Not Toxic. Efficiently built to give hell to nihilistic posers who make themself a priority. Sick of that mimicry and Redditors entirely. If all you are is a Schedule jockey looking for stolen glory privilege then may that firing come with a prison sentence cherry on top.
@@Emperor-InkerBut the system wants more babies produced each hear to get cheaper and larger workslaves for the future and keep you in debt via marriage so you stay a good little dog who won't complain and take whatever they do to you at work.
@@Emperor-InkerBut the system wants more babies produced for ever cheaper and larger future slaveWorkerLaborPool. Also get married for never ending debt so they can do whatver they want to you and the married worker takes it
Yeah, I'm done with that. The salary/OT exempt thing is just legalized wage theft. The "It'll pay off with a bonus" never quite works out. The bonus, IF there is one at all, pays maybe 1/10 th of all the OT I put in. Since 2020, I've learned to work either work part-time on-demand or full time ONLY if they pay me for all overtime hours worked.
@@Merlin_From_Shrek_3 No it isn't. In the US, we have a 40 hour work week. Anything over 40 hours is overtime. You get paid for that ovetime unless you are salaried/OT exempt, which is a business term for "you work for free after 40 hours".
@@Seattle-2017Technically he is correct. In a salary position all hours worked, regular and overtime, are your pay. It's just you get paid the same whether you work 40 hours or 80 hours. It sucks and I'll avoid it if I can. There are perks for salaried positions but the question is do they outweigh having to work so many hours? My answer is no.
Even at smaller CPA firms it seems like it’s like that. The one I worked at Would frequently let you know that you were expected to work over the weekends when you were not at the office. It was all because of time constraints, but it was all ridiculous. How can you be refreshed when you’re expected to work all the time? Luckily for me, I started my accounting career at 35 after I had a career change and at that point, I knew not to put up with BS. I did not work weekends whether they wanted me to or not. And I still did a good job and people wanted to work with me on their team.
How did you get treated after you did your required work only? Did they fire you or did you get by ok just doing your own work and leaving when your hours are over @@jjminor
This exact corporate culture is the universal norm in Japan and it has legit gotten in the way of people being able to date, have friends, vote intelligently, eat healthy, and reproduce.
@@pointvector1951 The Big 4 are the biggest accounting/consulting/legal/finance companies in the world. They are Deloitte, EY, KPMG, and PwC, essentially every single famous, large company, or government has used their services at some point, be it Tesla, Amazon, Microsoft, Disney, Activison-Blizzard, NYT, Ford, GM, GE, Shell, Exxon, Perdue, HP, Pzifer, Siemens, Fischer, Wall Street, most governments or any other large company in the entertainment, energy, accounting, legal, gaming, news, automobile, management, finance, pharmaceutical, and medical industries. They are notoriously difficult to work for and have a terrible work culture but almost every college or university pushes students toward these companies because they are resume boosters, if you get into their program and last for two or so years you are effectively hirable to almost anywhere in the accounting/consulting world. It used to be the big five, six, and eight but consolidation has trimmed it to the big four. During the Big Five era, Arthur Andersen was complicit in the infamous Enron scandal of 2001 and had their assets divided into the big four companies.
@@pointvector1951 I believe they are the 4 largest accounting firms. Apart from obviously being toxic workplaces, every one of them has been under investigation in recent years for executive corruption and all sorts of shady BS.
@pointvector1951 There was a clue in the comment you were replying to when it said, "industry accountant." "Big 4" is short for big 4 accounting firms.
Former PwC here. That place sucks. During my intro call with my Senior Manager he said to me “There is no reason why you should work past 7 PM” to which I replied “You mean 5 PM, right?”. Afterwards, he would constantly reach out to me at 4:55 PM or sometimes after 5 PM to give me work to do. After working there for three years, I called it quits. It was a horrible experience and I would not recommend it to anyone.
Adding on to my previous comment. PwC does something called “reinvestment” which just means you have a collateral duty to perform on top of your 40-hour commitment to the client. The amount of responsibility associated with this collateral duty can vary, but it is not uncommon to work around 5-10 hours a week on it which creates even more work for you. It is just nonsense.
Is that why kids work there for a year to 3 years just so they get their foot in the door out of college then leave to do their own thing or work for a smaller firm or leave the accounting field?
As a former employee I want to share my story, this is 100% real. I worked there for years and got promoted multiple times. I had a family situation that required me to ask for a leave, then when I came back I wanted to discuss quitting because my job was highly demanding. My boss talked me into staying part-time. So I started doing a job search to get out of that stress. I finally found a new job. Then HR immediately asked me for a private meeting because they said someone found out I have a new job and I can’t work PART TIME with them if I have another job!!😂 So I resigned same day and gave them my notice that I will leave in a couple of weeks, but they decided to exercise an option where they let me out a couple of days before bonuses were paid out so I was not paid my bonus. This is corporate scum at its finest. They don’t care about you. They don’t care about you at all, at all
I had a boss that worked in investment banking which is even worse than big 4 as it's 80 hour weeks with an all night with no sleep once a month. They treat you like shit on their shoes. He was so unbelievably toxic. He was so pompous and arrogant but in my opinion it was a front for being a coward. He would never give me feedback one on one. He told one of my coworkers feedback on me and that coworker would bring me in a room and tell me it. Coward. This guy is the type that sent me a 5 paragraph email saying how incorrect "Beginning an email with hi, hello, or hey is innapropriate, you can only use their first name in an intro". If I showed up 10 seconds after him or left 10 seconds before him, I'd get a 4 paragraph email. He made my female coworker balling cry 2 times. He gave another coworker a panic attack where he fell back in chair and hit his head on the ground. They called 911 for help. An ambulance showed up, rolled out a stretcher and in front of 50 of his coworkers unconcious, they strapped him on a stretcher and took him to the ER. He later said "Oh it's just because I'm unhealthy and have gotten fat recently." He was way too nice to call out this man. I ended up getting laid off. When he and HR brought me in a room and told me, I just didn't care. My last words to him were "Welp, I probably won't ever see you again... so see ya" and walked out. Like I have massive student loans and getting laid off with no income should be devestating, but I didn't care. When I last left the parking lot driving off, the song "I can see clearly now the rain is gone. I can see past obstacles in my way. It's gonna be a bright, bright, bright, sunny shiny day..." I was literally at top of my lungs yelling this song. It was cathartic. I ended up getting a new job, making 35% more in an awesome culture. I can't be grateful enough for him firing me. It was the best thing to ever happen to me. I've had dreams of finding out where he lives and rubbing dog shit on his windows and door handles. The most astonishing this of this all is that he had a wife. I couldn't get over that any woman on earth would ever in a billion years marry him even though he was rich.
Especially when you have another job lined up, that's a lesson: Never let them know you are leaving until shortly before you do, if not the same day. Collect your bonus and boogie. If you've a new job lined up, you don't need any of them as a reference anyway. Just boogie. They aren't going to give you the courtesy of working those extra two weeks. They'll just fire you. So don't give them the chance. That's the work world we live in - zero loyalty from them, so it should be zero loyalty from you.
I had a manager who wanted to have a one way window installed in their office so they could watch (spy on) the employees. Fortunately the higher up said no to that. She ended up getting sacked because everybody eventually quit on her. Hi NANCY.
"An officer should not work, looking over his men's shoulder, checking on every detail of what they are doing, and calling them to account at every furlong post. This maidenly attitude corrodes confidence and destroys initiative." - The Armed Forces Officer, Edition of 1950, p. 211
About 10 years ago I worked at PwC Montreal. Literally hated everybody there (Except one senior manager that later became partner, P.C.) Got fired after the first year because I was entering too many hours in my time sheet during busy season (the real worked hours) and the partners hated this because it lowered their jobs' net margins (a senior manager explained that to me after the fact). 2 years later in industry I was making more money then my manager (who worked 6 years to get there and works 3x more hours than me). Audit is a scam.
My friends worked at PWC and KPMG. These are just glorified resume booster companies. And they work you they really do own you. Making partner basically is more about how much you can brownnose.
Most accounting students spend college hearing that you have to work Big 4 and pass the CPA to have a good career. This message is reinforced by job listings for senior positions that ask for Big 4 experience. For that reason many Big 4 associates put up with a lot.
@@thuglifebear5256 employers care. Unless you are in private practice, you have to be lucky to get a good corporate accounting gig without big 4 on your resume.
And those college students potentially take out six figures worth of student loan debt, so they feel they need to work at the Big 4 firm to get higher pay and pay off their student loans.
I did an internship at PwC. I didn’t accept a full time offer for 1 reason. The best career advice I’ve ever heard is to look at the people above you and see if they’re happy. No one was and the partner said he only did accounting because his dad told him too. I’m so glad I left. I’m in a great job now with perfect work/life balance.
@@smpiano6605 nah, I started at amazon as a warehouse grunt and moved up to an admin position. I work M-F 8 hour shifts and work from home Monday and Friday. Amazon also lets you use your time off when and how you want. My manager approves all vacation time off.
And I can wear what I want. In public accounting you have to dress business casual. I could roll into work at amazon wearing the same pajamas I wore the day before when I worked from home haha
I once worked with colleagues from US, me being from EU, at an EU client site. I was 24 yo back then and I was asked by a 50+ male colleague from US why I was leaving at 5.30-6 pm, while the US manager was still there. I said - my work for the day is done and the working hours too. He told me that in US they have to come to work before the manager does and leave after he does. All the EU colleagues were coming at work around 9.30-10 am, US people were already there. EU workers were leaving at 5.30-6 pm, US workers were still there. At the end of the project the US manager badmouthed all the EU colleagues to they EU management for not doing their work. We had fabulous reviews from the client though, so we never heard of that US manager again and we got good appraisals at the end of the year. Was working at one of the biggest IT companies worldwide. Also, all the US colleagues were taking turns in buying lunch for the US manager, we never bothered. Huge gap in mentality.
@@zerohero5753 I'd also argue that even the taxes are higher, we have free education and healthcare in EU. I wouldn't say the payment is US is higher, so I don't see any incentive to kiss anyone's behind for something that is transactual (one works to be paid). Also, EU has laws for employment, while US lacks in this domain.
Same, like our building locks at 6pm, I can't stay late, even if I wanted to. Because my company doesn't want to pay me overtime and I legally can't just "stay and work for free".
After one year with the company, my managers gave me the feedback that my work was excellent. One week later, yearly feedback put me in the bottomest tier, my coach told me it was nothing to worry about. One week later, was fired for "low performance" 🎉🎉🎉
That’s pretty brutal, when I was at Deloitte all first years were basically given a 3 (average rating) 2nd year and on it was open season though… I didn’t know how under paid I was until after I was laid off and picked up for something 30% more pay
Years of being told how important and valued I am, and how great our product is doing in the marketplace. Only to be told that no matter how well OUR team is doing, the overall company had a bad year, so no raise (or an insultingly small raise). Will everything we've done and our years of poor raises be recognized if the company ever has a good year? No, of course not.
Were you able to collect unemployment in that situation? Or did the company fight it because they said they didn't lay you off, rather they fired you for "low performance".
Former Deloitte employee - one of the big 4, rivaling PwC. In case people here don't know who are the Big 4 (Accounting) firms, they are: Deloitte, KPMG, PwC, Ernest & Young. Deloitte ironically have trophies/awards, bagging the Best Ethical Employer/Company of the Year (not joking!). But behind closed doors, my own ex-boss did every dirty trick to oust me out of the company, even though I have proved my KPI for the last 3 months was above 90%. Deloitte don't appreciate your hard work, they only keep those who are submissive + don't challenge bosses authority/challenge the status quo + can talk more sugar-coated "truths" bosses want to hear. Don't get hired by Deloitte, if you can. If you do get hired by Deloitte, some of you have to expect to not stay long there. However long you stay there, best find a way to maintain your humanity & sanity, while the workplace system or group(s) of people tempt to corrupt/break you down overtime.
Thank you for telling us about this fact about Delloite, lots of professors in my college tell that getting in Big 4 accounting firms is the actual fulfillment of one's Life.
I didn’t know there was a top 10 list out there unless you are talking about auditting/tax? If so then why not, same shit different company. I’m sure the small businesses have the same shady ongoings too
@@jimbojimbo6873 After b4 there’s the nationals (BDO, RSM, Grant Thronton, Baker Tilly, etc). I’m in audit and would like to change to consulting or advisory, but seems difficult if I couldn’t get in and then I’d have to be a staff 1 again.
Stay strong. I left but big 4. I wish I had switched practices to a different advisory type, I'd have possibly ended up with better managers and projects. Took me 6 months to emotionally and intellectually recover after huge burnout. Lol. After time I lost emotions. My mind took a large toll and I wasn't able to think as fast as before or remember information. I lost my creativity. I've regressed in my verbal skills to high school level and in social skills as well. I realized I was terribly sad only after quitting and literally crying for 7 days when I visited my parents. I still don't know what went wrong.
i went to school with a lot of people who worked at big 4 after grad and none of them ever made partner, all of them burned out in 5 years or less. they called it the bamboo ceiling but in reality it's just the way the business is run. their whole game is to nab smart, hard-working, anxious, high-C people and squeeze every last drop of work out of them for as long as they can. then they replace them with the next crop of new grads. rinse repeat. it works because these companies offer something these new grads desperately need: decent pay right out of school for a company with a big brand name. if you're gonna do it, know the trade you're making and have a plan for when you've decided enough is enough.
That old, and very funny, musical called "How to Succeed in Business without Really Trying" is from a different era, but some of it's lessons still apply.
I just applied for them knowing I was never going to get hired so I could claim that I'm looking for a job. Glad to know I never got an interview with them.
I advise people to add up the actual hours they work and calculate their actual hourly rate. I was in a big architectural firms for many years before it occurred to me to do the calculation. I found out I was getting paid less per hour than I would get for manual labour.
I seen the same thing from a lawyer that was working 60 hours a week and realized a person with a 2 year degree getting hourly wages would make more more money logging those kind of hours with decent overtime incentives.
In my profession (Architecture), they don't ask you to work overtime (as a salaried/OT exempt worker). They just place ridiculous deadlines on you that you have to meet, and the only way of meeting them is by working a lot of unpaid OT. All to make the boss look good. If you don't work the OT and don't meet the deadline, then it's a "meeting" in the bosses' office. They ask "what's the problem?", and "how can we help?". If you're honest with them about the deadline, they don't want to hear it, and imply that you work too slow. And they don't threaten your job, but you're first on the layoff list when the layoffs roll around. I basically had enough of this shit back in 2020, and vowed to never work full time salaried/OT exempt again. It has worked out so far with different freelance and sub-contracting gigs, and a part time job that's now full time but I get paid for all my overtime. I'm making almost double what I was prior to my 2020 layoff, and retirement has become a real possibilty.
In my profession (control engineer), they would keep all the meetings on overtime. God, they wouldn't even pay me for it. It's hell. But for the fact of the matter, I wouldn't go to half the meetings like that anyways 😅
As I've been thinking a lot lately, how could businesses really be reputable if they're abusive to their employees while having a "too big to fail" vibe.
The military can be like this too. I have a couple decades of experience in the Army before retiring. It can been filled with people just sitting around at times waiting to be the last to leave. I had a supervisor, an officer, he wouldn't leave the office until 6 p.m. often. He wasn't doing anything. I got stuck leaving at 5 p.m. most days because of him, even if I got all my work done hours ago. I could easily be online at home than at work.
I watched the video and thought the comments were translated from 1970's Japan for a second. I don't have a good reason why I thought that, but it clicked.
So many work environments are about optics. The more you move up the ladder it's more about saying the right thing, and being a yes man, while delivering nothing. No foresight or vision. I mentally checked out before my plant inevitably closed and was laid off. No regrets.
that's actually a really good list of explaining how office optics work. So, if you're perceived as a lead, leave first, so everyone else will ACTUALLY LEAVE AT A REASONABLE HOUR. if you tell them, they won't. be a role model, leave early. :) you hit the nail on the head, its a lack of a merit-based system. its all optics.
Yeah man, I think we could do a lot of damage to this nonsense if each one got each other’s backs… for example, if I knew someone in accounting I could totally blast it full volume in the forums, because myself I know I will never end up working these types of domains and definitely not the Big 4s. That friend could do the same for me in video games, these companies are so stingy and anti-accountability that them finding this very same comment could land me in trouble.
Recently mckinsey consultant in India commited suicide due to high work pressure. He was from IIT and IIM highly prestigious and competitive institutes
As someone who does taxes and full charge bookkeeping here is some advice. If you work for someone else's company, do the bare min but learn. Do not get involved in corporate and take steps to complete your certs, and get a business up and running. If you own your own tax firm, I would go 100%. There is a major shortage of tax preparers. If you have to say over at a big four, do your own company work on the low and never say anything about it to anyone (get your CPA or EA). Stay one year then leave. TLDR: Do not work unless you get paid.
How do you get clients? What do you specifically pitch? I currently have some small business clients (basically corner shops and such) but I want to expand to small tier manufacturing businesses as there is more revenue in that.
It was the big 5 before. I have worked at andersen consulting (now accenture), mind games are definitely the name of the game. My four years there were hell; imagine working 16 hrs a day, 7x a week for a measly overtime allowance (and that is not giving it due to the manager's use of company policy loopholes). This is in the Philippines delivery center alone. I have an interview with pwc now and I am thankful to have watched this video.
Most corporate offices work you to death. I suggest live a frugal and minimalist lifestyle so you are not affected by the workload and you can quit at anytime
Back when I worked for university career services I remember big 4 recruiting staff asking if they could stay after 5pm on Friday to process on-site interview offers. I informed them absolutely not as the University closes the student center at 5pm on Friday. Just as I expected push-back an armed campus police officer appeared in the doorway. Have a great weekend. And go get a life!
Not leaving until your manager does is a South Korean thing in business and there self deletion rates are horrendous. It just leads to people staying doing nothing really but not leaving for the optics.
My brother worked for one of the big 4, in NYC, and can confirm it was horrible. He had the flu once and they called him and chewed him out for not coming to work, even though he had a fever and was puking and everything.
I love the old people who’ve been in the same dead end, entry level job for twenty to thirty years and get upset at new hires who value their own lives. These people are all over the service and hospitality industries.
I spent 4 years at PwC. No lies detected. I remember pulling an all nighter in the office. Went home at 5am to take a shower. Went to bed and was woken up by my partner asking where I was ... I said I overslept and went back into the office 30 minutes later. Working until 7pm was the standard. It wasn't an issue when I was single and fresh out of college. Id never have that lifestyle now that im married with children
2 years back I have chose to join big 4 due to excitement, imagine after rejecting better offers and didn't interview for counter offers. Since my interview till the exit, I felt terrible about the process, HRs, management of projects, etc. Everyone from my project left already within few months after spending a year.
Here, where I work in Norway, people show up around lunch and leave 2-3 hours later. Most work at home, some even bring their pcs when they travel abroad for months and work a couple of hours a day.
I worked for one of them for a total of 11 years, in two countries. There was definitely a lot of work involved but I didn’t mind that as I signed up for a salaried position with no set time really. What bothered me was when my utilization was low (happens due to seasonality sometimes and the projects), I still had to sit and pretend that I was busy until 6-7, and you were made to feel bad if you weren’t present. That and the weekly transcon travel for projects took its toll on me. I now have such a great work life balance at my new job, can’t even think of my old job without getting goosebumps. Not that it’s not a good professional experience, but make sure you pull out before you burn out
Started my career in public for 2 years then went to industry. Learned more in my 1st year in industry working regular hours implementing a new ERP system than working all the hours I did in public for 2 years. Now as a corporate controller I don’t give a s*** if candidates I’m hiring were in public, way more concerned if the person actually cares enough to look into root causes and tries to understand WHAT they’re doing rather than going through the motions on HOW to do it. And most managers in the field I know think the exact same thing. Times are a changing, managers have wised up to the whole BS public accounting is top tier mentality.
In my last job I worked about 45-60 min overtime every day. And despite that, I was still the last person to arrive and the first person to leave EVERY day. After only 6 weeks I got fired. Main reason being that I "didn't spend enough time in the office" and therefore "wasn't serious enough" and "too immature to work for his company". Yes, he actually called me immature, three times no less. So happy to be out of there, working there was hell in general. I didn't even get a warning either, he just fired me out of nowhere one Monday morning. Came in to work just to go straight home again (and that was a long commute)
I'm so thankful to be able to work from home and avoid most of the corporate nonsense. It also helps that I work for a pretty small company. There's still come cringy work culture stuff, but it's generally isolated a weekly meeting and the occasional "virtual happy hour" that's entirely optional.
I worked for a regional firm for a year and encountered a lot of this. Mind games, competitiveness, people talking behind your back, people having mental breakdowns and sobbing at work and at the client. Too much insanity to describe. I quit after working for a lead who wanted me to lie and bend rules and bitched to management when I didn’t. Have a much more chill job now for same pay and working on starting my own firm in the evenings at my own pace. I don’t know why public accounting attracts psychos, but it definitely does.
I worked at Accenture Federal. I will honestly say the Federal side of the Big Four is not toxic. Mostly cuz as federal contractors they gotta follow federal labor laws or lose the contract. So that side of those businesses tend to be better managed. If you are ever asked to do overtime, atleast in my experience. they let you know a week in advance so you can make your arrangements. then it has to be approved by the Account Manager of the contract. I only experienced it once while working there, and they were doing everything to try to avoid having all of the teams on contract do OT. The commercial side of the company was basically everything in this video.. and a lot of us were glad we had our security clearances XD
Very strange, this reads more like Japanese/Korean Business culture than anything I've had experience with in the US. Baffles me that these are the same companies that do random team building and random extra activities that waste time for no reason, but also expect you to work more than 40 hours for free basically. I don't know what kind of work they even do here, but I don't think I've ever been busy enough to actually be working constantly 100% of the time I'm at work and not been able to get my work done in 40 hours.
Lmao my two roommates are both in consulting, and one at PWC specifically. Late nights are the norm, rarely see them log off before ~6, sometimes I'll even see them working until 9, 10, or one time even 11pm. Meanwhile I'm in software so I hop off between 5-530 almost every day
My managers at the restaurant I worked at hated me because I was really active about leaving as on time as possible because they would keep pushing and pushing. If I got my side and finishing work done on time, they would find any reason to keep me there. 😂 nope cya
As a contractor, I am enjoying my morning shifts, then going home for a good nap, and making money for night shift, then I get to essentially take an extra day off if money is flowing in. Get pretty much a 4 day work schedule and live in a unicorn economy. Those afternoon naps can be anywhere between 2-4 hours.
Sharing rooms can lead to unintended consequences. Maybe someone arranges to "room" with someone and has motives that could lead to harassment or even assault?
PWC is a shithole. I unironically arrive and leave on time and the current senior who has been a diversity hire all his life and worked at the "big firms" has complained about me leaving on time and even asked the partners "Do you think HE (me) could do a better job than me?" to which one partner replied "Yes!". By the way PWC for past few years has been summoned to federal enquiries. I applied at PWC years ago and I am glad they didnt give me the job.
Milton had such a wonderful job. They put him in the basement, away from everyone else. No one knows he is there. He can do whatever he wants all day. And still get paid for it. He really had it made.
Until they fixed the glitch. Though, I will say this: I worked as a federal civilian for the military for several years. There was so little work to do there that I had to use my time to learn and study, which was fine. However, eventually I needed more and quit. It didn't help that the military office and IT policies were getting worse.
I spent 6 years early in my career working for the largest European services firm. It was great at first; traveling internationally every week! By the time I left, I was alcoholic and had a nervous breakdown. A good reason exists around why they bring in young people, who eventually will not put up with this garbage. The execs in this space are usually a variation of mental illness that hasn’t even been fully identified as of yet. One of my old school managers would pine on about the good old days of clocking people’s restroom breaks, and setting out egg McMuffins at his reports desks on Saturdays to see if they showed up that day.
What a great video. Began my career at Arthur Andersen in 1989 and worked there for three years to get my CPA license. This was back in the days when there was a Big 8. Quite frankly it was pretty miserable the entire time. Your video is pretty spot on.
I had a job offer at one of the big 4, but I turned them down since during the technical interviews I kept getting told they let employees use excess work hours towards a Friday off. In the last interview, the team manager acted like a slimmy asshole, and he let it slip that employees must prove they've earned their Friday off, even if they've more than 8 hours. I honestly was pissed since it felt I was being misled so much and that my time was wasted with all the interviews, but it prevented me from working there.
when I was teaching overseas I was the first one in and last one out only because i wasn't qualified to do that job and didn't know what I was doing. meanwhile other teachers were partying all night and were late but did fine at their job. A lot of times people are late leaving as they don't really have the skills to do their job :)
Big 4 is literally the impediment of the phrase “Golden handcuffs” I use to want to go into management consulting until I started seeing a lot deeper depth on how they actually treat them. A lot Ivy League entitled egotistic people that look at others as if they are inferior to them. Like cool you went to an Ivy League school that ran your pockets dry. Cool you want a cookie cuz people can do the same type of work if not BETTER than you on doing the same things you do through stuff you can find open source.
At walmart we work 2-11 and have protected time off that we earn. we always get yelled at for not clocking in early and staying till 11. yet if you clock in early you have to clock out early due to the 8 hour limit. Even when you try to clock in at 2 they still complain cause you could have been there sooner. Also they complain that people use their protected time off to leave early... work is dumb
Legend says some of these practices would earn you a raise, or a promotion, and get you ahead in the industry. Nowadays it's just used to squeeze you for everything you're worth only to be discarded when someone cheaper comes along to suffer the same fate. Still baffled how some of these companies survive when they put optics above all else and also constantly cry about nothing actually getting done.
I try to tell people I work with that are seeking more responsibility to get noticed to STOP it! They are so worried they have this drive to be noticed if it leads to more money. It does not.
The income potential at partner is what keeps all this insanity going. For most tenured partners at big 4, $1M annual is total comp. With so much upside at stake, survival becomes Mad Max Thunder-dome. In addition keep in mind that with the exception of chargability and sales at higher levels, all performance is subjective. This means the incentive manage perception is critical for reviews.
I worked at Intel for 3 years as a process engineer. 10-12 hour days are normal, monday - Friday. usually also working another 2-4 hours on sunday, just to keep up with job responsibilities. the area i worked in used fear of layoffs to push people. i am glad i found another position in another company that treats its employees better.
I had a buddy who worked at EY and did a 100 hour work week during busy season. That means he was doing 60-80 hours during the other weeks. And this was as a 1st year making around 57-60k/year with no stock/revenue share. He said he worked about 45 hours during non busy season
Fk yeah, bro. Get some!!!! Could you do a piece on the FAANG and what it's REALLY like to work there? I live in Northern California and been in tech even before the Internet. So...I know what's up. Find some people to talk about the truth about those places. TLDR == its fukd.
So glad I'm not part of any bs company structure or ethos like this anymore. Education industry was just the same. Entrepreneurial route all the way now. No more 70 hour weeks unless it's totally on my terms.
As someone else in the comments has pointed out, this kind of work culture is the norm in Japan and South Korea. It’s outrageous to see it get spread out like a pandemic.
I interviewed there and was not surprised when the less qualified interviewers tried to pry some industry knowledge from me and I kept it basic because I knew they wouldn't hire me.
Yeah this all seems very typical for a big 4 accounting firm. Unfortunatly the whole "benefit" of working at firm like this is that it is a huge resume booster but you basically have to give up two or three years of your life for that.
I feel like some of these people would much rather chain their employees to their desks and force them to work 24/7 for free but are sad that they can’t due to the legality so they try to get as close to that as humanly possible.
If U work for a company all U owe them is what was on the job description/app. U should never feel guilty. Way back I worked for a lot of big retail/sales companies. 1 time 1 of them called me & said I was on a list to cover for ppl. who could not work that day. I never consented to the list nor did I know re to it. 2 companies tried to pull this on me. I refused to go in, hung up the phone, & went out to dinner with my parents. Good video.
My manager said: "you must spend 1 hour on each project to done them everyday". The problem is there more than 8 projects. Audit is work without light. Literally
Hey Josh- busy season is when we actually have client work that we charge. For some people busy season is around 3 or 4 months of the year (for tax its around 3/15 and 9/15) the other 8 months, unless specified, we aren't utilized so we literally just log on and log off. The goal of the 55 hours during busy season is to have a Yearly 78%utilization rate with the 8 months we arent billing
Got fired from a software company for not putting in more than 10 hours a day. 😒😒
5 місяців тому
Quit my first six figure job. Inept managers, hired friends, family, sons, dads, nobody had any qualifications. Hired me to do a machine install arrivibg in 5 weeks. They had no clue what they were doing. Gave 2 wks notice secind week Was set up. now its on them. They could not even move stock out of the area the machine was to install. pity. I was on track, and going to automate the machine, order would automatically make parts. six figures , never thought anyone would quit surprise.
I literally work for my paycheck to pay my bills. I come in at my scheduled time and leave at my scheduled time. My bosses at every job I’ve been at dislike me and I do not care.
Clink my link galaxylamps.co/joshuafluke and get your galaxy 2.0 lamp today while it's still on sale!
Toxic or not? No way bro.
Not Toxic. Efficiently built to give hell to nihilistic posers who make themself a priority. Sick of that mimicry and Redditors entirely. If all you are is a Schedule jockey looking for stolen glory privilege then may that firing come with a prison sentence cherry on top.
I will buy one soon when I have money. I’ve been looking for one.
My cousin works for Pwc in the UK & from hear from both this video & her I'd say this sounds about right unfortunately
@@Emperor-InkerBut the system wants more babies produced each hear to get cheaper and larger workslaves for the future and keep you in debt via marriage so you stay a good little dog who won't complain and take whatever they do to you at work.
@@Emperor-InkerBut the system wants more babies produced for ever cheaper and larger future slaveWorkerLaborPool. Also get married for never ending debt so they can do whatver they want to you and the married worker takes it
If you want me to work for 55 hours, you're gonna pay me for 55 hours. And pretending to work for even more than that will cost extra.
Yeah, I'm done with that. The salary/OT exempt thing is just legalized wage theft. The "It'll pay off with a bonus" never quite works out. The bonus, IF there is one at all, pays maybe 1/10 th of all the OT I put in. Since 2020, I've learned to work either work part-time on-demand or full time ONLY if they pay me for all overtime hours worked.
But bro the ot is part of your salary
@@Merlin_From_Shrek_3 No it isn't. In the US, we have a 40 hour work week. Anything over 40 hours is overtime. You get paid for that ovetime unless you are salaried/OT exempt, which is a business term for "you work for free after 40 hours".
@@Seattle-2017Technically he is correct. In a salary position all hours worked, regular and overtime, are your pay. It's just you get paid the same whether you work 40 hours or 80 hours. It sucks and I'll avoid it if I can. There are perks for salaried positions but the question is do they outweigh having to work so many hours? My answer is no.
I am hourly in a union. One minute over its 84/hour
PWC: people working constantly
It's a people-whoring company.
wanking more like it
Even at smaller CPA firms it seems like it’s like that. The one I worked at Would frequently let you know that you were expected to work over the weekends when you were not at the office. It was all because of time constraints, but it was all ridiculous. How can you be refreshed when you’re expected to work all the time?
Luckily for me, I started my accounting career at 35 after I had a career change and at that point, I knew not to put up with BS. I did not work weekends whether they wanted me to or not. And I still did a good job and people wanted to work with me on their team.
How did you get treated after you did your required work only? Did they fire you or did you get by ok just doing your own work and leaving when your hours are over @@jjminor
Yeah man, even from smaller assurance outfits, the requests are copious
This exact corporate culture is the universal norm in Japan and it has legit gotten in the way of people being able to date, have friends, vote intelligently, eat healthy, and reproduce.
And they shouldn’t reproduce if their children are going to have to live that kind of life.
it was all planned that way
thats the result of people just "going with the flow" and "being agreeable" for a whole generation.
No wonder Japans population is literally declining. More people are dying than being born and a shocking amount are suicides.
You guys are deluded
The reasons why people ended up that way is because Japan has made it a death sentence to not conform.
Industry accountant here. Big 4 is hella toxic. Always has been and always will be.
@@pointvector1951 The Big 4 are the biggest accounting/consulting/legal/finance companies in the world. They are Deloitte, EY, KPMG, and PwC, essentially every single famous, large company, or government has used their services at some point, be it Tesla, Amazon, Microsoft, Disney, Activison-Blizzard, NYT, Ford, GM, GE, Shell, Exxon, Perdue, HP, Pzifer, Siemens, Fischer, Wall Street, most governments or any other large company in the entertainment, energy, accounting, legal, gaming, news, automobile, management, finance, pharmaceutical, and medical industries. They are notoriously difficult to work for and have a terrible work culture but almost every college or university pushes students toward these companies because they are resume boosters, if you get into their program and last for two or so years you are effectively hirable to almost anywhere in the accounting/consulting world.
It used to be the big five, six, and eight but consolidation has trimmed it to the big four. During the Big Five era, Arthur Andersen was complicit in the infamous Enron scandal of 2001 and had their assets divided into the big four companies.
@@pointvector1951 pwc, delloite, KPMG and other maybe EY
And they never read last year's file so ask the same questions.
@@pointvector1951 I believe they are the 4 largest accounting firms. Apart from obviously being toxic workplaces, every one of them has been under investigation in recent years for executive corruption and all sorts of shady BS.
@pointvector1951
There was a clue in the comment you were replying to when it said, "industry accountant."
"Big 4" is short for big 4 accounting firms.
Former PwC here. That place sucks. During my intro call with my Senior Manager he said to me “There is no reason why you should work past 7 PM” to which I replied “You mean 5 PM, right?”.
Afterwards, he would constantly reach out to me at 4:55 PM or sometimes after 5 PM to give me work to do. After working there for three years, I called it quits. It was a horrible experience and I would not recommend it to anyone.
Adding on to my previous comment. PwC does something called “reinvestment” which just means you have a collateral duty to perform on top of your 40-hour commitment to the client. The amount of responsibility associated with this collateral duty can vary, but it is not uncommon to work around 5-10 hours a week on it which creates even more work for you. It is just nonsense.
typical wall street brokerage....."dont bother comming in on sunday , if you didnt come in on saturday".....70-90 hr/week = standard😳😳😳
@@lunam7249Learn to say NO.
Is that why kids work there for a year to 3 years just so they get their foot in the door out of college then leave to do their own thing or work for a smaller firm or leave the accounting field?
@@SuperStarTidus18 What is the monthly wage for working like a lunatic?
As a former employee I want to share my story, this is 100% real. I worked there for years and got promoted multiple times. I had a family situation that required me to ask for a leave, then when I came back I wanted to discuss quitting because my job was highly demanding. My boss talked me into staying part-time. So I started doing a job search to get out of that stress. I finally found a new job. Then HR immediately asked me for a private meeting because they said someone found out I have a new job and I can’t work PART TIME with them if I have another job!!😂 So I resigned same day and gave them my notice that I will leave in a couple of weeks, but they decided to exercise an option where they let me out a couple of days before bonuses were paid out so I was not paid my bonus. This is corporate scum at its finest. They don’t care about you. They don’t care about you at all, at all
I had a boss that worked in investment banking which is even worse than big 4 as it's 80 hour weeks with an all night with no sleep once a month. They treat you like shit on their shoes. He was so unbelievably toxic. He was so pompous and arrogant but in my opinion it was a front for being a coward. He would never give me feedback one on one. He told one of my coworkers feedback on me and that coworker would bring me in a room and tell me it. Coward. This guy is the type that sent me a 5 paragraph email saying how incorrect "Beginning an email with hi, hello, or hey is innapropriate, you can only use their first name in an intro". If I showed up 10 seconds after him or left 10 seconds before him, I'd get a 4 paragraph email. He made my female coworker balling cry 2 times. He gave another coworker a panic attack where he fell back in chair and hit his head on the ground. They called 911 for help. An ambulance showed up, rolled out a stretcher and in front of 50 of his coworkers unconcious, they strapped him on a stretcher and took him to the ER. He later said "Oh it's just because I'm unhealthy and have gotten fat recently." He was way too nice to call out this man.
I ended up getting laid off. When he and HR brought me in a room and told me, I just didn't care. My last words to him were "Welp, I probably won't ever see you again... so see ya" and walked out. Like I have massive student loans and getting laid off with no income should be devestating, but I didn't care. When I last left the parking lot driving off, the song "I can see clearly now the rain is gone. I can see past obstacles in my way. It's gonna be a bright, bright, bright, sunny shiny day..." I was literally at top of my lungs yelling this song. It was cathartic. I ended up getting a new job, making 35% more in an awesome culture. I can't be grateful enough for him firing me. It was the best thing to ever happen to me. I've had dreams of finding out where he lives and rubbing dog shit on his windows and door handles. The most astonishing this of this all is that he had a wife. I couldn't get over that any woman on earth would ever in a billion years marry him even though he was rich.
Especially when you have another job lined up, that's a lesson: Never let them know you are leaving until shortly before you do, if not the same day. Collect your bonus and boogie. If you've a new job lined up, you don't need any of them as a reference anyway. Just boogie. They aren't going to give you the courtesy of working those extra two weeks. They'll just fire you. So don't give them the chance. That's the work world we live in - zero loyalty from them, so it should be zero loyalty from you.
@@DL-fl5ul Thanks for telling us about the toxicity of the Investment firms.
Shouldn't you be able to sue, based on the fact that the firing was based on learning you were working parallel to working part time for them?
I had a manager who wanted to have a one way window installed in their office so they could watch (spy on) the employees. Fortunately the higher up said no to that. She ended up getting sacked because everybody eventually quit on her. Hi NANCY.
hahah 😂, that final flex by name and all 🤣
Sadly, she will never read that comment as people like that will never watch videos like that.
Hi Nancy! XD
Bye nancy! 👋
"An officer should not work, looking over his men's shoulder, checking on every detail of what they are doing, and calling them to account at every furlong post. This maidenly attitude corrodes confidence and destroys initiative." - The Armed Forces Officer, Edition of 1950, p. 211
About 10 years ago I worked at PwC Montreal. Literally hated everybody there (Except one senior manager that later became partner, P.C.) Got fired after the first year because I was entering too many hours in my time sheet during busy season (the real worked hours) and the partners hated this because it lowered their jobs' net margins (a senior manager explained that to me after the fact). 2 years later in industry I was making more money then my manager (who worked 6 years to get there and works 3x more hours than me). Audit is a scam.
"audit is a scam" for the public, the auditors, and any prospective accounting student
My friends worked at PWC and KPMG. These are just glorified resume booster companies. And they work you they really do own you. Making partner basically is more about how much you can brownnose.
“Making partner is basically more about how much you can brownnose.” You can say that again!
huh, that kinda explains why these kind of companies have a lot of wahmen SM and partners, its just to show off and get that DEI money
@@gokicuysome of yall truly are miserable
@@whyme7862 thx 4 concern m8
You have to be sadistic to make partner. That can take 15 years of working min 45-50 hours a week during normal times and 70-100 during busy season
Most accounting students spend college hearing that you have to work Big 4 and pass the CPA to have a good career. This message is reinforced by job listings for senior positions that ask for Big 4 experience. For that reason many Big 4 associates put up with a lot.
💯
Fuck those positions too then! Why do they want people that worked at big 4? They want drones!
Eh, if you make CPA you can just skip the Big 4, no? Who cares if you're a high powered clerk if you're already at certified level?
@@thuglifebear5256 employers care. Unless you are in private practice, you have to be lucky to get a good corporate accounting gig without big 4 on your resume.
And those college students potentially take out six figures worth of student loan debt, so they feel they need to work at the Big 4 firm to get higher pay and pay off their student loans.
I did an internship at PwC. I didn’t accept a full time offer for 1 reason.
The best career advice I’ve ever heard is to look at the people above you and see if they’re happy. No one was and the partner said he only did accounting because his dad told him too. I’m so glad I left.
I’m in a great job now with perfect work/life balance.
What field are you in? Is it still accounting or something else?
@@smpiano6605 nah, I started at amazon as a warehouse grunt and moved up to an admin position. I work M-F 8 hour shifts and work from home Monday and Friday. Amazon also lets you use your time off when and how you want. My manager approves all vacation time off.
And I can wear what I want. In public accounting you have to dress business casual. I could roll into work at amazon wearing the same pajamas I wore the day before when I worked from home haha
@@NickOloteo I’m in public at a top 10 firm and we can wear casual stuff guess it depends on office
@@bluemo7253 PwC was the least strict out of the big 4. They let you wear jeans haha
I once worked with colleagues from US, me being from EU, at an EU client site. I was 24 yo back then and I was asked by a 50+ male colleague from US why I was leaving at 5.30-6 pm, while the US manager was still there. I said - my work for the day is done and the working hours too. He told me that in US they have to come to work before the manager does and leave after he does. All the EU colleagues were coming at work around 9.30-10 am, US people were already there. EU workers were leaving at 5.30-6 pm, US workers were still there.
At the end of the project the US manager badmouthed all the EU colleagues to they EU management for not doing their work. We had fabulous reviews from the client though, so we never heard of that US manager again and we got good appraisals at the end of the year. Was working at one of the biggest IT companies worldwide.
Also, all the US colleagues were taking turns in buying lunch for the US manager, we never bothered. Huge gap in mentality.
I'd argue that there's a bigger incentive to act that way in the US because the pay is much higher and taxes much lower.
@@zerohero5753 I'd also argue that even the taxes are higher, we have free education and healthcare in EU. I wouldn't say the payment is US is higher, so I don't see any incentive to kiss anyone's behind for something that is transactual (one works to be paid). Also, EU has laws for employment, while US lacks in this domain.
Same, like our building locks at 6pm, I can't stay late, even if I wanted to. Because my company doesn't want to pay me overtime and I legally can't just "stay and work for free".
@@ira2016 The fact you think you have "free education and healthcare" tells me all I need to know about your "accounting" skills.
@ira2016 Nothing is free. You're an accountant. You know better
My shift is 8 to 5. I get an hour lunch. I take my 1 hour lunch every single day. I don't work past 5. I don't care about priorities or deadlines.
how's minimum wage?
@@jmcooney2000 wouldn't know. I make $42/hr 🙃
Stress less @@jmcooney2000
@@jmcooney2000 If he gets a 8 to 5 with an hour lunch. He probably makes salary and way above minimum wage. What are you talking about?
@@errussia2981 I made that comment 3 months ago I can't remember
After one year with the company, my managers gave me the feedback that my work was excellent. One week later, yearly feedback put me in the bottomest tier, my coach told me it was nothing to worry about. One week later, was fired for "low performance" 🎉🎉🎉
That’s pretty brutal, when I was at Deloitte all first years were basically given a 3 (average rating) 2nd year and on it was open season though… I didn’t know how under paid I was until after I was laid off and picked up for something 30% more pay
Years of being told how important and valued I am, and how great our product is doing in the marketplace. Only to be told that no matter how well OUR team is doing, the overall company had a bad year, so no raise (or an insultingly small raise).
Will everything we've done and our years of poor raises be recognized if the company ever has a good year? No, of course not.
Were you able to collect unemployment in that situation? Or did the company fight it because they said they didn't lay you off, rather they fired you for "low performance".
When you write words like "bottomest" it's hard to blame them.
Former Deloitte employee - one of the big 4, rivaling PwC. In case people here don't know who are the Big 4 (Accounting) firms, they are: Deloitte, KPMG, PwC, Ernest & Young.
Deloitte ironically have trophies/awards, bagging the Best Ethical Employer/Company of the Year (not joking!). But behind closed doors, my own ex-boss did every dirty trick to oust me out of the company, even though I have proved my KPI for the last 3 months was above 90%. Deloitte don't appreciate your hard work, they only keep those who are submissive + don't challenge bosses authority/challenge the status quo + can talk more sugar-coated "truths" bosses want to hear. Don't get hired by Deloitte, if you can. If you do get hired by Deloitte, some of you have to expect to not stay long there. However long you stay there, best find a way to maintain your humanity & sanity, while the workplace system or group(s) of people tempt to corrupt/break you down overtime.
Thank you for telling us about this fact about Delloite, lots of professors in my college tell that getting in Big 4 accounting firms is the actual fulfillment of one's Life.
I work at a Big 4 in consulting
Literally every waking moment I want to cry
I been wanting to change to b4 cause I’m at a top 10 firm but the name isn’t as good.
I didn’t know there was a top 10 list out there unless you are talking about auditting/tax?
If so then why not, same shit different company. I’m sure the small businesses have the same shady ongoings too
@@jimbojimbo6873 Well there’s big4 followed by the national firms (BDO, RSM, Grant Thronton, Baker Tilly, etc).
@@jimbojimbo6873 After b4 there’s the nationals (BDO, RSM, Grant Thronton, Baker Tilly, etc).
I’m in audit and would like to change to consulting or advisory, but seems difficult if I couldn’t get in and then I’d have to be a staff 1 again.
Stay strong. I left but big 4. I wish I had switched practices to a different advisory type, I'd have possibly ended up with better managers and projects.
Took me 6 months to emotionally and intellectually recover after huge burnout. Lol.
After time I lost emotions. My mind took a large toll and I wasn't able to think as fast as before or remember information. I lost my creativity. I've regressed in my verbal skills to high school level and in social skills as well. I realized I was terribly sad only after quitting and literally crying for 7 days when I visited my parents.
I still don't know what went wrong.
i went to school with a lot of people who worked at big 4 after grad and none of them ever made partner, all of them burned out in 5 years or less. they called it the bamboo ceiling but in reality it's just the way the business is run. their whole game is to nab smart, hard-working, anxious, high-C people and squeeze every last drop of work out of them for as long as they can. then they replace them with the next crop of new grads. rinse repeat. it works because these companies offer something these new grads desperately need: decent pay right out of school for a company with a big brand name. if you're gonna do it, know the trade you're making and have a plan for when you've decided enough is enough.
That old, and very funny, musical called "How to Succeed in Business without Really Trying" is from a different era, but some of it's lessons still apply.
I just applied for them knowing I was never going to get hired so I could claim that I'm looking for a job. Glad to know I never got an interview with them.
I advise people to add up the actual hours they work and calculate their actual hourly rate.
I was in a big architectural firms for many years before it occurred to me to do the calculation. I found out I was getting paid less per hour than I would get for manual labour.
I seen the same thing from a lawyer that was working 60 hours a week and realized a person with a 2 year degree getting hourly wages would make more more money logging those kind of hours with decent overtime incentives.
Also how much the experience is worth on your CV after. For some, the shit WLB is worth it for a few years to accelerate your career.
Took you years to occur to you do this calculation? Faaaaaack, any person w 2 neurons would put this calculation together
It took you _that_ long to run those numbers?
The architecture industry is terrible when it comes to money overall. The culture of overworking for nothing is instilled in us since college. ☠️☠️☠️
This has been the Big 4 for the last 30 years. In our program they said "Get your three years in and never go back." What an attitude to have.
3 years? That is a lot 😂
@@na27000 I couldn't do it again. 🤣🤣 Three months is enough to tell you that they suck ass.
3 years gets you to senior associate with a little bit of supervisory experience
5 years gets you to manager
That's all you need
The amount of overtime I'd be working is exactly zero hours. You want me to work it? Pay for it.
Exactly!💯
In my profession (Architecture), they don't ask you to work overtime (as a salaried/OT exempt worker). They just place ridiculous deadlines on you that you have to meet, and the only way of meeting them is by working a lot of unpaid OT. All to make the boss look good. If you don't work the OT and don't meet the deadline, then it's a "meeting" in the bosses' office. They ask "what's the problem?", and "how can we help?". If you're honest with them about the deadline, they don't want to hear it, and imply that you work too slow. And they don't threaten your job, but you're first on the layoff list when the layoffs roll around.
I basically had enough of this shit back in 2020, and vowed to never work full time salaried/OT exempt again. It has worked out so far with different freelance and sub-contracting gigs, and a part time job that's now full time but I get paid for all my overtime. I'm making almost double what I was prior to my 2020 layoff, and retirement has become a real possibilty.
@@Seattle-2017 Yeah, I get it. Glad you could find a better way. 👍
In my profession (control engineer), they would keep all the meetings on overtime. God, they wouldn't even pay me for it. It's hell. But for the fact of the matter, I wouldn't go to half the meetings like that anyways 😅
But then you won’t be promoted and rot in same position. Is that okay with you??
Its so weird and painful to know that these kind of workplaces exists.
As I've been thinking a lot lately, how could businesses really be reputable if they're abusive to their employees while having a "too big to fail" vibe.
The military can be like this too. I have a couple decades of experience in the Army before retiring. It can been filled with people just sitting around at times waiting to be the last to leave. I had a supervisor, an officer, he wouldn't leave the office until 6 p.m. often. He wasn't doing anything. I got stuck leaving at 5 p.m. most days because of him, even if I got all my work done hours ago. I could easily be online at home than at work.
I watched the video and thought the comments were translated from 1970's Japan for a second. I don't have a good reason why I thought that, but it clicked.
@ch-yq5ynThe bombshell is the Big 4 doesn’t pay as much as industry
@@VKEvilutionthe reason because it is.
So many work environments are about optics. The more you move up the ladder it's more about saying the right thing, and being a yes man, while delivering nothing. No foresight or vision. I mentally checked out before my plant inevitably closed and was laid off. No regrets.
that's actually a really good list of explaining how office optics work.
So, if you're perceived as a lead, leave first, so everyone else will ACTUALLY LEAVE AT A REASONABLE HOUR.
if you tell them, they won't. be a role model, leave early. :)
you hit the nail on the head, its a lack of a merit-based system. its all optics.
ex big 4 here. hated it. this video is just the tip of iceberg. the perks and career boost when I was young was well worth it in the short term
Haha r/accounting represent , thanks Josh for covering our sub lmaoooo
Yeah man, I think we could do a lot of damage to this nonsense if each one got each other’s backs… for example, if I knew someone in accounting I could totally blast it full volume in the forums, because myself I know I will never end up working these types of domains and definitely not the Big 4s.
That friend could do the same for me in video games, these companies are so stingy and anti-accountability that them finding this very same comment could land me in trouble.
I hope he covers r/furrysinaccounting next! Updoot fellow redditor!
Recently mckinsey consultant in India commited suicide due to high work pressure. He was from IIT and IIM highly prestigious and competitive institutes
That’s so sad 😢
As someone who does taxes and full charge bookkeeping here is some advice. If you work for someone else's company, do the bare min but learn. Do not get involved in corporate and take steps to complete your certs, and get a business up and running. If you own your own tax firm, I would go 100%. There is a major shortage of tax preparers. If you have to say over at a big four, do your own company work on the low and never say anything about it to anyone (get your CPA or EA). Stay one year then leave. TLDR: Do not work unless you get paid.
How do you get clients? What do you specifically pitch? I currently have some small business clients (basically corner shops and such) but I want to expand to small tier manufacturing businesses as there is more revenue in that.
@@apuapustaja1 I got most of my big clients from the connections I made working for the big firms.
So do you have any employees or is it just you? Are there any online forums/networking resources that you can recommend?
It was the big 5 before. I have worked at andersen consulting (now accenture), mind games are definitely the name of the game. My four years there were hell; imagine working 16 hrs a day, 7x a week for a measly overtime allowance (and that is not giving it due to the manager's use of company policy loopholes). This is in the Philippines delivery center alone. I have an interview with pwc now and I am thankful to have watched this video.
Most corporate offices work you to death. I suggest live a frugal and minimalist lifestyle so you are not affected by the workload and you can quit at anytime
It is best to live in a forest and do farming grow own food so no money is needed for living. That would be the best way to live.
Back when I worked for university career services I remember big 4 recruiting staff asking if they could stay after 5pm on Friday to process on-site interview offers. I informed them absolutely not as the University closes the student center at 5pm on Friday. Just as I expected push-back an armed campus police officer appeared in the doorway. Have a great weekend. And go get a life!
even the hiring process is toxic with most consultant firms, not just the big 4. they don't even pay well for normal level employees.
Make sure that TPS report is on my desk Monday morning, 8am, sharp. Ummmk, have a good weekend.
The "orange press" is the perfect analogy.... Keep up the amazing content!
Not leaving until your manager does is a South Korean thing in business and there self deletion rates are horrendous. It just leads to people staying doing nothing really but not leaving for the optics.
Damn, thank you PWC for rejecting me
When I worked at Koch a manager asked me if I was unhappy with my job because I never stayed late.
That's why I don't agree with installing apps on my personal devices and I rather they buy me a new device for that.
My brother worked for one of the big 4, in NYC, and can confirm it was horrible.
He had the flu once and they called him and chewed him out for not coming to work, even though he had a fever and was puking and everything.
It’s amazing that pwc was voted one of the top places to work.
They pay 6 digits only benefit
Those lists are created by the companies on the list to promote working for the companies on the list. They have to be. It’s gotta be a scam.
I always take the "best places to work" lists with a grain of salt.
@@racaulk I take them with a salt truck.
@@LeeHawkinsPhoto actually if you see them there it means they have no intricate value whatsoever
I love the old people who’ve been in the same dead end, entry level job for twenty to thirty years and get upset at new hires who value their own lives. These people are all over the service and hospitality industries.
I spent 4 years at PwC. No lies detected. I remember pulling an all nighter in the office. Went home at 5am to take a shower. Went to bed and was woken up by my partner asking where I was ... I said I overslept and went back into the office 30 minutes later.
Working until 7pm was the standard. It wasn't an issue when I was single and fresh out of college. Id never have that lifestyle now that im married with children
Taking a role with the big 4 was a big mistake. Lots of really really clever people, but super corporate. Was relieved when I got out after a year.
2 years back I have chose to join big 4 due to excitement, imagine after rejecting better offers and didn't interview for counter offers. Since my interview till the exit, I felt terrible about the process, HRs, management of projects, etc. Everyone from my project left already within few months after spending a year.
Here, where I work in Norway, people show up around lunch and leave 2-3 hours later. Most work at home, some even bring their pcs when they travel abroad for months and work a couple of hours a day.
Norway is a heaven for employees I believe it is a great place to live.
I worked for one of them for a total of 11 years, in two countries. There was definitely a lot of work involved but I didn’t mind that as I signed up for a salaried position with no set time really. What bothered me was when my utilization was low (happens due to seasonality sometimes and the projects), I still had to sit and pretend that I was busy until 6-7, and you were made to feel bad if you weren’t present. That and the weekly transcon travel for projects took its toll on me. I now have such a great work life balance at my new job, can’t even think of my old job without getting goosebumps. Not that it’s not a good professional experience, but make sure you pull out before you burn out
Started my career in public for 2 years then went to industry. Learned more in my 1st year in industry working regular hours implementing a new ERP system than working all the hours I did in public for 2 years. Now as a corporate controller I don’t give a s*** if candidates I’m hiring were in public, way more concerned if the person actually cares enough to look into root causes and tries to understand WHAT they’re doing rather than going through the motions on HOW to do it. And most managers in the field I know think the exact same thing. Times are a changing, managers have wised up to the whole BS public accounting is top tier mentality.
In my last job I worked about 45-60 min overtime every day. And despite that, I was still the last person to arrive and the first person to leave EVERY day. After only 6 weeks I got fired. Main reason being that I "didn't spend enough time in the office" and therefore "wasn't serious enough" and "too immature to work for his company". Yes, he actually called me immature, three times no less. So happy to be out of there, working there was hell in general. I didn't even get a warning either, he just fired me out of nowhere one Monday morning. Came in to work just to go straight home again (and that was a long commute)
I'm so thankful to be able to work from home and avoid most of the corporate nonsense. It also helps that I work for a pretty small company. There's still come cringy work culture stuff, but it's generally isolated a weekly meeting and the occasional "virtual happy hour" that's entirely optional.
I worked for a regional firm for a year and encountered a lot of this. Mind games, competitiveness, people talking behind your back, people having mental breakdowns and sobbing at work and at the client. Too much insanity to describe. I quit after working for a lead who wanted me to lie and bend rules and bitched to management when I didn’t. Have a much more chill job now for same pay and working on starting my own firm in the evenings at my own pace. I don’t know why public accounting attracts psychos, but it definitely does.
I worked at Accenture Federal. I will honestly say the Federal side of the Big Four is not toxic. Mostly cuz as federal contractors they gotta follow federal labor laws or lose the contract. So that side of those businesses tend to be better managed. If you are ever asked to do overtime, atleast in my experience. they let you know a week in advance so you can make your arrangements. then it has to be approved by the Account Manager of the contract. I only experienced it once while working there, and they were doing everything to try to avoid having all of the teams on contract do OT. The commercial side of the company was basically everything in this video.. and a lot of us were glad we had our security clearances XD
Very strange, this reads more like Japanese/Korean Business culture than anything I've had experience with in the US.
Baffles me that these are the same companies that do random team building and random extra activities that waste time for no reason, but also expect you to work more than 40 hours for free basically. I don't know what kind of work they even do here, but I don't think I've ever been busy enough to actually be working constantly 100% of the time I'm at work and not been able to get my work done in 40 hours.
Lmao my two roommates are both in consulting, and one at PWC specifically. Late nights are the norm, rarely see them log off before ~6, sometimes I'll even see them working until 9, 10, or one time even 11pm.
Meanwhile I'm in software so I hop off between 5-530 almost every day
My managers at the restaurant I worked at hated me because I was really active about leaving as on time as possible because they would keep pushing and pushing. If I got my side and finishing work done on time, they would find any reason to keep me there. 😂 nope cya
Worked for another big 4: same exact thing. Terrible working habits.
As a contractor, I am enjoying my morning shifts, then going home for a good nap, and making money for night shift, then I get to essentially take an extra day off if money is flowing in. Get pretty much a 4 day work schedule and live in a unicorn economy. Those afternoon naps can be anywhere between 2-4 hours.
You ever notice how it's always "busy season" the moment you need literally anything?
Sharing rooms can lead to unintended consequences. Maybe someone arranges to "room" with someone and has motives that could lead to harassment or even assault?
PWC is a shithole. I unironically arrive and leave on time and the current senior who has been a diversity hire all his life and worked at the "big firms" has complained about me leaving on time and even asked the partners "Do you think HE (me) could do a better job than me?" to which one partner replied "Yes!". By the way PWC for past few years has been summoned to federal enquiries. I applied at PWC years ago and I am glad they didnt give me the job.
Haha good on you man! They sound like pieces of 💩
Rejected a Talent acquisition role at one of them. The pay was average and not worth my sanity.
This is what life looks like without unions.
Milton had such a wonderful job. They put him in the basement, away from everyone else. No one knows he is there. He can do whatever he wants all day. And still get paid for it.
He really had it made.
Until they fixed the glitch. Though, I will say this: I worked as a federal civilian for the military for several years. There was so little work to do there that I had to use my time to learn and study, which was fine. However, eventually I needed more and quit. It didn't help that the military office and IT policies were getting worse.
I spent 6 years early in my career working for the largest European services firm. It was great at first; traveling internationally every week! By the time I left, I was alcoholic and had a nervous breakdown.
A good reason exists around why they bring in young people, who eventually will not put up with this garbage. The execs in this space are usually a variation of mental illness that hasn’t even been fully identified as of yet. One of my old school managers would pine on about the good old days of clocking people’s restroom breaks, and setting out egg McMuffins at his reports desks on Saturdays to see if they showed up that day.
What a great video. Began my career at Arthur Andersen in 1989 and worked there for three years to get my CPA license. This was back in the days when there was a Big 8. Quite frankly it was pretty miserable the entire time. Your video is pretty spot on.
I had a job offer at one of the big 4, but I turned them down since during the technical interviews I kept getting told they let employees use excess work hours towards a Friday off. In the last interview, the team manager acted like a slimmy asshole, and he let it slip that employees must prove they've earned their Friday off, even if they've more than 8 hours. I honestly was pissed since it felt I was being misled so much and that my time was wasted with all the interviews, but it prevented me from working there.
when I was teaching overseas I was the first one in and last one out only because i wasn't qualified to do that job and didn't know what I was doing. meanwhile other teachers were partying all night and were late but did fine at their job. A lot of times people are late leaving as they don't really have the skills to do their job :)
Big 4 is literally the impediment of the phrase “Golden handcuffs” I use to want to go into management consulting until I started seeing a lot deeper depth on how they actually treat them. A lot Ivy League entitled egotistic people that look at others as if they are inferior to them.
Like cool you went to an Ivy League school that ran your pockets dry. Cool you want a cookie cuz people can do the same type of work if not BETTER than you on doing the same things you do through stuff you can find open source.
If you are sick, take off. FMLA. They cannot fire you.
At walmart we work 2-11 and have protected time off that we earn. we always get yelled at for not clocking in early and staying till 11. yet if you clock in early you have to clock out early due to the 8 hour limit. Even when you try to clock in at 2 they still complain cause you could have been there sooner. Also they complain that people use their protected time off to leave early... work is dumb
“Praise be” 🤣🤣🤣🤣
You legit made me spit my coffee… Now I gotta go down and get changed! 😅😅🤣🤣🤣
My Hero.....
I work for one of the big four in Europe and this is NOT my experience. It's a brilliant place to work.
Corporate simps… nuff said
Legend says some of these practices would earn you a raise, or a promotion, and get you ahead in the industry.
Nowadays it's just used to squeeze you for everything you're worth only to be discarded when someone cheaper comes along to suffer the same fate.
Still baffled how some of these companies survive when they put optics above all else and also constantly cry about nothing actually getting done.
I try to tell people I work with that are seeking more responsibility to get noticed to STOP it! They are so worried they have this drive to be noticed if it leads to more money. It does not.
The income potential at partner is what keeps all this insanity going. For most tenured partners at big 4, $1M annual is total comp. With so much upside at stake, survival becomes Mad Max Thunder-dome. In addition keep in mind that with the exception of chargability and sales at higher levels, all performance is subjective. This means the incentive manage perception is critical for reviews.
Most traditional industries such as banking and management consultancy are like that
I worked at Intel for 3 years as a process engineer. 10-12 hour days are normal, monday - Friday. usually also working another 2-4 hours on sunday, just to keep up with job responsibilities. the area i worked in used fear of layoffs to push people. i am glad i found another position in another company that treats its employees better.
I had a buddy who worked at EY and did a 100 hour work week during busy season. That means he was doing 60-80 hours during the other weeks.
And this was as a 1st year making around 57-60k/year with no stock/revenue share. He said he worked about 45 hours during non busy season
HAHAHA. That last "PwC was the cherry on top!
Fk yeah, bro. Get some!!!!
Could you do a piece on the FAANG and what it's REALLY like to work there? I live in Northern California and been in tech even before the Internet. So...I know what's up. Find some people to talk about the truth about those places. TLDR == its fukd.
Doesn’t even need to be “Big 4”. Public accounting in general is a complete hellscape.
So glad I'm not part of any bs company structure or ethos like this anymore. Education industry was just the same. Entrepreneurial route all the way now. No more 70 hour weeks unless it's totally on my terms.
As someone else in the comments has pointed out, this kind of work culture is the norm in Japan and South Korea.
It’s outrageous to see it get spread out like a pandemic.
This subreddit sounds entirely satire. Like role-playing a nightmare corporate lifestyle. Crazy
I interviewed there and was not surprised when the less qualified interviewers tried to pry some industry knowledge from me and I kept it basic because I knew they wouldn't hire me.
Yeah this all seems very typical for a big 4 accounting firm. Unfortunatly the whole "benefit" of working at firm like this is that it is a huge resume booster but you basically have to give up two or three years of your life for that.
I feel like some of these people would much rather chain their employees to their desks and force them to work 24/7 for free but are sad that they can’t due to the legality so they try to get as close to that as humanly possible.
Databricks, exactly exactly.
If U work for a company all U owe them is what was on the job description/app. U should never feel guilty. Way back I worked for a lot of big retail/sales companies. 1 time 1 of them called me & said I was on a list to cover for ppl. who could not work that day. I never consented to the list nor did I know re to it. 2 companies tried to pull this on me. I refused to go in, hung up the phone, & went out to dinner with my parents. Good video.
I work 45+ hours per week, but get paid every hour. Freelancer.
My manager said: "you must spend 1 hour on each project to done them everyday".
The problem is there more than 8 projects.
Audit is work without light. Literally
Hey Josh- busy season is when we actually have client work that we charge. For some people busy season is around 3 or 4 months of the year (for tax its around 3/15 and 9/15) the other 8 months, unless specified, we aren't utilized so we literally just log on and log off. The goal of the 55 hours during busy season is to have a Yearly 78%utilization rate with the 8 months we arent billing
I had a buddy that said he worked a 100 hour week during busy season at EY and 60-70+ the other weeks. I think he said 45 during non busy season
Got fired from a software company for not putting in more than 10 hours a day. 😒😒
Quit my first six figure job. Inept managers, hired friends, family, sons, dads, nobody had any qualifications.
Hired me to do a machine install arrivibg in 5 weeks.
They had no clue what they were doing. Gave 2 wks notice secind week Was set up.
now its on them.
They could not even move stock out of the area the machine was to install.
pity. I was on track, and going to automate the machine, order would automatically make parts.
six figures , never thought anyone would quit surprise.
I literally work for my paycheck to pay my bills. I come in at my scheduled time and leave at my scheduled time. My bosses at every job I’ve been at dislike me and I do not care.
I really feel sorry for all the people working in places like this. The company that I am working for is the complete opposite.
That why we should care about that there will be plenty of non corporate companies on the job market.