but of those 11 a couple are series games that I know how to play, so really only 9! The other shelf you can't see off camera is more like 50/50.
Disagree I think US can focus all 8 or 9 orders on Pacific theatre for the first couple turns at least or more, and maybe make one order or two in European theatre. Mostly it is only US in Pacific, though UK has some, and maybe Russia to a limited extent. I'd say 12 orders for factions, 6 for Italy, 3 for China, and China is always paired with US player so really 9 + 6 can RAW be in the game for US/China player, but 12 + 3 = 15. Another idea is each nation has different orders. US 12, UK 12, Russia 10, Germany 14 or Japan 14, China 3, maybe Italy 5. I would play around with it, but those are possible changes to consider if you go down that road, but obviously RAW is fine as you all face the same limitation. It also limited nations like the US. You have a lot of resources, but that 9 order limit means YOUR choices as a player MATTER, and so it is not how many orders you have but how well you execute the potential of those orders. Like it is not the size that matters but how you use it so to speak. Carry a Big Stick and speak Softly put another way.
If Britain and China move together on SEAsia, the Japanese woll have a tougher time of it to the point where their oil in the Dutch islands are threatened.
As always, really appreciate all your work and reviews. You helped me to make up my mind and not to get this one - whilst I appreciate some design ideas (custom dice and unit stance), the movement phase at this scale should be far less chaotic, and BBs being stronger then CVs sound like a very odd design choice for WW2
Hmm... I like programmed movement (like Gunslinger, RoboRally) ... mistakes are part of the fun. But does it really work for a grand strategic game? ... I mean ... How many generals in history have invaded the wrong country (Not counting GW) What does that actually simulate?
I did like the video but i have to make fun of this line around minute 14 Japan: "My oil was so well protected as it was historically" ummmm.... No. The USA hap tremendous submarine convoy destroying success. by 1944 the high command was planning on what they were going to do with each boat that came in. Even in the 1930s they were running out of oil. then never had enough oil, never had even close to enough. It is good that it is not historical, cuz then japan would never have a chance!
I’m so torn. It’s a lot of money for a game that would only hit the table once a year but it also seems like the kind of game you should for that once a year event. I wish it wasn’t so HUGE and expensive. I could fit 7 other games on my shelf instead of this and costs as mich as three GMT games (including shipping). I’ve backed it for now but really do not now if I will go through it. Damn it! Wish I had a friend that’d buy it
The game box is only 6" tall. So when stood on it's end, on a top shelf, let's say, it takes up only 6" of shelf space. Thus you still have room for six of those seven games that you were worried wouldn't fit. :)
The China player gets a benefit but no one else gets they get to officially eat Chinese food while they're playing nobody else can do that they're not allow it to part of the rules and you can't eat Japanese food either well maybe unless you're the Japanese player and then you can but nobody else can eat those kinds of foods why you play
I’m BGG it says 2-6 hours. We play slow but that game cannot be played faster than say 8-10 hours. One of the intro scenarios is the East Front and that may take 2-4 hours.
Too big a game to just do a cursory 30 minutes. Showing the board with some moves and actions was nearly 30 minutes. Our first thoughts video was around 20 minutes.
Carriers have the most offensive power in 1 unit (5 if you put both the Carrier and the Fighter squadron into surface attack) and is the only unit in the game that can influence neighbouring areas without needing an order. They are a bit stronger than the Battleships and a bit more expensive, in game terms I think they are very well balanced, though yeah, a bit unrealisticaly so.
you two got a very good chemistry !
Great review, of a game our groups loves. It's worth mentioning, the 2nd Kickstarter has optional rules to chop some aspects of the game to significantly speed up play. Can't wait to try them.
I've backed the 2nd kickstarter and so cant wait to get this to my table
Just got my 2nd Edition from the Kickstarter, looking forward to playing!
So looking forward to this game. Ordered on Kickstarter. Looks epic. Love round maps too! Thanks. Very much enjoyed your session. You guys are great!
While watching I'd like to point out that the carrier plane regenerated if destroyed.
So the battleship has these benefits:
red vs green, so 2 red/black vs 3 green/black (sometimes +1 white), with advantage 1 vs 2...
-1 oil +1 iron, oil being costlier
The carrier has these:
attack 3/0+2/1 anti air or 0/3+1/2 anti naval, total 5/1 or 1/5 vs 2/3 or 1/4, so way better.
the fighter respawns when destroyed
it can help defend or attack the land next to it when doing nothing
So when you have one, always get the other, then collect at least one cruiser and sub.
It a matter of taste what you like best, but as green will be destroyed more easily, I'd build backup of those as well as blue and some yellow to keep advantage after battles.
Like in A&A planes are generally nicer value for money as they keep value after you won at sea, but ships are cooler and more tempting to build.
The solution to the table was two 30" x 72" foldable resin tables, put side by side with the playmat in the middle. A few bucks for the table and a few angry looks from wife who wonders why you moved all the furniture in the living room / dining room lol. With 6 players, which player do you recommend also does China?
I will travel anytime to get a game with ya! - I'll bring the beer and pretzels !!
The boat just arrived in NY the other day. It should be here in a few weeks! I can't wait!!! 😃
Well if I'm not mistaken the boat was offloading the games in Savannah port, GA. It finally was unloaded around the 31st where it is waiting to be sent to QML in Florida. Hopefully there are no delays in customs check and delivering. Can't wait!
Really interesting review fellas! While I have no intentions of buying another massive monster wargame, you’ve given me a lot of ideas that I’d like repurpose my 2d edition A World at War and make something playable and homebrewed out of that! Again, thanks for the review!
As I watch the video and think on it, Grant hits a big issue (for developers and players) on the head: should the game be an accurate “simulation” that follows the historical event or should players be able to do the unthinkable to create a different viable strategy? Personally, outside of simulations that I solo, I’d prefer games with multiple routes to victory instead of a formulaic path. Grant mentioned players abandoning France being ahistorical. While that might be true, I think it goes to the deeper struggle for the developer in how much should they hamstring players to the historical event and how much leeway should they have for atypical strategies? I’m a fan of the options but can see how it would turn people off.
@@yukidaruma6988 My vote is for the latter. I have no interest in following the path laid out by historical events. If I did, then I would play the Allies every time knowing that I would win the game more often than not.
Gosh that looks good. Haven't got the space but would love to play it when Covid is over.
Good video. Frame at 20:15 on a mug? The videos on solitaire play were helpful. A video on finishing or ending a game well, solitaire & group, would be great. There are tons of how to start, but few "how does this madness end!" tips!
thank you for the show
Great review guys :-)
Man, was I waiting for this one.
Great recap and review, guys! Hopefully we can get together again for a rematch!
The problem with the combat system for this game is that it only takes the attacker's offensive strength (i.e. # of dice available to use) into account. The defender's defensive strength has no impact at all. This system is basically a "more dice rolls" version of the Axis & Allies combat system (both games share the same designer).
Great video guys
Should give Imperial Border a shot. I'm pretty hyped for that 👍🏻
Lol 😄 You can't fight in here! This is the war room! 😄
The map isn’t really that much bigger than A&A Global. It’s 42” diameter and fits on most dinningroom tables. Won’t fit on a single foldout church table, but would easily on two.
Thanks so much for this. It's taken this game from, "Maybe I'll try and talk my convention group into it," to "I might have to insist." I'm _a little_ disappointed to find out the command sticks seemed more like a gimmick than something practical. I wonder if just using them and getting some practice at it would make them more useful?
Oh, and I wanted to note that there is a _very affordable_ 2nd Edition upgrade kit available from Nightingale Games for owners of the 1st Edition.
Perhaps, but the reality is the stacks and areas are all pretty accessible and reasonably within reach.
I also agree that aircraft carriers are underpowered. If you want to use house rules you can easily fix it by giving aircraft carriers an additional fighter or a bomber.
Loved this video you made and the game
In the game war room, how many air movement points from Madagascar to the Horn of Africa
Three, moving from the island to I4 takes one move.
So you'd have to write your order to a zone within two steps from B7 (Horn of Afrika).
So either B8 or seazone I3, I4 or I6. And afterwards you can indeed move to B7 or change your mind and move up to two zones elsewhere.
You might find yourself in battle if others move there.
Has anyone created a 1939 or 1940 starting scenario like people did in A&A games? I'd be very interested in that.
I haven't played yet but I get your point in the carriers only having one aircraft. But as mentioned they don't need an order and you get a free one every round. You don't have to invest in planes like you do in A&A. They probably aren't worth investing to much in but as long as they stay alive thats free value every round. Of course it can cause you stress points though unfortunately if it is killed.
I have a question about combat. The rules say to take turns rolling batches of 10. I get that it makes a difference rolling 10 and assigning hits before rolling another 10 rather than rolling 20 and having perfect information on what you can assign hits to. But do you really need to alternate? Is it just because the rules say to have each side roll 10, and then remove the hotspot marker that indicated 10 dice? Or is there another reason I am missing?
EDIT: Rereading the rules subs will dive after sets of 10 are rolled and they are damaged. Is that the only other thing that would really matter?
Awsome game. Sold my first KS edition on ebay (what was a fault) but thinking about getting 2nd edition next year. Unfortunate my gaming "group" consists of only me and a friend of mine...
How would you rebalance Battleships and Aircraft Carriers if it were up to you? 1 less HP?
Also black and white results work when NONE of the sides have force advantage, the only way black and white results are misses if one side HAS the advantage and the other doesn't.
I love the shelves in the back, where did you get them?
These shelves are Kallax from Ikea. There's cheaper versions from Walmart (better homes and goods, brand, or something like that)
@@ThePlayersAid One caveat to the Walmart shelves, they are slightly smaller which can be a problem for things designed for Kallax dimensions, like the Too Many Bones Trove Chest for instance.
War Room: it refers to the postgame discussion LOL.
Do you ever get into fights at the table?
You can't fight in here, this is the WAR ROOM!
wish i knew 4 other gamers
If Super-Bombers existed that is how you bring Washington to heel. Germany needs the Red Skull and Hydra. We need the War Room: Hydra expansion, or call it Man in the High Castle: War Room expansion.
When talking about China you mentioned "I would never play 7 players" but is this game not 1-6 players ref. BGG and the Kickstarter? I do how ever see that there are 7 countries tho, if so what country is meant not to be played?
China technically can be played by a 7th player, and there are groups that have done it, but I would not recommend it. I think officially it's a 1-6 person game, but people have tried it.
Ok, thank you for your quick reply
Battle ship if you added another color, so Red + One additional color, so how about Red + White or Red + Blue? Correct, Carriers should have at least 2 respawnable Fighters so if you kill one it respawns for free or Cheap, so if a normal plane cost X, then reduce the cost. Axis and Allies that cost was 12, so I'd say cost 3 to regenerate a new Fighter on Carrier. Something like that. But if the RAW for war room game is 1 fighter you can always respawn free that is nice but it should be 2 Fighters.
You can't tell me you know how to play all of the games behind you.
Of the ones that you can see in this video 11 are unplayed, but of those 11 a couple are series games that I know how to play, so really only 9! The other shelf you can't see off camera is more like 50/50.
Disagree I think US can focus all 8 or 9 orders on Pacific theatre for the first couple turns at least or more, and maybe make one order or two in European theatre. Mostly it is only US in Pacific, though UK has some, and maybe Russia to a limited extent.
I'd say 12 orders for factions, 6 for Italy, 3 for China, and China is always paired with US player so really 9 + 6 can RAW be in the game for US/China player, but 12 + 3 = 15. Another idea is each nation has different orders. US 12, UK 12, Russia 10, Germany 14 or Japan 14, China 3, maybe Italy 5. I would play around with it, but those are possible changes to consider if you go down that road, but obviously RAW is fine as you all face the same limitation. It also limited nations like the US. You have a lot of resources, but that 9 order limit means YOUR choices as a player MATTER, and so it is not how many orders you have but how well you execute the potential of those orders. Like it is not the size that matters but how you use it so to speak.
Carry a Big Stick and speak Softly put another way.
If Britain and China move together on SEAsia, the Japanese woll have a tougher time of it to the point where their oil in the Dutch islands are threatened.
As always, really appreciate all your work and reviews. You helped me to make up my mind and not to get this one - whilst I appreciate some design ideas (custom dice and unit stance), the movement phase at this scale should be far less chaotic, and BBs being stronger then CVs sound like a very odd design choice for WW2
Hmm... I like programmed movement (like Gunslinger, RoboRally) ... mistakes are part of the fun.
But does it really work for a grand strategic game? ... I mean ... How many generals in history have invaded the wrong country (Not counting GW)
What does that actually simulate?
Looks like you need to get yourself a bigger table. Then buy the larger neoprene map, sold by the publisher separately!
... I guess you - got 2 have - a war-room - to play - War-Room ... ;) 6 Players ?? > command-bunker needed ?? ;) cool game though :)
Just the map alone is intimidating.
Larry must have size 13 shoes
I think Washington would only be capturable by the Japanese. Germany is so much more likely to go after London
It's Axis and Allies on steriods.
It's Axis & Allies with a lot more d12 thrown into the mix.
I did like the video but i have to make fun of this line around minute 14
Japan: "My oil was so well protected as it was historically"
ummmm.... No. The USA hap tremendous submarine convoy destroying success. by 1944 the high command was planning on what they were going to do with each boat that came in. Even in the 1930s they were running out of oil. then never had enough oil, never had even close to enough. It is good that it is not historical, cuz then japan would never have a chance!
I’m so torn. It’s a lot of money for a game that would only hit the table once a year but it also seems like the kind of game you should for that once a year event. I wish it wasn’t so HUGE and expensive. I could fit 7 other games on my shelf instead of this and costs as mich as three GMT games (including shipping). I’ve backed it for now but really do not now if I will go through it. Damn it! Wish I had a friend that’d buy it
If you have a group of players you'll play it with try to get them to chip in!
The game box is only 6" tall. So when stood on it's end, on a top shelf, let's say, it takes up only 6" of shelf space. Thus you still have room for six of those seven games that you were worried wouldn't fit. :)
@@ThePlayersAid Yep! And then watch the group dissolve into bedlam when they fight over who gets to keep the game at their house.
The China player gets a benefit but no one else gets they get to officially eat Chinese food while they're playing nobody else can do that they're not allow it to part of the rules and you can't eat Japanese food either well maybe unless you're the Japanese player and then you can but nobody else can eat those kinds of foods why you play
Bizarre that you say the game takes 18 to 30 hours and the kickstarter page says 1 to 2 hours, how could they ever come to those low numbers
I’m BGG it says 2-6 hours. We play slow but that game cannot be played faster than say 8-10 hours. One of the intro scenarios is the East Front and that may take 2-4 hours.
STICKERS (._.)
I appreciate your work, but come on: over an hour? No. These reviews seem to get longer and longer lately.
Too big a game to just do a cursory 30 minutes. Showing the board with some moves and actions was nearly 30 minutes. Our first thoughts video was around 20 minutes.
I guess you’ve never watched a Calandale video? An hour is a short intro by his standard, lol. Keep it up, TPA.
Then don't watch and go away, you are rude
@@ThePlayersAid bro.... Don't even give these comments a response, I love the content, the longer the better! Keep it up broskys!
Did you forget to hit shift while typing that colon? Innit that supposed to be a semicolon?