Not the collab I thought I'd ever see but holy hell fun. Also: Crinacle, dude, fountain pens are as much about tactility and sound as all the others! I went from headphones in like 2010 to fountain pens in 2013 and now mechanical keyboards in 2021 and they're all a pretty cohesive experiential sort of experience. Get yourself a decent Lamy starter pen and have the nib customised to see what it's about :P
it's much worse if you're in both hobbies.. every 3 months I contemplate if I'll buy a pack of new switches to try on my keyboard or if I should use that money to get a new pair of chi fi iems that's released. either way my wallet takes a hit every time
As someone into all three hobbies, here is my theory: It isn't just sound but those very sensitive to sensation overall. The biggest thing you pay for with an expensive pen is a pleasurable sensation of writing (how wet is the flow, how smooth, how much feedback, how flexible). Audiophiles love the sense of sound, pens love tactility, and keyboards bridge that gap for those that love both. I would wager that hypersensitive folk (common in ADHD, autism spectrum, and anxiety) are over represented in these hobbies, and I bet a lot of them also enjoy high-end photography/cinema gear for the same reason.
I happen to be a connisouir of all of these. 😁. I love my fountain pens, custom keyboard (only made 1), have two full audiophile setups that I love, and have a lot of photography and videography gear. The only one that has given returns though is my photography/videography gear which I do part-time during college and it's becoming a great source of income.
As someone with ADHD, a very expensive audio equipment hobby, a too expensive keyboard hobby, and a very large set of Fuji X bodies and lenses (along with a dozen 35mm film rangefinder cameras and film that I develop myself), I feel both seen and called out lol Pens, these days I use a Lamy fountain-pen style stylus for my Boox e-ink tablet :)
this explains wayyyyy too much... I also have ADHD and am a connoisseur of photography (mostly film, which probably further validates your point lol), audio equipment, and keyboards.
This was really refreshing to hear someone who seems very in tune with a collector space like audiophile gear to say you don't need to go to the highest end and actually acknowledge the diminishing returns. I'm also into photography, and cameras and lenses have a similar problem but very few creators ever acknowledge that it's not necessary.
If the camera ecosystem were like the audiophile ecosystem, we'd have Leica making their cameras out of a single block of marble, Sony using pure sapphire for their G-master lenses etc, oh and the HDMI cables that link your camera to the monitor would be idk, 8N-OCC-silver-bullshit-whatever plated for the most premium video signal Gotta admit though, the audio side has its bang for buck stuff like moondrop, which in camera-land you totally don't get any of at all.
I tried to get into camera hobby because I'm really into photography but gave up right away with people talking about "budget" cameras and showing straight up thousand dollar ones... never searched about cameras again and I keep taking pictures with my phone lol
@@StevenAPK Well, the best camera is the one you take with you. Besides, most new cameras with phat price tags are needlessly fancy for most hobbyists. Just stick to a basic old used mirrorless and a couple of budget Chinese manual lenses and itll produce some impressive photos.
"The overlap is mechanical keyboards, audiophile and fountain pens" Me writing this with my phantom techware 87 while wearing M40x with my 58x and SHP9600 flanking me while my Lamy Safari lays on my desk with a bottle of Carbon black ink and the just delivered converter
I'm a hifi+fountain pen fool, and I think fountain pens are partially in the audio space too, because the different nibs (tips) make different sounds when you write and also there's just a certain comfort in having a proper high quality writing tool that writes a bit more smoothly and freely than the regular "freebie" ballpoint pen. also you can buy different colored inks that are really pretty yo write with
@@Daniel-dj7fh Honestly, my Lamy Al-Star is one of my most reliable workhorse pens. (It's the same design as the Safari, but in aluminium.) And while I know it's definitely more expensive, the TWSBI Eco is my second workhorse pen -- it writes beautifully, has a great ink capacity, is easy to disassemble for cleaning, etc. If you're willing to save up for a bit longer, it's well worth the price imo! (I also use Kaweco Sports, which I personally love but sometimes have issues with hard-starting with one of my nibs. My Kaweco Brass Sport is my EDC, and one of my hands down fave pens, but is definitely not on the cheaper end...) Alternatively, Goulet Pens have posted some good vids of pens on a budget; I highly recommend checking those out too!
Haha, nice meetup. As someone belonging to both camps, this is my theory: I think what keyboard fans and headphone fans have in common is the interest in fine details, quality/ergonomic "anything" in general. For me it expands to other areas, like Mice, Shoes, anything you name it, except pens :P . BUT I'm not a hoarder by nature, I don't necesarily want to own more than 1-2 good pair of something, HOWEVER because of bs-marketing all around us, it is very difficult to find the real gems in each category, therefeore it is often a journey until I find what best fits. Betty and Crinacle are both very helpful in finding some shortcuts and therefore saving time and money at least in avoiding nonsense.
@@3nertia keyboard community hates clickies for mostly the same reason audiophiles hate heavy v-shaped, bass boosted, clipping earphones. They sell a lot because they're superficially very impressive to people new to the hobby that don't have a trained taste or sense yet, are what most comercial brands push in their products and are preferred by the same reasons enthusiasts hate them
I think for keyboards the appeal is partially that it's *not* mass produced. It makes your setup more unique. Also what you say about what connects the audiophile space and the keyboard space I think it's simply that we are confronted every day with audio and lots of us have to sit in front of a keyboard all day. Both of these should be as pleasant as possible, imo
I think the link between all three hobbies is the chase for the perfect "expirience" audiophiles look for the perfect audio experience, keyboard hobbyists look for the perfect typing expensive, and fountain pen collectors look for the perfect writing experience, so I think that desire for the perfect expirience is what links them together and why's there is so much overlap
Yo, I thought I was crazy. But I am literally a collector of keyboards, headphones, and fountain pens. My theory is, I value tools with form and function, and I like exploring the best features/items which serve these functions. There’s also a lot of aspects to each of these hobbies, so there’s a lot to learn and customize. So much money and time is sunk into these hobbies.
once you sit with your endgame you don't spend that much, got an used HD800 modded with SDR for 800€ 2 years ago, never spent another euro in the hobby
@@kloningankumain4802 It's like anything else that's got an enthusiast level. There's always a sweet spot where you can go higher but choosing to go higher sees costs climbing for minimal gains. It's like how a cheap sedan vs a sports car, vs a race car, vs a super car. Each performance level is going to increase more and more and the percentage of performance improvement is going to go down and down.
@@Loleyke actually that is not the case in here, there is a lot product release every year, and the problem is, it's not about which one better than HD800, but it is more about curiosity what character they produce,
Camp, Audiophile keyboard fountain pen here. My theory is that we enjoy simple things done to perfection or at least a level that your average person doesn't experience. Most people use the keyboard that came with a PC, free bic pens they found in their couch, and the headphones that came with their device. I enjoy the craftsmanship and seeing how a person/company can take something simple and make it something wonderful. It carries through to other facets of my hobbies, personal motto: "Anything worth doing is worth overdoing!"
to go to the fountain pen point, what you are realising here is that all these hobbies are linked with and thats feeling, we want the best feeling and interactions with what we are doing. A nice set of headphones is a nice way to interact with the content we consume and the keyboards are the same, a nice tool for our pcs. same goes with fountain pens, great tool for writing experience.
As someone who participates in all three hobbies I like the tinkering aspect of it, whether it be lubing switches, pad rolling, or nib swapping it gives me something to play with trying out different pieces to find out what I like best or what works better.
Keyboards+audiophiles+fountain pens. It's sensory feedback in general, I suspect. The distinctive feel of a good pen on paper, the satisfying sound and feel of a good keyboard, and the sound of good audio equipment. That's my guess.
Huh, so fountain pens also go deep in this way? I have exclusively used fountain pens since I knew the difference and prefer them over even supposedly good ballpoints. But my most expensive one was €12 and currently my primary one is €2,50, which served me well for the past 3 years. I avoid using any other kind of pen or pencil because I hate how those feel, even mechanical pencils. So is there a benefit in looking at higher end ones or should I just stick to what I consider good to not be caught in another expensive hobby?
@@jrp335 aah makes sense. I'll stick to my cheap pen on whatever paper is available as I barely write but type way more and often use a (smooth surface) drawing tablet instead.
Great collab! Over the last few years during the pandemic, I spent soo much into these hobbies ahaha. The lockdown was especially hard for me since you had to stay inside and work from home. Everyday felt the same. Today, I have 5 keyboards, 6 headphones, 3 iems, 2 speakers sets, and a dac/am setup… Sure, I love collecting and some may see this as horrible investments. However, I use all of these interchangeably every day. Each headphone and keyboard I own sound, feel and look different. Some might argue that people in these hobbies are very materialistic, but its all subjective. Then again, it does make everyday feel a bit better and different to me.
the deadly thing that both hobbies have is once you try the expensive stuff (like $1000 headphones or a $1000 keyboard) you will never want to go back to your cheap stuff.
Drop artificially created the overlap between mech keys/audiophiles/fountain pens during the massdrop days and massdrop was on every youtube channel. If I remember correctly there was also the geek art/collectibles space as well as every day carry and vaping spaces as well when it was in it's heyday.
This needs to be waaaaayyy higher since this is it. There might be something slightly more deeper than that of people liking high quality sensory stimulating items. But in the last 10 years or so drop could pretty much be the root cause of it.
Two of my faves! Crin has long been one of my go to's when sanity checking some of my reviews, but I only buy a keyboard when Betty ok's it. Great colab!
I'm coming from the other way. I was big in DIY audio before getting into keyboards. While audio can get really expensive, anything I see is usually available. Not the case with keyboards. I'll see something that looks nice and it's a group buy I need to wait a year for. Both for the case and the keycaps
Nice video Betty! my dad is always saying that my keyboard hobby is really costly and then he puts sooo much money into his headphones and speakers, (he as spent bout 3000$ +) XD. I can aprecciate your content as it has made me appriciate this sound prerifirals hobby more.
Really nice to see this mashup from 2 of the most adictive and informative channels i met on the covid isolation time. All recognition and succes to both of you!
As someone whove been in the audio hobby for almost 8 years i can say you that the sweet spot in terms of in ear monitors are $1000. Summit fi ($3000+) often comes with rather poor return of investment (as what ive experienced with selling my sub $3000 for just $300 due to driver imbalance/issues). Though ive since been on hiatus with the hobby my current rotation stands with 4 sub $1000 iems (each costing $1.2k, $1.8k, 1.6k and $1.1k) my dap is also north $1k (@ $1.2k). Those are the iems alone, cables... cables are a whole nother story. I have custom cables made for each of my iems costing ($1k, $799, $500 and $200 being the cheapest). Its a fun hobby I'll tell you that but man it has made my wallet certainly dry I'm just glad ive attained contentment. Edit: grammar
Great surprise video, Betty. Sennheiser headphones are top notch.There is no replacement for great audio! A lot of people will get into DAC setups with headphones and/or speakers for their PCs. That still wasn't enough for me. I'm the PC guy that actually has a Yamaha surround receiver, 4 Polk Audio S20 Signature Series speakers, and a BIC America P12 subwoofer connected to my PC through HDMI. Long story made short, it's enough to p*ss off my neighbors when necessary. Incredible highs and mids, along with foundation shaking lows, all with excellent clarity.
I got called out when crinacle mentioned the holy trinity of spending a lot of money are the keyboard, audiophile and fountain pen communities. So my take on the link on the three are the feel and customisability. For fountain pens we collect them due how they feel in hand and how they feel writing. Also with how different inks look and their properties. Mech keeb community would be also the same, the feel and sound of the switches, case and keycap together. Coupled with the fact that you can make the keyboard feel and sound how you like. Audiophile would be cause of how different people prefer different sounds, the fit of the headphones/IEM. Also coupled with the variety of aftermarket cables and earpads, DAC and amps.
@@haberdasherrykr8886 Agreed, these are great headphones. I went super deep and spent a crap ton on audio gear. Once you find something you like, just enjoy it. That's what it's all about right?
I love fountain pens, or stationary in general and consider myself an audioenthusiast. My personal crossover comes from drawing/ painting and art making in general and listening to music while creating. Now in a artslump I'm chasing the gear to improve my auditory and drawing feel experience to cope with my unproductivity
Great discussion about how these two hobbies/communities intersect by some great content creators :) I've been into computers and audio (heavy emphasis on portable audio) essentially my whole life. When I was younger, I was just enjoying what I had and as I slowly learned more about things as I got older and experienced more stuff, there was a point where I said to myself "maybe there's more to improve on with these things I don't think about as much". For headphones and other audio stuff, I was already into portable gear (I went from tape/CD walkmen to MD to DAPs) but there was a point when I realized I could get additional and potentially better earbuds/IEMs than the ones that came with my the player. Once I tested a few 'budget' options for the time (2009-2010) I quickly went further into IEMs and then started to consider full sized headphones to upgrade from. I was fortunate to have PortaPros for many years prior, since the mid 90s, so I had a stable foundation but I still gravitated to earbuds and later IEMs for out-and-about due to better isolation. 2012-present has seen shuffling between many headphones/IEMs constantly, trying new things, with currently resting on HD600 and a modified FX01 as my daily drivers, but between buying/selling and meetups I've tried virtually everything outside of cIEMs. I also have Stax SR404LE and a DIY amp for special occasions. Speaking of, a sub-hobby spawned off this where a small group of friends started to build project amps/dacs/cables and still do to this day, including some of our own designs, and my desktop setup aside from a modified HD600 is entirely DIY at this point. Crin hates tubes, but I like to switch around between them and SS depending what I'm listening to. Since this is a keeb channel, lets focus more on that. This happened to me for keyboards right after I fully upgrade my computer, again late 2000s/early 2010s, where I thought "what else can I upgrade or improve upon at this stage". Ah, I see people with nicer keyboards online...maybe that's where I go next. My parents worked in a hospital and my dad managed to bring home a NIB Cherry G80-11900 (PCB mount MX Black, similar to an 1800 layout but had a trackpad built in). That started me down the path of finding GH and DT forums after noticing an ergonomic difference with the Cherry switches and 'would you like to know more?' haha. I was active then prior to the Cherry MX patent expiring, so it was mostly vintage stuff and up-and-coming brands like Filco, Ducky and Leopold at the forefront using new production Cherry switches...aside from ALPS boards or buckling spring for the hardcore operators, and the coveted Realforce/HHKB (for those into that style). I think there were other switch types/brands then (MX inspired stuff that was cheap, ALPS knockoffs, etc.) but I never tried any of those, just the usual suspects of the era. I obtained and traded many vintage Cherry and IBM boards, my favorites of all time being the G80-2100HDU and Model M Space Saver with the bolt mod. I never have gotten my fingies on an old IBM beam spring board (yet) and have only seen them behind glass, but apparently they're god-tier tactile...though I am a linear switch guy from the beginning. Once 60%/75% boards were becoming a common thing, around when the Poker released, I had gotten on the GH60 prototype to provide feedback and still have one of those as my travel board as well as the budget king of the time, a QFR. That was my then endgame daily - despite the Costar stabs (which are a pain when doing maintenance but fine otherwise) I heavily modified it with vintage MX Black plate mount switches, thick PBT dyesub keycaps, an original red Cherry ESC (I keep this on every daily), a Frosty Flake controller and various case damping (as I was damping everything from headphones, speakers, and turntables at that time to tune sound and work out resonances). Custom keycaps were the up-and-coming thing with SP and some others trying to replicate cherry profile and legends with doubleshots and dyesubs (again prior to patents expiring and GMK). I used the QFR daily for about 8 years straight - compared to a nice option today, it's pretty unrefined but I still love it. Enter modern times, with the massive variety of MX clones and customs with 'exotic' options and materials that far exceed the prior era IMO. Such high levels of refinement and many options, it's simply great. I had a little catching up to do and to narrow down where to pick back up, but it further cemented why I loved tinkering and these hobbies...but it's the customization on top of perfecting what is ideal for your preference (within your budget) and just enjoying the interaction with the keyboard itself, as well as the community, that makes it truly special. Fortunately I have at least one IRL friend that geeks out over custom keyboards but I'm always glad for those that go way deeper into it like Switch and Click ^-^ Cheers!
building my first keyboard rigth now, your videos really helped me to find what i want I hope I dont get addicted to keyboards..... I don't have money for that
Coming into keyboards as an audiophile I was like, damn this hobby is cheap. I can have more than ONE set of keyboard and still like half price of my headphone?
as a fountain pen person: it is about sound in some aspects. the sound of a smooth nib going over paper is so satisfying. even your handwriting is barely legible chicken scratch like mine.
I've been falling into the fishkeeping hobby and I gotta say that salt water keepers is where the BIG BUCKS are. You can buy tiny frags of one coral for easily thousands of dollars. Every hobby gets expensive if you got deep enough. Also I'd argue that the fountain pen hobby crosses over into mech keyboards because it's about textures and experiences with touch.
I've been into good keyboards and headphones since the 90s. I still daily drive Model M :D The headphones in the 90s were really really bad, keyboards were awesome. You could find alps keyboards and model ms that nobody wanted. Now the headphones and amplifiers are absolutely amazing, while the keyboard people are sticking painter tape on the back of PCBs. Custom keyboards with mx switches and group buys is barely moving forward. The biggest innovation with keyboards has been swappable sockets, rgb and 150 variations of mx browns.
I know the distance is a problem (Singapore vs US) but it would be interesting to see a collab for each building a system for the other with same amount of money.
i just purchased a new turntable and after doing some research, i could imagine turntables being a hobby on the level of keyboards and headphones. like imagine "custom" turntables that you can mod to improve sound. many switchable parts from the plate the spins your vinyl around to the cartridge to the preamp.
As far as expensive hobbies go, custom keyboards are very affordable and accessible. From personal experience I can tell you that there are far deeper cash holes you can go down - Cameras, watches, fountain pens and bikes to name a few!
haha its funny how you brought up fountain pens because im into all 3 (keyboard,pen,headphone). for me it has to do with the fact that most people interact with those 3 things on very surface levels so its fun to see how far the rabbit hole goes on seemingly mundane objects. also there is something about all 3 that tickles a part of my brain that just finds them satisfying.
Fountain pens have a nice sound when they write. But they also just feel really nice. It's... Probably all a push away from disposable utility, into quality and personalized. Different fountain nibs, paper, ink, etc, have the same customized effects as like switches and PCBs etc probably. It's also a bit of a push to analog and anachronisms slightly.
I think the relation between the two isn't just exclusive to these few hobbies, I think a lot of hobbies share similarities. I am a car enthusiast and there is a certain level of feedback that I want from a car when driving and I also want a certain sound too. This can apply to watches, cameras, and other hobbies as well.
I think a couple things that link the keyboard and audiophile communities is proximity and 'finer tastes'. Audio stuff and keyboards can be both readily used at a desktop pc or within an entertainment room. By 'finer tastes' I mean just generally having better than the stock and immediate aftermarket. There's Razer, HyperX, SteelSeries, and all those other companies, but their products are kinda sold as a whole item and really the only replaceable things are switches and keycaps, and those usually stick to a single profile type.
I have been playing with headphones for a while and just got into mechanical keyboard world, tbh, my first impression was: huh, it's not very expensive to get to the top range of set up, good. XD
Same for me...except: This is nice, but I don't like the cable. Detachable cable is awesome, but what if I want to sit over there? I like the convenience of wireless, but what about latency? One is nice, but I have two computers. I upgraded mine at work and now the one at home sucks. I need another. I just bought one on DROP, but it won't arrive for another 8 months, so I'll buy another for now.
One set of headphones I have is more than I've ever spent on keyboards. I've spent more on vinyl, turntables and cartridges than headphones. It's a deep deep hole.
Id say the overlap goes deeper than just keyboards, headphones, and pens. Things like watches and knives are in the same as pens so really its pens, keyboards, headphones, watches, and knives (maybe). I think it’s because these hobbies prioritize a high quality experience that may have been lost to time and that have a “mechanical” aspect and a serious modding community that seeks to improve and create new things to enjoy.
I think the connection between keyboards, headphones and fountain pens is that they're all chasing a feeling/sensation and are willing to spend ludicrous amounts of money for it.
i think what is related with keyboards and audio is that newer isn't really better. For computer components, keyboards are the one part that you don't need to worry about getting displaced by new tech. If you have a keyboard you like from the 80s, you can still use it now. This encourages investing the maximum you can because it's going to last a long time and is the one component you carry with you to your next computer setup. Audio is similar. Lots of people have vintage speakers and amplifiers from the 70s that they absolutely love. While there are some good and interesting things coming out now, some of the best items ever made are decades old. like the LS3/5 speakers originally built for BBC studios
A used version of a given headphone will usally be around 60-80% of the original price depending on completeness and actual wear/condition because good headphones stay good forever if you take care of them unlike say consoles or pc components or tvs or even keyboards, which have a designated lifetime on the switches. Broken cables can be switched out, for popular headphones there will always be replacement pads and "depending on the model model" headbands so the parts that actually wear out can always be replaced. You can either resell the headphones if you decide to quit the hobby or just get rid of a couple you are unlikely to use anymore and get a good chunk of money back compared to other electronics or just keep them and use them for the rest of your life really I mean, I expect my HD660S to work in 30, 40 years still and if they do they will sound just as lovely so fuckit For me, the audiophile hobby is truly a "buy once keep forever" type deal and I can comfortably say that I have reached my endgame with the eqiupment I have rn because I have reached the point I wanted to. People tend to forget what got them into these expensive hobbys in the first place, either you set fixed goals or you will be spending more and more with time with more and more diminishing returns. People tend to forget that really lovely audio stuff is there for you to enjoy the music in a way basic stuff just can't do and with all the technicalities and marginal improvements there are people tend to fall into "chasing that dragon" and I hate to see it happen because truly enjoying what you have kinda gets lost on the way.
This is super interesting to watch Betty! It would be awesome to see you collab with DankPods for another discussion on the audiophile and keyboard world! Love your videos and hope you stay safe :D
As an audio enthusiast, I've hit about as far as I want to go in headphones and have turned to keyboards as a cheaper alternative to scratch the tech itch. Tbh keyboards sound expensive but headfi boggles the mind especially when you see stuff like the Sennhieser Orpheus lol.
The link is Consumerism. None of all those items are either rare, precious or wear and tear. There's no excuse for hoarding them except to fill an empty void in your heart.
While scrolling these comments, I was thinking that all of this pointless customization and consumption is indicative of a clear purpose in life, perhaps lack of a spiritual center or other guiding force. In an attempt to fill that void, which people can sense if they can’t exactly articulate, they spend the money they spend their time to earn.
I’m come to notice that a lot of us are in the same hobbies. I’ve noticed that watches, knives, guns, pens, headphones, keyboards, mice, and more have a lot of the same members within these communities. I almost always see a cool knife opening up packages in all the different hobbies I mentioned, for example.
Comparing the Model F, Box Jades, and the newer ZealPC Clickiez, i think the Clickiez completely replace the Box Jades in terms of the best modern clicky switch. The Model F is worth it, but for daily usage I would still recommend a nice custom with the ZealPC Clickiez. Haven't tried alps, so I can't comment there. Honestly I just wish we had more variety, seems like every new switch is either linear or tactile, which is just a bit sad, boosting the most boring type of switches.
I think the overlap is the same as people who spend a lot on, ergo chairs. It's something that you will probably use often and can be very very very personal in what you decide you want.
As an enthusiast enthusiast, I'm pleasantly surprised that this collab happened; although it's making me realize the unlikelyhood of another crossover like a DBK x Urban Gentry collab. Too bad the thumbnail doesn't do enough to bait the crin crowd. Actually makes me kinda curious as to whether Betty will actually put some money down on a Crin collab IEM or not?
Being a fairly active in both hobbies - I think keyboards are definitely a more expensive hobby (by a long shot). Even barrier to entry is much more - you can’t possibly get a decent ckb for under $200 - meanwhile you can get good midrange headphones/IEMs for that price
A couple of things here... Barrier of entry VS what you need to spend for "endgame". $200 is also NOT midrange, midrange is around $700 to 1k now for headphones. All the popular keyboard people I've watched here have praised and recommended keyboards at around $80 too, which is around the price of the most recommended budget IEM. You're also doing keyboard vs specifically headphones/IEMs (should add speakers here too). Audio, if we're doing it properly, would also at least include your amp and DAC.
Super Love it. Electronic DIY could be a good place to start. From there I know what is Audiophile, Mechanical Keyboard. It starting from viewing switches to find Holy Grail Switch, and then start collecting different kind switches, tactile/linear/click, manufactures, brands, material types, lubes, etc. Compare to my other hobby like Rubik (related to the same thing, namely asmr, smoothness and lube), I find expenses magnitude is 10x higher. Not to mention I just deal with switches centric only (or yet), not yet with layouts, and casing upgrades. Knowing other hobby less expensive does not make me stop. Knowing other hobby more expensive does not make me relief. To EndGame this Holy Grail search, I think for right now I just satisfy my self with viewing switches comparison, and find a way to save money for my dream keyboard (cyberboard), and also find a way to tell my wive about the price.
As someone who has spent a significant amount of money on both keyboards and audiophile equipment, there's no one solution for everyone. I personally have found that I enjoy the extra benefits of going the high route and dropping unimaginable wads of cash on the hobbies. But to date, the most memorable and note-worthy typing and listening experiences I've had are with a pair of cheap Apple earphones and the older MacBook keyboards. No amount of money can bring back the enjoyment factor and literal years of usage I had with both products, but I know it's different for everyone.
Oh my, I'm into Headphones, IEM's, Speakers, Vinyl and recently got into mechanical keyboards. Started out with Tecware Phantom TKL, but Outemu switches started to die on me and I wanted something smaller as I would hit the keyboard with mouse when gaming (low sens). Now I have Epomaker EP84 and waiting for Milky Yellow switches and a set of new keycaps. Gonna lube and tape the stabs too. Brothers and sisters, I hope our wallets will be blessed to allow us to spend money on those things :D
Wait until y'all hear about custom built lightsabers. Those things range from $80-$3000 depending on build quality, features and overall style. Especially the custom made replicas. My very generic and basic custom built LGT saber was $109 for the base saber,then a electronics upgrade (Proffie Core V2) which came with a Neopixel Blade (has neopixel led's inside the blade) for $219.99) then I plan on eventually buying a covertec wheel adapter (screws on the pommel of the saber) which is $9.99 with a covertec belt clip (clips to a belt so you can sheave your saber) which all of these upgrades round my saber up to $239.99. Now that's really cheap for a custom made lightsaber with realistic lighting and sounds. While it's basic in design it works perfectly. Now double the cost of the original saber hilt + the core / blade upgrades / pommels because I'm gonna make my saber Dual-Bladed. Now it's $578. Still on the cheap side of things though. Consistently I see really cool looking sabers go for $300-$2000 with the absolute highest end of all sabers going for $2999.99. Really expensive hobby and most people do it alongside cosplaying as star wars characters or their own original characters and with that the cost to finish their hobby is closer to at least $150 - $1200 for a complete cosplay + their saber's cost. My own cosplay is going to be about $130 and then the total price of my eventually completed lightsaber.
in addition, one critical reason that i spent audio product before any of other hobbies is because of hearing ability loss problem. we human lose our hearing ability as we old and after you losing your hearing ability, there is no way to restore it. so, if you do have some enthusiasm for audio hobbies, you better start early before your ear become useless. it is time limit hobby for sure.
Didnt even think about this until it was compared in this video, but my keyboard build was about 400 and my headphone + dac/amp setup is about 500, so really not too far off from eachother
my wallet cries
u just wanted better headphones
A wallet can’t cry if there’s nothing in it
Not the collab I thought I'd ever see but holy hell fun. Also:
Crinacle, dude, fountain pens are as much about tactility and sound as all the others! I went from headphones in like 2010 to fountain pens in 2013 and now mechanical keyboards in 2021 and they're all a pretty cohesive experiential sort of experience. Get yourself a decent Lamy starter pen and have the nib customised to see what it's about :P
ua-cam.com/users/Chyrosran22
This man loves Alps switches. You'll love his channel
you ever think of doing a dt990 review with all its popularity?
bro I did not expect this collab. Love it when keebs and headphone enthusiast collide lol, we all go broke together.
i know right i never expeccted this i thought it was pc
it's much worse if you're in both hobbies.. every 3 months I contemplate if I'll buy a pack of new switches to try on my keyboard or if I should use that money to get a new pair of chi fi iems that's released. either way my wallet takes a hit every time
I had a feeling since i seen both switch and click and hyppo in his comments
@@yellowcam1422 it's extra wallet sadness being a Car Motorcycle PC Keybored enthusiast
why did you mention me twice?
Crinacle: "You spend money to hear things that other people can't." Betty: "Ok, so you're basically spending money to be crazy." Lol!
I mean on the other end of the table, people spend money to hear clacky clacky noises
As someone into all three hobbies, here is my theory: It isn't just sound but those very sensitive to sensation overall. The biggest thing you pay for with an expensive pen is a pleasurable sensation of writing (how wet is the flow, how smooth, how much feedback, how flexible). Audiophiles love the sense of sound, pens love tactility, and keyboards bridge that gap for those that love both.
I would wager that hypersensitive folk (common in ADHD, autism spectrum, and anxiety) are over represented in these hobbies, and I bet a lot of them also enjoy high-end photography/cinema gear for the same reason.
I happen to be a connisouir of all of these. 😁. I love my fountain pens, custom keyboard (only made 1), have two full audiophile setups that I love, and have a lot of photography and videography gear. The only one that has given returns though is my photography/videography gear which I do part-time during college and it's becoming a great source of income.
please stop being right, i'm feeling a little bit too validated by this
As someone with ADHD, a very expensive audio equipment hobby, a too expensive keyboard hobby, and a very large set of Fuji X bodies and lenses (along with a dozen 35mm film rangefinder cameras and film that I develop myself), I feel both seen and called out lol
Pens, these days I use a Lamy fountain-pen style stylus for my Boox e-ink tablet :)
this explains wayyyyy too much... I also have ADHD and am a connoisseur of photography (mostly film, which probably further validates your point lol), audio equipment, and keyboards.
Did you have to mention pens? Now I want to get a custom pen… how rich do you think I am stop giving me ideas.
This was really refreshing to hear someone who seems very in tune with a collector space like audiophile gear to say you don't need to go to the highest end and actually acknowledge the diminishing returns. I'm also into photography, and cameras and lenses have a similar problem but very few creators ever acknowledge that it's not necessary.
💯🎯
the struggle is real. i own a $2,500 24-70mm 2.8 lens, but almost always use my used $200 85mm 1.8 lens. amounts in USD
If the camera ecosystem were like the audiophile ecosystem, we'd have Leica making their cameras out of a single block of marble, Sony using pure sapphire for their G-master lenses etc, oh and the HDMI cables that link your camera to the monitor would be idk, 8N-OCC-silver-bullshit-whatever plated for the most premium video signal
Gotta admit though, the audio side has its bang for buck stuff like moondrop, which in camera-land you totally don't get any of at all.
I tried to get into camera hobby because I'm really into photography but gave up right away with people talking about "budget" cameras and showing straight up thousand dollar ones... never searched about cameras again and I keep taking pictures with my phone lol
@@StevenAPK Well, the best camera is the one you take with you. Besides, most new cameras with phat price tags are needlessly fancy for most hobbyists. Just stick to a basic old used mirrorless and a couple of budget Chinese manual lenses and itll produce some impressive photos.
"The overlap is mechanical keyboards, audiophile and fountain pens"
Me writing this with my phantom techware 87 while wearing M40x with my 58x and SHP9600 flanking me while my Lamy Safari lays on my desk with a bottle of Carbon black ink and the just delivered converter
fancy mechanical pencils too
I have like 15 FPs 😅😅
if you have a lamy safari, you're nowhere down the rabbit hole
I'm a hifi+fountain pen fool, and I think fountain pens are partially in the audio space too, because the different nibs (tips) make different sounds when you write and also there's just a certain comfort in having a proper high quality writing tool that writes a bit more smoothly and freely than the regular "freebie" ballpoint pen. also you can buy different colored inks that are really pretty yo write with
fountain pen gang rise up!
also the feeling too! I used to be into the space and the flow/nibs you used factored into the smoothness so ig theres some crossover there maybe?
Fountain pens overlap because of tactility and aesthetics. You can really appreciate the feel and the fine details at the same time.
R/mechanicalheadpens is an example of this :)
Fountain pen enjoyer who's been getting into keyboards right here :') My wallet cries but my heart rejoices.
@@RoundSeal I only have the Lamy Safari, anything you could recommend at a similar pricepoint?
@@Daniel-dj7fh Honestly, my Lamy Al-Star is one of my most reliable workhorse pens. (It's the same design as the Safari, but in aluminium.) And while I know it's definitely more expensive, the TWSBI Eco is my second workhorse pen -- it writes beautifully, has a great ink capacity, is easy to disassemble for cleaning, etc. If you're willing to save up for a bit longer, it's well worth the price imo! (I also use Kaweco Sports, which I personally love but sometimes have issues with hard-starting with one of my nibs. My Kaweco Brass Sport is my EDC, and one of my hands down fave pens, but is definitely not on the cheaper end...)
Alternatively, Goulet Pens have posted some good vids of pens on a budget; I highly recommend checking those out too!
@@RoundSeal thanks bruv
Haha, nice meetup. As someone belonging to both camps, this is my theory: I think what keyboard fans and headphone fans have in common is the interest in fine details, quality/ergonomic "anything" in general. For me it expands to other areas, like Mice, Shoes, anything you name it, except pens :P . BUT I'm not a hoarder by nature, I don't necesarily want to own more than 1-2 good pair of something, HOWEVER because of bs-marketing all around us, it is very difficult to find the real gems in each category, therefeore it is often a journey until I find what best fits. Betty and Crinacle are both very helpful in finding some shortcuts and therefore saving time and money at least in avoiding nonsense.
That makes sense & thank you!
Crin saying he loves clickies feels kind of like the equivalent of telling an audiophile you love bass boosted, v-shaped tws
*gaming tws hedphones made by beats or raycon
@@coffeemug1012 lol ikr
unless its thick click jades
Wait, what?
@@3nertia keyboard community hates clickies for mostly the same reason audiophiles hate heavy v-shaped, bass boosted, clipping earphones. They sell a lot because they're superficially very impressive to people new to the hobby that don't have a trained taste or sense yet, are what most comercial brands push in their products and are preferred by the same reasons enthusiasts hate them
I think for keyboards the appeal is partially that it's *not* mass produced. It makes your setup more unique.
Also what you say about what connects the audiophile space and the keyboard space I think it's simply that we are confronted every day with audio and lots of us have to sit in front of a keyboard all day. Both of these should be as pleasant as possible, imo
I think the link between all three hobbies is the chase for the perfect "expirience" audiophiles look for the perfect audio experience, keyboard hobbyists look for the perfect typing expensive, and fountain pen collectors look for the perfect writing experience, so I think that desire for the perfect expirience is what links them together and why's there is so much overlap
Yo, I thought I was crazy. But I am literally a collector of keyboards, headphones, and fountain pens. My theory is, I value tools with form and function, and I like exploring the best features/items which serve these functions. There’s also a lot of aspects to each of these hobbies, so there’s a lot to learn and customize. So much money and time is sunk into these hobbies.
I have spent way too much money on both and can confirm Audio is an extremely expensive hobby.
once you sit with your endgame you don't spend that much, got an used HD800 modded with SDR for 800€ 2 years ago, never spent another euro in the hobby
There lot of chifi out there you just need to join community to know the information. Price to performance ratio
@@kloningankumain4802 It's like anything else that's got an enthusiast level. There's always a sweet spot where you can go higher but choosing to go higher sees costs climbing for minimal gains. It's like how a cheap sedan vs a sports car, vs a race car, vs a super car. Each performance level is going to increase more and more and the percentage of performance improvement is going to go down and down.
@@Loleyke actually that is not the case in here, there is a lot product release every year, and the problem is, it's not about which one better than HD800, but it is more about curiosity what character they produce,
I started my audiophile journey in 2021, now I’ve transition to mechanical keyboards in early 2022. Now this video answers so many question.
Camp, Audiophile keyboard fountain pen here. My theory is that we enjoy simple things done to perfection or at least a level that your average person doesn't experience. Most people use the keyboard that came with a PC, free bic pens they found in their couch, and the headphones that came with their device. I enjoy the craftsmanship and seeing how a person/company can take something simple and make it something wonderful. It carries through to other facets of my hobbies, personal motto: "Anything worth doing is worth overdoing!"
I knew it was crinicl when you said “pretty known these days”. It’s good to see him getting more recognition
As a keyboard enthusiast and an audiophile, I like my empty wallet
lmao F for your wallet-kun
You are my brother lmao
You forgotten PC
I feel safer with no money
being an audiophile and keeb enthusiast i had to compromise... so i sold my house
to go to the fountain pen point, what you are realising here is that all these hobbies are linked with and thats feeling, we want the best feeling and interactions with what we are doing. A nice set of headphones is a nice way to interact with the content we consume and the keyboards are the same, a nice tool for our pcs. same goes with fountain pens, great tool for writing experience.
As someone who participates in all three hobbies I like the tinkering aspect of it, whether it be lubing switches, pad rolling, or nib swapping it gives me something to play with trying out different pieces to find out what I like best or what works better.
Lego collecting is a hobby I have spent so much money on I lost track and probably sacrificed my financial future. But hey, more Lego!
i eat lego with salt
I know the feel.
Money is shit anyway. Good for you. Lego>Money.
Keyboards+audiophiles+fountain pens. It's sensory feedback in general, I suspect. The distinctive feel of a good pen on paper, the satisfying sound and feel of a good keyboard, and the sound of good audio equipment. That's my guess.
My interests over the past year explained
Huh, so fountain pens also go deep in this way?
I have exclusively used fountain pens since I knew the difference and prefer them over even supposedly good ballpoints.
But my most expensive one was €12 and currently my primary one is €2,50, which served me well for the past 3 years.
I avoid using any other kind of pen or pencil because I hate how those feel, even mechanical pencils.
So is there a benefit in looking at higher end ones or should I just stick to what I consider good to not be caught in another expensive hobby?
@@WyvernDotRed the different choices of nibs go way deeper than that. The paper used matters. There are new shades of blue ink being made ever day..
@@jrp335 aah makes sense.
I'll stick to my cheap pen on whatever paper is available as I barely write but type way more and often use a (smooth surface) drawing tablet instead.
Great collab! Over the last few years during the pandemic, I spent soo much into these hobbies ahaha. The lockdown was especially hard for me since you had to stay inside and work from home. Everyday felt the same. Today, I have 5 keyboards, 6 headphones, 3 iems, 2 speakers sets, and a dac/am setup… Sure, I love collecting and some may see this as horrible investments. However, I use all of these interchangeably every day. Each headphone and keyboard I own sound, feel and look different. Some might argue that people in these hobbies are very materialistic, but its all subjective. Then again, it does make everyday feel a bit better and different to me.
Thank you, nice!
the deadly thing that both hobbies have is once you try the expensive stuff (like $1000 headphones or a $1000 keyboard) you will never want to go back to your cheap stuff.
Yup.
Drop artificially created the overlap between mech keys/audiophiles/fountain pens during the massdrop days and massdrop was on every youtube channel. If I remember correctly there was also the geek art/collectibles space as well as every day carry and vaping spaces as well when it was in it's heyday.
This needs to be waaaaayyy higher since this is it. There might be something slightly more deeper than that of people liking high quality sensory stimulating items. But in the last 10 years or so drop could pretty much be the root cause of it.
Two of my faves! Crin has long been one of my go to's when sanity checking some of my reviews, but I only buy a keyboard when Betty ok's it. Great colab!
Nice to see you uploading a variety of content! Crazy to see how far you’ve come!!
Thanks!
I'm coming from the other way. I was big in DIY audio before getting into keyboards. While audio can get really expensive, anything I see is usually available.
Not the case with keyboards. I'll see something that looks nice and it's a group buy I need to wait a year for. Both for the case and the keycaps
My two hobbies in one. This is great
You must be broke
@@nebula6137 things can come in budget....
That was unexpected lol and also it’s good to know that I am not just dumping *that much* money into keyboards 😂
Nice video Betty! my dad is always saying that my keyboard hobby is really costly and then he puts sooo much money into his headphones and speakers, (he as spent bout 3000$ +) XD. I can aprecciate your content as it has made me appriciate this sound prerifirals hobby more.
Lmao
cost to manufacture+r&d and profit margin yeah kb hobby is quite expensive
Really nice to see this mashup from 2 of the most adictive and informative channels i met on the covid isolation time. All recognition and succes to both of you!
Thank you very much!
As someone whove been in the audio hobby for almost 8 years i can say you that the sweet spot in terms of in ear monitors are $1000. Summit fi ($3000+) often comes with rather poor return of investment (as what ive experienced with selling my sub $3000 for just $300 due to driver imbalance/issues). Though ive since been on hiatus with the hobby my current rotation stands with 4 sub $1000 iems (each costing $1.2k, $1.8k, 1.6k and $1.1k) my dap is also north $1k (@ $1.2k). Those are the iems alone, cables... cables are a whole nother story. I have custom cables made for each of my iems costing ($1k, $799, $500 and $200 being the cheapest). Its a fun hobby I'll tell you that but man it has made my wallet certainly dry I'm just glad ive attained contentment.
Edit: grammar
I'm into keyboards, IEMs and fountain pens. I feel personally attacked
Same LOL I'm also into stationary in general like different kinds of paper and pens
Great surprise video, Betty. Sennheiser headphones are top notch.There is no replacement for great audio! A lot of people will get into DAC setups with headphones and/or speakers for their PCs. That still wasn't enough for me. I'm the PC guy that actually has a Yamaha surround receiver, 4 Polk Audio S20 Signature Series speakers, and a BIC America P12 subwoofer connected to my PC through HDMI. Long story made short, it's enough to p*ss off my neighbors when necessary. Incredible highs and mids, along with foundation shaking lows, all with excellent clarity.
thank you!
I got called out when crinacle mentioned the holy trinity of spending a lot of money are the keyboard, audiophile and fountain pen communities. So my take on the link on the three are the feel and customisability.
For fountain pens we collect them due how they feel in hand and how they feel writing. Also with how different inks look and their properties.
Mech keeb community would be also the same, the feel and sound of the switches, case and keycap together. Coupled with the fact that you can make the keyboard feel and sound how you like.
Audiophile would be cause of how different people prefer different sounds, the fit of the headphones/IEM. Also coupled with the variety of aftermarket cables and earpads, DAC and amps.
Yeah... not diving in audio anytime soon. Got my philips sp9500. Perfectly happy. From what I learned in the keeb rabbit hole, ignorance is bliss.
I will reinforce your decision and say shp9500 are sufficiently capable
And if you like them enjoy them
No need to spend more
Just forget about fomo
@@haberdasherrykr8886 Agreed, these are great headphones. I went super deep and spent a crap ton on audio gear. Once you find something you like, just enjoy it. That's what it's all about right?
i heard of crinacle from dankpods, i didnt expect to see a video about him in this channel. very fascinating
I love fountain pens, or stationary in general and consider myself an audioenthusiast.
My personal crossover comes from drawing/ painting and art making in general and listening to music while creating. Now in a artslump I'm chasing the gear to improve my auditory and drawing feel experience to cope with my unproductivity
Man, if he went into the turntable space as well, the Audiophile hobby can easily reach $100k+ there's a lot of snake oil for turntables too.
Great discussion about how these two hobbies/communities intersect by some great content creators :) I've been into computers and audio (heavy emphasis on portable audio) essentially my whole life. When I was younger, I was just enjoying what I had and as I slowly learned more about things as I got older and experienced more stuff, there was a point where I said to myself "maybe there's more to improve on with these things I don't think about as much".
For headphones and other audio stuff, I was already into portable gear (I went from tape/CD walkmen to MD to DAPs) but there was a point when I realized I could get additional and potentially better earbuds/IEMs than the ones that came with my the player. Once I tested a few 'budget' options for the time (2009-2010) I quickly went further into IEMs and then started to consider full sized headphones to upgrade from. I was fortunate to have PortaPros for many years prior, since the mid 90s, so I had a stable foundation but I still gravitated to earbuds and later IEMs for out-and-about due to better isolation. 2012-present has seen shuffling between many headphones/IEMs constantly, trying new things, with currently resting on HD600 and a modified FX01 as my daily drivers, but between buying/selling and meetups I've tried virtually everything outside of cIEMs. I also have Stax SR404LE and a DIY amp for special occasions. Speaking of, a sub-hobby spawned off this where a small group of friends started to build project amps/dacs/cables and still do to this day, including some of our own designs, and my desktop setup aside from a modified HD600 is entirely DIY at this point. Crin hates tubes, but I like to switch around between them and SS depending what I'm listening to.
Since this is a keeb channel, lets focus more on that. This happened to me for keyboards right after I fully upgrade my computer, again late 2000s/early 2010s, where I thought "what else can I upgrade or improve upon at this stage". Ah, I see people with nicer keyboards online...maybe that's where I go next. My parents worked in a hospital and my dad managed to bring home a NIB Cherry G80-11900 (PCB mount MX Black, similar to an 1800 layout but had a trackpad built in). That started me down the path of finding GH and DT forums after noticing an ergonomic difference with the Cherry switches and 'would you like to know more?' haha. I was active then prior to the Cherry MX patent expiring, so it was mostly vintage stuff and up-and-coming brands like Filco, Ducky and Leopold at the forefront using new production Cherry switches...aside from ALPS boards or buckling spring for the hardcore operators, and the coveted Realforce/HHKB (for those into that style). I think there were other switch types/brands then (MX inspired stuff that was cheap, ALPS knockoffs, etc.) but I never tried any of those, just the usual suspects of the era.
I obtained and traded many vintage Cherry and IBM boards, my favorites of all time being the G80-2100HDU and Model M Space Saver with the bolt mod. I never have gotten my fingies on an old IBM beam spring board (yet) and have only seen them behind glass, but apparently they're god-tier tactile...though I am a linear switch guy from the beginning. Once 60%/75% boards were becoming a common thing, around when the Poker released, I had gotten on the GH60 prototype to provide feedback and still have one of those as my travel board as well as the budget king of the time, a QFR. That was my then endgame daily - despite the Costar stabs (which are a pain when doing maintenance but fine otherwise) I heavily modified it with vintage MX Black plate mount switches, thick PBT dyesub keycaps, an original red Cherry ESC (I keep this on every daily), a Frosty Flake controller and various case damping (as I was damping everything from headphones, speakers, and turntables at that time to tune sound and work out resonances). Custom keycaps were the up-and-coming thing with SP and some others trying to replicate cherry profile and legends with doubleshots and dyesubs (again prior to patents expiring and GMK). I used the QFR daily for about 8 years straight - compared to a nice option today, it's pretty unrefined but I still love it.
Enter modern times, with the massive variety of MX clones and customs with 'exotic' options and materials that far exceed the prior era IMO. Such high levels of refinement and many options, it's simply great. I had a little catching up to do and to narrow down where to pick back up, but it further cemented why I loved tinkering and these hobbies...but it's the customization on top of perfecting what is ideal for your preference (within your budget) and just enjoying the interaction with the keyboard itself, as well as the community, that makes it truly special. Fortunately I have at least one IRL friend that geeks out over custom keyboards but I'm always glad for those that go way deeper into it like Switch and Click ^-^ Cheers!
wow I loved hearing your perspective and history within the hobbies! Glad you enjoy the channel 😄
My guess for fountain pens, it’s in the tactile feel of a good pen on good paper, and the very subtle sound of pen on paper
building my first keyboard rigth now, your videos really helped me to find what i want
I hope I dont get addicted to keyboards..... I don't have money for that
I have been a fountain pen enthusit for about 25 years now. I just started to get into Keebs, retro gaming-- and have played around with audio.
Coming into keyboards as an audiophile I was like, damn this hobby is cheap. I can have more than ONE set of keyboard and still like half price of my headphone?
16:09 Betty does a killer Owen Wilson impression
when crin mentioned fountain pens that caught me so off guard i feel like i just got my mind read LOL
as a fountain pen person: it is about sound in some aspects. the sound of a smooth nib going over paper is so satisfying. even your handwriting is barely legible chicken scratch like mine.
I've been falling into the fishkeeping hobby and I gotta say that salt water keepers is where the BIG BUCKS are. You can buy tiny frags of one coral for easily thousands of dollars. Every hobby gets expensive if you got deep enough.
Also I'd argue that the fountain pen hobby crosses over into mech keyboards because it's about textures and experiences with touch.
OH SNAP! Love both of you! Listening to this on my KZ Crins lol!
Thank you, awesome!
I've been into good keyboards and headphones since the 90s. I still daily drive Model M :D The headphones in the 90s were really really bad, keyboards were awesome. You could find alps keyboards and model ms that nobody wanted. Now the headphones and amplifiers are absolutely amazing, while the keyboard people are sticking painter tape on the back of PCBs. Custom keyboards with mx switches and group buys is barely moving forward. The biggest innovation with keyboards has been swappable sockets, rgb and 150 variations of mx browns.
Well in 97 you got the hd600s soo
Yeah, wish there were more good modern alps-like options.
I love the collab crinacle is such a good person ❤️
I know the distance is a problem (Singapore vs US) but it would be interesting to see a collab for each building a system for the other with same amount of money.
i just purchased a new turntable and after doing some research, i could imagine turntables being a hobby on the level of keyboards and headphones. like imagine "custom" turntables that you can mod to improve sound. many switchable parts from the plate the spins your vinyl around to the cartridge to the preamp.
Big fan of both channels haha great collab!
Thank you!
I wasn't expecting you to mention fountain pens, but my recent obsessions are keyboards, audio, mechanical watches, fountain pens, and photography.
As far as expensive hobbies go, custom keyboards are very affordable and accessible. From personal experience I can tell you that there are far deeper cash holes you can go down - Cameras, watches, fountain pens and bikes to name a few!
Photographers and mechanical watch collectors are asking you to hold their beer.
haha its funny how you brought up fountain pens because im into all 3 (keyboard,pen,headphone). for me it has to do with the fact that most people interact with those 3 things on very surface levels so its fun to see how far the rabbit hole goes on seemingly mundane objects. also there is something about all 3 that tickles a part of my brain that just finds them satisfying.
haha agreed
Fountain pens have a nice sound when they write. But they also just feel really nice. It's... Probably all a push away from disposable utility, into quality and personalized. Different fountain nibs, paper, ink, etc, have the same customized effects as like switches and PCBs etc probably. It's also a bit of a push to analog and anachronisms slightly.
I think the relation between the two isn't just exclusive to these few hobbies, I think a lot of hobbies share similarities. I am a car enthusiast and there is a certain level of feedback that I want from a car when driving and I also want a certain sound too. This can apply to watches, cameras, and other hobbies as well.
I think a couple things that link the keyboard and audiophile communities is proximity and 'finer tastes'. Audio stuff and keyboards can be both readily used at a desktop pc or within an entertainment room. By 'finer tastes' I mean just generally having better than the stock and immediate aftermarket. There's Razer, HyperX, SteelSeries, and all those other companies, but their products are kinda sold as a whole item and really the only replaceable things are switches and keycaps, and those usually stick to a single profile type.
I think the scratching sound of fountain pens on special surfaces has actually a lot to do with sound.
It’s so satisfying
I have been playing with headphones for a while and just got into mechanical keyboard world, tbh, my first impression was: huh, it's not very expensive to get to the top range of set up, good. XD
Same for me...except:
This is nice, but I don't like the cable.
Detachable cable is awesome, but what if I want to sit over there?
I like the convenience of wireless, but what about latency?
One is nice, but I have two computers.
I upgraded mine at work and now the one at home sucks. I need another.
I just bought one on DROP, but it won't arrive for another 8 months, so I'll buy another for now.
Mechanical keyboards is waste of money. I use latest MacBook keyboard and it’s good enough.
@@vqa33 ok
One set of headphones I have is more than I've ever spent on keyboards. I've spent more on vinyl, turntables and cartridges than headphones. It's a deep deep hole.
I love crin's reaction when you asked him about the cost of hd800s. I felt what he felt.
It's considered cheap in audio space somehow lol
Id say the overlap goes deeper than just keyboards, headphones, and pens. Things like watches and knives are in the same as pens so really its pens, keyboards, headphones, watches, and knives (maybe). I think it’s because these hobbies prioritize a high quality experience that may have been lost to time and that have a “mechanical” aspect and a serious modding community that seeks to improve and create new things to enjoy.
I think the connection between keyboards, headphones and fountain pens is that they're all chasing a feeling/sensation and are willing to spend ludicrous amounts of money for it.
i think what is related with keyboards and audio is that newer isn't really better. For computer components, keyboards are the one part that you don't need to worry about getting displaced by new tech. If you have a keyboard you like from the 80s, you can still use it now. This encourages investing the maximum you can because it's going to last a long time and is the one component you carry with you to your next computer setup.
Audio is similar. Lots of people have vintage speakers and amplifiers from the 70s that they absolutely love. While there are some good and interesting things coming out now, some of the best items ever made are decades old. like the LS3/5 speakers originally built for BBC studios
A used version of a given headphone will usally be around 60-80% of the original price depending on completeness and actual wear/condition because good headphones stay good forever if you take care of them unlike say consoles or pc components or tvs or even keyboards, which have a designated lifetime on the switches.
Broken cables can be switched out, for popular headphones there will always be replacement pads and "depending on the model model" headbands so the parts that actually wear out can always be replaced.
You can either resell the headphones if you decide to quit the hobby or just get rid of a couple you are unlikely to use anymore and get a good chunk of money back compared to other electronics or just keep them and use them for the rest of your life really
I mean, I expect my HD660S to work in 30, 40 years still and if they do they will sound just as lovely so fuckit
For me, the audiophile hobby is truly a "buy once keep forever" type deal and I can comfortably say that I have reached my endgame with the eqiupment I have rn because I have reached the point I wanted to.
People tend to forget what got them into these expensive hobbys in the first place, either you set fixed goals or you will be spending more and more with time with more and more diminishing returns.
People tend to forget that really lovely audio stuff is there for you to enjoy the music in a way basic stuff just can't do and with all the technicalities and marginal improvements there are people tend to fall into "chasing that dragon" and I hate to see it happen because truly enjoying what you have kinda gets lost on the way.
This is super interesting to watch Betty! It would be awesome to see you collab with DankPods for another discussion on the audiophile and keyboard world! Love your videos and hope you stay safe :D
Thank you!
Her name is Betty? YES! Now I know what to whisper continuously in my sleep, thanks.
I'm just dipping into the audio scene myself and saw your comment on one of his videos, now here we are. Life is weird sometimes.
Oh wow. Didn't expect this. Props to y'all both
As an audio enthusiast, I've hit about as far as I want to go in headphones and have turned to keyboards as a cheaper alternative to scratch the tech itch. Tbh keyboards sound expensive but headfi boggles the mind especially when you see stuff like the Sennhieser Orpheus lol.
I knew this collab would happen the second I saw your sennheisers
The link is Consumerism.
None of all those items are either rare, precious or wear and tear. There's no excuse for hoarding them except to fill an empty void in your heart.
While scrolling these comments, I was thinking that all of this pointless customization and consumption is indicative of a clear purpose in life, perhaps lack of a spiritual center or other guiding force. In an attempt to fill that void, which people can sense if they can’t exactly articulate, they spend the money they spend their time to earn.
This is what happens when you forsake God
In the unlikely event that I win the lottery, buying "mid-fi" audio is definitely at the top of my list of things to buy
Nothing like a vanishing point gold nib gliding over smooth paper. The tactile feedback is fantastic, in a similar manner to mechanical keyboards.
The amount of money you probably spend to make your fans happy makes this even better!
crinacle is so well spoken and his voice is so soothing
Your audio production is impeccable.
Thank you!
@@SwitchandClickOfficial Seriously, your sound is better than most of the MSM channels.
I’m come to notice that a lot of us are in the same hobbies. I’ve noticed that watches, knives, guns, pens, headphones, keyboards, mice, and more have a lot of the same members within these communities. I almost always see a cool knife opening up packages in all the different hobbies I mentioned, for example.
This is a sick video
Comparing the Model F, Box Jades, and the newer ZealPC Clickiez, i think the Clickiez completely replace the Box Jades in terms of the best modern clicky switch. The Model F is worth it, but for daily usage I would still recommend a nice custom with the ZealPC Clickiez. Haven't tried alps, so I can't comment there. Honestly I just wish we had more variety, seems like every new switch is either linear or tactile, which is just a bit sad, boosting the most boring type of switches.
I think the overlap is the same as people who spend a lot on, ergo chairs. It's something that you will probably use often and can be very very very personal in what you decide you want.
As an enthusiast enthusiast, I'm pleasantly surprised that this collab happened; although it's making me realize the unlikelyhood of another crossover like a DBK x Urban Gentry collab. Too bad the thumbnail doesn't do enough to bait the crin crowd. Actually makes me kinda curious as to whether Betty will actually put some money down on a Crin collab IEM or not?
Got the Moondrop X Crin
@@SwitchandClickOfficial The Blessing 2, Dusk? Wow, just jumped right in! I hope you enjoy them.
Being a fairly active in both hobbies - I think keyboards are definitely a more expensive hobby (by a long shot). Even barrier to entry is much more - you can’t possibly get a decent ckb for under $200 - meanwhile you can get good midrange headphones/IEMs for that price
A couple of things here...
Barrier of entry VS what you need to spend for "endgame". $200 is also NOT midrange, midrange is around $700 to 1k now for headphones. All the popular keyboard people I've watched here have praised and recommended keyboards at around $80 too, which is around the price of the most recommended budget IEM.
You're also doing keyboard vs specifically headphones/IEMs (should add speakers here too). Audio, if we're doing it properly, would also at least include your amp and DAC.
I watch both, the reason is because the people making the videos are hilarious. Glarses got me addicted to keyboards.
Super Love it. Electronic DIY could be a good place to start. From there I know what is Audiophile, Mechanical Keyboard. It starting from viewing switches to find Holy Grail Switch, and then start collecting different kind switches, tactile/linear/click, manufactures, brands, material types, lubes, etc. Compare to my other hobby like Rubik (related to the same thing, namely asmr, smoothness and lube), I find expenses magnitude is 10x higher. Not to mention I just deal with switches centric only (or yet), not yet with layouts, and casing upgrades. Knowing other hobby less expensive does not make me stop. Knowing other hobby more expensive does not make me relief. To EndGame this Holy Grail search, I think for right now I just satisfy my self with viewing switches comparison, and find a way to save money for my dream keyboard (cyberboard), and also find a way to tell my wive about the price.
Went from mechanical keyboards, to audiophile equipment, to watches. Circling back to mech keebs is refreshing financially, funnily enough.
As someone who has spent a significant amount of money on both keyboards and audiophile equipment, there's no one solution for everyone.
I personally have found that I enjoy the extra benefits of going the high route and dropping unimaginable wads of cash on the hobbies. But to date, the most memorable and note-worthy typing and listening experiences I've had are with a pair of cheap Apple earphones and the older MacBook keyboards.
No amount of money can bring back the enjoyment factor and literal years of usage I had with both products, but I know it's different for everyone.
Oh my, I'm into Headphones, IEM's, Speakers, Vinyl and recently got into mechanical keyboards. Started out with Tecware Phantom TKL, but Outemu switches started to die on me and I wanted something smaller as I would hit the keyboard with mouse when gaming (low sens). Now I have Epomaker EP84 and waiting for Milky Yellow switches and a set of new keycaps. Gonna lube and tape the stabs too. Brothers and sisters, I hope our wallets will be blessed to allow us to spend money on those things :D
Betty has the most soothing voice and timbre. I could listen to her speak all day.
A collab between my 2 favourite people from 2/4 of my favourite hobbies! (Yes i know im 9 months late)
Wait until y'all hear about custom built lightsabers. Those things range from $80-$3000 depending on build quality, features and overall style. Especially the custom made replicas. My very generic and basic custom built LGT saber was $109 for the base saber,then a electronics upgrade (Proffie Core V2) which came with a Neopixel Blade (has neopixel led's inside the blade) for $219.99) then I plan on eventually buying a covertec wheel adapter (screws on the pommel of the saber) which is $9.99 with a covertec belt clip (clips to a belt so you can sheave your saber) which all of these upgrades round my saber up to $239.99. Now that's really cheap for a custom made lightsaber with realistic lighting and sounds. While it's basic in design it works perfectly. Now double the cost of the original saber hilt + the core / blade upgrades / pommels because I'm gonna make my saber Dual-Bladed. Now it's $578. Still on the cheap side of things though.
Consistently I see really cool looking sabers go for $300-$2000 with the absolute highest end of all sabers going for $2999.99.
Really expensive hobby and most people do it alongside cosplaying as star wars characters or their own original characters and with that the cost to finish their hobby is closer to at least $150 - $1200 for a complete cosplay + their saber's cost. My own cosplay is going to be about $130 and then the total price of my eventually completed lightsaber.
If I'm correct it mechanical keyboards began around 2016 on a Korean forum
in addition, one critical reason that i spent audio product before any of other hobbies is because of hearing ability loss problem.
we human lose our hearing ability as we old and after you losing your hearing ability, there is no way to restore it.
so, if you do have some enthusiasm for audio hobbies, you better start early before your ear become useless. it is time limit hobby for sure.
Didnt even think about this until it was compared in this video, but my keyboard build was about 400 and my headphone + dac/amp setup is about 500, so really not too far off from eachother
oh wow did not expect this collab! love it since im in both communities!
Your content is incredible it never fails to be amazing ❤
Wow, thank you!